Ecliptor
#TeamJanuary
- Pronouns
- He/Him
So it was successful because... it was successful (?)
-
Hey everyone, staff have documented a list of banned content and subject matter that we feel are not consistent with site values, and don't make sense to host discussion of on Famiboards. This list (and the relevant reasoning per item) is viewable here.
StarTopic Future Nintendo Hardware & Technology Speculation & Discussion |ST| (Read the staff posts before commenting!)
- Thread starter Dakhil
- Start date
It got successful with third parties because it got successful commercially. That's how I interpret it.
Companies were willing to move heaven and earth to make ports happen, because there was a significant audience willing to pay for it.
This thread is a university level course in multiple subjects. I wouldn't be surprised if we have a rundown of underwater basket weaving at some pointIf it means more cool educational posts from oldpuck, Thraktor, and LiC, then that won’t be a bad thing.
It was successful because Nintendo made it successful. Something like the Wii U showed when they did a poor job at that. They even went out of their way to give 3rd-parties the spotlight at that launch, and that turned out badly. Nintendo didn't get successful with Switch because of luck. It's because they learned from their prior mistakes, and changed their approach.
If we want to talk about a console that got lucky with its initial success, I would say the one that stands out is the PS4. Why? Because Sony didn't have to do anything when their competition tripped at the starting line. Wii U was already in a bad position, and XBOne's focus on TV and initial 24-hr mandatory check-ins let Sony just coast. And the PS4 was following the financial devastation of the PS3, which had bled them dry of all their PS2 profits. They needed a miracle, and they got one. The video of sharing PS4 games? It wasn't some new idea. It's an old idea to reflect on the hurdles s one would have to go through with XBOne games.
darthdiablo
+5 Death Stare
- Pronouns
- he/him
HankyPanky
Like Like
- Pronouns
- Funcle
i do feel like there could have been something before what we learned about as Drake T239 (presuming a better than Orin node) given how early rumours of a Pro began circulating. GA10F as the GPU maybe there was an earlier version of this with less SM, F implying it's the 7th revision?
OP
OP
Thraktor
"[✄]. [✄]. [✄]. [✄]." -Microsoft
- Pronouns
- He/Him
The letters in Nvidia's embedded GPU names don't indicate revision count, they just part of the name of the GPU. They use the same naming scheme as desktop GPUs, but with letters instead of numbers at the end.
The first two letters are the architecture (GA in this case being Ampere), then 10 means it's the first version of Ampere (there wasn't a second, but it's relevant for other architectures like Maxwell), and then the last digit/letter is specific to the GPU. On the desktop GPU side of things, they use numbers, with the lower numbers being bigger GPUs (eg GA102 is bigger than GA104). Embedded GPUs end with a letter, and although Ampere is the only example, it seems like lower letters also mean bigger GPUs. So GA10B (Orin's GPU) is bigger than GA10F (T239's GPU).
I don't understand a single column of that table, but thank you.
Whoops yeah i think i forgot to put a word or something inbetween there. Probably meant to write it in a way like you did.
Guess my non-native english speaking self deserves being made fun of for posting without double checking for dumb errors such as this.
TomNookYankees
Koopa
- Pronouns
- He/Him
If Switch 2 gets a non-cloud version of RE9 I'll eat my hat.Any expectation of RE9 arriving to Switch 2…
Also would be cool if Capcom did Remake collection, something like this, but for the remakes.
ItWasMeantToBe19
Manakete
RE9 launching like two months before the Switch 2 gives very little reason for optimism that this is intended for Switch 2 as… they could have just waited the two months.
Then again, maybe the Switch 2 is later in 2025, blarghhhhhh
Then again, maybe the Switch 2 is later in 2025, blarghhhhhh
OP
OP
In terms of the total amount of GPCs, SMs, and CUDA cores, yes. GA10B has 2 GPCs, 16 SMs, and 2048 CUDA cores. And GA10F has 1 GPC, 12 SMs, and 1536 CUDA cores.
But not necessarily in terms of the amount of SMs per GPC. GA10B is like GA104 where there are 8 SMs per GPC. And GA10F is like GA102 where there are 12 SMs per GPC.
HankyPanky
Like Like
- Pronouns
- Funcle
January is just a rumour right? given the proximity RE9 could easily end up being March and you know what that means...
I mean, if they announce a Switch 2 version once the damn thing is acknowledged, I don't necessarily think a 2 month late port would hurt its sale.
Those who want to play the game portably would wait, and it would no doubt be an early technical showpiece.
Ab
Like Like
- Pronouns
- He
I mean they've been working on switch 2 games for awhile, no doubt. But yeah, the delay is probably due to the softwareMaybe the reason for revealing the switch 2 is because they don’t want to make the “switch” to fully create Switch 2 games because of ballooning budget?
TheBlueBerryJelly
Rattata
- Pronouns
- he/him
Whatever game comes out in march, comes out on Switch 2. That's it. That's the universal rule
HankyPanky
Like Like
- Pronouns
- Funcle
nailed it. but RE9 should come to Switch 2 regardless, would surely be an impressive port/launch title.
My Tulpa
Bob-omb
Yep.
The Wii U following the Wii really broke people and their perceptions.
Every Nintendo home console sold less and less, it was always the trend.
61.91 - NES
49.10 - SNES
32.93 - N64
21.74 - GameCube
13.56 - Wii U
Wii U is exactly where one should have expected.
The only correct answer is Wii was an anomaly and broke away from the trend because it was far from a “traditional home console”
SoldierDelta
Designated Xenoblade Loremaster
- Pronouns
- he/him
Even then, it's not like the Wii stood the test of time. It was popularity, noone can deny that, but it was "fad" popularity. Not sustainable and it kinda killed Nintendo's momentum after for when the Wii U released. Hell, we saw a similar thing with the Xbox Kinect's popularity. It was popular for a time but it came at a cost that damaged the publisher's reputation for the long run.
It really needs to be stressed how much the handhelds carried Nintendo for a large portion of their existence. The NES and SNES did very well and the Wii was a good shot of money, but the Game Boy, Game Boy Color, GBA, DS and especially the 3ds hard-carried Nintendo at points.
Giancarlo
Nintendo connoiseur
speaking of Resident Evil, what happened to the rumored timed exclusive Resident Evil Revelation 3, that was suposed to release on Switch back in 2021? did Capcom cancelled this game to focus on Resident Evil 8?
My Tulpa
Bob-omb
Or, they could be counting the new Switch hardware as part of the Switch family and count it along with the other hardware.
I know it’s not popular, but it is possible. I really don’t see a good reason why they wouldn’t want to do this, tbh.
But even if they did, they still don’t have to have the new hardware as part of their projection for FY ending March 2025…if they are still aren’t 100% sure when it’s releasing and the price point etc. This is always something they can revise in later financials when it becomes more concrete.
Marce-chan
Magical Girls <3
- Pronouns
- They/Them
With 2023 having Super Mario Bros. Wonder that we have absolutely no reason to believe was ever targeting to release any earlier, I think it's safe to assume the soonest Nintendo ever expected to release Switch 2 was early 2024 - that's if, they ever targeted anything other than late 2024.
Just having the SoC finalizing doesn't mean the hardware was finished since there's a lot more to it.
They probably had a roadmap with an intended very conservative life for Switch early in its life, but development of the next machine, COVID and Switch's success made them target 2024 ever since they actually had a plan.
It kinda lines up that they'd release 2D Mario in 2023 then 3D Mario with the new console in 2024, Mario Kart in 2025 or something. It also adds that it's about where we'd expect all the possible major games to arrive.
From the probably earliest team to jump to the next platform (3D Mario team, released a game that sold 27m right at the start of the gen, major re-released were planned for later so they really didn't have to make anything more for the Switch) to the latest ones, I think the vast majority of first party major games targeting the launch window of the Switch 2(so fall 2024 through fall 2025) started development by 2019 through 2022. And again, that seemed super reasonable back then since pretty much all games for the Switch took less time than their sequels.
I think Capcom will put just about everything on the Switch 2. Unless they're already aiming for a Monster Hunter Rise sequel to launch in 2026, World is a prime candidate for late port - and so are all the REmakes, Biohazard and Village. RE9 late port is something I definitely expect.Any expectation of RE9 arriving to Switch 2…
Also would be cool if Capcom did Remake collection, something like this, but for the remakes.
Well I would still want to believe on the Switch-first Resident Evil game just coming alongside The Succ but that seems to be dead and buried for awhile now
They already made that switch from early life Switch games to late life Switch games. Just look at Breath of the Wild to Tears of the Kingdom, Splatoon 2 to 3 and heck even Super Mario Odyssey to Wonder.Maybe the reason for revealing the switch 2 is because they don’t want to make the “switch” to fully create Switch 2 games because of ballooning budget?
Most games started taking longer and longer to make with bigger and bigger teams working on them. I don't think they can run away from it and I doubt many games will end up costing as much as late Switch games like Tears of the Kingdom and Metroid Prime 4.
But yeah, I don't think they'll really aim for "true next gen experience" with anything but the next Super Mario and Mario Kart until Animal Crossing. Switch games but higher resolution is what I really expect most of the output to look like. And hey, that's in no way a bad thing!! Everyone was dreaming about Tears of the Kingdom being the launch title and I don't anyone would complain if it was.
Wait RE9 was officially announced? Or are there new rumors on it?
Danny
Like Like
- Pronouns
- He/Him
I don't think major third parties have ever cared so much about Nintendo hardware that they would delay their games so that they become Nintendo launch games. Their main priority is PC and PS after all.
Marce-chan
Magical Girls <3
- Pronouns
- They/Them
I think the biggest issue with that giant Capcom leak and the Insomniac leak is that, unlike Nintendo game leaks that are mostly from games already being tested or even already gone gold(like Metroid Prime Remastered, Fire Emblem Engage) is that those had roadmaps of games that weren't even in pre-production -- and might never enter.
See, if anyone made a similar leak for Nintendo back in 2017 it'd probably have something like "Metroid Prime 4 2020, new Zelda 2021, Pokémon 2019, Pokémon 2022, 1-2 Switch Sequel 2021, Switch Sports 2019, Fire Emblem 2018, Fire Emblem 2020, Detective Pikachu 2019, insert some game that would make everyone go nuts about for 2019 that was ultimately cancelled" and we'd all have unrealistic expectations and doom at the same time.
I think that information on Resident Evil 8 just got out really, really early on, so what the game ultimately became was at a game that was aiming to be a new Revelations title for Switch - I mean Resident Evil is really notorious for having games turning into very different directions mid-dev or spin offs turning into mainline titles.
Resident Evil Outrage was aiming at a late 2021 release AFAIK. But so was 4 aiming for 2022 and Monster Hunter Wilds aiming for 2023. There was this Ace Attorney game that probably had a blank year but didn't enter production until much closer to it and is probably arriving like 4 years later.
I think they had a planned game to be a Switch timed exclusive, started development on it, had ideas from it turning into RE8 and was ultimately scrapped without actually entering full development.
Danny
Like Like
- Pronouns
- He/Him
The problem with your reasoning on Switch 2 being a pro version of the Switch is that would lead Nintendo to permanently have to make games able to run on tech from 2015 (Switch), that could be ruinous for their future in gaming. Would large proportion of gamers accept to permanently just play games based on ancient tech when all other games being made change with the times? It would mean that the next Zelda game for instance can't offer any more than Tears of the Kingdom, because the tech will be the same.
That is why the majority think Switch 2 will not be a pro version of the Switch but a next generation Switch, because that offers the opportunity to make new games designed with new tech in mind and thus makes Nintendo able to offer new experiences to players.
Steve
Koopa
- Pronouns
- he/him
I mean... Nintendo Handheld has been Nintendo bread and butter because casual consumers knows and like the Idea of a portable system, plus there isn't much competition in that space, mostly because Nintendo has a chokehold of Game output, it was one of the main reason the Vita failed because they developed lesser quality exclusive... Well stopped making exclusives in it first year, despite it being more powerful than the 3DS. (gravity rush, was pretty good)
Even the 3DS, despite it being seen as a failure, sold extremely well and kept Nintendo keep the lights on.
The only way i can see someone overtaking the Switch 2 in the handheld scene, would be if Sony or Microsoft decide creating a whole Division, based on making handheld exclusives, which seems unlikely, because of money and manpower. Instead we'll either see cloud version or digital, heck the digital version seems unlikely, because it would mean developers would need to scale down their games to make it run, kinda like the series s, but even that some developers don't like that.
Like... the thing that is the most important when it comes to consoles and handheld is the output of games and couple of time we seen Nintendo struggle doing that, with Gamecube, Wii U and N64, reason why the PS1, PS2 and PS4 were huge successes is because of their game output. But meanwhile the Switch now consist of both the handheld and console division, reason why we never had a bad drought, like FE, 2D metroid, Animal crossing, Kirby and much more were handheld exclusives, instead we saw countless of series get new life with the Switch, my favourite example would be Fire emblem and Kirby forgotten land.
unluckily we're currently in the transitional period for the Switch, reason why there hasn't been huge games, because most of them moved on, like Next level game, Mercury Steam, EDP 8, EDP 10, monolith soft and the Kirby Dev and much more are probably making Switch 2 games for a 2025-2026 releases.
My Tulpa
Bob-omb
Yes, I was just responding to the perception that Nintendo has a habit of making mistakes and failure consoles after successful consoles. It’s something people say but it never rings true.
Traditional Nintendo consoles selling less and less over time had nothing to do with following a successful console or not.
Concernt
Optimism is non-negotiable
- Pronouns
- She/Her
T239 is not GPU compatible with Tegra X1. Concurrent development, cross gen, these are possible but they are not easy in the way Series X|S and Xbox One games being cross gen is.
The "good reason" is it's a new, incompatible architecture with a new feature set enabling new games. It's not a Game Boy Color, it's a Game Boy Advance. In fact that's probably an accurate analogy; GBA shared the CORE brand with Game Boy, as we expect the next system to share with Nintendo Switch. It had SOME cross gen support, too. But it had its own brand and its own games, which are, quite plainly, a necessity for utilising a new SOC design with a new, incompatible architecture - which GBA had.
T239 is demonstrably not designed to suit a "pro" system or simple extension of the family, it would take software moving heaven and earth to make it act like one in earnest.
What you CAN have, what we've seen with Game Boy Advance and Xbox Series X|S, is a new generation that is ALSO the best way to play previous generation games, and branded as such. Both used extensions of the core brand rather than entirely new names, with some games providing enhancements on the newer system, while ALSO being incompatible (to different degrees) new generations. This kind of transition could work for a system designed around T239 and seems to be what many expect.
But a pro? Simply another member of the family?
Time we moved on. This isn't Tegra X1+'s system, this is T239's.
omniryu
Like Like
- Pronouns
- He/him
Can you imagine you got yourself a whole new architecture. More ram, better CPU with more cores to play like 2 or three titles for it. Lol.
The new 3DS is great but like how many games truly took advantage of the new hardware? There is probably more but I can only think of Xenoblade 1.
Last edited:
Aufhebung RPG
History is tragedy becoming comedy
Yokoi Gunpei may be long gone, but his legacy and light will protect Nintendo forever (referring to the portable concept)
Aufhebung RPG
History is tragedy becoming comedy
I think the failure of the wiiu is very different from the failure of the N64 and the NGC, the wiiu was the result of Nintendo's console/handheld ecosystem not producing enough output under the pressure of HD development and a large number of people needing to take care of the development of 3DS games, so I don't really see the use of the wiiu as an example as being informative, but it's clear that Iwata had an early idea of what he wanted to do in terms of a console/handheld hybrid ecosystem (NS), but he clearly underestimated the difficulty of HD development and the manpower required during the wiiu era.and didn't have any energy to spread out to develop games for another platform, so you can't have both the fish and the bear's paw.
- Pronouns
- He/Him
oldpuck
Like Like
- Pronouns
- he/they
You write very fluently, so it looked like you were making a strange point rather than making an error
SoldierDelta
Designated Xenoblade Loremaster
- Pronouns
- he/him
I do think the Wii U and N64 are very alike in a few key ways, namely that they're both "next-gen" systems that suffered from software droughts due to the strain on development and that they relied on using a specific "gimmick" (Wii U Gamepad and 64DD) that never really saw a proper use from Nintendo themselves to the point they essentially gave up on the idea after a certain point. That said, yeah I can't really disagree. N64 and GC were far later into the generation's lives than they should've been and were generally suplexed by the new kid on the block, while the Wii U...
The main reason why the Wii U is a key point of discussion with the Switch 2 is that they're very comparable in concept. They're a "next-gen" system for Nintendo that'll likely use the same branding as their predecessor. That's a very valid comparison to make, and I think Nintendo is all to aware of the risks of next-gen game development. They aren't resting on their laurels, they're just trying to get into a position where their business doesn't implode overnight for the third time in less than three decades.
Last edited:
Tentacle-tropes
Kremling
I don’t really think there is any valid comparison between the two since the circumstances between said systems are night & day. The only way a comparison makes sense is if Nintendo makes a product that fails from step 0, essentially from the planning phase. At that point it doesn’t really matter what else goes wrong since the main albatross is in complete product redesign territory.
SoldierDelta
Designated Xenoblade Loremaster
- Pronouns
- he/him
Compelling point overall. I do think a general software problem for "next gen" systems does at least have a precedent, as discussed the N64 was egrigious for that, but I do agree that the Wii U's problems were fairly specific to it. That said, it should be pointed out that the other achillies heel for the Wii U was just how bleak the Wii U's general launch was. I can't really blame people for putting no faith into a system with a HD 2D Mario title that looks identical to all the others, a Nintendo mini-game collection that had a mix in quality for the gimmick of the system, a karaoke title and an exclusive and upgraded version of a multi-plat.
The Wii U's base design concept was a huge fault, yes, but it wasn't the only thing that sunk it... it's just that it's failings do happen to cross over into other console's issues like the N64's or even the 3ds' launch year.
Giancarlo
Nintendo connoiseur
beside severals games that was originaly planned to N64DD, the transition of 2D to fully 3D gameplay, may have be some chalenge to Nintendo, we have Mario that is a level based gameplay, how do we translate that to 3D.
Tentacle-tropes
Kremling
I think it the only thing that sunk it since even had some of these issues been corrected early, or even not exist, you are still looking at a device that does poorly enough that we are back at the conundrum of which device to salvage. And for the record it would always be the 3DS since its issues weren’t anchored to being conceptual poison.
While there might be concern for software, overall they’ll be fine. Even if they just end up copying Switch’s launch & launch year lineup to a varying degree. What they really need is ~2 titles to help anchor the year. From there smaller titles & 3rd parties can help build around them.
theguy
Paratroopa
Looks as though some investors may have already had some meetings on the new hardware
why does this sound like richard leadbetter
Steve
Koopa
- Pronouns
- he/him
3D Mario and Mario Kart X are my two prime contenders for being on the Switch 2 in its first year.
I can maybe see Luigi Mansion 4 also being Next year since I’m presuming NL games started development shorty after 3. (Maybe a new IP)
I’m also guessing we’ll see 3-4 smaller ports and maybe we’ll finally get GameCube and possibly DS for NSO.
I’m also curious if we’ll see some unexpected third party exclusives, since the Switch had sniper clip for example, (I’m desperately wanting a eternal Darkness remake, won’t happen because of legal reasons I think)
Concernt
Optimism is non-negotiable
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Given the size of GCN games, they'd have to be downloaded seperate from one another. This isn't an entirely absurd idea, even with a dedicated app, but I wonder if they won't just slap GCN remakes and remasters into Expansion Pack or a new tier and call that "GCN NSO". It would be a shame because Pikmin 1+2 HD as they exist down have online play. On the other hand, a prospective GCN NSO app wouldn't have Pikmin 1 and 2 with pointer controllers or wide-screen. Lose-lose.
What I'd really like to see with NSO next gen is use the additional memory and CPU resources to inject online play into Switch 1 games that didn't launch with it.
Aufhebung RPG
History is tragedy becoming comedy
Considering that MP4 will most likely be on switch2 at the same time, I think the lineup of games for the first year will be ample enough.
Steve
Koopa
- Pronouns
- he/him
Pretty much like the Booster pass for MK8 and animal crossing DLC and downloaded.
But I think Nintendo wouldn’t mind the size of the GameCube games and would prefer the NSO library emulation. Also N64 is currently 1.7GB in size with 7-64MG games, so we’re expecting a storage increase for Switch 2.
Meanwhile GameCube size are often 1,46GB, if GameCube comes with 40 games over years on NSO we’ll see the app size be 50GB+, which isn’t much for NG standard.
Like with the Switch 2 we’ll see more and more games being more GB in storage, like there’s a huge possibility of the next 3D Mario being 30GB+ in storage size.
But, your idea of a separate section of the eshop being based for downloading HD GameCube games and emulated one sounds pretty smart actually, heck maybe the NSO section of the eshop will be akin to the virtual console.
Steve
Koopa
- Pronouns
- he/him
I’m personally leaning it being a holiday 2024 game, but heck who knows maybe it’s a cross gen summer/October title.
Concernt
Optimism is non-negotiable
- Pronouns
- She/Her
I see what you mean. Though on that last part, there's already an NSO section of the eShop, and there's the NSO Home Screen app where they could allow you to browse GCN games with manuals and more without having to download them first, if they like.
RingoGaSuki
Moblin
Given the relative similarity of their power, I’m quietly hoping we also get Wii games on NSO alongside Gamecube, in a higher tier. They would definitely need to be downloaded one by one, but that’s not that crazy an idea
Last edited:
