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StarTopic Future Nintendo Hardware & Technology Speculation & Discussion |ST| (Read the staff posts before commenting!)

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I doubt Nintendo is in panic, but i also doubt they're very happy that they had to delay the system out of CY 2024 for whatever reasons.

No need to "only Sith deal in absolutes" this. ;D
 
If this turns out to be a 4N, 16GB LPDDR5X machine hitting 3.5TF peaks I will personally squee.

I... Need to change my title, because I don't expect that! 4N, sure, but 3TF and 12GB of LPDDR5 has been expectation as of late.
 
Lozjam said:
An overclocked Switch Oled can actually run games at 4K, with no DLSS. It can even run BotW, through emulation, at 4k. Its a bit of a slideshow, but it's possible.


It probably won't even need DLSS to run 4k 60.
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Impressive. Most impressive. Truthfully, it is rather comical he's able to run native Switch games on a Nintendo Switch OLED using a Switch Emulator to prove "Yeah, this shit is pretty powerful once you overlock it."

navierStokes said:
DF has looked at RT on the Steam Deck and ROG Ally. The Deck is tested primarily through Steam OS, but windows on the Deck doesn't provide the same level of performance (e.g. it's a lot lower), thus highlighting the excisting driver and windows quirks on the Deck.
There's not much of new conclusions to base speculation on, but it does provide an updated framing of how RT works on a handheld format with current day devices.

If the Series S is the lowest denominator in the current home console space, then these handheld are the equivalent in the handheld space for current-gen games.
One interesting thing to not is that all of the tested hardware is made on or has evolved from RDNA2 (the ROG Ally is RDNA3). Some relative comparisons are performed between these devices, where they mention how the Series S doesn't have RT effects, whereas the Steam Deck at its targeted resolution is able to run it at a playable level.



Companion article: https://www.eurogamer.net/digitalfoundry-2024-steam-deck-rt-tested-vs-rog-ally

The resolution at which they primarily test at is 720p or upscaled to 720p.

I wish they provided some additional metrics also (e.g. memory use, power usage), but on the other hand they're not really that unknown from previous testing.
ROG Ally's RDNA3 is able to provide the performance uplift over the Steam Deck, but it's power usage is also higher.

Tested titles are:
  • Control
  • Doom Eternal
  • Alan Wake 2
  • Avatar Frontier's of Pandora
  • Crysis 2 Remastered
  • Persona 3 Reload
  • Cyberpunk 2077
  • Metro Exodus Enhanced edition
I wish Oliver had access to the RTX 2050 (4GB) that Rich had used for his faux-T239 tests, although I presume that the low VRAM would be too constrained even at the low resolution.

One specific title that stands out and something that @ILikeFeet already brought up once when Avatar:Frontier's of Pandora was released, is that the ROG Ally even with its hardware grunt doesn't provide a playable experience and stutters when traversing through the world.
Although Oliver doesn't say it, it does highlight how the limited bandwidth of these handheld can be constraining in current day's titles, but for the Switch 2 there'll be a bespoke port so certain aspects of that can perhaps be remedied. Moreover, VRAM usage on AMD and NVIDIA aren't 1 to 1 and there are certain nuances that can make a difference (e.g. architectural differences, API).
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Yeah. Also, comparing x86 vs. ARM doesn't always bode well for projections into how something may run on the Switch 2. It'll give you a ballpark idea like what Rich did for his RTX 2050 tests, but he was still using a bloated Windows OS with PC titles to make his point.

Jenn. E Tails said:
There is no way in any universe that the switch 2 will reach series S levels of performance and have a price range below $500 and have more than 1 hour of battery life.

Peolple need to understand that Nintendo will have affordable price + battery life as their priorities.
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The Chips inside the Series consoles, and PS5 were taped out I think in 2019, and Drake was taped out as far as we can understand in 2022, so three years newer, though we're also talking x86 vs. ARM here. In terms of mobile chips, progress has advanced a lot quicker than desktop/laptop-level in recent years. It is absolutely not impossible to suggest the Switch 2 could rival the Series S in realistic performance even if Raw performance it may fall short.

In terms of pricing, you're also looking at 400 dollars, possibly more for Switch 2 upon launch, which would also line up with inflation based on the cost of the Switch 1 back in 2017, or even the Switch OLED in 2021. Battery Life is about the only thing I'll agree with here, but if you check out the first page of this thread, there are a ton of informed posts by Thraktor, Oldpuck, and others who have demonstrated based on what Tegra Orin can do, a custom chip like the Tegra T239, could absolutely provide the performance similar to a Series S with comparable wattages to a Stock V1 Switch.

ReddDreadtheLead said:
You would never, ever, E V E R hear this from a developer for video game software. Yes they bleed out into other aspects of CS like software engineering and also semi who are in contact here and there, but you will never ever hear about what node it is from those that make games.

It’s not their job and it’s not what they care about. Only the company who makes it, or the company who sells it, will disclose that information.
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At best, you'll see a quip that says, "This new Tegra chip was manufactured by [Insert either TSMC, or Samsung]."

But funnily enough, that would give us enough info to get a very good idea of what node it is. If by chance, they do show what foundry made the chip, say TSMC, then we'd know it was probably 4N, but more importantly that it was not SEC8N. If is said it was Samsung, but we later find out what clocks the Chip is running, plus its power wattage, we could then determine pretty well what exact node it was made on.

Either way, none of this will matter once games are showcased on it, and Fami will likely forget about it in the end. It'll only come back once the system launched, and hackers/homebrewers discover what clockspeeds, and what wattages the system runs on. Only then, we'll know for sure.
 
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darthdiablo said:
I don't think Nintendo's desperate either, but I think what Jake meant is, wouldn't Nintendo have to anyway? There's no Nintendo games announced beyond June.

Or are we going to expect Twitter-drops from Nintendo for the games coming in July and afterwards, no Direct?
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Exactly! There are no Nintendo games after Luigi’s Mansion 2 HD comes out June 27th. Considering the fact that there hasn’t been a general direct so far this year, I think we should be getting one before Luigi’s Mansion 2 HD comes out. I don’t think it’ll be May though. June is a safe bet since that’s usually when Nintendo has directs. That’s also assuming we get one either before or after Switch 2 is announced, if it really is gonna be announced within the next month or two.
 
BreakAtmo said:
As far as I know N4P was only confirmed to be smaller and more efficient, and N4C was outright advertised as cheaper (though possibly only because it is, again, smaller).
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Compared to TSMC's N4 process node, TSMC only promised 6% increased performance for TSMC's N4P process node. But compared to TSMC's N5 process node, TSMC does promise 11% increased performance, 22% higher power efficiency, and 6% higher transistor density.

And TSMC did mention about TSMC's N4C process node being a more cost-effective option for value-tier products due to better yields from the up to 8.5% die size reduction.
 
Mirev said:
Really going insane about Pyoro's tweet.

Multiple "SW" = Switch 2 confirmed to be the name?
Nintendo WC 1990 were in october 10th... idk

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I don't think this would be a name confirmation only... let's see where this red bird goes
 
BDGAME said:
So, the 550MHz is the peak power efficiency for GPU, but not for RT cores, right? Maybe put it at 650 MHz is to maximize the RT Cores and DLSS capacities.
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The RT cores are in the GPU. There is no way of extracting a separate performance curve for those cores by themselves.
Thraktor said:
With Switch 2, it seems pretty unlikely that there will be a Mariko-style updated SoC at any point in the console's lifespan, which means they'll need to design a system which they can still buy parts for perhaps as much as 8 years later. Nintendo (and, I'm sure Nvidia) have surely spent a lot of time talking with RAM manufacturers about the production lifespan of the parts they're interested in, and if it's expected that LPDDR5X will almost completely replace 5 in the same way 4X replaced 4, then there would be a very strong incentive for Nintendo to have an SoC with LPDDR5X support even if they had no intention of using the higher speeds.
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This is all very smart.
 
So, given Pyoro starts tweeting a few days before something happens, i'd guess next week might have something after all?

If it's ReDraketed related and not just Nintendo having more tournaments over summer or something.
 
darthdiablo said:


No idea. Might not be a hint, but I also have not known Pyoro to really tweet much at all unless it's to hint at something (not saying he "never", he has before).
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SoldierDelta said:


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Two to four Switches.

It's not Switch 2.

It's PLURAL.



Prediction before it explodes:

New budget Switch 1 model a-la 2DS.

New generation model.
 
Remember the F-Zero return hint? That's I guess the same type of hint
Why would he pick one of the only cartridge that have switched on it, 7th may is around the corner...
 
Truno said:
Nintendo World Championship?
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Just to downplay theories because, let's be honest, Fami is being turned into a light show at HQ so let's downplay it a bit.

There is an omission from the Wii U that hasn't been ported yet to Switch, being NES Remix. That is a rather notable omission given their quality. Alternatively it's something for NSO. It's not a guarantee that it's Switch 2.

But also it's literally right next to the Financial Briefing in addition to how the SW1-4 clues line up, i'm just so perplexed right now. Don't do this to us you wonderful, aggravating bird...
 
Will Pyoro be the hero to finally open the ReDraketed doors?

Or will he be the biggest troll in recent history?

Willst he soar?

Or willst he suck?

^^
 
Concernt said:
Two to four Switches.

It's not Switch 2.

It's PLURAL.



Prediction before it explodes:

New budget Switch 1 model a-la 2DS.

New generation model.
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A new Switch model like the 2DS? Not sure what audience that would be for, why not buy a Switch Lite?

Safe Prediction: A new Nintendo World Championship or new NSO games

Ideal Outcome: Switch 2/successor announcement
 
Shoulder said:
What I'm stuck on is the Timestamps next to SW1 thru SW4. I don't get it.
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Don't know why/context of Pyoro tweeting, but you can read about the 1990 Nintendo World Championships cartridge here. It also mentions exposed dip switches (which we see in the image). Those dip switches were used to set the amount of time players have to complete the games, I presume that's what the duration values next to SW1 thru SW4 are for.
 
I feel like Switch 2 is a bit too predictable. It may just be something like NES remix or other retro stuff. Or Nintendo is hosting another World Championship competition.
 
That's Pyoro.

If Pyoro is posting.

Then it's hit marketing

Which means it's working

Which means...

Not being entirely serious, just a silly joke from Doctor Who.
 
Concernt said:
Two to four Switches.

It's not Switch 2.

It's PLURAL.



Prediction before it explodes:

New budget Switch 1 model a-la 2DS.

New generation model.
Click to expand...

If this will be correct, I can see Nintendo announcing a budget-model Switch 1 next week and the new generation one in june/july
 
SoldierDelta said:
Just to downplay theories because, let's be honest, Fami is being turned into a light show at HQ so let's downplay it a bit.

There is an omission from the Wii U that hasn't been ported yet to Switch, being NES Remix. That is a rather notable omission given their quality. Alternatively it's something for NSO. It's not a guarantee that it's Switch 2.

But also it's literally right next to the Financial Briefing in addition to how the SW1-4 clues line up, i'm just so perplexed right now. Don't do this to us you wonderful, aggravating bird...
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Pyoro has been extremely transparent with NSO drops, so I doubt its that tbh
 
Concernt said:
That's Pyoro.

If Pyoro has heard...

That means it's hit marketing

Which means it's working

Which means...
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My thoughts just now as well.

Would Pyoro really tease a dry PR announcement?

But on the other hand, it would be way too soon for a full reveal.

... If it's Switch 2 related after all.
 
I'm kind of expecting this TBH lol

Nintendo announces and adds Nintendo World Championship variation for some NES games in the NES app.

OHHHH
giphy.gif
 
Truno said:
Pyoro has been extremely transparent with NSO drops, so I doubt its that tbh
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That's true. That leaves NES Remix which, I need to state... it's an odd fucking time to announce that thing right? With this hint?

Maybe Nintendo is bringing back Nintendo World Championship after stopping in 2017? Listen, I'm trying to be rational with this because the one road that makes sense is too... optimistic after years of this shit happening. I want to be wrong in my hopes because I don't want to be disappointed, but here we are and we're kind of stuck like this.

So fuck it, i guess we wait.
 
Bonejack said:
My thoughts just now as well.

Would Pyoro really tease a dry PR announcement?

But on the other hand, it would be way too soon for a full reveal.

... If it's Switch 2 related after all.
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Formal announcements of a successor before/during the first financial briefing of the FY of a new Nintendo platform are the norm to be honest, even for consoles launching at the end of that FY (like the 3DS or the Switch).
 
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