• Hey everyone, staff have documented a list of banned content and subject matter that we feel are not consistent with site values, and don't make sense to host discussion of on Famiboards. This list (and the relevant reasoning per item) is viewable here.

StarTopic Future Nintendo Hardware & Technology Speculation & Discussion |ST| (Read the staff posts before commenting!)

Reader mode
TechnicalTip6578 said:
i mean console comparisons are most of the time helpful to understand whether a game is workable or not, and how would they end up looking & running, that's how most people did with last gen 3rd party ports for switch
Click to expand...
The problem with doing that is that not all devs will use the machine as efficiently as it can be used. Switch 2 might be close to PS4 in raw power, but if used correctly will likely outclass it by a fair margin.

But that will always be on a game by game basis because not everyone will bother using more than just the raw power.
 
Skittzo said:
The problem with doing that is that not all devs will use the machine as efficiently as it can be used. Switch 2 might be close to PS4 in raw power, but if used correctly will likely outclass it by a fair margin.

But that will always be on a game by game basis because not everyone will bother using more than just the raw power.
Click to expand...
This!☝️
Some games will port and scale nicely and others won't. We already see this with Wii U - > Switch ports. Despite Switch being more performant than Wii U, some ports scale nicely to the new hardware (MK8 DX, BoTW) while others don't (Bayo 1 + 2). Comparisons are hard to be made because there's always some trade-offs between the machines.
 
TechnicalTip6578 said:
my main albeit minor question here is that if the console is comparable to PS4 in terms of power, how would stuff like Botw with 0 loading times, matrix tech demo & possibly other rumored/speculated stuff (like Mihoyo games & FF7R integrade) work there?

obviously there will be massive compromises but i'm moreso curious on the technical aspect, as in would it be massively similar to the whole switch port deal: that is, it doesn't look great but it runs fine
Click to expand...
I made an ELI5 for most of this a few days ago:
RennanNT said:
The new generation Switch will have a big leap in power, like you usually get on new console generations, and DLSS on top of it gets you results which are way above what you would get from the power leap alone (in resolution and framerate). But DLSS doesn't reduce load times. This is thanks to super fast storage and a dedicated file decompressor.

Imagine you draw comic books, digitalize your drawings, print them in the same size you draw and sell them. Then, people who buy them really want them to be 2x the width and 2x the height. You could start drawing bigger, but that takes a lot more time per page and you don't have that much time... What do you do?

You just draw like aways and, after digitalizing, you stretch your image in the PC and print it in the requested size. You don't slow down and you do what people asked you. The problem is that the bigger book now looks blurry and people weren't that pleased with the result.

Then DLSS 2 came and did a much better job at stretching. It was so good that instead of people asking you to draw bigger, they started asking the authors who were drawing bigger to shrink their drawing and DLSS 2, because then these authors would be able to draw faster.

So, with DLSS you can increase the size of your book (output resolution) or you can increase how many pages you can draw by shrinking your drawing (reducing native resolution to increase framerate while keeping the same output resolution) or you can increase both by a smaller factor.

Imagine your work involves reading and writing a lot of documents and you can't work if you don't have them in your desk. You hire someone to fetch a huge batch of documents, then you yourself unpack and organize everything in your shelf before you get the docs you will need for the next X minutes and go to your desk.

What Sony, MS and now Nintendo did this generation was hiring professional runners to fetch the documents (super fast storage) AND hire someone else to do the organization for you (dedicated file decompressor). So, you don't have to wait much for the docs to arrive the office and you don't have to wait all the docs to be unpacked.
Click to expand...
And I will add that:

  • The "as powerful as the PS4" discussion is about handheld and only about GPU raw power at that.
  • Besides drawing smaller and faster, it's also possible to use DLSS to draw smaller and prettier instead.
  • You also hired someone to help painting the background (ray tracing), so you can still do colored drawing books in an acceptable pace, even if you're not fast enough yourself.
 
Last edited:
'As powerful as a PS4 in handheld' is also what I expected. When people don't clarify if they mean handheld or docked, I assume docked. Docked raw power I'm assuming PS4 Pro levels based on the leaks and the specs (assuming N4).

PS4 levels in handheld mode is more than fantastic.
 
So if Page 1717 is correct, the Switch NG is powered by salsa, and whether you run Quality, Performance, or Balanced mode DLSS depends on the type of salsa. Brilliant play. Also, I'm now incredibly hungry.
 
Ghostsonplanets said:
El Analista de Bits Ray Reconstruction/DLSS 3.5 analysis:



Oldpuck (rather sensible) point is that comparison between architectures is a fool errand. As he said, there's too many differences between the Ampere Nvidia uArch and the GCN 4.0 AMD uArch. And his point, to make it even easier to understand, is very simplified and doesn't take into account that PS4 Pro and Switch 2 are very different machines, with different bandwidth, CPUs, IO, RAM, etc. When you try to compare both, there will be trade-offs between each other. Some areas the PS4 Pro will excel over Switch 2, some areas where Switch 2 will excel over PS4 Pro. Thinking of Switch 2 as a comparable device as PS4 but with modern features and access to higher resolutions output due to DLSS is a very fair level of expectations.
Click to expand...

Oldpuck made a good point, but realistically speaking there's no universe where a PS4 Pro outperforms this device as a whole package under 3.5 TFLOPS docked. Most of the reason this is being said is because of memory bandwidth and pixel fillrate, which is an inherent limitation to mobile devices and something we'd have to deal with as long as these still use LPDDR. Regardless, the actual chip is way superior simply when acknowledging the architectural advantage and nothing will change that.
 
VegiHam said:
Whatever it turns out to be, someone will have been posting it under our noses all along

So my thinking is, is it Delight? Nate's been describing things as delightful recently, it could be an oblique sort of reference to ray tracing, and its the kind of weird name Nintendo would like
Click to expand...

I really don't see Nintendo dropping the Switch brand unless it's like Nintendo Switch Delight lol. Nintendo Delight would be funny though.
 
Meelow said:
I really don't see Nintendo dropping the Switch brand unless it's like Nintendo Switch Delight lol. Nintendo Delight would be funny though.
Click to expand...
Given Nintendo's history with choosing code names, I think "Delight" is almost too simple. Maybe this is the baker in me but I think something like "Blueberry Delight" or "Cookie Delight" is more likely than just "Delight".

Additionally, a "Delight" is a kind of layered pudding, which would suit with its design intent (more than one thing, both handheld and console, and even more of it than before.). Alternatively it could refer to its improved software stack. One layer for running Switch games, another layer for enhanced Switch games, a deep, ground cookie layer for native software, and a light, creamy topping for the new applet/system software environment.
 
Coming out of my self-imposed ban to do a quick post. If any of the below had already been shared (I only check this thread sporadically), sorry for the duplication.

tgtCG said:
I've searched Capcom's IR library and had seen no indication of some unannounced multi million seller releasing before the end of the fiscal year. I concur with others that that was assumed due to misunderstanding or miscommunication.
Click to expand...
Thank you. Finally someone else noticed. This Mochizuki tweet is the one (1) single source of all subsequent re-reports of a Capcom “unannounced game, which would sell millions, by March next year”. It was never corroborated by the primary source or any other major news outlets (content aggregators are hardly news organizations).

This joins a long list of other gaming facts for which Mochizuki was the one (1) single source: Sharp was making an LCD panel for Switch 2, Nintendo’s FY03/24 forecast did not include any new hardware, PS5 broke even in 2021, Furukawa said Switch in mid lifecycle in 2022, Nikkei predicted Nintendo wouldn’t release a new model in FY02/23 (which came true but Nikkei did not predict that), Furukawa “declined to comment” on the next-gen in 2022, and Hosiden “withdrawn” FY forecast due to Switch production difficulties, just off the top of my head.

Speaking of the conspicuous missing Capcom game, in today’s Nikkei article regarding the Tokyo Game Show:
21日に来場した東洋証券の安田 秀樹シニアアナリストは任天堂の家庭用ゲーム機「ニンテンドースイッチ」に続く次世代機の発表が 想定されるなか、大型タイトルが少ない印象は拭えない
Click to expand...
“Visiting the venue on the 21st, Hideki Yasuda, senior analyst at Toyo Securities, said he couldn’t shake the impression that there are few major titles, as Nintendo is expected to announce a next-generation console to succeed the Nintendo Switch.” He seems to imply that some major titles are being held back for the announcement of Switch NG.

Hidden content is only available for registered users. Sharing it outside of Famiboards is subject to moderation.
 
Raccoon said:
even as a joke, how could "not what I assumed we were talking about here" ever be construed as moving the goalpost

what, I'm gatekeeping what I thought?
Click to expand...

1. puck blends salsa
2. raccoon implies blending salsa is fucked up (gatekeeping salsa making)
3. thread mentions salsas that are blended or processed multiple times over
4. raccoon said oh that salsa doesn’t count (moving the goal post)

Anyway this is dumb and I’m dumb. Please let’s move along lol
 
VegiHam said:
Whatever it turns out to be, someone will have been posting it under our noses all along

So my thinking is, is it Delight? Nate's been describing things as delightful recently, it could be an oblique sort of reference to ray tracing, and its the kind of weird name Nintendo would like
Click to expand...
Nintendelight

Raccoon said:
what if the codename is songbird lmao
Click to expand...
I actually unironically like this.

TheGreatMightyPoo said:
I’m thinking a summer release.
Click to expand...
I'm thinking a salsa release.
 
Discostew said:
How about NXS?
Click to expand...
NSX

acura_nsx_gt3_evo_front.jpg
 
NintenDuvo said:
The Monster Hunter 20th Anniv. happens in March 2024, would love for the next Monster Hunter to be announced alongside the NG Switch
Click to expand...
The new Monster Hunter should be announced along with the other Switch 2 games as a matter of logic. On the anniversary we will probably get more information about the game and other things
 
karmitt said:
1. puck blends salsa
2. raccoon implies blending salsa is fucked up (gatekeeping salsa making)
3. thread mentions salsas that are blended or processed multiple times over
4. raccoon said oh that salsa doesn’t count (moving the goal post)
Click to expand...
I did NOT say that salsa doesn't count. All I said is that I was referring to something else. And I didn't even say blending salsa was fucked up, I said it was fucked up to learn that oldpuck does it that way, the implication being that the emotional response comes from it not being the way I do it, or being something I personally disagree with. what the hell are you doing roasting my ass like this for a series of incredibly unserious posts in response to a self-described bad analogy???

in fact, only point three is accurate. working from the bottom: I did NOT say that salsa verde doesn't count, the thread DID correct me, I did NOT say it was fucked up to blend salsa, and oldpuck didn't even blend salsa. that was a nonserious extrapolation from the scenario he described.

I already know that this post is just proving you right in your mind as I move the goalpost by splitting hairs and arguing the semantics of my own post as I attempt to absolve myself of all criticism by labelling all of my posts as jokes and gatekeeping how people can reply to them. I know all this and will post this anyway because getting this sort of criticism over what I see, correctly or not, as fucking nothing really pisses me off. iirc oldpuck yeahed my stupid joke, even though he probably didn't actually laugh or even nose exhale at that garbage. you know why? because sometimes it's better to bend and be friendly than to criticize each other's character over the most inane interactions on the internet. would it have been better for me to just not make an arrogant-sounding joke about assuming someone's taste and asserting my own? yes, I see now that it would. but what compelled you to break down a series of what I'll concede are substandard even for me jokes about salsa preparation to paint me as a sincerely arrogant and malicious asshole? what have I done to be met with such scrutiny?

and all of this is extra stupid because that part of my post was a draft I forgot to delete
 
fwd-bwd said:
Coming out of my self-imposed ban to do a quick post. If any of the below had already been shared (I only check this thread sporadically), sorry for the duplication.


Thank you. Finally someone else noticed. This Mochizuki tweet is the one (1) single source of all subsequent re-reports of a Capcom “unannounced game, which would sell millions, by March next year”. It was never corroborated by the primary source or any other major news outlets (content aggregators are hardly news organizations).

This joins a long list of other gaming facts for which Mochizuki was the one (1) single source: Sharp was making an LCD panel for Switch 2, Nintendo’s FY03/24 forecast did not include any new hardware, PS5 broke even in 2021, Furukawa said Switch in mid lifecycle in 2022, Nikkei predicted Nintendo wouldn’t release a new model in FY02/23 (which came true but Nikkei did not predict that), Furukawa “declined to comment” on the next-gen in 2022, and Hosiden “withdrawn” FY forecast due to Switch production difficulties, just off the top of my head.

Speaking of the conspicuous missing Capcom game, in today’s Nikkei article regarding the Tokyo Game Show:

“Visiting the venue on the 21st, Hideki Yasuda, senior analyst at Toyo Securities, said he couldn’t shake the impression that there are few major titles, as Nintendo is expected to announce a next-generation console to succeed the Nintendo Switch.” He seems to imply that some major titles are being held back for the announcement of Switch NG.

* Hidden text: cannot be quoted. *
Click to expand...
This post was such a rollercoaster it gave me a slight headache.

Always love your stuff. Despite everything, it's reassuring.
 
Raccoon said:
I did NOT say that salsa doesn't count. All I said is that I was referring to something else. And I didn't even say blending salsa was fucked up, I said it was fucked up to learn that oldpuck does it that way, the implication being that the emotional response comes from it not being the way I do it, or being something I personally disagree with. what the hell are you doing roasting my ass like this for a series of incredibly unserious posts in response to a self-described bad analogy???

in fact, only point three is accurate. working from the bottom: I did NOT say that salsa verde doesn't count, the thread DID correct me, I did NOT say it was fucked up to blend salsa, and oldpuck didn't even blend salsa. that was a nonserious extrapolation from the scenario he described.

I already know that this post is just proving you right in your mind as I move the goalpost by splitting hairs and arguing the semantics of my own post as I attempt to absolve myself of all criticism by labelling all of my posts as jokes and gatekeeping how people can reply to them. I know all this and will post this anyway because getting this sort of criticism over what I see, correctly or not, as fucking nothing really pisses me off. iirc oldpuck yeahed my stupid joke, even though he probably didn't actually laugh or even nose exhale at that garbage. you know why? because sometimes it's better to bend and be friendly than to criticize each other's character over the most inane interactions on the internet. would it have been better for me to just not make an arrogant-sounding joke about assuming someone's taste and asserting my own? yes, I see now that it would. but what compelled you to break down a series of what I'll concede are substandard even for me jokes about salsa preparation to paint me as a sincerely arrogant and malicious asshole? what have I done to be met with such scrutiny?

and all of this is extra stupid because that part of my post was a draft I forgot to delete
Click to expand...

I um erm …sorry!

I put a hidden smirk cause in my first “gatekeeping” post cause it wasn’t meant to be taken seriously. Maybe that was missed please forgive

Edit: I’m at the office checking in a bit as I work and I definitely was not invested in trying to paint you as anything. I spent all of a few minutes writing some posts and they clearly didn’t land!
 
Last edited:
TechnicalTip6578 said:
so in a sense, NG is going to be a PS4 level of power in both handheld & docked modes but the modern tech within it is what helps the games there giving a good & sometimes comparable to current/last gen games' visuals?
Click to expand...
That’s exactly it. It should be powerful enough that anything the base last gen consoles did should be easily achievable. Anything beyond that will require using these new technologies and the results are going to vary on a game-to-game basis. Because these technologies are different enough that they don’t just map to “more power” in a universal way.

TechnicalTip6578 said:
my main albeit minor question here is that if the console is comparable to PS4 in terms of power, how would stuff like Botw with 0 loading times, matrix tech demo & possibly other rumored/speculated stuff (like Mihoyo games & FF7R integrade) work there?
Click to expand...
Because they can heavily leverage those new technologies.

“No loading times” basically have nothing to do with the GPU and entirely to do with the storage tech.

Ray tracing is basically a new kind of core. NG can have next gen RT while still having “classic” GPU performance less than the PS4 while having incredible ray tracing.

Same for CPU. Same for AI.

“Power” only matters when two machines are doing the exact same thing. A jackhammer is a more powerful hammer. A laser isn’t. Nintendo is releasing a laser and your asking “how hard does it hit stuff?”
TechnicalTip6578 said:
This is what I understood as well. If it manages to hit 3.5TFLOPS raw power, that's within 15% of a PS4 Pro, and that's not accounting for architectural upgrades since a like-for-like tflops comparison doesn't take those into account.
Click to expand...
You’re exactly right but not all “architectural upgrades” make FLOPS more powerful.

The PS4 Pro is a 4 TFLOPS machine, and the architecture means all those flops can be effectively used all the time.

NG is a (possibly) 3 TFLOPS machine, but only half of them can be used effectively all the time. The other half are only available under certain conditions.

You can’t just compare flops and know roughly how two radically different architecture will perform against each other.


TechnicalTip6578 said:
Therefore, it doesn't surprise me people said 'before' DLSS, because surely it [The DLSS] can account for that 15% and way more.
Click to expand...
These people are taking an (optimistic) understanding of NG’s flops, ignoring the differences in architectures, then adding DLSS on top. It misunderstands what these GPUS are doing.
 
DDark said:
I can’t speak for Raccoon, but we had a big garden, so my dad would can a lot, and what we would do, was peel and chop up a bunch of tomatoes, as well as onions and a couple different kind of peppers. Throw them into a large stock pot with some other ingredients (herbs, canning salt, I think vinegar, etc…) and simmer. Then we’d pour that into canning jars and continue the process with the water bath, etc…

(We’d cut the veggies relatively smallish, and end up with like a chunky salsa. That’s what my sister would then blend up to make even smoother.)
Click to expand...

For me making salsas with my mom, would include a mortar and pestal, blender, or knives for different types of salas. So you can have it chunky, pulpy or smooth.

For me personally with my tacos I prefer a smoother salsa over something's pulpy. When I have tostada's, tortas, or sopes I prefer something a little more chunky. You know what I else I like to make? Guacamole on a well season mortar and pestal it's a chef's kiss.

What does this all have to do with the NG Switch? Well I can't speculate on an empty stomach lol.
 
One of my great shames is that I basically never make homemade salsa. My wife makes an incredible mango salsa though.
 
Speaking of codenames, did anyone figure out what "HAC" is supposed to mean? "HAC" obviously isn't related to NX or Indy and I'm not sure what other codename it could be referring to. I've heard "Handheld and Console" but I don't think there's much evidence to support that other than it fits.
 
Reader mode
You must log in or register to reply here.
Please read this staff post before posting.

Furthermore, according to this follow-up post, all off-topic chat will be moderated.
Last edited:


Back
Top Bottom