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StarTopic Future Nintendo Hardware & Technology Speculation & Discussion |ST| (Read the staff posts before commenting!)

It’s a case of people reacting to things they don’t like. That’s really it. People on this thread have challenged MVG’s opinions in a normal way and it hasn’t been a problem.
Challenging them is fine. There are even people in those YouTube comments offering their ideas for solutions like patching the same way Xbox did.

It's just really weird when people make it into something it's not. Literally everyone here is speculating and doesn't know everything.

That's parts of the fun imo.
 
I'll take Nate over most people in this thread, tbh.

Most of you act like conspiracy nuts, who only hear what you want to hear.
Conspiracy nuts is going a little far, don't you think? There isn't really a lot to go off and Nate is still speculating like the rest of us.
 
He proved most of his predictions are really off, no offense
you literally value a one time leaker in order to support your Switch 2 is 2023 narrative. Stop lmao.
Y'all read just what y'all want
The irony :ROFLMAO: :ROFLMAO: :ROFLMAO: :ROFLMAO:
What do you mean exactly?
You are never going to get an explanation or something well informed from him. It's why Bellydrum harps on him with snide comments like he's a piggybacker cause he only speaks up when Nate or some other leaker does.
It’s a case of people reacting to things they don’t like. That’s really it. People on this thread have challenged MVG’s opinions in a normal way and it hasn’t been a problem.
That is not even true. When he did his video this place lost their minds lmfao. The typical people who post well thought out posts challenged it in a normal way. But there were way too many others who overreacted.

Conspiracy nuts is going a little far, don't you think? There isn't really a lot to go off and Nate is still speculating like the rest of us.
No. P4blo talks like a conspiracy nut. It's like talking to the average twitter blue subscriber quite frankly.
 
"Oh no, Nintendo can't make mistakes! Even though they committed so many before!"

Nintendo works in mysterious ways sometimes. I thought we knew this by now. Dumb decisions can happen in any corporation at any time, either due to internal or external factors.
Yes, but that doesn't mean they're going to make this specific mistake. I'd say that BC applies to Nintendo's endeavor for a smooth transition to the successor. Not to mention the integration of their account system. This is probably confirmation biss, but I consider BC to be a lock for whatever form this new system is gonna take.
 
Even with multiple devkits out there for Switch 2, this don't means that we're coping for a 2023 release... only for a grow up in speculations, more inside info coming in the near future and even an announcement of the system itself
 
It's being heavily implied he has some weird bias of some kind. In that video he doesn't outright say there is no BC. He offered 3 different scenarios, one of which i don't think is likely at all (that Switch 2 is just a Switch with higher clocks). I did not watch the podcast posted though.

It's all speculation so I don't see any point in acting like he's just saying it troll. Also don't the Drake leaks count as evidence since it works a bit different than the architecture in the Switch? There's also a ton of concern generally from people who've been following about how BC will work on the new system.

Personally, I'm not concerned at all, I think it will definitely have BC. I have no doubt in my mind.
I just find the shade kind of weird, I'm pretty sure NateTheHate and MVG would probably like a new Switch with BC too...
The only big flaw I saw in MVG's reasoning for no BC is his claim that emulation based BC wouldn't be possible. If AMD based hardware like the steam deck can emulate the switch fairly well I see no reason to think that Nintendo and Nvidia wouldn't be able to emulate their own hardware on NVidia hardware.

That being said I have a feeling that the real challenge is fitting the Switch cartridge slot in the new hardware and that's why nintendo has been shifting to more digital only releases and releases that come out earlier as digital.

It’s a case of people reacting to things they don’t like. That’s really it. People on this thread have challenged MVG’s opinions in a normal way and it hasn’t been a problem.
It's arguably been a mix of people with sound reasons for why BC should be reasonably likely on switch 2 and some people outright coping about how there's no way nintendo would make a dumb move that feels very similar to ways some people are insisting that switch 2 will come out this year.
 
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That is not even true. When he did his video this place lost their minds lmfao. The typical people who post well thought out posts challenged it in a normal way. But there were way too many others who overreacted.
I never said there weren't people who were outraged, just that there were people who challenged his opinion in a normal way and were accepted way more. There were respectable technical breakdowns about how nintendo could do BC that were greeted with no controversy.
That's parts of the fun imo.
It's all for fun I wish people came in here with that in mind.
 
you literally value a one time leaker in order to support your Switch 2 is 2023 narrative. Stop lmao.

The irony :ROFLMAO: :ROFLMAO: :ROFLMAO: :ROFLMAO:

You are never going to get an explanation or something well informed from him. It's why Bellydrum harps on him with snide comments like he's a piggybacker cause he only speaks up when Nate or some other leaker does.

That is not even true. When he did his video this place lost their minds lmfao. The typical people who post well thought out posts challenged it in a normal way. But there were way too many others who overreacted.


No. P4blo talks like a conspiracy nut. It's like talking to the average twitter blue subscriber quite frankly.
That's just one person, though.
 
Conspiracy nuts is going a little far, don't you think? There isn't really a lot to go off and Nate is still speculating like the rest of us.

Let them, they are disconnected from reality going off at other people on a forum calling them crazy and conspirationist over some video games theories and facts lmao

Team2024 is very aggressive towards Team2023, I really don't get the frustration
 
Let them, they are disconnected from reality going off at other people on a forum calling them crazy and conspirationist over some video games theories and facts lmao

Team2024 is very aggressive towards Team2023, I really don't get the frustration
Dude, I get it, but maybe chill out a little and listen to some of the less combative responses.
 
the twitt doesnt exist anymore 🙃
It only says this:
“Leak Express:
⚠️
El kit de desarrollo de Switch 2 ha llegado a España. Que un estudio español ya disponga del kit, frente a la política de secretismo de Nintendo, es un impulso en sus relaciones e indica que estamos en las últimas fases previas a la presentación de la consola.”

Which roughly translates to:

“The development kit of Switch 2 has arrived in Spain. The fact that a Spanish studio already has the kit, in contrast to Nintendo’s secrecy policy, is a boost in their relations and indicates that we are in the final stages prior to the presentation of the console.”
 
Feels like I walked into a bit of a warzone in here. It's just video game speculation guys, let's all calm down.

Team 2023/2024, doesn't matter.
 
Let them, they are disconnected from reality going off at other people on a forum calling them crazy and conspirationist over some video games theories and facts lmao

Team2024 is very aggressive towards Team2023, I really don't get the frustration
If it's August and still no announcement of new hardware, will you finally chill out?
 
Nate and MVG don't need defending. It's totally fair to put their propositions under scrutiny and the ones who go too far are a vocal minority who should be dealt with accordingly. We've gone over this already; yes they're knowledgeable, but that does not make them infallible by default.
 
Also, it's now July: the final countdown for #Team2023 has begun! Unless you're one the ones who's cutoff point is August or even September, Godspeed, for you are all braver souls than I.
 
Also, it's now July: the final countdown for #Team2023 has begun! Unless you're one the ones who's cutoff point is August or even September, Godspeed, for you are all braver souls than I.


Let's go

Good luck everyone
 
On the subject of backwards compatibility, my take is that if you use the "because Nintendo" logic, that would most likely point to them CLINGING onto backwards compatibility for successful platforms at any cost. Case in point: every single one of their handhelds and the Wii U to the Wii (while the Wii to the GameCube is probably just so they could delay going into HD development for the time being and focus on lean development and motion controls). Instances where they couldn't have back compat involve either a format change (cartridges to discs to cartridges again) and a complete architecture change (I would assume something like the N64 to GameCube, but also undoubtedly Wii U to Switch).

Not to mention a couple weeks ago, Phil Spencer was talking about how because Xbox hardcore lost the Xbox One/PS4 generation, that put them on the worst possible position against Sony because people built up their libraries since the Xbox One/PS4, building that ecosystem and keeping customers within it so they can get more game sales cuts. (While I have my hang-ups with what he said there for other things, in this case I see where he's coming from even if Nintendo rebuilt their ecosystem from scratch and largely supplanted what Phil Spencer said) By extension, Nintendo should also be aware of how valuable it is to keep an ecosystem going, especially how healthy both Switch and PS4 sales generally are/were.
 
On the subject of backwards compatibility, my take is that if you use the "because Nintendo" logic, that would most likely point to them CLINGING onto backwards compatibility for successful platforms at any cost. Case in point: every single one of their handhelds and the Wii U to the Wii (while the Wii to the GameCube is probably just so they could delay going into HD development for the time being and focus on lean development and motion controls). Instances where they couldn't have back compat involve either a format change (cartridges to discs to cartridges again) and a complete architecture change (I would assume something like the N64 to GameCube, but also undoubtedly Wii U to Switch).

Not to mention a couple weeks ago, Phil Spencer was talking about how because Xbox hardcore lost the Xbox One/PS4 generation, that put them on the worst possible position against Sony because people built up their libraries since the Xbox One/PS4, building that ecosystem and keeping customers within it so they can get more game sales cuts. (While I have my hang-ups with what he said there for other things, in this case I see where he's coming from even if Nintendo rebuilt their ecosystem from scratch and largely supplanted what Phil Spencer said) By extension, Nintendo should also be aware of how valuable it is to keep an ecosystem going, especially how healthy both Switch and PS4 sales generally are/were.
Yeah imo the only way it will not have BC, is if Nintendo somehow has a fallout with Nvidia and some other companys tech will power the next Switch. Which I consider extremely unlikely.
 
I disagree with that framework. Me taking someone’s opinion into account for the sake of speculation doesn’t mean I have some confirmation bias or whatever you were trying to imply. You said “whatever fits your narrative” and now you’re saying that taking his information into account IS my narrative so I’m barely even sure what you’re arguing.
On the subject of backwards compatibility, my take is that if you use the "because Nintendo" logic, that would most likely point to them CLINGING onto backwards compatibility for successful platforms at any cost. Case in point: every single one of their handhelds and the Wii U to the Wii (while the Wii to the GameCube is probably just so they could delay going into HD development for the time being and focus on lean development and motion controls). Instances where they couldn't have back compat involve either a format change (cartridges to discs to cartridges again) and a complete architecture change (I would assume something like the N64 to GameCube, but also undoubtedly Wii U to Switch).

Not to mention a couple weeks ago, Phil Spencer was talking about how because Xbox hardcore lost the Xbox One/PS4 generation, that put them on the worst possible position against Sony because people built up their libraries since the Xbox One/PS4, building that ecosystem and keeping customers within it so they can get more game sales cuts. (While I have my hang-ups with what he said there for other things, in this case I see where he's coming from even if Nintendo rebuilt their ecosystem from scratch and largely supplanted what Phil Spencer said) By extension, Nintendo should also be aware of how valuable it is to keep an ecosystem going, especially how healthy both Switch and PS4 sales generally are/were.
+1.

This is what is surprising to me because MVG justified his thoughts with « Nintendo will do what Nintendoes » which I kind of thought was a little weird considering how hell bent they’ve been on backwards compatibility with literally all their consoles in the modern era.

I have no doubt in my mind that Nintendo will make it work regardless of what dark magic they’ll conjure up. There is no way the Switch ecosystem just folds up like this.
 
+1.

This is what is surprising to me because MVG justified his thoughts with « Nintendo will do what Nintendoes » which I kind of thought was a little weird considering how hell bent they’ve been on backwards compatibility with literally all their consoles in the modern era.

I have no doubt in my mind that Nintendo will make it work regardless of what dark magic they’ll conjure up. There is no way the Switch ecosystem just folds up like this.
The only reason I believe people are even entertaining no back compat is because of rumors saying there's none, which doesn't necessarily mean anything for the final product. A reminder that the PS5 literally turned into a PS4 Pro for back compat during development, even as early as March 2020 when reported on.

resize

And this didn't even turn out to true, now that we know that the PS5 actually runs every PS4 game at higher clocks and faster load times.
 
+1.

This is what is surprising to me because MVG justified his thoughts with « Nintendo will do what Nintendoes » which I kind of thought was a little weird considering how hell bent they’ve been on backwards compatibility with literally all their consoles in the modern era.

I have no doubt in my mind that Nintendo will make it work regardless of what dark magic they’ll conjure up. There is no way the Switch ecosystem just folds up like this.
Nintendo handicapped the Wii U, all because of compatibility with a dead architecture. If they had gone with an X86 APU like the 2 others, it would have been a ton better.

And somehow MVG expects that a BC implementation is too much of a hurdle for the worlds biggest GPU company.
 
If Drake has been done for over a year, why wouldn't the devkits be final?
The chip might be set, but that doesn't mean that Nintendo has set every aspect of the console overall. Nintendo expanded memory on the Switch, famously, but also upped handheld clock speeds very late in the pre-launch development period. The NX was a famously fast turnaround, so it seems likely that Nintendo would have nailed those sorts of details down before sending "final" devkits

The finalized devkit for the Switch was a pretty polished unit. You can see some examples here. You'll note that the body looks very much like the Switch, but it's clearly also a custom design to support the extra ports in the back - it was clearly designed in tandem or even after the final body for the Switch itself was designed.

You can also see that it comes with a "cradle" to dock it to the TV, because the unit is too large to fit in standard dock. Early descriptions of NX devkits didn't have a screen/dock - developers were pretty sure, in fact, that the "handheld profile" was a separate piece of hardware entirely, more like a Wii U.

Since I'm pretty set on believe holiday 2024 is the launch window, final devkits seem unlikely, but putting that aside, it's entirely possible for the SOC to be done, but the devkits to not be quite final.

Would it be expected for Mercury Steam to get a dev kit ahead of other 3rd party studios?
Only if they had a game. Early devkit users are like beta testers of your development software. It costs money for that company to play around with new tech without a project, it costs money for Nintendo to support them. If they really are working on Metroid 6, then it would make sense. If not, I am not sure that Mercury Steam is on the list of studios who get one just to see what they can do with it.

Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if Nintendo had considering cutting ties to MS after the post-Dread kerfluffle. Nintendo tends to treat bad corporate culture at partner studios as liability.
 
Nate and MVG don't need defending. It's totally fair to put their propositions under scrutiny and the ones who go too far are a vocal minority who should be dealt with accordingly. We've gone over this already; yes they're knowledgeable, but that does not make them infallible by default.
It's not like they are purely guessing though. They have their own sources (just not enough sources to come out with their own story without risking the jobs of those sources) and earlier in this thread Nate said to expect to hear more about the next hardware in the next few months, which would be a weird thing to say as purely a guess.

I'm listening to the podcast episode right now and it sounds like what they are suggesting is that if there is BC then it will be digital only, and that is not far fetched when one considers:

1) The price of the switch carts with adequate space for AAA games (meaning the 32GB carts) being prohibitively expensive.

2) Nintendo themselves have been pushing for customers to buy digital instead of physical with both their new voucher system as well as their recent trend of releasing digital shadow drops with a physical release weeks or months later.

3) The Best Buy deal of buy 2 get 1 free to clear out switch cart shelf space

4) Several third party games shifting towards required downloads for switch games
 
The chip might be set, but that doesn't mean that Nintendo has set every aspect of the console overall. Nintendo expanded memory on the Switch, famously, but also upped handheld clock speeds very late in the pre-launch development period. The NX was a famously fast turnaround, so it seems likely that Nintendo would have nailed those sorts of details down before sending "final" devkits

The finalized devkit for the Switch was a pretty polished unit. You can see some examples here. You'll note that the body looks very much like the Switch, but it's clearly also a custom design to support the extra ports in the back - it was clearly designed in tandem or even after the final body for the Switch itself was designed.

You can also see that it comes with a "cradle" to dock it to the TV, because the unit is too large to fit in standard dock. Early descriptions of NX devkits didn't have a screen/dock - developers were pretty sure, in fact, that the "handheld profile" was a separate piece of hardware entirely, more like a Wii U.

Since I'm pretty set on believe holiday 2024 is the launch window, final devkits seem unlikely, but putting that aside, it's entirely possible for the SOC to be done, but the devkits to not be quite final.
That wouldn't require new devkits would it? Only new firmware.

Anything hardware would obviously require new devkits though.
 
I don’t know NWeedle’s general trustworthiness, but he did leak Metroid Dread in May, 2020:



And reconfirmed it in April 2021:



Metroid Dread was developed by MercuryStream in Madrid.



Thank you! So he seems to have ties with MS Studio somehow, and I doubt they would talk if Nintendo woudln't let it loose, and all the recent events are pointing to an announcement promptly
 
Only if they had a game. Early devkit users are like beta testers of your development software. It costs money for that company to play around with new tech without a project, it costs money for Nintendo to support them. If they really are working on Metroid 6, then it would make sense. If not, I am not sure that Mercury Steam is on the list of studios who get one just to see what they can do with it.

Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if Nintendo had considering cutting ties to MS after the post-Dread kerfluffle. Nintendo tends to treat bad corporate culture at partner studios as liability.
What would be the cost? Having a couple of engineers ready the studio tools for it and provide feedback on a prototype (that I assume would cost a couple thousand dollars at max, basically nothing) sounds like a good investment from any mid sized developer and especially for a studio that has made a Switch exclusive in the past.

An iterative Switch 2 would also not be in the same position as the Switch, it would be instead the successor of a proven concept and its devkits would be highly desirable
 
I don’t know NWeedle’s general trustworthiness, but he did leak Metroid Dread in May, 2020:



And reconfirmed it in April 2021:



Metroid Dread was developed by MercuryStream in Madrid.

There was also a rumor earlier this year to expect a MercurySteam game in 2025 so if they just got Switch 2 dev kits now (which is what those tweets are saying) that would line up with with having a game out by 2025.

And yes it would be safe to assume that MS would get dev kits before other western devs if its for a first party nintendo game such as a sequel to Dread.

Only if they had a game. Early devkit users are like beta testers of your development software. It costs money for that company to play around with new tech without a project, it costs money for Nintendo to support them. If they really are working on Metroid 6, then it would make sense. If not, I am not sure that Mercury Steam is on the list of studios who get one just to see what they can do with it.

Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if Nintendo had considering cutting ties to MS after the post-Dread kerfluffle. Nintendo tends to treat bad corporate culture at partner studios as liability.

Dread has been nintendo's best selling Metroid game, especially in japan, so I doubt nintendo hasn't already given them the greenlight to make their next 2D metroid game.
 
There was also a rumor earlier this year to expect a MercurySteam game in 2025 so if they just got Switch 2 dev kits now (which is what those tweets are saying) that would line up with with having a game out by 2025.

And yes it would be safe to assume that MS would get dev kits before other western devs if its for a first party nintendo game such as a sequel to Dread.



Dread has been nintendo's best selling Metroid game, especially in japan, so I doubt nintendo hasn't already given them the greenlight to make their next 2D metroid game.

So that means #Team2026 is disqualified
 
In spanish but the best part:
...Nash has also told us that they are using the pro controller with the devkit, not the controllers because they do not want it to leak under any circumstances, now they are only doing "technical upgrades"...


With a big bag of salt, i wouldnt believe them anyway (random youtube clickbaits), but NWeedle liked the tweet about the video above.
 
Also means that 2023 is very unlikely if Mercury Steam, who we can safely assume is working on another metroid game, is only just now getting a switch 2 dev kit.
Software development kits have been circulating for quite literally years. If they're receiving hardware over a year since SOC tapeout, that would STRONGLY imply finalised hardware distribution, which can happen as little as 3 months before going gold.
 
Also means that 2023 is very unlikely if Mercury Steam, who we can safely assume is working on another metroid game, is only just now getting a switch 2 dev kit.

No they been working on it since longer than just now. Read the messages above

The fact they are not giving the new Joycons to the devs means they have some drastic changes like Factory uncle implied
 
No they been working on it since longer than just now. Read the messages above
We don't know for certain that they've been working on it for X amount of time, just that development has been possible for a very long time indeed.
In spanish but the best part:



With a big bag of salt, i wouldnt believe them anyway (random youtube clickbaits), but NWeedle liked the tweet about the video above.

Worth noting that earlier Nintendo Switch Development Kits had a Wii Accessory Port and were tested with a Wii Classic Controller Pro, for similar reasons. If I'm not mistaken, they still distribute this kit, Wii Classic Controller Pro and all. Often called "SDEV".
 
Worth noting that earlier Nintendo Switch Development Kits had a Wii Accessory Port and were tested with a Wii Classic Controller Pro, for similar reasons. If I'm not mistaken, they still distribute this kit, Wii Classic Controller Pro and all. Often called "SDEV".

You remember when prior the launch of the Wii ?
 
It's not like they are purely guessing though. They have their own sources (just not enough sources to come out with their own story without risking the jobs of those sources) and earlier in this thread Nate said to expect to hear more about the next hardware in the next few months, which would be a weird thing to say as purely a guess.

I'm listening to the podcast episode right now and it sounds like what they are suggesting is that if there is BC then it will be digital only, and that is not far fetched when one considers:
Even in the extreme case where Switch 2 games are digital only, hard to imagine they'd totally cut out the physical BC right away. Cut it out in later years/models as happened with GCN-on-Wii and GBA-on-DS? OK.
 
The BC shader thing seems like kind of a stupid worry at this point unless it's literally unsolvable.

Nintendo has a massive amount of incentive to get the shaders to compile correctly for the Switch 2 to allow for BC and NVIDIA has the best programmers in gaming.

Unless perfect shader translation is literally impossible, NVIDIA will be able to figure it out in the... four years they've been working on this at least?
 
Software development kits have been circulating for quite literally years. If they're receiving hardware over a year since SOC tapeout, that would STRONGLY imply finalised hardware distribution, which can happen as little as 3 months before going gold.
Multiple journalists though have confirmed that Software Dev kits were taken back in mid-late 2022 and it's likely that once nintendo starts making the new dev kits that they would first give them out to first party devs and close AAA third party partners.

The BC shader thing seems like kind of a stupid worry at this point unless it's literally unsolvable.

Nintendo has a massive amount of incentive to get the shaders to compile correctly for the Switch 2 to allow for BC and NVIDIA has the best programmers in gaming.

Unless perfect shader translation is literally impossible, NVIDIA will be able to figure it out in the... four years they've been working on this at least?
That points to digital BC being very likely but doesn't make cartridge BC necessarily likely
 
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