• Hey everyone, staff have documented a list of banned content and subject matter that we feel are not consistent with site values, and don't make sense to host discussion of on Famiboards. This list (and the relevant reasoning per item) is viewable here.

StarTopic Future Nintendo Hardware & Technology Speculation & Discussion |ST| (Read the staff posts before commenting!)

Reader mode
ReyVGM said:
If "GOTY edition" means a re-release that includes all the patches and content in one package, then Nintendo has kinda done that before.

Hyrule Warriors, Fire Emblem Warriors Xenoblade 1 have been re-released multiple times with everything included. You could even say Mario Kart 8 Deluxe falls into that category (until Nintendo started releasing new DLC for it that is).
Click to expand...

Yeah, Nintendo silently updates many of their Switch games. Take Mario Tennis Aces for example; current prints include all the DLC. Same goes for Mario Golf: Super Rush.
 
0
D36 said:
Thoughts?

Click to expand...

At first I thought this was another extrapolation of a very generic job posting, but between the in-house rendering engine, mention of console development experience (but not mentioning PC, not listing example consoles, and not mentioning cross-platform development), and "making the next generation of game experiences," there's probably a decent chance it's NLG and they're starting to work on their pipeline for next-gen games.

chocolate_supra said:
Hidden content is only available for registered users. Sharing it outside of Famiboards is subject to moderation.
Click to expand...
Dekuman said:
Hidden content is only available for registered users. Sharing it outside of Famiboards is subject to moderation.
Click to expand...
I mean, they've said this like six times before and even given "purchase history" as an example of what Nintendo Account can carry forward to next-gen hardware. The writing is on the wall and the only reason they don't come out and say it is because they don't want to talk about anything next-gen until they're ready to announce it all.
 
Indeed, Nintendo does seem to keep saying how much they're not fond of resetting each generation.

...it's just that some people interpret them as being tsundere about the subject.
 
MisterBono said:
I see Zippo gave a price for this thing :unsure: has anyone else posted a price?
Click to expand...
I'm pretty skeptical a price would be known at this point. I imagine Nintendo has had a target price for a while which has guided their hardware design process, but I'd imagine it's hard to really finalize the price until a bit closer to launch. Maybe I'm wrong, but I thought I remember hearing stories of other hardware where price was something internally still being decided in the months before the public confirmation. There's also the fact that hardware manufacturers have been pulling the unusual move of increasing their console prices after launch in the last few years. Those two things are what's influencing me here.

I'd possibly believe someone saying "Nintendo is aiming for $____" and maybe as a range, but I wouldn't trust someone who is stating what the price will be when the console releases potentially over a year from now. I haven't seen Zippo's comment; this is just my general two cents.
 
Last edited:
0
D36 said:
Thoughts?

Click to expand...

I’m sorry but I just have to butt in. There are plenty of switch games that are visually stunning. He seems to be the type that sees a piece of turd to be “visually stunning” as long as it runs at 4K methinks. It is quite bothersome because that ad specifically has no intention of demeaning the switch. The uploader confirmation bias kicking in really hard.

Also this is a job ad. Y’all want them to be say, “please come and work at these crappy looking games”? “your contribution will shape the OLD generation of games”?
 
Last edited:
Multiverse said:
I’m sorry but I just have to butt in. There are plenty of switch games that are visually stunning. He seems to be the type that sees a piece turd running at 4K to be “visually stunning” methinks. It is quite bothersome because that ad specifically has no intention demeaning the switch. The uploader confirmation bias kicking in really hard.

Also this is a job ad. Y’all want them to be say, please come and work at these crappy looking games? your contribution with shape the OLD generation of games?
Click to expand...
Which games would you consider "visually stunning"?
Would you still, in 2023, consider them stunning alongside the likes of Ratchet and Clank, Sackboy's adventures, Horizon:FW etc.?
 
Armoured_Bear said:
Which games would you consider "visually stunning"?
Would you still, in 2023, consider them stunning alongside the likes of Ratchet and Clank, Sackboy's adventures, Horizon:FW etc.?
Click to expand...
the textures and assets may not be “visually stunning” at times, but the art style most definitely is. with the extra power, art style, textures and assets will look even better
 
Armoured_Bear said:
The Pikmin ga

The pikmin games have always looked very nice and it looks fantastic for the hardware, it doesn't "stun" anyone who is used to visually modern games though.
Click to expand...
I think said people who are used to visual modern games want prestige more than anything. Pikmin is quite visually stunning, but it also has the halmark of Nintendo's rounded aesthetics for its characters, not the typical "edgy" ones like Kratos or whatnot.

I dare say Pikmin 4 looks stunning.
 
Does a game need to be at the bleeding edge to actually make one want to stop and appreciate the visuals? That’s all that stunning really means.

Some of the ending sequence of Tears of the Kingdom had me absolutely grinning. It was, in fact, stunning. I’m sure Pikmin 4 has its moments as well.

Not sure why we need to gatekeep visuals being stunning here. One could say HD2D is stunning to the right audience - even just very detailed and well animated pixel art like the recent Metal Slug Tactics fits.

FeiFongWong said:
For gaming hermits playing only on ancient switch they may be stunning.
Click to expand...

I’m playing Renmant 2 right now. Quit being weird.
 
Visually stunning could mean many things. Notice how no one said, "graphically stunning." Graphically stunning for Switch is totally a thing, though.

Someone can find the opening dive after the Tears of The Kingdom intro to be visually stunning, I know I did and I have a PC that runs circles around the PS5 and XSX.

Not everything is a graphics elitist contest of who is pushing the best ray tracing or the most polygons.

Games are largely a visual medium with a variety of styles. I think many Nintendo games still look fantastic, if anything, I think the Switch hurts its games most with the terrible resolutions. Having run my own copy of ToTK on my PC at 4k, I was shocked to see all of the texture work and details I could not notice at all on Switch. I do not know if sharing those screens on here is allowed but it blew me away. It actually evoked something in me the way good visual should.

Horizon is probably the most graphically impressive console game to date but its art style and aesthetic straight-up puts me to sleep. What GG has done with the PS4/PS5 is incredible... But the visual style is cluttered, busy, looks focus tested to hell and back, abrasively over-saturated, and many elements of it are generic. There are no cute Goron kids or any memorable goofy ass NPCs that leave their imprint on your brain. They are all very slightly stylized humans trying their best to look real. Now, I don't think it's a bad game but I say all this to say, even with more power I do not think Nintendo will go in the direction of hyper detail.

I hope they continue to prioritize clarity and simplicity, and only up the visual density and detail in places where it matters most. One thing for sure is they will never target realism and prioritize both believability as well as game feel. If you can make me believe I am controlling a bunch of colorful little plant aliens or possessing a frog with my hat, you've won. You don't need 800 godzillaflops to do that, just a game that is fun to look at and play. This is why I was happy the moment I heard the Switch 2 might be able to push PS4 like visuals let alone PS4 Pro, Nintendo doesn't need much to make beautiful games.

I do hope we get much better performance and resolution next gen though lmao
 
Now why are ”we” getting so offended about this, it’s literally an opinion, and it’s literally a perspective. If someone says something’s visually stunning to them, it is visually stunning to them, if someone does not use these as examples of visually stunning it is because they don’t find it visually stunning.

don’t… get hot and bothered by it, it’s not that serious?

FeiFongWong said:
For gaming hermits playing only on ancient switch they may be stunning.
Click to expand...
I managed to chuckle
 
I played TOTK and GOW Ragnarok back to back and I found the former far more visually memorable than the latter despite the vast gulf in hardware performance.
No need to be condescending to other posters or act like this is an even remotely objective subject.
 
Adulfzen said:
I played TOTK and GOW Ragnarok back to back and I found the former far more visually memorable than the latter despite the vast gulf in hardware performance.
No need to be condescending to other posters or act like this is an even remotely objective subject.
Click to expand...
The thing with BOTW and TOTK is that aesthetically they are stunning but at the same time you can also see how the hardware is limiting them.

So, full speed ahead with Nintnedo having more resources to work with.
 
0
Multiverse said:
I’m sorry but I just have to butt in. There are plenty of switch games that are visually stunning. He seems to be the type that sees a piece turd running at 4K to be “visually stunning” methinks. It is quite bothersome because that ad specifically has no intention demeaning the switch. The uploader confirmation bias kicking in really hard.

Also this is a job ad. Y’all want them to be say, please come and work at these crappy looking games? your contribution with shape the OLD generation of games?
Click to expand...
Personally I‘d say one of the few switch games that looks visually stunning while running on a 4K TV at first glance and without looking too closely at background details or aliasing is Mariokart 8 Deluxe. I played the game at quite some parties over the past few years, sometimes with people who never played it before and to this day many think that it has to be a new game.

Otherwise I have to agree that most Switch games look noticeable worse on the big screen often because of rendering at lower resolution, framerate or draw distance.
 
Armoured_Bear said:
Which games would you consider "visually stunning"?
Would you still, in 2023, consider them stunning alongside the likes of Ratchet and Clank, Sackboy's adventures, Horizon:FW etc.?
Click to expand...
...the idea that anyone would suggest Horizon Forbidden West is somehow more visually stunning than Breath of the Wild is baffling to me.

Like, beyond having a more coherent style and a much better sense of scale to the world, Breath of the Wild integrates tech in smart ways, which is way more impressive than raw grunt. In Breath of the Wild, the visuals and gameplay have this perfect synergy. Even shooting stars are but materials to make better your meals or clothing, and that's amazing.

Raw grunt that Forbidden West doesn't really have to begin with, given it's a PS4 game, and it's not like Switch can't do those.

I get we're all excited about new hardware but give Nintendo Switch its dues, Tears of the Kingdom IS one of the best looking games to come out over the last two years.
 
OctoSplattack said:
Dring was the first one say it, but Robinson was among those who echoed the statement.

Click to expand...

I mean. They were right.

Wonder is a big splash in the market, but it's definitely not "big" next to Tears of the Kingdom, Tears of the Kingdom is likely to be the last AMBITIOUS title for Switch.

Wonder is not ambition. Wonder is a return to the mean. Wonder is New Super Mario Bros. 2... 2. That doesn't mean it'll be small, it'll sell well no doubt.

But big? Ambitious? Expensive? Impressive? It is exactly none of those things.
 
Kazuyamishima said:
I don't follow his Twitter but it's just kind of weird to let him be a liar "because twitter" once again to quote the man "For those disappointed with the Skyward Sword remaster, Wind Waker and Twilight Princess are 100% coming this year. So that's at least one good 3D Zelda." 100%
Click to expand...

Again, you're dissecting a tweet as if it's reported journalism. It's not. It has no bearing on his professional work.

"Let him be a liar" is ridiculous. We have completely blurred the line between the published work of people who report on the video game industry professionally and any sort of personal take, informed or not, on personal social media accounts.

Andy, or any other journalist, may or may not share accurate, informed info on his personal twitter. There's an ocean between that and their published work, which is actual reporting.

The deluge of information from industry personalities who are not journalists has made people forget what actual reporting is.

bellydrum said:
You don't have to follow him on Twitter to get annoyed at people posting him here. No need to run defense for him
Click to expand...

You're misunderstanding my point. I'm not running defense for Andy, I'm saying people have forgotten the difference between a Twitter account and published reporting.
 
Last edited:
Everyone who reports on this stuff has gotten things wrong from time to time, "plans change" wouldn't have become a small meme if that wasn't the case. For Andy Robinson he's clearly in a position where he could have some kind of sources and other people who are fairly reliable have backed what he's saying so I don't really see the point of bringing up the past where he's maybe been wrong.
 
ILikeFeet said:
Click to expand...


nicholas-cage-fabulous.gif
 
supmo said:
Click to expand...

Thanks, unfortunately the link does work for me (I'm getting a "sci-hub.se cannot be reached" error).

LiC said:
Looks like this paper contains the quote @Thraktor mentioned, "The robust read disturb and long retention at fresh state makes the SGVC device very suitable for the highly read-intensive memory applications such as game-grade memory."

I read the whole thing despite understanding none of the science. It also discusses how self-refreshing or wear levelling is not needed to maintain reliability even after more extreme read cycle tests than other 3D NAND can withstand. And their "ballpark" figure for the cost of a 125 GB chip is less than $5 (a 1 Tbit chip with cost per GByte less than 4 cents), though that's based on various assumptions about manufacturing costs and the like from 2017.

Some specs:

Capture.png


I don't know how much can be made of this table. The voltages and packaging info look basically the same as current Switch game cards, but I assume those are more or less standard and not done that way on purpose because of the (potential) connection to Nintendo.
Click to expand...

The specs are interesting, but there's probably not a whole lot to read into them. 3.3V/1.8V are standard for NAND chips (although 1.2V is becoming more common now). The interface, if it's a standard x8 configuration, would give 133MB/s, but (a) this was six years ago, (b) given it's a test chip to prove out the technology, the interface may not have any relationship to what they'd use on final hardware, and (c) if they used this on a game card they probably wouldn't use a standard flash interface anyway. The 48TSOP package seems to be commonly used on a variety of Macronix parts. I think they only use 16LGA on Nintendo game cards currently, but it is a reasonably common standard used by other manufacturers.

Dakhil said:
Hopefully this means that the Game Cards specific to Nintendo's new hardware can achieve at least 1 GB/s in sequential read speeds. (I know that sequential read speeds are not as important as random read speeds, but I'm using sequential read speeds since Mike Cerny mentioned sequential read speeds.)
Click to expand...

It's hard to say. They were getting 133MB/s on test chips in 2017 (with all the caveats listed above), so it's probably a reasonably safe assumption that they could hit higher speeds on production chips in 2024, but any number we could come up with would be purely a guess.

I suspect the bigger issue might be the interface between game cards and the console. They currently use an 8-bit wide SPI-style interface, clocked at either 25MHz or 50MHz, providing up to 50MB/s of bandwidth. It's an evolution of the interface they've used going back to the DS, and although it has the benefit of being simple and cheap to implement, it's not something you'd use to hit GB/s speeds. Macronix also use SPI-style interfaces for their serial NAND and NOR products, and the fastest parts they're offering run at 166MHz, with a 200MHz part under development. I haven't found SPI interfaces in use much higher than 200MHz elsewhere, either, although I'll admit I haven't done a particularly thorough search. If Nintendo updated the existing game card interface to run at 200MHz, they'd get 200MB/s, which would be a decent upgrade on the current cards, although still well short of their internal storage (if they actually do use 512GB of internal storage, the slowest 512GB parts hit 1.7GB/s, and even 128GB/256GB UFS 2 would hit a baseline of 850MB/s).

So, if they want game cards much faster than 200MB/s, then they'll need to change the game card interface. Designing a gigabit-level interface from scratch in-house doesn't seem like a sensible use of R&D spending, so they would have to look for an existing standard they can use and potentially modify, and in particularly one which doesn't have per-device license fees. The only two I'm aware of that would suit their needs would be PCIe and M-PHY (the physical interface used by UFS). Both only require a small annual membership fee to the standards organisation and have no further license fees, and both match or exceed Nintendo's required performance and are widely adopted. They'll also continue to be improved with updated specifications for a long time.

If I were to guess, I'd say PCIe is more likely. It's more widely used, and T239 has ample PCIe connectivity. Even a single PCIe 4 lane (4 wires) would give them 2GB/s to work with. It would also allow them to connect the card slot directly to the SoC without any intermediate chips. Because the current Switch card interface is proprietary, it requires a separate chip on the motherboard which translates from eMMC commands from the TX1, and also provides a variety of crypto functionality. If they can move that crypto work onto the SoC, they can eliminate an extra custom IC and save costs.
 
Last edited:
ReddDreadtheLead said:
Now why are ”we” getting so offended about this, it’s literally an opinion, and it’s literally a perspective. If someone says something’s visually stunning to them, it is visually stunning to them, if someone does not use these as examples of visually stunning it is because they don’t find it visually stunning.

don’t… get hot and bothered by it, it’s not that serious?


I managed to chuckle
Click to expand...
Who is getting hot and bothered or even offended?

I didn't see a single post that did this. Lol.

Gotta love how why discussion with disagreement has to result one side telling the other they're getting emotional... For disagreeing...

Some people are content with Nintendo's visuals...
Adulfzen said:
I played TOTK and GOW Ragnarok back to back and I found the former far more visually memorable than the latter despite the vast gulf in hardware performance.
No need to be condescending to other posters or act like this is an even remotely objective subject.
Click to expand...
I personally think Ragnarok looks amazing and I love the art direction in that game funnily enough. Horizon is the more impressive game graphically but I'd much rather look at GoWR.

I am an absolute sucker for the BoTW/ToTK aesthetic so very few games can surpass that for me lol.

I think Ratchet & Clank PS5 looks amazing as well. Probably the best graphical showcase after Forbidden West but with all the charm. Even then, I don't think the stylization is up there with Nintendo's best.

Btw, quick side note: Ive been playing Baldur's Gate 3 for a couple of hours and thinks this looks great. I can 100% see this game on Drake especially since Divinity OS2 came to Switch. I will 100% buy it when that happens XD.
 
SiG said:
I think said people who are used to visual modern games want prestige more than anything. Pikmin is quite visually stunning, but it also has the halmark of Nintendo's rounded aesthetics for its characters, not the typical "edgy" ones like Kratos or whatnot.
Click to expand...
So I've learned that there are only two types of gamers.
1.Nintendo fans who adore cuteness, hate "edgy" (Kirby good, Kratos bad) and love low resolution gaming .
2. Gamers on PC/other consoles who own their platforms for "prestige", don't care about games but love sharp edges and pixel counting.


That's gaming covered it seems.
 
FWIW I adore the look of BOTW (and SS and WW TBH), it's gorgeous but things like the low res rocks are quite jarring nowadays, for non "Nintendo hermits" :)
 
Historia (Caligula 2 and more) made a new UE5 tech demo featuring cloud and AI applications including voice recognition, chatgpt, and voice creation



2023-07-24_15h28_03.png

0e44c054b33e91ffa3eb4f52ec7bf23b.png

historia.co.jp

ChatGPT×UE5、技術デモ「名探偵モカと密室脱出」を発表！"声だけ"でプレイする3D脱出ゲーム｜株式会社ヒストリア

ヒストリアはChatGPTとUnreal Engine 5（以下、UE5）を用いた技術研究、3D脱出ゲーム「名探偵モカと密室脱出」の発表を行いました。また、プレイムービーの公開を行いました。 ゲーム開始からクリアまでを収録したノーカット動画はこちら https://youtu.be/N2uDYZ1PNNM 本作は社内の技術研究として制作されたプロジェクトであり、ゲームとしての一般公開の予定はありま
historia.co.jp
historia.co.jp

「名探偵モカと密室脱出」開発者による見どころ紹介！ ー ChatGPTに任せたゲーム進行と自然な会話の実現方法｜株式会社ヒストリア

ここではChatGPTとUnreal Engine 5を用いた技術デモ「名探偵モカと密室脱出」の詳細な解説を行います。 ゲーム開始からクリアまでを収録したノーカット動画はこちら https://youtu.be/N2uDYZ1PNNM プロジェクトの概要は【こちら】をご覧ください。 ■プロジェクト紹介 『名探偵モカと密室脱出』はChatGPTおよびAzure Cognitive Servicesと
historia.co.jp
 
lexony said:
Personally I‘d say one of the few switch games that looks visually stunning while running on a 4K TV at first glance and without looking too closely at background details or aliasing is Mariokart 8 Deluxe. I played the game at quite some parties over the past few years, sometimes with people who never played it before and to this day many think that it has to be a new game.

Otherwise I have to agree that most Switch games look noticeable worse on the big screen often because of rendering at lower resolution, framerate or draw distance.
Click to expand...
Yeh, MK8 was properly "stunning" for me on Wii U, the lightning makes such a difference and it still looks great, I'm drooling at how good the next game could look.
 
Armoured_Bear said:
Yeh, MK8 was properly "stunning" for me on Wii U, the lightning makes such a difference and it still looks great, I'm drooling at how good the next game could look.
Click to expand...
Me too.
But, in all honesty, what I want the most is crisp 4K 60fps in 3-4 players splitscreen.
If I have that I wouldn't care too much even if it looks less detialed than MK8D.
 
0
Reader mode
You must log in or register to reply here.
Please read this staff post before posting.

Furthermore, according to this follow-up post, all off-topic chat will be moderated.
Last edited:


Back
Top Bottom