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StarTopic Future Nintendo Hardware & Technology Speculation & Discussion |ST| (Read the staff posts before commenting!)

I know in the mobile space Nintendo has pulled back a bit but I could see them restrategise and re-enter the market. They may be afraid of say Mario kart having loot boxes again with bad PR and the returns likely weren't as high as expected. But even non randomized transactions make some good money. Mobile is seen as feast or famine, but IDK I don't see how those decently performing mobile games weren't profitable enough to double down on a bit (I don't see the full costs obviously and maybe some bad PR scared Ninty but IDK, as long as its not Mario on the app store, I think they could get away with what everyone else is doing). I personally don't care for dark pattern mobile games but there is money to be made. Not sure if they get much bigger than peak fire-emblem heroes stuff but hey, no Zelda yet. A new animal crossing thing could also take off.
I honestly don't know what Nintendo is waiting for to make a Zelda gacha game for phones. You could summon any character from the franchise like in FEH and play as them with the gameplay of a 2D Zelda, since it looks like Nintendo won't be making any more 2D Zeldas from now on.
 
I honestly don't know what Nintendo is waiting for to make a Zelda gacha game for phones. You could summon any character from the franchise like in FEH and play as them with the gameplay of a 2D Zelda, since it looks like Nintendo won't be making any more 2D Zeldas from now on.
I'm still expecting that Zelda dating sim based off the scrapped elements from Ocarina of Time.
 
Yeah, somewhat, because ...

Okay, I'll put a quick couple things I'd like for the new console in response to @oldpuck's earlier open inquiry.

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But you're right, I think. It would be incredibly difficult to keep up the growth.

By the way, the console case should be able to become translucent so I can see the pikmin hard at work maintaining the hardware and making it operate.
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Talking about Nintendo growing their business ... this is just speculation.

What about a Nintendo phone? Their one and only platform, the Switch+.

It runs Android in a safe virtualized environment minus the home screen and a few basic apps.
I has 5G and a decent camera that some games use.
Has detachable controllers that you can leave at home.
Of course, it runs all your Switch games.

People who like a premium phone go for a Switch 2 XL at 700$. It has better cameras, screen and casing.
People who want a budget phone go for the Switch 2 Lite for 350$.
People that just want a Switch buy any SKU and just don't put a SIM card in it.

When Iwata mentioned they would adopt an Apple-like release model, maybe he wasn't kidding. (Was it Iwata?)
This doesn't seem far-fatched at all actually and would present an option to anyone who needs a new phone and likes gaming.

I would trust Nintendo a lot more with my data than any Android phone manufacturer or Google.

ETA:
Maybe this is the ultimate gimmick.
Being dockable, it could replaces all your devices.
They would put a lot of those in each household, since they are very personal.
 
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DLSS can function on anything that has the proper hardware (tensor cores) so volta and up, a custom Turing SOC wouldn't be the hardest thing in the world to make, I can't point to a Turing SOC with it because they didn't make Turing SOCs, period.

Ok.

So you try to argue against me that using an Ampere SoC is overkill to do simple DLSS…and then you just admit to me there is not such thing as a Volta or Turning SoC that can adequately do simple DLSS of 1080p games to 4K.

This is why I think your argument isn’t compelling. You are agreeing with me but don’t know it lol.

So you got me there, however. they do have a Volta SOC with tensor cores such the jetson xavier which has 48 tensor cores and is more in line with what a pro model wouldve offered (even if its still kinda binary incompatiable iirc)


The tensor cores in older Nvidia SoC’s were used for car AI and such. Not DLSS gaming. For good reasons.



I mean....the RTX 2050 (laptop chip) has DLSS that works fine and that only has 64 tensor cores, I think you overestimate what DLSS needs to function, Nintendo is targetting lower fidelity experiences either way it doesn't need to be perfect


That’s ampere architecture, not Turing or Volta (just to hit home against your augment that ampere SoC is overkill for 4K DLSS.)

And the RTX 2050 isn’t good for 4K DLSS. It’s primarily used for 1080p DLSS gaming for ~60fps

And the RTX 2050 is 30w

And the RTX 2050 has 64 tensor cores, not 48

And the RTX 2050 has memory clocks at 1.7 ghz

This isn’t a good argument against why I say 12SM at 1ghz and 15w isn’t overkill to get 4K DLSS to adequately work.


I am trying to say that DLSS cant really gets 720p30 to 4K or 4K60, the point of DLSS is that if a game that runs at say. 1080p60 in the first place then DLSS might get it to 4K30-4K60, but if the game wasn't hitting that frame rate at the target res DLSS isn't gonna magically double the FPS, DLSS isn't the point of the chip, it's a bonus to give it longevity when native rendering isn't cutting it anymore.

Huh?

Rendering at lower resolutions like 540p/720p to 4K is exactly how DLSS performance mode works (especially in lower end systems that can’t force 400w and push 2000 CUDA cores and 300 tensor cores and over clocking).

I can see Drake SoC being exactly what is needed to get a game like ToTK that is 900p/30fps on the tx1+ and being able to DLSS to 4K/60fps, with a bit left over from some graphics pushing.

And DLSS is the point of the chip. I don’t know why anyone would say that it isn’t.

It’s exactly the kind of tech advancement Nintendo gravitates towards. Everyone who guesses Nintendo will use cutting edge tech for raw graphics rendering power…has always been wrong. At least they have been wrong in the last 30 years. Which makes me confident in saying you are wrong about this.


Power is complex, it's way more than just a number, let me try and explain, lets Drake turns out to be a horrible disappointment and only gets us PS4 teraflop numbers.1.84TFlops.

This is what anyone should expect the power of Drake to be in portable mode based on the Nvidia leaks.

this would imply Drake could only do PS4-level stuff and that's an absolute yeah? wrong. By virtue of being newer Drake has features that allow it to do things in fewer steps than the PS4 ever could, it has a much faster CPU that allows physics and logic that the ps4 isn't capable of either, etc etc, I am sure many people smarter than me here can explain this far better in case my explanation wasn't satisfactory

I mean, you still have to factor in performing at 11w and much lower clocks…but ok? I’m betting Drake portable should look/run better than the ps4 too. So what?

That has nothing to do with how Nintendo will approach their software development nor how they position the Drake model in the Switch brand.

It's not really angering anyone, the only issue with it is that such a massive power leap would be completely wasted on basic graphical upgrades that provide very little to the core experience of playing games and undersell its own potential.

Well, I don’t see the ps5 adding anything new to the “core experience of gameplay” or adding new gameplay. It’s essentially newer hardware to make games look and run (hopefully) better.

the new hardware would allow for stuff like VR, more advanced physics, new gameplay mechanics, worlds of much larger scope, and much higher fidelity visuals. imagine wii -> wii u jumps in game complexity. That's the sort of thing this hardware allows for. it would be the first real jump for Nintendo since the Wii U. It would just be a crying shame if they didn't use it to its full capability.

One thing I’ve learned from watching gamers discuss Nintendo hardware over the last 30 years, is that Nintendo never actually ends up using advanced tech exactly how core gamers think/expect them to.

As I’ve said, if Nintendo can find a way to use tensor to do some crazy, unique AI gameplay with it instead of DLSS, they will make some exclusives like that. But that’s for a 1-2 Switch kind of game, not a mainline game.

VR? Irrelevant. That’s a niche peripheral in the console market anyways whether Nintendo wants to do it or not makes no difference in how Drake is positioned or what their software development strategy is.

To put it another way, by the time Nintendo wants to develop, and eventually release, some huge grand game of a big franchise with scope and gameplay never seen before now that they have released ToTK…that’s like another 6+ years anyways. We are talking about hardware released after the Drake/Switch brand.

I think it would be a massive L for everyone, especially for game design, devs are stuck catering to what is inching closer to being archaic hardware, wasting precious hours trying to optimize things that shouldn't need to be optimized and compromising their game design in the process than using the full tools they have and customers would be forced to use the same hardware they are clearly begging to have replaced for a while longer just to play nintendo's games. it just makes no sense

I guess ps5/Series X devs have been taking a massive L for 3 years now. No one really cares. People seem to enjoy the games released the last 3 years. For those new consoles, as well as the old Switch consoles. As well as the pc whic runs 5+ year old tech. If devs take a massive loss for 5 years instead of just 3…pretty sure it won’t make much a difference.

In other words, you are overblowing and overstating this “massive L”. Diminishing returns. This is 2023 not 1993.

The majority of the Switch userbase of gamers are extremely happy with the type of Nitnendo games they are getting. They just want them to look and run optimally.

Drake will provide this…
 
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So, was the chat screenshot mentioning the cancellation of the T239 fake or what?
According to the comments related to this rumor, the "T239 cancelled" rumor had a wide impact because the source had made numerous and accurate revelations about Nvidia's GPU. But the original text is very short and lacks clear details, therefore, there are too many possible interpretations, for example, the actual situation may be that the final code name of T239 was adjusted, etc.
 
I know a lot of us have assumed a fairly robust DLSS solution for Redrakted. But remember this is Nintendo, and I don't know how hard they would go on tensor cores and newer tech (and it seems like the Redrakted hardware was finalized a while ago). I wouldn't be surprised if they have a customized "lite" solution they worked with Nvidia for... like not quite at a DLSS 2.0 level, let alone frame gen. Then consider that upscaling from low resolutions may have bad artifacting and probably wont do much on handheld mode. A DLSS solution will certainly help Redrakted, but I don't know that it will be the "magic" that it is on PC. Or I my vibe is wrong and they just got everything needed for a full fat DLSS solution, who knows. Or super bad end, somehow no DLSS solution (or like garbage DLSS 1.0 tier solution) at all somehow, despite all the implications from the leak. Imagine the outcry.
 
Has a Metroid game been heavily marketed?
Define heavily marketed?

The E3 2021 Direct ended with the Zelda 35th material - the Age of Calamity DLC, Skyward Sword HD was announced along with it's custom Joy-Cons, the Zelda Game and Watch, along with the first proper trailer for Tears of the Kingdom. The total Zelda coverage was 6.5 minutes.

Dread got a 5 minute trailer, the announcement of a pair of Amiibo, a 7 minute documentary on the history of the game's development, and then an hour of Treehouse Live. NoA featured it in 16 videos over the course of it's marketing cycle (by comparison, Kirby and the Forgotten Land got half as many).

Offline, Dread had an extensive television campaign. Not only were there a slew of American ads (where the game sells pretty well), but Japan and the UK (where it does not) were given custom ads, above and beyond the standard "game play + voice over" treatment. Dread had physical billboards in multiple countries including ones where the franchise sold poorly to expand it's reach. I live in a Major American City, and have never seen a Mario billboard, but there were Dread wraparounds for city busses (which I couldn't find photos of, so you get Hong Kong).

For cross promotion Dread was given a Tetris-99 cup, and was featured in every Switch OLED ad (effectively the OLED's launch title and killer app, which many reviews noted). NoA and NCL setup a competition among 17 streamers to complete as much of the game as possible in 90 minutes.

In terms of merch, in addition to the two amiibo, My Nintendo did a holographic poster, sold a customized case, Power A controller, and hoodie and did a contest for them. A Special Edition was released.

Post launch, the game got free DLC, and was Nintendo's pick* for Game of the Year at the TGAs. Generally, Dread is regarded as having a large and aggressive marketing campaign. You could not throw a cat without hitting Dread marketing.
 
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I know a lot of us have assumed a fairly robust DLSS solution for Redrakted. But remember this is Nintendo, and I don't know how hard they would go on tensor cores and newer tech (and it seems like the Redrakted hardware was finalized a while ago). I wouldn't be surprised if they have a customized "lite" solution they worked with Nvidia for... like not quite at a DLSS 2.0 level, let alone frame gen. Then consider that upscaling from low resolutions may have bad artifacting and probably wont do much on handheld mode. A DLSS solution will certainly help Redrakted, but I don't know that it will be the "magic" that it is on PC. Or I my vibe is wrong and they just got everything needed for a full fat DLSS solution, who knows. Or super bad end, somehow no DLSS solution (or like garbage DLSS 1.0 tier solution) at all somehow, despite all the implications from the leak. Imagine the outcry.
Given Nintendo's love of raw image outputs, I think they will skip dlss and have NERD make a custom machine learned spatial upscale. Dlss would still be an option, but that's for third parties and non-EPD studios
 
I know a lot of us have assumed a fairly robust DLSS solution for Redrakted. But remember this is Nintendo, and I don't know how hard they would go on tensor cores and newer tech (and it seems like the Redrakted hardware was finalized a while ago). I wouldn't be surprised if they have a customized "lite" solution they worked with Nvidia for... like not quite at a DLSS 2.0 level, let alone frame gen.
I get why you're dubious, but in the Nvidia hack from last year, we saw Drake had standard tensor cores, and that, in fact, no only was Nintendo using "full fat" DLSS 2, they were actually working with a version more advanced than the one that was released at the time (2.2, which wasn't released until July).

It seems highly likely that, in fact, DLSS 2 updates since then have been updating the public version of DLSS 2 with the more advanced version being built for Nintendo. Obviously, Drake will be limited by horsepower, but the only differences from the "real" version are because DLSS 2 needs to jump through hoops on PC that consoles don't require, and this allows some performance optimizations on console
 
0
Pikmin : Star Fox
Pikmin 2 : Star Fox 64
Pikmin 3 : Star Fox Zero
Pikmin 4 : ?

OR

Pikmin : Star Fox
Pikmin 2 : Star Fox 64
Pikmin 3 : Star Fox Command
Pikmin 4 : Star Fox Zero

edit: damn wrong pinned thread lmao my bad
 
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Define heavily marketed?

The E3 2021 Direct ended with the Zelda 35th material - the Age of Calamity DLC, Skyward Sword HD was announced along with it's custom Joy-Cons, the Zelda Game and Watch, along with the first proper trailer for Tears of the Kingdom. The total Zelda coverage was 6.5 minutes.

Dread got a 5 minute trailer, the announcement of a pair of Amiibo, a 7 minute documentary on the history of the game's development, and then an hour of Treehouse Live. NoA featured it in 16 videos over the course of it's marketing cycle (by comparison, Kirby and the Forgotten Land got half as many).

Offline, Dread had an extensive television campaign. Not only were there a slew of American ads (where the game sells pretty well), but Japan and the UK (where it does not) were given custom ads, above and beyond the standard "game play + voice over" treatment. Dread had physical billboards in multiple countries including ones where the franchise sold poorly to expand it's reach. I live in a Major American City, and have never seen a Mario billboard, but there were Dread wraparounds for city busses (which I couldn't find photos of, so you get Hong Kong).

For cross promotion Dread was given a Tetris-99 cup, and was featured in every Switch OLED ad (effectively the OLED's launch title and killer app, which many reviews noted). NoA and NCL setup a competition among 17 streamers to complete as much of the game as possible in 90 minutes.

In terms of merch, in addition to the two amiibo, My Nintendo did a holographic poster, sold a customized case, Power A controller, and hoodie and did a contest for them. A Special Edition was released.

Post launch, the game got free DLC, and was Nintendo's pick* for Game of the Year at the TGAs. Generally, Dread is regarded as having a large and aggressive marketing campaign. You could not throw a cat without hitting Dread marketing.
Baller comment
 
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Define heavily marketed?

The E3 2021 Direct ended with the Zelda 35th material - the Age of Calamity DLC, Skyward Sword HD was announced along with it's custom Joy-Cons, the Zelda Game and Watch, along with the first proper trailer for Tears of the Kingdom. The total Zelda coverage was 6.5 minutes.

Dread got a 5 minute trailer, the announcement of a pair of Amiibo, a 7 minute documentary on the history of the game's development, and then an hour of Treehouse Live. NoA featured it in 16 videos over the course of it's marketing cycle (by comparison, Kirby and the Forgotten Land got half as many).

Offline, Dread had an extensive television campaign. Not only were there a slew of American ads (where the game sells pretty well), but Japan and the UK (where it does not) were given custom ads, above and beyond the standard "game play + voice over" treatment. Dread had physical billboards in multiple countries including ones where the franchise sold poorly to expand it's reach. I live in a Major American City, and have never seen a Mario billboard, but there were Dread wraparounds for city busses (which I couldn't find photos of, so you get Hong Kong).

For cross promotion Dread was given a Tetris-99 cup, and was featured in every Switch OLED ad (effectively the OLED's launch title and killer app, which many reviews noted). NoA and NCL setup a competition among 17 streamers to complete as much of the game as possible in 90 minutes.

In terms of merch, in addition to the two amiibo, My Nintendo did a holographic poster, sold a customized case, Power A controller, and hoodie and did a contest for them. A Special Edition was released.

Post launch, the game got free DLC, and was Nintendo's pick* for Game of the Year at the TGAs. Generally, Dread is regarded as having a large and aggressive marketing campaign. You could not throw a cat without hitting Dread marketing.
You are definitely better informed than I am about the marketing of that game :censored:
But in my defense, I was talking about the franchise in general rather than just one specific game in my previous posts.
 
Pikmin : Star Fox
Pikmin 2 : Star Fox 64
Pikmin 3 : Star Fox Zero
Pikmin 4 : ?

OR

Pikmin : Star Fox
Pikmin 2 : Star Fox 64
Pikmin 3 : Star Fox Command
Pikmin 4 : Star Fox Zero
Pikmin: metroidvania-esque
Pikmin: Stylish Herdlike Action Game
Pikmin Souls
Pikmin Tactics
Pikmin Crossing
 
I honestly don't know what Nintendo is waiting for to make a Zelda gacha game for phones. You could summon any character from the franchise like in FEH and play as them with the gameplay of a 2D Zelda, since it looks like Nintendo won't be making any more 2D Zeldas from now on.

I feel like they have other franchises more suited to mobile and monitization. Things like Style Savvy, Nintendogs, and Custom Robo come to mind. Trying to force franchises into mobile spaces where it simply doesn't naturally fit is probably more trouble than it's worth.

I wish they would make a Super Smash Bros CCG. Imagine how cool that would be.
 
I feel like they have other franchises more suited to mobile and monitization. Things like Style Savvy, Nintendogs, and Custom Robo come to mind. Trying to force franchises into mobile spaces where it simply doesn't naturally fit is probably more trouble than it's worth.

I wish they would make a Super Smash Bros CCG. Imagine how cool that would be.
Yes, Nintendo definitely lacks too much ambition when it comes to expanding its IPs. They could do many things but they never do anything...
 
I know a lot of us have assumed a fairly robust DLSS solution for Redrakted. But remember this is Nintendo, and I don't know how hard they would go on tensor cores and newer tech (and it seems like the Redrakted hardware was finalized a while ago). I wouldn't be surprised if they have a customized "lite" solution they worked with Nvidia for... like not quite at a DLSS 2.0 level, let alone frame gen. Then consider that upscaling from low resolutions may have bad artifacting and probably wont do much on handheld mode. A DLSS solution will certainly help Redrakted, but I don't know that it will be the "magic" that it is on PC. Or I my vibe is wrong and they just got everything needed for a full fat DLSS solution, who knows. Or super bad end, somehow no DLSS solution (or like garbage DLSS 1.0 tier solution) at all somehow, despite all the implications from the leak. Imagine the outcry.
Nintendo already uses AMD's FSR for some Switch games like Splatoon 3, so I'd imagine they would use DLSS, especially when that offers better image quality and slightly better performance by comparison.

Because this is a closed system using a custom chip, would Nvidia be able to optimize this somewhat better than their own PC GPUs?
 
So I have a general question for the thread that isn’t entirely hardware-related:

How does Nintendo maintain or grow their console business from here?

Switch is the third best-selling console to date, with a shot at taking the number one spot.

They have sold half a billion pieces of first-party software on Switch, more than any other console to date. In fact, they may sell more first party software on Switch than on DS and Wii combined (excluding Wii Sports):

n2O5EW9.jpg


Source: https://www.installbaseforum.com/fo...hardware-sales-data-from-1983-to-present.170/

Some of their games are reaching absolutely ridiculous numbers of over 50 million units sold.

I honestly don’t think there’s a lot of room for improvement on their current model. Even maintaining that kind of sales performance next-gen will be extremely challenging.

How do they grow their console business from here?
Well

I look at something like iphone and wonder could Nintendo ever reach an audience larger than 100 million ish?

Now I don’t think Nintendo could reach billions … but I do wonder if they had a slightly faster cadence of hardware releases … and a development platform that spanned multiple generations of hardware… and expanded their install base I bet they could double or triple their install base and with it their software sales …

With all that talk years back about mimicking that approach I’d have thought they would have done something about it by now…
 
You are definitely better informed than I am about the marketing of that game :censored:
But in my defense, I was talking about the franchise in general rather than just one specific game in my previous posts.
Aside from oldpuck’s big Dread post, there’s also:

- The original Metroid being part of a push for older, more experienced players. This is why it was advertised together with the NES Advantage controller.

- Metroid Prime being the GC’s big holiday game in 2002.
 
I don't know why we're pretending that we're dog piling on MVG. Some of the disagreements do go a little far, but that's as bad as it gets. Most here are expressing bewilderment at what he's saying because it contradicts some of the data we've seen. Why shouldn't we scrutinize the opinions of someone who should be more knowledgeable on this subject and should know what he's talking about?
Are you kidding me? At this rate it's cyclical. MVG says something that doesn't align with what some want or are hoping for.

Then we get people complaining about it. When in reality... It's an INNOCUOUS speculative opinion on a console that doesn't even exist yet.

Speculation in itself is someone admitting they don't have any actual evidence to back their claim, and it's just a theory or a guess. That is the premise of this thread. The door is open for them to be wrong because they aren't declaring anything. I do not think it's scrutiny when people are clearly getting negative emotions over it and labeling people things, like what...

At this rate when it comes up again, I am just going to tell people to boot up BoTW or ToTK and touch(or cut) grass.

Like, he can have an opinion, but we can't have an opinion on his opinion? It's not like this thread has gotten overly toxic last night. It's been normal discourse and I wonder if we have a problem with defending people we like who don't really need it.
You seem really bothered by this. Some people just rather read actual speculation instead of complaining about what some dude on the internet said.

But pop off king...

Here's some grass.

BAAB93FE_80F9_4E7D_B739_EDDE177D51C7.jpeg



Can't wait to see how much Drake improves this image quality!
 
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If they have kept that up, then more than likely, Nintendo worked with Nvidia to provide either some development tools to keep legacy games working on future hardware, and/or added a compatibility layer ala Proton, and can translate instructions/executables on the fly. Though that last one I wonder if it would require something at the hardware level to make it work.
The fact is that Nintendo has had several years to design a solution with dedicated teams of employees (who could solicit direct assistance from Nvidia) who have done rather stellar work in the field of legacy software in the past. Proton is a fork of Wine, and as such has quite a few software-specific compatibility tweaks involved. What Nintendo is likely going to need is a system level setup, most likely something akin to Rosetta, to translate Maxwell instructions to Ampere instructions, although there's likely to be far more similarities than differences there than doing binary translation from PowerPC to x86 and then x86 to ARM64 and thus should be a simpler solution to create. For the 1% of software or less that this does not fully translate, patches can handle the rest.

And this is really just to keep compatibility with cartridges and software that is not re-issued on new hardware, as we can expect a fair number of indie software releases to be re-issued on new hardware.
And then there's the (now pretty good) chance that Nintendo releases patches for its own software that offers Ampere instructions and also codes in things like new framerate and resolution caps at least, (if we're lucky) DLSS support to take those games to 4K at most.
Arm mentions that the Armv8 extensions (e.g. Armv8.2, etc.), which the Cortex-A78C uses, are backwards compatible with Armv8, which the Cortex-A57 uses. So I don't think the CPU's the problem with respect to backwards compatibility. The GPU's probably the problem, although not an impossible problem to solve.
It's 100% a Maxwell-related issue, no doubt about it.
I think everyone from MVG to people who understand hardware on here are on the same page when it comes to BC with a Switch 2. Atleast, the understanding of it’s not as simple as a click of a button. To me the issue isn’t MVG saying it can’t be done because he doesn’t say that.

The discussion comes from will nintendo do what’s needed to be done to have as much BC as possible.
If Nintendo wants to keep selling Switch evergreen software in the volume it currently enjoys, it will need to resolve this problem, as no one doing a hardware upgrade is likely to WANT to keep their Switch around alongside the new hardware. If their goal is "near-seamless transition", that has to be considered a given.
Shouldn't we be hearing way more leaks if there really were dev kits out in the wild and if Nintendo were planning to announce something soon? I remember Bloomberg and other leakers talking non-stop about the Switch Pro in 2021, and while it was just the OLED model in the end, there was a lot more noise than now.
What is there left to leak?

We know the chip it's using and everything about it aside from final clock speeds and process node.
We know, based on it being another Tegra-based design, that we're getting another hybrid.

We know as much, if not MORE, about the internal hardware and the intended design than we did about Switch in a similar time window from its launch. What dev is going to break NDA to tell us clock speeds, total RAM and what the read speeds on carts and storage are meant to be that only the most diehard of diehards would appreciate this far out from launch? Could they even tell us about new Joycons when Nintendo could easily not include them with 3rd-party dev kits until post-announcement? Could they tell us about the final storage capacity when dev kits almost NEVER reflect that information?

Let's face facts: we have all the best bits of information that devs would be privy to at this stage already, there's no major surprises left for them to leak, it's all tech minutia now that only daily readers of this thread care to know. And no one is risking their careers over minutia that we never got from leaks during the ramp-up to the Switch to begin with.
I actually think one of the possible avenues for growth is more third-party software sales. It might be time for Nintendo to start grabbing some of Microsoft and Sony's audience by becoming a viable place to play some of the bigger third-party games.
That was gonna be my response to your original post. No matter if they sell a little less or a little more hardware, software is where the money's made, so Nintendo's best play for platform growth is to start stealing food off of Sony and Microsoft's plate, so to speak, by netting more attention from more 3rd-parties, including the AAA crowd, if not through established IPs seeing release on the new hardware than through new ones grown on Nintendo's user base, and hope that also leads to more hardware sales in the process, or at least maintaining their current high bar. I've maintained this position for a while that it's really the only goal left that Nintendo hasn't achieved at this point.
 
Are you kidding me? At this rate it's cyclical. MVG says something that doesn't align with what some want or are hoping for.

Then we get people complaining about it. When in reality... It's an INNOCUOUS speculative opinion on a console that doesn't even exist yet.

Speculation in itself is someone admitting they don't have any actual evidence to back their claim, and it's just a theory or a guess. That is the premise of this thread. The door is open for them to be wrong because they aren't declaring anything. I do not think it's scrutiny when people are clearly getting negative emotions over it and labeling people things, like what...

At this rate when it comes up again, I am just going to tell people to boot up BoTW or ToTK and touch(or cut) grass.
I get that, but when said speculation doesn't align with certain data, the scrutiny becomes more prevalent. Yes, there are some who are over critical, but they're a vocal minority. It's just like what was happening with P4blo. If you're speculation is dubious at best, expect criticism (obviously, ignore the more toxic detractors). This is cycle is over exaggerated, imho.
 
also this BC argument is never going to get resolved until the system is revealed isn't it?
I have yet to argue with anyone regarding BC lol.

I firmly believe it is happening.

I get that, but when said speculation doesn't align with certain data, the scrutiny becomes more prevalent. Yes, there are some who are over critical, but they're a vocal minority. It's just like what was happening with P4blo. If you're speculation is dubious at best, expect criticism (obviously, ignore the more toxic detractors). This is cycle is over exaggerated, imho.

What? Noo. Pablo was literally spamming the thread with craziness and posting fake shit as if it was a matter of fact that also ended up headlining on other sites as news and MVG is just stating what he thinks. This is nothing like that. Have your opinion of an opinion and keep it moving. It can be done respectfully.

It is also worth bringing up because it is a pattern of behavior on here for people to react this way when someone says something they don't want to hear. I've seen this happen with Digital Foundry as well as a few other insiders whenever they have any dissenting opinions or guesses.
 
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You seem really bothered by this. Some people just rather read actual speculation instead of complaining about what some dude on the internet said.

But pop off king...

Here's some grass.

BAAB93FE_80F9_4E7D_B739_EDDE177D51C7.jpeg



Can't wait to see how much Drake improves this image quality!
I'm more annoyed that we're over exaggerating a problem that isn't all that pressing. People are complaining about someone with a lot of knowledge on game development saying things that are refutable (speaking specifically about BC) or just for the sake of being contrarian.
 
I honestly don't know what Nintendo is waiting for to make a Zelda gacha game for phones. You could summon any character from the franchise like in FEH and play as them with the gameplay of a 2D Zelda, since it looks like Nintendo won't be making any more 2D Zeldas from now on.
I think a smaller scale top down 2D Zelda that's puzzle based(think of Captain Toad) and features gacha can do really, really well.

I'm still expecting that Zelda dating sim based off the scrapped elements from Ocarina of Time.
That would enter the console gaming scene, but I'd like a horror game made from scrapped elements of Majora's Mask. Or really just a very creepy game, maybe visual novel or something around the guy who sells masks.

Metroid Prime Hunters remaster/sequel for Switch + mobile please.

And just add Samus in MK8DX you cowards.
 
I have to disagree. I don't care how powerful Nintendo can make their next system, $500 will shut out a large part of Nintendo's market. Nintendo launches Switch 2 for $500 and it immediately turns into "I'll wait for a price cut" for most people.

They don't need to stick to $300, but I think going higher than $400 will be a tough ask.

Why does that matter if they still have options from $150-$300 to buy for the price conscious?

A $500 Drake Switch will be geared mostly to people who already have a Switch but want to enhance their Switch gaming in both graphics and performance. Or for people interested in finally entering the Switch ecosystem because the graphics/performance is finally suitable to their tastes.

If it’s about people looking to adding yet another Switch console to their household at a decently affordable price, they will have many other options still.

This talk of 449 seems a little insane. Nintendos Upper hand has been price i feel a switch price drop and a 349-399 price is the most likely deal. Because they can eat a tiny bit of the price and make it up via software as they will be more competing with the series s rather than PS5/Series X

When the Switch launched it was the same price as the ps4 slim. It still did gangbusters.

The best selling model now is even $50 more than that.

Drake can release comparable to what the other consoles are selling at and be just fine.
 
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I suspect they'll have some releases for Switch for a while, but their big titles will be on the new hardware. They're going to want to draw people into the new console, and they're going to want to make use of what it has to offer for development.

Why wouldn’t Nintendo support the other 140 million Switch hardware out there longer than devs supported the ps4/one?

Why would the “biggest” Nintendo games not support the other 140 million Switch hardware out there longer than the “biggest” games have been supported on the ps4/one?

Price will likely be $100 more expensive than Switch OLED.

Simple as that.

Absolutely.

There is no way the new Drake Switch sits alongside the OLED at $100 or less.

If there is one thing Nintendo is known to do is to put premium prices on their premium products because they like to maintain a sense of quality and value, rather than promote an expectation of devaluing.

If Drake is priced too close to OLED, they feel it will lead people to believe that the new hardware doesn’t offer that much more OR the OLED might be priced too high for what it is.

I say they have to have more than $100 difference.

Sure, the Lite was able to have a $100 difference, but it had the EXACT same insides as the model that was $100 more.


That's completely irrelevant and a different subject altogether, though. What does matter is that Drake won't be a small jump in the slightest (it's not a rumour, this is stolen info) and games truly made for it will blow away anything you ever managed to play on the Switch, while not needing to be "AAAA".

Ah yes, I remember all the Wii games that blew away anything I could have ever imagined playing on the GameCube!

And I remember all the Wii U games that blew away anything I could have ever imagined playing on the Wii!

And I remember all the Switch games that blew away anything I could have ever imagined playing on the Wii U!
 
Not just COVID, the march of technology. It's relatively easier to downscale an Xbox Series S game to Xbox One than it is an Xbox One game to Xbox 360. Not just in raw performance but in how similar they are. Very few, if any, games NEED the "next gen" to function, and when you can do cross-gen and get more sales from it without a tremendous amount of extra work, you'd tend to do so.

There are vanishingly few gameplay concepts or games that simply can't function on even Nintendo Switch, and last Gen home consoles have at least twice the grunt of Switch. Like we see with Sega, it's entirely possible to make and publish games ranging from Switch to Series X, nearly two orders of magnitude, performance wise, and do well off it.

Nintendo knows this, I think, and will embrace cross gen in a way they rarely did before.
I broadly agree, although my particular phrasing of it would be that the growth rate of the average complexity of conventional major game design is slower than the growth rate of computing power.
But extra computing ability is such a shame to waste... still, I have trust in human creativity to work with what's available.
So I'm really excited for the prospects of unconventional game design concepts. I want to see some of that lateral thinking!

For example, here's something that occurred to me today. Just like how when single core progression slowed down, CPU design moved over to multi core, I think that there's potential for multi-game/task design.
Imagine something similar to split screen couch co-op, but instead of 2 players, it's 1 player controlling both sides. The left side of the controller is used for the left side's input; the right side of the controller for the right half. Granted, this essentially asks for 'games designed to be playable with one hand'. So directions + few command buttons.
One example would be, say, turn based JRPGs with stories following two perspectives. Conventionally, maybe you'd be alternating between the perspectives. But if you have multithreading grunt to spare, why not play both simultaneously? Ok, reading text would be annoying; would probably need to like, use the touchscreen to maximize one side/minimize the other when it's story time. Or it's an opportunity for an attachment that's basically a return of that Game Boy accessory that was... a larger screen or magnifying glass? Forgot which.
Aside from that, platformers, shoot-em-ups, anything else doable with a NES level of inputs. Imagine operating two at the same time. Hell, would it necessarily be two of the same genre? No, I say!

dusts this post off... again
"Hmm, with the passing of Raquel Walch today, Fantastic Voyage now comes to mind... eyes the Dr. Mario viruses They can be used. But how? The player is shrunken and then enters a patient's body to fight the the Viruses, yes, but what's the core game here? Maybe a Dr. Mario, but in 3D and the camera shifted to behind the player avatar, and you're moving about throwing capsules at the viruses (I must admit being inspired to a degree by that thread on Cosmic Smash). But is that impressive enough? Does it give off 'can't be satisfyingly executed on base Switch' vibes? Probably not. May need to kick it up a notch; maybe multiplayer co-op along with cranking up viral density/load."

Here's one possible way for this example to further evolve:
Picture the base 3D Dr. Mario as the left side of the screen. Now I add another conceit: the main player ship has limited capsules to work with! Oh no, now what? Now there's a secondary vessel making supply runs to replenish the main ship's ammo. These supply runs can be a simple flying game of some sort. A shoot-em-up without the shooting; could be 2D or 3D. The key is it needs to be able to be played with just directions/ABXY. But do you alternate between playing the two modes? No. Simultaneous play is how this idea goes. Your left hand plays 3D Dr. Mario. Your right hand plays the resupply run game.
Bonus extension: Yaknow, Dr. Mario doesn't really need all that many input buttons, right? Even with the above, you probably should still have L2 and R2 remaining. Enter sub/mini-game #3: The manufacturing of capsules/loading up the next batch for the supply vessel. Assuming only two inputs to work with, it's gonna be super simple. What I originally had in mind was something super lame, like waiting on automatic dice rolls and using one input to accept/refuse. But screw that, just remembered something while typing this paragraph; Game & Watch uses two buttons. Remember that G&W game where you're controlling a trampoline; moving left and right trying to bounce objects from one side to the other? Let's go with that. In this case, the objects will be halves of capsules with randomized colors. Every two halves you manage to bounce over to the right side completes one capsule. Letting a half drop to the floor has no consequence beyond it disappearing.
And remember, the conceit wrapping up all of this stuff is that all three are being played simultaneously. Ok, the screen will probably be cut such that Dr. Mario takes up half of the width and majority of the height, the supply vessel flying game is the other half of the width and same height, and the capsule bouncing game is full width, but only a minority of the height.

Yeah, somewhat, because ...

Okay, I'll put a quick couple things I'd like for the new console in response to @oldpuck's earlier open inquiry.

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But you're right, I think. It would be incredibly difficult to keep up the growth.

By the way, the console case should be able to become translucent so I can see the pikmin hard at work maintaining the hardware and making it operate.
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Are we 100% sure this is going to be a new switch could it be something different other than the same tablet form factor
Strictly speaking, the design points towards a low power device, and it explicitly has the ability to be hooked up to another display.
I mean sure, there could be a timeline out there where this thing is a Nintendo thin and light laptop. But history would suggest high likelihood for tablet again.
 
Nintendo already uses AMD's FSR for some Switch games like Splatoon 3, so I'd imagine they would use DLSS, especially when that offers better image quality and slightly better performance by comparison.

Because this is a closed system using a custom chip, would Nvidia be able to optimize this somewhat better than their own PC GPUs?
It's not slightly better performance, it's a lot better performance due to using dedicated hardware (tensor cores).

And yea it should run faster than it does on similar powered PCs due to being integrated into NVN.

And I agree they will probably use DLSS and not their own custom tech.
 
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yes. best not to expect compatibility with 100% of switch games, but more like 98%-99%

Based on what. Meaning, which rumor are you choosing to base this off of?

This would make sense if the Switch 2 was extremely weak, but if the Switch 2 is a reasonable leap, this makes very little sense unless the Switch 2 version of Prime 4 is barely an upgrade.

One of the bigger issues Prime 4 faces is that it's likely it will look worse visually than Prime 1 Remastered on Switch (as that game is a tiny environment game with little environmental interaction and few enemies on screen at once) so a Switch 2 version might be helpful in avoiding the first impression of "why does it look worse than this remaster?"

Well I think you are hitting on what the Drake model will do for Switch gaming.

Games like MP4 and ToTK and the next 3D Mario will be allowed to be played at full 4K/60fps with improved graphical IQ

Rather than having the OLED version of ToTK (and other games in the next few years) where 900p and almost locked 30fps and poor AA and medium graphics settings are your only options.

The power of the Drake model with DLSS will give the optimal version many people have wanted since 2017.

If you call that “barely an upgrade”, well I guess this would be the part when discussing new Nintendo hardware where people inevitably chant “temper your expectations”
 
Nobody on this forum will like my answer, but:

Multiple hardware SKUs. Diverge the console and handheld lines again.

Nintendo achieved their greatest success (Wii+DS at 250m sales) when they supported two systems. More systems on the market = more sales. The hard cap for a single system is 150, and I don't see that changing.

The problem with your answer is believing that raw hardware sales = success. And it doesn’t.

The Switch is bringing in more revenue, more profit, more software sales, and increasing more engagement in Nintendo games than at any era in their history. Even more than the Wii+DS years.

So, no. Switch has proven Nintendo can be more successful, and sell more games, by focusing on one platform rather than divert their attention between multiples.

To answer that guys question, what Nintendo should do to maintain this brand and this kind of success is what Iwata suggested for the Switch platform, follow the Apple model of hardware releases while maintaining the permanent OS/account platform as the bridge.
 
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