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StarTopic Future Nintendo Hardware & Technology Speculation & Discussion |ST| (Read the staff posts before commenting!)

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Discostew said:
The XB1 doesn't have just the DDR3 RAM in it. It also has about 32MB of eSRAM, which I think is capable of around 204GB/s (102GB/s each way). However, from what I understand, it could only be accessible in 8MB chunks, so it couldn't render an entire 1080p frame into it like what Wii U could with its 32MB of eDRAM. I believe they continued using the same method they used with the 360, which was a form of tile rendering where it renders tiles in the fast RAM, and flushes them back to main RAM. Fast of course, but it's still limited to the speed of the main RAM. Switch uses tile rendering, but cache is used for holding those tiles as they are rendered instead of a separate RAM bank.

PS4 has nothing like this. It still relied on immediate mode, where all rendering is done on the main RAM, hence a need for that high bandwidth.
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Ack! You're right, I totally forgot about the Xb1's eSRAM. D:
 
Honestly, when it comes to the controllers on the next console, the only thing that matters is that they have hall effect sticks. I don't even know what we'd do with extra buttons.
 
Aufhebung RPG said:
My personal conservative guess is that we'll still face a lot of 30fps games on switch2, so I'd be more interested in knowing the difference in performance required between 1440p30fps and 1440p60fps
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really, it's 2x. you need twice to power to put out twice the frames at the same time. of course, this is extremely rough, assuming you aren't cpu bound nor memory bound. and with upscaling, the power gap could shift depending on input resolutions

IMO, we'll see a lot of 30fps games from third parties regardless. this device is less powerful than the Series S after all. but first party games would more often hit 1440p/60, I think.

navierStokes said:
www.westerndigital.com

Western Digital Showcases New Super Speeds and Massive Capacities for M&E Workflows at NAB 2024 | Western Digital

At the NAB Show 2024, April 13-17, 2024, in Las Vegas, Western Digital Corp. (NASDAQ: WDC) is unveiling an exciting lineup of technologies and new storage solutions .
www.westerndigital.com www.westerndigital.com




WD is putting out microsd express
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the pieces are coming together

evil-smile-patrick-star.gif
 
I don't think we'll get any surprises from Nintendo on the framerate front. They've been remarkably consistent with pretty much every franchise in the series since the GC (with a tiny exception or two like with Mario Sunshine being 30 fps).
 
Steve said:
How about a scroll wheel.
shrek-shrek-rizz.gif
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You know my feelings on this.

But it gets better.

Because a pointing stick can do that too.

Edit: actually you're kind of right.

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Continuing to add buttons to the original layout of the joycon would not be in line with the post-Satoru Iwata philosophy of Nintendo hardware design, as it would result in the buttons becoming more numerous and not as easy for the general public to understand and use, and if the rumor is to be believed I think that the entire layout will be changed, but with combinations of modes that fit the traditional grips.
 
navierStokes said:
www.westerndigital.com

Western Digital Showcases New Super Speeds and Massive Capacities for M&E Workflows at NAB 2024 | Western Digital

At the NAB Show 2024, April 13-17, 2024, in Las Vegas, Western Digital Corp. (NASDAQ: WDC) is unveiling an exciting lineup of technologies and new storage solutions .
www.westerndigital.com www.westerndigital.com

WD is putting out microsd express
Click to expand...
Should be the same product that was announced by SanDisk back in February at CP+. If anyone's not aware, WD owns SanDisk, and continues to release SD cards under that brand, which is the familiar one in the context of microSD cards and partnership with Nintendo.

I don't remember if the previous announcement by SanDisk had a timeframe, but this one says they'll be available this summer. Samsung's February announcement said "later this year."
 
LiC said:
Should be the same product that was announced by SanDisk back in February at CP+. If anyone's not aware, WD owns SanDisk, and continues to release SD cards under that brand, which is the familiar one in the context of microSD cards and partnership with Nintendo.

I don't remember if the previous announcement by SanDisk had a timeframe, but this one says they'll be available this summer. Samsung's February announcement said "later this year."
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Well, that clears things up, because when I was looking into other articles, they kept shifting between WD and SanDisk, and it didn't make any sense without that context of WD owning SanDisk.
 
oldpuck said:
* Hidden text: cannot be quoted. *
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jumpforce said:
The hope that a Switch model with 4K capability or any other meaningful hardware upgrade is launching next year is very disputable if I may tell you this. I don’t know Nate but there is a reason he‘s saying that his information from 2021 was correct at that time. I would recommend this forum to keep expectations for the next year or two in check.
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This is one I remember. Their 2 posts from Dec '22 seem pretty prescient now. And we'll see how their most recent one turns out in less than 3 weeks.
 
ILikeFeet said:
I still think back buttons are the next logical evolution of controllers. not necessarily innovation, but it would be nice putting your spare fingers to use
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Whatever the new buttons or new layout is, for Nintendo this means that there will definitely be new interactions and forms of gameplay, so on top of that I still maintain what I just said, if the rumors are true then we're likely to see a new joycon with a new layout rather than the same layout used with the switch
 
Bulborb said:
This is the fucking laziest Switch 2 mockup or any console mockup iv ever seen holy fuck its so lazy its impressive. Hori split pads on a current switch with a 2 slapped on the screen lmfaaaoo
Nintendo-Switch-2-NVIDIA-GPU-Arm-CPU-SOC-2.png
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That system surely has a large chip on its shoulder.

I'm going to hell for that joke. Hope there's video games down there.
 
navierStokes said:
WD is putting out microsd express
Click to expand...
LiC said:
Should be the same product that was announced by SanDisk back in February at CP+. If anyone’s not aware, WD owns SanDisk, and continues to release SD cards under that brand, which is the familiar one in the context of microSD cards and partnership with Nintendo.

I don’t remember if the previous announcement by SanDisk had a timeframe, but this one says they’ll be available this summer. Samsung’s February announcement said “later this year.”
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Yes, SanDisk showed the same microSD Express card at the CP+ in February, but it is good to have this official press release. As @LiC noted, the SanDisk PR indicates a summer shipping window, while Samsung’s Korean PR (not in the English version) offers a vague statement of “B2B shipping first, followed by B2C this year”.

The official product image shows the claimed read and write speeds of 880 MB/s and 650 MB/s:
worlds-first-sd-microsd-express-nab.png.wdthumb.1280.1280.webp

Their live demo at the CP+ certainly backed up those speed claims:

008l.jpg


Not unlike the Samsung products, the SanDisk cards also incorporate some thermal management features. They certainly learned from the thermal problems exhibited by the first-gen Express cards, which could go as high as 96°C (204.8°F). I don’t know if these second-gen controllers would throttle the R/W speed based on temperature though.
 
fwd-bwd said:
Not unlike the Samsung products, the SanDisk cards also incorporate some thermal management features. They certainly learned from the thermal problems exhibited by the first-gen Express cards, which could go as high as 96°C (204.8°F). I don’t know if these second-gen controllers would throttle the R/W speed based on temperature though.
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You know, I wouldn't be too worried about card throttling for Switch NG because the main instance where R/W speed would throttle from temperature is during long sessions of consistently high transmission. For games on Switch NG, this really only applies during "loading" segments, and those are unlikely to be long anyways.
 
Discostew said:
You know, I wouldn't be too worried about card throttling for Switch NG because the main instance where R/W speed would throttle from temperature is during long sessions of consistently high transmission. For games on Switch NG, this really only applies during "loading" segments, and those are unlikely to be long anyways.
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Unless Nintendo limits the speed for whatever reason like they did on switch.

I’m also Leary of 800mb/s being fast enough anyway…

Seems more like a side step, lateral move

I’m sure there will be some improvements but it’s still gonna take some time to fill 10-16GB

But hey it’s better than what we have now I guess
 
MP! said:
Unless Nintendo limits the speed for whatever reason like they did on switch.

I’m also Leary of 800mb/s being fast enough anyway…

Seems more like a side step, lateral move

I’m sure there will be some improvements but it’s still gonna take some time to fill 10-16GB

But hey it’s better than what we have now I guess
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For the specs we expect the NG Switch to be, in my totally non technically sourced opinion, I don't see how 800mb/s would be largely detrimental. Lesser assets would be expected. If you watch Digital Foundry's PC Ratchet Rift Apart tech review, a stock SATA SSD at 500mb/s runs the game adequately with only small bits of pausing through portals. You're talking about a 10x storage speed increase from what Switch was mostly dealing with. While it is still a ways off from the Series X/S speed of 2.4 GB I don't think it would be a major issue.

That doesn't seem like a side step or lateral move to me.
 
Gotdatmoneyy said:
For the specs we expect the NG Switch to be, in my totally non technically sourced opinion, I don't see how 800mb/s would be largely detrimental. Lesser assets would be expected. If you watch Digital Foundry's PC Ratchet Rift Apart tech review, a stock SATA SSD at 500mb/s runs the game adequately with only small bits of pausing through portals. You're talking about a 10x storage speed increase from what Switch was mostly dealing with. While it is still a ways off from the Series X/S speed of 2.4 GB I don't think it would be a major issue.

That doesn't seem like a side step or lateral move to me.
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I just really don’t want 30 second load times again
15 seconds is asking too much for me haha
I’m really impatient
 
MP! said:
I just really don’t want 30 second load times again
15 seconds is asking too much for me haha
I’m really impatient
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That's what the FDE is for. Most of the effort in loading game assets isn't getting them out of storage, but turning compressed assets into ones that the game can use.
 
MP! said:
I just really don’t want 30 second load times again
15 seconds is asking too much for me haha
I’m really impatient
Click to expand...

Load times aren't only dependent on storage speed. The time it should take to fully saturate the Switch's memory is not necesssrily how long it takes the game to load.

But either way, calling 50-100mb/s jumping to 880mb/s a side step is totally inaccurate. I doubt most multiplat titles on the Series X and PS5 are even pushing the storsge limits hard.

But I would still expect ports of current gen games to take longer to load on the next gen Switch than the PS5 or Series X. There are going to be limits somewhere. Using micro sd express would actually be one of the best case scenarios imo if were getting speeds rated at around 880mb/s
 
So the guy who broke news about the Switch 2 delay is now retracting his other news about their being a direct this month and the reveal happening in June smh, so all we can do now is wait until May 7th and hope Nintendo acknowledges this device exists, this going to be a sad 3 and 1/2 weeks
 
NintenDuvo said:
So the guy who broke news about the Switch 2 delay is now retracting his other news about their being a direct this month and the reveal happening in June smh, so all we can do now is wait until May 7th and hope Nintendo acknowledges this device exists, this going to be a sad 3 and 1/2 weeks
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I mean most insiders were saying it would be revealed in march but that didn't happen so the delay is pretty much confirmed.
 
NintenDuvo said:
So the guy who broke news about the Switch 2 delay is now retracting his other news about their being a direct this month and the reveal happening in June smh, so all we can do now is wait until May 7th and hope Nintendo acknowledges this device exists, this going to be a sad 3 and 1/2 weeks
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We have heard Q1 2025. If that's the target then I would expect Nintendo to mention it on May 7th. I don't expect them to actually reveal anythig until the fall though. If you plan to have a major business shaking launch in the fiscal year, I don't see how you can avoid mentioning that when you lay out your roadmap for the year.

At least if I was an investor I would be pissed if they didn't. Don't have to have any news to share but I should know whether something is or isn't in the works.
 
MP! said:
Unless Nintendo limits the speed for whatever reason like they did on switch.

I’m also Leary of 800mb/s being fast enough anyway…

Seems more like a side step, lateral move

I’m sure there will be some improvements but it’s still gonna take some time to fill 10-16GB

But hey it’s better than what we have now I guess
Click to expand...
The microSD card slot on Switch does read at 90+ MB/s. The reason why loading during gameplay isn't actually that fast is because of the CPU. The bottleneck comes from software decompression of game assets. On Switch NG, there's an entire FDE block dedicated to that purpose and will handle it far better. But, we don't know the input/output rate of that block. 800MB/s input may even be too much for it. This is a portable that's assumed to have the minimum raw performance of a PS4 (but with a better CPU), and the PS4 had to deal with ~100MB/s HDD + CPU decompression. However you look at it, what Switch NG will have is a major set up from any console prior to PS5/Series.

As for time spent filling up the full 10-16GB/s, this is never the case during gameplay. The only time this has been applicable nowadays is upon booting a game when it's loading the more common assets that are expected to be used consistently, and even then, it's not filling all that space up. The amount that gets loaded between transitions is certainly less than the overall capacity.
 
Gotdatmoneyy said:
But I would still expect ports of current gen games to take longer to load on the next gen Switch than the PS5 or Series X. There are going to be limits somewhere. Using micro sd express would actually be one of the best case scenarios imo if were getting speeds rated at around 880mb/s
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Right, but considering the assets of games ported from those systems to NG Switch won't have the same quality, they'll also be smaller in size.
 
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