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StarTopic Future Nintendo Hardware & Technology Speculation & Discussion |ST| (New Staff Post, Please read)

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Cuzizkool said:
Can I take a moment to ask about the Switch 2 dock? The internet went wild when it was revealed the OLED dock would have a chip in it. We now know that the chip is the most basic of chips and is just for background tasks and whatnot and in no way enhances the visuals or performance of OLED. But what IS a feasible hypothetical version that could? I ask because I see all the hype from Nvidia about Orin x2, x4, xwhatever that's going to power autonomous cars, and it got me thinking. Could Nintendo design a dock with some form of chip that would assist in enhancing visuals?
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Sort of? There are already devices that do uprez of Switch output. But what you're probably asking about is a second GPU, so that games could natively add cool features and get around the power limit of handheld. This is a very hard problem for 2 big reasons

Cuzizkool said:
This would obviously not be cheap, and I would expect Nintendo to sell this optional accessory separately for the "graphics crowd". Again, I know very little about how electronics work, but is USB-C, the connection between Switch and the dock, fast/efficient enough to allow one SoC to communicate well with another chip in the dock?
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It isn't, which is the first big problem. You'd need an upgraded Switch with a new kind of connector.

The second is that being able to Switch GPUs transparently while a game is running is a tricky engineering problem.

Cuzizkool said:
Sorry if I'm asking stupid questions here. :oops:
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No apology required.
 
oldpuck said:
Sort of? There are already devices that do uprez of Switch output. But what you're probably asking about is a second GPU, so that games could natively add cool features and get around the power limit of handheld. This is a very hard problem for 2 big reasons


It isn't, which is the first big problem. You'd need an upgraded Switch with a new kind of connector.

The second is that being able to Switch GPUs transparently while a game is running is a tricky engineering problem.


No apology required.
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Honestly with the kind of bus that would be required to try and mitigate lag across that amount of distance to the CPU (is thunderbolt 5 out yet)?, and the enclosure and cooling system and all needed to make the external gpu actually usable, never mind how a dock would be put into that.... it would probably be more cost effective to somehow figure out how to make a portable PS5.
 
Crusters said:
Honestly with the kind of bus that would be required to try and mitigate lag across that amount of distance to the CPU (is thunderbolt 5 out yet)?, and the enclosure and cooling system and all needed to make the external gpu actually usable, never mind how a dock would be put into that.... it would probably be more cost effective to somehow figure out how to make a portable PS5.
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as wide as you could theoretically go, you'll probably hit a bottleneck somewhere just by not being clocked fast enough
 
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oldpuck said:
Sort of? There are already devices that do uprez of Switch output. But what you're probably asking about is a second GPU, so that games could natively add cool features and get around the power limit of handheld. This is a very hard problem for 2 big reasons


It isn't, which is the first big problem. You'd need an upgraded Switch with a new kind of connector.

The second is that being able to Switch GPUs transparently while a game is running is a tricky engineering problem.


No apology required.
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There is that good old scd patent though.


www.tweaktown.com

Nintendo patents external console upgrade box

Nintendo's newly patented external box boosts console processing speed and network latency.
www.tweaktown.com www.tweaktown.com
 
Hermii said:
There is that good old scd patent though.


www.tweaktown.com

Nintendo patents external console upgrade box

Nintendo's newly patented external box boosts console processing speed and network latency.
www.tweaktown.com www.tweaktown.com
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The scd is actually a cloud based device:

Joe Bentdahl Not really it is a cloud network device designed to offload some storage, ram, and processing power so you don't have to rely on the power of the console. Essentially old consoles could operate with equal processing power and ram to new consoles using the cloud.

And we all know how that over marketed nonsense ended up.
 
Crusters said:
Honestly with the kind of bus that would be required to try and mitigate lag across that amount of distance to the CPU (is thunderbolt 5 out yet)?, and the enclosure and cooling system and all needed to make the external gpu actually usable, never mind how a dock would be put into that.... it would probably be more cost effective to somehow figure out how to make a portable PS5.
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Totally correct but pluggable motherboard southbridges used to be the default in portable machines. Just put a whole damn PCIe connector in there, and drive power off a side channel… :p
 
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Crusters said:
The scd is actually a cloud based device:

Joe Bentdahl Not really it is a cloud network device designed to offload some storage, ram, and processing power so you don't have to rely on the power of the console. Essentially old consoles could operate with equal processing power and ram to new consoles using the cloud.

And we all know how that over marketed nonsense ended up.
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The patent had a cloud element to it, but as you can see here, it wasn't all cloud based.

53167_60_nintendo-successfully-patents-external-console-upgrade-box.png
 
Hermii said:
The patent had a cloud element to it, but as you can see here, it wasn't all cloud based.

53167_60_nintendo-successfully-patents-external-console-upgrade-box.png
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Joe Bentdahl is literally the designer of the device, those are his words, not mine. Those processors and memory are in service of the network interface, to the cloud, not for the console, they just deliver the console data server side, and then receive the processing and store the data sent from server side, to be sent to the console.

This is a lot more inefficient and lag inducing than just streaming entirely from the cloud, which mostly only needs controller input data sent out.

Cloud streaming eats this concept for lunch, cloud streaming is on switch, and cloud streaming sucks.
 
Crusters said:
Joe Bentdahl is literally the designer of the device, those are his words, not mine. Those processors and memory are in service of the network interface, to the cloud, not for the console, they just deliver the console data server side, and then receive the processing and store the data sent from server side, to be sent to the console.

This is a lot more inefficient and lag inducing than just streaming entirely from the cloud, which mostly only needs controller input data sent out.

Cloud streaming eats this concept for lunch, cloud streaming is on switch, and cloud streaming sucks.
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I see. I feel like its not as much allowed to make fun of the power of the cloud after flight sim.It can have many different interesting applications for gaming. its just not a simple power multiplier like ms initially marketed it as.

Not that I think that is a way forward for Nintendo. It requires massive infrastructure.
 
Hermii said:
I see. I feel like its not as much allowed to make fun of the power of the cloud after flight sim.It can have many different interesting applications for gaming. its just not a simple power multiplier like ms initially marketed it as.

Not that I think that is a way forward for Nintendo. It requires massive infrastructure.
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It can. It won't. The worst possible application is the inevitable future because it enables a business model where customers own nothing and everything is in the hands of whoever owns the servers.
 
Tomorrow is the big day (Investor Meeting), Gonna be really interesting 👀 They either deny talking about future hardware/release plans (aka it's coming soon) or just outright say "no new HW this fiscal year".
 
RainTech said:
Tomorrow is the big day (Investor Meeting), Gonna be really interesting 👀 They either deny talking about future hardware/release plans (aka it's coming soon) or just outright say "no new HW this fiscal year".
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I’m leaning more on the “no new hardware this fiscal year”
 
Feburary 21st means the outlook was for the next quarter wich endet in June. Switch Oled was announced in July. May Forecast is always for the entire next fiscal year. May is the only forecast that covers an entire FY. This argument dosen't work.

So yeah, still no lie detected.
 
RainTech said:
Tomorrow is the big day (Investor Meeting), Gonna be really interesting 👀 They either deny talking about future hardware/release plans (aka it's coming soon) or just outright say "no new HW this fiscal year".
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Most likely they do neither of these things, it'll only pop up if someone asks about it. And in the broader market I think the subject has kinda died down.
 
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Hermii said:
Sure about that? Seems like that would open up a lot of legal gray areas.
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He's correct. I don't know where the idea that you can't lie to shareholders came from but that's not true. The board is responsible for making the best moves and decisions for the overall firm. If it is in the best interest to lie about certain things they can and they will. The bigger point is that, consistently lying to shareholders breeds distrust which can harm the organization. Also, they cannot release information that openly misleads shareholders. That's why non answers or "we're always working on new hardware but we have nothing to announce/discuss at this time" are preferred

But the blanket "they can't lie"? Naw, that's not true.
 
I am once again asking for this thread to realize that "we have no plans" and "we have nothing to announce" are Nintendo's common PR answers specifically because they don't confirm or deny anything. The entire concept of trying to analyze when they're disconfirmations or tacit confirmations doesn't make any sense; the whole point of PR statements is to avoid revealing future plans before they're ready for public announcement, so if they had any implicit meaning/pattern to them at all it would defeat the purpose.

To reiterate:

LiC said:
The only meaningful thing Nintendo has said about new hardware during a Q&A in the modern era is this: "Please note that we have no plans to launch a new Nintendo Switch model during 2020." If they say the same thing about 2022 specifically, then obviously that's that. Anything else, and no conclusions can be drawn whatsoever.
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Dekuman said:
When is their FY 2022 Q&A?
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I think the Q&A is on the same day as the earning release for the fiscal year ending in March 2022, which is 10 May 2022. But the official translation for the Q&A won't be released until a week later.
 
Dakhil said:
I think the Q&A is on the same day as the earning release for the fiscal year ending in March 2022, which is 10 May 2022. But the official translation for the Q&A won't be released until a week later.
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To clarify, the release will be happening in roughly 17 hours or so, I believe.
 
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Falcatops said:
Are there any twitter accounts that relay information prior to the official translation? I know that ZhugeEX tends to comment about the reports.
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I think Dave Gibson usually translates the Q&A before Nintendo publishes the official translation, although Dave Gibson does tend to translate quite liberally.
 
Dakhil said:
I think Dave Gibson usually translates the Q&A before Nintendo publishes the official translation, although Dave Gibson does tend to translate quite liberally.
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Ah yes I remember that name now. I was looking for him but couldn’t remember his name haha. Thanks for the quick reply! 💪🏻
 
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Really hope there's a new console on the horizon, even though I think new hardware is 2023 at the earliest. Recently fell back in love with my Switch.
 
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Falcatops said:
Are there any twitter accounts that relay information prior to the official translation? I know that ZhugeEX tends to comment about the reports.
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I seem to recall an account named Cheesemeister live-tweeting from the Q&A in the past, not sure whether they still do or no.
 
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A reminder that game consoles tend to be first talked about (but not actually announced) a year or two in advance in order to build up hype. The PS5 was 1.5 years ahead of time, for example, same with many of Nintendo's own consoles. If the console is coming early next year there's a very high chance we hear about it tomorrow. If nothing is mentioned the odds of an early 2023 release drop substantially, though not to 0 obviously.
 
Stinkmeiser45 said:
A reminder that game consoles tend to be first talked about (but not actually announced) a year or two in advance in order to build up hype. The PS5 was 1.5 years ahead of time, for example, same with many of Nintendo's own consoles. If the console is coming early next year there's a very high chance we hear about it tomorrow. If nothing is mentioned the odds of an early 2023 release drop substantially, though not to 0 obviously.
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Unless they're considering this a revision or some other manner of upgrade/side grade and not a new console gen.

Which despite the leaked specs seems to be the current rumor.
 
Skittzo said:
Unless they're considering this a revision or some other manner of upgrade/side grade and not a new console gen.

Which despite the leaked specs seems to be the current rumor.
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Even if they market this as a revision, it's clearly not a traditional revision like a New 3DS or DSi or whatever, considering the massively higher specs. So I cant see them doing an announcement then release dump like they do with those. The sales potential are much higher so they will want more time for marketing and hype to build up.
 
Stinkmeiser45 said:
A reminder that game consoles tend to be first talked about (but not actually announced) a year or two in advance in order to build up hype. The PS5 was 1.5 years ahead of time, for example, same with many of Nintendo's own consoles. If the console is coming early next year there's a very high chance we hear about it tomorrow. If nothing is mentioned the odds of an early 2023 release drop substantially, though not to 0 obviously.
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3DS was announced at E3 2010 and released February 2011, That’s only 8 months of difference.
 
Stinkmeiser45 said:
Even if they market this as a revision, it's clearly not a traditional revision like a New 3DS or DSi or whatever, considering the massively higher specs. So I cant see them doing an announcement then release dump like they do with those. The sales potential are much higher so they will want more time for marketing and hype to build up.
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Of course they do appear massievely higher when the Hardware of the Switch itself was nearly ancient when it came out.

If somebody jumps 1 cm, then a jump about 50-100 cm from somebody else shouldnt shock us….
 
Stinkmeiser45 said:
I did say the odds don't drop to 0. Indeed, I could see them announcing it as late as September. But the odds definitely drop, since most consoles are closer to 1.5 years.
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When a console it's still selling amazing like in Switch or DS case you want a short time period between announcement and release of the new console to 'lose' as little sales from the console that's still selling amazing, that's why I think the wait between announcement and release will be closer to 3DS one than the ones from Wii U/NX.
 
CypressFX said:
Of course they do appear massievely higher when the Hardware of the Switch itself was nearly ancient when it came out.

If somebody jumps 1 cm, then a jump about 50-100 cm from somebody else shouldnt shock us….
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Literally no one in this thread predicted 12sm. This is the alternative reality where WUST actually happened.
 
Blue Monty said:
When a console it's still selling amazing like in Switch or DS case you want a short time period between announcement and release of the new console to 'lose' as little sales from the console that's still selling amazing, that's why I think the wait between announcement and release will be closer to 3DS one than the ones from Wii U/NX.
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I could see it. I'm definitely not saying they cant do a September announcement, but either way it's fair to say if we don't see any kind of talk of new hardware tomorrow the odds have dropped to some degree although clearly we're debating how much.
 
Stinkmeiser45 said:
Even if they market this as a revision, it's clearly not a traditional revision like a New 3DS or DSi or whatever, considering the massively higher specs. So I cant see them doing an announcement then release dump like they do with those. The sales potential are much higher so they will want more time for marketing and hype to build up.
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New 3DS had a 6x CPU boost, we have no idea what the effective boosts for this will be but we can assume it'll be somewhere around the same level, though this time for both the CPU and GPU.
 
Skittzo said:
New 3DS had a 6x CPU boost, we have no idea what the effective boosts for this will be but we can assume it'll be somewhere around the same level, though this time for both the CPU and GPU.
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I point it out anyway but of course you are already aware that the GPU is much more important for video game consoles than the CPU.
 
Skittzo said:
New 3DS had a 6x CPU boost, we have no idea what the effective boosts for this will be but we can assume it'll be somewhere around the same level, though this time for both the CPU and GPU.
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It’s not actually comparable. The new 3ds was far from current tech at the time it came out, and if I’m not mistaken a significant part of that power boost was reserved by super stable 3d.

It just had more and faster clocked cpu cores and more memory. Not actual new tech.
 
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CypressFX said:
Of course they do appear massievely higher when the Hardware of the Switch itself was nearly ancient when it came out.

If somebody jumps 1 cm, then a jump about 50-100 cm from somebody else shouldnt shock us….
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afaik the Switch was still some of the most powerful mobile hardware available at the time.
 
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