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StarTopic Future Nintendo Hardware & Technology Speculation & Discussion |ST| (Read the staff posts before commenting!)

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Samuspet said:
What hardware details are in the SDK?
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That was slightly misleading - let me clarify.

The SDK has skeletal support for building for more than one platform, much like there is support for alternate hardware in the OS. I have also heard there are some redacted bits of the documentation? But that I haven’t seen myself so I cannot confirm.

Regardless, Nintendo is doing what it needs to hide details but no more than what it needs to. If the Nvidia hack hadn’t happened, then I suspect we’d be hearing more.

Like, learning that the next device shares an API, OS, SDK, package manager, submission tools and build chain as the Switch would be a big deal if it weren’t the natural consequence of things we already knew
 
Ghostsonplanets said:
I understand what you're trying to say, but being a bit more fair (Or perhaps even pedantic. I'm sorry if I'm coming across this way), X360 was a very well documented hardware, from both Microsoft as well as the community efforts. I think the point with Switch 2 is that, in theory, bar any HW or SW flaw to exploited, it will be a far bit harder and a slower process for the community to understand the system, the way it handle and communicate with it's components, etc. So development of emulators or HBrew will be a very slow burning process.

Edit: That being said, I do believe there will be a frenzy at trying to break down the system and find exploits, even if it takes some obscene amount of compute resources.
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Gonna need a RX 5950XTX to run Switch 2 emulation at native docked settings isn't it.
 
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oldpuck said:
That was slightly misleading - let me clarify.

The SDK has skeletal support for building for more than one platform, much like there is support for alternate hardware in the OS. I have also heard there are some redacted bits of the documentation? But that I haven’t seen myself so I cannot confirm.

Regardless, Nintendo is doing what it needs to hide details but no more than what it needs to. If the Nvidia hack hadn’t happened, then I suspect we’d be hearing more.

Like, learning that the next device shares an API, OS, SDK, package manager, submission tools and build chain as the Switch would be a big deal if it weren’t the natural consequence of things we already knew
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well Iwata did tell us this was the plan way back. though that was probably referring to Project Indy and how it would have reused a lot of Wii U development tools, and architecture
 
Kazuyamishima said:
Why? Why does everyone hate emulation so much around here? It's insane for game preservation. I agree it should be done only after the system is dead and is not being sold anymore in order to not damage the sales but still
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I personally love emulation, but hate the whole discourse and people being asses about it. "hehe you dum cos U pay for gaem I get 4 free"
 
lemonfresh said:
are the developers of yuzu or ryujinx really at fault for people pirating games on their software I think they just want to create emulators for being able to run switch games on more powerful hardware, I dont think they made it so people could pirate games. Thats on the fault of the pirates. I still support the switch emulator devs for making amazing software that allows us not to be limited by the switchs capacity and also allows for perservation in the future. Basically shouldn't fault the emulator devs of stuff like yuzu for the piracy I think thats right and kinda devalues their works and is disrespectful to them

Also without the emulators being developed now we wouldn't have them in the future for preservation purposes its good that they are developed early so in the future they can work well
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Hey don't get me wrong, I like emulation and preservation. I even donated my fair share to preservation. What I dislike though is that current day emulation enables piracy of recently released games. I have a miyoo mini for GBA games and a hacked switch for some good old retro multiplayer. I hack every console I can possible hack even a playstation classic, wii u, ps4, wii, 3ds, gamecube. Not that I play them that much but it's just nice to have.

MadMechanic said:
Piracy is frowned upon in the emulation space and in some places don't allow posts with links to downloading ROMs.
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That is correct, even piracy in GBATemp is frowned upon, but of course we can't deny that the majority of use cases is for piracy else we wouldn't get opinions like "Nintendo customers are dumb, why would they buy games if you can emulate it for free." Like dude.
 
Man… things really slowed down around here.

I’m guessing things will stay slow until either Nate drops some details, or the week before/of the Nintendo financials update/investor meeting.
 
TheSentry said:
Man… things really slowed down around here.

I’m guessing things will stay slow until either Nate drops some details, or the week before/of the Nintendo financials update/investor meeting.
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To be fair, it's because software speculation/wish listing has been jettisoned into it's own thread.
 

This was such a cool video back in the day and the Wii u being able to produce these graphics blew me away back in the day. I am insanely hyped to see something like this in the future with NG and possible Ray tracing. A desert temple with mirror shield puzzles and ray traced lighting would be so beautiful
 
Kazuyamishima said:

This was such a cool video back in the day and the Wii u being able to produce these graphics blew me away back in the day. I am insanely hyped to see something like this in the future with NG and possible Ray tracing. A desert temple with mirror shield puzzles and ray traced lighting would be so beautiful
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You won't see something like this... You will see something waaaaaaaay better, like not even close.
 
Meelow said:
Agreed! This was an early Nintendo HD game, imagine what the Zelda team has learned now.

Zelda Switch 2 is going to look insane.
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Luckily there's already a certain late PS4 open world game that I consider my benchmark. If the combination of raytracing, DLSS and the improved CPU can pull off an even better looking game, I'd be amazed forever.
 
Kazuyamishima said:
Why? Why does everyone hate emulation so much around here? It's insane for game preservation. I agree it should be done only after the system is dead and is not being sold anymore in order to not damage the sales but still
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But people only care about emulators when the system is alive, the big selling point of the Switch emulator is playing new Switch games on emulators with better fps and 4k. Thankfully the days when that happens will be truly over when Switch 2 comes out.
 
Danny said:
But people only care about emulators when the system is alive, the big selling point of the Switch emulator is playing new Switch games on emulators with better fps and 4k. Thankfully the days when that happens will be truly over when Switch 2 comes out.
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Thats not true, emulators for dead systems are very popular. Especially because its the only way you can a lot of the games for these systems without owning original hardware, and that will not be an issue for Switch 2.
 
I know people get annoyed with the constant comparisons between emulation and piracy, but I dunno, it feels difficult to look past the assumption that most people who are emulating games are pirating it. It's probably irrational to be really upset over it because it's not like Nintendo is my buddy that I need to protect. But it's annoying how people try to justify or be deceptive about piracy. I mean, some people act as if they're entitled to pirate games because they don't run at 4K 60fps on native hardware. And when Tears of the Kingdom leaked you had a bunch of people on Era that just so happened to get an early copy at the same time. Just stop.
 
Silent said:
I know people get annoyed with the constant comparisons between emulation and piracy, but I dunno, it feels difficult to look past the assumption that most people who are emulating games are pirating it. It's probably irrational to be really upset over it because it's not like Nintendo is my buddy that I need to protect. But it's annoying how people try to justify or be deceptive about piracy. I mean, some people act as if they're entitled to pirate games because they don't run at 4K 60fps on native hardware. And when Tears of the Kingdom leaked you had a bunch of people on Era that just so happened to get an early copy at the same time. Just stop.
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I think there should be a law thats something to the effect off "If a game has gone at least a year without being on a storefront, everything is fair game". The example you gave would be a clear violation, but emulators are great for preservation.
 
Silent said:
I know people get annoyed with the constant comparisons between emulation and piracy, but I dunno, it feels difficult to look past the assumption that most people who are emulating games are pirating it. It's probably irrational to be really upset over it because it's not like Nintendo is my buddy that I need to protect. But it's annoying how people try to justify or be deceptive about piracy. I mean, some people act as if they're entitled to pirate games because they don't run at 4K 60fps on native hardware. And when Tears of the Kingdom leaked you had a bunch of people on Era that just so happened to get an early copy at the same time. Just stop.
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I also don't get the logic of thinking emulation/piracy and stuff like that is about game preservation. Its mostly about people wanting to play new games for free, that is the big motivation for the whole scene. Thankfully the Switch 2 will only have an emulator when the console is dead or nearing death, so we will no longer have stuff like TOTK happening in the future which is great. And all those Nintendo haters that have made fun of people buying Nintendo games for years due to emulation will cry about it being impossible to pirate for free anymore.
 
Danny said:
I also don't get the logic of thinking emulation/piracy and stuff like that is about game preservation. Its mostly about people wanting to play new games for free, that is the big motivation for the whole scene. Thankfully the Switch 2 will only have an emulator when the console is dead or nearing death, so we will no longer have stuff like TOTK happening in the future which is great. And all those Nintendo haters that have made fun of people buying Nintendo games for years due to emulation will cry about it being impossible to pirate for free anymore.
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People absolutely play old stuff on emulators. People also buy Switch games legally even if they play them in 4K on their PC. The third group who just want stuff for free, is the problem.
 
Honestly, I want the Switch 2 to be cracked fairly early, so I can turn it into the ultimate emulation machine. Replace my clunky Steam Deck.
 
I think Furukawa would personally cut up all of Jensens leatherjackets if nVidia would fuck up as bad as with Switch V1 again with ReDraketes SoC.
 
YolkFolk said:
How do people feel Nintendo’s best looking Switch games compared to the best looking 360/PS3 games?
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Tears of the Kingdom is generationally superior graphically compared to the best of Xbox 360. But most games were basically at the 360 level just a higher res.

Next gen is going to be kind of weird, because we're nearly leapfrogging a generation in terms of capabilities. We might not see Nintendo make the most of it for a year or two.
 
YolkFolk said:
How do people feel Nintendo’s best looking Switch games compared to the best looking 360/PS3 games?
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Eons ahead? Switch is a machine built around the PBR and baked/RT GI paradigm. X360 and PS3 were good hardware for their time and have some great looking games, but are way outclassed by Switch games.
 
Concernt said:
Tears of the Kingdom is generationally superior graphically compared to the best of Xbox 360. But most games were basically at the 360 level just a higher res.

Next gen is going to be kind of weird, because we're nearly leapfrogging a generation in terms of capabilities. We might not see Nintendo make the most of it for a year or two.
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Ghostsonplanets said:
Eons ahead? Switch is a machine built around the PBR and baked/RT GI paradigm. X360 and PS3 were good hardware for their time and have some great looking games, but are way outclassed by Switch games.
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Do you think games like GTA V or The Last of Us were as good as TotK visually/technically?
 
YolkFolk said:
Do you think games like GTA V or The Last of Us were as good as TotK visually/technically?
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There's a need to separate things here. Artistically and what they're outputting on screen, a player can mistake them as pretty much equal. All three are graphical showcases on their hardware.
But in terms of rendering pipeline, what BoTW/ToTK are doing is a generation ahead of what TLOU and GTA V did on PS3/X360.

A good benchmark of Switch prowess is seeing PS3/X360 ports to the system. Most of the times, the games ported get an uplift to 1080p(A 2.25x pixel shading uplift) and sometimes even go from 30 to 60.

What really helds back the Switch, aside from memory/bandwidth, is that by having a modern GPU and games taking usage of a modern rendering pipeline, they end being too much taxing on the system and hence why resolution take a hit.
 
Nintendo Switch, more or less, can run games with modern rendering at a low resolution, or older rendering at a high resolution, but struggles to do both. NG Switch, then, will probably do much the same. Games that target Switch-like and Xbox One level fidelity will reach very high pixel counts, while next gen only games will run, but with a low internal resolution.

Which, for a handheld hybrid, is perfectly fine, and about what I expect.
 
oldpuck said:
Th 360 was far more advanced at the time of its release than NG will be at its release, and Xenia is pretty good.

Moore’s Law might be dead but it’s not that dead.
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I agree. I think people are going to be surprised at how much quicker than expected these things get rolling.

That being said, I do disagree with your earlier assertion that Nintendo doesn't see a higher amount of attention in the emulation space. Nintendo feeds on nostalgia bait hard, and I've always seen more attention given to Nintendo projects from my long years of dipping in and out of those communities.
 
Danny said:
I also don't get the logic of thinking emulation/piracy and stuff like that is about game preservation. Its mostly about people wanting to play new games for free, that is the big motivation for the whole scene. Thankfully the Switch 2 will only have an emulator when the console is dead or nearing death, so we will no longer have stuff like TOTK happening in the future which is great. And all those Nintendo haters that have made fun of people buying Nintendo games for years due to emulation will cry about it being impossible to pirate for free anymore.
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You are making a lot of sourceless and baseless assumption here. For the extreme vast majority of time, emulation was simply about playing old games. Things only changed with the Switch, and now the majority are suddenly just about wanting to play new games for free?

You have a bias, and it's showing.

Ultimately, I don't disagree that idiots running around openly pirating TotK helped the image of things at all, but you're just mad at them and tarring the whole decades long scene with a big brush because of it.
 
I think the ethics and social implications of emulation are a little off-topic.

We just had evidence of them merging the next system's system software into the main branch! That's exciting. We could be at or near the point they're flashing system software to production units, which would point to launch, or at least an announcement, very soon!
 
Kazuyamishima said:

This was such a cool video back in the day and the Wii u being able to produce these graphics blew me away back in the day. I am insanely hyped to see something like this in the future with NG and possible Ray tracing. A desert temple with mirror shield puzzles and ray traced lighting would be so beautiful
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This will be surpassed
 
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ns156 said:
You are making a lot of sourceless and baseless assumption here. For the extreme vast majority of time, emulation was simply about playing old games. Things only changed with the Switch, and now the majority are suddenly just about wanting to play new games for free?

You have a bias, and it's showing.

Ultimately, I don't disagree that idiots running around openly pirating TotK helped the image of things at all, but you're just mad at them and tarring the whole decades long scene with a big brush because of it.
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Those that emulate Nintendo games today are people who argue that Nintendo deserves to be emulated because they have such underpowered hardware and they can play Nintendo games that run much better on their emulator on their Steam decks etc. The funny thing is that those arguments will be exposed as fraudelent by themselves when the Switch 2 releases and is a very powerful handheld system and still they won't buy the Switch 2 system anyway and will complain how much harder it is for them to use their Steam decks to play Switch 2 games compared to how it was with Switch 1. Their arguments shifts all the time, from game preservation to better performance but the true underlining reason behind their drive towards emulation and piracy never changes. The reason i am anti what they do is that if a larger proportation of gamers did what they do then the gaming industry would be dead, Nintendo would no longer be a video game company, meaning what we love today would no longer exist. So the less successful they are at what they are doing, the more money Nintendo will get from the Switch 2 and the more money Nintendo will have in spending towards making games in the future and hiring more people to make even more quality games in the future. This is not hyperbole, Reggie even said that the Switch was a ''make or break'' situation for Nintendo after the failure of the Wii U, so Nintendo unlike Sony and Microsoft can fail and those failures can threaten the viability of their business in the long and short run. So the less piracy and emulating of Nintendo games the more viable Nintendo becomes.
 
I went back into the Switch pre-launch Tegra X1 rabbit hole and it's a bit amusing that all the fears and things we talk about with regards to T239 performance and viability when compared to PS5/XSeries are the same things that were discussed about Tegra X1. All the talks about it being a modern SoC with being a GPU in the same class of the others current generation consoles, the talks about being it too slow to get ports, etc.

All these talking point were also talked with the Tegra X1. We saw with Switch that what was said ended being true: Tegra X1 has a modern GPU that was in the same class (featureset) as PS4/XOne and that allowed it to punch above its weight. And the fears of Switch being looked over by developers because it was a "PS3/X360 performance" mobile chip were unfounded.

Watching these videos again made me remember that whatever happens with T239 and Switch 2, it will be a great machine/SoC and that great things will be done with it. And DLSS will really let it punch way above its weight🤗


 
Danny said:
Those that emulate Nintendo games today are people who argue that Nintendo deserves to be emulated because they have such underpowered hardware and they can play Nintendo games that run much better on their emulator on their Steam decks etc. The funny thing is that those arguments will be exposed as fraudelent by themselves when the Switch 2 releases and is a very powerful handheld system and still they won't buy the Switch 2 system anyway and will complain how much harder it is for them to use their Steam decks to play Switch 2 games compared to how it was with Switch 1. Their arguments shifts all the time, from game preservation to better performance but the true underlining reason behind their drive towards emulation and piracy never changes. The reason i am anti what they do is that if a larger proportation of gamers did what they do then the gaming industry would be dead, Nintendo would no longer be a video game company, meaning what we love today would no longer exist. So the less successful they are at what they are doing, the more money Nintendo will get from the Switch 2 and the more money Nintendo will have in spending towards making games in the future and hiring more people to make even more quality games in the future. This is not hyperbole, Reggie even said that the Switch was a ''make or break'' situation for Nintendo after the failure of the Wii U, so Nintendo unlike Sony and Microsoft can fail and those failures can threaten the viability of their business in the long and short run. So the less piracy and emulating of Nintendo games the more viable Nintendo becomes.
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I think you read too many of these rage bait posts, I don't think those peoples even play the games at all.
 
Kazuyamishima said:

This was such a cool video back in the day and the Wii u being able to produce these graphics blew me away back in the day. I am insanely hyped to see something like this in the future with NG and possible Ray tracing. A desert temple with mirror shield puzzles and ray traced lighting would be so beautiful
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Is no one going to state the obvious that this original demo was bullshit of the highest order on par with Ubisoft downgrades of the time?

BotW and TotK are technical marvels for the WiiU/Switch hardware especially with regards to their physics systems but they never got near the visual fidelity of that original trailer. The sheer density of the World alone in the opening reveal shot is way beyond anything in the two recent Zelda games. It’s essentially an “in engine” tech demo probably running on hardware several times more powerful than Switch nevermind WiiU.

They could actually remake the two games on Drake to the point it would be justified to charge full price for them imo. Absolutely everything could be improved from the amount of foliage in the World to better draw distances, higher quality tree models instead of the obvious billboards everywhere, better lod, much more detailed textures, much higher shadow resolution (or RTAO) all at much higher resolutions and at 60fps. They could even add a 30fps RT mode which enabled RTGI.

I would much rather have that than a patch that just ups the resolution and framerate on both games for Drake. Both options would obviously be ideal.
 
I thought I'd find something new, but instead... off topic, off topic everywhere 🤣😭

Ghostsonplanets said:
Headphone Jack always. Bluetooth has come a long way, but it still can't match a decent grade P2 Headphone. Also, flexibility is always better.
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I agree. Not to mention the difficulty of finding a pair of bluetooth earphones that are comfortable 😅
 
YolkFolk said:
Were they?

We got a few insane ‘miracle’ ports but they were hardly a regular occurrence and the vast majority of big third party PS4/XB1 games didn’t come to Switch.
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Yes. Switch library has a lot of crossover with PS and XB library. Unlike past Nintendo systems, it's actually very feasible to have Switch as it's your main machine this generation. It's just that the big games, the ones with bigger marketing and commercial pull, mainly skip the hardware. But the vast majority of games being released do target the Nintendo hardware as well. The ones who skip are in the minority.

Compared to pre-launch fears of the machine being a Wii U 2 + 3DS JP in terms of developer support, the fears were very unfounded.
 
Teal'c said:
I thought I'd find something new, but instead... off topic, off topic everywhere 🤣😭
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I think a lot of topics (like, actual on-topic ones) have been pretty much discussed dry already.

Unless there's new stuff from some outlets (Eurogamer, Nate and so on) or without hints about the missing info from the hardware (which at this point is really in the details area), there might not be much activity here outside of people entering an off topic loop again. ;D

As for comfortable BT headphones, i can recommend the Bose 700 ones. They're not the newest at this point, and not the cheapest though.
 
ugh, bluetooth headphones... another battery to keep charged to play videogames

that's what i need in my life, more batteries please
 
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