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I guess if they have something in early June, early July, etc it makes sense. just an unused spot so far as far as I can recall
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StarTopic Future Nintendo Hardware & Technology Speculation & Discussion |ST| (Read the staff posts before commenting!)
- Thread starter Dakhil
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Deleted member 887
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Nintendo is the only external customer for Drake. Drake fabrication has started.
Either Nvidia takes a multimillion dollar loss on Drake, or Nintendo does. This will not happen. A Drake device will launch next year.
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I wouldn’t say it necessarily started because people will read it as something else and as you saying Drake started production for the switch 2 somehow, I’ll just say that a physical version of the hardware exists in NVidia’s hands enough to where they are testing software on it and they would be able to iron out minor bugs if need be.
However I should note that nvidia is not Intel nor are they AMD, they are infamous for having intense pre-verification work done. While AMD can be on stepping F2 on their silicon and Intel can be on J1, indicating a dev hell. Nvidia is routinely, routinely, on A1 or A0. Infamous? Not in the bad sense, I meant they are known in a good sense for testing a lot before, rather than after, for the product.
A0 is like the first step and doesn’t need more work done to it, it’s a perfect chip.
Very rare for them to be on like A2. Very, very rare.
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Deleted member 887
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Yeah I meant t239 directly, but fair point.
Neither Nintendo nor Nvidia are going to have a large stockpile of chips on their balance sheet with unannounced hardware, and if they’re using the same allocated foundry capacity as Orin, then they are teed up to move from engineering samples to chip production if they haven’t already.
yohoopzcrazy
Cappy
Out of curiosity - you guys think Nvidia will do some extra security stuff to make Drake hacking harder?
OP
OP
Considering that's what Nvidia did with later revisions of Erista (Tegra X1), as well as Mariko (Tegra X1+), probably.
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Yeah, also with A78C it has newer security features so it’s in Nintendo’s interest for that too. Should be more secure, to the bane of a few.
Cheetah6442
Bob-omb
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Do we know if the next Switch will have BC?
It's expected to have it
kimbo99
Spirit Detective
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According to some enthusiast sites, Miyamoto basically confirmed it won't be.
ertaboy356b
Resident Troll
Mariko is already hard to hack.
YugamiSekai
T239 vs. Picross 4K
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Most likely, but if any method was to release for hacking it, you better hope you get one as fast as possible when it comes out.
On another note, I've been playing GeForce Now on my Switch over Android and that has not helped with this wait, I need to see TotK and BotW at 60fps.
NintenDuvo
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Are those quotes from the most recent Q&A session regarding Nintendo mentioning the words "Next Generation Hardware"?
LiC
Member
Yes, it's from the Q&A. But while 次世代機 means next-generation hardware, it's just repeating the phrasing of the question that was asked (you can Ctrl+F for it in the PDF), so there's no significance to the fact that Shiota used that phrase in his response.
And to not leave this merely implied: There is no significance for new hardware to anything Nintendo disclosed, or anything they said in their Q&A, as part of these financial results, because there never is. Cutting the sales forecast for Switch units has no meaning at all for when they might be planning to release new hardware.
Concernt
Optimism is non-negotiable
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As I've said before, May is a pretty absurd proposition... I mean. It didn't do Sega Saturn any favours. I think the reality is probably more they aren't counting the Drake device among projections, at least for now. They expect to sell 19 million of the EXISTING Switch units by end of FY. I think March or April is the likely window; either a strong start or strong end to their Fiscal Year. There's also the fact that in this same financial report they showed a roadmap for game releases with a glaring gash in the March-April area. I don't see them going 2 months totally dry then bursting out a new generation alongside a new Zelda game; In fact I believe they're more likely going to want to have as big an install base as possible on the Drake platform before Zelda launches. Unlike 2017, they don't NEED Zelda to sell this new device. It will sell out almost instantly regardless, and if anything having the initial rush finished up by time Zelda comes out would benefit them. It's like a free second launch. Actual launch day, and the day the big exclusive (if cross-gen) game launches. Like Xbox Series X's super-soft, back-compat dependant November 2020 launch and subsequent glut of content in 2021.
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I don’t disagree with you necessarily on a lot of this, but how relevant is May to Saturn’s failure, and is it relevant today?
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I'm not sure that it is. What was more relevant to Saturn's failure was shadow-dropping the console without telling retailers whatsoever and fiddling with the sales agreements around it that made them largely unwilling to stock and promote it. That it happened in May is largely irrelevant.
Concernt
Optimism is non-negotiable
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It's less that May is bad in and of itself and more that it's not as good as the alternatives. I'm still working on the assumption of early 2023, which May is a stretch, but let's work with H1, January to May. January and February are out, not enough time for marketing and distribution. So, why not May?
Because March and April have many more advantages:
Right at the end or start of the Fiscal Year, which looks good on paper. Pleases investors, which means more money for them through, well, investments.
BEFORE GOLDEN WEEK, which is April 29th to May 5th. While not quite comparable, this is sort of like Japanese Christmas when it comes to gifts, but it varies from family to family. Also means launching before Japanese exam results season, which is another big one.
American tax return season, an influx of liquid cash into the consumer economy which brings real cash flow in the consumer space closer to holiday season than any other time except the holiday season.
The original Nintendo Switch had all of those benefits going for it and clearly it worked out for it. If they are able to get it out in March or April, aren't those enough reason to bite the bullet?
May also has a few things going against it;
It's the middle of a quarter, Nintendo likes to launch at the start or end (Lite, OLED and 2017 Switch, for example.) for the sake of investor relations (see above).
It's right before the summer games drought. That drought has reasons; January to April has more consumer spending on in-home entertainment. May to August sees that fall off in favour of holiday spending.
It falls awkwardly after Golden Week, just about, but way before Christmas. It is neither the thing to get for a good report card, nor is it the hot toy for Christmas. It's just... The late Spring console launching after people (in the US) have spent their tax return and just before they begin spending on holidays.
Games launching in May? That's reasonable. Hardware? Well, that's more complicated just because of the higher price, so consumer spending trends are more pronounced.
As I also mentioned there's the big gap in their schedule (per this financial report) and finally there's one point I want to reiterate. Software can slip, hardware tends not to. If this device was planned for late 2022 to early 2023, as reliable leakers have repeatedly expressed, that means that it was planned for FY22/23. Slipping a quarter from Q3 to Q4 (from Holiday to March) is reasonable, even for hardware planned years in advance. Slipping an entire fiscal year, from Q4(22/23) to Q1(23/24)? That's a lot less likely.
While I think May is possible, I think March or April is more likely. I concede that April is still Q1(23/24), but I think being the first month of a new fiscal year gives it a decent chance, a sort of possible Hail Mary launch window for a console that couldn't make Holiday launch, then couldn't even make EOY(Fiscal).
Those are my thoughts anyway. I know "Switch 1 launched with Zelda so why wouldn't Switch Drake" has a lot of weight, and not without reason, but as I said, I just don't think Switch Drake NEEDS Zelda nearly as much as Switch 1 did.
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What
You have got to be kidding? The next Switch not being BC with OG games would seriously make me reconsider buying one
I can see a bold and funky interpretation of a wrong traduction of a very vague out of context miyamoto quote...
Concernt
Optimism is non-negotiable
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He (Miyamoto) didn't say this. I'm not saying they were lying, maybe something got lost in translation or misunderstood, but no. In fact the recent financial meeting actually had a section about this, I believe! They talked about how going forward, "backwards compatibility" would be more along the lines of being compatible through emulation or a translation layer rather than previous backwards compatible consoles from Nintendo that used hardware solutions.
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Sorry, I should have clarified: My reply wasn’t about what Miyamoto said it was more about. “How did they even come to the conclusion based on what he said, when he quite literally implied the opposite”
It’s like they read something else entirely.
Because this:
Recently, however, the software development environment itself has gradually become more standardized, so it is generally easier to create a playback environment that allows software for past hardware to be played on new hardware than before. However, Nintendo's strength is in creating new games. With new hardware, we would like to propose unique games that cannot be realized on existing hardware
Is very clear about their position on Bc, nowhere does it even say “there won’t be BC”
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Pretty sure the way you read it (aka the very very likely correct one) doesn't bring as many clicks as the way they did read it!
;D
There is already a known attack on pointer authentication which affects the implementation in A78C.
The PACMAN Attack
PACMAN: Attacking ARM Pointer Authentication with Speculative Execution
pacmanattack.com
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Oh my- well, I wonder if the switch’s secure environment mitigates this vulnerability. It’s not on like a more easily accessible platform to get into like the M1.There is already a known attack on pointer authentication which affects the implementation in A78C.
The PACMAN Attack
PACMAN: Attacking ARM Pointer Authentication with Speculative Execution
Unfortunately but not much I can do now!
They're already getting by fine without it. Probably wouldn't hurt to add it as defense in depth, but they don't really need it.
Mr Swine
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My gut tells me that Nintendo wants to milk Switch as much as possible while having a steady decline YoY before releasing Drake.
I hope so, been playing Sonic Frontiers and it really needs a resolution and performance patch as it looks blurry at times.
LukasManak22
who the fuck is that
I still think that Drake is not launching with Zelda and that it's in fact late 2023 release for a new hardware.
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It comes with it. A78C/X1C and later.
Lol, what hoops did they jump through to make that conclusion?
edit: wtf is a famicoin?
MrEevee98
Founder of nintenleaks
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I was looking through the Q&A PDF, I didn't find anything that made mention of this comment, can you give me the exact location?
HankyPanky
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when Nintendo talks 'next generation' and 'new experiences' I presume they are posturing further out to what comes after Switch or alongside eventually. not Drake which they'll treat as part of the Switch family, same concept, same experiences.
OP
OP
SK Hynix starts shipping low-power, high-efficiency LPDDR5X chips - KED Global
SK Hynix Inc., the world’s second-largest memory chipmaker, said on Wednesday it has begun selling low-power, high-efficiency DRAM chips called LPDDR5X,
www.kedglobal.com
Serif
𝕽𝖊𝖓𝖊𝖌𝖆𝖉𝖊 𝕬𝖓𝖌𝖊𝖑
I think they were making a sarcastic reference to the thread on ResetEra.
Nintendo BC talk gives me a headache. The constant "Switch 2 won't have BC because Nintendo", devoid of context and history, has been annoying, It's one thing to be concerned and ask if it's feasible, it's another thing to keep asserting that it won't happen for nebulous reasons.
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AxkilAvenger
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You should get in there at least for the laughs. One guy is saying how we had to re buy vc games from Wii to play on Wii U. Amazing how wrong people will remember things just to make a point
Serif
𝕽𝖊𝖓𝖊𝖌𝖆𝖉𝖊 𝕬𝖓𝖌𝖊𝖑
I made the mistake of participating. Remind me not to do it again.You should get in there at least for the laughs. One guy is saying how we had to re buy vc games from Wii to play on Wii U. Amazing how wrong people will remember things just to make a point
Hosermess
Koopa
I love how a difference of ~2-4 weeks in a release date can apparently make or break a console. Not that the points made aren't compelling or sensible. But in the long run, if it's released a month before TotK, they'll still end up being lumped together even if its turns out not to be a "launch day title".
I mean, when you consider an earlier release, if there are any big name 3rd party Drake exclusives as launch day games, Nintendo would be doing them a favour by not releasing ToTK on the same day.
I mean, when you consider an earlier release, if there are any big name 3rd party Drake exclusives as launch day games, Nintendo would be doing them a favour by not releasing ToTK on the same day.
D
Deleted member 887
Guest
This has been Nintendo's language since the SNES. "New experiences" in Nintendo talk can mean a new control scheme, but it can also mean "we're pushing the existing hardware to its limits, time for an upgrade."
I think that the ratio of genuine dev philosophy to empty corporate sloganing is about 50/50 here, but in this context it means "we're going to talk about this our way, on our schedule"
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Absolutely. MK8DX was a port from an older console and released a month and a half after launch, but was definitely marketed a launch window title and has presumably shifted a lot of consoles with its 48 million units.
MP!
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this reminds me of reggie's whole "Yeah, but is an HD Wii ENOUGH?" statement he made before Wii U came out...
Yes Reggie, an earlier HD wii would have been enough...
Nintendo tends to overthink this stuff just as much as we do.
A 4K switch would be enough but they probably aren't content with just that.
I'm assuming this means they will have some other hook in addition to the hybrid "play anywhere" hook that switch already has.
Whatever it is I hope it comes next year for sure, cause I really don't want to see switch sales and support shrivel and die like the wii did for years before the Wii U.
Yes Reggie, an earlier HD wii would have been enough...
Nintendo tends to overthink this stuff just as much as we do.
A 4K switch would be enough but they probably aren't content with just that.
I'm assuming this means they will have some other hook in addition to the hybrid "play anywhere" hook that switch already has.
Whatever it is I hope it comes next year for sure, cause I really don't want to see switch sales and support shrivel and die like the wii did for years before the Wii U.
Concernt
Optimism is non-negotiable
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New gameplay experiences doesn't have to mean new gimmicks! There are plenty of ideas that are easier, if not outright made possible for the first time, by the presence of so much more RAM and RT hardware. And that resolution helps, too.
Bowser's Fury is an amazing concept that, objectively, struggles on Switch hardware. If they want to embrace a new gameplay paradigm of a gigantic open world for Mario that's totally seamless, without sacrificing level complexity, they need more power.
Plus "new gameplay experiences" includes things like Elden Ring, Red Dead Redemption 2, etc. coming to a handheld.
I very much doubt the Drake Switch is anything more than a beefier Switch designed to run games Switch 1 just can't due to sheer grunt.
Serif
𝕽𝖊𝖓𝖊𝖌𝖆𝖉𝖊 𝕬𝖓𝖌𝖊𝖑
I agree. The GBA offered new experiences from the GB/C by virtue of the hardware power, and that was the basis of the GBA's pitch. SNES level games that wouldn't have been feasible on GB/C without significant cutbacks (looking at the Donkey Kong platformers in particular). Likewise, the 3DS offered new experiences not just because there's glasses free 3D, but the additional power meant we could have full-fat 3D Zelda on a portable. The 2DS without its glasses free 3D still offered new, fresh experiences from the original DS, because of the hardware jump.
I understand we're far from the 8 bit to 16 bit level of 'newness'. but even the Switch -> Drake gap can enable new experiences. I don't immediately assume there will be some main gimmick or hook of the new system aside from extra features and the existing hybrid concept.
A new experience could very well be an open-world Mario at 4K 60 FPS with a ton of real-time physics objects on screen. Possible on current Switch? Yes, in the same way that GBA games are possible on GB/C - with compromises.
Fake Edit: As I was typing this I see @Concernt had a similar sentiment right above mine, haha
YolkFolk
Tingle
Most not made by Nintendo.So like most console successors ever then?
even most of Nintendo's hardware. the Wii was an outlier as far as performance goes. every other device had a notable performance bump over their predecessor. most also had some kind of gimmick to go with it
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