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StarTopic Future Nintendo Hardware & Technology Speculation & Discussion |ST| (Read the staff posts before commenting!)

I expect that future Nintendo games will run at 720p-1080p and DLSS to 4k. I do not expect a single game on this device to deliver a "native" non-DLSSed 4k image.

I hope that Nintendo includes a "4k mode" for legacy games on the device. TVs do awful upscaling of video game content, because their upscaling strategies are for movies (I don't like them there either) - doing a simple linear upscale of the image in real time when on UHD TVs would make them look so much better without having to screw with TV settings, and it isn't like the device doesn't have power to spare when running classic switch games.
you mean nearest neighbor? yeah, since many TVs dont even support that (whyyyy), it would be nice if they have the option.
But i would prefere to have an AI scaler as well as an option. and please, have some game by game options and more filters.

I know, sounds complicated, but say:
this game i want with a blue light filter, and and NN ubscaling
this one i dont want upscaled at all
this one needs this controller profile, and NN

you just need a subselection in the quick settings menue or in the details about the game.

its not that hard, when playing old switch games that are not patched for the new hardware, the power should be more then enough,
and for controller mapping and filters --- the current switch does that already, only you cant do it on a game to game basis and its hidden far away in the menu.

Oh, and "not a single"... stuff like wario ware, many indies, animal crossing, Smash is even 1080 on the base switch with 60fps, tropical freeze, toad treasure tracker, mario kart 8... all 1080 already on switch. I feel there will be some. I asume many will be 2k and then DLSSed up to 4k.
Heck, evene the Wii U had a handfull of 1080 games.
 
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3DS never overtook DS's install base, but eventually the majority of games were made for 3DS anyway. If games not possible on the old hardware have enough appeal, software sales for the old device will dwindle as has always happened.
3DS wasn't a revision. DS sales were a trickle, moving software over exclusively to the 3DS was necessary to sell hardware, and the excitement of a "new" experience.

A revision is the opposite, you're hoping that the existing library is enough to sell new hardware, before sales are trickling off. If, in 2 years, Nintendo moves development exclusively to the new device, they'll be trying to pump up hardware with new software, but without the power of new hardware launching behind it, while cutting off the majority of their install base behind them.

If Nintendo wants to do like phones do, then development will never be exclusive for this device. At best, we will get a long cross gen period, and then a THIRD switch, and games with run on both New Switch and it's followup, constantly rolling forward.
 
What i hate to see is something like this;

Leaks point to need hardware coming

Nintendo reveals Switch OLED lite launching later this year

Nothing else to announce
No new console in development

So we'll be spending the rest of the year in speculation purgatory again
The difference this year is that we don't really have anything pointing to an alternate scenario this time. Last year, Switch OLED was always a somewhat known quantity, it was just assumed to be just an internal prototype like Calcio and Copper. This year, there's absolutely nothing suggesting new Mariko hardware is coming aside from idle speculation from people who have convinced themselves Drake can't possibly be close.
 
The difference this year is that we don't really have anything pointing to an alternate scenario this time. Last year, Switch OLED was always a somewhat known quantity, it was just assumed to be just an internal prototype like Calcio and Copper. This year, there's absolutely nothing suggesting new Mariko hardware is coming aside from idle speculation from people who have convinced themselves Drake can't possibly be close.
Eh...wait... isnt that revisionism, or do i miss something here? I thought the narative was that nobody expected a just oled switch, but it was "the 4k switch will maybe have an oled screen, they are testing it" or something like that?

3DS never overtook DS's install base, but eventually the majority of games were made for 3DS anyway. If games not possible on the old hardware have enough appeal, software sales for the old device will dwindle as has always happened.
... dont ignore the tank in software sales because R4 flashc ards where everywhere. There was no chance to keep the DS an atractive platform.
Its always a big factor in why developers move on, except for some causal stuff (just dance, fifa).
 
Eh...wait... isnt that revisionism, or do i miss something here? I thought the narative was that nobody expected a just oled switch, but it was "the 4k switch will maybe have an oled screen, they are testing it" or something like that?
There was always the chance of just what we got but people just prefered to ignore it and try to come with explanations of why that couldn't happen.
... dont ignore the tank in software sales because R4 flashc ards where everywhere. There was no chance to keep the DS an atractive platform.
Its always a big factor in why developers move on, except for some causal stuff (just dance, fifa).
This was an issue in the West especially in Europe, but in Japan it wasn't and software sales were still really healthy when DS support was dropped.
 
Introducing new ways to play has always been part of Nintendo's DNA. As a successor, simply having better graphics/specs isn't going to cut it, especially when competitors already have more powerful hardware out in the market.

They need to have a differenciator between the old Switch and this new one. The new Switch introduced tabletop mode, the JoyCon idea (controllers that can split into two) in addition to HD Rumble and its hybrid design. A successor will similarly need to be disruptive instead of just giving us the "same ol' Switch but with better graphics and 4k support".

So yeah, I disagree that it will just have to be a Switch with 4k support. It will have to be something other than (just) a Switch. The gimmicks will be centered around, but won't impede/interfere with more traditional ways to enjoy games. Nintendo was able to experiment with Labo, Ring Fit Adventure, and now Nintendo Switch Sports. I am predicting they will keep adding-on to the ideas of modular functionality.
You can come up with "new ways to play" without changing anything about the current hardware proposition. I don't think this conception of Nintendo's philosophy is accurate, where something as unique and successful as the current Switch couldn't be followed up with largely more of the same. Moreover, with Furukawa repeatedly insisting that we're halfway through the Switch's life cycle, why should we expect that the next model will differ significantly? Whether you call it a revision or successor or not, unless they wait until 2027 to release it, then straight from the horse's mouth it's going to be considered a Switch and will therefore have the hardware proposition of the Switch.
 
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3DS wasn't a revision. DS sales were a trickle, moving software over exclusively to the 3DS was necessary to sell hardware, and the excitement of a "new" experience.

A revision is the opposite, you're hoping that the existing library is enough to sell new hardware, before sales are trickling off. If, in 2 years, Nintendo moves development exclusively to the new device, they'll be trying to pump up hardware with new software, but without the power of new hardware launching behind it, while cutting off the majority of their install base behind them.

If Nintendo wants to do like phones do, then development will never be exclusive for this device. At best, we will get a long cross gen period, and then a THIRD switch, and games with run on both New Switch and it's followup, constantly rolling forward.
Unless Nintendo speeds up their refresh cycle (certainly a possibility with Atlan coming in a few years and the traditional "Pro" approach seemingly not really working out for them this gen), I don't think it's realistic that they make it all the way to Switch 3 before releasing an exclusive game. If they've got a new hardware feature they want to flex, it could even happen as soon as launch. Failing that, though, at some point (probably by the time they get an upgraded Lite out) it's probably going to be more beneficial to them to incentivize upgrades than to keep selling to Switch 1 owners, at least for some of their games.

Eh...wait... isnt that revisionism, or do i miss something here? I thought the narative was that nobody expected a just oled switch, but it was "the 4k switch will maybe have an oled screen, they are testing it" or something like that?
Switch OLED is the "Aula" that showed up in firmware in 2020. The chances of it being a retail product were largely dismissed, but they were always there.
 
Eh...wait... isnt that revisionism, or do i miss something here? I thought the narative was that nobody expected a just oled switch, but it was "the 4k switch will maybe have an oled screen, they are testing it" or something like that?
What he means is that the OLED model was actually a known factor, for well over a year at the time. It was datamined in April 2020, people just weren't sure it would actually ever release since several other datamined models never did.
 
There was always the chance of just what we got but people just prefered to ignore it and try to come with explanations of why that couldn't happen.

This was an issue in the West especially in Europe, but in Japan it wasn't and software sales were still really healthy when DS support was dropped.

Unless Nintendo speeds up their refresh cycle (certainly a possibility with Atlan coming in a few years and the traditional "Pro" approach seemingly not really working out for them this gen), I don't think it's realistic that they make it all the way to Switch 3 before releasing an exclusive game. If they've got a new hardware feature they want to flex, it could even happen as soon as launch. Failing that, though, at some point (probably by the time they get an upgraded Lite out) it's probably going to be more beneficial to them to incentivize upgrades than to keep selling to Switch 1 owners, at least for some of their games.


Switch OLED is the "Aula" that showed up in firmware in 2020. The chances of it being a retail product were largely dismissed, but they were always there.

What he means is that the OLED model was actually a known factor, for well over a year at the time. It was datamined in April 2020, people just weren't sure it would actually ever release since several other datamined models never did.
But was there ever a narative that it would be a standalone release with the same mariko chip?
Since i was shure it was nore a "its a prototype, they have them all the time, its probably to test a display for the switch Pro".
Maybe im misremembering.

At least for me, a standalone release that is an upgrade...of only the screen seemed so far out there (but then again, we expected a mid gen refresh).
Which is also why im 85% shure that this is switch 2 (irrelevant how they call it in the end), with exclusives, huge marketitng push, etc.
 
My current thinking is to release Drake in 2022 or 2023 and a true next-gen console in 2026 or 2027 that is completely different from the Switch.
 
But was there ever a narative that it would be a standalone release with the same mariko chip?
Since i was shure it was nore a "its a prototype, they have them all the time, its probably to test a display for the switch Pro".
Maybe im misremembering.

At least for me, a standalone release that is an upgrade...of only the screen seemed so far out there (but then again, we expected a mid gen refresh).
Which is also why im 85% shure that this is switch 2 (irrelevant how they call it in the end), with exclusives, huge marketitng push, etc.
... Narrative? The datamine literally said that's all it was, it was just a question of whether this model would release. And it did.
 
... Narrative? The datamine literally said that's all it was, it was just a question of whether this model would release. And it did.
speculative narative. i mean we speculated about all possible outcomes, and just having an internal build/profile does not mean its meant as a product. I feel like people expected 4k switch, and that was an internal test thing for a different screen.

Im not disputing that there was a profile in the datamine that corresponds to the final oled model.
 
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I doubt Nintendo will treat this as a new device that will immediately replace the old Switch models. They'll probably initially reveal this as a premium option and only in the future will they phase out the older Switch models. I just can't see Nintendo abandoning the massive install base of the old Switch so quickly.

It doesn't matter how powerful it will be. Nintendo can take some advantage of it early on by boosting the resolution and framerate of their current-Switch games and take full advantage of that power in the future when they shift their development exclusively to the new Switch - it's not like they'll abandon it in a few years. Plus there would be third-party exclusives anyway.
 
But was there ever a narative that it would be a standalone release with the same mariko chip?
Since i was shure it was nore a "its a prototype, they have them all the time, its probably to test a display for the switch Pro".
Maybe im misremembering.

At least for me, a standalone release that is an upgrade...of only the screen seemed so far out there (but then again, we expected a mid gen refresh).
Which is also why im 85% shure that this is switch 2 (irrelevant how they call it in the end), with exclusives, huge marketitng push, etc.
It was never the dominant narrative, but it was always a possibility. Most didn't think, or didn't want to think, it was ever going to release, and the rumors appeared to be supporting that narrative at the time, but of course, in the end, it appears that some conflation was going on.

The difference this year is that there's no alternate possibility to really be ignored. The only unreleased models remaining in firmware are ones that we are far more confident than we ever were with Aula that they're just test boards (they've been there for longer and appear to be missing too much hardware (like a cart slot) to ever release) and there's been no credible rumors of new hardware existing aside from Drake.
 
My current thinking is to release Drake in 2022 or 2023 and a true next-gen console in 2026 or 2027 that is completely different from the Switch.
It would make sense and would give the switch brand enough life to leap over the ds sales and possibly the PS2, so it would reign supreme BWAHAHAHA!!!!

but in a serious note, it could actually achieve that goal.
 
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It was never the dominant narrative, but it was always a possibility. Most didn't think, or didn't want to think, it was ever going to release, and the rumors appeared to be supporting that narrative at the time, but of course, in the end, it appears that some conflation was going on.

The difference this year is that there's no alternate possibility to really be ignored. The only unreleased models remaining in firmware are ones that we are far more confident than we ever were with Aula that they're just test boards (they've been there for longer and appear to be missing too much hardware (like a cart slot) to ever release) and there's been no credible rumors of new hardware existing aside from Drake.
K, get it. I mean, it did seem pretty unlikely to just push another revision with a better screen, but then again, with the pandemic and all... whatever.


Im just hoping that we are talking about a timeframe of say 6-12 months, and not 18...
 
K, get it. I mean, it did seem pretty unlikely to just push another revision with a better screen, but then again, with the pandemic and all... whatever.


Im just hoping that we are talking about a timeframe of say 6-12 months, and not 18...
Yeah, I think timeframe is probably the only factor that could make this year a bust. Hopefully we'll get some clarity on that tonight.
 
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Don't expect third party exclusives from parties that are not already supporting the Switch if there is no Nintendo money involved (and Nintendo is quite picky and smart with the money hats).
I just mean those that are interested but don't want to severely compromise their ports for the current Switch, they would release their port only for the new Switch even if it means skipping out on that install base of the old Switch.
 
My current thinking is to release Drake in 2022 or 2023 and a true next-gen console in 2026 or 2027 that is completely different from the Switch.

I'm genuinely curious what "completely different" from the Switch means. I've heard people mention it a few times, ie, that Nintendo will eventually introduce a "new concept", or "new platform", etc.

But what else could they possibly do at this point? We know Nintendo will never go back to supporting two consoles again (home + portable), so the hybrid nature of the Switch is absolutely going to be a staple of all future Nintendo consoles. Given that fact, what else could they do? Maybe a camera in the rear for AR or something, but I don't see any way at this point that Nintendo can do something "completely different" from the Switch.
 
I just mean those that are interested but don't want to severely compromise their ports for the current Switch, they would release their port only for the new Switch even if it means skipping out on that install base of the old Switch.
Only case that you can argue this being true kind off is some Square Enix/Konami/Ubisoft/Embracer titles that have skipped the Switch. I guess getting now all titles from this four companies will be nice though but don't expect a change in how much Switch is supported by companies that are already not supporting the Switch, they had 6 years to decide a strategy with the Switch and they just decided to not have one this will not change only due to more powerful hardware.

edit: Forgot WB games, count on their future titles also releasing on the Drake
 
I still think future Nintendo 'gimmicks' will come from peripherals and accessories like we already have seen with the leg strap and Labo. (And other less popular accessories like the fishing pole). Only 'gimmicks' I can see Drake getting are some improved joy-cons with new capabilities .
 
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Only case that you can argue this being true kind off is some Square Enix/Konami/Ubisoft/Embracer titles that have skipped the Switch. I guess getting now all titles from this four companies will be nice though but don't expect a change in how much Switch is supported by companies that are already not supporting the Switch, they had 6 years to decide a strategy with the Switch and they just decided to not have one this will not change only due to more powerful hardware.

edit: Forgot WB games, count on their future titles also releasing on the Drake
I agree that there won't be much of a change. I just mean that those third parties who are already supporting Switch could port their PS4 titles easily by just focusing on Drake. Maybe Capcom would release their recent RE titles or even something like DMC4 and V to it. Whereas something like Dragon Quest would be on any Nintendo system regardless of how intensive the next DQ would be. It just depends on what they feel like.
 
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I think that, while the speculation about the potential gimmick of the next device is interesting, there’s something that has to be taken into account here and cannot be ignored.

There is such a thing as feature creep and having too many gimmicks becomes a turn off or a selling point that sways them away from what they liked because of overload. They’d need to balance the switch features, and adding another feature that A) doesn’t seem like too much, but also B) can’t be too little.

These days people are more accustomed to moving forward with what works and isn’t trying to be too different.


It becomes an organic integration into the hardware and has the software that supports it appropriately that makes it worth the hassle of investing into said hardware.
 
I'm genuinely curious what "completely different" from the Switch means. I've heard people mention it a few times, ie, that Nintendo will eventually introduce a "new concept", or "new platform", etc.

But what else could they possibly do at this point? We know Nintendo will never go back to supporting two consoles again (home + portable), so the hybrid nature of the Switch is absolutely going to be a staple of all future Nintendo consoles. Given that fact, what else could they do? Maybe a camera in the rear for AR or something, but I don't see any way at this point that Nintendo can do something "completely different" from the Switch.

Indeed. For as long as video games are played on a screen with a controller, I expect the Switch concept to remain. They may indeed add gimmicks here and there, maybe even jump to VR eventually (the switch and joycons are a good base for that), but overall, there won't be a totally different console concept.
 
I might expect a standalone VR/AR/MR (?) headset down the line with foveated rendering and DLSS using a modified Switch+ chip, but as an actual third pillar sold alongside future Switch hardware, not a replacement.

The Switch has brought a lot of interesting play mechanics with its form factor including wearable exercise gear, AR kart racing, cardboard pianos, VR, motion controlled sports and swordplay, etc while never detracting from the core feature of hybrid gaming. I personally don't want this to go away.
 
Latest Nikkei article regarding the "next Switch" below (machine translated). It's an opinion piece, and nothing too interesting in it.

Nintendo's "Next Switch": Three scenarios come to mind due to concerns about peaking out

Nintendo's "Nintendo Switch," which has entered its sixth year of release, is at a critical moment. Due to the shortage of semiconductors and the turmoil in logistics, production and delivery have been struggling, and there are increasing voices saying that demand has "peaked off" (home appliance mass sales executives). Since it is a historic hit product, strategies such as next-generation machines are particularly difficult. Three scenarios come to mind in "Next Switch".

Nintendo will announce its consolidated financial results for the fiscal year ending March 2022 on the afternoon of the 10th. It seems that the number of switches sold was around 23 million units, a decrease of 20% from the previous term. Due to the shortage of semiconductors, we have not been able to supply a sufficient amount to the market. There is also a large reactionary decline from the previous period (28.83 million units) when there was a big hit with the demand for nesting and the popular software "Animal Crossing: New Clothes Forest".

Switch sales for the fiscal year ending March 2011 are expected to be around 20 million units. Since it has a production base in China, there are concerns about the impact of the city blockdown (lockdown) in Shanghai. Attention will also be focused on the net income plan for the fiscal year ending March 2011, which will be announced on the 10th.

The switch has sold 103.54 million units in total (as of the end of December 2009), making it an exceptional hit. The "Wii" released in 2006 also sold a total of 101.63 million units, but stalled in the fifth year. As for software sales, the cumulative sales of "Family Computers" released in 1983 are about 500 million, while the number of switches is about 800 million.

What is the next move for such a switch? There are three scenarios that market players envision.

The first is to launch an improved version of the current model within a year or two. You can extend the life of the switch and continue to collect profits by selling software.

The bottleneck is the lack of semiconductors. Hideki Yasuda, a senior analyst at Toyo Securities, points out that "the production of the current model alone is difficult, and even if an improved version is added, there is a concern that the number of units shipped at the time of launch will be insufficient." In the first place, the current model has a high degree of perfection, and it is difficult to bring out a new taste. In October 2021, we just launched an improved version that uses OLED for the screen.

The second scenario is the introduction of next-generation consoles that sell high-definition video compatible with switches. It has the advantage of being able to take over the users of the switch while creating a fresh taste.

The concern is that "software for next-generation consoles will not sell" (domestic securities analyst). Some people hesitate to purchase software for next-generation consoles because the capacity of the recording medium installed in the hardware is filled with the software of the switch that has already been purchased. Software makers may also prioritize switch software development.

Masahiro Ono, an analyst at Morgan Stanley MUFG Securities, sees the potential for both improved and next-generation consoles. Even in the case of next-generation consoles, the software will be compatible, and "I hope to maintain and expand the number of annual users of nearly 100 million people."

The third is the scenario of launching a completely new next-generation machine. Mr. Yasuda of Toyo Securities says, "If hardware is attractive, software will sell naturally."

However, there is a risk that attractive software will not be available at the time of release. If you get up and running, not only users but also software makers will be interested in hardware made by other companies. Manufacturers who have continued to develop software for switches may question Nintendo's decision.

It is also difficult to determine when to launch next-generation consoles. If it is extended until three to four years later, the momentum of the switch will slow down in the meantime, and it may create a valley of business performance. If the timing coincides with the next-generation model of Sony Group's "PlayStation 5" (released in 20), there is a risk of diversifying demand.

Nintendo's performance has been influenced by the ups and downs of hardware in the past. In FY03 / 09, when Wii was a big hit, it earned 279 billion yen in consolidated net income. On the other hand, in the fiscal year ended March 31, 2014, when the Wii U, whose cumulative sales were only 13.56 million units, was the mainstay, it had a deficit of 23.2 billion yen.

Nintendo has an unwritten rule that "entertainment is valuable because it is different from others." "As long as Nintendo is Nintendo, we will continue to put out challenging hardware," said Kenji Fukuyama, an analyst at UBS Securities. He also points out that "the next Switch will not necessarily be a success."

The switch was developed by former president Satoru Iwata, who died suddenly in 2015. "Up until now, I've been running on the rails laid by Mr. Iwata. The next hardware to be released is the sense of President Shuntaro Furukawa," said Mr. Yasuda of Toyo Securities. Can you clear the difficult situation? President Furukawa will also reach a critical moment.
 
Something to keep in mind as we discuss the new device, is that Drake is likely a larger leap over the Switch than the 3DS was over the DS.
Regardless of whether it is sold as a revision or new console, that is still most likely going to be the case.
 
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google translation:
Nikkei: Nintendo's "Next to Switch" is a three-scenario that comes to mind due to concerns about peaking out As mentioned in the article, the lack of software at the time of launch as a concern if the next-generation machine is not compatible with the current machine is big because Switch was said to be the same at the beginning of the release. I don't think it's a minus.
 
Unless Nintendo speeds up their refresh cycle (certainly a possibility with Atlan coming in a few years and the traditional "Pro" approach seemingly not really working out for them this gen), I don't think it's realistic that they make it all the way to Switch 3 before releasing an exclusive game.
That’s not what I was saying. The scenario proposed was this
  1. Nintendo releases a Pro revision, targeted at power users
  2. It sells really well
  3. Nintendo drops support for Classic Switch in 2-3 years, games are Drake exclusive
I do not see that happening because:
  1. Even if it sells exceptionally well, Drake isn't going to break 20% of the install base
  2. That's maybe 25 million units
  3. With sales tapering over time, as Switch sales generally die off.
  4. Leaving Nintendo selling for a small install base
  5. And hoping a new Mario is enough to get 100 million users to look at buying 2 year old hardware
I was suggesting that one strategy would be to release a successor to Drake in 3 years, launch that with Next Gen fanfare, but spend two years developing games cross gen games for Next Gen and Drake, but leaving base switch behind. I don't think that is the only strategy, but one of the reasons that there is the "this thing is so big, nintendo HAS to give this a Big Next Gen Launch" is because the sales excitement generated by that launch really does matter to the life of the console
 
What i hate to see is something like this;

Leaks point to need hardware coming

Nintendo reveals Switch OLED lite launching later this year

Nothing else to announce
While there are little clues regarding Nintendo's next move, an OLED Lite is probably near the bottom of possible outcomes in the next few years. Take a look at the age distribution of Switch users in Japan:

svsYCpL.png

Left to right: mobile, Switch, PS4
Bottom to top: under 10, 10s, 20s, 30s, 40s, 50s (and above?)
Data source: Famitsu Game White Paper 2020

This 2019 data demonstrated that Switch did a much better job than mobile and PS4 in creating new customers by attracting a much larger user base in the younger age brackets. My guess is that the data from prior years probably showed the same skew, thus contributing to the introduction of Lite model (released in September 2019) and also the multiple-units-per-household strategy. To continue the mastery of the youth market and multiple purchases, I think that it's crucial to maintain the Lite model's low price point. It seems rather unlikely that any premium components would be added to it. If anything, the company may be actively looking into more cost-cutting measures. (On a side note, this also suggests that the TV output would never be added to Lite—children don't own TVs.)

The Lite model may live on for a few more years to target this market, but I do wonder how Nintendo/Nvidia could lower the cost of Drake enough to eventually upgrade the Lite. The beefy 12 SMs SoC (if true) doesn't seem to fit the price range. Would a new low-end SoC be introduced for the next Lite model? That would create a new profile that the developers have to support. Hopefully by then, however, the Switch development tools would make performance scaling relatively straightforward for developers.
 
Latest Nikkei article regarding the "next Switch" below (machine translated). It's an opinion piece, and nothing too interesting in it.


google translation:
Nikkei: Nintendo's "Next to Switch" is a three-scenario that comes to mind due to concerns about peaking out As mentioned in the article, the lack of software at the time of launch as a concern if the next-generation machine is not compatible with the current machine is big because Switch was said to be the same at the beginning of the release. I don't think it's a minus.

That’s it, pack it up folks. The switch to is dead! Long live the Wii U. Nintendo is doomed yet again. You love to see it.
 
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That’s not what I was saying. The scenario proposed was this
  1. Nintendo releases a Pro revision, targeted at power users
  2. It sells really well
  3. Nintendo drops support for Classic Switch in 2-3 years, games are Drake exclusive
I do not see that happening because:
  1. Even if it sells exceptionally well, Drake isn't going to break 20% of the install base
  2. That's maybe 25 million units
  3. With sales tapering over time, as Switch sales generally die off.
  4. Leaving Nintendo selling for a small install base
  5. And hoping a new Mario is enough to get 100 million users to look at buying 2 year old hardware
I was suggesting that one strategy would be to release a successor to Drake in 3 years, launch that with Next Gen fanfare, but spend two years developing games cross gen games for Next Gen and Drake, but leaving base switch behind. I don't think that is the only strategy, but one of the reasons that there is the "this thing is so big, nintendo HAS to give this a Big Next Gen Launch" is because the sales excitement generated by that launch really does matter to the life of the console
I don't think 25m drake sales can keep the switch alive until 2026.
That would be adding about 8m sales a year. However, base model switch sales have been tanking hard. 20m 2020, to about 13m 2021. I'd imagine 2022 that probably drops to around 8m or lower, and then into the dirt by 2023. Cant even imagine how low base model sales are gonna be in 2025. So 8m drakes a year does not keep the switch alive until 2026, 2025 would even be hard. I think they need to get the drake up to at least 10m per year to sustain past 2024, 12m to be on the safer side though.
 
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It’s not actually comparable. The new 3ds was far from current tech at the time it came out, and if I’m not mistaken a significant part of that power boost was reserved by super stable 3d.

It just had more and faster clocked cpu cores and more memory. Not actual new tech.

Oh geez I can feel old memories rattling around in my brain.

I don't recall QTM (Qu....something tracking manager?) taking up any power at all really.

The n3ds new system module QTM services were at n3ds exclusive register address F zero. That's how I remembered it, just the one F and zeros: 0x1F000000, and had a memory pool of 0x00400000, 4 MB, Half of it, 0x00200000, 2 MB, was exclusively reserved for QTM services head tracking, the GPU had access to the other half of the range. For doing.... Stuff... I guess. That's the only thing I remembered it takes up half a small physical memory space that's newly addressed to the new arm11's.

You can't do any head tracking at all with any of the cameras other functions in use, so I'm pretty sure it just uses the same processing resources reserved for the cameras MCU services, never really touching anything used to run games.
 
That’s not what I was saying. The scenario proposed was this
  1. Nintendo releases a Pro revision, targeted at power users
  2. It sells really well
  3. Nintendo drops support for Classic Switch in 2-3 years, games are Drake exclusive
I do not see that happening because:
  1. Even if it sells exceptionally well, Drake isn't going to break 20% of the install base
  2. That's maybe 25 million units
  3. With sales tapering over time, as Switch sales generally die off.
  4. Leaving Nintendo selling for a small install base
  5. And hoping a new Mario is enough to get 100 million users to look at buying 2 year old hardware
I was suggesting that one strategy would be to release a successor to Drake in 3 years, launch that with Next Gen fanfare, but spend two years developing games cross gen games for Next Gen and Drake, but leaving base switch behind. I don't think that is the only strategy, but one of the reasons that there is the "this thing is so big, nintendo HAS to give this a Big Next Gen Launch" is because the sales excitement generated by that launch really does matter to the life of the console
Are first party exclusives actually necessary for a "big next gen launch", though? PS5/XS seem to be selling just fine with those still being pretty thin on the ground even 18 months in. I think as long as they can build sufficient momentum around the thing initially.

Also, launch is certainly important, but it's important to remember that most people don't buy new hardware at launch. If they can get people to buy in to it not just being a revision, I think they'll be fine.
 
Are first party exclusives actually necessary for a "big next gen launch", though? PS5/XS seem to be selling just fine with those still being pretty thin on the ground even 18 months in. I think as long as they can build sufficient momentum around the thing initially.

Also, launch is certainly important, but it's important to remember that most people don't buy new hardware at launch. If they can get people to buy in to it not just being a revision, I think they'll be fine.
It's impossible to know how the PS5 and Xbox would be selling without supply shortages. Obviously they sell out immediately right now, but that's in large part due to scalping. It's possible the PS5 and Xbox would be selling amazing right now with no shortage and it's also possible they wouldn't. But until they get proper stock I wouldn't read anything into their performance.
 
Snice talk about Drake’s potential “gimmick” has come up, can we discuss the possibility of a camera(s)? AR utilization would need it. It could provide “a new way to play” that couldn’t be done on Switch before. And if Nintendo ever got into 3rd party apps again (Im still bitter about no Netflix on Switch), then Zoom or other camera based apps/games could be a possibility. Yes, that would dictate certain games/apps be handheld only, but I think that’s a fair trade. After the DSi, 3DS, and WiiU, I thought cameras were going to be a staple on all hardware going forward. But Switch bucked the trend. Has the price of decent mobile cameras decreased enough to make this a good business decision? IMO 480p cameras couldn’t cut it in 2011, but Nintendo went with them anyway. I wonder what resolution they would go with today.

EDIT

Depending on dock design, I suppose a front camera could be used docked as well. Maybe like a PSEye or Kinect scenario…
 
It's impossible to know how the PS5 and Xbox would be selling without supply shortages. Obviously they sell out immediately right now, but that's in large part due to scalping. It's possible the PS5 and Xbox would be selling amazing right now with no shortage and it's also possible they wouldn't. But until they get proper stock I wouldn't read anything into their performance.
While true you to a degree you can absolutely read into the performance of PS5 in at least one territory (JP). There is more then enough information there, scalping or not, to present a picture.
 
While true you to a degree you can absolutely read into the performance of PS5 in at least one territory (JP). There is more then enough information there, scalping or not, to present a picture.
If in every region PS4 performed like in Japan in 2012-2014 (we are talking worse performance than Wii U), Sony would be out of the hardware buisness. You can’t use at all PS performance in Japan and try to make it global , in other regions like UK/Spain PS5 software has been selling great and it’s the best selling SKU by a lot in almost all cross-gen releases between the two platforms.
 
Nothing in next year's forecast indicates new revision or successor,
at least not this calendar year, maybe possible March release next year.
 
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Nor does it indicate there not being one. Let’s not go down this route again. There’s a whole thread about it.

Well 21m forecasted units, less net sales (more expansive model should easily mean at least stronger net sales) and less profit at least suggest that we will hardly new hardware launch this calendar year, because if for instance new hardware is releasing this year, forecast numbers should easily be stronger.
Maybe launch in March next year, so effect on new hardware launch wouldnt be so strong..
 
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Considering how well the Switch and the software is still selling, they could go this FY without announcing new hardware quite easily. They really have no need for a Switch Pro going by those numbers. This dosen't mean they won't, but sales figures surely aren't pressuring them into releasing new hardware.

Q&A will maybe shed some light but i highly doubt it.
 
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