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StarTopic Future Nintendo Hardware & Technology Speculation & Discussion |ST| (Read the staff posts before commenting!)

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ILikeFeet said:
10GB for games a minimum, I say. 2GB might be crazy given the Switch, but we don't know what nintendo is planning for the OS and just having more than the Series S is already an amazing starting ground. most other features people want can easily fit within 2GB with room to spare
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I'm wondering if the steam deck's 16GB RAM is comparable to the switch2's 12GB RAM
 
darthdiablo said:
switch2fastmockup2.png

This was made by @mjayer based on last time we found dimensions. Curious if anything has changed (should be 206mm wide for tablet part alone, IDK if anything would change here)
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Looking at this dimensions... this mock up holds pretty damn close. I was working on a new one and then pulled this up to check and ya.. close enough.
 
Aufhebung RPG said:
I'm wondering if the steam deck's 16GB RAM is comparable to the switch2's 12GB RAM
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It's LPDDR5 6400 MT/s vs Switch 2 LPDDR5X 7500 MT/s, and there's inherently more memory overhead with running a full Linux OS + Steam itself, even in Game Mode where the KDE environment is unloaded, and I assume the Proton compatibility layer contributes to additional memory usage.

Switch OS will be leaner and games will be written with the hardware in mind and that will include the memory configuration.
 
Keep in mind the M4 released on the $999 iPad Pro has the same bandwidth as the leaked shipping details as above.

M4 has LPDDR5X, more specifically around LPDDR5X-7700. The Switch 2 SoC is not at all old nor will be when it releases next year.
 
definitely disappointed by the size but I'm feeling very grateful for leaks for once

if we hadn't been warned eons ago I would've been despondent

now instead it just feels like an inevitable bummer. like when an old cat dies
 
I don't think any PC handheld has LPDDR5X, even if most of them have 16 GB.

Truthfully I think they splurge on RAM because of their 'do as you wish' model of providing the user with enough resources to run as many applications as they want on the device and try to run any game they want, since these are PCs after all. Open up all the Chrome tabs while playing Starfield.

Meanwhile I doubt the Switch 2 will let you play YouTube and a game at the same time. Though I would appreciate other background applets like streaming or chat.
 
Aufhebung RPG said:
I'm wondering if the steam deck's 16GB RAM is comparable to the switch2's 12GB RAM
Click to expand...
Steam Deck has 16 GB of LPDDR5 6400 5500 (thanks Redd for the correction) MT/s RAM VS. the Switch 2's alleged 12 GB of LPDDR5(X?) 7500 MT/s RAM. Breaking that down into bandwidth numbers, that's 88 GB/s for the Steam Deck and 120 GB/s for the Switch 2. On paper the Switch 2 has it beat in bandwidth, but not quantity. That being said...

As a general note, it's hard to compare them. Like, really hard. Their architectures don't handle memory bandwidth the same, and the environments are different too. One is a portable PC that plays games and another a game console with a closed ecosystem. I also don't know off the top of my head how much memory the Steam Deck allocates to the OS, nor do we know how much the Switch 2's OS will use. The Deck's extra RAM could matter or it could not if a bunch of its memory is going to the OS, the Switch 2's closed environment and higher level of accessibility/programming provided by NVN means that you can better optimize ports, or even optimize them in the first place compared to the Deck! Fun stuff like that.

Putting it in car terms, It's not so much comparing a sports car to a truck, but rather like comparing a Miata to a Honda S2K. Yeah they're both sporty vehicles, both convertibles, and at a surface level do the same thing of providing a fun experience (yay fast* cars, yay gaming), but everything from how it makes power/how the engine revs out, to the suspension of the cars, and to the design ethos is different.

*lol nah
 
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Raccoon said:
definitely disappointed by the size but I'm feeling very grateful for leaks for once

if we hadn't been warned eons ago I would've been despondent

now instead it just feels like an inevitable bummer. like when an old cat dies
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I'm not thrilled about it being bigger (I've been pocketing my Erista so I get ya) but I will say the silver lining is at least it's not Steam Deck sized. That's a big damn relief for me.
 
Serif said:
I don't think any PC handheld has LPDDR5X, even if most of them have 16 GB.

Truthfully I think they splurge on RAM because of their 'do as you wish' model of providing the user with enough resources to run as many applications as they want on the device and try to run any game they want, since these are PCs after all. Open up all the Chrome tabs while playing Starfield.

Meanwhile I doubt the Switch 2 will let you play YouTube and a game at the same time. Though I would appreciate other background applets like streaming or chat.
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YouTube can survive on truly miniscule amounts of RAM. While I don't expect it, I'd like to see Nintendo open up applet development to third parties. Discord, YouTube (background audio and streaming to), Twitch, etc. would benefit. A dedicated BlueSky applet for sharing album photos (with X being kicked out of the Album next month and all.)

But I really don't expect it. Barebones is what I expect, truly.
 
So... where are these coming from? The part numbers, I mean? And how is it being tracked? Is there some shipment websites where this info is available?
 
oldpuck said:
I'm not sure, just because there isn't a lot of data on the situation.

Honestly, the low latency bandwidth probably helps the CPU more than the GPU. Low latency memory helps most in cases where you make lots of small reads, which is a pretty classic CPU situation.
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I have heard that before - CPUs prefer low latency, GPUs prefer high bandwidth, hence why we don't see GDDR6 slots on motherboards (although we have seen DDR4 graphics cards, which... ew). I'll need to find out if there are any GPU-specific benefits from low-latency.
 
BY2K said:
So... where are these coming from? The part numbers, I mean? And how is it being tracked? Is there some shipment websites where this info is available?
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It's customs data. Imports and exports from countries are applicable to local laws for customs, and freight data is useful to lots of different analysts, so there are are companies that aggregate various customs records for folks to search.

That means the data can be slightly slippery, as exact labeling for one part or another isn't always perfect, nor is the transcription from some engineers handwritten form into a database always perfect. But the patterns in the data are solid.
 
BY2K said:
So... where are these coming from? The part numbers, I mean? And how is it being tracked? Is there some shipment websites where this info is available?
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These are Vietnamese shipping orders that are tracked and the information is  mostly public. People have been using these for years, particularly for phone specs of upcoming models.
You just have to know how to use the system.
 
So uh...

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Thank you everyone who responded to my question and tried to explain Ram speed/quantity. I tried my best to follow and I'm still lost due to the math not being basic lol

If only Ram math was like: 10x200=2000, 12x120= 1440, therefore 10x200>12x120
 
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That Digital Foundry T239 simulation used a 4 GB 2050, the Matrix demo wouldn't even boot with that little VRAM.

Would like to see a redo with the larger amount and bandwidth we're now aware of.
 
Sol said:
So with 12 GB of RAM, would it be reasonable to assume that 10.5 GB would be available to developers for games? I'm assuming Nintendo will reserve more than 500 MBs for the OS this time around to allow for more features.
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Currently uses something close to 0.75 of a gigabyte, so somewhere between that and triple that (for triple the total RAM) are what I'd consider the extreme boundaries. Leaving 9.75-11.25 remaining.
 
Serif said:
That Digital Foundry T239 simulation used a 4 GB 2050, the Matrix demo wouldn't even boot with that little VRAM.

Would like to see a redo with the larger amount and bandwidth we're now aware of.
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That would require soldering. Have Digital Foundry been known to go that far (soldering additional RAM just to do this type of testing?)

Or just use a different GPU altogether?
 
lattjeful said:
Steam Deck has 16 GB of LPDDR5 6400 MT/s RAM VS. the Switch 2's alleged 12 GB of LPDDR5(X?) 7500 MT/s RAM. Breaking that down into bandwidth numbers, that's 88 GB/s for the Steam Deck and 120 GB/s for the Switch 2. On paper the Switch 2 has it beat in bandwidth, but not quantity. That being said...

As a general note, it's hard to compare them. Like, really hard. Their architectures don't handle memory bandwidth the same, and the environments are different too. One is a portable PC that plays games and another a game console with a closed ecosystem. I also don't know off the top of my head how much memory the Steam Deck allocates to the OS, nor do we know how much the Switch 2's OS will use. The Deck's extra RAM could matter or it could not if a bunch of its memory is going to the OS, the Switch 2's closed environment and higher level of accessibility/programming provided by NVN means that you can better optimize ports, or even optimize them in the first place compared to the Deck! Fun stuff like that.

Putting it in car terms, It's not so much comparing a sports car to a truck, but rather like comparing a Miata to a Honda S2K. Yeah they're both sporty vehicles, both convertibles, and at a surface level do the same thing of providing a fun experience (yay fast* cars, yay gaming), but everything from how it makes power/how the engine revs out, to the suspension of the cars, and to the design ethos is different.

*lol nah
Click to expand...
I get what you mean with the "can't compare them" argument but there's no question here, with significantly more memory bandwidth over the original Steam Deck model it's gonna rip (gpu wise) over any of these PC handhelds in the real world, this is the final confirmation we needed on that matter. If anything, these PC handhelds can't compete with the Switch 2, not the other way around.
 
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