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StarTopic Future Nintendo Hardware & Technology Speculation & Discussion |ST| (Read the staff posts before commenting!)

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PixelKnight said:
I think it’ll almost certainly be a hybrid again. What I’m not expecting to change is the single pipeline for games, so even if they were to change it up, I could see the most likely change being just having dedicated hardware models (like the Switch Lite) for portable or home console play closer to launch, if only to sell multiple devices to families more quickly. Even then I think that’s way less likely than just a single core system like the Switch, with hardware variants to follow later.
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The Switch ecosystem roadmap was successful, so I presume they’ll follow it up with some adjustments

Chaotic Neutral said:
I don’t see them moving away from the hybrid model, at least not for a long while.
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I don’t see them ever moving from hybrid. The idea of them capitalizing on their handheld market dominion and using that base to take a chunk of the home market by making a hybrid is phenomenal. And the way things are looking with the competition:

• Sony: Focused on the home market

• Microsoft: Focused on the home market and a subscription model via an ecosystem of a next gen console and a beefed up previous gen variant

Nintendo can comfortably sit as a hybrid console that has one to two SKUs per household. And right now, that can turn into three because of the successor and continued support for the OG Switch. They can solidly stay as a three per household item via timely refreshes
 
Stefan51278 said:
Apple buys bigger bulk, but I see your point. I still think 4N would make a launch before the second half of 2024 unlikely. They need to produce a lot of chips for launch and the following months, developers need final Devkits at last half a year before the device ships. I personally would hope for 4N and 16GB of Ram, that would be a monster of a Hybrid console. I heard a rumor someday that Nintendo wants something that can't easily be emulated on a Steamdeck and going for 16GB of Ram would ensure that for a loooong time.
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Nintendo and Apple aren't competing for node, thankfully.
 
ziggyrivers said:
The CMA snitching the Switch 2 💀
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*Snitch 2
Just like the early models of the Xbox One, it'll monitor you, even if the system is turned off. Big Brother Nintendo will watch your every move so they can give you the best gaming experience. Invasion of privacy? What're ya talkin' about? Coming to your homes on Holiday 1984 2023!
 
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slsk said:
TSMC have N4P classed as Mainstream (suitable for mid-to-low-end mobile devices) next year:
Advanced%20Technology%20Roadmap.PNG


Image from: https://www.anandtech.com/show/1883...e-power-delivery-in-2026-n2x-added-to-roadmap
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Is the 4N node in that diagram the same as the node Nvidia are using for Lovelace?
 
Gerald said:
Do You still think guys about Late 2023-Early 2024 For Switch 2?
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I don't really know, but one thing I've been thinking more and more lately is that early 202X is unlikely based on historical precedent.

Yes, I know, the Switch launched in March. But it was meant to launch holiday 2016, and they couldn't delay it a full year given how terribly the Wii U was performing. Moreover, there was no real danger in a "reveal late 2016, release early 2017" strategy from a sales perspective, since the Wii U was doing so poorly at this point that the potential additional sales in early 2017 from the Switch far, far exceeded the likely losses in holiday Wii U sales.

If you remove the Switch, what do you have? Nothing, that's what. Every single Nintendo home console has released in North America in August or later of the calendar year of its release. Japan has had a couple of Nintendo home consoles release in June, but the most recent one was the Nintendo 64.

I just cannot see this trend being overruled in this case. What would be the advantage of an early release over delaying it a few months? Either you have to reveal it before the holidays (cannibalizing the holiday Switch sales), or you have a pretty short marketing cycle which begins immediately after the holidays (which I feel would be controversial).

So to summarize: if it doesn't come this year, I'm not expecting it to come until later next year.
 
I think we can all agree that generally suits on a governmental board have even less understanding and knowledge about how games are made than the average internet forum person. ^^
 
here's the key excerpt of that article

"Nintendo does not currently offer COD, and we have seen no evidence to suggest that its consoles would be technically capable of running a version of COD that is similar to those in Xbox and PlayStation in terms of quality of gameplay and content."
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some version of Call of Duty could perhaps run on Switch but it wouldn't be sufficiently competitive. The only uncompromised way to play the games would be on Microsoft's platforms
 
arsen said:
They also want details about that deal, are they trying to bait Microsoft to leak Nintendo next-gen? lol
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In that case, let em cook. Yeah, they're government suits, but I want my REDACTED, goddamnit!!!!!
 
Just watched the gameplay preview available for press members for tears of the kingdom and as much as I liked the original game, I have to say: the performance isn't looking so good. I know BoTW started rough as well but eventually the patches fixed nearly all performance issues with the few exceptions being: korok forest and the entrance to rito village.

Both of these aren't much of an issue considering that they're places you visit once in a while but watching the tears of the kingdom gameplay, I noticed the FPS drops quite a lot during combat which wasn't an issue for me who first played botw on a 2019 model switch after multiple patches were already in place.

I'm honestly considering on waiting for a new switch model to play the game.
 
kasparov77 said:
Just watched the gameplay preview available for press members for tears of the kingdom and as much as I liked the original game, I have to say: the performance isn't looking so good. I know BoTW started rough as well but eventually the patches fixed nearly all performance issues with the few exceptions being: korok forest and the entrance to rito village.

Both of these aren't much of an issue considering that they're places you visit once in a while but watching the tears of the kingdom gameplay, I noticed the FPS drops quite a lot during combat which wasn't an issue for me who first played botw on a 2019 model switch after multiple patches were already in place.

I'm honestly considering on waiting for a new switch model to play the game.
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Just a heads up, most previewers said performance was fine during their playtime. There were some drops during big fights with lots of effects and during the Ultrahand-crafting (which is somewhat understandable, manipulating objects and physics in real time after all).

One previewer apparently said that the B-roll footage Nintendo provided had lots of issues and has been captured really shitty.
 
Bonejack said:
I think we can all agree that generally suits on a governmental board have even less understanding and knowledge about how games are made than the average internet forum person. ^^
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I mean it‘s not wrong what they‘re saying from a visual standpoint. But it‘s overall a weak argument. You could very well develop a high quality COD for Switch that is comparable with PS/XBOX content-wise.
 
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ILikeFeet said:
a terrible fucking argument that ignores how games are made and history
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"Nintendo does not currently offer COD, and we have seen no evidence to suggest that its consoles would be technically capable of running a version of COD that is similar to those in Xbox and PlayStation in terms of quality of gameplay and content."

"similiar" is a highly subjective term though.

You could argue the Wii Call Of Dutys were not similiar. You could also argue they were. You could argue 30fps is not similiar to 60fps, and so on. To a lot of people it is, to some it isnt.

You would have to get into the nitty gritty to make that argument, which I bet CMA did not.
 
TSR3 said:
Still Team 2023 at the moment, but I’m relaxed about late 2024 if it’s on TSMC N4 node
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As long as the second half of this year's software schedule remains a mystery, I will remain optimistic about a late 2023 release for Redacted. If there is a June Direct that shows off a bunch of Switch titles for later this year with no mention of new hardware, then I will move my expectations to late 2024.

As long as Drake is on a node better than 8nm, performance will be impressive even for hardware releasing in late 2024. Consoles specs are only cutting edge/high end when they launch, every year after that they continue to become more and more outdated. In 2027 Redacted will be "outdated" hardware regardless if it released in 2023 or 2024.

The node that Drake is on will be dependent on what manufacturer was willing to offer Nintendo a good deal. If Samsung is offering Drake on their 5nm solution for significantly less cost compared to TSMC 4N, then I would expect Nintendo to go with Samsung, even if performance is 20% worse.
 
ReddDreadtheLead said:
How?
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I was being sarcastic, but one would think:
“If the Switch isn’t capable of running CoD, why would Nintendo bother? Maybe their successor to Switch is coming along”
You could present a counter argument of “cloud version”, but it’s exactly why it was intended as a sarcastic statement 😅

Bonejack said:
I think we can all agree that generally suits on a governmental board have even less understanding and knowledge about how games are made than the average internet forum person. ^^
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Yup. That’s what some replies are saying.
 
Concernt said:
The Shield TV didn't flop, but the OEM market for the X1 didn't materialise until Nintendo stepped up.

T239 is pretty much as good as it gets for its TDP, and Xbox Series X wasn't too far behind the curve at launch.


Consoles use custom processors, which isn't the same as outdated.
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I always thought the Shield TV flopped really hard because i genuinely never saw anyone talking about it online, huh...

T239 will do fine, and even with the possibility of it being on 8nm, i don't care tbh because even then we' still get PS4 level visuals on a handheld. Or at least very close to PS4, which is more than enough even for the next 7 years. Current games releasing on it are still holding up well against PS5.

As for the custom SoCs, they're still based on older tech no? Shouldn't this qualify as "outdated" hardware?
Like, when PS5 & Series X launched, we already had proper AMD RDNA2 as well as Nvidia Ampere based GPUs for 1-2 months. I know it's not a lot of time but technically speaking they launched with older tech. It's still a generation behind, but not on the same level as it was with the Wii U, which was truly outstandingly outdated for a console released in 2012.
 
ziggyrivers said:
I was being sarcastic, but one would think:
“If the Switch isn’t capable of running CoD, why would Nintendo bother? Maybe their successor to Switch is coming along”
You could present a counter argument of “cloud version”, but it’s exactly why it was intended as a sarcastic statement 😅


Yup. That’s what some replies are saying.
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Hm, I see. Although in jest, Nintendo has had demanding games on their system that just required severe downgrades to run (not look great, just run) which proves the scalability of some proprietary game engines.
 
Goodtwin said:
As long as the second half of this year's software schedule remains a mystery, I will remain optimistic about a late 2023 release for Redacted. If there is a June Direct that shows off a bunch of Switch titles for later this year with no mention of new hardware, then I will move my expectations to late 2024.

As long as Drake is on a node better than 8nm, performance will be impressive even for hardware releasing in late 2024. Consoles specs are only cutting edge/high end when they launch, every year after that they continue to become more and more outdated. In 2027 Redacted will be "outdated" hardware regardless if it released in 2023 or 2024.

The node that Drake is on will be dependent on what manufacturer was willing to offer Nintendo a good deal. If Samsung is offering Drake on their 5nm solution for significantly less cost compared to TSMC 4N, then I would expect Nintendo to go with Samsung, even if performance is 20% worse.
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TSR3 said:
Is that 20% figure the expected performance difference between Samsung and TSMC nodes, or just an example or your own acceptance limit
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Um, if I’m not mistaken, Samsung 5 nm does not perform 20% worse than TSMC 4nm, it performance closer to 30-40% worse if you want a comparable yield.


But I could be misremembering it. In any case, if it’s performing 20% worse it would be 20% worse with also lower yield meaning they have to buy more waters to accommodate for the lower yields. But if clocked lower, where it is even worse than that, I think the yield would be about the same.
 
Raccoon said:
here's the key excerpt of that article



some version of Call of Duty could perhaps run on Switch but it wouldn't be sufficiently competitive. The only uncompromised way to play the games would be on Microsoft's platforms
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I don't think that matters to the Switch gamer. It didn't for thr wii gamer or ds gamer in the past

Hermii said:
"Nintendo does not currently offer COD, and we have seen no evidence to suggest that its consoles would be technically capable of running a version of COD that is similar to those in Xbox and PlayStation in terms of quality of gameplay and content."

"similiar" is a highly subjective term though.

You could argue the Wii Call Of Dutys were not similiar. You could also argue they were. You could argue 30fps is not similiar to 60fps, and so on. To a lot of people it is, to some it isnt.

You would have to get into the nitty gritty to make that argument, which I bet CMA did not.
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Therein lies my biggest problem with their claim, they make no specifics. They didn't cite anything. In a world where fortnite, overwatch, and apex has cross play, the idea is bunk. If they really want to tout performance, they have to argue against high end pcs and the like. There's also the many Bethesda ports, the Witcher, etc as citation. And the old Wii CoDs. This shit sloppy and toxic, bordering on using trash ass sources like gamefaqs, 4chan, and neogaf/resetera to make the arguments for them. It's insulting to the intelligence.
 
TomNookYankees said:
Normally I would agree, but Microsoft were the ones claiming that if they brought Call of Duty to Nintendo hardware that it would be at parity with other versions in terms of features.

www.gameinformer.com

Microsoft Signs 10-Year Deal To Bring Call Of Duty To Nintendo

If there's one thing Nintendo fans have wanted all these years, it's Call of Duty, right?
www.gameinformer.com www.gameinformer.com
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And they can, but notice they never said Switch. They know the lifespan of systems and how long it would take to port a game, so they're not going to limit themselves to a system that might be in its way out. The CMA isn't working from foresight but rather as if games are made instantly
 
If Nintendo starts including 4K (or higher quality) assets in their games and bloats their bigger games (like Smash or Zelda) to 50 GBs or so, do we Nintendo requiring large downloads instead of going for a 64GB cart?
 
ILikeFeet said:
I don't think that matters to the Switch gamer. It didn't for thr wii gamer or ds gamer in the past


Therein lies my biggest problem with their claim, they make no specifics. They didn't cite anything. In a world where fortnite, overwatch, and apex has cross play, the idea is bunk. If they really want to tout performance, they have to argue against high end pcs and the like. There's also the many Bethesda ports, the Witcher, etc as citation. And the old Wii CoDs. This shit sloppy and toxic, bordering on using trash ass sources like gamefaqs, 4chan, and neogaf/resetera to make the arguments for them. It's insulting to the intelligence.
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Go off king
 
Goodtwin said:
The node that Drake is on will be dependent on what manufacturer was willing to offer Nintendo a good deal. If Samsung is offering Drake on their 5nm solution for significantly less cost compared to TSMC 4N, then I would expect Nintendo to go with Samsung, even if performance is 20% worse.
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I don't know if Samsung's necessarily cheaper than TSMC in the long run, especially if Nintendo and Nvidia have to fabricate more wafers with Samsung vs with TSMC since wafer yields with Samsung are not as good as wafer yields with TSMC.
 
There’s also the thing that, TSMC’s 4 nm is going to be long lived just like their 7 nm and their 16 nm. Samsung nodes typically aren’t that long, and they will have Nintendo move to a newer node which is going to cost them. Meanwhile, if they stay with TSMC then in that case they don’t have to necessarily refresh it so soon, they can remain at the 4 nm for probably the rest of the life cycle of the Nintendo switch 2.
 
L_esson said:
I'm not sure what the big deal is with NERD's job offer (which, by the way, is easily accessible in French by changing "EN" to "FR" in the filename in the url).
I mean, of course Nintendo is going to have a next generation system at some point, and it's especially true after more than 6 years with the Switch.

NERD has also worked on emulation for systems like NES/SNES Mini iirc, or even the recent Mario/Zelda Game&Watch (not sure for those), it's always best to think of all possibilities when "other Nintendo systems" are mentioned.
The French document also doesn't explicitly talk about new generations, just mentions "future Nintendo platforms" which can be another Game&Watch or a Mini console or even something else.

Of course, I'm deliberately posting in a pessimist way to temper expectations and such, I think we should never jump to conclusions too quickly even from an official Nintendo document and especially for NERD, even considering what they worked on before.

I just don't think it confirms something we didn't know, except maybe some kind of cross-platform but that could just be for NSO stuff.
If anything, this job offer actually worries me because it feels a bit late and could indicate that we won't even have a reveal this year, or am I mistaken?
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they are helping Nintendo with cross-gen games, for both Switch and it sucessor, like working with they engines to work on both consoles, allowing Nintendo internal studios, it subsidiaries a much easir job to work on both console, imagine if Retro Studios plan to release Metroid Prime 4 on both Switch and it sucessor, NERD will give Retro Studios the tecnology/know how necessary for them to do this
 
ItWasMeantToBe19 said:
CoD probably skipped the Switch because the carts were small.

The big issue for the Switch 2 and CoD is that the carts will probably still be small.
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Nintendo still has not used the 64GB cartdridge for Nintendo Switch games and possibly it sucessor, Tears of the Kingdom is the first party game that use a 32GB cartdridge, the rest of Nintendo first-party games on Switch used the 8 and 16GB cartdridge.
 
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