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StarTopic Future Nintendo Hardware & Technology Speculation & Discussion |ST| (New Staff Post, Please read)

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NintenDuvo said:
So the guy who broke news about the Switch 2 delay is now retracting his other news about their being a direct this month and the reveal happening in June smh, so all we can do now is wait until May 7th and hope Nintendo acknowledges this device exists, this going to be a sad 3 and 1/2 weeks
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Source?
 
Meelow said:
Source?
Click to expand...
Brazil posted the update in the Direct Speculation thread.

Brazil said:
Hey, everyone! Didn't wanna leave you hanging for the entire month, so here I am.

You'll remember that the info I had back during the Switch 2 delay week was that we'd have a Direct in April and an Indie World presentation prior to that. I had those talks a couple of days after the Switch 2 discussions, but I now believe that the event info itself was already outdated at that point.

I no longer believe we'll get a Direct this month.

Apart from one person, who heard some rumblings two weeks ago, no one else seems to have heard anything about an April Direct since then - which they probably would've, at this point. One source in particular, that had talked about an April Direct before, is now expecting the next one to happen around the obvious SGF timeframe - so late May/early June. (Edit: Maybe even this is wrong! But we will get PlayStation/Xbox events in that timeframe, at least.)

The Indie World seems to have been planned to be aired pre-GDC, but I guess all of those plans went out the window immediately as well.

Anyway - that's it: the beauty of talking about planned event dates months in advance, haha. I'll catch flak for this, and that's alright, but hopefully that helps people settle back and enjoy the games coming out instead of getting anxious over more announcements for a while.

Edit: Also, obligatory apologies to anyone who was really looking forward to this due to my earlier info. I've said this before, but I only said anything because I was on cloud nine that week... and I probably should've restrained myself, haha.
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Discostew said:
The XB1 doesn't have just the DDR3 RAM in it. It also has about 32MB of eSRAM, which I think is capable of around 204GB/s (102GB/s each way). However, from what I understand, it could only be accessible in 8MB chunks, so it couldn't render an entire 1080p frame into it like what Wii U could with its 32MB of eDRAM. I believe they continued using the same method they used with the 360, which was a form of tile rendering where it renders tiles in the fast RAM, and flushes them back to main RAM. Fast of course, but it's still limited to the speed of the main RAM. Switch uses tile rendering, but cache is used for holding those tiles as they are rendered instead of a separate RAM bank.

PS4 has nothing like this. It still relied on immediate mode, where all rendering is done on the main RAM, hence a need for that high bandwidth.
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So been thinking about this more and more, but does this mean that even Switch 2 will have overall less bandwidth than base Xb1? D:

edit:

Also, do you guys think Nintendo will finally be able to replicate these promotional renders but in-game?

F1cbOiNagAAbo64.jpg:large
 
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NintenDuvo said:
So the guy who broke news about the Switch 2 delay is now retracting his other news about their being a direct this month and the reveal happening in June smh, so all we can do now is wait until May 7th and hope Nintendo acknowledges this device exists, this going to be a sad 3 and 1/2 weeks
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Changes happen. It's unfortunate, but plans change. That may or may not have been the best information at the time.
 
On one hand congrats to Nintendo for seemingly creating enough momentum to actually be able to coast for months.

On the other hands... What does that say about the rest of the industry when there simply isn't that much more exciting stuff then the switch that would eat up it's sales and make people want more from it.

Feels like
A) consoles over extended themselves to the point where the cost for the customer, and to achieve the fidelity and produce the games more frequently did go to high
B) the mobile market ruined itself to some degree with free to play and live service games
C) pc still has more complexity for the average customer (but it's getting better)
D) new development like VR kinda burned out

Just 2 years ago gaming seemed to have more forward momentum
 
I think Nintendo may not even announce the codename of the new machine in the fiscal year instead opting to just drop a teaser for the new machine in October, just like the switch (of course, I know the switch codename NX was announced in 2015)
 
Aufhebung RPG said:
I think Nintendo may not even announce the codename of the new machine in the fiscal year instead opting to just drop a teaser for the new machine in October, just like the switch (of course, I know the switch codename NX was announced in 2015)
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MP! said:
I just really don’t want 30 second load times again
15 seconds is asking too much for me haha
I’m really impatient
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The most reliable information we have directly states that:

1) The new hardware has dedicated file decompression hardware
2) Nintendo have been literally doing demonstrations of instantaneous loading on the new hardware

Aether said:
On one hand congrats to Nintendo for seemingly creating enough momentum to actually be able to coast for months.

On the other hands... What does that say about the rest of the industry when there simply isn't that much more exciting stuff then the switch that would eat up it's sales and make people want more from it.

Feels like
A) consoles over extended themselves to the point where the cost for the customer, and to achieve the fidelity and produce the games more frequently did go to high
B) the mobile market ruined itself to some degree with free to play and live service games
C) pc still has more complexity for the average customer (but it's getting better)
D) new development like VR kinda burned out

Just 2 years ago gaming seemed to have more forward momentum
Click to expand...
This is just cherry-picking a narrative for the sake of doomposting. A AAA GOTY candidate released just weeks ago. Independent studios just did their own Direct-format presentation that was packed with great games that will easily run on both Steam Deck (literally the least complex PC configuration you could ask for) and Switch 2 (and frankly, Switch 1 as well). One of the most demanded Nintendo remakes is releasing literally next month. "I'm not getting the Switch 2 reveal on my preferred schedule" is not an industry-wide crisis. If there is an industry-wide crisis right now, it's mass layoffs of developers in the traditional AAA space - which Nintendo/Indies/Valve mercifully do not participate in.

As for VR - publicly traded companies have ruined that market, which everyone should have realised the moment Facebook bought Oculus. There was no world where shareholders were going to agree to investment that wouldn't bear fruit in the long-term or even medium-term. They just want the line to go up quarterly, forever. Likewise, if Sony refuse to even keep their smaller studios operational to maintain a non-AAA 1st party schedule, there was no way they'd be champions for VR. That leaves Valve to actually carry the VR industry on its back (they don't have the staff numbers to release enough games to do this, but they can and do make the right calls on hardware/tools support), unless Nintendo dips into VR again.
 
kingman said:
So been thinking about this more and more, but does this mean that even Switch 2 will have overall less bandwidth than base Xb1? D:
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I think you're forgetting that Switch 2 (just like Switch) will be using cache for handling the aspect that XB1 uses eSRAM for. Tile rendering. While I don't know the number off the top of my head for cache's performance, it's certainly faster than main RAM. I'm not even sure if cache is benchmarked the same way as RAM.
 
KarlRemarx said:
The most reliable information we have directly states that:

1) The new hardware has dedicated file decompression hardware
2) Nintendo have been literally doing demonstrations of instantaneous loading on the new hardware


This is just cherry-picking a narrative for the sake of doomposting. A AAA GOTY candidate released just weeks ago. Independent studios just did their own Direct-format presentation that was packed with great games that will easily run on both Steam Deck (literally the least complex PC configuration you could ask for) and Switch 2 (and frankly, Switch 1 as well). One of the most demanded Nintendo remakes is releasing literally next month. "I'm not getting the Switch 2 reveal on my preferred schedule" is not an industry-wide crisis. If there is an industry-wide crisis right now, it's mass layoffs of developers in the traditional AAA space - which Nintendo/Indies/Valve mercifully do not participate in.

As for VR - publicly traded companies have ruined that market, which everyone should have realised the moment Facebook bought Oculus. There was no world where shareholders were going to agree to investment that wouldn't bear fruit in the long-term or even medium-term. They just want the line to go up quarterly, forever. Likewise, if Sony refuse to even keep their smaller studios operational to maintain a non-AAA 1st party schedule, there was no way they'd be champions for VR. That leaves Valve to actually carry the VR industry on its back (they don't have the staff numbers to release enough games to do this, but they can and do make the right calls on hardware/tools support), unless Nintendo dips into VR again.
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Nintendo released LABO VR back in 2019, and I think Nintendo will continue to try to do VR on switch2. the whole LABO series can be considered as Shigeru Miyamoto's first attempt to break away from the traditional "TV and joystick interaction" mode of game consoles, and the new gameplay of VR will definitely be within the scope of Nintendo's R&D and design.
 
The good news now is that with each passing day, we're getting closer and closer to whenever Nintendo's next generation of hardware is released
unless nintendo shutdown
 
However, it should be noted that, unlike Sony Microsoft, a comprehensive technology company, Nintendo is very clear about its status as a gaming and entertainment company, so if the vr technology can not be matured, Nintendo will not formally promote their own vr devices, for Nintendo their competitive ability is still their own ability to create a new way of playing and interacting with models that are different from the mainstream vr, this point is in the design of traditional game consolesThis is the same in the design of traditional game consoles, LABO is a very good example.
 
Oh so there might not be a Direct this month? Well, time for me to get hope that the delay rumors get backtracked too, we're back folks!
(Just kidding, everything's fine.)

redmutineer75 said:
* Hidden text: cannot be quoted. *
Click to expand...

Theoretically, IF this was legit info and the poster edited their post due to "being found" or something, this would be the funniest and prolly quickest "fuck around and find out" ever.

Though that's likely just funny imagination.
 
Aufhebung RPG said:
However, it should be noted that, unlike Sony Microsoft, a comprehensive technology company, Nintendo is very clear about its status as a gaming and entertainment company, so if the vr technology can not be matured, Nintendo will not formally promote their own vr devices, for Nintendo their competitive ability is still their own ability to create a new way of playing and interacting with models that are different from the mainstream vr, this point is in the design of traditional game consolesThis is the same in the design of traditional game consoles, LABO is a very good example.
Click to expand...
They literally made a Red-Black low res bulky VR device in the 90s, and once again without mature technology lately with Labo. I wouldn‘t put anything past this company.
 
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General Direct in April never quite made sense to me if they really were suddenly pivoting from plans to have the new console announced in March - even less so to have that information so soon after the delay.

I personally don’t think we get another General Direct before Switch 2 is public knowledge. Who knows when that’ll be.
 
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Darknut85 said:
They literally made a Red-Black low res bulky VR device in the 90s, and once again without mature technology lately with Labo. I wouldn‘t put anything past this company.
Click to expand...
The promotion I'm referring to is their thorough application of LABO-like technology to the next-gen console proper.
 
oldpuck should DM 5 regulars from the thread, giving each a codename, but only one person gets the right one, but neither of the 5 know which one's the right one. The 5 users then post the codename they got here and you guys have a 5 post limit to decide which one's the right one!

(Absolutely don't do this oldpuck, and don't give out the name or anything that could lead to trouble for you.)
 
karmitt said:
General Direct in April never quite made sense to me if they really were suddenly pivoting from plans to have the new console announced in March - even less so to have that information so soon after the delay.

I personally don’t think we get another General Direct before Switch 2 is public knowledge. Who knows when that’ll be.
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I had fluctuating doubts but I basically came to accept we're in a 2020-esc situation with Partner Directs.

I agree though. We're likely to get a Switch 2 mention soon and we'll maybe get a "First look at a Switch 2 title" at the next not-but-functionally-is-E3 Direct. Past that, idk.
 
SoldierDelta said:
I had fluctuating doubts but I basically came to accept we're in a 2020-esc situation with Partner Directs.

I agree though. We're likely to get a Switch 2 mention soon and we'll maybe get a "First look at a Switch 2 title" at the next not-but-functionally-is-E3 Direct. Past that, idk.
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I think I would if they did a tweet and give third party the green card to start mentioning which ports they’re making, like the NX days.

Like the worst part of any generation transition is that the game output slows down and all developers start’s focusing on NG machine. (Which is good and logical)

Like the Xbox one and PlayStation 4 last years were pretty tame, except we got third party mentioning which game they’re developing.
 
Steve said:
I think I would if they did a tweet and give third party the green card to start mentioning which ports they’re making, like the NX days.

Like the worst part of any generation transition is that the game output slows down and all developers start’s focusing on NG machine. (Which is good and logical)

Like the Xbox one and PlayStation 4 last years were pretty tame, except we got third party mentioning which game they’re developing.
Click to expand...
It's hard to remember a lot of the pre-2017 NX days, but I don't think there was a lot of announced games for the NX at the time. Granted, this was during the "Great Depression - Nintendo Edition" era so a lot of third parties were... hesitant to say the least. It only really started to pick up when the Nintendo Switch Presentation 2017 happened.

That said, the Nintendo Switch is probably one of the most profitable consoles of all time with a fair chunk of the best selling games of all time. I have little doubt that third parties would go crazy for the Switch 2 and reveal basically every 8th and the majority of 9th gen titles ever made coming to Nintendo consoles. There's a better than awful chance that the Switch 2 might have the biggest launch lineup of any console to date.
 
SoldierDelta said:
It's hard to remember a lot of the pre-2017 NX days, but I don't think there was a lot of announced games for the NX at the time. Granted, this was during the "Great Depression - Nintendo Edition" era so a lot of third parties were... hesitant to say the least. It only really started to pick up when the Nintendo Switch Presentation 2017 happened.

That said, the Nintendo Switch is probably one of the most profitable consoles of all time with a fair chunk of the best selling games of all time. I have little doubt that third parties would go crazy for the Switch 2 and reveal basically every 8th and the majority of 9th gen titles ever made coming to Nintendo consoles. There's a better than awful chance that the Switch 2 might have the biggest launch lineup of any console to date.
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That’s an exciting aspect.
Would be similar to DS where third party support is good.

Plus this time around we’ll hopefully see Cod, FF, Rockstar games and more.

Also hopefully we’ll see more media app on the switch 2, since I’m still surprised we haven’t gotten Netflix or Disney plus. Heck maybe a domino app, just like the Wii.
 
Steve said:
Also hopefully we’ll see more media app on the switch 2, since I’m still surprised we haven’t gotten Netflix or Disney plus. Heck maybe a domino app, just like the Wii.
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I woudnt bet on it. Theres zero technical reasons those cant be on Switch, which tells me the same reason theyre not on Switch (no idea) probably applies just as much to Switch 2.
 
Hermii said:
I woudnt bet on it. Theres zero technical reasons those cant be on Switch, which tells me the same reason theyre not on Switch (no idea) probably applies just as much to Switch 2.
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I’m curious as do why though? Would it be because the fear of it getting hack, because I can’t believe that Netflix has some exclusivity deals between Sony and Microsoft.

Streaming services makes a lot of sense in my opinion because of the portability. Like Netflix not wanting a potential of 140+ million customers seems strange.
 
Guess the Switch has TWO more General Direct in its ribcage, instead of one (assuming they do June and September this year). What I can see Nintendo doing is this:
  • In May they acknowledge that a new generation device will be released this Fiscal Year, but say to wait for when Nintendo is ready to unveil details;
  • September or October reveal trailer;
  • January digital event;
  • March worldwide release
 
Steve said:
I’m curious as do why though? Would it be because the fear of it getting hack, because I can’t believe that Netflix has some exclusivity deals between Sony and Microsoft.

Streaming services makes a lot of sense in my opinion because of the portability. Like Netflix not wanting a potential of 140+ million customers seems strange.
Click to expand...

Most likely related to who pays for the app development.

NintenDuvo said:
So the guy who broke news about the Switch 2 delay is now retracting his other news about their being a direct this month and the reveal happening in June smh, so all we can do now is wait until May 7th and hope Nintendo acknowledges this device exists, this going to be a sad 3 and 1/2 weeks
Click to expand...

Since it isn't coming this year, I'm not worried about the announcement tbh. We've been told so many dates over the last 3 years. When it is announced it is announced.

If anything I find it more funny that last year so many people holding hope for a launch in the fiscal year. Nintendo explicitly said the business would be run the same and that new hardware wasn't baked into the projections. Those reports tell you what you need to know if you just listen to what they are saying lol.
 
KarlRemarx said:
The most reliable information we have directly states that:

1) The new hardware has dedicated file decompression hardware
2) Nintendo have been literally doing demonstrations of instantaneous loading on the new hardware


This is just cherry-picking a narrative for the sake of doomposting.
Click to expand...
Na, I didn't mean it as doom posting. The gaming industry does have a restructuring period right now, Nintendo is doing well in momentum (look at hardware sales in the 8th year).
KarlRemarx said:
A AAA GOTY candidate released just weeks ago.
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Did not say anything against some good games coming out. But Microsoft and Sony acknowledged that they need to port it at least to pc to deal with increased cost to maximise return on big AAA games.
KarlRemarx said:
Independent studios just did their own Direct-format presentation that was packed with great games that will easily run on both Steam Deck (literally the least complex PC configuration you could ask for) and Switch 2 (and frankly, Switch 1 as well).
Click to expand...
Yeah? Not like there weren't indie presentations for the last decade. Did not say a word that Indies are not doing as well as always.
(That means a good selection but to many of them not paying rent... This wil never change, same for firm and music). Steam deck was what I meant with gotten way better, but by design there are more options, more pitfalls and more to fiddle around with it. It's probably the closest pc gaming has gotten to a console like experience...but it just isn't. And pc gamers would not want it, it would mean cutting down on options/possibilities to at least some degree to streamline the experience.
KarlRemarx said:
One of the most demanded Nintendo remakes is releasing literally next month.
Click to expand...

...wat? Did I miss something?
KarlRemarx said:
"I'm not getting the Switch 2 reveal on my preferred schedule" is not an industry-wide crisis.
Click to expand...
That was not my point...
KarlRemarx said:
If there is an industry-wide crisis right now, it's mass layoffs of developers in the traditional AAA space - which Nintendo/Indies/Valve mercifully do not participate in.
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That WAS what I was mostly refering to?
I mentioned Nintendo still hasomentum, and that the reduces enthusiasm in ancillary gaming spaces (mass layoffs, Xbox fans working about the brand, the whole focus on service games topic, vr kinda dying) plays to Nintendos benefit in there being less of a push for new hardware.

Mind you, I'm not happy with it taking so long (mostly cause it's obvious Nintendo won't push more big games onto switch so the longer it takes for switch2 the longer I'm waiting). But that was not doom posting or the reason for my points. It was more a generally slightly designated take, expecting this year to be a restructuring one overall for platform holders and AAA Devs, with slight hope that say 25 or 26 will be better overall.
(Also: new hardware launches, especially successfull ones, are good for ALL parties, indies (not to many evergreen games at the start, big chance), Dev (new technical possibilities, less restrictions, fresh base where new entries can differentiate more from previous ones)...

KarlRemarx said:
As for VR - publicly traded companies have ruined that market, which everyone should have realised the moment Facebook bought Oculus. There was no world where shareholders were going to agree to investment that wouldn't bear fruit in the long-term or even medium-term.
Click to expand...
...yeah. but I also kinda expected more substantial VR games. Chicken/egg problem to some degree, and I kinda thought Sony will continue to push it, then again, the price proposition in a recession is not there, the decisions for psvr2 where probably made during the pandemic thinking it would leave more restrictions and that people would continue to invest in tech products.
KarlRemarx said:
They just want the line to go up quarterly, forever. Likewise, if Sony refuse to even keep their smaller studios operational to maintain a non-AAA 1st party schedule, there was no way they'd be champions for VR. That leaves Valve to actually carry the VR industry on its back (they don't have the staff numbers to release enough games to do this, but they can and do make the right calls on hardware/tools support), unless Nintendo dips into VR again.
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Nintendo's not dipping into VR, the hardwares just not there currently. And valve...that's a cop out. They have all the money they want, and even more. If they would really want to push it, there would be a handful of studios now working on VR games. They want to be a big player, but they don't want to be the mayor player.
 
kingman said:
So been thinking about this more and more, but does this mean that even Switch 2 will have overall less bandwidth than base Xb1? D:

edit:

Also, do you guys think Nintendo will finally be able to replicate these promotional renders but in-game?

F1cbOiNagAAbo64.jpg:large
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Practically? Yes. Especially with new techniques like mesh shaders and virtualized geometry. Get ready for 1M polygon Mario models!

Not really, but they can do high poly models like over 100K triangles for extra round noses and mustache strands
 
a lot of the slides I'm interested in are up in the GDC vault and I'm slowly going through them

Next Level of Mobile Graphics: Ray Tracing in 'Arena Breakout' (Presented by Tencent Games)

video
gdcvault.com

Next Level of Mobile Graphics: Ray Tracing in 'Arena Breakout' (Presented by Tencent Games)

gdcvault.com gdcvault.com

slides
gdcvault.com

Next Level of Mobile Graphics: Ray Tracing in 'Arena Breakout' (Presented by Tencent Games)

gdcvault.com gdcvault.com

notable points
  • uses UE4
  • has RT reflections, soft shadows, and ambient occlusion
  • initial implementation used 4.4GB of video memory
  • knocked it down to 1.1GB total
  • tested on a Dimensity 9200
  • on android now, coming to ios soon
  • BLAS build time was < 0.5ms
  • TLAS build time was 1ms
  • shadows and AO use 1 ray each
  • average fps was 59.2fps, 1% low was 22.9fps, minimum was 51fps
  • average power usage was 3.0447W, average voltage was 4.1924V
 
ILikeFeet said:
I still think back buttons are the next logical evolution of controllers. not necessarily innovation, but it would be nice putting your spare fingers to use
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As long as they can be disabled! on my steam deck I turn them off cuz I accidently click those fuckers. I was playing sonic adventure 2 on it and clicked one and it made me jump off the fucking stage. I was gonna throw my steam deck but realized I dont have money to be breaking shit xD
 
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