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StarTopic Future Nintendo Hardware & Technology Speculation & Discussion |ST| (Read the staff posts before commenting!)

Reader mode
Concernt said:
As someone who uses OLED and LCD on the daily, OLEDs have issues and LCDs are still great. If this is a NEW technology like Sharp seems to imply, it could be VERY impressive. HDR, high-nit brightness mini LED LCD would smash OLED Model.
Click to expand...
Grumpy old man here but why do people use "on the daily", instead of just "daily"?
"As someone who uses OLED and LCD daily" is perfectly correct.
 
Yet another instance of sloppy reporting from Mochizuki? I have other things to tend to, so please forgive my unorganized thoughts:
  • The original slide did NOT say "new game console", but "new [panel] models for VR and gaming".
    • Mochizuki conveniently forgot to mention "VR" and added "console" to make his point.
  • The slide did NOT identify any potential clients (let alone contracted clients).
    • It was Mochizuki himself namedropping Nintendo, while it could be Sony, Tencent, or other usual suspects.
  • Sharp Display Technology Corporation (SDTC) manufactures both LCD and OLED panels.
    • Again, the slide did NOT specify the panel type.
    • Unless there's another source independently confirming it being LCD, I wouldn't be so sure that it isn't OLED.
  • Sharp Corporation does sell mini-LED TVs. It is unclear, however, whether they manufacture the panels themselves or source it from other Hon Hai subsidiaries.
    • More importantly, AFAIK SDTC does NOT supply any mini-LED panels to partners.
    • Although it isn't impossible that SDTC is setting up a mini-LED product line for Nintendo, I doubt that it'd be economic for either side.
    • Not to mention, as the panel size decreases, the cost of OLED panel becomes cheaper than mini-LED. (The opposite is true when the size increases, hence the cost advantage of large mini-LED TVs.)
  • Even if the new panel is intended for Nintendo, it doesn't automatically mean Switch 2.
Edit: Grammar
 
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MrBones said:
I agree. I think that 15m number is really cocky with their (likely) tepid H2 software lineup.

I think, best case, we get DLC and a larger holiday title (like 2D Mario or DK) , but that's literally it. Expecting a big Summer Direct that unveils a blowout H2 with tons of unannounced games is delusional, unfortunately
Click to expand...
How is it delusional? Why wouldn't they have a summer Direct, when they've had one almost every year? I'm having a hard time understanding how you came to that assertion.
 
HankyPanky said:
there was talk a long while back (before the OLED model) that Nintendo was looking into Mini-LED (that Sharp also produce) and now 'Sharp has been involved in since the product's R&D stage'. Mini-LED would fall broadly under a 'LCD' type panel too, presumably. seems a bit OTT to fire up a new production line for something unless it's perhaps the first iteration of these panels in smaller, mobile size? the author makes a not so-subtle nod to Nintendo being the likely customer. it also says these production lines are in trial phase this FY which doesn't bode well for it being ready particularly soon.

www.techradar.com

Nintendo Switch Pro could sport a Mini LED display – here's why that matters

The next Nintendo Switch could get a bit upgrade
www.techradar.com www.techradar.com
Click to expand...
Other day I was looking for my amazing C825 Mini LED TV and asking myself if Nintendo can utilize that Tech on Switch 2. It cheap than OLED but has a amazing black levels and more bright too. So they can use something like HDR. And what is better: Mini LED consume less watts than OLED. My TV uses 230 W, while a OLED C1 uses the double of that.

So, If Nintendo bring to us a Mini LED painel, it will be the best choose they can do.
 
MrBones said:
Not in the dark, I just think people shouldn't expect a Summer direct. They can easily coast on social media reveals of H2 DLC for Pokemon, Zelda, and Mario Kart, and maybe a smaller/mid-sized game reveal ala Age of Calamity.
Click to expand...
Gotcha, that would be a bummer but I will have my hands full with Zelda, Pikmin, and Diablo IV. Hope that can hold me over.
 
0
The reports by other major Japanese press regarding the Sharp earnings have no mentions of a new panel/product line for gaming applications: Nikkei, NHK, Reuters, Asahi, Yumiuri, and TBS.

Even more curious, another article on Bloomberg Japan described the subject differently from what Mochizuki wrote earlier:

"A slump in the market for large LCD panels and LCDs for PCs and smartphones led to a deterioration in business performance. The operating loss of the display device business in the previous fiscal year was 66.4 billion yen (20.3 billion yen profit in the year before). This fiscal year, the company aims to expand the small to medium panel business by launching new models for VR and gaming applications, and also aim to significantly reduce the deficit in this business." (Machine translation with my edits)

This account matches what was in the original presentation slide.
 
Hermii said:
Imo the article leaves zero doubt this is Nintendo.
Click to expand...

If he threw a few winky faces in the article I would be 100% convinced.

(this is /s cause I'm not anywhere close to 100% convinced that what he's heavily implying is true. This is like that Jensen Huang gossip rag article where he "was seen heading in the direction of Nintendo"...there was a big freakout but nothing ever came of it - yet anyway))
 
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fwd-bwd said:
The reports by other major Japanese press regarding the Sharp earnings have no mentions of a new panel/product line for gaming applications: Nikkei, NHK, Reuters, Asahi, Yumiuri, and TBS.

Even more curious, another article on Bloomberg Japan described the subject differently from what Mochizuki wrote earlier:

"A slump in the market for large LCD panels and LCDs for PCs and smartphones led to a deterioration in business performance. The operating loss of the display device business in the previous fiscal year was 66.4 billion yen (20.3 billion yen profit in the year before). This fiscal year, the company aims to expand the small to medium panel business by launching new models for VR and gaming applications, and also aim to significantly reduce the deficit in this business." (Machine translation with my edits)

This account matches what was in the original presentation slide.
Click to expand...
Ya know Fwd, you could probably make a career out of being a better Japan tech news sleuth than the rest. Im not kidding, maybe you should start a substack or something.
 
MrBones said:
2016, 2020, 2022
Click to expand...
2016: To be fair, there wasn't much to show outside of 3DS titles and Breath of the Wild. Seems like they were preparing for the Switch, in retrospect.

2020: Covid, nuff said

2022: If you don't count the Partner Showcase, like I do, then I'll give you that, but I doubt they'd do it again. I expect them to announce more first-party titles, as we don't know much outside of Pikmin 4.
 
fwd-bwd said:
Yet another instance of sloppy reporting from Mochizuki? I have other things to tend to, so please forgive my unorganized thoughts:
  • The original slide did NOT say "new game console", but "new [panel] models for VR and gaming".
    • Mochizuki conveniently forgot to mention "VR" and added "console" to make his point.
  • The slide did NOT identify any potential clients (let alone contracted clients).
    • It was Mochizuki himself namedropping Nintendo, while it could be Sony, Tencent, or other usual suspects.
  • Sharp Display Technology Corporation (SDTC) manufactures both LCD and OLED panels.
    • Again, the slide did NOT specify the panel type.
    • Unless there's another source independently confirming it being LCD, I wouldn't be so sure that it isn't OLED.
  • Sharp Corporation does sell mini-LED TVs. It is unclear, however, whether they manufacture the panels themselves or source it from other Hon Hai subsidiaries.
    • More importantly, AFAIK SDTC does NOT supply any mini-LED panels to partners.
    • Although it isn't impossible that SDTC is setting up a mini-LED product line for Nintendo, I doubt that it'd be economic for either side.
    • Not to mention, as the panel size decreases, the cost of OLED panel becomes cheaper than mini-LED. (The opposite is true when the size increases, hence the cost advantage of large mini-LED TVs.)
  • Even ifthe new panel is intended for Nintendo, it doesn't automatically mean Switch 2.
Edit: Grammar
Click to expand...
Was Mochi always this sloppy?
 
Armoured_Bear said:
What dialect is yours?
Click to expand...


61ANegMDwDL._AC_SY879_.jpg
 
I was thinking maybe a dual release from the get go if Nintendo want to hit a low price point for Switch and still have a premium option.

So
Switch 2 - LCD Screen and 128GB
Switch 2 OLED - OLED Screen and 256GB


Then later down the line when they manage to shrink the chip we can get
Switch 2 V2 which would replace Switch 2
Switch 2 OLED V2 which would replace Switch 2 OLED
Switch 2 Lite
 
Armoured_Bear said:
Grumpy old man here but why do people use "on the daily", instead of just "daily"?
"As someone who uses OLED and LCD daily" is perfectly correct.
Click to expand...
Thank you for that info. Beside the informatioal factor I use this side to improve my English skills and something like that really helps.
 
0
kalosmani said:
I was thinking maybe a dual release from the get go if Nintendo want to hit a low price point for Switch and still have a premium option.

So
Switch 2 - LCD Screen and 128GB
Switch 2 OLED - OLED Screen and 256GB


Then later down the line when they manage to shrink the chip we can get
Switch 2 V2 which would replace Switch 2
Switch 2 OLED V2 which would replace Switch 2 OLED
Switch 2 Lite
Click to expand...
Honestly, if they could manage a good MiniLED screen I would take it over OLED. Higher peak and sustained brightness, better HDR, better power efficiency. There's a reason Apple uses them in their most expensive iPads.

OLED black levels are incredible, but you sacrifice a bit in other areas to get them.
 
Armoured_Bear said:
I'm not convinced that "on the daily" belongs to any particular dialect.
It's just pointless slang.
Click to expand...
If I say it or type it and people understand it, it's communicated something. Communication is the point of language. I wouldn't call it "pointless" on that basis. Please don't get twisted up about it!

We all use language a little differently, and I'd bet there's probably a literal ocean, or at least a sea, between us, so things are super different over here! Heck, we have an entire native language that isn't English, and sometimes we use words in that language in place of English.

I avoid that here because it's an English speaking website on the whole, and I don't want to miscommunicate anything. But it's also not a formal environment, so I feel comfortable using highly dialectical language. Stuff like "on the daily", or the contraction "am't". As long as people understand, I don't tend to worry!
 
fwd-bwd said:
Yet another instance of sloppy reporting from Mochizuki? I have other things to tend to, so please forgive my unorganized thoughts:
  • The original slide did NOT say "new game console", but "new [panel] models for VR and gaming".
    • Mochizuki conveniently forgot to mention "VR" and added "console" to make his point.
  • The slide did NOT identify any potential clients (let alone contracted clients).
    • It was Mochizuki himself namedropping Nintendo, while it could be Sony, Tencent, or other usual suspects.
  • Sharp Display Technology Corporation (SDTC) manufactures both LCD and OLED panels.
    • Again, the slide did NOT specify the panel type.
    • Unless there's another source independently confirming it being LCD, I wouldn't be so sure that it isn't OLED.
  • Sharp Corporation does sell mini-LED TVs. It is unclear, however, whether they manufacture the panels themselves or source it from other Hon Hai subsidiaries.
    • More importantly, AFAIK SDTC does NOT supply any mini-LED panels to partners.
    • Although it isn't impossible that SDTC is setting up a mini-LED product line for Nintendo, I doubt that it'd be economic for either side.
    • Not to mention, as the panel size decreases, the cost of OLED panel becomes cheaper than mini-LED. (The opposite is true when the size increases, hence the cost advantage of large mini-LED TVs.)
  • Even if the new panel is intended for Nintendo, it doesn't automatically mean Switch 2.
Edit: Grammar
Click to expand...
Wow. If those are your disorganized thoughts, I don’t wanna see them organized xD

Joke aside, thanks for your input, fwd-bwd! Just another case of mistranslation, or in this case, sloppy and deliberate mistranslation. If the presentation didn’t identify customers, it’s possible Sharp is preparing screens to present to interested parties and then see if they get a purchase to mass produce. With a saturation of portable, high-end consoles, what’s next besides pushing the limits of the tech? Perhaps VR on the go

It’s possible the Mini-LED is, as you mentioned, for the eventual Lite revision. Talking about Game & Watch, maybe a Mario themed one?

mjayer said:
Ya know Fwd, you could probably make a career out of being a better Japan tech news sleuth than the rest. Im not kidding, maybe you should start a substack or something.
Click to expand...
Start a blog, promo on Twitter, make a 15/30 minute podcast, then a Discord 🤪
 
Thanks for the kind words. I shared these posts because we are all on this crazy train together, or as a certain foreign forum puts it, an “asylum”. No intention to write professionally outside of this thread.
 
dram and nand just keeps tumbling. given how late these can be changed, maybe Nintendo can get 16GB and 256GB combos

20230509_140949_2023-05-09_140837.png


DRAMeXchange - 【Market View】DRAM and NAND Flash Prices Expected to Fall Further in 2Q23 Due to Weak Server Shipments and High Inventory Levels, Says TrendForce

DRAM, NAND Flash, SSD, Module and Memory card, and provides market research on spot and contract prices, daily news, market views and reports, and monthly datasheets of semiconductor industry.集邦科技
www.dramexchange.com www.dramexchange.com
 
ILikeFeet said:
dram and nand just keeps tumbling. given how late these can be changed, maybe Nintendo can get 16GB and 256GB combos

20230509_140949_2023-05-09_140837.png


DRAMeXchange - 【Market View】DRAM and NAND Flash Prices Expected to Fall Further in 2Q23 Due to Weak Server Shipments and High Inventory Levels, Says TrendForce

DRAM, NAND Flash, SSD, Module and Memory card, and provides market research on spot and contract prices, daily news, market views and reports, and monthly datasheets of semiconductor industry.集邦科技
www.dramexchange.com www.dramexchange.com
Click to expand...
16GBLPDDR5+256GB eMMC would be... Extremely welcome.
 
fwd-bwd said:
Yet another instance of sloppy reporting from Mochizuki? I have other things to tend to, so please forgive my unorganized thoughts:
  • The original slide did NOT say "new game console", but "new [panel] models for VR and gaming".
    • Mochizuki conveniently forgot to mention "VR" and added "console" to make his point.
  • The slide did NOT identify any potential clients (let alone contracted clients).
    • It was Mochizuki himself namedropping Nintendo, while it could be Sony, Tencent, or other usual suspects.
  • Sharp Display Technology Corporation (SDTC) manufactures both LCD and OLED panels.
    • Again, the slide did NOT specify the panel type.
    • Unless there's another source independently confirming it being LCD, I wouldn't be so sure that it isn't OLED.
  • Sharp Corporation does sell mini-LED TVs. It is unclear, however, whether they manufacture the panels themselves or source it from other Hon Hai subsidiaries.
    • More importantly, AFAIK SDTC does NOT supply any mini-LED panels to partners.
    • Although it isn't impossible that SDTC is setting up a mini-LED product line for Nintendo, I doubt that it'd be economic for either side.
    • Not to mention, as the panel size decreases, the cost of OLED panel becomes cheaper than mini-LED. (The opposite is true when the size increases, hence the cost advantage of large mini-LED TVs.)
  • Even ifthe new panel is intended for Nintendo, it doesn't automatically mean Switch 2.
Edit: Grammar
Click to expand...

The article doesn't seem to be based just on the slide, but also comments made by the CEO Robert Wu on an investor call. The article is reprinted here on Yahoo Finance, and quotes Wu directly:

“I can’t comment on any details regarding specific customers. But as to a new gaming console, we’ve been involved in its R&D stage,” Wu told analysts on a call after releasing quarterly earnings.
Click to expand...

Maybe some more transcripts to wait for alongside the English translation of Nintendo's?

Edit: Also, the mini LED talk is just speculation here on this thread. There's no comment on it in the article.

ILikeFeet said:
dram and nand just keeps tumbling. given how late these can be changed, maybe Nintendo can get 16GB and 256GB combos

20230509_140949_2023-05-09_140837.png


DRAMeXchange - 【Market View】DRAM and NAND Flash Prices Expected to Fall Further in 2Q23 Due to Weak Server Shipments and High Inventory Levels, Says TrendForce

DRAM, NAND Flash, SSD, Module and Memory card, and provides market research on spot and contract prices, daily news, market views and reports, and monthly datasheets of semiconductor industry.集邦科技
www.dramexchange.com www.dramexchange.com
Click to expand...

It's pretty close to a 50% drop for both LPDDR and UFS from mid-2022 to mid-2023 at this point. I still don't think 16GB of RAM is particularly likely, although I'm warming to the possibility of 256GB of storage. Not just based on price, but also the CMA report on the MS Activision acquisition brought up lack of storage space quite a lot when comparing the Switch to MS and Sony's console, presumably based on developers' responses. If those developers are saying the same thing to Nintendo, then they may be inclined to go heavier on storage for their next console.
 
Thraktor said:
It's pretty close to a 50% drop for both LPDDR and UFS from mid-2022 to mid-2023 at this point. I still don't think 16GB of RAM is particularly likely, although I'm warming to the possibility of 256GB of storage. Not just based on price, but also the CMA report on the MS Activision acquisition brought up lack of storage space quite a lot when comparing the Switch to MS and Sony's console, presumably based on developers' responses. If those developers are saying the same thing to Nintendo, then they may be inclined to go heavier on storage for their next console.
Click to expand...
at 16GB, I question if there's much improvement over 12GB. given the other limitations, running out of memory will be the last thing to happen to you
 
Concernt said:
If I say it or type it and people understand it, it's communicated something. Communication is the point of language. I wouldn't call it "pointless" on that basis. Please don't get twisted up about it!

We all use language a little differently, and I'd bet there's probably a literal ocean, or at least a sea, between us, so things are super different over here! Heck, we have an entire native language that isn't English, and sometimes we use words in that language in place of English.

I avoid that here because it's an English speaking website on the whole, and I don't want to miscommunicate anything. But it's also not a formal environment, so I feel comfortable using highly dialectical language. Stuff like "on the daily", or the contraction "am't". As long as people understand, I don't tend to worry!
Click to expand...
Sure, my use of "pointless" is that you add two words on to one (not you personally, sure you didn't invent it!) with no change in meaning, not that slang is pointless. Often slang add a lot over the standard language it replaces.

I have to confess, I'd have to guess what "am't" means, never heard that before.
"am not" I imagine?

Anyway, I'm going back to shouting at clouds.
 
ILikeFeet said:
dram and nand just keeps tumbling. given how late these can be changed, maybe Nintendo can get 16GB and 256GB combos

20230509_140949_2023-05-09_140837.png


DRAMeXchange - 【Market View】DRAM and NAND Flash Prices Expected to Fall Further in 2Q23 Due to Weak Server Shipments and High Inventory Levels, Says TrendForce

DRAM, NAND Flash, SSD, Module and Memory card, and provides market research on spot and contract prices, daily news, market views and reports, and monthly datasheets of semiconductor industry.集邦科技
www.dramexchange.com www.dramexchange.com
Click to expand...
You'll get 8 and 128 and like it.
 
Armoured_Bear said:
Sure, my use of "pointless" is that you add two words on to one (not you personally, sure you didn't invent it!) with no change in meaning, not that slang is pointless. Often slang add a lot over the standard language it replaces.

I have to confess, I'd have to guess what "am't" means, never heard that before.
"am not" I imagine?

Anyway, I'm going back to shouting at clouds.
Click to expand...
I mean, I get the whole conciseness/brevity/'why waste time say lot word when few word do trick' aspect, but...it's nice to have ways to say things that, I dunno, have some character.

It's why English is such a rich poetic/narrative language. Idioms and slang galore. A veritable ocean of argot.
 
ILikeFeet said:
at 16GB, I question if there's much improvement over 12GB. given the other limitations, running out of memory will be the last thing to happen to you
Click to expand...
Would 16gb theoretically alleviate some pressure for faster ssd access for larger textures by letting them be more persistent in memory?
 
kvetcha said:
I mean, I get the whole conciseness/brevity/'why waste time say lot word when few word do trick' aspect, but...it's nice to have ways to say things that, I dunno, have some character.
Click to expand...
Yes, that's completely right. I suppose I just don't feel it with "on the xyz".
What does annoy me is when expressions change because reasons and make less sense, e.g. "someone has passed away" which has 1 distinct meaning has been replaced with "someone has passed" which is incredibly vague.

Still, I'm on a forum with many from the USA, the land of "could care less" and calling a main course an "entree" so I should temper my expectations.

mickey-mouse-haha-laugh-nrvjxyxhtlccaakn.gif
 

New Mochi article

Sharp Corp. on Thursday revealed it was supplying liquid crystal displays to an “upcoming” gaming console, potentially spurring speculation that Nintendo Co. is getting ready to update its popular but aging Switch.

Sharp Chief Executive Officer Robert Wu said the Japanese firm, which is owned by Taiwan’s Foxconn Technology Group, has been working closely with an unnamed company on developing a gaming console since it was in the R&D phase. Sharp plans to launch pilot LCD-panel production lines this fiscal year for the new device, he said.
Click to expand...
 
Armoured_Bear said:
Yes, that's completely right. I suppose I just don't feel it with "on the xyz".
What does annoy me is when expressions change because reasons and make less sense, e.g. "someone has passed away" which has 1 distinct meaning has been replaced with "someone has passed" which is incredibly vague.

Still, I'm on a forum with many from the USA, the land of "could care less" and calling a main course an "entree" so I should temper my expectations.

mickey-mouse-haha-laugh-nrvjxyxhtlccaakn.gif
Click to expand...
we're a strange people, full of contradictions
 
Foltzie said:
Would 16gb theoretically alleviate some pressure for faster ssd access for larger textures by letting them be more persistent in memory?
Click to expand...
in theory, yes. it's good for assurance, but the question is, is that assurance worth the extra cost? how often will such overhead benefit you?
 
Armoured_Bear said:
Still, I'm on a forum with many from the USA, the land of "could care less" and calling a main course an "entree" so I should temper my expectations.
Click to expand...
Hey now, don’t blame that on America, Britain started using entree differently long ago.
 
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0
Dekuman said:

New Mochi article
Click to expand...
If this is accurate, then the Redacted is launch mid/late 2024.

If it’s not related to the direct successor, it could be Nintendo probably preparing for the Lite 2, even though it would feel veeery soon. I can’t see them releasing a Lite only a year after. Unless they want to get people in the 2’s ecosystem for them to later upgrade.

Or it’s not related to Nintendo.

Or, completely hot take: the Switch 2 will have a “Slim” type revision, that’s cheaper because of the LCD

ILikeFeet said:
in theory, yes. it's good for assurance, but the question is, is that assurance worth the extra cost? how often will such overhead benefit you?
Click to expand...
Could the extra RAM be for the possible upres AI Nintendo has been working on (from patents)?
 
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