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StarTopic Future Nintendo Hardware & Technology Speculation & Discussion |ST| (Read the staff posts before commenting!)

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Danny said:
Lots of talk about 256 GB storage and big third party AAA games. But how big a jump in size do we think Nintendo first party games will see on the Switch 2? I expect Zelda and Xenoblade on Switch 2 will take up a lot of space.
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In terms of storage space, I hope Nintendo counterbalances it with good compression tools that utilize the SSD. If they do that, we shouldn't have to worry too much. At most I expect something around the 50GB mark for first-party titles at worse.
 
Danny said:
Lots of talk about 256 GB storage and big third party AAA games. But how big a jump in size do we think Nintendo first party games will see on the Switch 2? I expect Zelda and Xenoblade on Switch 2 will take up a lot of space.
Click to expand...
It really depends on what they can do with new cards and their size. I think that will be the limiting factor. At the least, I think we'll see more games breaking 32GB for sure.
 
Omfg it's working now 😵‍💫

If this site dies just because of the RAM and storage, imagine the reveal
 
Really depends on what the game is to determine Nintendo game sizes and also how expensive the bigger card cards are. I'd imagine the new format would have 32 GB filling the spot of 16 GB cards. Or maybe 64 GB is the new 16 GB and 128 GB cards become the much more expensive ones.

They wont ship games on the super expensive cards same as Switch. That'll mostly be what limits size I would figure.
 
Danny said:
Lots of talk about 256 GB storage and big third party AAA games. But how big a jump in size do we think Nintendo first party games will see on the Switch 2? I expect Zelda and Xenoblade on Switch 2 will take up a lot of space.
Click to expand...

SD cards are always on offer, not too concerned about that personally.
 
Even though I have a 1TB micro sd card on the side, I am probably going to get something bigger for the next system. I kind of just want to have one card and be done with it for the entire generation. Hopefully the next system has a high capacity. IIRC, the Switch 1 can only accept up to 2TB cards.

Danny said:
Lots of talk about 256 GB storage and big third party AAA games. But how big a jump in size do we think Nintendo first party games will see on the Switch 2? I expect Zelda and Xenoblade on Switch 2 will take up a lot of space.
Click to expand...

I'd imagine that there will be a decent bump. The next big Mario and Kirby adventures won't be less than 6 GB's. I can only imagine how big the next Monolith Soft game will be.

My biggest wonder is how much will fit on the cartridges and how big the required downloads will be.
 
KMA3 said:
Although ram and rom are more wonderful than expected
I'm a little disappointed that the gpu is ampere
ampere does not support frame generation, right?
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Not DLSS frame generation, no. But an equally underpowered Lovelace wouldn't be expected to do it well either. Nor do we even know if the thing will support output of greater than 60fps in either mode. There are always things like FSR frame generation out there if a developer really wants to try stretching.
Jake said:
Ok, I have a 512 GB microSD on my Switch right now. Once Switch 2 is released next year, I’ll probably just use my microSD to transfer my Switch 1 games over, then get one of the SD Express cards.
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You can't even do that between multiple Switch 1s, since they encode the downloaded games specifically for a system. Presumably it will be the same next go around.
YolkFolk said:
How do people feel about 256GB of storage - taking into account the potential size of third party games?
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Fine. ~200GB as a cap for what kind of single game you could download without expansion is more generous for 2025 than ~26GB was for 2017.
ZonaiResearcher said:
Are they really going to go for MicroSD Express over MicroSD? 256GB is going to be filled up super fast with larger game sizes on Switch 2. My Switch 1 is nearly full with a 1TB microSD. I don’t think microSD Express is ready at this time.
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It's not like supporting microSD Express would prevent lesser cheaper cards from being used. Just, those slow cards wouldn't be allowed to create a bottleneck for everyone and everything.
 
I am very confident that the console will not be named Switch Attach. Not only is it worse than Wii U, but I don't think we have any significant evidence of the name. The YouTube survey just read like a mistake to me.
 
How do others feel about those bulletpoints being paraded around?
  • Handheld: Right above PS4* before DLSS
  • Docked: Between PS4 Pro* & Xbox Series S* before DLSS with more modern hardware than the former
  • RAM: Slower than PS5 & XSX|S in
    the speed department, but more capacity than XSS. Should have 10.5-11 GB
    of RAM available to games going by the Switch 1's RAM allotment for its
    OS.
  • Storage: UFS 3.1's max speeds should be a hair under XSX|S (2.1 GB/s vs. 2.4 GB/s), still plenty fast even if not maxed out.Lines up with what Digital Foundry &
    NateDrake heard about decompression techniques & fast load times of
    the BotW tech demo (respectively for each source).
I have always thought trying to say "this is where Switch 2 will be in relative to XSS, PS5, PS4 Pro, etc" is an exercise in futility because the architectures are more than a bit different. As in Switch 2 will excel in areas, but not other areas, compared to XSS, SD, etc.

It's a bit disappointing to see those bulletpoints being pushed/shared in various places (like Twitter for example) more than the shipment data findings have been - because I feel like those kind of assessments can be a bit subjective, I'd rather just stick to the cold hard facts (12GB, 256 UFS 3.1, etc).
 
JoshuaJSlone said:
You can't even do that between multiple Switch 1s, since they encode the downloaded games specifically for a system. Presumably it will be the same next go around.
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I'm hoping for a download from local network feature. It takes too long to redownload stuff - I honestly hope we're talking microsd-express to force a new card and some sort of local system transfer.
 
darthdiablo said:
How do others feel about those bulletpoints being paraded around?
  • Handheld: Right above PS4* before DLSS
  • Docked: Between PS4 Pro* & Xbox Series S* before DLSS with more modern hardware than the former
  • RAM: Slower than PS5 & XSX|S in
    the speed department, but more capacity than XSS. Should have 10.5-11 GB
    of RAM available to games going by the Switch 1's RAM allotment for its
    OS.
  • Storage: UFS 3.1's max speeds should be a hair under XSX|S (2.1 GB/s vs. 2.4 GB/s), still plenty fast even if not maxed out.Lines up with what Digital Foundry &
    NateDrake heard about decompression techniques & fast load times of
    the BotW tech demo (respectively for each source).
I have always thought trying to say "this is where Switch 2 will be in relative to XSS, PS5, PS4 Pro, etc" is an exercise in futility because the architectures are more than a bit different. As in Switch 2 will excel in areas, but not other areas, compared to XSS, SD, etc.
Click to expand...
I think it's kinda dangerous to go around saying all this stuff without confirmation on clock speeds and that node size. We're pretty sure we have the right info and can make inferences based on other leaks, but it's not all concrete. Going around and telling everyone to expect a portable PS4 Pro which is as good as a Series S when docked is asking for trouble and backlash eventually imo. (I know your example doesnt say it's as good as a Series S, but I've seen a ton of people already make that comparison)
 
BDGAME said:
These 6.35W for 624 MHz clocks put switch 2 at 2 TFlops on portable mode and with a consume close to the original Switch (8.9W full machine) , so 3 hour of battery if it has SEC 5LPP with a similar battery.

But they say here that the Peak for T239 GPU would be at 3.5 Tflops, and that Switch 2 can achieve it at 1.2 GHz. So even at SEC 8NM switch 2 can run clocks at 522 MHz and consume 7W, what can still give a proper good 1.7 Tflop handled and a battery time close to the original Switch.

So, even at 8NM switch 2 can be a powerful hybrid, if these numbers are actured. Am i missing something or the entire debate between 8 and 4 is not worth in the end?
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if i read thraktors stuff right, this is just the gpus power draw estimations, so the full switch2 would be drawing more power than this when you add in screen, cpu, ram, and other components. its more to show just how much extra power is required because of this fat gpu
 
darthdiablo said:
How do others feel about those bulletpoints being paraded around?
  • Handheld: Right above PS4* before DLSS
  • Docked: Between PS4 Pro* & Xbox Series S* before DLSS with more modern hardware than the former
  • RAM: Slower than PS5 & XSX|S in
    the speed department, but more capacity than XSS. Should have 10.5-11 GB
    of RAM available to games going by the Switch 1's RAM allotment for its
    OS.
  • Storage: UFS 3.1's max speeds should be a hair under XSX|S (2.1 GB/s vs. 2.4 GB/s), still plenty fast even if not maxed out.Lines up with what Digital Foundry &
    NateDrake heard about decompression techniques & fast load times of
    the BotW tech demo (respectively for each source).
I have always thought trying to say "this is where Switch 2 will be in relative to XSS, PS5, PS4 Pro, etc" is an exercise in futility because the architectures are more than a bit different. As in Switch 2 will excel in areas, but not other areas, compared to XSS, SD, etc.

It's a bit disappointing to see those bulletpoints being pushed/shared in various places - because I feel like those kind of assessments can be a bit subjective, I'd rather just stick to the cold hard facts (12GB, 256 UFS 3.1, etc).
Click to expand...

Trying to narrow down the specifications for the console in terms of, "it's above X but below Y pre-DLSS" will always be unwise as the situation is more nuanced than that and it'll lead to ill-informed expectations
 
carbvan said:
I think it's kinda dangerous to go around saying all this stuff without confirmation on clock speeds and that node size. We're pretty sure we have the right info and can make inferences based on other leaks, but it's not all concrete. Going around and telling everyone to expect a portable PS4 Pro which is as good as a Series S when docked is asking for trouble and backlash eventually imo. (I know your example doesnt say it's as good as a Series S, but I've seen a ton of people already make that comparison)
Click to expand...
That's my thoughts as well.

Those first 2 bulletpoints cannot even really be inferred simply from 12GB RAM and/or 256 GB storage, which was the only main things that came out from LiC's shipment data findings.

The person was piggybacking on top of this to inject his own opinion on where Switch 2 would be in relative to other consoles, and this injected take is now propagating out there and being taken somewhat as gospel right now. 🤦‍♂️
 
darthdiablo said:
How do others feel about those bulletpoints being paraded around?
  • Handheld: Right above PS4* before DLSS
  • Docked: Between PS4 Pro* & Xbox Series S* before DLSS with more modern hardware than the former
  • RAM: Slower than PS5 & XSX|S in
    the speed department, but more capacity than XSS. Should have 10.5-11 GB
    of RAM available to games going by the Switch 1's RAM allotment for its
    OS.
  • Storage: UFS 3.1's max speeds should be a hair under XSX|S (2.1 GB/s vs. 2.4 GB/s), still plenty fast even if not maxed out.Lines up with what Digital Foundry &
    NateDrake heard about decompression techniques & fast load times of
    the BotW tech demo (respectively for each source).
I have always thought trying to say "this is where Switch 2 will be in relative to XSS, PS5, PS4 Pro, etc" is an exercise in futility because the architectures are more than a bit different. As in Switch 2 will excel in areas, but not other areas, compared to XSS, SD, etc.

It's a bit disappointing to see those bulletpoints being pushed/shared in various places (like Twitter for example) more than the shipment data findings have been - because I feel like those kind of assessments can be a bit subjective, I'd rather just stick to the cold hard facts (12GB, 256 UFS 3.1, etc).
Click to expand...
Ugh.

UGH.


You know my thoughts here!!!

But "more modern than the former" is barely even true! It's "more modern than both"!!!

UGH!!!
 
Don't really like how the post about slightly better than PS4 performance while portable and better than PS4 Pro performance while docked info is spreading across X and Reddit. We simply do not have enough information about clock speed or process node. Its setting people up for disappointment.
 
Please work now, I much prefer talking about specs stuff in here, I get less of a headache. I literally read a post elsewhere that said console optimization doesn't make a meaningful difference. 😵‍💫
 
SnowydayUK said:
Does this mean Switch 2 is in Mass Production or starting to go into Mass Production
Click to expand...
sounds like it's very close as the data is still a couple of months behind.

speculation - Switch 2 is going to mass production at approximately the same time as it would have for a 2024 launch. this will be before the end of the summer and the reveal will be before October, a month i've seen pop up repeatedly as the potential reveal timeframe.

so anytime between July-September and i'd personally take July/August over anything later.
 
8pjobw.jpg
 
SnowydayUK said:
Thanks Nate
Click to expand...
And if past is of any indicator (cuz patterns don't necessarily remain a pattern),

The announcement will be around when the mass production starts. This has held true for SWOLED, Lite, Orig Switch. For example, orig Switch mass production began in October 2016, around the same time announcement was made.

Which would make sense, it is to get ahead of the narrative & inevitable leaks (mass production is a huge logistical thing, it becomes nearly impossible to control leaks at that point)
 
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Zedark said:
Hi all, anything new?

Just kidding, I just read up on the last 20 pages. I stated months before that I personally feel that RAM bandwidth is a more important investment than absolute RAM capacity, at least in the battle between 16GB LPDDR5 and 12GB LPDDR5X. I'm glad to read we seem to be getting the latter.

I wonder how big of a deal 12GB vs. 16GB actually is for a device like this Switch 2 tbh. Games will probably use lower quality assets, which reduces the need for capacity vs. PS5/XSX. And additionally the decompression engine and high speed storage help with refreshing RAM contents pretty quickly anyway. So I feel having higher bandwidth, which feeds data from RAM to CPU and GPU and prevents those from stalling, is more important as a bottleneck than RAM capacity in my humble estimation.
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I don't believe Switch 2 will use low quality assets.

The machine that have these is the XBox Series S because it targeting on 1080p only, but switch 2 probably will try to make a bigger resolutions, thanks to DLSS.

For what I read here, DLSS still needs the high quality textures to make a game in 4K. So, switch 2 will need to send these for the cuda cores and gpu do the trick.

But since a portable uses slow memory and has a lower bandwidth, that can be a little trick. The solution that looks like they will use is put a data's descompressor on the hardware. That way switch 2 will be able to receive a compacted texture (like a 1 GB of high quality textures compacted in 200 MB, for example) , what will make possible to traffic that amount of data without a hit because of bandwidth or lack of more memory.

That way games with 144p or 4k will look good on Switch 2.
 
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mrtanooki said:
Don't really like how the post about slightly better than PS4 performance while portable and better than PS4 Pro performance while docked info is spreading across X and Reddit. We simply do not have enough information about clock speed or process node. Its setting people up for disappointment.
Click to expand...
It really isn't. Real world performance can realistically expected to be above this in many scenarios. Not "raw FLOPS", which are a kind of bad representation for comparison, but it has upscaling, it has mesh shaders, etc.

But it's also a really bad comparison. It's not a Gen8 console, it's a Gen9 handheld.
 
darthdiablo said:
And if past is of any indicator (cuz patterns don't necessarily remain a pattern),

The announcement will be around when the mass production starts. This has held true for SWOLED, Lite, Orig Switch. For example, orig Switch mass production began in October 2016, around the same time announcement was made.

Which would make sense, it is to get ahead of the narrative & inevitable leaks (mass production is a huge logistical thing, it becomes nearly impossible to control leaks at that point)
Click to expand...
Do we have a timeline for when the other Switch units started stockpiling -> mass production? Could be useful for predicting an announcement now.
 
Josh5890 said:
Even though I have a 1TB micro sd card on the side, I am probably going to get something bigger for the next system. I kind of just want to have one card and be done with it for the entire generation. Hopefully the next system has a high capacity. IIRC, the Switch 1 can only accept up to 2TB cards.



I'd imagine that there will be a decent bump. The next big Mario and Kirby adventures won't be less than 6 GB's. I can only imagine how big the next Monolith Soft game will be.

My biggest wonder is how much will fit on the cartridges and how big the required downloads will be.
Click to expand...
Well, it might be a while until we get anything past 2TB. Isn't the current maximum 1.5? Even that is pretty pricy.
 
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