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StarTopic Future Nintendo Hardware & Technology Speculation & Discussion |ST| (Read the staff posts before commenting!)

Nintendo should be worried now, a phone can run very demading games natively
At a much higher cost than a console and I don’t care to play games with a touchscreen.

Edit: Yes, you can pair controllers with the phone. Great for those that are interested, for sure, and it is impressive. Just not my cup of tea.
 
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And it'll impact nothing lmao.

I swear so many of these comments are concern trolling. I don't think people understand what the gaming industry looks like on the phone nowadays lmao.
Going to go ahead and put linkURL on /ignore list. To have to reach that point, one would have to repeatedly post bad takes, and show elements of concern trolling.
 
Pretty excited to see Apple taking gaming more seriously. Apple Arcade is a good start before that they almost seems to be against gaming with Metal instead of Vulkan, poor driver, and mediocre hardware.

I think you guys are REALLY underestimating Apple this time. Just rebutting some points I read on this page.

1- "Price". Yes, the iPhone 15 Pro will be at least 2x more expensive than the Switch 2, but that never stopped Apple from selling more iPhones in 1 YEAR than Nintendo has produced Switches since 2017. These phones are already ultra-popular playing mobile games, Having console-level games will only increase its appeal. It's 1200 dollars to take a portable video game + all the functions that iPhones already do today.
2- Smartphones have always been more powerful than the Switch. This is partly true, but until then this power had never been used to its full extent, now we are seeing games that are at console level running on these machines, at least 6 months before Nintendo launches its console that has the biggest selling point (outside the exclusives) would be exactly that.
3- "Controls": iPhone controls better than Joy-con are nothing new.
4- "Battery": perhaps the most dubious factor so far, however the A17 Pro will be produced on a node that we wouldn't even dream of having in Drake, that is, it will be more energy efficient, and with access to fast charging and perhaps even a bigger battery than the one present in the Switch 2.
5- "Temperature": this first interaction will certainly be the A17 Pro's Achilles heel, but what about in 2 or 3 years? We will have an even more powerful and efficient chip.

This will be just the first iteration of an iPhone with access to AAA games, and they still managed to deliver before the launch of the Switch 2. We will see more and more games and with each generation the distance to Nintendo's hardware will increase.
Great masterstroke by Apple that only continues to enrich its ecosystem. Mac, iPhone, iPad and Vision Pro all sharing the same software and same hardware, unfortunately this is not something Nintendo can compete with.

All those factors applied way before the Switch and currently, mobile gaming is far from taking over console gaming.

The phone's power haven't been used to their fullest extent because they are half the Switch size. The Switch battery alone is bigger than half the phone. If you think the Switch is underclocked then phone are basically limping. There's a comparison video of Fortnite on Switch and a mobile phone that demolish the Switch but the Switch comes out ahead or at least much closer than it should on paper. Some optimization played a part but you can only do so much with passive cooling.

Sure, in 3 years, hardware will make up for the drawback but if I wait another 3-4 years, I can get another Switch that will trounce that and the cost for both devices will be the same price as 1 iPhone.
 
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And you're saying that as if taking away those exclusive would threaten Nintendo's existence. It's not that simple either.

As others have repeatedly pointed out, many of us would rather not do our hardcore gaming on our iPhones.
You might not, but today we have a real mobile gaming scenario and it is the fastest growing sector of the gaming industry.
Until then, I always thought it was stupid to play anything other than Sudoku or Clash Royale on a smartphone.
But we didn't have decent software until then, and now that's changing.
Hundreds of millions of people buy iPhones every year, which do you think the majority will prefer? Buy a Switch to play, or just buy a controller and play at least the same third party games, but on a more portable device, with a better screen and with access to simple things like Discord?
 
Can't wait for this

How can a 2008 fan-game (Pokemon Reloaded) still be superior to all the other fan-games trying to make Pokemon into an action game. This fan game has been getting support since then btw even if it has slowed down in recent years, plus even if it’s a Spanish fangame it has English support .
 
Wouldn't stuff like this be more worrying to Sony / MS? The dedicated handheld market has already proven itself to be insulated against the encroachment of "AAA" mobile gaming as there just isn't the appetite - no decent built in controls / phones are needed for other stuff and terrible battery drain from these types of games is a killer / throttling. This isn't a new thing.

I'd be more concerned if I were Sony / MS - a new Apple TV variant, actively cooled with a controller would be cheap and not far off from their own consoles

The fact mobile tech is developing so quick compared to desktop tech - that's a problem for Sony / MS not Nintendo
 
You might not, but today we have a real mobile gaming scenario and it is the fastest growing sector of the gaming industry.
Until then, I always thought it was stupid to play anything other than Sudoku or Clash Royale on a smartphone.
But we didn't have decent software until then, and now that's changing.
Hundreds of millions of people buy iPhones every year, which do you think the majority will prefer? Buy a Switch to play, or just buy a controller and play at least the same third party games, but on a more portable device, with a better screen and with access to simple things like Discord?

This is not a market that has been conditioned to pay premium for games. If its over $10 it's a huge barrier of entry to most ios gamers
 
This has been a real head scratcher for me. Nintendo patented their reconstruction technique back in 2020, Xenoblade Chronicles 3 implemented it reconstructing 540p up to 1080p with impressive results. The only thing I will say about this implementation is it resolves in a softer image than your typical 1080p resolve, but all in all it was solid and certainly much better than FSR 1.0. I was dead certain that Zelda TotK would use it, and I still feel like it should have. They could have rendered at 720p instead of 900p and then reconstructed up to 1080p. Most of the framerate hitches are caused by memory bandwidth limitations, so the lower rendering resolution should have cleaned up those drops. Seeing as how Monolithsoft is very hands on with Zelda development, seems like something that would have been possible to implement. I would assume they have their reasons, but I would be damn curious to know what those reasons are, because I Zelda TotK art style would have played nice with a softer image of higher resolution.
Not to get too off topic, but yeah. Was confused as to why they didn't implement Monolith Soft's reconstruction tech. Imo the artifacting from FSR 1.0 is more distracting than the slighty soft imagine we'd get with MS's solution.
 
Oh, you mean plug-in controllers sold separately? Yeah I can see that being fine to use.

The problem again with this is that people use their phones for other shit, and by and large do not want to be using it to play demanding games. This is a fundamentally untenable barrier to phone gaming encroaching on console gaming.
I don't think that I would actually play Death Stranding on my phone. Though I think it would be cool if games would continue to come to as many platforms as possible and that we are possibly heading to a future where what games are available to you is not necessarily determined by the size, power or the mobility of the hardware you want to own and that without having your device constantly connected to the internet.
 
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Are you a part time troll? You go into multiple topics and make questionable comments that are trollish
Giancarlo is certainly not a troll, you'd see him active often enough in the live chat of big Nintendo YouTuber's channels during their Switch 2, Direct and title speculation streams so he's very enthusiastic about Nintendo overall, just somebody like myself with no real tech background that as a consequence doesn't have the knowledge base to immediately see problems in some sketchy rumours or half-baked speculations and to dismiss the bad comparisons as soon as they're made before they become worrying
 
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This is not a market that has been conditioned to pay premium for games. If its over $10 it's a huge barrier of entry to most ios gamers
Yes, that is definitely an issue.
But millions of players are already used to paying this on their consoles and PCs, it wouldn't be difficult to extend the same to their smartphone.
 
Did we ever get a reason why 505 did the publishing of the pc version? Cause its technically a sony ip right?

I don't know, but it would be great to know because being a Sony IP it was 505Games who distributed the game on PC, impressively even on Gamepass it is possible to play.
 
Sony is the one who's gonna be hit hardest with this.

Xbox has Gamepass, an unbeatable value that just gives you all their exclusives and you're free to buy AAA third party games on the side, and Nintendo will be fine with their suite of exclusives.

Sony has exlusives, but fewer and farther between. 1-2 a year maybe that people consider must buys, but now if you can get those third partys on your Phone or Switch 2, then that's a huge hit for reasons to get a PS5.
 
I think scary that iPhone15Pro uses the world's most advanced 3nm process,
but it is only 10% more powerful CPU and 20% more powerful GPU than 4nm (=5nm) of one generation ago.
It means the moore's law is dead after 3nm makes difficult to develop Switch3.
But it is too early to worry when Switch2 is not released yet...
It's fine. Switch 2 will last 14 years and then we'll have graphene transistors.
 
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Wouldn't stuff like this be more worrying to Sony / MS? The dedicated handheld market has already proven itself to be insulated against the encroachment of "AAA" mobile gaming as there just isn't the appetite - no decent built in controls / phones are needed for other stuff and terrible battery drain from these types of games is a killer / throttling. This isn't a new thing.

I'd be more concerned if I were Sony / MS - a new Apple TV variant, actively cooled with a controller would be cheap and not far off from their own consoles

The fact mobile tech is developing so quick compared to desktop tech - that's a problem for Sony / MS not Nintendo
It's not a threat to any platform holder.

I don't know about most of you here but I cannot possibly imagine dedicating ~50% or more of my phone battery to playing a AAA console game for any period of time.

Why is that? Because I need my phone for many daily purposes.

I need my phone for the 50 school apps that schools insist on using now
I need my phone for authenticator apps
I need my phone for payment apps
I need my phone to check the weather
I need my phone to use the flashlight when I'm looking for stuff in the horrendous tupperware drawer
I need my phone to deposit checks
I need my phone to make payments on bills
I need my phone to order dinner/lunch
I need my phone to text/call my wife
I need my phone to coordinate picking up my kids from their grandparents
I need my phone to open and close my garage
I need my phone to arm/disarm my security system
I need my phone to print documents
I need my phone to take pictures of random stuff I'll need (like recipes/license plates/passwords)
I need my phone to take pictures of my family.
I need my phone to play music while I'm driving the kids so they aren't yelling at me for liking "classic" (ugh) rock



There is no way in hell I will be wasting a large chunk of my battery using my phone to play AAA games when I can just play them on a dedicated device while my phone is free to charge or do whatever else I need it to do.
 
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I think you guys are REALLY underestimating Apple this time. Just rebutting some points I read on this page.

1- "Price". Yes, the iPhone 15 Pro will be at least 2x more expensive than the Switch 2, but that never stopped Apple from selling more iPhones in 1 YEAR than Nintendo has produced Switches since 2017. These phones are already ultra-popular playing mobile games, Having console-level games will only increase its appeal. It's 1200 dollars to take a portable video game + all the functions that iPhones already do today.
2- Smartphones have always been more powerful than the Switch. This is partly true, but until then this power had never been used to its full extent, now we are seeing games that are at console level running on these machines, at least 6 months before Nintendo launches its console that has the biggest selling point (outside the exclusives) would be exactly that.
3- "Controls": iPhone controls better than Joy-con are nothing new.
4- "Battery": perhaps the most dubious factor so far, however the A17 Pro will be produced on a node that we wouldn't even dream of having in Drake, that is, it will be more energy efficient, and with access to fast charging and perhaps even a bigger battery than the one present in the Switch 2.
5- "Temperature": this first interaction will certainly be the A17 Pro's Achilles heel, but what about in 2 or 3 years? We will have an even more powerful and efficient chip.

This will be just the first iteration of an iPhone with access to AAA games, and they still managed to deliver before the launch of the Switch 2. We will see more and more games and with each generation the distance to Nintendo's hardware will increase.
Great masterstroke by Apple that only continues to enrich its ecosystem. Mac, iPhone, iPad and Vision Pro all sharing the same software and same hardware, unfortunately this is not something Nintendo can compete with.
I know many here disagree with me, and that's okay.
My point is that we have reached an unprecedented point in the history of the games industry. As I said before, we're talking about AAA games being released on smartphones in the same year that they were released on consoles and PCs. You can't compare this to OUYA, or any wave of mobile-gaming we've had before.
 
I think it is silly to be taking this Apple stuff seriously. We've literally been hearing about how phones are going to make video game systems obsolete for the last 15 years. There is a reason it hasn't happened.

This also reminds me of all those "Angry Birds are going to be bigger than Mario" articles all those years ago lol.
 
Did we ever get a reason why 505 did the publishing of the pc version? Cause its technically a sony ip right?
At the time DS deal was signed Sony wasn’t releasing games on PC neither planning but one of the must to for Kojima was for a PC version to exist (even if delayed) so they got a 3rd party as part of such a deal to publish it on the platform.
 
I think it is silly to be taking this Apple stuff seriously. We've literally been hearing about how phones are going to make video game systems obsolete for the last 15 years. There is a reason it hasn't happened.

This also reminds me of all those "Angry Birds are going to be bigger than Mario" articles all those years ago lol.
tbf, Angry Birds could have grown much bigger than it did if Rovio didn't just flick the "pure greed" switch.
 
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It's not a threat to any platform holder.

I don't know about most of you here but I cannot possibly imagine dedicating ~50% or more of my phone battery use to playing a AAA console game for any period of time.

Why is that? Because I need my phone for many daily purposes.

I need my phone for the 50 school apps that schools insist on using now
I need my phone for authenticator apps
I need my phone for payment apps
I need my phone to check the weather
I need my phone to use the flashlight when I'm looking for stuff in the horrendous tupperware drawer
I need my phone to deposit checks
I need my phone make payments on bills
I need my phone to order dinner/lunch
I need my phone to text/call my wife
I need my phone to coordinate picking up my kids from their grandparents
I need my phone to open and close my garage
I need my phone to arm/disarm my security system
I need my phone to print documents
I need my phone to take pictures of random stuff I'll need (like recipes/license plates/passwords)
I need my phone to take pictures of my family.
I need my phone to play music while I'm driving the kids so they aren't yelling at me for liking "classic" (ugh) rock



There is no way in hell I will be wasting a large chunk of my battery using my phone to play AAA games when I can just play them on a dedicated device while my phone is free to charge or do whatever else I need it to do.
Yeah, but that's for your Phone.
If Apple expands this to Apple TV.....then suddenly those AAA games are looking far more reasonable.
I think Apple is banking on setting the stage for Apple TV being their primary "console", while iPhones are going to be for taking your games with you on the go for short bursts
 
I think you guys are REALLY underestimating Apple this time. Just rebutting some points I read on this page.

1- "Price". Yes, the iPhone 15 Pro will be at least 2x more expensive than the Switch 2, but that never stopped Apple from selling more iPhones in 1 YEAR than Nintendo has produced Switches since 2017. These phones are already ultra-popular playing mobile games, Having console-level games will only increase its appeal. It's 1200 dollars to take a portable video game + all the functions that iPhones already do today.
2- Smartphones have always been more powerful than the Switch. This is partly true, but until then this power had never been used to its full extent, now we are seeing games that are at console level running on these machines, at least 6 months before Nintendo launches its console that has the biggest selling point (outside the exclusives) would be exactly that.
3- "Controls": iPhone controls better than Joy-con are nothing new.
4- "Battery": perhaps the most dubious factor so far, however the A17 Pro will be produced on a node that we wouldn't even dream of having in Drake, that is, it will be more energy efficient, and with access to fast charging and perhaps even a bigger battery than the one present in the Switch 2.
5- "Temperature": this first interaction will certainly be the A17 Pro's Achilles heel, but what about in 2 or 3 years? We will have an even more powerful and efficient chip.

This will be just the first iteration of an iPhone with access to AAA games, and they still managed to deliver before the launch of the Switch 2. We will see more and more games and with each generation the distance to Nintendo's hardware will increase.
Great masterstroke by Apple that only continues to enrich its ecosystem. Mac, iPhone, iPad and Vision Pro all sharing the same software and same hardware, unfortunately this is not something Nintendo can compete with.

giphy.gif
 
It's not a threat to any platform holder.

I don't know about most of you here but I cannot possibly imagine dedicating ~50% or more of my phone battery use to playing a AAA console game for any period of time.

Why is that? Because I need my phone for many daily purposes.

I need my phone for the 50 school apps that schools insist on using now
I need my phone for authenticator apps
I need my phone for payment apps
I need my phone to check the weather
I need my phone to use the flashlight when I'm looking for stuff in the horrendous tupperware drawer
I need my phone to deposit checks
I need my phone make payments on bills
I need my phone to order dinner/lunch
I need my phone to text/call my wife
I need my phone to coordinate picking up my kids from their grandparents
I need my phone to open and close my garage
I need my phone to arm/disarm my security system
I need my phone to print documents
I need my phone to take pictures of random stuff I'll need (like recipes/license plates/passwords)
I need my phone to take pictures of my family.
I need my phone to play music while I'm driving the kids so they aren't yelling at me for liking "classic" (ugh) rock



There is no way in hell I will be wasting a large chunk of my battery using my phone to play AAA games when I can just play them on a dedicated device while my phone is free to charge or do whatever else I need it to do.
In fact I usually use my phone to another stuff WHILE playing games.
 
Thinking the new iPhone running AAA games will hurt the next Switch is like thinking phones of the 2000s running PS2 games will hurt the DS or PSP. The average iPhone user is not spending the premium price of an AAA game on the Apple Store. The people that would be swayed from this probably don’t even make up a notable percentage of the Switch’s playerbase.
 
Yeah, but that's for your Phone.
If Apple expands this to Apple TV.....then suddenly those AAA games are looking far more reasonable.
I think Apple is banking on setting the stage for Apple TV being their primary "console", while iPhones are going to be for taking your games with you on the go for short bursts
Well yeah if it's a different device that's an entirely different story.
 
I think scary that iPhone15Pro uses the world's most advanced 3nm process,
but it is only 10% more powerful CPU and 20% more powerful GPU than 4nm (=5nm) of one generation ago.
It means the moore's law is dead after 3nm makes difficult to develop Switch3.
But it is too early to worry when Switch2 is not released yet...
Between 1 to 2nm is around the functional limit apparently, just a bit below that point it becomes almost impossible to ensure a stable electron flow and prevent jumping to other components, 2nm is anticipated to be an industry standard within the next few years anyway, so on the table for Switch 3 since we're talking a 2030 release year at least
 
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Apple should be focusing on making Mac gaming a thing instead of 4 ports on iPhone, the biggest issue for such a thing to work is that not only phone is a market that refuses to pay for games but also that unless Apple pays for it, ports don’t happen.
 
Its just the normal ''Nintendo doomed'' discourse. I mean in the recent years alone everything from the Steam deck to the ROG Ally have been proclaimed as a Switch killer that will end Nintendo. Meanwhile the Switch will sell 15 million units in its 7th year not to mention millions upon millions of software sales in this fiscal year alone. Now this new Iphone is the latest supposed Switch killer.

Some people are just desperate for Nintendo to leave the hardware market and become a third party developer like Sega did previously so they have to conjure up different Nintendo killers every year to make that dream a reality.

Will this Iphone be a better fit for parents to buy as a christmas present to their 10-year old kid over a Switch 2? If not, then its not a Switch 2 killer, just like the steam deck was never a Switch killer.

And if Nintendo were to ever be short on cash in the future nothing prevents them from crapping out a ton of Gacha mobile games with popular Nintendo IPs to survive permanently as a rich company anyway, so any hope of seeing Nintendo´s imminent doom is futile.
 
It also remains to be seen if these games will come to the platform outside of these big Apple events where they are paying the publishers to put games on.

They need to come to the platform organically for it to take off. If it’s just once a year at these events, then it’s not serious
 
If apple would actually place ANY kind of focus on gaming I might be worried... but they haven't and the likely will not. You don't see an apple designed controller do you? Even their VR headset has 0 gaming focus (and no controllers!) So... until and unless that changes please keep apple out this thread yaw, it's really off topic imo.
 
I know many here disagree with me, and that's okay.
My point is that we have reached an unprecedented point in the history of the games industry. As I said before, we're talking about AAA games being released on smartphones in the same year that they were released on consoles and PCs. You can't compare this to OUYA, or any wave of mobile-gaming we've had before.
Just a reminder, but PCs have been through this. For decades it was a separate market, extremely marked by piracy, and with niche games that took advantage of the exclusive control forms of PCs (mouse and keyboard).
Until it became common for console games to be released on PC, and today millions of players have put their consoles aside and play exclusively on PC.
 
Thinking the new iPhone running AAA games will hurt the next Switch is like thinking phones of the 2000s running PS2 games will hurt the DS or PSP. The average iPhone user is not spending the premium price of an AAA game on the Apple Store. The people that would be swayed from this probably don’t even make up a notable percentage of the Switch’s playerbase.
Well, to be honest, the main reason 3DS + Vita don't sell half as much as DS + PSP is precisely because of the advent of mobile gaming, so yes, the iPhone was a problem for them.
 
Are we seriously comparing iPhones to Switch 2 now

It's two different ways of playing, no one will really play AC:Mirage or Death Stranding on a 6" Screen with no real controller except at the toilet.

The only threat is that Raytracing and AI Upscaling just got mainstreamed by Apple, and Nintendo better not come too late to the party.

That's why we getting a reveal soon
Apple's announcements today, whilst impressive, have no relevance to Nintendo. They are still very separate audiences and has no affect against when a Switch 2 is going to be revealed.
 
Let's be real, announcing RE8 for phones is literally just for marketing. Nobody is actually going to buy it. Apple knows that, and Capcom probably knows it too, so I wouldn't be surprised if Apple funded the port as an advertising expenditure.
 
1- "Price". Yes, the iPhone 15 Pro will be at least 2x more expensive than the Switch 2, but that never stopped Apple from selling more iPhones in 1 YEAR than Nintendo has produced Switches since 2017.
Everyone needs a phone.

If the argument is that 'a ton of people have an iPhone, therefore porting these games threatens the Switch cause it reaches a wider audience', phones have become an essential tool and battery life is too precious to expend on AAA gaming for most people.

The most appealing phone game I've ever played is Vampire Survivors 'cause I can waste time when I'm bored playing one-handed and I don't need to worry about battery consumption.

Even at home when my phone's battery is less of a concern, I prefer to use it in small tasks and even during gaming off to the side.
Is the iPhone 15 pro even capable of running a switch 2 emulator?
The GBA was emulated 6 months before release
Emulating a system usually requires more power than that system itself and grows more complex depending on the system's architecture and features, and I can't imagine how emulating a feature like DLSS would work. The Switch 2 is estimated to be PS4+ power. I am skeptical the iPhone 15 Pro has the necessary specs to emulate it or that developers will even sweat the effort to code an emulator. At best maybe some 2D games, which is the current status of PS4 emulation.
 
Apple should be focusing on making Mac gaming a thing instead of 4 ports on iPhone, the biggest issue for such a thing to work is that not only phone is a market that refuses to pay for games but also that unless Apple pays for it, ports don’t happen.
But that's exactly what Apple is doing, today it's trivial to port any software between iOS and MacOS, same architecture, same API, everything is already connected.
 
It's not a threat to any platform holder.

I don't know about most of you here but I cannot possibly imagine dedicating ~50% or more of my phone battery to playing a AAA console game for any period of time.

Why is that? Because I need my phone for many daily purposes.

I need my phone for the 50 school apps that schools insist on using now
I need my phone for authenticator apps
I need my phone for payment apps
I need my phone to check the weather
I need my phone to use the flashlight when I'm looking for stuff in the horrendous tupperware drawer
I need my phone to deposit checks
I need my phone to make payments on bills
I need my phone to order dinner/lunch
I need my phone to text/call my wife
I need my phone to coordinate picking up my kids from their grandparents
I need my phone to open and close my garage
I need my phone to arm/disarm my security system
I need my phone to print documents
I need my phone to take pictures of random stuff I'll need (like recipes/license plates/passwords)
I need my phone to take pictures of my family.
I need my phone to play music while I'm driving the kids so they aren't yelling at me for liking "classic" (ugh) rock



There is no way in hell I will be wasting a large chunk of my battery using my phone to play AAA games when I can just play them on a dedicated device while my phone is free to charge or do whatever else I need it to do.

Lol your point has absolutely zero to do with my post so why you quoting it? What would battery drain / using your phone for other stuff have to do with a theoretical console like Apple TV device?
 
Lol your point has absolutely zero to do with my post so why you quoting it? What would battery drain / using your phone for other stuff have to do with a theoretical console like Apple TV device?
Sorry, I was more using your post as a jumping off point. You seemed to indicate that iPhones getting these games should be worrying to MS/Sony, not a theoretical Apple TV getting them.

I don't think the phones having these games has any bearing on any console makers.
 
my iPhone runs extremely hot when I’m flicking between a couple of apps constantly for half an hour, what the hell is it gonna do if I run RE4? explode?
 
Apple TV is pretty appealing ngl. Saw a demo of one at the Apple Store running Dead Cells and Rayman with a Dualshock 4 hooked up. Teeny little box.

Switch 2 still seems like a more appealing product cause I have the option to, uh, Switch. And Nintendo games.

But if you have zero interest in either of those things then an Apple TV that could play some current-gen titles could be a serious option vs. other consoles. Depending on the price.
 
Please read this staff post before posting.

Furthermore, according to this follow-up post, all off-topic chat will be moderated.
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