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StarTopic Future Nintendo Hardware & Technology Speculation & Discussion |ST| (Read the staff posts before commenting!)

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lexony said:
I mean considering that it is still a PC but dedicated for gaming it has an amazing user experience. Steam OS has a great UI were Nintendo could learn one thing or two (even with their more minimalistic approach) and it is great how you get so many services like Cloud Saves and Online for free on a handheld like device.
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It's an amazing user experience... For a PC.

I think it was @Serif who discussed their experiences with it, being good, but it's not a Switch in terms of UX.
 
Concernt said:
It's an amazing user experience... For a PC.

I think it was @Serif who discussed their experiences with it, being good, but it's not a Switch in terms of UX.
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It's very functional. I think you'd be silly to call it bad, but I can understand not getting on with it as well as the Switch's. The biggest perk in comparison to the other handheld PCs is that it's actually a good device regardless of the Big Picture Mode or the actual PC interface due to the trackpads.

That said, Switch's OS clears if only because it's more functional and minimalist.
 
SoldierDelta said:
It's very functional. I think you'd be silly to call it bad, but I can understand not getting on with it as well as the Switch's. The biggest perk in comparison to the other handheld PCs is that it's actually a good device regardless of the Big Picture Mode or the actual PC interface due to the trackpads.

That said, Switch's OS clears if only because it's more functional and minimalist.
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I think the Deck is very neat, my core point is just it's a different market.
 
Concernt said:
I think the Deck is very neat, my core point is just it's a different market.
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Yeah.

The Deck's main problem is that there are so fucking many options that need an quick method of access. Proton options, local files, button configs, updates, beta branches, privacy, Steam Family Share, Community hubs, DLC, mods good lord mods, non-steam games including emulators, and that's on specific games before mentioning quick-access options like frame rates and wattage, friend options, Steam options... just... jesus christ.

The Switch thankfully doesn't need nearly as much stuff, but the Steam Deck deserves credit for being decently handled overall.
 
Shish said:
Steam Deck: i'm a joke to you?

I hope Switch 2 will be the last Nintendo console to focus on performance,
Now these graphical leaps have become too small to justify the price.
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Steam deck is not a mass market device. I mean the device itself is only sold in a couple of markets WW.
 
SoldierDelta said:
Yeah.

The Deck's main problem is that there are so fucking many options that need an quick method of access. Proton options, local files, button configs, updates, beta branches, privacy, Steam Family Share, Community hubs, DLC, mods good lord mods, non-steam games including emulators, and that's on specific games before mentioning quick-access options like frame rates and wattage, friend options, Steam options... just... jesus christ.

The Switch thankfully doesn't need nearly as much stuff, but the Steam Deck deserves credit for being decently handled overall.
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I'll always find the Switch vs Steam deck debate to be interesting, since both are meant for vastly different markets. The switch is meant for ease of plays and console gaming, meanwhile the Deck is meant for the PC crowds who loves to experiment and are PC enthusiast.

Like Valve i would presume competing with other PC handheld (which can use steam)
Meanwhile Nintendo are doing the same strategy of the Wii, by sitting in their corner and letting Xbox and Sony duke it out. Like the only company who seems to hitting the ring of handheld console would either be Sony and Microsoft, but both will be digital only and play Ps4/Xbox one games, since i don't believe neither company want to waste resources of having an handheld division and making handheld exclusives.

Like Nintendo quite literally have no competition in the handheld market and with the switch 2 on the arrival i can see Nintendo competing with both console manufacturer with exclusives games as usual.
 
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Aufhebung RPG said:
The Mario Galaxy you're pushing is also a customized game based entirely on the wii's unique hardware and controller,
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Dude all you do with the Wii remote is wiggle which can be mapped to a button and no one cares about using the aiming to collect the star bits. Stop hyping up a thr "new and innovative " for a game like this. It just doesn't make the game stand out
Aufhebung RPG said:
your idea that Nintendo doesn't need hardware breakthroughs just quality first-party games to entice gamers to buy them is purely an act of condescension on the part of a Nintendo fanboy, all video game development from pong to the present day has always been based on the fact that the hardware determines the game'sThe minimum framework that development can support, both in terms of graphical performance and gameplay design.
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I think you're taking this a bit too far. I don't know how old you are but alot of us has been gaming for decades and we mainly praise the games and the Controller is secondary. Also, no one is saying there won't be any improvements. Everyone is saying is that it won't be that important as the games comes first.
Aufhebung RPG said:
That's fine, everyone has everyone's needs, I just tend to go for the "new" hardware design level all the time in that thread, I apologize if I offended anyone, sorry.
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No, you're fine. We are just trying to tell you that it isn't necessary. It is nice. It can be optional. I had fun with building Labo and using the VR. After awhile I stop using it.
 
omniryu said:
Dude all you do with the Wii remote is wiggle which can be mapped to a button and no one cares about using the aiming to collect the star bits. Stop hyping up a thr "new and innovative " for a game like this. It just doesn't make the game stand out

I think you're taking this a bit too far. I don't know how old you are but alot of us has been gaming for decades and we mainly praise the games and the Controller is secondary. Also, no one is saying there won't be any improvements. Everyone is saying is that it won't be that important as the games comes first.

No, you're fine. We are just trying to tell you that it isn't necessary. It is nice. It can be optional. I had fun with building Labo and using the VR. After awhile I stop using it.
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I'm going to reiterate my point again, and then I'm not going to continue to argue about it. I can agree with you when you say "games are primary", but I must also remind you that it's impossible to discuss games in any way that circumvents their hardware interaction modes, or else the argument is a vacuum ball chicken.A simple logic is that the computer and console hardware came first before the games themselves were developed from the hardware itself, and while it's true that games do drive the iteration of the controller or hardware design, it's also a basic fact that hardware design is always the framework for software design.
 
I own around seven different handhelds including the Steam Deck. Switch is the only one that functions as a proper hybrid device that is designed top-to-bottom as a 2-in-1 console. Switching between handheld and docked modes i.e. external sound and display output, graphics configuration, controller pairing is streamlined and pain-free. The design sensibilities e.g. detachable controllers, covered screen in the dock, UI scaling, etc. serve it on an aesthetic and functional level.

The Steam Deck and other handheld PCs do not offer this level of convenience no matter how much automation has been incorporated by the vendor. Here I'm just talking about the 'hybrid' experience i.e. changing between home and mobile modes, and not the other individual features offered by their OS's. It is very convenient to chat with friends directly on a Steam Deck, it is not convenient to dock it and have it immediately behave like a home console without fiddling with menus.

Unless another console-maker like Sony or Microsoft makes such a device, the Switch maintains its uniqueness in the market as the only true seamless hybrid gaming console.
 
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Serif said:
I own around seven different handhelds including the Steam Deck. Switch is the only one that functions as a proper hybrid device that is designed top-to-bottom as a 2-in-1 console. Switching between handheld and docked modes i.e. external sound and display output, graphics configuration, controller pairing is streamlined and pain-free. The design sensibilities e.g. detachable controllers, covered screen in the dock, UI scaling, etc. serve it on an aesthetic and functional level.

The Steam Deck and other handheld PCs do not offer this level of convenience no matter how much automation has been incorporated by the vendor. Here I'm just talking about the 'hybrid' experience i.e. changing between home and mobile modes, and not the other individual features offered by their OS's. It is very convenient to chat with friends directly on a Steam Deck, it is not convenient to dock it and have it immediately behave like a home console without fiddling with menus.

Unless another console-maker like Sony or Microsoft makes such a device, the Switch maintains its uniqueness in the market as the only true seamless hybrid gaming device.
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Extremely minor UI element on Switch that I appreciate:

On OLED Model, some OS elements are made smaller, pixel for pixel, so they appear the same size on both Nintendo Switch and OLED Model. I noticed it especially when I was setting them up side by side. Not really relevant, but I love touches like that. Games, as far as I know, are able to read the device they're running on, so they could theoretically make UI elements bigger or smaller depending on if they're on a Lite, a regular or an OLED.
 


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we can expect what ever 30 Aya Neos get announced this year to have SD Express I guess
 
redmutineer75 said:
Considering that those new microSD Express cards max out at 800 MB/s sequential read speed, the chain of storage speed will only be as strong as its weakest link, whether that be the cartridge, SSD, or external storage. Though it won't matter as much since Switch 2 games will likely have much lower-quality assets than equivalent PS5 games.
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Assuming the CPU isn't a major bottleneck with respect to sequential and random read speeds as with the Nintendo Switch, I presume the Game Cards are probably the lowest dominator in terms of sequential and random read speeds.
 
Dakhil said:
Assuming the CPU isn't a major bottleneck with respect to sequential and random read speeds as with the Nintendo Switch, I presume the Game Cards are probably the lowest dominator in terms of sequential and random read speeds.
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I think that's a reasonable assumption, but at present I expect some (maybe not all) games will require at least a partial install to run. What's the maximum speed we could realistically see from Game Card, be it Samsung or Macronix?
 
omniryu said:
Some people here feels like that Nintendo needs another gimmick for their machine to stand out, but a couple of us are arguing that it is the games itself that are the innovation. While games like Wii Sports is good. It is games like Mario Galaxy that provides more depth and stand the test of time. Take a look at switch sports and mario odyssey. Mario odyssey out blew switch sports. Why? Because it is very innovative game. The 85 million people who played Wii sports were part of a fad and left. That's what no one is talking about.
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I would argue that it is both that you need but context is key here. Switch 1 definitely, & now that’s it proven, Redacted not so much. Indeed software will be key here but I don’t think looking at Oydessy versus Switch Sports is really the way to go. They are both innovative & both have a role to play in garnering audiences to the system.
 
Concernt said:
I think that's a reasonable assumption, but at present I expect some (maybe not all) games will require at least a partial install to run. What's the maximum speed we could realistically see from Game Card, be it Samsung or Macronix?
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the same as the micro SD Express, theoretically
 
Aufhebung RPG said:
I agree with this, but the question still remains "why does it have to be TSMC 4N", there are many better processes than Samsung 8nm that also cost less than TSMC 4N
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Several reasons. The TL;DR version is: Redesigning for new nodes costs Nvidia money, because most modern nodes no longer share the underlying technologies. Drake is halfway between Ampere and Ada. The smart money is that it will be on the same node as either Ampere or Ada.

Ampere was designed originally for TSMC 7nm. Nvidia spent a shitload of money redesigning it for Samsung 8nm because of various problems (mostly cost/yield related) with TSMC 7nm.The only thing that made that redesign worth it was the transition from the data center versions of Ampere to the desktop version required some reworks anyway. Because of this, datacenter Ampere is still on TSMC 7nm.

Ada Lovelace was originally called "Ampere 2" internally, and is very similar to Ampere. The version of the Ampere that we know is in Drake is halfway the version of Ampere in Orin, and Ada. Ada is on TSMC 4N.

The possibilities are:
  1. Drake is on 8nm, like desktop Ampere and Orin. Drake's GPU design was finalized after Lovelace's memory system was designed but before the tech was transitioned to 4N
  2. Drake is on 4N, like Ada Lovelace, and Drake's design was finalized after the transition to 4N.
  3. Drake in on 7nm, as an unusual halfway point. Nvidia reverse their redesign of desktop Ampere onto 8nm, pushing the tech back into the 7nm version, in order to give Nintendo a more power efficient version of Drake without the full cost of 4N.
  4. Nvidia ate the cost of a complete redesign of Ampere for Nintendo and Nintendo only - despite the fact that their desktop products sell 3-5x as many units per year as the Switch.
Options 1 and 2 probably cost roughly the same amount of money from a design perspective, but with different schedules. Option 3 is pricier than the first 2, and option 4 is pricier still. Which brings us to the second cost consideration, other than the node itself, which @Hermii pointed out.

Nvidia keeps multiple products on the same node. It's not a law of Physics or anything, they can and will do whatever makes the most sense. But Nvidia has to buy the capacity, not the customer (which is usually also Nvidia, but in this case is Nintendo). Capacity is cheaper in advance, and extremely expensive if purchase at the last minute.

By sharing nodes across products, if a product gets hot, Nvidia can back off production of other products temporarily in order to push more of the hot product out, without having to pay extortionist pricing. Conversely, if a product sinks, Nvidia's not stuck holding the back on all of the planned capacity they've already purchased, it can be shifted to other products. This is a second mark against an unusual node. Nvidia is stuck paying for the success or failure of a Nintendo product. That's a very unusual situation for Nvidia, and not one I think they'd be into.

But none of that is why I think 4N is correct. It's just because the Orin power consumption numbers roughly match with other power consumption tests on Ampere, and 8nm just breaks the power budget. Ada Lovelace levels of efficiency, however, hit right square in the middle of expected power draw.

I'm not an electrical engineer, so there are big error bars on my interpretation of the 8nm tests, and my sense of how much fat could be trimmed. And there aren't Nvidia GPU products on other nodes to test to see how close they could get, but since generally all the other likely nodes as less power efficient than 4N, I tend to lean one of two ways. "Either my understanding of power draw is right, and it needs to be on 4N to go as big as Drake, or it's wrong, and 8nm is viable. If 8nm is viable, then it's probably the biggest GPU-per-dollar that Nintendo could get, in which case, it's 8nm."
 
oldpuck said:
Several reasons. The TL;DR version is: Redesigning for new nodes costs Nvidia money, because most modern nodes no longer share the underlying technologies. Drake is halfway between Ampere and Ada. The smart money is that it will be on the same node as either Ampere or Ada.

Ampere was designed originally for TSMC 7nm. Nvidia spent a shitload of money redesigning it for Samsung 8nm because of various problems (mostly cost/yield related) with TSMC 7nm.The only thing that made that redesign worth it was the transition from the data center versions of Ampere to the desktop version required some reworks anyway. Because of this, datacenter Ampere is still on TSMC 7nm.

Ada Lovelace was originally called "Ampere 2" internally, and is very similar to Ampere. The version of the Ampere that we know is in Drake is halfway the version of Ampere in Orin, and Ada. Ada is on TSMC 4N.

The possibilities are:
  1. Drake is on 8nm, like desktop Ampere and Orin. Drake's GPU design was finalized after Lovelace's memory system was designed but before the tech was transitioned to 4N
  2. Drake is on 4N, like Ada Lovelace, and Drake's design was finalized after the transition to 4N.
  3. Drake in on 7nm, as an unusual halfway point. Nvidia reverse their redesign of desktop Ampere onto 8nm, pushing the tech back into the 7nm version, in order to give Nintendo a more power efficient version of Drake without the full cost of 4N.
  4. Nvidia ate the cost of a complete redesign of Ampere for Nintendo and Nintendo only - despite the fact that their desktop products sell 3-5x as many units per year as the Switch.
Options 1 and 2 probably cost roughly the same amount of money from a design perspective, but with different schedules. Option 3 is pricier than the first 2, and option 4 is pricier still. Which brings us to the second cost consideration, other than the node itself, which @Hermii pointed out.

Nvidia keeps multiple products on the same node. It's not a law of Physics or anything, they can and will do whatever makes the most sense. But Nvidia has to buy the capacity, not the customer (which is usually also Nvidia, but in this case is Nintendo). Capacity is cheaper in advance, and extremely expensive if purchase at the last minute.

By sharing nodes across products, if a product gets hot, Nvidia can back off production of other products temporarily in order to push more of the hot product out, without having to pay extortionist pricing. Conversely, if a product sinks, Nvidia's not stuck holding the back on all of the planned capacity they've already purchased, it can be shifted to other products. This is a second mark against an unusual node. Nvidia is stuck paying for the success or failure of a Nintendo product. That's a very unusual situation for Nvidia, and not one I think they'd be into.

But none of that is why I think 4N is correct. It's just because the Orin power consumption numbers roughly match with other power consumption tests on Ampere, and 8nm just breaks the power budget. Ada Lovelace levels of efficiency, however, hit right square in the middle of expected power draw.

I'm not an electrical engineer, so there are big error bars on my interpretation of the 8nm tests, and my sense of how much fat could be trimmed. And there aren't Nvidia GPU products on other nodes to test to see how close they could get, but since generally all the other likely nodes as less power efficient than 4N, I tend to lean one of two ways. "Either my understanding of power draw is right, and it needs to be on 4N to go as big as Drake, or it's wrong, and 8nm is viable. If 8nm is viable, then it's probably the biggest GPU-per-dollar that Nintendo could get, in which case, it's 8nm."
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What do you mean by your point #4? I'm just curious?

I am curious because Nvidia use to report Switch numbers every chance they got and then as someone here pointed out awhile back.
They stopped individually reporting Switch numbers and incorporated everything into gaming. Then massive rumors about an overstock of Ampere cards on the market and the cards weren't selling like they had expected.

I'm just pointing this out because if ever there were an instance to where Nvidia would eat the cost to satisfy a customer, it would be with Nintendo where the Switch has been more consistently selling than their own GPU's...
 
Serif said:
I own around seven different handhelds including the Steam Deck. Switch is the only one that functions as a proper hybrid device that is designed top-to-bottom as a 2-in-1 console. Switching between handheld and docked modes i.e. external sound and display output, graphics configuration, controller pairing is streamlined and pain-free. The design sensibilities e.g. detachable controllers, covered screen in the dock, UI scaling, etc. serve it on an aesthetic and functional level.

The Steam Deck and other handheld PCs do not offer this level of convenience no matter how much automation has been incorporated by the vendor. Here I'm just talking about the 'hybrid' experience i.e. changing between home and mobile modes, and not the other individual features offered by their OS's. It is very convenient to chat with friends directly on a Steam Deck, it is not convenient to dock it and have it immediately behave like a home console without fiddling with menus.

Unless another console-maker like Sony or Microsoft makes such a device, the Switch maintains its uniqueness in the market as the only true seamless hybrid gaming device.
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I completely agree with this and it's why I think the hybrid approach doesn't really have competition at the moment. The value proposition of the Switch is currently without compare and I don't see that changing for future Nintendo hybrids until Microsoft or Sony make an actual hybrid.

For the consumer, the real world UX matters even more than theoretical performance.
 
Aufhebung RPG said:
I agree with this, but the question still remains "why does it have to be TSMC 4N", there are many better processes than Samsung 8nm that also cost less than TSMC 4N
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It has been explained many times but the main reasons people flip between Samsung 8 nm and TSMC 4N is simply because those are nodes we know Nvidia has designed products on and has capacity for. That's it. It is not deeper than that.

No one is postulating other nodes because we just don't know any others that Nvidia is using right now and it makes no sense for them to use a node that they have no other products for just for Nintendo.

That would just add expense and vulnerability that they would have no contingency plan for.

As I said before. This has been stated over and over and over. Will it be TSMC 4N? I dunno, that would be the most logical given they just made a huge ass chip. But there are some basic clocks we can expect and if it is 8nm it should still be fine.
 
redmutineer75 said:
Considering that those new microSD Express cards max out at 800 MB/s sequential read speed, the chain of storage speed will only be as strong as its weakest link, whether that be the cartridge, SSD, or external storage. Though it won't matter as much since Switch 2 games will likely have much lower-quality assets than equivalent PS5 games.
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This made me think: what's stopping nintendo on switch 2 from following the ps5's physical media approach? (that is, taking the media from a slow cartridge and installing it into the console's internal storage).

They could go for a 128 and 256GB model switch 2 or 256/512GB and have cartridges that are cheap because they're slow (but just updated enough with new security features so people can't dump them using the MIG dumping tool). And the UFS 3 storage inside the switch would be as fast as the expandable sd express card.
 
A less often discussed variable of the 8nm vs 4N debate is: longevity. If Nintendo wants this thing (and various revisions) to last 7 or more years, 4N is better and more future proof in the long run, I imagine.
 
brainchild said:
For the consumer, the real world UX matters even more than theoretical performance.
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Even as a pure handheld player, and a super technical one to boot, a Steam Deck cannot offer the experience the Switch does.

I love my Steam Deck. But the complexity and jank of the Deck Experience is fundamentally tied to offering PC flexibility. 8 times out 10, I’d rather play on Switch.
 
NineTailSage said:
What do you mean by your point #4? I'm just curious?
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Exactly what I said - Nvidia absolutely could redesign their core IP for Nintendo. I’m not saying it’s impossible.

But the financial risk of doing it would be Nvidia’s, and the financial success would be Nintendo’s. That’s a horrible deal for Nvidia.

If Nintendo demands better than 8nm, and Nvidia has to eat costs to take the deal, why would Nvidia eat the cost of a complete redesign of their architecture when they could just eat the cost of 5nm?

To be clear, eating the cost of 5nm would suck for Nvidia. But as you point out, RTX 40 is underperforming. If Drake is on 5nm, then Nvidia can reuse spare RTX 40 capacity without having to shell out any cash for a new node. Nvidia has already got a financial investment in 5nm. The risk is smaller.

To be clear, I don’t think either Nvidia or Nintendo have the other by the balls. Nvidia rescued Nintendo when the Wii U was failing and Nintendo rescued Nvidia when the TX1 was failing and the tegra team with it.

They stand to make a lot of money together and a lot less apart. I think Nvidia continued to offer the software stack to Nintendo basically for free. I think Nvidia offered Nintendo a bunch of options, and all of them are priced fairly, no gouging but no major cost eating either. Nvidia made sure that they’d make decent profit per chip, while giving Nintendo the best chance to sell as many consoles as possible.

I find it very hard to make a case for the end result of that discussion to be that Nvidia takes a huge financial risk for a product not as good as 5nm and not as cheap for Nintendo as 8nm.
 
oldpuck said:
Exactly what I said - Nvidia absolutely could redesign their core IP for Nintendo. I’m not saying it’s impossible.

But the financial risk of doing it would be Nvidia’s, and the financial success would be Nintendo’s. That’s a horrible deal for Nvidia.

If Nintendo demands better than 8nm, and Nvidia has to eat costs to take the deal, why would Nvidia eat the cost of a complete redesign of their architecture when they could just eat the cost of 5nm?

To be clear, eating the cost of 5nm would suck for Nvidia. But as you point out, RTX 40 is underperforming. If Drake is on 5nm, then Nvidia can reuse spare RTX 40 capacity without having to shell out any cash for a new node. Nvidia has already got a financial investment in 5nm. The risk is smaller.

To be clear, I don’t think either Nvidia or Nintendo have the other by the balls. Nvidia rescued Nintendo when the Wii U was failing and Nintendo rescued Nvidia when the TX1 was failing and the tegra team with it.

They stand to make a lot of money together and a lot less apart. I think Nvidia continued to offer the software stack to Nintendo basically for free. I think Nvidia offered Nintendo a bunch of options, and all of them are priced fairly, no gouging but no major cost eating either. Nvidia made sure that they’d make decent profit per chip, while giving Nintendo the best chance to sell as many consoles as possible.

I find it very hard to make a case for the end result of that discussion to be that Nvidia takes a huge financial risk for a product not as good as 5nm and not as cheap for Nintendo as 8nm.
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I think most of my confusion was in the number of GPU's that are sold in comparison to what Switch sells...
This is another reason that Nvidia are all aboard the Ai train and selling their architecture (at a premium price of course) to anyone that will fork out the cash.

To be fair I don't believe that cost is or was the determining factor of whether T239 is on 4nm or 8nm.(moreover to align the manufacturing with a competent partner). Nvidia got the hell away from Samsung when it comes to anything they deem a priority, my guess is that Orin does well enough but when they were including Switch numbers in the Tegra business (it was the bulk of their profit for that segment).
 
oldpuck said:
The possibilities are:
  1. Drake is on 8nm, like desktop Ampere and Orin. Drake's GPU design was finalized after Lovelace's memory system was designed but before the tech was transitioned to 4N
  2. Drake is on 4N, like Ada Lovelace, and Drake's design was finalized after the transition to 4N.
  3. Drake in on 7nm, as an unusual halfway point. Nvidia reverse their redesign of desktop Ampere onto 8nm, pushing the tech back into the 7nm version, in order to give Nintendo a more power efficient version of Drake without the full cost of 4N.
  4. Nvidia ate the cost of a complete redesign of Ampere for Nintendo and Nintendo only - despite the fact that their desktop products sell 3-5x as many units per year as the Switch.
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Didn't even knew about the Ampere data center version being on TSMC 7nm, interesting stuff!
Was TSMC 7nm that terrible of a node for game consoles and desktop GPU hardware, resulting in newer PS5 & Xbox models jumping so quickly to TSMC 6nm?
 
Thombias said:
Didn't even knew about the Ampere data center version being on TSMC 7nm, interesting stuff!
Was TSMC 7nm that terrible of a node for game consoles and desktop GPU hardware, resulting in newer PS5 & Xbox models jumping so quickly to TSMC 6nm?
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Series consoles haven't made the jump yet as far as I know. PS5 did quickly, but I think that's partly because they pushed clock speeds to the limit of what 7nm can handle, impacting yields more than Xbox.
 
Darknut85 said:
That isn’t even guaranteed for PS5.
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Yeah, it's true. I'm assuming internal Switch 2 developers wouldn't push too hard for graphics if the game would suffer too much. I'm guessing they would aim for 1080p 60fps? Idk maybe even internal open world/bigger games won't be able to achieve 60 fps.

I'm really hoping Metroid Prime 4 got pushed to Switch 2 tbh. I can't see how they can manage the type of game everyone thinks it is going to be, on a switch. People want a significant jump from the first 3 prime games. Zelda (Botw/Totk) are huge games but it's not really stylized realism. idk We'll see.
 
VintoWin said:
Yeah, it's true. I'm assuming internal Switch 2 developers wouldn't push too hard for graphics if the game would suffer too much. I'm guessing they would aim for 1080p 60fps? Idk maybe even internal open world/bigger games won't be able to achieve 60 fps.

I'm really hoping Metroid Prime 4 got pushed to Switch 2 tbh. I can't see how they can manage the type of game everyone thinks it is going to be, on a switch. People want a significant jump from the first 3 prime games. Zelda (Botw/Totk) are huge games but it's not really stylized realism. idk We'll see.
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And it's clear that The Legend of Zelda is 100% going to stick to a stylized rendering approach, because that's the way to circumvent the graphical race while giving players the best visuals possible.

The most reasonable guess is that the biggest games will still be 30fps
 
My personal feelings,

At this point i see no reason for Nintendo not to mention, announce or reveal the Nintendo Switch Successor by May 7th, there is no holiday sales to deter, there is no Fiscal Sales to deter and as of now there is no big Switch game that would have it legs cut off from an announcement. So come May 7th and Nintendo still refuse to acknowledge there is a Nintendo Switch Successor then for my own personal sanity im go have to avoid
this forum and "Switch 2" topics altogether because at this point and time its just ridiculous stalling the announcement, time for Switch 1 to be put out to pasture.
 
NintenDuvo said:
My personal feelings,

At this point i see no reason for Nintendo not to mention, announce or reveal the Nintendo Switch Successor by May 7th, there is no holiday sales to deter, there is no Fiscal Sales to deter and as of now there is no big Switch game that would have it legs cut off from an announcement. So come May 7th and Nintendo still refuse to acknowledge there is a Nintendo Switch Successor then for my own personal sanity im go have to avoid
this forum and "Switch 2" topics altogether because at this point and time its just ridiculous stalling the announcement, time for Switch 1 to be put out to pasture.
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Same, long radio silence is turning fans insane, so I‘ll leave to not become a double clown (if you know, you know).
 
Ojoloco said:
www.linkedin.com

Game Recruiter on LinkedIn: #gamerecruiter #gamejobs #unrealengine #leadprogrammer #nintendo…

🎮 HIRING a Lead Unreal Engine Programmer! Our client is on a mission to create a groundbreaking casual, cooperative party game for Nintendo's next-gen…
www.linkedin.com www.linkedin.com
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This is the most news we've gotten in around 3 months. Holy shit we're desperate.

Anyway, let's dissect some of the small things here:
  • "Must live in Canada" - Bit weird, but okay. If it's a Nintendo studio, it's likely Next Level Games, but it could be another company like Ubisoft or Drinkbox (Guacamelee). However, this is a listing for Unreal Engine, something that Nintendo is going to jump to with this next system in all likelyhood. NLG is my best guess.
  • "a new casual, cooperative party game that's set to dazzle on Nintendo's upcoming next-gen console" - 1-2-Switch 3: Switch Harder. Probably going to be the tech demo or something similar.
  • "you will create the technical backbone of our brand-new AA multiplayer game" - Smaller scale, def along the lines of 1-2 Switch.
 
SoldierDelta said:
This is the most news we've gotten in around 3 months. Holy shit we're desperate.

Anyway, let's dissect some of the small things here:
  • "Must live in Canada" - Bit weird, but okay. If it's a Nintendo studio, it's likely Next Level Games, but it could be another company like Ubisoft or Drinkbox (Guacamelee). However, this is a listing for Unreal Engine, something that Nintendo is going to jump to with this next system in all likelyhood. NLG is my best guess.
  • "a new casual, cooperative party game that's set to dazzle on Nintendo's upcoming next-gen console" - 1-2-Switch 3: Switch Harder. Probably going to be the tech demo or something similar.
  • "you will create the technical backbone of our brand-new AA multiplayer game" - Smaller scale, def along the lines of 1-2 Switch.
Click to expand...
I highly doubt it's NLG. Furthermore, the description they give of the game does not fit with what you propose about 1-2-Switch. It's more of an Overcooked style thing.
In addition to the fact that NLG has its own recruitment page


Since they also mention a Party Animal type aesthetic, my bet is on Ubisoft with a rabbids game that follows current trends.
The UE part probably will be set to follow a standard for hiring even if you then go in and use Snowdrop or whatever the game handles.
Ubisoft or a smaller Canadian studio
 
Ojoloco said:
I highly doubt it's NLG. Furthermore, the description they give of the game does not fit with what you propose about 1-2-Switch. It's more of an Overcooked style thing.


Since they also mention a Party Animal type aesthetic, my bet is on Ubisoft with a rabbids game that follows current trends.
The UE part probably will be set to follow a standard for hiring even if you then go in and use Snowdrop or whatever the game handles.
Click to expand...
Ubisoft is also one of the publishers who loves to leak consoles, and they mention NG in a Job offering. Things add up./s
 
Stinky Horse said:
Why would a Nintendo owned studio need to brag about how well the game is received by play testers? This is someone pretty small I think.
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It could literally just be the hiring agency hyping it up a bit. Someone also brought to my attention that Ubisoft doesn't really use UE, rather Snowdrop. EA can also be ruled out because the only two Canadian EA game studios are a FIFA studio and a mostly-defunct support studio in Montreal. WB Games can be ruled out because they're working on a single-player game. Rockstar, Coalition, and a whole bunch of other studios can't really be counted because they're either smaller, don't use UE, don't work on smaller projects, don't work with Nintendo or are virtually defunct. I guess it's possible that Klei could be making something for Switch? It'd be strange though, especially since they use/used Unity. I legitimately have no fucking clue, no game studio based in Canada makes sense for it.
Ojoloco said:
I highly doubt it's NLG. Furthermore, the description they give of the game does not fit with what you propose about 1-2-Switch. It's more of an Overcooked style thing.
In addition to the fact that NLG has its own recruitment page


Since they also mention a Party Animal type aesthetic, my bet is on Ubisoft with a rabbids game that follows current trends.
The UE part probably will be set to follow a standard for hiring even if you then go in and use Snowdrop or whatever the game handles.
Ubisoft or a smaller Canadian studio
Click to expand...
Ubisoft uses Snowdrop for stuff like Rabbids, not UE. Even so, there's three Ubisoft companies located in Canada, Quebec (Immortals:Feynx Rising, currently working on a mobile game), Montreal (working on the Sands of Time Remake and Project Hexe) and Toronto (Splinter Cell Remake). None of them add up with working on a Party game with UE.

Literally the only one that makes sense is NLG, and even then I can't disagree with the notion that it'd be incredibly odd to be them to make a party game or that Nintendo accidentally leaked a mention of a next-gen console.
 
SoldierDelta said:
It could literally just be the hiring agency hyping it up a bit. Someone also brought to my attention that Ubisoft doesn't really use UE, rather Snowdrop. EA can also be ruled out because the only two Canadian EA game studios are a FIFA studio and a mostly-defunct support studio in Montreal. WB Games can be ruled out because they're working on a single-player game. Rockstar, Coalition, and a whole bunch of other studios can't really be counted because they're either smaller, don't use UE, don't work on smaller projects, don't work with Nintendo or are virtually defunct. I guess it's possible that Klei could be making something for Switch? It'd be strange though, especially since they use/used Unity. I legitimately have no fucking clue, no game studio based in Canada makes sense for it.

Ubisoft uses Snowdrop for stuff like Rabbids, not UE. Even so, there's three Ubisoft companies located in Canada, Quebec (Immortals:Feynx Rising, currently working on a mobile game), Montreal (working on the Sands of Time Remake and Project Hexe) and Toronto (Splinter Cell Remake). None of them add up with working on a Party game with UE.

Literally the only one that makes sense is NLG, and even then I can't disagree with the notion that it'd be incredibly odd to be them to make a party game or that Nintendo accidentally leaked a mention of a next-gen console.
Click to expand...
The UE part probably will be set to follow a standard for hiring even if you then go in and use Snowdrop or whatever the game handles.
Click to expand...


If there is one thing for sure, it is that it is not NLG because they do not use agencies like this, nor do they make that kind of games, nor do they use UE (although I insist that UE is set as a standard in contracting, it does not indicate that it is used in the project), nor Being part of Nintendo they would put the next gen Nintendo console.

Edit.
Ubisoft, due to its own structure, its studios work on multiple projects at the same time, they lead a couple of projects but collaborate on a thousand projects from other Ubisoft studios.
 
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Tentacle-tropes said:
I would argue that it is both that you need but context is key here. Switch 1 definitely, & now that’s it proven, Redacted not so much. Indeed software will be key here but I don’t think looking at Oydessy versus Switch Sports is really the way to go. They are both innovative & both have a role to play in garnering audiences to the system.
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I do recognize the hardware did get it here. But not in the new way to play. Don't get me wrong. In the initial stage there were games that had some creative way to play with the Switch. There was a game that you lay two switch flat and connect and have a tank travel from one switch to another depending on how you made the travel. I love stuff like that. It just that never got the acclaim it deserve or the sales relative to the games that largely use traditional controls.

Also, the hybrid nature obviously is the main reason above anything else. I definitely recognize that. It is more practical than a novelty. There isn't a new control or a way to interacted with the game you're playing. It is one system, one library, anywhere you go, on and off the TV.
oldpuck said:
RTX 40 is underperforming.
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This is news to me. The mighty RTX 40 is underperforming. I mean I know GPU sales were in the slumps in the last few years but all I see is 4090 here and 4090 there.
Darknut85 said:
That isn’t even guaranteed for PS5.
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Can you imagine traveling back to 2013 or hell, 2018 and saying that 1080p isn't guaranteed for the PS5?
 
Project Manager: "So devs, what do you want to focus on? Visual eyecandy or performance?"

Devs: "What's performance?!"

AKA most devs will always priorize optics over performance.
 
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