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StarTopic Future Nintendo Hardware & Technology Speculation & Discussion |ST| (Read the staff posts before commenting!)

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YolkFolk said:
Native 4K will be something not even worth the effort and would be a waste of resources considering the upscaling capabilities of the hardware. It’s something I would very rarely expect to see.
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Depends on how much work it takes to inject DLSS into the render pipeline for the game. There are numerous PS4 games that render at native 4K on the PS4 Pro so I wouldn't write off the ability for Drake to be able to render various Switch games at native 4K. If Drake does turn out to be 3.3 Tflop in docked mode, it will be 8x the Tegra X1 and that is without factoring in architectural advancements. I think its very much on the table that Drake can do native 4K for Switch level games that rendered at 900-1080p.
 
theguy said:
Me to this thread once the Switch 2 releases:


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Nintendo with FSR 1.0 once they have access to DLSS on NG
 
dsm said:
Can we expect the Switch 2 to be at the 400$ level or is that unrealistic and it will be more at the 450$-500$ ballpark?
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I think $400 will be about right. Maybe $450 is possible but I doubt they'll try to go higher than that.

$400 with zero plans for price drops over 6-7+ years is probably what they'll do.
 
Skittzo said:
I think $400 will be about right. Maybe $450 is possible but I doubt they'll try to go higher than that.

$400 with zero plans for price drops over 6-7+ years is probably what they'll do.
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probably profitable at that price then

anyways I assume nothing on BC was stated?
 
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I game on PC heavily but a $400 Switch 2 feels like a great value even compared to the base $400 Steam Deck (unless you really have a massive Steam library). A more convenient hybrid with an included dock and wireless controllers, Nintendo games, native optimized ports of last and current gen titles, with more efficient upscaling on these titles and a better match for 4K televisions. Presumably a larger, higher resolution screen, too. They could get away with charging $450 but I think they're aware of the inevitable cost comparisons with a PS5.
 
Giancarlo said:
Nintendo will be in the business area, possibly showing Switch sucessor to third party
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That's speculative though, not confirmed -- and yes, I'm betting on that horse too but willing to lose.
Just because something has a chance that it FEELS LIKE IT CAN BE happening isn't the same as it will be happening.

I get being hopeful about things, but there's a reason users post about being cautious about one's expectations.
 
A Quick Deconfuser on DLSS 3.5 - it's not your fault you're confused. It's Nvidia's.

DLSS is a tool for using AI to improve the visual quality of video games. DLSS 2, 3, and 3.5 each introduced major new features. Because of that, gamers tend to use the version number to refer to the feature added.

But the version you use doesn't mean you use every feature.

There are four features we care about in DLSS.

DLSS Upscaling - this was the only real feature in DLSS 1, and DLSS 2 radically changed how it worked, vastly improving. So most of the time when people say "DLSS" they mean "DLSS 2 Upscaling." It lets you take a low res game, that runs at a higher frame rate, and then keep that good frame rate while upscaling the image to a higher resolution.

DLAA - a high quality antialiasing. DLSS Upscaling always includes AA. DLAA just lets you use the anti-aliasing by itself.

DLSS-G is the official name of DLSS Frame Generation. This uses AI to make new frames between the frames the game draws directly, increasing smoothness. It was introduced in DLSS 3 so it is sometimes called DLSS 3, which is confusing, and we're all trying to stop. It is very cool, but it has lots of non-obvious limitations.

DLSS-RR short for DLSS Ray Reconstruction. This replaces part of the ray tracing pipeline with the same AI that Upscaling uses. It can vastly increase RT quality, and sometimes increases RT performance too. It was introduced in DLSS 3.5, so it is sometimes called DLSS 3.5, but I think at this point you can see how that is super fucking confusing.

These DLSS features can be combined in lots of different combinations. Just because you have DLSS 3.5 in your game, doesn't mean you are using every feature.

Just to add to the complications Every version of DLSS as brought improvements to all of these features, not just adding new ones. So in general, you want the latest version, even if you don't use any of the new features.

TL;DR: Just because the New Switch has the latest DLSS version, doesn't mean every feature is on in every game, or that they will all work on the new hardware.

DLSS upscaling and DLAA will definitely work on the New Switch.

DLSS-G will probably not though there are some smart people who think otherwise, but even those folks would recognize there are serious caveats.

DLSS-RR probably will but the tech is very early, so there isn't the kind of data out there to be super sure. Yet.
 
Lugia667 said:
will Nintendo sell it at a profit is the question? Last time they took a loss was on the Wii U and I doubt they wanna repeat that
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Nintendo already have more profit with Switch than with Wii + DS profit since several years ago (?, I think I read someone data regarding this previously, I didn't remember). So Nintendo can have 2 Wii U failure (but Switch 2 will be miles different than Wii U)
 
KeijiKG said:
That's speculative though, not confirmed -- and yes, I'm betting on that horse too but willing to lose.
Just because something has a chance that it FEELS LIKE IT CAN BE happening isn't the same as it will be happening.

I get being hopeful about things, but there's a reason users post about being cautious about one's expectations.
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But it does fit, Gamescom: Nintendo showing off Switch 2 to western devs mostly. Tokyo Game show: Nintendo showing off Switch 2 to Japanese devs mostly.
 
KeijiKG said:
That's speculative though, not confirmed -- and yes, I'm betting on that horse too but willing to lose.
Just because something has a chance that it FEELS LIKE IT CAN BE happening isn't the same as it will be happening.

I get being hopeful about things, but there's a reason users post about being cautious about one's expectations.
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Nintendo showed Switch sucessor for third parties at Gamescom 2023, why questioning this coundt happen at Tokyo Game Show 2023
 
Goodtwin said:
Depends on how much work it takes to inject DLSS into the render pipeline for the game. There are numerous PS4 games that render at native 4K on the PS4 Pro so I wouldn't write off the ability for Drake to be able to render various Switch games at native 4K. If Drake does turn out to be 3.3 Tflop in docked mode, it will be 8x the Tegra X1 and that is without factoring in architectural advancements. I think its very much on the table that Drake can do native 4K for Switch level games that rendered at 900-1080p.
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There’s no reason to do native anything when it has DLSS baked in (Unless the game doesn’t support it obv).
 
You know all this talk about power reminds me, how are they going to deal with the cooling on this thing, is it going to have a jet turbine behind it that can also work as a personal hover board with how much air it propelled.
 
LongDrake said:
You know all this talk about power reminds me, how are they going to deal with the cooling on this thing, is it going to have a jet turbine behind it that can also work as a personal hover board with how much air it propelled.
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it just won't clock as high to need a massive cooler
 
Devs seeing the matrix demo on switch 2 at gamescom.

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Insiders hearing the rumours from said Devs.

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Fami reading the Eurogamer and VGC articles today.

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Me finishing work and reading Fami.
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Joke aside I bet Nvidia also worked on the cooling solution to the thing like their GPU and if Gamer Nexus has shown its very sophisticated
 
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Pacobob said:
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Also, I'm not sure if we went over this, but are there any potential optimizations/performance gains to be made from adjusting DLSS for set spec? Whether it's getting frametimes down or improving image quality? I'm beginning to wonder if Drake being the only thing so far that is 1. running DLSS and 2. has set specs across the board might be why the demos behind closed doors have been so impressive.
 
Bnois said:
@NateDrake a little while ago you told us that developers weren’t shown new hardware at Gamescom. Since Eurogamer is reporting on it now, was it something you didn’t know about or prefered not to disclouse?
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I specifically said they did not show press. I never said they didn't show developers. Literally, everyone noticed that I only mentioned the press portion of his tweet being wrong.

Godhound said:
@NateDrake considering that media outlets already sharing more than you were able to share previously, would you like to add something to that from what you've heard? Or it's the same stuff we know now from Eurogamer and VGC?
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Largely the same stuff, with a few things I could add, but I'm reluctant to do so; as a few of my contacts from Gamescom are pissed off that EG/VGC ran reports on this right now.

All I'll add here is that there were no playable demos, as this thread speculated. No one played Switch Successor at Gamescom. Only tech demos were shown, and some were shown, as mentioned, on hardware with "target specs" or via a video capture. To my understanding, there was no actual Switch 2 hardware on display -- if there were, it may have been a devkit but there was no final hardware shown to partners.
 
NateDrake said:
I specifically said they did not show press. I never said they didn't show developers. Literally, everyone noticed that I only mentioned the press portion of his tweet being wrong.



Largely the same stuff, with a few things I could add, but I'm reluctant to do so; as a few of my contacts from Gamescom are pissed off that EG/VGC ran reports on this right now.

All I'll add here is that there were no playable demos, as this thread speculated. No one played Switch Successor at Gamescom. Only tech demos were shown, and some were shown, as mentioned, on hardware with "target specs" or via a video capture. To my understanding, there was no actual Switch 2 hardware on display -- if there were, it may have been a devkit but there was no final hardware shown to partners.
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i take it what you heard is what VGC & Eurogamers more or less reported? There is a lot of doubt in the other place that the UE5 demo runs on the Switch 2.
 
NateDrake said:
I specifically said they did not show press. I never said they didn't show developers. Literally, everyone noticed that I only mentioned the press portion of his tweet being wrong.



Largely the same stuff, with a few things I could add, but I'm reluctant to do so; as a few of my contacts from Gamescom are pissed off that EG/VGC ran reports on this right now.
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By the same stuff, does that include the Matrix Awakens demo?
 
SoldierDelta said:
Considering it's using Ray-tracing, one of the things i had big doubts about for the system, and apparently looks good... on-god we're in for a great console.

Still wondering if Nintendo will ever use RT in their games though. Probably a bit too annoying to get working for them, but we'll see.
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Nvidia effectively confirmed ray tracing for the successor 4 years ago. They were never going to proceed to leave this feature out of the next Nintendo platform. Steam Deck has it. The S22 series of phones had it. Current PS/XBox systems have it. It’s an industry standard in so many spaces, and a technology that’s been mainstream since 2018. Of course Nintendo will use it. There is also a Common Endeavour here - Nintendo can get Nvidia’s tech into over 140m pairs of hands outside of the PC arena. THAT is why future Nintendo hardware is an exciting prospect.
 
NateDrake said:
I specifically said they did not show press. I never said they didn't show developers. Literally, everyone noticed that I only mentioned the press portion of his tweet being wrong.



Largely the same stuff, with a few things I could add, but I'm reluctant to do so; as a few of my contacts from Gamescom are pissed off that EG/VGC ran reports on this right now.

All I'll add here is that there were no playable demos, as this thread speculated. No one played Switch Successor at Gamescom. Only tech demos were shown, and some were shown, as mentioned, on hardware with "target specs" or via a video capture. To my understanding, there was no actual Switch 2 hardware on display -- if there were, it may have been a devkit but there was no final hardware shown to partners.
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Dang they’re mad at EG/VGC? But isn’t this how it works? They probably have different sources that had no problem with the articles being ran. While some of yours take issue with it
 
NateDrake said:
All I'll add here is that there were no playable demos, as this thread speculated. No one played Switch Successor at Gamescom. Only tech demos were shown, and some were shown, as mentioned, on hardware with "target specs" or via a video capture. To my understanding, there was no actual Switch 2 hardware on display -- if there were, it may have been a devkit but there was no final hardware shown to partners.
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in your opinion nate, do you think Nintendo used Matrix to showcase what the hardware is capable of? (when it comes to specs & ofc the usage of DLSS)
 
NateDrake said:
I specifically said they did not show press. I never said they didn't show developers. Literally, everyone noticed that I only mentioned the press portion of his tweet being wrong.



Largely the same stuff, with a few things I could add, but I'm reluctant to do so; as a few of my contacts from Gamescom are pissed off that EG/VGC ran reports on this right now.

All I'll add here is that there were no playable demos, as this thread speculated. No one played Switch Successor at Gamescom. Only tech demos were shown, and some were shown, as mentioned, on hardware with "target specs" or via a video capture. To my understanding, there was no actual Switch 2 hardware on display -- if there were, it may have been a devkit but there was no final hardware shown to partners.
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I’m curious if you know the extent of those tech demos, specifically if the Matrix demo was running with full Nanite and Lumen, because that could be a big boon for UE5 games releasing on Switch 2
 
TechnicalTip6578 said:
in your opinion nate, do you think Nintendo used Matrix to showcase what the hardware is capable of? (when it comes to specs & ofc the usage of DLSS)
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Yes, but, as reported, it was shown on hardware targeting Switch Successor specs and not Switch Successor itself. Such a demo would be beneficial to Nintendo in the sense it shows that the hardware could do --when using DLSS features-- & aids Epic to market UE5 as a viable option to partners making games for the device.

ezidro3 said:
I’m curious if you know the extent of those tech demos, specifically if the Matrix demo was running with full Nanite and Lumen, because that could be a big boon for UE5 games releasing on Switch 2
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I have a few details about how it ran on the target spec hardware -- but am reluctant to share such details right now.
 
Serif said:
It's more than the Series S.
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WHEW. Well hopefully the OS doesn't eat up too much then too. I was hoping for a "more Nintendo" OS along the lines of the Wii U or 3DS, but if they go with something lightweight again so the system can play bigger games, I'd be ok with that.
 
LongDrake said:
You know all this talk about power reminds me, how are they going to deal with the cooling on this thing, is it going to have a jet turbine behind it that can also work as a personal hover board with how much air it propelled.
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Power consumption is probably... basically the same as the original Nintendo Switch.

So, heat dissipation is probably. Basically the same as the original Nintendo Switch. A vent at the top with the heat sink, a heat pipe to the SOC, and air intakes at the bottom, flowing through an aluminium channel cooling the midplate and thus anything thermally connected to it.

If anything changes, I could see the heat pipe getting a LOT shorter- or gone altogether. SOC and RAM, paste on top, then a vapour chamber-heat sink in a single unit, so the SOC is either in line with the vent, or just off to the side. Could be more efficient.
 
Two things from the reports stood out for me.

Firstly, the BotW demo pretty much confirmed that Switch NG will be backward compatible. It is rather unlikely that Nintendo rebuilt a whole a** game just for a tech demo. This is a patched Switch game, running on the successor hardware.

As for the Matrix Awakens demo, I wonder what it said about the storage speed of Switch NG:



At what storage speed it can achieve “visuals comparable to Sony‘s and Microsoft’s current-gen consoles”?
 
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