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StarTopic Future Nintendo Hardware & Technology Speculation & Discussion |ST| (Read the staff posts before commenting!)

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Dark Cloud said:
Always fun to get my hopes up from online people only to see I was misled again
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The funny thing is that the more plausible outcome is a better outcome than what this fake rumor posited


Micro-mesh sdk is out. The presentation is in 6 hours, so I'll miss it. But I'll watch it when I wake up

github.com

GitHub - NVIDIAGameWorks/Displacement-MicroMap-Toolkit

Contribute to NVIDIAGameWorks/Displacement-MicroMap-Toolkit development by creating an account on GitHub.
github.com github.com
 
I have an exclusive leak that corroborates this.

My friend is a janitor that works for NOJ and he told me that he found the Drake design documents in the trash. He later heard a drunk Miyamoto exclaim something about "Always Online 5G Cloud gaming" and a "return to PowerPC", whatever that means.

Trust me guys.
 
SoldierDelta said:
It's actually impressive how behind Nintendo is on specific QoL features for their device. That's the punishment for living in the 6th and 7th generation for 20 years total, I guess.
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Yep.
oldpuck said:
I don't think Vivox is solving the problem you think it's solving. Vivox provides a single standard solution for integrating voice chat into a game, and for making friend's lists work across the platform. It doesn't matter how good Nintendo's own solution is, that problem would still exist for developers. It's a problem that only a 3rd party could ever solve.
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The problem is that a solution even has to be provided.
 
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chocolate_supra said:
Also forgive my ignorance, but is T239 considered part of the Tegra line? I haven't heard of anything being referred to as "Tegra" post-X2.

So I mean... if that person is right and Tegra has been dropped, could that mean Mariko has ended production in preparation for Drake to ramp up or..?
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For whatever reason, Nvidia has been dropping some of the product names that they used to use, like Tegra, Quadro, and Titan, in favor of a more codename and number focused approach.
 
That account seemed sketchy, but the idea of 5LPP isn't so strange anyway. @Z0m3le makes a good case that the clocks that were found would match with the 5LPP process. If they somewhere else, it's even better. Assuming they don't do 8nm (but for that process a 12SM chip would be gigantic and likely unrealistic imo).

This topic hasn't been discussed for a while I believe: what are big-N's options for expandable storage? Even assuming eMMC stays, that would give them 400 MB/s that they will be able to utilise this time around. Has any SD card format caught up to this read speed level at an affordable cost?

ItWasMeantToBe19 said:
How much would 256 GBs of UFS 4.0 storage cost for Nintendo to add in the Switch 2.
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I think UFS4 is overkill compared to UFS3. I don't know about the cost, but if there is a way for them to get 512GB of UFS3 for the same price as 256GB of UFS4, then the former seems like a much better deal. The XSS SSD read speed won't be the baseline for read speed for many years considering game devs tend to support older PCs for a very long while, so matching or surpassing the 2.4 GB/s is not a priority I feel. The 1.45 GB/s of UFS3 seems more than adequate, and should allow for very rapid loading as well.
 
Ashee said:
i was talking to a friend about the rumors of Drake and he brought up this patent for VR. I know there was talk here about Nintendo not going the VR route as a new "feature" but maybe it will see the light?
Nintendo-VR-Patent.jpg
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I'm not saying I would, but slap some Wario Ware on that mess (VRio Ware? Wario VRware?) and I'm in.

Especially if 9-Volt has some full-color microgames showing what could be.
 
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TLZ said:
Hi people. Whats this rumoured 5LPP tweeted by a Korean guy about? I just saw it in my news feed.
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Someone with no cited track record talking about Drake nodes. Then they claimed it wasn't happening. Are being fairly flip floppy about the subject.
 
ItWasMeantToBe19 said:
PS4 at 720p in handheld mode and PS4 at 1080p HDR with DLSS to 4K in docked mode is near the upper end of my expectations.

I have no belief whatsoever it will come even slightly close to the Series S.
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That would position the next Switch comparatively lower than the first switch was on release. Indeed, the the current model is more powerful than a PS3 both in handheld and docked mode.

It's not impossible, but it's certainly unlikely considering that:
1. mobile technology has advanced faster in the past years
2. Nintendo is using a bespoke chip rather than an off the shelves one.
3. A 12 SMs chip will have a performance floor likely higher than a PS4 in any case.
4. Nvidia has a significant advantage over AMD when it comes to rtx along with the trump card that DLSS is.
 
To entertain this rumor Atlan was canceled, and since Drake would have been bundled into some sort of package deal (supposedly on the same node) they'll all start fresh with something Thor-based 18 months down the line? Hmm, I could see an entire chip manufacturing line being scrapped due to delays if something more promising is further along than initially expected, especially if we're talking about a dead-end node here. Seems to jibe with Nate's info, unless ninjas gave everyone a script.
 
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Feels like the more u talk about random rumors, the more the console will be held by Nintendo at this point
 
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If [REDACTED] is cancelled and the Switch is to run until 2027, it is extremely odd that Creatures and Game Freak are recruiting staff for the next generation. (Creatures clearly says next gen hardware).

...gen10 is for PS5, Xbox Series and PC? This is shocking.
 
ReddDreadtheLead said:
Absolutely zero.
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davonne-rogers-pretends-to-be-shocked.gif




Let me expand upon this, there was no reason to blindly believe a random account on the Internet that was making claims as though it was real or accurate. We have a tendency to believe here what we want to believe to suit our own biases.

When this account first came up, the first thing that we should’ve done was not believe instantly that they’re reliable just because someone else said they’re reliable and just because they said a few things, what is it that makes them reliable? This person says a lot of things. If someone said that they checked their account at least a couple of times that made them reliable, they should’ve posted what made them believe that they are reliable, because 9 times out of 10, you need a third fourth or maybe a 50th different opinion on this matter before you conclude something is at all reliable. Seriously, we went off of an Era post claiming that they are reliable to conclude “yeah they’re reliable” among other things.

I’m not trying to dissuade on the speculation, I actually encourage it, but can we not just blindly believe anything on the Internet? There’s literally a whole meme about people going on the Internet to say lies, and this person is literally no one that’s relevant.

If even the most reliable Leaker of Nvidia has not commented on this, and they basically know everything that goes on in Nvidia, that should’ve thrown some red flags in your head that something isn’t right or somethings not clicking, right?


That is my two cents with respect to this.





Are we really forgetting that WaddleDeeKnows was a thing???
 
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majimazio said:
If [REDACTED] is cancelled and the Switch is to run until 2027, it is extremely odd that Creatures and Game Freak are recruiting staff for the next generation. (Creatures clearly says next gen hardware).

...gen10 is for PS5, Xbox Series and PC? This is shocking.
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You do realize next generation could mean Gen 10 as well, right?
Never read things into PR statements or recruitment ads.
 
I was thinking Nintendo can attemp VR as an add on similar to PSVR. But the difference would be it being wireless. Basically the Switch would be docked into the headset itself. Using the Switch battery and chip to power the headset. The Joycons can be used as controllers too. So the only cost would be the headset, lenses, and outer cameras. It would be more a Quest competitor rather than a PSVR2 in terms of pricing. Obviously it wouldn't be dirt cheap but they can undercut Quest 3 and PSVR2 price as they do not need to bundle controllers like PSVR2 or include a chip and battery like Quest.

Then you also have the Nintendo exclusive you can't get on PSVR2 and Quest. Imagine Mario Kart VR, WarioWare VR, Wii Sports VR, Zelda VR and etc.
 
I... I find very exciting the idea of Drake being cancelled lol. Not because I wouldn't love a new Switch, but the idea of not knowing absolutely anything about the next gen Nintendo console brings back my beloved wild speculation (and hope for a powerful home console too...)
 
stodesign12 said:
I... I find very exciting the idea of Drake being cancelled lol. Not because I wouldn't love a new Switch, but the idea of not knowing absolutely anything about the next gen Nintendo console brings back my beloved wild speculation (and hope for a powerful home console too...)
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Nintendo making an x86 box would be limited by their own development capacity

they'd have the worst looking games on their own system
 
Dakhil said:
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There is something strange. Why are they talking about Atlan/Thor? What does it have to do with Drake being cancelled or being 5nm? To me, they are either making up things or mixing up Drake with Atlan which we know was cancelled for Thor.
To give them benefit of doubt, maybe Drake and Atlan were on the same process node(5nm LPP) and Atlan got canned for Thor on 4N or better, and they mixed things up.



They also added this. I used Google Translate but I have no idea what they are talking about. They are really really sketchy.
 
majimazio said:
If [REDACTED] is cancelled and the Switch is to run until 2027, it is extremely odd that Creatures and Game Freak are recruiting staff for the next generation. (Creatures clearly says next gen hardware).

...gen10 is for PS5, Xbox Series and PC? This is shocking.
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I'm pretty sure OG Switch is Game Freak's next-gen. \s (kinda)

IMO, Nintendo not releasing new hardware within the next 18 months is like Apple not releasing a new iPhone for 2-3 years and let revenue fall down a cliff. It's the kind of mismanagement that can oust the whole board.

A lot of doom here because of one random tweet.
 
LukasManak22 said:
plus it would forever hurt their creative process. So, we made this box just like everyone else, please buy it.
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Can't see why. At the end of the day, it's the game catalog what makes a Nintendo system special, plus the gimmicky controls if the mass market ends up liking them. Obviously, the home console wouldn't rule out another hybrid or a fully portable system running the same games (assuming we don't know anything about the CPU).
 
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KMStwo said:
There is something strange. Why are they talking about Atlan/Thor? What does it have to do with Drake being cancelled or being 5nm? To me, they are either making up things or mixing up Drake with Atlan which we know was cancelled for Thor.
To give them benefit of doubt, maybe Drake and Atlan were on the same process node(5nm LPP) and Atlan got canned for Thor on 4N or better, and they mixed things up.



They also added this. I used Google Translate but I have no idea what they are talking about. They are really really sketchy.
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🥱
 
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Let's see where we are, I'm seeing a lot of information that is starting to get confusing. That person from Korea says that Nvidia no longer manufactures the chip at 5nm, so it will be a disappointment I guess right?
What situation are we in?
What are the possibilities of what is to come?
What performance could it get?
Please put me in a situation because since yesterday when the person from Korea appeared I am very confused.

Thank you.
 


last reply is "I will check this info. Thanks."
I cant believe someone that drops this type of bomb and has to check more when they present info that refutes it
 
KMStwo said:
There is something strange. Why are they talking about Atlan/Thor? What does it have to do with Drake being cancelled or being 5nm? To me, they are either making up things or mixing up Drake with Atlan which we know was cancelled for Thor.
To give them benefit of doubt, maybe Drake and Atlan were on the same process node(5nm LPP) and Atlan got canned for Thor on 4N or better, and they mixed things up.



They also added this. I used Google Translate but I have no idea what they are talking about. They are really really sketchy.
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What if their source was taken down by Nintendo Ninjas?
 
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stodesign12 said:
I... I find very exciting the idea of Drake being cancelled lol. Not because I wouldn't love a new Switch, but the idea of not knowing absolutely anything about the next gen Nintendo console brings back my beloved wild speculation (and hope for a powerful home console too...)
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I think Nintendo would like to keep it that way (even if the successor is just around the corner), all because of...
 
As crazy as it sounds, from the way the Korean guy writes, I do believe he has information about Samsung's production line, but it's outdated and way out of context.
 
Onizuka said:
Let's see where we are, I'm seeing a lot of information that is starting to get confusing. That person from Korea says that Nvidia no longer manufactures the chip at 5nm, so it will be a disappointment I guess right?
What situation are we in?
What are the possibilities of what is to come?
What performance could it get?
Please put me in a situation because since yesterday when the person from Korea appeared I am very confused.

Thank you.
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  • samsung 5nm is only a disappointment if you wanted tsmc 4nm, but it doesn't change expected performance, which is all we should be caring about anyway
  • the situation is no different than before this (fake) rumor
  • no different possibilities
  • no difference in expected performance
this twitter user threw out a bunch of shit that can't be verified and shit that has nothing to do with drake in an attempt to create a connection where there was none. disregard all of their posts unless someone more reputable corroborates their shit
 
TLZ said:
So is this 5LPP rumour fake?
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No. He gives a second rumor that it was canceled recently. I talked with him directly and basically Drake is/was 5LPP, but the place where he got the info, the info for it disappeared, which he assumes means it was canceled.

From the public Linux info, we know that isn't the case, and he was unaware of the Linux kernel updates for the chip, as well as Nvidia's Hack info related to the chip. It simply disappeared from wherever he sourced the information when he went back to get more info. He is a big Samsung leaker, it wouldn't surprise me if Samsung saw the tweet and cleaned up the Tegra line info he was reading from (this last part on his source is my speculation, but he mentioned that the chip "seems" to be canceled, alongside the canceled Atlan, mentioning Thor... 3 Tegra chips, likely his source is a Tegra list of some sort.
 
Onizuka said:
Let's see where we are, I'm seeing a lot of information that is starting to get confusing. That person from Korea says that Nvidia no longer manufactures the chip at 5nm, so it will be a disappointment I guess right?
What situation are we in?
What are the possibilities of what is to come?
What performance could it get?
Please put me in a situation because since yesterday when the person from Korea appeared I am very confused.

Thank you.
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There is nothing new happening. There's no real reason to assume the person claiming it was 5nm in the first place has that sort of info.

Check the OP for updates, as of now nothing has really changed.
 
Z0m3le said:
No. He gives a second rumor that it was canceled recently. I talked with him directly and basically Drake is/was 5LPP, but the place where he got the info, the info for it disappeared, which he assumes means it was canceled.

From the public Linux info, we know that isn't the case, and he was unaware of the Linux kernel updates for the chip, as well as Nvidia's Hack info related to the chip. It simply disappeared from wherever he sourced the information when he went back to get more info. He is a big Samsung leaker, it wouldn't surprise me if Samsung saw the tweet and cleaned up the Tegra line info he was reading from (this last part on his source is my speculation, but he mentioned that the chip "seems" to be canceled, alongside the canceled Atlan, mentioning Thor... 3 Tegra chips, likely his source is a Tegra list of some sort.
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I have to admit, I’ve been periodically refreshing to see if you responded to this:
 
LiC said:
I really don't want to get into process node posting, but either this chart's numbers are wrong, or the entire discussion where "Orin's power consumption is bad on 8nm and we need to move to at least 5nm for it to be better" has been foundationally flawed. It's not clear to me which node Orin's 8N is based on, but let's assume it's 8LPP for now. According to this chart, 8LPU offers a whopping 60% reduction in power consumption over 8LPP. That already makes it better than 5LPP! 5LPP would have 46.8% the power consumption of 10LPP, as you calculated, while 8LPU would have only 36% of 10LPP. 8LPA would be even better at 30.6% of 10LPP.

According to the other Samsung chart in this post, 8LPU is the direct evolution of 8LPP. So if T239 needed to move off 8N/8LPP to improve power consumption, why would they make the more expensive and difficult jump to branch of the family with 5LPP, even though 5LPP is less efficient than the directly available 8LPU? If 8N is actually based on 8LPU instead (which this article claims is the case), then this would make even less than zero sense, since moving from 8N/8LPU to 5LPP would actually result in a less power efficient chip than if they had just stuck with what Orin was already using.

If we believe the chart, the first possible node that would result in power savings compared to 8LPU would be 4LPP, at 25.2% of 10LPP's power consumption. Although, that's if you even trust that number, since it's based on Samsung's claim from sometime last year about a node that didn't exist then and possibly still doesn't exist today.

So I'm wondering if this chart is just totally wrong. It seems to be based entirely on Samsung's marketing claims and I don't see an indication that any testing was done to verify it.

I feel the need to state explicitly that even if the numbers are all accurate, none of this means a worse performing node is going to be used. It would just mean the 5nm rumor is wrong, and things go back to being between Samsung 8nm (though potentially a significantly better 8nm than Orin uses) and TSMC. And with that, I will try to again start ignoring process node discussions because I really just don't care.
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Orin is listed as using 8LPP. 8LPU doesn't exist, it was canceled. As I mentioned this chart posted by Zedark is advertised numbers, and that they are rough estimates, there is also too many factors in designing a chip, to actually have every chip made on 2 different nodes, hit these exact efficiency differences. We do have a tool Nvidia uses for Orin power consumption estimations, and we also know TSMC 4N is a lot better than half the power consumption, so the closest node for the DLSS test's naming to relate to the clocks (which is up to some debate, though I don't think it makes any other sense) is Samsung 5nm process nodes.

Also, just for the record, the leaker never back tracked on 5LPP, he simply said that it "seems" to be canceled. He also mentioned that the chip simply "disappeared" from wherever he got the info.
kvetcha said:
I have to admit, I’ve been periodically refreshing to see if you responded to this:
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He is already discrediting NVN2 info, which only uses T210, T214 and T239. LiC is the only person I know who has directly seen the info, so I'm second handing the information here, but Kopite7 also confirmed it was T239.
 
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