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StarTopic Future Nintendo Hardware & Technology Speculation & Discussion |ST| (Read the staff posts before commenting!)

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What's the most recent Linux related T239 work, other than the CPU clusters? Just curious.

There not being any T239 Nvidia products like a Shield TV announced at CES, but T239 still being worked on and possibly entering fabrication is part of what fuels my thought process for 2023. Regardless of the strange game of telephone going on elsewhere.
 
Hermii said:
I mean he has been talking about those features all along in the late 2022/23 model which he now says is canned.
Click to expand...
Clarity will come.

In the meantime: just operate under the condition of a plan to bring something out in 2023 may or may not exist.

Don't think of it as a cancellation of an SoC. At best, think of it as a delay to bring the SoC to market via this specific product.

As said; many questions here will be answered.
 
Most JP work places are off work until Jan 3rd, so if we were going to start hearing anything, today would be the day. Sounds like things might be heating up.
 
Dekuman said:
Which post was this
Click to expand...
He deleted/edited his posts, but he said that the 2023, DLSS-capable device on which he's been reporting is shelved, then said Drake could be used for a future Nintendo device (and made some weird statements about early concepts for it or something).

The obvious issue being that Drake IS the 2023, DLSS-capable device.

Edit:
NateDrake said:
Clarity will come.

In the meantime: just operate under the condition of a plan to bring something out in 2023 may or may not exist.

Don't think of it as a cancellation of an SoC. At best, think of it as a delay to bring the SoC to market via this specific product.

As said; many questions here will be answered.
Click to expand...
Ignoring that this isn't what you originally implied, this type of clarification would have been greatly appreciated at any point it was politely requested in the past week while the thread was blowing up from your confusing original statements.
 
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NateDrake said:
Clarity will come.

In the meantime: just operate under the condition of a plan to bring something out in 2023 may or may not exist.

Don't think of it as a cancellation of an SoC. At best, think of it as a delay to bring the SoC to market via this specific product.

As said; many questions here will be answered.
Click to expand...
I'm curious what the benefits of a potential delay from, say May to holiday would achieve. If it's still the same SoC...are they changing the outer shell or controllers drastically? Could Ninvidia really have decided to cancel 1. A potential Switch Pro and 2. delay the chip/product they've been working on since 2019? How long has the SoC been done and if it has been done, what have the HW teams been working on? What perfect scenario or game are they waiting for?
 
Lancelot said:
Sony does, too lol. But yeah, I'll keep myself shut until we have actual next gen versions with substantial differences. Pikmin 4 is likely to be the first victim in that case.
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Even Miyamoto wants 4k Pikmin!!
 
0
oldpuck said:
Hah! Let me try a second time and see if I can be clearer.

Power draw of a piece of hardware is correlated with the performance of that hardware. In general, less power, less performance, and vice versa. 100% agree with you.

However, the tests that were talking about don't actually control the power draw. The wattage numbers are just labels, they don't actually reduce the power draw of the test. What I'm saying is, those power numbers and those clock speeds in the test might not be directly related.

For example, let us say that 4.2W is, in fact, the target power draw on Drake for handheld mode. Totally reasonable. But the developer building NVN2 doesn't have access to Drake yet, it's still being designed. He is using a RTX 2060 for development. He wants to clock his RTX 2060 down low, to simulate Drake running in handheld mode. He picks the lowest clock his 2060 supports - 660Mhz - and that becomes the low power test clock, which is labeled "4.2 W".

In this scenario the two numbers are related. But they're not correlated. Meaning that we can't predict Drake's clocks from these numbers.

This is not the only scenario. I can imagine scenario where they are correlated, but the wattage number is just the GPU power draw, not the whole SOC. In that case, we can make predictions about the clocks, but we can't guess the final power draw (because that would involve information about memory and CPU clocks we still don't have).

Without more context, we can't know which of these scenarios is the correct one - or if it is a third scenario entirely
Click to expand...

In the first scenario would you have a guess as to why the label is a Wattage if it's not the second scenario? For example could it be the an expected total power draw of Drake, which would give you the reverse information from the second scenario, but would imply lower clocks since the CPU and other items haven't been accounted for yet.
 
Serif said:
There not being any T239 Nvidia products like a Shield TV announced at CES, but T239 still being worked on and possibly entering fabrication is part of what fuels my thought process for 2023. Regardless of the strange game of telephone going on elsewhere.
Click to expand...
If they had a physical unit, unless something catastrophic happened, shouldnโ€™t take more than a year to be ready for a product.

First signs of a physical product was April last year. Itโ€™s been 8 months or so since, Iโ€™d expect the chip to be truly finished by May, for a later launch. But thatโ€™s just me, no one has to believe me.
 
NateDrake said:
Clarity will come.

In the meantime: just operate under the condition of a plan to bring something out in 2023 may or may not exist.

Don't think of it as a cancellation of an SoC. At best, think of it as a delay to bring the SoC to market via this specific product.

As said; many questions here will be answered.
Click to expand...

I think I read this on a fortune cookie once. ;)
 
Selarmor said:
He deleted/edited his posts, but he said that the 2023, DLSS-capable device on which he's been reporting is shelved, then said Drake could be used for a future Nintendo device (and made some weird statements about early concepts for it or something).

The obvious issue being that Drake IS the 2023, DLSS-capable device.

Edit:

Ignoring that this isn't what you originally implied, this type of clarification would have been greatly appreciated at any point it was politely requested in the past week while the thread was blowing up from your confusing original statements.
Click to expand...

How much difference is there really between "Don't think of it as a cancellation of an SoC. At best, think of it as a delay to bring the SoC to market via this specific product." than "Drake could be used for a future Nintendo device"?

I realize he's pretty much the only target we can go to around here but some people are asking a little too much of him I think.
 
mariodk18 said:
Most JP work places are off work until Jan 3rd, so if we were going to start hearing anything, today would be the day. Sounds like things might be heating up.
Click to expand...
Pretty much, that would give us until the 9th or so as a deadline for January. Just in case, it's coming either way.
 
NateDrake said:
In the meantime: just operate under the condition of a plan to bring something out in 2023 may or may not exist.
Click to expand...

This is the default setting with Nintendo anyway.

plans.png
 
NateDrake said:
Clarity will come.

In the meantime: just operate under the condition of a plan to bring something out in 2023 may or may not exist.

Don't think of it as a cancellation of an SoC. At best, think of it as a delay to bring the SoC to market via this specific product.

As said; many questions here will be answered.
Click to expand...

I know we as individuals tend to get antsy or frustrated with cryptic posts but I understand why you don't want to leak information without verifying it's accurate or leak information that may risk one of your contacts their job. I for one do appreciate your due diligence and will patiently till you release your podcast.


From what I believe and still believe the T239 is the switch successor it probably was redeveloped a couple times before Nintendo determine that SoC is better to be posed as a successor rather than a pro model.
 
mariodk18 said:
I'm curious what the benefits of a potential delay from, say May to holiday would achieve. If it's still the same SoC...are they changing the outer shell or controllers drastically? Could Ninvidia really have decided to cancel 1. A potential Switch Pro and 2. delay the chip/product they've been working on since 2019? How long has the SoC been done and if it has been done, what have the HW teams been working on? What perfect scenario or game are they waiting for?
Click to expand...
My best guess is IF Drake is delayed away from the TotK launch then the main reason is they donโ€™t feel like they can manufacture enough consoles to even begin to satisfy demand. Sony have seen how pointless launching a new in demand console is when you can only satisfy 10-20% of consumers for the first two years.

Changing their naming, positioning and marketing for Drake (from Pro/4K to Switch 2) would have been expensive but itโ€™s not something that would delay the launch imo because it was only ever rumour to begin with to the outside world.

One new thought I have is that Nintendo will 100% reveal Drake this year no matter if itโ€™s launching this year or not. I think even Nintendo will be sick of the constant rumour mill surrounding the device online (which at times can actually effect their stock prices if people expect an announcement during a Direct for instance). Weโ€™re approaching NX levels of frustration at least from the enthusiasts like us ๐Ÿ˜‚

Hopefully Nate can let us know one way or another for sure soon. If Drake is delayed then I apologise to those who were really looking forward to it in May. I was only ever sharing what I heard and the person I talked to was absolutely insistent that it was coming with Zelda (because his project was a launch window game) and he still thought the same after they broke up for the Xmas break. If itโ€™s been delayed then itโ€™s something that only happened in the very recent past. We shall seeโ€ฆ
 
Hosermess said:
How much difference is there really between "Don't think of it as a cancellation of an SoC. At best, think of it as a delay to bring the SoC to market via this specific product." than "Drake could be used for a future Nintendo device"?

I realize he's pretty much the only target we can go to around here but some people are asking a little too much of him I think.
Click to expand...
He now seems to be implying that a 2023 Switch-esque device (Pro/2/Super/whatever) using Drake was shelved in favor of using Drake in a different device that will come at a later date.

What he originally said was:
The mid-gen [DLSS] refresh planned for 2023 [is shelved].

Drake/NVN2 can still be the SoC for the next-gen hardware.

No one ever said Drake was the SoC for the revision.

No one has ever said the Drake SoC was 100% for the mid-gen refresh.
The cancellation of the refresh has no impact on the use of Drake for the next-gen hardware.
Click to expand...
And, when asked about this next-gen system:
I have a few details but nothing that's concrete enough to share/report, as early concepts will evolve and change before final details are set. Preliminary details show promise but, again, nothing is set in stone and they can/will change.
Click to expand...

So despite referring to the 2023 device and Drake synonymously for quite some time, and the Nvidia leak all but confirming that Drake is the only SoC in development, he originally claimed that the 2023 device was some other, non-Drake DLSS device that was cancelled, and that Drake may being used in some future device whose development is at a point where "early concepts will evolve and change".

So yes, I think these are notably different claims, especially since the newer one doesn't contradict itself.
 
NateDrake said:
Clarity will come.

In the meantime: just operate under the condition of a plan to bring something out in 2023 may or may not exist.

Don't think of it as a cancellation of an SoC. At best, think of it as a delay to bring the SoC to market via this specific product.

As said; many questions here will be answered.
Click to expand...

I absolutely know you do not mean to word it like such but the vagueness of this post reminds me of the stuff cryptobros would post when pumping a coin, lol โ€œTRUST THE PLANโ€ in a sense. With how tied to your podcast these things are I donโ€™t blame some for assuming your predictions are here mainly to pump it up.

Personally seems more safe to just wait and see how their 2023 calendar year looks before assuming hardware can even slot in. (my personal prediction: late 24 Switch 2 because the OLED burn in 2021 proved to me no pro existed and the successor is years off)
 
SeafoamGaming said:
I absolutely know you do not mean to word it like such but the vagueness of this post reminds me of the stuff cryptobros would post when pumping a coin, lol โ€œTRUST THE PLANโ€ in a sense. With how tied to your podcast these things are I donโ€™t blame some for assuming your predictions are here mainly to pump it up.

Personally seems more safe to just wait and see how their 2023 calendar year looks before assuming hardware can even slot in. (my personal prediction: late 24 Switch 2 because the OLED burn in 2021 proved to me no pro existed and the successor is years off)
Click to expand...
Why would the successor be years off? Nintendo has launched new hardware every 2 years since Switch launched. OLED was 2 years ago, and there's no Pro, so that would mean a successor this year, no?
 
I think the mid-gen refresh was hardware that was expirmented on for a while back in 2020/2021, but Nintendo instead took features from the shelved hardware, and moved it to Drake to further refine the features from the shelved refresh. Drake is too far along to be cancelled imo, I think the mid-gen refresh is being confused with Drake, they seem to be different things. Remember, features from the OLED will probably also in Drake, like the OLED display. These devices are very hard to map-out feature wise so features from cancelled hardware could easily be moved to new hardware, which leads to confusion among insiders on which device is which.
 
Concernt said:
Why would the successor be years off? Nintendo has launched new hardware every 2 years since Switch launched. OLED was 2 years ago, and there's no Pro, so that would mean a successor this year, no?
Click to expand...

Patterns donโ€™t really exist especially with a pandemic. 3DS ended up having gaps with revisions after a while too after the N3DS line, before the 2DSXL.
 
I'm bored, so I'm going just write this to get it out of my system (These ain't real spec's):

Nintendo Switch Plus+

GPU: Nvidia Tegra Something
CPU: ARM Cortex-A75 2.2 GHz / 1.2 GHz (Backwards Compatibility)
RAM: 8GB 3200Mhz
Storage: 32GB SSD, 32GB Internal Memory
Display: 1600 x 900 (900p) OLED
Output: 480p, 720p, 1080p, 1440p, 4K (Supersampling/DLSS from 1440p)
 
The thing is, no one actually cares what Nintendo's past plans may have been, or why reporting on those plans got it wrong. At best it's a discussion to amuse ourselves when there's nothing else to talk about. Right now the only 2023 plans that anyone cares about are the ones that have had all this unnecessary confusion thrown up around them in the name of covering some sort of past plans.
 
These are the only articles prior to the Aug 2020 "4K ready" article by Mochizuki I can find relevant to a potential "Switch Pro" that was potentially canned.

WSJ - Mochizuki: Oct 4, 2018
Nintendo Co. plans to release a new version of its Switch videogame console next year to maintain the sales momentum of the device, according to suppliers and others with direct knowledge of the plan.
Nintendo is still debating what new hardware and software features to include in the upgrade and weighing the cost of the features, people with knowledge of the discussions said.
One option is improving the display, they said. The current Switch uses a lower-end liquid-crystal display without some technologies that are standard in more recent smartphone LCDs. Updating the display with these technologies would make it brighter, thinner and more energy-efficient. The updated Switch isnโ€™t expected to adopt the organic light-emitting diode or OLED panels used in Apple Inc.โ€™siPhone X series.
Nintendo is looking to release the new Switch in the latter half of 2019, perhaps as soon as summer, the people said.
Click to expand...
Mar 25, 2019
Nintendo Co. NTDOY 0.40%โ–ฒ plans to launch two new versions of its Switch gaming console as early as this summer, people familiar with the matter said, as the company seeks to sustain sales momentum for the product going into a crucial third year.
One version will have enhanced features targeted at avid videogamers, although it wonโ€™t be as powerful as Sony Corp. โ€™s PlayStation 4 Pro or Microsoft Corp. โ€™s Xbox One X, according to parts suppliers and software developers for Nintendo who have access to a prototype of the machine.

Videogame-hardware makers generally come out with new consoles every five to six years, and it is common for them to update the devices in the middle of their life cycles to keep the momentum going. Sony introduced the PlayStation 4 in November 2013 and updated it with a less-expensive version in September 2016 and a high-end model two months later. Sales of the PlayStation 4 remain strong.

Nintendoโ€™s suppliers and game developers have been talking with their investors about the new Switch machines for several months. People who have used the devices say they arenโ€™t just similar-looking new versions with a higher or lower performance.

โ€œYou would be wrong to think the enhanced version is similar to what Sony did with PS4 Pro and the other is just a cheap alternative that looks very similar to some past hand-held machines, say, Sonyโ€™s PlayStation Vita,โ€ one person who has used the new devices said.
Click to expand...
Draw what conclusions you may think of.
 
NateDrake said:
In the meantime: just operate under the condition of a plan to bring something out in 2023 may or may not exist.
Click to expand...
This is markomarko tier

Itโ€™s such a non-answer that is intentionally vague. Nintendoโ€™s QA can be more explicit than this. But whatever at this point. We are all deep in the rot. Might as well see it through to the end.
 
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SeafoamGaming said:
Patterns donโ€™t really exist especially with a pandemic. 3DS ended up having gaps with revisions after a while too after the N3DS line, before the 2DSXL.
Click to expand...
Didn't they launch OLED Model in the middle of the pandemic?

Even 2020 didn't stop Microsoft and Sony.
 
Work under the assumption that Holiday 2024 is latest the device is coming out( Nate and others have shown they have no real info on its release) at least Holiday 2024 can serve as buffer.
 
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Maybe Mochizuki is gearing up to release his first article on the 4K Switch mid January, once he gets back from winter break. Add factory murmurs, this vague Nvidia JP visit, the linux updates, no T239 at CES...Worst case scenario, even if Drake doesn't release with Zelda, I think we're due for an update from someone on this thing. It's been a year and 3 months since the 11 devs article that Nintendo refuted.
 
mariodk18 said:
Maybe Mochizuki is gearing up to release his first article on the 4K Switch mid January, once he gets back from winter break. Add factory murmurs, this vague Nvidia JP visit, the linux updates, no T239 at CES...Worst case scenario, even if Drake doesn't release with Zelda, I think we're due for an update from someone on this thing. It's been a year and 3 months since the 11 devs article that Nintendo refuted.
Click to expand...
Didnโ€™t Mochizuki a couple days ago pointed to that the recent news of the scrapped Switch Pro was the device he was talking about back in 2020/2021?
 
.
mariodk18 said:
Maybe Mochizuki is gearing up to release his first article on the 4K Switch mid January, once he gets back from winter break. Add factory murmurs, this vague Nvidia JP visit, the linux updates, no T239 at CES...Worst case scenario, even if Drake doesn't release with Zelda, I think we're due for an update from someone on this thing. It's been a year and 3 months since the 11 devs article that Nintendo refuted.
Click to expand...

Iโ€™ve given up on him reporting again. Or maybe I just donโ€™t want face the music that new hardware is so far away
 
0
hologram said:
He literally just posted a smiley face
Click to expand...
Under any context I think it's clear that ": )" means "the recent news of the scrapped Switch Pro was the device he was talking about back in 2020/2021"

"hey u up?"
": )"

aka

"hey u up?"
"the recent news of the scrapped Switch Pro was the device he was talking about back in 2020/2021"
 
Hermii said:
Taking Nate on his word it was referring to Rt/Dlls/A78 hardware coming out in 2023. Which can't be anything other than Drake.
Click to expand...

If you remember the old brainchild info assuming that was true, the specifications of the chip (number of cores etc) was not decided until mid-2021 or later. Meanwhile the majority of Nate's information besides timeframe seems to be from late 2020.
So the root of all these rumours may be plans for a chip of certain technologies but uncertain specification.
 
bellydrum said:
Under any context I think it's clear that ": )" means "the recent news of the scrapped Switch Pro was the device he was talking about back in 2020/2021"

"hey u up?"
": )"

aka

"hey u up?"
"the recent news of the scrapped Switch Pro was the device he was talking about back in 2020/2021"
Click to expand...
The Bellydrumification of discourse.
 
bellydrum said:
Under any context I think it's clear that ": )" means "the recent news of the scrapped Switch Pro was the device he was talking about back in 2020/2021"

"hey u up?"
": )"

aka

"hey u up?"
"the recent news of the scrapped Switch Pro was the device he was talking about back in 2020/2021"
Click to expand...

Beautiful. :)
 
0
NateDrake said:
Clarity will come.

In the meantime: just operate under the condition of a plan to bring something out in 2023 may or may not exist.

Don't think of it as a cancellation of an SoC. At best, think of it as a delay to bring the SoC to market via this specific product.

As said; many questions here will be answered.
Click to expand...
The question remaining: When will you free us from our suffering ๐Ÿ˜‚?!?

Jk, I really hope the best for this Switch successor to end this discussion once and for allโ€ฆ
 
the_marmolade said:
I'm bored, so I'm going just write this to get it out of my system (These ain't real spec's):

Nintendo Switch Plus+

GPU: Nvidia Tegra Something
CPU: ARM Cortex-A75 2.2 GHz / 1.2 GHz (Backwards Compatibility)
RAM: 8GB 3200Mhz
Storage: 32GB SSD, 32GB Internal Memory
Display: 1600 x 900 (900p) OLED
Output: 480p, 720p, 1080p, 1440p, 4K (Supersampling/DLSS from 1440p)
Click to expand...
Pokemon_GO_Plus_Plus_Wordmark.png
 
0
bellydrum said:
How deep is it?
Click to expand...
At least as deep as Sony wrt money during the PS3 daysโ€ฆ.

5B deepโ€ฆ.
Shiba said:
Thatโ€™s why I ask because I saw people on here and other places saying that Mochizuki was vindicated about his reporting.
Click to expand...
the smiley face was clearly just his vindication from what someone else also reported of what he was talking about. It corroborated his information about a thing in 2021 that he spoke about. He didnโ€™t look crazy now, someone else also reported what he was talking about, he feels vindicated.

I bet people were laughing at him for not getting something right.



Thinking ofโ€ฆ so two different sources have commented on a thing in 2021, giving credence to something
 
I assumed Mochizuki's 2021 reporting was him conflating Drake with Switch OLED, and that his 11 devs report was about Drake. As far as I'm concerned he was 'vindicated' by the NVN2 leaks. I personally draw no connection between a 4K enabled Switch and whatever John Linneman was talking about, which I still think was a Mariko Pro, it may even have been the device with 'enhanced features targeted at avid videogamers' Mochizuki talked about in 2019, posted by @mariodk18 above.
 
bellydrum said:
Under any context I think it's clear that ": )" means "the recent news of the scrapped Switch Pro was the device he was talking about back in 2020/2021"

"hey u up?"
": )"

aka

"hey u up?"
"the recent news of the scrapped Switch Pro was the device he was talking about back in 2020/2021"
Click to expand...
Oh dang, then I cant imagine what it means when @Thugstas goes "๐Ÿ˜‰"
 
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