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StarTopic Future Nintendo Hardware & Technology Speculation & Discussion |ST| (Read the staff posts before commenting!)

For God's sake, Gamecube wasn't the last powerful hardware from Nintendo. It was Switch. It was a powerful mobile hardware which left a lot of people impressed. At times the talk about Switch power feels like revisionism.
For a 2017 tablet, it was pretty nuts. The only reason why it's not so highly praised anymore is because we're 7 years since launch lmao
Both of you are correct. In recent years, the Switch "not being powerful" narrative got stronger and louder simply due to its age, how the big 3rd party games still seem to be missing the console, and all the graphics comparisons/glitches/bugs etc.

With regards to the reception towards the reveal and release of the Switch, there was a LOT of acclaim for the games that you could finally now play on a portable console and I'll always remember when I watched the reveal trailer (and thinking that Nintendo is so back /hj). One of the most prevalent opinions on the reveal being, HOLY SHIT YOU CAN PLAY SKYRIM ON THE GO
and here, I'm gonna double down on looking forward to playing Starfield on Switch 2 next year

6sWt08m.png

shoutout to the one who commented asking about RDR2 coming to Switch, it's finally (maybe) gonna happen in the next 2 years lol

here's the reddit threads in the pic for a throwback: thread 1, thread 2, thread 3
 
the only part I have trouble wrapping my head around is the better RT. I know Nvidia has better RT, but it's lacking in power and raw horsepower. we have yet to see Ray Reconstruction in work, so we can't say yet if that's the cause. and we don't have many benchmarks comparing the versions of UE5 to track improvements
It’s possible that the smaller GPU is helping it in this case, assuming Nvidia kept the same L2 cache and didn’t make it have half the bandwidth, then the less ALUs sharing the L2 meaning more resources for the ALUs keeping those 1536 shaders better fed.

L2 bandwidth on Ampere is about the same as RDNA2’s L3 bandwidth I believe.
 
Catching up here - where is the "March release" chatter coming from? I assume some of us just watched Nate's YT. I thought it meant there was chatter about March 2024 would be the "reveal", with release later in the year? March 2024 release seems pretty optimistic to me.
It’s speculative commentary, for now. Just leave it at that. From the Nate video. Also, from the Eurogamer Article about not being sure if it’s a late launch or an earlier launch.
 
I'm just going to say it...

The next 3D mainline Mario in 4K/60fps using photo mode like Odyssey is going to be amazing.

(And imagine if it's open world, even in 1080p it would look amazing).
 
So....

  • Pokemon DLC leaker saying graphics patch for new Switch to be released alongside DLC2
  • Eurogamer report earlier in the week from Tom Phillips saying Nintendo is "keen" on launching sooner than the second half of 2024
  • Nate hearing vague mentions of "March 2024" among developers.

Seems to me like multiple points are starting to align for a launch in the first half of 2024.
Im not so sure about that. Eurogamer reported it, but this was likely developer chatter and speculation. Nate reported it, but it’s from the same chatter and again it was speculative, even adding that he’s not sure if that’s announcing the new system in March besides the “I’m not sure if it means releasing in March”. The Pokémon DLC is iffy at best.

Not to be a downer but I haven’t seen anything concretely pointing to an early 2024 launch. Current actions give me a different vibe. Unless they feel like sabotaging this holiday for the sake of a new system, I don’t see it getting announced this year or hitting a March 2024 release date.

Also, March is simply an assumption, it’s only earlier than whatever late 2024 is. Could be that it is speculation of it being November 24, but they decide for September 24. Or they go with May 24. Again, all speculative.

Not to rain on the parade.
 
Quoted by: LiC
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Guys, hype is fun and all, but don't go batshit crazy with this 4k60 stuff. Only because a lastgen-to-be game was tech demoed at 4k60 using DLSS doesn't mean every 1st party full game will be.

Edit: just noticed it says 'Boo' under my name. Lol. Found that funny seeing it after posting this.
 
Thinking about it March 2024 is likely the reveal date.

Nintendo wouldn't talk about launch plans to publishers being shown the console the first time, it makes more sense to say, here's our new Switch, we are planning to reveal it March 2024, do you want to bring some of your games over, and chances for co-marketing at the reveal and at launch window.
 
1600 pages of entertainment

Guys, hype is fun and all, but don't go batshit crazy with this 4k60 stuff. Only because a lastgen-to-be game was tech demoed at 4k60 using DLSS doesn't mean every 1st party full game will be.
If indies can hit a nice sweetspot and last gen games can I'll be satisfied. I don't really ask for much tbh, I'm probably ok with gaming on 1080p for a good while.
 
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Im not so sure about that. Eurogamer reported it, but this was likely developer chatter and speculation. Nate reported it, but it’s from the same chatter and again it was speculative, even adding that he’s not sure if that’s announcing the new system in March besides the “I’m not sure if it means releasing in March”. The Pokémon DLC is iffy at best.

Not to be a downer but I haven’t seen anything concretely pointing to an early 2024 launch. Current actions give me a different vibe. Unless they feel like sabotaging this holiday for the sake of a new system, I don’t see it getting announced this year or hitting a March 2024 release date.

Also, March is simply an assumption, it’s only earlier than whatever late 2024 is. Could be that it is speculation of it being November 24, but they decide for September 24. Or they go with May 24. Again, all speculative.

Not to rain on the parade.
So we need something "concretely pointing" to an early 2024 launch, but for a later launch, a "vibe" suffices?

Sabotaging the holiday is an oft-repeated cliché without much justification behind it. When they're going to announce the system is dependent on when they're going to launch it, and when they're going to launch it is based on its own development timeline and its own plans for success, not the sales of the thing it will replace. There isn't even any empirical evidence (publicly) that late adopters stop existing when new hardware is announced, it's just something people say and assume is true. To the extent that it's true, it's still weighed against the importance of timing for success of the new thing that's going to sell for the next 7 years.
 
It's also not unlikely that March 2024 is the "ALL ABOARD"/submission deadline to devs/publishers to get on the hype train when it starts chugging along/launch in May/June.
 
Imo, it would be foolish of Nintendo not to replicate and enhance the Switch's success. Be it form factor, release date, hybrid model, etc.
 
Re the March thing.

I think someone else suggested it in the million or so pages overnight, but would it make sense if March is when NDAs expire?

That would be a thing that developers would know, because they'd have signed the NDA. And it would also fit with developers assuming that something must be happening by March while being unsure of exactly what that something is. Which could then lead to March-related gossip as they speculate among themselves.

It would also fit if there are a cohort of developers who don't have dev kits (or specific information about launch timing targets) who might be signing NDAs to see a GamesCom presentation.

Anyway, I thought it was worth putting that out there as a possible explanation of why developers might know something about a March date without being able to offer clarity as to whether it's for an announcement, launch or something else.
 
Because the Eurogamer or VGC article (can't remember which) say Nintendo is trying to get the console out the first half of 2024 and now Nate says that March 2024 has something happening. This is most likely either the release (less likely) or reveal (more likely). Nintendo said in the past that they want to keep the announcement to release relatively short. A March announcement and then waiting 8 months until the holidays isn't a quick timeframe. All 3 of these things combined, first half of 2024 makes the most sense.
Clarification: They never mentioned first half, they simply said “sooner if possible”. People are somehow inferring that this means March 2024, because of Nate’s speculative comment on March 2024 (the end of the FY).
 
Guys, hype is fun and all, but don't go batshit crazy with this 4k60 stuff. Only because a lastgen-to-be game was tech demoed at 4k60 using DLSS doesn't mean every 1st party full game will be.

Edit: just noticed it says 'Boo' under my name. Lol. Found that funny seeing it after posting this.
It's gonna be like the ps5 and Series where people thought 60fps was gonna be the norm, but only because of cross-gen
 
So, a few general comments on the updates:

Firstly, and most importantly, now that "around March" is on the table, I'd like to officially announce the re-launch of #TeamLeapDay. We'll be accepting membership applications by messenger pigeon, which must be accompanied by a one thousand word essay on why Wave Race should be a launch title.

Secondly, it looks like I wasn't completely wrong about BoTW, with both DLSS and fast loading confirmed to be in the demo. No mention of ray tracing, but two out of three ain't bad.

Actually being able to run DLSS at 4K/60fps is a bit better than I'd expected. My personal expectations were 4K/30fps, or around 1440p/60fps, just due to the cost of running DLSS itself, but it looks like it's either cheaper than I expected, or the hardware is more capable than I expected, or a bit of both. Good news either way.

The talk of "instant" load times in BoTW is interesting. Of course nothing is truly instant (even Ratchet & Clank uses a short portal sequence to hide loading, a bit like the old door-opening trick on Metroid Prime back in the day), but we're probably talking around a second or so for it to feel instant. That's about a 30x speed up compared to the Switch.

It's important to note that there are multiple factors which impact loading speeds, not just the speed of the storage itself (although as I've explained before, I was already expecting that to be much quicker). Roughly speaking, I'd categorise them into three different bottlenecks which could factor into how fast loading is:
  1. The speed of the storage medium itself. Obviously this can be a big bottleneck, as if you want to pull 1GB of data off a storage device which maxes out at 100MB/s, you can't do that any quicker than 10 seconds.
  2. The CPU overhead associated with pulling that data off the storage medium. The main part of this nowadays is decompression. If your CPU can't decompress data fast enough, then even if you've got super fast storage you're not going to be leveraging it (unless you want to ship purely uncompressed assets and balloon the game size). Aside from decompression, though, there's still some additional overhead of just communicating with the storage medium and transferring the data, which can be non-trivial.
  3. Non-storage related CPU work. This is doing everything you need to do to actually set up the game state. Allocate memory for all the different things you need to keep track of during gameplay, initialise all the different systems which are going to be running, and sync the game state with the save file. This is also where you're doing any kind of procedural generation, which is often overlooked when thinking about load times. People playing No Man's Sky on the PS5 for the first time were really puzzled why it wasn't loading much quicker than the PS4, but the game is fully procedural, so it was never really bottlenecked by storage in the first place.
On Switch, it seems most games are bottlenecked by number 2. We know that T239 contains a dedicated File Decompression Engine, so ideally we're not bottlenecked here anymore, but if we were, it would suggest that the FDE is around 30x as fast at decompressing data as the Switch CPU. I don't know if we can say for sure what data rates BoTW was operating at while loading, but I don't believe it's noticeably faster on internal storage or microSD than game cards. Game cards top out at 50MB/s, so if the Switch CPU was able to keep up with that, then we'd be looking at 30x as much, or about 1.5GB/s of compressed data coming into the FDE. It could certainly be less than that, with the CPU perhaps bottlenecking things even lower on the Switch, but honestly 1.5GB/s or so wouldn't be crazy. Both MS and Sony designed much faster decompression hardware 3 years previously, and Nvidia isn't exactly a slouch when it comes to designing fast coprocessors.

If we were bottlenecked on storage, then again comparing to the original Switch game card as the baseline we'd once more be looking at around 1.5GB/s. For a while I've been considering UFS 3.1 to be reasonably likely, which ranges from 1.7GB/s to 2GB/s read speeds, and is pretty much in line with this. In fact, if Nintendo actually is considering 512GB of storage for the console, then 1.7GB/s UFS 3.1 is the slowest option they would have. Nobody makes 512GB modules for either eMMC or UFS 2.

The last one probably isn't trivial for BoTW on the original Switch, although likely a lighter workload than it is for ToTK with its increased number of gameplay systems. I definitely don't expect a 30x speedup here, but between taking the decompression work off the CPU, and just having more, faster CPU cores to do the work, it should be much faster either way.

Of course this is all based on a very specific reading of "instant" loading. If 2 seconds counts as instant, then divide every number in half. If it's 0.5 seconds, multiply by 2, etc. However, given expectations of internal storage close to 2GB/s, and dedicated decompression hardware to remove the main CPU bottleneck, dropping load times from 30s to around 1s seems quite reasonable.
Thraktor please, there’s only so much I can handle
 
With how little they are utilizing 8 this gen so far that makes me very confused.
It was (probably) intentionally asking for something high to make them raise the bar.

Eg

expects them to go with better CPUs and better storage
gauges how much they can chew
Sony and MS deliver much better requirements than they requested
they get what they really wanted

They only wanted 1GB/s probably because they expected less than that, they got more. They wanted more CPU cores because they expected something moderate, they got a nice jump from the Jaguars.

If neither asked for this, the storage could have been slower and the CPUs could have been slower.


Remember that consoles historically have terrible CPUs and storage for games, until now.
 
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just listened to the podcast very interesting thanks for Nate & the other guy.

the March date was mentioned as a possible date devs could submit games for launch (with a lead time of a couple of months to iron out issues). this seems more realistic than a March launch to me, May/June being the actual launch window if it's H1. reveal around Jan/Feb works for this too the only issue is production leaks, would be better to reveal this year?

also MP4 mentioned as a possible cross-gen launch title. this late in the game it simply has to be given this title's potential as a cross-gen showcase. first time we see it will be the next-gen version or it's a massive missed oppurtunity. 3D Mario/DK can come as the primary launch title with wider appeal. two big games & patches/ports, more than good with many bases covered.
 
March - Reveal
June - Games Blowout
September or after (2024) - Release

If the plan was a release in March 2024 then the system would need to be announced in some form this year.

Naw, if the plan is a March launch, they could easily announce it in Jan/Feb 2024. This thing doesn’t need more than a month or two lead time.

If the announcement is March, then they can release it in May/June.

6 month time between announcment and this upgrade is totally unnecessary lol.

Not many (none) developers finding out about Switch 2 in September 2023 and going to have games ready for March 2024.

Really doesn’t matter if 3rd party has games ready for its launch or not.

This report is saying Nintendo is only now showing 3rd party devs how UE5 runs on the new upgrade? Nintendo isn’t going to wait around for them to absorb that and figure it out now lol. Nintendo will release a new hardware model
when THEY are ready too.

Also, if you are going off Nate, he said devs were upset in 2022 about games they were developing for the new hardware not being able to come out by the end of 2022. So, it sounds like there are 3rd party efforts already have well been worked on. But again, they don’t matter to help push the new model release
 
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Rich confirms the Zelda demo was 4k60 (doesn't he?) which is hardly revelatory, but was new info
Perhaps I’m misinterpreting this:

@ 10:10

But it reads to me like, when using the context of the discussion, he’s making a speculative assumption based on what was done with the original switch for BOTW1 and deems that it is entirely plausible for it to be 4K60 (with DLSS) on the switch 2 due to being a Switch 1 game. But also uses it to contest the Matrix Demo with comparison to Doom Eternal and Witcher 3 in setting the expectations.

in essence he believes it uses DLSS for 4K60 because it seems realistic considering what it is and what it is succeeding.
 
My two cents is that if we are getting a March 2024 release, we will get some sort of official news from Nintendo by the end of October. It could be nothing more than a "Hey, this exists and it is coming out next March." I don't think Nintendo will manage to announce the system, showcase it, and release it all within 3 months.
 
My two cents is that if we are getting a March 2024 release, we will get some sort of official news from Nintendo by the end of October. It could be nothing more than a "Hey, this exists and it is coming out next March." I don't think Nintendo will manage to announce the system, showcase it, and release it all within 3 months.
Agreed. There is no possible way they keep a console under wraps until 3 months before it ships. The system's casing will get out and leak, the controllers, probably an entirely assembled system. They need to announce it well before it's a solid way through mass production.
 
My two cents is that if we are getting a March 2024 release, we will get some sort of official news from Nintendo by the end of October. It could be nothing more than a "Hey, this exists and it is coming out next March." I don't think Nintendo will manage to announce the system, showcase it, and release it all within 3 months.
This would make sense. Didn't Grubb hear about an announcment at the end of the year too? Maybe I'm misremembering
 
God how many times though do we have to play this game? lol Without new features, Idk...
How about re-imagined with BOTW/TOTK controls (sans climbing of course)? I love the world, and I personally think it would be fun to have a different spin put on it.

I recognize it is not for everyone though.
 
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A couple of thoughts:
the fact that nintendo's behind the curtains showcase was focused on loading times, ray-tracing and dlss kind of confirms that the main focus of the next switch won't be some strange new hardware innovations or new way of play, otherwise they would have probably highlighted something like that. It could still have some weird hardware quirks but I don't expect them to be the main focus or selling point just like the joycons were not the main selling point of the switch.

I agree.

They are showcasing what this new Switch model is intended to do…play Switch games with modern graphics IQ similar to current consoles with 60fps performance.

If there is some kind of “gameplay gimmick” it’s going to be a niche thing Nintendo (think 1-2 Switch) will dabble with, not change their whole game design towards a like they do their successor consoles.

If this had some gen breaking successor gameplay gimmick like designing for a motion controller Wii mote or designing for an asymmetric gamepad thingy, 3rd party devs would know about it by now.

For the march 2024 reveal/release I'm wondering, would they announce the new console out of the blue like that? I mean technically according to Nintendo there's no next gen switch console since they're avoiding the topic with shareholders, so would they give an heads up to shareholders during one of the financial meetings before the public announcements no? Especially if one of the shareholders asks questions about the next switch or the prototype shown at this events.

There is no reason to NOT announce it out of the blue like that. It’s still going to be a Switch that plays Switch games. It’s going to be a premium option.

They can easily reveal it 1-4 months before release.


That's a big assumption, could be that the gimmick will only be really supported by Nintendo at launch and is already known to some devs but not the Gamecom ones.

Right. And if that’s the case, it’s a side gimmick, not one that the console is all about.

Which means this new model is mostly designed to do exactly what it appears to be doing. Using an updated SoC to render a game that the Lite/OLeD would render, and then with DLSS be able to make it a 4K looking game with enough power left over to have solid 60fps performance with graphical IQ comparative to modern graphic techniques.

Which is exactly what they have been showing off with this new model.

none of these features imply a higher price point. it's all already incorporated into the architecture

The fact that the OLED with a Tx1+ SoC inside selling extremely well at $350 is what implies this new model launching at a price higher than $399.

Between frame generation and DLSS upscaling, is input latency gonna be an issue?

This is based on the Orin chip which is 3rd gen tensor cores. No reason to think they would change that, so no reason to expect frame generation to function on it.
 
This would make sense. Didn't Grubb hear about an announcment at the end of the year too? Maybe I'm misremembering
Oh yeah I forgot but he did say that back in February he heard it being announced late 2023. He couldn’t verify it though
 
With the Mario Edition Switch, I don't see an announcement this year, and January is to close to march.

I expect a march announcement for fall release.
Half a year sound about right. And back to school is a good period for a launch.

In regards to the "super fast loading" on BotW:
I really don't understand that point.
That the new storage solution has to be faster is a "duh". How fast? No idea.
Higher bandwidth, and a much higher single core speed OR a dedicated decompression unit. Both are kinda baseline, and with the assets that BotW has they don't need to be that high to get to 0 load times. Demon souls is similar while being ~ 4 times the size. And BotW only needs a small part of the full ram compared to Demon souls.

In other words: it's as if they would port a GC game and boast about load times, when the whole game disc can be stored in ram on startup.
 
This would make sense. Didn't Grubb hear about an announcment at the end of the year too? Maybe I'm misremembering

iirc Grubb said he was expecting a reveal or something similar by end of August. It’s presumed that culminated in the developer reveal at Gamescom. Not sure if he’s doubled down on any further reveal claims.
 
This is what I'm feeling at the current moment:

- Announcement this calendar year

- Reveal February/March

- Launch May/June

I can't wrap my head around a March launch. If I were Nintendo, I'd want Mario Wonder, SMRPG and other titles in the lineup to have plenty of time to bask in the spotlight.



Edit: If the successor is backwards compatible, then I guess the concerns for software are unfounded?

All concerns are unfounded and self-imposed
 
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Oh man.. if DLSS was used to upscale 4k, that's disappointing. I would think 4x the bandwidth would be enough (I know, switch is 900p). Maybe this could sort of confirm it's no more than 102 GB/as.

But if it's an emulation, then maybe that's understandable too.
Did anyone ever think it was likely to be higher than 102GB/s?
 
iirc Grubb said he was expecting a reveal or something similar by end of August. It’s presumed that culminated in the developer reveal at Gamescom. Not sure if he’s doubled down on any further reveal claims.
I don't think he said August. He most recently said he was expecting some kind of announcement this year, "end of summer, basically." The Gamescom/closed-door stuff was always a separate thread to that.
 
I know somebody already posted the video, but I'm posting the video since I'm doing a long, rough summary of today's Nate the Hate episode.

BotW Switch 2 Tech Demo - Load Time & Resolution
  • NateDrake mentioned Gamescom 2023 was the first time since GDC 2023 developers can meet in person, which leads to conversations, which leads to media hearing about information shared during these conventions and industry events, like the tech demos for the Nintendo Switch's successor
  • NateDrake also mentioned Gamescom 2023 was a good opportunity for Nintendo and its partners to bring tech demos to demonstrate exactly what the Nintendo Switch's successor could potentially offer when it comes into the market
  • And NateDrake mentioned that once Gamescom 2023 was over, two reports were released: one from Eurogamer and one from Video Games Chronicle
  • NateDrake started with Eurogamer's report where Eurogamer reported one of the two tech demos Nintendo showed off for the Nintendo Switch's successor was a souped up version of Breath of the Wild, which was designed to the Nintendo Switch's successor's beefier target specs, although there's no suggestion Breath of the Wild's planned to be re-released for the Nintendo Switch's successor
  • NateDrake and MVG were confused by people asking if the Breath of the Wild tech demo confirms that the Nintendo Switch's successor has backwards compatibility
  • These are the pieces of information about the Breath of the Wild tech demo that NateDrake has heard about, but Eurogamer didn't report on
    • The Breath of the Wild tech demo was running at 4K at 60 fps via DLSS
    • The actual key focus of the Breath of the Wild tech demo was to showcase improved load times
      • NateDrake mentioned that when playing Breath of the Wild on the Nintendo Switch, the time it took from going from the main menu to an in-game save was around 30 seconds
      • Although 30 seconds is not a terrible loading time, 30 seconds feel like an eternity compared to how fast games on the PlayStation 5 and the Xbox Series X|S load from the main menu to an in-game save, which MVG concurs with
    • When running the Breath of the Wild tech demo on the Nintendo Switch's successor (in terms of target specs), what was shown was a smooth transition from the main menu straight to the game, with the load times eliminated
      • MVG was surprised, and asked if NateDrake's talking about a significantly enhanced storage that goes way beyond what's currently possible with the Nintendo Switch, with NateDrake saying confirming yes
      • MVG asked if NateDrake mentioned 3D NAND, with NateDrake confirming that he did talk about 3D NAND a few episodes ago, with "interesting" as MVG's response
  • NateDrake re-iterated that the souped up version of Breath of the Wild is only a tech demo
  • MVG mentioned that he tweeted on Twitter a couple days ago that when a hardware maker gets developers in a room and shows tech demos, it's really for showcasing specific features of the hardware
  • When MVG asked NateDrake if he heard about which version of DLSS was used, considering the conflicting information, with one source saying DLSS 3.5 initially, which was edited out, and another source saying DLSS 3.1, NateDrake heard that DLSS 3.5 was used, but the full feature set of DLSS 3.5 may not be used
  • NateDrake mentioned there's a possibility a feature like Frame Generation may not be utilised in the Nintendo Switch's successor, or wasn't utilised in the tech demos
    • NateDrake mentioned there's a little uncertainty on that front for now
  • NateDrake mentioned that there's technically nothing preventing DLSS 3.5 from being featured on the Nintendo Switch's successor
  • NateDrake hedge his bets that DLSS 3.5 is used for the Nintendo Switch's successor, since DLSS 3.5 is the most advanced form of DLSS, the benefits are definitely there, and DLSS 3.5's something developers can take advantage of
  • NateDrake thinks not supporting Frame Generation isn't a big deal since developers are still getting advanced upscaling technology, and developers won't be able to take a game with Frame Generation and radically outperform what developers are getting at the base level
  • MVG mentioned the base temporal upsampling is a significant enhancement to what developers currently have on the Nintendo Switch, with the best thing being FSR, which is very simple in terms of upscaling
  • MVG thinks the Nintendo Switch's successor's getting DLSS 3.5, a cut down version of DLSS 3.5, or a mobile DLSS 3.5, is pretty big
  • MVG says NateDrake's right in saying that DLSS is there for improving performance
  • MVG thinks DLSS is one of Nintendo's secret weapons that would give Nintendo a really big advantage going into the next generation of hardware
  • NateDrake thinks Nintendo and third party developers can utilise DLSS in significant ways
  • And NateDrake thinks DLSS being a base level feature for the hardware will pay dividends for Nintendo and third party developers, since Nintendo can come in with new hardware without having to necessarily compete directly with the Xbox Series X|S and the PlayStation 5 in terms of raw performance to remain competitive, by using DLSS to get a rendered resolution comparable to what the Xbox Series X|S and the PlayStation 5 can output natively without having to render natively, closing the gap in a cheater's type of context, and as a technology of the future
  • NateDrake thinks DLSS will make hardware comparisons moot since raw power is no longer a defining factor of hardware
    • NateDrake used the comparisons between the PlayStation 2, the GameCube, and the Xbox as an example, where the PlayStation 2 is advertised as supporting up to 66 million polygons, whereas the GameCube supported 6-12 million polygons, and the Xbox supported 120 million polygons
    • However, the PlayStation 2's advertised 66 million polygons is only theoretical performance, and the PlayStation 2 only supports closer to 5 million polygons in terms of real world performance
    • The Xbox's real world performance never got to be fully utilised due to the PlayStation 2 being the market leader
  • The lesson is that raw numbers can't be taken as gospel, and that feature sets, engine support, etc. also has to be taken into account, to determine the true power range of a video game system
  • Although the Nintendo Switch's successor won't be as powerful as the Xbox Series S in terms of raw performance, the Nintendo Switch's successor support more modern technologies, which would give the Nintendo Switch's successor a fighting chance to compete with the Xbox Series X|S and the PlayStation 5 in terms of resolution and perhaps frame rates in some scenarios
  • MVG thinks the load times on the Nintendo Switch were not the best, but rather okay
  • MVG thinks the PlayStation 5 and the Xbox Series X|S spoiled gamers with features like Quick Resume, and most games run very quickly, with some games having an almost seamless gameplay experience, with unnoticeable loading times
  • MVG thinks what Nintendo did as a stopgap measure to the noticeable loading times on Nintendo Switch games (e.g. Breath of the Wild, Tears of the Kingdom) is reducing the GPU frequencies and increasing the CPU frequencies during loading, which MVG said he did for some of the games he helped developed, which helped, but is not a viable option
  • But MVG thinks Nintendo rightly identified better loading times as one of the priorities for the Nintendo Switch's successor, not to necessarily compete with the Xbox Series X|S and the PlayStation 5, but rather come up with a streamlined approach to loading times, since the reality is there's 4K, better visuals, etc., that are making vgames larger, where 10 GB games are no longer the norm, but rather 40+ GB games are the new norm
  • NateDrake thinks that Nintendo showcasing a simple fade from the main menu to the game with the Breath of the Wild tech demo is indicative of Nintendo's and Nvidia's priorities with the Nintendo Switch's successor, where Nintendo and Nvidia are aware that loading times are a relic of the past, and these new standards of gaming need to be adopted in order to compete
  • NateDrake also thinks that Nintendo can't come in with new hardware that has loading times where there are two systems with quick loading
  • NateDrake thinks that demonstrating Breath of the Wild having that instantaneous fade from the main menu to the game is a strong demonstration of the Nintendo Switch's successor's capabilities, which impressing him more than seeing and hearing that Breath of the Wild runs at 4K at 60 fps, with MVG saying that enhanced visuals are expected
  • MVG says that Nintendo focusing on loading performance and the way data is stored is very big and tells him that Nintendo has new tech that people will know about in due course
    • MVG wonders how much the Nintendo Switch's successor would cost, but he decides to continue talking about the reports from Eurogamer and Video Games Chronicle rather than speculate on the price
    • MVG mentioned the time will come for a price prediction for the Nintendo Switch's successor
Matrix Awakens Full RTX on Switch 2 Beyond PS5/Series X?
  • NateDrake mentioned the Video Games Chronicle corroborated Eurogamer's report, but went beyond, reporting Nintendo was showcasing The Matrix Awakens Unreal Engine 5 tech demo, which was originally showcased on the Xbox Series X|S and the PlayStation 5 in 2021, running on hardware that has comparable or similar specs with the Nintendo Switch's successor, not on native hardware, citing the Video Games Chronicle's own sources
  • NateDrake speculated The Matrix Awakens Unreal Engine 5 tech demo could have been
    • running on a PC with comparable specs
    • a video that Nintendo was using to show what was achieved on devkits
  • MVG mentioned that he remembered after downloading The Matrix Awakens Unreal Engine 5 tech demo that he was impressed
  • MVG thinks that people making assumptions that the Nintendo Switch's successor is more powerful than the PlayStation 5 and/or the Xbox Series X|S is a very dangerous assumption to make, especially since no one knows which hardware The Matrix Awakens Unreal Engine 5 tech demo was running on, and The Matrix Awakens Unreal Engine 5 tech demo was most certainly running via DLSS and probably via Frame Generation
  • MVG re-iterates what NateDrake said about raw performance no longer being the most important factor, saying that being smart in key areas to make the performance run exceptionally well at a handheld resolution or a docked resolution in a hybrid console is the most important, which based on the Video Games Chronicle's report, was done well, with NateDrake concurring
  • NateDrake also mentioned the Video Games Chronicle reported on the visuals on The Matrix Awakens Unreal Engine 5 tech demo being comparable to what's shown on the PlayStation 5 and the Xbox Series X|S, with Video Games Chronicles later clarifying that doesn't mean the Nintendo Switch's successor's raw performance is close to comparable with the PlayStation 5 and the Xbox Series X|S
  • NateDrake has heard that The Matrix Awakens Unreal Engine 5 tech demo showcased very advanced ray tracing that's identical, if not better, than what's shown on the PlayStation 5 and the Xbox Series X|S in terms of The Matrix Awakens Unreal Engine 5 tech demo
  • NateDrake said the Nintendo Switch's successor may have surpassed the PlayStation 5 and the Xbox Series X|S in terms of the implementation of ray tracing in The Matrix Awakens Unreal Engine 5 tech demo
  • MVG asked NateDrake to confirm that before the Nintendo Switch was formally unveiled that there was an Unreal Engine 4 demo being showcased, with NateDrake confirming the Elementals Unreal Engine 4 tech demo was showcased
  • MVG thinks Epic circling back with Nintendo and showcase new tech on Nintendo's new hardware was always going to be the case, which MVG is very excited to hear, although he doesn't know if the floodgates will open with more Unreal Engine 5 games coming out
  • MVG's excited that Epic seems to have been preparing a version of Unreal Engine 5 for the Nintendo Switch's successor, which he thinks developers are excited about as well
  • NateDrake said he wouldn't be surprised if the The Matrix Awakens Unreal Engine 5 tech demo was a means of showing that the Nintendo Switch's successor is Unreal Engine 5 compatible, and how much can be achieved when paired with DLSS
  • MVG learnt that when Epic is showcasing something, Epic is making a statement to investors, the public, and/or developers, that Unreal Engine 5 is already ready for the Nintendo Switch's successor, and the tools are already be available when developers are ready to make games, unlike other engines (e.g. Unity, etc.)
  • NateDrake thinks that showcasing The Matrix Awakens Unreal Engine 5 tech demo demonstrates that the Nintendo Switch's successor's capable at running at a fidelity comparable to the PlayStation 5 and the Xbox Series X|S as reported by the Video Games Chronicle, and how Unreal Engine 5 plays well with Nvidia's technology (e.g. DLSS) that the Nintendo Switch's successor supports
  • NateDrake mentions there was uncertainty about the frame rate The Matrix Awakens Unreal Engine 5 tech demo was running at on the Nintendo Switch's successor, with MVG commenting on being surprised if The Matrix Awakens Unreal Engine 5 tech demo was running faster than on the PlayStation 5 and the Xbox Series X|S, which is around 25 fps, not because of performance, but rather to achieve that film aesthetic
  • NateDrake mentioned that obviously, developers would naturally ask Epic what's the resolution The Matrix Awakens Unreal Engine 5 tech demo was running at without enabling DLSS, which NateDrake doesn't have answers to, since that's not the point of The Matrix Awakens Unreal Engine 5 tech demo, since the purpose was to show The Matrix Awakens Unreal Engine 5 tech demo with DLSS enabled, and what can be achieved
  • NateDrake has heard that developers were impressed by what was shown with The Matrix Awakens Unreal Engine 5 tech demo
  • NateDrake thinks that if DLSS is a base feature that every game has access to and can utilise, the Nintendo Switch's successor can be considered a magic box that can punch well above its weight, with MVG concuring
  • MVG said as a developer, he's very excited about what was reported on about the Nintendo Switch's successor, and he hopes he can learn more when the time comes
Release & Reveal Timing Discussed at Gamescom?
  • NateDrake mentioned there was other talk outside of the two tech demos with respect to the Nintendo Switch's successor that piqued his curiosity, which he couldn't get full clarity
  • NateDrake heard a lot of talk at Gamescom of March 2024 with respect to the Nintendo Switch's successor
  • MVG was surprised, asking if that's referring to the release date, with NateDrake mentioning there was no clarity if March 2024 is for a release date, a release window, or a reveal date
  • MVG admitted March 2024 was not in his bingo card since he thought the Nintendo Switch's successor's coming out in 2H 2024 based on the fact that developers need roughly at least 12 months to familiarise with new hardware
  • MVG thinks that talks of March 2024 means that Nintendo needs to announce new hardware really soon, which MVG can't see a reveal happening this year, due to Super Mario Wonder, and the OLED model and Nintendo Switch Lite bundles, releasing next month
  • NateDrake said that March 2024 was mentioned during Gamescom more than once, but without specific context
  • NateDrake thinks most people would agree that March 2024's referring to the reveal date since that's when the current fiscal year ends where 15 million Nintendo Switch units are projected to be sold, and that gives Nintendo enough time to reveal and plan a 6 month marketing cycle
  • If March 2024 is referring to a release, NateDrake mentioned that as MVG said, Nintendo has to reveal the hardware in the near future, or else Nintendo has a very limited marketing window and lead up, which NateDrake said Nintendo feasibly could do, mentioning people will bring up the Nintendo Switch being announced on October 2016, a showcase in January 2017, and release in March 2017
  • NateDrake mentioned that people have to remember that Nintendo announced the intention of releasing Nintendo Switch, which at the time was known as the Nintendo NX, in March 2017, on April 2016, almost a full year before launch
  • NateDrake mentioned that with any hardware manufacturer typically announces working on or intentions of releasing a successor 10-12 months before release, which Sony did with the PlayStation 5 and was very open with investors, and Microsoft discussed a little bit of the Xbox One's successor before officially revealing the Xbox Series X|S during the Games Awards in 2019, before releasing the Xbox Series X|S 11 months after
  • NateDrake thinks that March 2024 being the release date would be a very unprecedented situation where there's no open communication from Nintendo to investors or consumers about having active plans to release a successor in the near future, since right now is the beginning of September, and Nintendo hasn't officially announced any intentions to release a successor to the Nintendo Switch, although that's obvious, given NateDrake and MVG have discussed devkits being distributed, and NateDrake and MVG are currently discussing the tech demos at Gamescom, and Tokyo Game Show is coming around the corner
  • NateDrake wonders how Nintendo will play its hand if March 2024 is the release date since no company has played its hand like this before, unless people want to count Sega with its abysmal roll out of the Sega Saturn, with MVG commenting "oof, bad old days"
  • MVG said a March 2024 release is hard to wrap his head around, but Nintendo may have its own plans
  • MVG asked NateDrake what video game should launch with the Nintendo Switch's successor if March 2024 is the release date, with MVG mentioning the rumoured 3D Super Mario Bros. game, with NateDrake answering maybe Metroid Prime 4 as a cross-gen release, with MVG replying that Metroid Prime 4 is that one video game with no real visibility, with a lot of rumours with unknown verifiability going around about Metroid Prime 4 being a cross-gen game, considering Nintendo has done this before, which is possible
  • MVG thinks that dropping a 3D Super Mario Bros. game and Metroid Prime 4, making Nintendo Switch Online (NSO) available to anyone with a Nintendo account and a NSO subscription, and dropping some Nintendo Switch games with patches (e.g. Breath of the Wild) alongside the Nintendo Switch's successor for a March 2024 release would be a very compelling launch
  • NateDrake wants to emphasise that the discussion of March 2024 at Gamescom isn't informed speculation, but actually what he heard from conversations about Gamescom, although there's no context about if March 2024 is the release date, a launch window, or a reveal date
  • NateDrake thinks March 2024 could be a window where Nintendo asks third party partners to finish up projects (by the end of March 2024) since Nintendo plans on launching hardware a couple months later (e.g. June 2024), which happened to Sony with the PlayStation 5 when Sony asked third party partners to submit games by mid-September 2020 if third party partners are planning a launch day release in November 2020, so Sony can go through log check, the certification process, and there's reasonable time to address bugs and issues
  • NateDrake also thinks Nintendo could have planned to release the Nintendo Switch's successor as early as March 2024
  • MVG said he's still betting on the Nintendo Switch's successor launching in 2H 2024
  • However, he thinks hearing March 2024 being talked about at Gamescom is interesting and definitely throws a wrench
  • NateDrake mentioned trying to get clarity about March 2024 being talked about at Gamescom from his sources since Gamescom with no success thus far
  • MVG still believes the 2023 is all about the Nintendo Switch with Super Mario Wonder, Super Mario RPG, and the OLED model and Nintendo Switch Lite bundles, with the Nintendo Direct having to be planned for September 2023, with NateDrake mentioning a Nintendo Drake is planned 3 days after this Nate the Hate episode is uploaded, if not announced already by Nintendo
  • NateDrake said he would like to agree with MVG, but all the talk about March 2024 at Gamescom gives him great pause
    • The lack of clarity from his sources makes me think a March 2024 release is likely, although he also thinks a March 2024 reveal also makes sense, making this a flip in the coin
  • MVG agrees that a March 2024 reveal makes sense
  • NateDrake mentions the hardware industry is very fluid and is dependent on the many cogs and gears moving at the right time with respect to mass production, software being ready
    • So because of that, one of the two scenarios: March 2024 being a release day or March 2024 being a reveal date could happen
  • NateDrake wonders if March 2024 comes up again at the Tokyo Game Show
    • And if so, he hopes the Tokyo Game Show provides clarity on what Nintendo's intentions are for March 2024 in terms of a release window or a reveal
  • MVG mentions Nintendo did have a presence in the business area and asks NateDrake if he's aware if Nintendo will have a similar presence at the Tokyo Game Show, with NateDrake answer he believes Nintendo does have a business meeting room, but not a show floor presence, in the Tokyo Game Show
  • MVG thinks there's a lot of smoke, there's only a matter of time people will hear more from Nintendo, and he bets March 2024 is when people will hear more about the Nintendo Switch's successor
  • NateDrake mentioned that March 2024 is a point of curiosity that he will be looking at with great focus (pun intended), with MVG being surprised, and NateDrake saying the Nintendo Switch's successor's not called the "Nintendo Focus"
Back-Compat Gamescom Clarity?
  • NateDrake has heard a little bit of discussion about backwards compatibility for the Nintendo Switch's successor
  • NateDrake hasn't received any clarity with respect to backwards compatibility
  • MVG thinks that the Breath of the Wild tech demo reported by Eurogamer confused people to the point people think backwards compatibility is implied
    • MVG think the Breath of the Wild tech demo doesn't really answer any questions about backwards compatibility since the Breath of the Wild tech demo was most likely curated and running native code, not running an emulation layer or wrapper, since the Breath of the Wild tech demo was there to showcase specific technical features to third party developers, so third party developers can understand what the hardware looks like and some things third party developers can leverage when developing next gen games
    • Therefore, MVG thinks nobody's closer to answering the question about backwards compatibility based on the Breath of the Wild tech demo, and he hopes that people will learn more about backwards compatibility at a later date
  • NateDrake re-iterated that the Breath of the Wild tech demo is all about showcasing the loading times being erased, going from the main menu to the game, with no splash screen, outside of the high resolution and high frame rate (via DLSS)
  • NateDrake mentioned the tech demos at Gamescom were meant to be about showcasing what can be done with the Nintendo Switch's successor and not necessarily about showcasing all the features of the Nintendo Switch's successor
  • NateDrake speculates backwards compatibility could be a talking point at the Tokyo Game Show that can reported by the media or that NateDrake hears from his sources
  • NateDrake re-iterates that he mentioned in a previous episode (on 2 August 2023) that he and MVG believe the Nintendo Switch's successor needs backwards compatibility and he and MVG would be very concerned if the Nintendo Switch's successor doesn't have backwards compatibility

Remember people: summary are ok, but go leave a LIKE on Nate's video.
 
I know somebody already posted the video, but I'm posting the video since I'm doing a long, rough summary of today's Nate the Hate episode.

BotW Switch 2 Tech Demo - Load Time & Resolution
  • NateDrake mentioned Gamescom 2023 was the first time since GDC 2023 developers can meet in person, which leads to conversations, which leads to media hearing about information shared during these conventions and industry events, like the tech demos for the Nintendo Switch's successor
  • NateDrake also mentioned Gamescom 2023 was a good opportunity for Nintendo and its partners to bring tech demos to demonstrate exactly what the Nintendo Switch's successor could potentially offer when it comes into the market
  • And NateDrake mentioned that once Gamescom 2023 was over, two reports were released: one from Eurogamer and one from Video Games Chronicle
  • NateDrake started with Eurogamer's report where Eurogamer reported one of the two tech demos Nintendo showed off for the Nintendo Switch's successor was a souped up version of Breath of the Wild, which was designed to the Nintendo Switch's successor's beefier target specs, although there's no suggestion Breath of the Wild's planned to be re-released for the Nintendo Switch's successor
  • NateDrake and MVG were confused by people asking if the Breath of the Wild tech demo confirms that the Nintendo Switch's successor has backwards compatibility
  • These are the pieces of information about the Breath of the Wild tech demo that NateDrake has heard about, but Eurogamer didn't report on
    • The Breath of the Wild tech demo was running at 4K at 60 fps via DLSS
    • The actual key focus of the Breath of the Wild tech demo was to showcase improved load times
      • NateDrake mentioned that when playing Breath of the Wild on the Nintendo Switch, the time it took from going from the main menu to an in-game save was around 30 seconds
      • Although 30 seconds is not a terrible loading time, 30 seconds feel like an eternity compared to how fast games on the PlayStation 5 and the Xbox Series X|S load from the main menu to an in-game save, which MVG concurs with
    • When running the Breath of the Wild tech demo on the Nintendo Switch's successor (in terms of target specs), what was shown was a smooth transition from the main menu straight to the game, with the load times eliminated
      • MVG was surprised, and asked if NateDrake's talking about a significantly enhanced storage that goes way beyond what's currently possible with the Nintendo Switch, with NateDrake saying confirming yes
      • MVG asked if NateDrake mentioned 3D NAND, with NateDrake confirming that he did talk about 3D NAND a few episodes ago, with "interesting" as MVG's response
  • NateDrake re-iterated that the souped up version of Breath of the Wild is only a tech demo
  • MVG mentioned that he tweeted on Twitter a couple days ago that when a hardware maker gets developers in a room and shows tech demos, it's really for showcasing specific features of the hardware
  • When MVG asked NateDrake if he heard about which version of DLSS was used, considering the conflicting information, with one source saying DLSS 3.5 initially, which was edited out, and another source saying DLSS 3.1, NateDrake heard that DLSS 3.5 was used, but the full feature set of DLSS 3.5 may not be used
  • NateDrake mentioned there's a possibility a feature like Frame Generation may not be utilised in the Nintendo Switch's successor, or wasn't utilised in the tech demos
    • NateDrake mentioned there's a little uncertainty on that front for now
  • NateDrake mentioned that there's technically nothing preventing DLSS 3.5 from being featured on the Nintendo Switch's successor
  • NateDrake hedge his bets that DLSS 3.5 is used for the Nintendo Switch's successor, since DLSS 3.5 is the most advanced form of DLSS, the benefits are definitely there, and DLSS 3.5's something developers can take advantage of
  • NateDrake thinks not supporting Frame Generation isn't a big deal since developers are still getting advanced upscaling technology, and developers won't be able to take a game with Frame Generation and radically outperform what developers are getting at the base level
  • MVG mentioned the base temporal upsampling is a significant enhancement to what developers currently have on the Nintendo Switch, with the best thing being FSR, which is very simple in terms of upscaling
  • MVG thinks the Nintendo Switch's successor's getting DLSS 3.5, a cut down version of DLSS 3.5, or a mobile DLSS 3.5, is pretty big
  • MVG says NateDrake's right in saying that DLSS is there for improving performance
  • MVG thinks DLSS is one of Nintendo's secret weapons that would give Nintendo a really big advantage going into the next generation of hardware
  • NateDrake thinks Nintendo and third party developers can utilise DLSS in significant ways
  • And NateDrake thinks DLSS being a base level feature for the hardware will pay dividends for Nintendo and third party developers, since Nintendo can come in with new hardware without having to necessarily compete directly with the Xbox Series X|S and the PlayStation 5 in terms of raw performance to remain competitive, by using DLSS to get a rendered resolution comparable to what the Xbox Series X|S and the PlayStation 5 can output natively without having to render natively, closing the gap in a cheater's type of context, and as a technology of the future
  • NateDrake thinks DLSS will make hardware comparisons moot since raw power is no longer a defining factor of hardware
    • NateDrake used the comparisons between the PlayStation 2, the GameCube, and the Xbox as an example, where the PlayStation 2 is advertised as supporting up to 66 million polygons, whereas the GameCube supported 6-12 million polygons, and the Xbox supported 120 million polygons
    • However, the PlayStation 2's advertised 66 million polygons is only theoretical performance, and the PlayStation 2 only supports closer to 5 million polygons in terms of real world performance
    • The Xbox's real world performance never got to be fully utilised due to the PlayStation 2 being the market leader
  • The lesson is that raw numbers can't be taken as gospel, and that feature sets, engine support, etc. also has to be taken into account, to determine the true power range of a video game system
  • Although the Nintendo Switch's successor won't be as powerful as the Xbox Series S in terms of raw performance, the Nintendo Switch's successor support more modern technologies, which would give the Nintendo Switch's successor a fighting chance to compete with the Xbox Series X|S and the PlayStation 5 in terms of resolution and perhaps frame rates in some scenarios
  • MVG thinks the load times on the Nintendo Switch were not the best, but rather okay
  • MVG thinks the PlayStation 5 and the Xbox Series X|S spoiled gamers with features like Quick Resume, and most games run very quickly, with some games having an almost seamless gameplay experience, with unnoticeable loading times
  • MVG thinks what Nintendo did as a stopgap measure to the noticeable loading times on Nintendo Switch games (e.g. Breath of the Wild, Tears of the Kingdom) is reducing the GPU frequencies and increasing the CPU frequencies during loading, which MVG said he did for some of the games he helped developed, which helped, but is not a viable option
  • But MVG thinks Nintendo rightly identified better loading times as one of the priorities for the Nintendo Switch's successor, not to necessarily compete with the Xbox Series X|S and the PlayStation 5, but rather come up with a streamlined approach to loading times, since the reality is there's 4K, better visuals, etc., that are making vgames larger, where 10 GB games are no longer the norm, but rather 40+ GB games are the new norm
  • NateDrake thinks that Nintendo showcasing a simple fade from the main menu to the game with the Breath of the Wild tech demo is indicative of Nintendo's and Nvidia's priorities with the Nintendo Switch's successor, where Nintendo and Nvidia are aware that loading times are a relic of the past, and these new standards of gaming need to be adopted in order to compete
  • NateDrake also thinks that Nintendo can't come in with new hardware that has loading times where there are two systems with quick loading
  • NateDrake thinks that demonstrating Breath of the Wild having that instantaneous fade from the main menu to the game is a strong demonstration of the Nintendo Switch's successor's capabilities, which impressing him more than seeing and hearing that Breath of the Wild runs at 4K at 60 fps, with MVG saying that enhanced visuals are expected
  • MVG says that Nintendo focusing on loading performance and the way data is stored is very big and tells him that Nintendo has new tech that people will know about in due course
    • MVG wonders how much the Nintendo Switch's successor would cost, but he decides to continue talking about the reports from Eurogamer and Video Games Chronicle rather than speculate on the price
    • MVG mentioned the time will come for a price prediction for the Nintendo Switch's successor
Matrix Awakens Full RTX on Switch 2 Beyond PS5/Series X?
  • NateDrake mentioned the Video Games Chronicle corroborated Eurogamer's report, but went beyond, reporting Nintendo was showcasing The Matrix Awakens Unreal Engine 5 tech demo, which was originally showcased on the Xbox Series X|S and the PlayStation 5 in 2021, running on hardware that has comparable or similar specs with the Nintendo Switch's successor, not on native hardware, citing the Video Games Chronicle's own sources
  • NateDrake speculated The Matrix Awakens Unreal Engine 5 tech demo could have been
    • running on a PC with comparable specs
    • a video that Nintendo was using to show what was achieved on devkits
  • MVG mentioned that he remembered after downloading The Matrix Awakens Unreal Engine 5 tech demo that he was impressed
  • MVG thinks that people making assumptions that the Nintendo Switch's successor is more powerful than the PlayStation 5 and/or the Xbox Series X|S is a very dangerous assumption to make, especially since no one knows which hardware The Matrix Awakens Unreal Engine 5 tech demo was running on, and The Matrix Awakens Unreal Engine 5 tech demo was most certainly running via DLSS and probably via Frame Generation
  • MVG re-iterates what NateDrake said about raw performance no longer being the most important factor, saying that being smart in key areas to make the performance run exceptionally well at a handheld resolution or a docked resolution in a hybrid console is the most important, which based on the Video Games Chronicle's report, was done well, with NateDrake concurring
  • NateDrake also mentioned the Video Games Chronicle reported on the visuals on The Matrix Awakens Unreal Engine 5 tech demo being comparable to what's shown on the PlayStation 5 and the Xbox Series X|S, with Video Games Chronicles later clarifying that doesn't mean the Nintendo Switch's successor's raw performance is close to comparable with the PlayStation 5 and the Xbox Series X|S
  • NateDrake has heard that The Matrix Awakens Unreal Engine 5 tech demo showcased very advanced ray tracing that's identical, if not better, than what's shown on the PlayStation 5 and the Xbox Series X|S in terms of The Matrix Awakens Unreal Engine 5 tech demo
  • NateDrake said the Nintendo Switch's successor may have surpassed the PlayStation 5 and the Xbox Series X|S in terms of the implementation of ray tracing in The Matrix Awakens Unreal Engine 5 tech demo
  • MVG asked NateDrake to confirm that before the Nintendo Switch was formally unveiled that there was an Unreal Engine 4 demo being showcased, with NateDrake confirming the Elementals Unreal Engine 4 tech demo was showcased
  • MVG thinks Epic circling back with Nintendo and showcase new tech on Nintendo's new hardware was always going to be the case, which MVG is very excited to hear, although he doesn't know if the floodgates will open with more Unreal Engine 5 games coming out
  • MVG's excited that Epic seems to have been preparing a version of Unreal Engine 5 for the Nintendo Switch's successor, which he thinks developers are excited about as well
  • NateDrake said he wouldn't be surprised if the The Matrix Awakens Unreal Engine 5 tech demo was a means of showing that the Nintendo Switch's successor is Unreal Engine 5 compatible, and how much can be achieved when paired with DLSS
  • MVG learnt that when Epic is showcasing something, Epic is making a statement to investors, the public, and/or developers, that Unreal Engine 5 is already ready for the Nintendo Switch's successor, and the tools are already be available when developers are ready to make games, unlike other engines (e.g. Unity, etc.)
  • NateDrake thinks that showcasing The Matrix Awakens Unreal Engine 5 tech demo demonstrates that the Nintendo Switch's successor's capable at running at a fidelity comparable to the PlayStation 5 and the Xbox Series X|S as reported by the Video Games Chronicle, and how Unreal Engine 5 plays well with Nvidia's technology (e.g. DLSS) that the Nintendo Switch's successor supports
  • NateDrake mentions there was uncertainty about the frame rate The Matrix Awakens Unreal Engine 5 tech demo was running at on the Nintendo Switch's successor, with MVG commenting on being surprised if The Matrix Awakens Unreal Engine 5 tech demo was running faster than on the PlayStation 5 and the Xbox Series X|S, which is around 25 fps, not because of performance, but rather to achieve that film aesthetic
  • NateDrake mentioned that obviously, developers would naturally ask Epic what's the resolution The Matrix Awakens Unreal Engine 5 tech demo was running at without enabling DLSS, which NateDrake doesn't have answers to, since that's not the point of The Matrix Awakens Unreal Engine 5 tech demo, since the purpose was to show The Matrix Awakens Unreal Engine 5 tech demo with DLSS enabled, and what can be achieved
  • NateDrake has heard that developers were impressed by what was shown with The Matrix Awakens Unreal Engine 5 tech demo
  • NateDrake thinks that if DLSS is a base feature that every game has access to and can utilise, the Nintendo Switch's successor can be considered a magic box that can punch well above its weight, with MVG concuring
  • MVG said as a developer, he's very excited about what was reported on about the Nintendo Switch's successor, and he hopes he can learn more when the time comes
Release & Reveal Timing Discussed at Gamescom?
  • NateDrake mentioned there was other talk outside of the two tech demos with respect to the Nintendo Switch's successor that piqued his curiosity, which he couldn't get full clarity
  • NateDrake heard a lot of talk at Gamescom of March 2024 with respect to the Nintendo Switch's successor
  • MVG was surprised, asking if that's referring to the release date, with NateDrake mentioning there was no clarity if March 2024 is for a release date, a release window, or a reveal date
  • MVG admitted March 2024 was not in his bingo card since he thought the Nintendo Switch's successor's coming out in 2H 2024 based on the fact that developers need roughly at least 12 months to familiarise with new hardware
  • MVG thinks that talks of March 2024 means that Nintendo needs to announce new hardware really soon, which MVG can't see a reveal happening this year, due to Super Mario Wonder, and the OLED model and Nintendo Switch Lite bundles, releasing next month
  • NateDrake said that March 2024 was mentioned during Gamescom more than once, but without specific context
  • NateDrake thinks most people would agree that March 2024's referring to the reveal date since that's when the current fiscal year ends where 15 million Nintendo Switch units are projected to be sold, and that gives Nintendo enough time to reveal and plan a 6 month marketing cycle
  • If March 2024 is referring to a release, NateDrake mentioned that as MVG said, Nintendo has to reveal the hardware in the near future, or else Nintendo has a very limited marketing window and lead up, which NateDrake said Nintendo feasibly could do, mentioning people will bring up the Nintendo Switch being announced on October 2016, a showcase in January 2017, and release in March 2017
  • NateDrake mentioned that people have to remember that Nintendo announced the intention of releasing Nintendo Switch, which at the time was known as the Nintendo NX, in March 2017, on April 2016, almost a full year before launch
  • NateDrake mentioned that with any hardware manufacturer typically announces working on or intentions of releasing a successor 10-12 months before release, which Sony did with the PlayStation 5 and was very open with investors, and Microsoft discussed a little bit of the Xbox One's successor before officially revealing the Xbox Series X|S during the Games Awards in 2019, before releasing the Xbox Series X|S 11 months after
  • NateDrake thinks that March 2024 being the release date would be a very unprecedented situation where there's no open communication from Nintendo to investors or consumers about having active plans to release a successor in the near future, since right now is the beginning of September, and Nintendo hasn't officially announced any intentions to release a successor to the Nintendo Switch, although that's obvious, given NateDrake and MVG have discussed devkits being distributed, and NateDrake and MVG are currently discussing the tech demos at Gamescom, and Tokyo Game Show is coming around the corner
  • NateDrake wonders how Nintendo will play its hand if March 2024 is the release date since no company has played its hand like this before, unless people want to count Sega with its abysmal roll out of the Sega Saturn, with MVG commenting "oof, bad old days"
  • MVG said a March 2024 release is hard to wrap his head around, but Nintendo may have its own plans
  • MVG asked NateDrake what video game should launch with the Nintendo Switch's successor if March 2024 is the release date, with MVG mentioning the rumoured 3D Super Mario Bros. game, with NateDrake answering maybe Metroid Prime 4 as a cross-gen release, with MVG replying that Metroid Prime 4 is that one video game with no real visibility, with a lot of rumours with unknown verifiability going around about Metroid Prime 4 being a cross-gen game, considering Nintendo has done this before, which is possible
  • MVG thinks that dropping a 3D Super Mario Bros. game and Metroid Prime 4, making Nintendo Switch Online (NSO) available to anyone with a Nintendo account and a NSO subscription, and dropping some Nintendo Switch games with patches (e.g. Breath of the Wild) alongside the Nintendo Switch's successor for a March 2024 release would be a very compelling launch
  • NateDrake wants to emphasise that the discussion of March 2024 at Gamescom isn't informed speculation, but actually what he heard from conversations about Gamescom, although there's no context about if March 2024 is the release date, a launch window, or a reveal date
  • NateDrake thinks March 2024 could be a window where Nintendo asks third party partners to finish up projects (by the end of March 2024) since Nintendo plans on launching hardware a couple months later (e.g. June 2024), which happened to Sony with the PlayStation 5 when Sony asked third party partners to submit games by mid-September 2020 if third party partners are planning a launch day release in November 2020, so Sony can go through log check, the certification process, and there's reasonable time to address bugs and issues
  • NateDrake also thinks Nintendo could have planned to release the Nintendo Switch's successor as early as March 2024
  • MVG said he's still betting on the Nintendo Switch's successor launching in 2H 2024
  • However, he thinks hearing March 2024 being talked about at Gamescom is interesting and definitely throws a wrench
  • NateDrake mentioned trying to get clarity about March 2024 being talked about at Gamescom from his sources since Gamescom with no success thus far
  • MVG still believes the 2023 is all about the Nintendo Switch with Super Mario Wonder, Super Mario RPG, and the OLED model and Nintendo Switch Lite bundles, with the Nintendo Direct having to be planned for September 2023, with NateDrake mentioning a Nintendo Drake is planned 3 days after this Nate the Hate episode is uploaded, if not announced already by Nintendo
  • NateDrake said he would like to agree with MVG, but all the talk about March 2024 at Gamescom gives him great pause
    • The lack of clarity from his sources makes me think a March 2024 release is likely, although he also thinks a March 2024 reveal also makes sense, making this a flip in the coin
  • MVG agrees that a March 2024 reveal makes sense
  • NateDrake mentions the hardware industry is very fluid and is dependent on the many cogs and gears moving at the right time with respect to mass production, software being ready
    • So because of that, one of the two scenarios: March 2024 being a release day or March 2024 being a reveal date could happen
  • NateDrake wonders if March 2024 comes up again at the Tokyo Game Show
    • And if so, he hopes the Tokyo Game Show provides clarity on what Nintendo's intentions are for March 2024 in terms of a release window or a reveal
  • MVG mentions Nintendo did have a presence in the business area and asks NateDrake if he's aware if Nintendo will have a similar presence at the Tokyo Game Show, with NateDrake answer he believes Nintendo does have a business meeting room, but not a show floor presence, in the Tokyo Game Show
  • MVG thinks there's a lot of smoke, there's only a matter of time people will hear more from Nintendo, and he bets March 2024 is when people will hear more about the Nintendo Switch's successor
  • NateDrake mentioned that March 2024 is a point of curiosity that he will be looking at with great focus (pun intended), with MVG being surprised, and NateDrake saying the Nintendo Switch's successor's not called the "Nintendo Focus"
Back-Compat Gamescom Clarity?
  • NateDrake has heard a little bit of discussion about backwards compatibility for the Nintendo Switch's successor
  • NateDrake hasn't received any clarity with respect to backwards compatibility
  • MVG thinks that the Breath of the Wild tech demo reported by Eurogamer confused people to the point people think backwards compatibility is implied
    • MVG think the Breath of the Wild tech demo doesn't really answer any questions about backwards compatibility since the Breath of the Wild tech demo was most likely curated and running native code, not running an emulation layer or wrapper, since the Breath of the Wild tech demo was there to showcase specific technical features to third party developers, so third party developers can understand what the hardware looks like and some things third party developers can leverage when developing next gen games
    • Therefore, MVG thinks nobody's closer to answering the question about backwards compatibility based on the Breath of the Wild tech demo, and he hopes that people will learn more about backwards compatibility at a later date
  • NateDrake re-iterated that the Breath of the Wild tech demo is all about showcasing the loading times being erased, going from the main menu to the game, with no splash screen, outside of the high resolution and high frame rate (via DLSS)
  • NateDrake mentioned the tech demos at Gamescom were meant to be about showcasing what can be done with the Nintendo Switch's successor and not necessarily about showcasing all the features of the Nintendo Switch's successor
  • NateDrake speculates backwards compatibility could be a talking point at the Tokyo Game Show that can reported by the media or that NateDrake hears from his sources
  • NateDrake re-iterates that he mentioned in a previous episode (on 2 August 2023) that he and MVG believe the Nintendo Switch's successor needs backwards compatibility and he and MVG would be very concerned if the Nintendo Switch's successor doesn't have backwards compatibility

This got 78 yeah is the most yeah I have ever seen in the Famiboards. Well done OP Dakhil 👏

* Edited : Already 117 yeah, wow
 
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