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StarTopic Future Nintendo Hardware & Technology Speculation & Discussion |ST| (Read the staff posts before commenting!)

I mean that you maybe forgot there's a more expensive system coming soon, that would certainly benefit from a TV-only version merely for docked clocks alone... But yeah, that's where the question came from, there's not much to cut from the Switch's price point at this point.
Screen, battery, charging circuitry. Plenty of savings to be made. I mean they ripped out internet on Wii Mini, who knows!

But Drake? Nooo. No way. Nintendo's top of the line console will be a hybrid for a long, long time.
 
I mean that you maybe forgot there's a more expensive system coming soon, that would certainly benefit from a TV-only version merely for docked clocks alone... But yeah, that's where the question came from, there's not much to cut from the Switch's price point at this point.
As long as Nintendo has fans believing that, the switch will remain $300+ with nary a price cut for its entire life.

Yet, somehow Nintendo still makes billions??? 🤔
 
Screen, battery, charging circuitry. Plenty of savings to be made. I mean they ripped out internet on Wii Mini, who knows!

But Drake? Nooo. No way. Nintendo's top of the line console will be a hybrid for a long, long time.
Lol, you just remembered me about that. Keep in mind it isn't the weakling the original console was. Docked mode is almost twice as powerful there, the compromises for handheld mode are much more severe in comparison. A TV-only version that gets you peak 3.2 TFLOPS every single time is an interesting prospect against the Series S. Also at a price point that isn't 400$ in a minimum.
 
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As long as Nintendo has fans believing that, the switch will remain $300+ with nary a price cut for its entire life.

Yet, somehow Nintendo still makes billions??? 🤔
I was going to edit that part, sorry. I mean that the Switch is already cheap af to manufacture as it is, so price cuts should've already been made if they wanted to.
 
I think the original concept for NX would have had Mariko upclocked at release in 2019 and a newer SoC (Drake) in 2021. Repeat as long as it works.

I don't think that the new management had the political will to follow through on 2019 and the "chip shortage" made Drake hard to manufacture in large, reliable quantities well enough to make the new management follow through.
We don't really have any solid evidence Drake is anything other than largely on schedule. I don't think there's any scenario where it could have been ready earlier than 2022.
 
Even if Drake was indeed ready, I don't think the software was. If dev kits for this have been indeed around since H2 2019... Well, H2 2022 means about two years of development at best (plus one year to possibly iron out dev kit oversights and set up pipelines), absolutely nothing for the scale of the games that are being made for this.
 
Even if Drake was indeed ready, I don't think the software was. If dev kits for this have been indeed around since H2 2019... Well, H2 2022 means about two years of development at best, absolutely nothing for the scale of the games that are being made for this.
Ports don’t need more than 2 years of dev.
 
Port on portable only =/= than home console / hybrid… so AAA port could sell well and making easy extra money
Sure, but it's not feasible to release these behemoths of consoles without at least one next gen, exclusive release. Even Skyrim that was originally shown in the Switch reveal as being on par with the PS4/One versions sold terribly, it doesn't even show up in tops. Everyone that ever wanted to play games of the magnitude of RDR2 probably already did, they're important to keep the system alive but not turn it into a killer product for many.
 
Sure, but it's not feasible to release these behemoths of consoles without at least one next gen, exclusive release. Even Skyrim that was originally shown in the Switch reveal as being on par with the PS4/One versions sold terribly, it doesn't even show up in tops. Everyone that ever wanted to play games of the magnitude of RDR2 probably already did, they're important to keep the system alive but not turn it into a killer product for many.
« We » don’t know if there are /is one or multiple games exclusive ready … rumors, whispers.. are nothing official but no smoke without fire.😉
 
« We » don’t know if there are /is one or multiple games exclusive ready … rumors, whispers.. are nothing official but no smoke without fire.😉
It ultimately depends on the date when ironed-out dev kits were sent to big players, 2019 is about the time this SoC was completely defined going from the NVN2 documents so... I think 2022 would've indeed been 2 or 3 years of development for things, decent but not groundbreaking enough for what you'd expect from a full blown next gen.
 
We don't really have any solid evidence Drake is anything other than largely on schedule. I don't think there's any scenario where it could have been ready earlier than 2022.
You don't. What outlook did they have on the project in 2016? We don't know and we won't know.
 
I think the device could still launch in May. Remember, back in October 15.0.0 was released, and it seemed to add changes to the OS under the surface. I think that update may have added Drake OS support for a May launch, 7 months before imo.
 
I think the device could still launch in May. Remember, back in October 15.0.0 was released, and it seemed to add changes to the OS under the surface. I think that update may have added Drake OS support for a May launch, 7 months before imo.
One of them did mention a new SoC according by modders, so it's very likely May is indeed the time. Now, checking out the schedules of every 1st party release, I think only pre-2019 franchises released on Switch will be able to show up in time for this year.
 
Is it possible Batman Arkham Collection was one of those Drake exclusives hence why we’ve not heard anything about it other than retailer listings?

On the matter of 3rd party AAA ports, I hope more of them include the cloud save options so if I had a game on Xbox/PS I could easily get the save I have on them and bring them to Switch.
 
If you're a big studio regardless of it being 1st or 3rd party, you most certainly have devkits for Drake. I think some of those leaks for the Switch that never became quite true are probably going to be Drake games, or at least many of the concepts in them. They might be worth revisiting at some point here.
 
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One of them did mention a new SoC according by modders, so it's very likely May is indeed the time. Now, checking out the schedules of every 1st party release, I think only pre-2019 franchises released on Switch will be able to show up in time for this year.
Do you have a link to this? This is the first I'm hearing of modders seeing indications of a new SoC in a firmware update recently.
 
Do you have a link to this? This is the first I'm hearing of modders seeing indications of a new SoC in a firmware update recently.
It was said in GBATemp looooooong time ago (the "recently" was in context), no idea if you can even find it at this point. I'll do my best.
 
Here it is, that was easier than I thought.

 
That was about Switch OLED.
The codenames inside are what intrigue me, "Aula" indeed ended up being die-shrink OLED while "Calcio" was apparently a TV only test board. Never quite knew the context for the later. Even after the release, there's nothing directly implying in the firmware Aula was this console, it's actually called Mariko internally or V2 as we all know.
 
Here it is, that was easier than I thought.

Totally offtopic, but it's pretty cool that gbatemp has remained alive and kicking after all these years. It's still a very useful resource at that. Literally my first forum, albeit I rarely ever posted.
 
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It was said in GBATemp looooooong time ago (the "recently" was in context), no idea if you can even find it at this point. I'll do my best.
Oh I thought you were referring specifically to the October 15.0 firmware update.
Here it is, that was easier than I thought.


The codenames inside are what intrigue me, "Aula" indeed ended up being die-shrink OLED while "Calcio" was apparently a TV only test board. Never quite knew the context for the later. Even after the release, there's nothing directly implying in the firmware Aula was this console, it's actually called Mariko internally or V2 as we all know.
Yeah that has nothing to do with a new SoC. Aula (which is not a die shrink OLED, it uses the same Mariko chip as the 2019 V2 revision) was potentially tied to a new display port chip, which could theoretically output 4k60fps. But not a console SoC.
 
The codenames inside are what intrigue me, "Aula" indeed ended up being die-shrink OLED while "Calcio" was apparently a TV only test board. Never quite knew the context for the later. Even after the release, there's nothing directly implying in the firmware Aula was this console, it's actually called Mariko internally or V2 as we all know.
Mariko is the codename for the SoC, not the Switch itself.

The Mariko SoC is present in the "V2" Switch (Iowa), the Lite (Hoag) and the OLED (Aula).
 
Is it possible Batman Arkham Collection was one of those Drake exclusives hence why we’ve not heard anything about it other than retailer listings?

On the matter of 3rd party AAA ports, I hope more of them include the cloud save options so if I had a game on Xbox/PS I could easily get the save I have on them and bring them to Switch.
Only if it was to include Arkham Knight I would guess. The compilations on the other consoles include it iirc.

There’s no reason why Switch wouldn’t be able to run Asylum, City and Origins. Those are PS3/Xbox 360 games which the current Switch model can handle.

I guess WB maybe didn’t want to cut out Knight. Assuming it was supposed to be for Drake.
 
Yeah, just checked it out. What's in the 15.0 firmware update, i'm curious?
This page of the thread has a few members talking about it. The update had a lot of changes under the hood that aren't user facing. Some of the findings:
15.0.0 also gives us an update on the syscall situation after 18 months. Refresher: https://famiboards.com/threads/nint...mis-summer-gameguess.2700/page-52#post-248489

Two new syscalls were implemented, using IDs within the block of 64 new ones that got added back in 12.0.0. However, there's still a gap of 16 stubbed IDs between the previous highest and the first new used one. So this would suggest that the expansion was preemptive reservation of IDs with some intention to use later on the current model, but the gap where 16 IDs remain stubbed after all this time supports the possibility that some calls could be used by another firmware build that we can't see.

There is definitely a new field involved in loading game files that I don't think anyone (that I've found) has really figured out the purpose of yet. Some sort of content metadata byte.
 
With that new rumour that TOTK is their last "big" game, if it's true it's pretty damning evidence for Drake being REAL soon. In time for their September through Holiday season period.

I think April to May remains likely.
 
This page of the thread has a few members talking about it. The update had a lot of changes under the hood that aren't user facing. Some of the findings:
For the last part, guess they're already preparing for the fact the SD Express standard might bottleneck the I/O demanding titles on Drake later down the line, so you will have to download data to the internal memory for performance.
 
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With that new rumour that TOTK is their last "big" game, if it's true it's pretty damning evidence for Drake being REAL soon. In time for their September through Holiday season period.

I think April to May remains likely.
Makes sense, a May release actually makes next gen versions of things like Pikmin 4 pretty damn likely, especially to align with Miyamoto's old intentions.
 
Even if Drake was indeed ready, I don't think the software was. If dev kits for this have been indeed around since H2 2019... Well, H2 2022 means about two years of development at best (plus one year to possibly iron out dev kit oversights and set up pipelines), absolutely nothing for the scale of the games that are being made for this.
« We » don’t know if there are /is one or multiple games exclusive ready … rumors, whispers.. are nothing official but no smoke without fire.😉
This isn't 2017's Nintendo. Switch 2 is almost guaranteed to succeed. Publishers should be eager to release early on the platform and keep selling as the userbase grows.

Bloomberg mentioned 11 developers having devkits. It's not hard to imagine the most prominent partners had them too for a long time and didn't leak anything.
Of course none of them will officially announce anything before Nintendo does. So all we'll get are rumours until the damn thing is announced.

As some said, RDR2 is a candidate. Genshin Impact is probably ready, Epic may have already ported Fortnite. I wouldn't be surprised if Hogwarts Legacy (July 25?) and Midnight Sons (TBA) are native on Switch 2 but cloud on Switch. All existing cloud games could get instant native versions, all Resident Evils, Hitman 3, Control, etc, Nintendo could have made this a contractual obligation. CDPR may port both Witcher 3 and Cyberpunk. I'd be baffled if From Soft is not already in talks to bring Elden Ring. Activision must be drooling at the profit they could make on the Switch platform, they're probably thinking about CoD on Switch 2 for a long time. Ubisoft has a very good partnership with Nintendo and will show support from day one.

All these games already released (or Hogwarts releasing very soon). There are probably countless other unannounced games that will release the same day on Switch 2, or maybe a couple of months later so people double-dip.

Many, like me, will choose to play those anywhere we want on that impressive little Drake machine.
 
This isn't 2017's Nintendo. Switch 2 is almost guaranteed to succeed. Publishers should be eager to release early on the platform and keep selling as the userbase grows.

Bloomberg mentioned 11 developers having devkits. It's not hard to imagine the most prominent partners had them too for a long time and didn't leak anything.
Of course none of them will officially announce anything before Nintendo does. So all we'll get are rumours until the damn thing is announced.

As some said, RDR2 is a candidate. Genshin Impact is probably ready, Epic may have already ported Fortnite. I wouldn't be surprised if Hogwarts Legacy (July 25?) and Midnight Sons (TBA) are native on Switch 2 but cloud on Switch. All existing cloud games could get instant native versions, all Resident Evils, Hitman 3, Control, etc, Nintendo could have made this a contractual obligation. CDPR may port both Witcher 3 and Cyberpunk. I'd be baffled if From Soft is not already in talks to bring Elden Ring. Activision must be drooling at the profit they could make on the Switch platform, they're probably thinking about CoD on Switch 2 for a long time. Ubisoft has a very good partnership with Nintendo and will show support from day one.

All these games already released (or Hogwarts releasing very soon). There are probably countless other unannounced games that will release the same day on Switch 2, or maybe a couple of months later so people double-dip.

Many, like me, will choose to play those anywhere we want on that impressive little Drake machine.
Your list is a good indicator of the potential of future switch 2 ports…
 
This isn't 2017's Nintendo. Switch 2 is almost guaranteed to succeed. Publishers should be eager to release early on the platform and keep selling as the userbase grows.

Bloomberg mentioned 11 developers having devkits. It's not hard to imagine the most prominent partners had them too for a long time and didn't leak anything.
Of course none of them will officially announce anything before Nintendo does. So all we'll get are rumours until the damn thing is announced.

As some said, RDR2 is a candidate. Genshin Impact is probably ready, Epic may have already ported Fortnite. I wouldn't be surprised if Hogwarts Legacy (July 25?) and Midnight Sons (TBA) are native on Switch 2 but cloud on Switch. All existing cloud games could get instant native versions, all Resident Evils, Hitman 3, Control, etc, Nintendo could have made this a contractual obligation. CDPR may port both Witcher 3 and Cyberpunk. I'd be baffled if From Soft is not already in talks to bring Elden Ring. Activision must be drooling at the profit they could make on the Switch platform, they're probably thinking about CoD on Switch 2 for a long time. Ubisoft has a very good partnership with Nintendo and will show support from day one.

All these games already released (or Hogwarts releasing very soon). There are probably countless other unannounced games that will release the same day on Switch 2, or maybe a couple of months later so people double-dip.

Many, like me, will choose to play those anywhere we want on that impressive little Drake machine.
You can't really say "guaranteed" when risky transition moves like these are on the table. Just like every company, Nintendo is being careful about this upgrade and wants to make it seem the most valuable possible for everyone, not just a single demographic that has never really supported 3rd parties all that much.
 
Makes sense, a May release actually makes next gen versions of things like Pikmin 4 pretty damn likely, especially to align with Miyamoto's old intentions.
I think going forward, for a year at least, most first party games will be solidly cross-gen, starting with Zelda, and of course including Pikmin 4.

However I still think it's coming out in April, briefly before Zelda, to cash in on Golden Week, tax returns in the US, and to increase the number of users before TOTK launches. In that brief period it'll have a few third party launch titles and 4K patches for BOTW, MK8, etc. A soft launch, like Xbox Series X.
 
You can't really say "guaranteed" when risky transition moves like these are on the table. Just like every company, Nintendo is being careful about this upgrade and wants to make it seem the most valuable possible for everyone, not just a single demographic that has never really supported 3rd parties all that much.
This thing will launch solidly aimed at the hardcore audience, which are more likely to purchase third party software.
 
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"Mariko", "Erista", "Drake": SOC code names
"Odin", "Modin", "Vali", "Frig": Motherboard code names.
"Aula", "Hoag", "Icosa", "Iowa", "Calcio", "Copper": Console code names


We've talked about the Comic Book naming convention for SOCs.

The motherboard code names are obviously norse, but they also probably don't refer to shipping motherboards? These are test boards used by Nvidia during development, which Horizon needs to detect for things like RAM timings and other non-SOC hardware specific configuration data. "Loki" for example is the name of the motherboard in the Nvidia Shield Portable

The console code names are Nintendo-internal, and are interesting because they actually have meaning. Icosa and Iowa are both "integrated" machines, meaning they can Switch - they are the V1 and the V2 Switch respectively. "Copper" and "Calcio" are both "console" devices - these have support for being connected to an external monitor without the dock, but they are also digital only machines and are almost definitely machines sitting on developer's desks at NCL offices, doing dev work. "Hoag" is the Lite a "handheld" only console.

"Aula" is unusual in this regard as it implies a new form factor by the naming convention.

If there are future "leaks" with code names, it will be useful to use this information as a gut check on how accurate they are, and what they might imply about both the hardware and the leak's source. There are, in fact, a few words that if they popped up in a leak would get my immediate attention, but I have yet to see surface.
 
Even if Drake was indeed ready, I don't think the software was. If dev kits for this have been indeed around since H2 2019... Well, H2 2022 means about two years of development at best (plus one year to possibly iron out dev kit oversights and set up pipelines), absolutely nothing for the scale of the games that are being made for this.

How do launch efforts for new consoles ever work then? I assume engagements start earlier than development kits exist for those partners, and they work off of an approximation. Once physical hardware is available they probably begin migrating the work over.

Somebody in here can correct me if that’s off, but I recall it being said that two years out from release is actually pretty far out for new hardware development kits.
 
However I still think it's coming out in April, briefly before Zelda, to cash in on Golden Week, tax returns in the US, and to increase the number of users before TOTK launches. In that brief period it'll have a few third party launch titles and 4K patches for BOTW, MK8, etc. A soft launch, like Xbox Series X.

I've been looking for a list of every Switch title expected to release in 2023 and it appears that there are very few games which have been given specific dates for release in April and beyond.

But I am guessing this may be normal? At least for Nintendo first party titles, they seem to give the specific dates within a few months of release.
 
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"Mariko", "Erista", "Drake": SOC code names
"Odin", "Modin", "Vali", "Frig": Motherboard code names.
"Aula", "Hoag", "Icosa", "Iowa", "Calcio", "Copper": Console code names


We've talked about the Comic Book naming convention for SOCs.

The motherboard code names are obviously norse, but they also probably don't refer to shipping motherboards? These are test boards used by Nvidia during development, which Horizon needs to detect for things like RAM timings and other non-SOC hardware specific configuration data. "Loki" for example is the name of the motherboard in the Nvidia Shield Portable

The console code names are Nintendo-internal, and are interesting because they actually have meaning. Icosa and Iowa are both "integrated" machines, meaning they can Switch - they are the V1 and the V2 Switch respectively. "Copper" and "Calcio" are both "console" devices - these have support for being connected to an external monitor without the dock, but they are also digital only machines and are almost definitely machines sitting on developer's desks at NCL offices, doing dev work. "Hoag" is the Lite a "handheld" only console.

"Aula" is unusual in this regard as it implies a new form factor by the naming convention.

If there are future "leaks" with code names, it will be useful to use this information as a gut check on how accurate they are, and what they might imply about both the hardware and the leak's source. There are, in fact, a few words that if they popped up in a leak would get my immediate attention, but I have yet to see surface.
"A"ula for "Advanced"? or "Augmented"? After, added, addition, another, accession?
 
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This isn't 2017's Nintendo. Switch 2 is almost guaranteed to succeed. Publishers should be eager to release early on the platform and keep selling as the userbase grows.

Bloomberg mentioned 11 developers having devkits. It's not hard to imagine the most prominent partners had them too for a long time and didn't leak anything.
Of course none of them will officially announce anything before Nintendo does. So all we'll get are rumours until the damn thing is announced.

As some said, RDR2 is a candidate. Genshin Impact is probably ready, Epic may have already ported Fortnite. I wouldn't be surprised if Hogwarts Legacy (July 25?) and Midnight Sons (TBA) are native on Switch 2 but cloud on Switch. All existing cloud games could get instant native versions, all Resident Evils, Hitman 3, Control, etc, Nintendo could have made this a contractual obligation. CDPR may port both Witcher 3 and Cyberpunk. I'd be baffled if From Soft is not already in talks to bring Elden Ring. Activision must be drooling at the profit they could make on the Switch platform, they're probably thinking about CoD on Switch 2 for a long time. Ubisoft has a very good partnership with Nintendo and will show support from day one.

All these games already released (or Hogwarts releasing very soon). There are probably countless other unannounced games that will release the same day on Switch 2, or maybe a couple of months later so people double-dip.

Many, like me, will choose to play those anywhere we want on that impressive little Drake machine.
You can't get "instant" native versions from cloud games, that's just not how game development works. They'd need to spend time porting the game to the specific hardware, cloud games just run on PC servers.
 
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Couldn’t the canned SoC have problems with reaching the promised performance, battery life and heat on an ampere Uarch which Nintendo/Nvidia decided to go back to the drawing board and design a brand new SoC?
 
Couldn’t the canned SoC have problems with reaching the promised performance, battery life and heat on an ampere Uarch which Nintendo/Nvidia decided to go back to the drawing board and design a brand new SoC?
That's always possible but there likely would've been evidence of something like that in the leaked NVN2 files. Assuming this hypothetical SoC got far enough into design to start implementing drivers and API features.

Again it's still by far the likeliest scenario that the cancelled revision was just using Mariko.
 
"Mariko", "Erista", "Drake": SOC code names
"Odin", "Modin", "Vali", "Frig": Motherboard code names.
"Aula", "Hoag", "Icosa", "Iowa", "Calcio", "Copper": Console code names


We've talked about the Comic Book naming convention for SOCs.

The motherboard code names are obviously norse, but they also probably don't refer to shipping motherboards? These are test boards used by Nvidia during development, which Horizon needs to detect for things like RAM timings and other non-SOC hardware specific configuration data. "Loki" for example is the name of the motherboard in the Nvidia Shield Portable

The console code names are Nintendo-internal, and are interesting because they actually have meaning. Icosa and Iowa are both "integrated" machines, meaning they can Switch - they are the V1 and the V2 Switch respectively. "Copper" and "Calcio" are both "console" devices - these have support for being connected to an external monitor without the dock, but they are also digital only machines and are almost definitely machines sitting on developer's desks at NCL offices, doing dev work. "Hoag" is the Lite a "handheld" only console.

"Aula" is unusual in this regard as it implies a new form factor by the naming convention.

If there are future "leaks" with code names, it will be useful to use this information as a gut check on how accurate they are, and what they might imply about both the hardware and the leak's source. There are, in fact, a few words that if they popped up in a leak would get my immediate attention, but I have yet to see surface.
Rather than Aula/Hoag/etc. being console codenames, my understanding is that they're "platform configuration" codenames. In other words "Aula" references the configuration combination needed to support Mariko, an OLED screen, the new TV dock, the new speaker drivers (just making that last one up, but you get the point), etc. The actual codenames for the entire console are HAC, HDH, and HEG*. And of course the codename for the entirety of the Switch hardware/software platform is NX.

That said, the name Aula (and its associated devkit name, ADEV) is interesting since (as you pointed out) it doesn't follow the letter pattern that I/H/C do. If I had to guess what it stood for I would probably say "Advanced," which if you wanted to put on a tinfoil hat could be an indication of that platform configuration being planned for something more than a screen upgrade. I don't really believe that myself in terms of what was planned for 2021, but at the same time I wouldn't find it unbelievable that the platform config for the Drake Switch might be a different "A" name.

* Which probably represent (if not officially "standing for" as such) Handheld And Console, Handheld Dedicated Handheld, and... Handheld EL orGanic? "Organic EL" is what it's called in Japanese and I'm not sure what else G would mean.
 
Couldn’t the canned SoC have problems with reaching the promised performance, battery life and heat on an ampere Uarch which Nintendo/Nvidia decided to go back to the drawing board and design a brand new SoC?
I find it very unlikely that Nintendo will allow the SoC to develop to the point of having its own API, as these problems would be detectable very early.
In such a case the most likely would be to do a die-shrink which would simply solve most of these problems.
 
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Only if it was to include Arkham Knight I would guess. The compilations on the other consoles include it iirc.

There’s no reason why Switch wouldn’t be able to run Asylum, City and Origins. Those are PS3/Xbox 360 games which the current Switch model can handle.

I guess WB maybe didn’t want to cut out Knight. Assuming it was supposed to be for Drake.
Switch had trouble running dark souls 1 which is also a PS3 game
 
Would you guys love it or hate it if Nintendo was to simply call it Nintendo Switch 2nd generation model?
It's not a bad idea, honestly. It keeps unbroken continuity with the existing Switch line and it provides an easy-enough way to distinguish hardware compatibility for later titles.
 
Please read this staff post before posting.

Furthermore, according to this follow-up post, all off-topic chat will be moderated.
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