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StarTopic Future Nintendo Hardware & Technology Speculation & Discussion |ST| (Read the staff posts before commenting!)

Ehhhhh, I don't know, I think it's worth somewhat entertaining. Yes, having Metroid as a launch title is risky, untested ground. But it could very well surpass sales expectations, at least outside Japan. When you take cross-gen into consideration as well, Metroid could go from a niche fan favorite to something far greater. I would be fine if it hit 5 million, but I wouldn't discount its potential to go even higher. As I've stated earlier, just because it hasn't been done before, it doesn't mean it can't now.
Speaking bluntly, the only way Metroid becomes a blockbuster flagship franchise is if it strips away everything fans like about the series. A slow-paced sci-fi shooter with maze gameplay and minimal story is not going to cut it. So if people want Metroid to break out into the mainstream, I don't think they're gonna like what that would require.

I like Metroid games. I consider myself a Metroid fan. I don't think fans often appreciate the fact that this series continues to get games at all is a minor miracle. If Metroid was a Square or Capcom series, it would have been binned a long time ago or transformed into something unrecognizable.
 
Didn’t the SV DLC leaker also say the second DLC wave was coming in early 2024 while it’s currently set for Winter 2023?

And why would Nintendo keep secrecy this late. Even if we accepted that Nintendo wanted to wait after TOTK, why do this Direct the way they did if Nintendo was going to announce it so soon? There’s secrecy and then there’s undermining your marketing plan by waiting ludicrously late to even begin discussion new console plans.

They have to keep secrecy on the timeline to not blow their current sales

If they announce Switch 2 in July for March 2024, no one would buy the Switch 1 during Christmas and everyone would be waiting for March

Same scenario if they announce the Switch 2 this October for March 2024, that would be bad on their end because holiday is where they make the most money

That’s why they need to keep a announcement to release date very tight (3-4 months max) and strategic to maximise their profits
 
Be pretty funny if this thing does come out with Prime 4 and it smashes records and then some. I wouldn't expect it to do Breath of the Wild numbers, but I think we're getting a little too comfortable underselling its potential. Even with the constant hiatuses and modest numbers, Metroid is more important than I think a lot of y'all are willing to admit, same with Pikmin and even Star Fox. They'll all get their chance to shine one day and Pikmin is looking to get there first. Also try to respond a little less condescendingly to posts you don't agree with and don't try to be too stubborn, it's getting annoying.
 
Be pretty funny if this thing does come out with Prime 4 and it smashes records and then some. I wouldn't expect it to do Breath of the Wild numbers, but I think we're getting a little too comfortable underselling its potential. Even with the constant hiatuses and modest numbers, Metroid is more important than I think a lot of y'all are willing to admit, same with Pikmin and even Star Fox. They'll all get their chance to shine one day and Pikmin is looking to get there first. Also try to respond a little less condescendingly to posts you don't agree with and don't try to be too stubborn, it's getting annoying.

The thing is that it just makes sense that they would use a heavy graphic/performance title for launch, we talking about a console as powerful as a Steam Deck which would be the first time Nintendo pulls something like that out of their hat

MP4 would be the perfect contender even if not a huge seller as Mario
 
Speaking bluntly, the only way Metroid becomes a blockbuster flagship franchise is if it strips away everything fans like about the series. A slow-paced sci-fi shooter with maze gameplay and minimal story is not going to cut it. So if people want Metroid to break out into the mainstream, I don't think they're gonna like what that would require.

I like Metroid games. I consider myself a Metroid fan. I don't think fans often appreciate the fact that this series continues to get games at all is a minor miracle. If Metroid was a Square or Capcom series, it would have been binned a long time ago or transformed into something unrecognizable.
Disagree, you can make a franchise have a wider appeal while keeping the spirit of what it represents intact. I don't want to accuse you of undervaluing the series strengths, but I don't see why those core aspects wouldn't work if they were kept in Prime 4.
 
Be pretty funny if this thing does come out with Prime 4 and it smashes records and then some. I wouldn't expect it to do Breath of the Wild numbers, but I think we're getting a little too comfortable underselling its potential. Even with the constant hiatuses and modest numbers, Metroid is more important than I think a lot of y'all are willing to admit, same with Pikmin and even Star Fox. They'll all get their chance to shine one day and Pikmin is looking to get there first. Also try to respond a little less condescendingly to posts you don't agree with and don't try to be too stubborn, it's getting annoying.
I think we're well past the point of not trying to be too stubborn.
 
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Speaking bluntly, the only way Metroid becomes a blockbuster flagship franchise is if it strips away everything fans like about the series. A slow-paced sci-fi shooter with maze gameplay and minimal story is not going to cut it. So if people want Metroid to break out into the mainstream, I don't think they're gonna like what that would require.

I like Metroid games. I consider myself a Metroid fan. I don't think fans often appreciate the fact that this series continues to get games at all is a minor miracle. If Metroid was a Square or Capcom series, it would have been binned a long time ago or transformed into something unrecognizable.
I'm afraid I agree.

The same way hardcore Zelda fans hate BotW, hardcore Metroid fans would hate a proper evolution of Metroid.

- "I hate these open spaces with so much to do, I need there to be only one corridor to go"!

Dread was amazing, in its own genre. Prime needs a lot of work to go mainstream.

It needs to rival Mass Effect, Dead Space or even Starfield.
Only then would I consider it a system seller.

Samus could be quite a character in the gaming industry it gameplay and story were on par.
 
Disagree, you can make a franchise have a wider appeal while keeping the spirit of what it represents intact. I don't want to accuse you of undervaluing the series strengths, but I don't see why those core aspects wouldn't work if they were kept in Prime 4.
Considering floating basic ideas like having NPCs who are not just faceless goons is met with a lot of resistance; it very much feels like the series doesn’t have a ton of strengths when described by fans.
 
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I know this thread is in danger of going too off topic, but I gotta ask. Does Prime really need that big of a shake up to go mainstream? I think we're underselling Prime's appeal and are just saying things without going really in depth as to what the series actually needs and what it doesn't. There are things I want to see the series do, myself, but I don't think that what comes before doesn't work anymore or whatever (I know that wasn't necessarily said by some of y'all, but still).

Someone should probably make a thread about it.
 
I'm afraid I agree.

The same way hardcore Zelda fans hate BotW, hardcore Metroid fans would hate a proper evolution of Metroid.

- "I hate these open spaces with so much to do, I need there to be only one corridor to go"!

Dread was amazing, in its own genre. Prime needs a lot of work to go mainstream.

It needs to rival Mass Effect, Dead Space or even Starfield.
Only then would I consider it a system seller.

Samus could be quite a character in the gaming industry it gameplay and story were on par.
I think Nintendo (or Retro in this case) can make a Metroid Prime game with more open areas (not open world but a very unlinear gameplay system) and a BOTW/TOTK physics base systems.

It isn't easy to not deviate the topic as they will not probably significant HW until late this year.
 
They have to keep secrecy on the timeline to not blow their current sales

If they announce Switch 2 in July for March 2024, no one would buy the Switch 1 during Christmas and everyone would be waiting for March

Same scenario if they announce the Switch 2 this October for March 2024, that would be bad on their end because holiday is where they make the most money

That’s why they need to keep a announcement to release date very tight (3-4 months max) and strategic to maximise their profits

I can't say I agree at all.

The sort of people who would be buying the Switch on its SEVENTH year would not be the sort of people to hold off to get something bigger, better beefier months later. Meanwhile the sort of people who are likely to buy the new Switch at launch are almost exclusively people who ALREADY have a Switch, and backwards compatibility means it wouldn't slow sales of software either.
 
I know this thread is in danger of going too off topic, but I gotta ask. Does Prime really need that big of a shake up to go mainstream? I think we're underselling Prime's appeal and are just saying things without going really in depth as to what the series actually needs and what it doesn't. There are things I want to see the series do, myself, but I don't think that what comes before doesn't work anymore or whatever (I know that wasn't necessarily said by some of y'all, but still).

Someone should probably make a thread about it.
Short of shaking things up, what would happen to make Metroid suddenly reach something like that 10m tier? It's been the big holiday game, though for a low-performing console. It was still pushed as a pretty big release for the much more successful Wii. The first Prime had a beautified rerelease on Switch that was extremely well received but hasn't blown up the charts or anything. So it doesn't seem to me like it's just a series that's been perpetually unlucky and never given a chance at making a name for itself as-is. I think a well-received Prime 4 that is very like the previous ones could become the top game in the series, sure, but it's still asking a lot for it to do something like double or triple the previous series high if it doesn't appeal in some new way.
 
They have to keep secrecy on the timeline to not blow their current sales

If they announce Switch 2 in July for March 2024, no one would buy the Switch 1 during Christmas and everyone would be waiting for March
I'm generally an agreeer on the "don't announce before Christmas for a post-Christmas hardware", but I thought the whole line of replies that led to here was about it still having a shot at late 2023, which is a very different thing.
 
I'm generally an agreeer on the "don't announce before Christmas for a post-Christmas hardware", but I thought the whole line of replies that led to here was about it still having a shot at late 2023, which is a very different thing.

There is still a shot at late 2023.

We will know by the 15th July for sure
 
I know this thread is in danger of going too off topic, but I gotta ask. Does Prime really need that big of a shake up to go mainstream? I think we're underselling Prime's appeal and are just saying things without going really in depth as to what the series actually needs and what it doesn't. There are things I want to see the series do, myself, but I don't think that what comes before doesn't work anymore or whatever (I know that wasn't necessarily said by some of y'all, but still).

Someone should probably make a thread about it.
We’ve had a few threads on this, not specifically Prime4.
  • Gameplay wise: Metroid could definitely improve in the combat department since I think it mediocre to serviceable. Could definitely open up more, both in abilities & map, to be more free-flowing & creative. I think they need to start moving away from de-powering Samus & doors that need a specific item that can’t be acquired for another 12hrs. I also think they need to stop bolting stuff onto completion time %. That’s off the top of my head; I’m sure there is more there.
  • Writing wise: Metroid needs to do better period. For outside audiences what really is there to latch onto here. Samus’ character? The nonexistent world building? The colorful cast of supporting characters? Enthusiasts may reference the manga no one read but for peopl outside that they are gonna need more.
There is work that Metroid needs to do to reach the lofty heights some have for the series. For me Metroid doing well initially is not the problem. Where to watch would be the legs & sequel performance. Dread really hasn’t changed the narrative about poor legs & the jury is out on sequel performance. I’m remain skeptical Prime 4 can change that.
 
Short of shaking things up, what would happen to make Metroid suddenly reach something like that 10m tier? It's been the big holiday game, though for a low-performing console. It was still pushed as a pretty big release for the much more successful Wii. The first Prime had a beautified rerelease on Switch that was extremely well received but hasn't blown up the charts or anything. So it doesn't seem to me like it's just a series that's been perpetually unlucky and never given a chance at making a name for itself as-is. I think a well-received Prime 4 that is very like the previous ones could become the top game in the series, sure, but it's still asking a lot for it to do something like double or triple the previous series high if it doesn't appeal in some new way.
Fair enough. I just think we're overblowing the significance of shaking up the formula. @LoneRanger suggested a more open-ended format could work, maybe something like the 2D games. Metroid, to me, doesn't seem to be in need of any drastic innovations, especially at the cost of its identity.
 
Also try to respond a little less condescendingly to posts you don't agree with and don't try to be too stubborn, it's getting annoying.
This is the hardware speculation thread. It's a data driven enterprise. The launch title is relevant only inasmuch as we can infer something about timing/performance/strategy from it.

There is a user who signed up yesterday who has posted over 60 messages to this thread, with a perspective that is unique, and I will say, not strongly supported by the data. That's fine - great even - but if you're new to a community, have a perspective different from that community as a whole, and have no sense of the community's values or decorum and then proceed to absolutely dominate the conversation by sheer volume of messages - well, expect some pushback.

It's not even that I disagree with that person (whom I have now ignored, no malice, it's just a volume thing). It's that if you come into our house and yell all the time, expect a strong response.

I don't expect that person to change their mind, but when exposed to different viewpoints, they simply reassert their original claims. Respectfully, that's what's stubborn.

I love Metroid. It is maybe my #2 franchise period. I think the Batman games have proven that Prime-like games can have a market. This has nothing to do with Metroid.

You can be the loudest voice in the room, you can have a minority opinion, and you can be indifferent to the way the thread operates. You cannot be all three.

To be clear - you aren't! You're great! But this conversation isn't being driven by the folks you're responding to.
 
We’ve had a few threads on this, not specifically Prime4.
  • Gameplay wise: Metroid could definitely improve in the combat department since I think it mediocre to serviceable. Could definitely open up more, both in abilities & map, to be more free-flowing & creative. I think they need to start moving away from de-powering Samus & doors that need a specific item that can’t be acquired for another 12hrs. I also think they need to stop bolting stuff onto completion time %. That’s off the top of my head; I’m sure there is more there.
  • Writing wise: Metroid needs to do better period. For outside audiences what really is there to latch onto here. Samus’ character? The nonexistent world building? The colorful cast of supporting characters? Enthusiasts may reference the manga no one read but for peopl outside that they are gonna need more.
There is work that Metroid needs to do to reach the lofty heights some have for the series. For me Metroid doing well initially is not the problem. Where to watch would be the legs & sequel performance. Dread really hasn’t changed the narrative about poor legs & the jury is out on sequel performance. I’m remain skeptical Prime 4 can change that.
Disagree a bit on the world building and combat as well as Dread not doing much to shift the narrative, but everything else I can agree with. I can see a more story focused Prime game that greatly iterates on combat and exploration. We saw pieces of that in Prime 3, but it was also too easy.
 
This is the hardware speculation thread. It's a data driven enterprise. The launch title is relevant only inasmuch as we can infer something about timing/performance/strategy from it.

There is a user who signed up yesterday who has posted over 60 messages to this thread, with a perspective that is unique, and I will say, not strongly supported by the data. That's fine - great even - but if you're new to a community, have a perspective different from that community as a whole, and have no sense of the community's values or decorum and then proceed to absolutely dominate the conversation by sheer volume of messages - well, expect some pushback.

It's not even that I disagree with that person (whom I have now ignored, no malice, it's just a volume thing). It's that if you come into our house and yell all the time, expect a strong response.

I don't expect that person to change their mind, but when exposed to different viewpoints, they simply reassert their original claims. Respectfully, that's what's stubborn.

I love Metroid. It is maybe my #2 franchise period. I think the Batman games have proven that Prime-like games can have a market. This has nothing to do with Metroid.

You can be the loudest voice in the room, you can have a minority opinion, and you can be indifferent to the way the thread operates. You cannot be all three.

To be clear - you aren't! You're great! But this conversation isn't being driven by the folks you're responding to.
I agree, but I don't think they were acting in a way that justifies those strong responses. Fwiw, the second part of my rant was also directed at them; digging your heels in will only do so much.
 
This is the hardware speculation thread. It's a data driven enterprise. The launch title is relevant only inasmuch as we can infer something about timing/performance/strategy from it.

There is a user who signed up yesterday who has posted over 60 messages to this thread, with a perspective that is unique, and I will say, not strongly supported by the data. That's fine - great even - but if you're new to a community, have a perspective different from that community as a whole, and have no sense of the community's values or decorum and then proceed to absolutely dominate the conversation by sheer volume of messages - well, expect some pushback.

It's not even that I disagree with that person (whom I have now ignored, no malice, it's just a volume thing). It's that if you come into our house and yell all the time, expect a strong response.

I don't expect that person to change their mind, but when exposed to different viewpoints, they simply reassert their original claims. Respectfully, that's what's stubborn.

I love Metroid. It is maybe my #2 franchise period. I think the Batman games have proven that Prime-like games can have a market. This has nothing to do with Metroid.

You can be the loudest voice in the room, you can have a minority opinion, and you can be indifferent to the way the thread operates. You cannot be all three.

To be clear - you aren't! You're great! But this conversation isn't being driven by the folks you're responding to.
I usually don't like to broadcast such a thing but when they said that Metroid Prime Remastered only looked "okay," and that the Mario Galaxy remaster looked better, I figured they were not someone worth continuing a conversation with and also put them on ignore before I said something even more mean.

Also, I'm very fatigued by how often Metroid discussion is dominated by fantasizing about it being a Mario/Zelda tier sales pillar rather than anything based on actual numbers, but that's a bit of a tangent.
 
Disagree a bit on the world building and combat as well as Dread not doing much to shift the narrative, but everything else I can agree with. I can see a more story focused Prime game that greatly iterates on combat and exploration. We saw pieces of that in Prime 3, but it was also too easy.
Overall world building is pretty woeful on a macro scale. On a micro scale it is okay.
I’ve only really had fun with 3D Metroid combat with Other M. I don’t find find good & the drop from Prime 1 to 2 kinda speaks to this. Dread was a step in the right direction but I still think it needs more.
We’ll have to wait for the next White Book how it’s progressed but we aren’t seeing something like XC2 or Kirby type legs.
 
I disagree with the notion that at launch, an exclusive title earmarked for 8 digit sales is necessary. I look at PS5 and say, Spider-Man was cross-gen. Where were the launch exclusives? Returnal was just under half a year later. Ratchet & Clank was just over half a year later.

I think that if Drake were to be released in time for holidays this year, then it is viable for The Next 3D Mario to be Drake-exclusive and launch in holiday 2024. Until then, I think that with the Switch brand now established, as far as exclusives go, you can survive off a steady stream of 7 digit sellers (both known 7 digit locks and attempts to raise dormant IPs to 7 digits) and 3rd party titles.

To continue on the 3rd party point, yes, the emergence of handheld PCs may have diluted the "AAA on the go" appeal to enthusiasts in general. But it was also brought up earlier about how there is no small amount of people who buy a system just to play certain one/two/three franchises. If you can secure the likes of full featured FIFA/Madden/COD, you gain access to a not-insignificant crowd. I am guessing that "FIFA/Madden/COD in your hands/on the go!" will appeal to a large enough segment such that handheld PCs flat out won't have the volume to satisfy for a while yet. There may even be a generation's worth of time to lock down the position of being the "$400 mobile FIFA/Madden/NBA 2K/MLB The Show/COD machine".
Of course, I'm not saying that being able to receive Elden Ring or <insert Capcom title> is useless. I'd dig them. You'd dig them. Even dimished, there's still enthusiasts/critics value to them. But just from a raw numbers perspective, enthusiast discussion may have a blind spot or two.

Alright, while your mouth is agape from my sheer audacity to suggest that a 8 digit launch exclusive isn't necessary, I can proceed to cram more down your throat. Maybe I'll eventually get wild enough to channel Michael Keaton's Batman encounter with Jack Nicholson's Joker ("You wanna get nuts!? Let's get nuts!"). (edit: my apologies to Mr. Keaton for misspelling his name the first time around)

It is now not unlikely for the September Direct to shadowdrop a GCN/Wii game. F-Zero is apparently the board favorite, due to having the most chatter. That can potentially set up for a Drake-exclusive F-Zero for the holidays. The plus side of this approach is that the F-Zero remaster can be the entry for the people only on base Switch, while the next F-Zero can utilize the opportunity exclusivity offers to go balls to the wall.
And/or it could be Wave Race: Blue Storm that's the GCN shadowdrop, thus setting up a launch exclusive Wave Race showcasing next level water physics.
...damnit, if only there was something to drop to setup a new Pilotwings.
Or hell, revive another IP, or even try to create a new one. The goal here is not to necessarily restrain yourself to preconceived notions of designing a broad appeal, 8 digit seller, but instead to test the limits of both hardware and your creativity. Push the bounds. Show the public the different sort of ideas and tricks that Nintendo can pull out with this new machine. Get us thinking, "Between Tears of the Kingdom and these, I, I, can't eve-, I can't even conceive of what the next big Zelda will be like."

In the meantime, why can't Super Mario Bros. Wonder be a cross-gen flagship title? Does a Drake-enhancement/bonus for a cross-gen have to be something strictly within the domain of visuals? What about cute/silly little bonuses?
Here's one on my mind: Leave the core game untouched, but instead add a new multiplayer mode (or two). Not just regular multiplayer, but... large multiplayer.
"Oh, so you're thinking of Super Mario Bros. 35"
No!...but also, yes, why not. That could be another mode (hence the 'or two' above). But the 'No!' is because what I had in mind originally was, "Why not go beyond 4 players within the same instance?" What about 8? 16? 32? Or 64 players all running around in the same instance of a level.
Granted, level design probably is not suited for that whatsoever, so new levels specifically for large number of players would have to be created. But ooh, the potential for levels to get funky if expressly designed for a lot of shenanigans to potentially happen simultaneously.

One last note:
I observe that Good-Feel has been busy recently with their upcoming Goemon spiritual successor. So if there's a Yoshi gaming coming out anytime soon, it's not by them. And it has been past 4 years since the last Yoshi title. Which means that there's still a timeline out there where we get a Yoshi's Island based god game/life simulator for Drake. I can still force us into that timeline through sheer willpower! ✊
 
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Metroid's best selling game is at barely 3 million, a Metroid game from a subseries that hasn't seen a new release in 15 years isn't doing 10 million.
 
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We’ve had a few threads on this, not specifically Prime4.
  • Gameplay wise: Metroid could definitely improve in the combat department since I think it mediocre to serviceable. Could definitely open up more, both in abilities & map, to be more free-flowing & creative. I think they need to start moving away from de-powering Samus & doors that need a specific item that can’t be acquired for another 12hrs. I also think they need to stop bolting stuff onto completion time %. That’s off the top of my head; I’m sure there is more there.
  • Writing wise: Metroid needs to do better period. For outside audiences what really is there to latch onto here. Samus’ character? The nonexistent world building? The colorful cast of supporting characters? Enthusiasts may reference the manga no one read but for peopl outside that they are gonna need more.
There is work that Metroid needs to do to reach the lofty heights some have for the series. For me Metroid doing well initially is not the problem. Where to watch would be the legs & sequel performance. Dread really hasn’t changed the narrative about poor legs & the jury is out on sequel performance. I’m remain skeptical Prime 4 can change that.
I feel like they are going all in on metroid 4. They know they need this. Botw went big and brought in a lot of new players. They changed conventions, added voice acting, did their own take on an open world. I've been there since OOT. It felt different from the formula but had enough to make it feel like part of the fam.
They will figure it out for MP4. Kind of how MP brought MP into the modern lexicon when people thought 1st person would never work. The reason I actually chimed in is I heard they hired some writers with some known bodies of work. Read this a while ago, so I can't remember the details. But it seemed like they were getting abit serious with the story aspects. Hoping for more bests like Dread, but even more. I guess they eent this toute with prime 3 already. Looking up yhose writer details Will make for a good google deep dive. I am one of these people who preordered mp4 when amazon still had the preorder deal. Anyway, I feel Nintendo are gonna make this a modern evolution of the mp franchise being aware of what gamers expect in 202X but in a nintendo way. I also feel they have taken a gamble and are betting on this to fill that void that nintendo gamers or cross platform gamers can get excited about. Plus all the backlog of switch games. Nintendo always benefits from bc. Wii and their hand held divisions.

Edited: clarity, grammer, typos.
 
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I disagree with the notion that at launch, an exclusive title earmarked for 8 digit sales is necessary.
Absolutely agree...


I look at PS5 and say, Spider-Man was cross-gen. Where were the launch exclusives? Returnal was just under half a year later. Ratchet & Clank was just over half a year later.
...but!

Sony had just sold folks a PS4 Pro 4 years earlier. This reset the clock in a number of ways. It slowed down first party development, as Sony needed to deliver 4k experiences on the platform, and it tapped the users who are usually first to move to the next console.

Sony likely didn't have much of a choice but to continue to support the PS4 for an extended amount of time, simply due to dev resources and need to recoup costs, and Sony had established the idea of a reduced/enhanced experience across console versions. What started as a 4k/HD division because 4k60/4k30/1080p30.

It's impossible to actually tell how well this gambit worked for Sony overall, as demand for game consoles was at a fever pitch by the time the PS5 launched, and millions of ex-gamers and new gamers suddenly couldn't leave their house, and the chip shortage constrained Sony's ability to deliver any system period.

Sony could deliver the same game across 3 consoles that were all with 2.5x of each other, and then use that to drive console sales to their OMGGRAPHIX core market. I find it harder to believe that Nintendo could deliver the same game across 2 consoles that are over 6x performance difference between them, and then use that to drive console sales to their "i don't care how dogshit it looks, i wants pokeman" market

But maybe that is a lack of imagination on my part. :)

I will say, gently, that the same crowd who seem to think that Nintendo can and will launch the console quickly, with a cross-gen library, are the often the same folks who seem to be most optimistic about the device's core performance. I don't care if it's the TARDIS, if the library is substantially cross-gen, then you and David Tennant are going to be playing lightly uprezzed Switch games together.

The PS4 still had legs by the time the PS5 came out and it made sense to run on them. But I feel like the move here is, instead, to simply run out the Switch's legs entirely before moving on. I could be wrong!
 
Demon’s Soul remake
Thanks, completely slipped my mind!
And casual searching around shows that it... only hit 1.4 million copies after almost a year? Another case of critical darling, but not a commercial flagship, huh.
Absolutely agree...



...but!
<snip (Context is appreciated!)>

Sony could deliver the same game across 3 consoles that were all with 2.5x of each other, and then use that to drive console sales to their OMGGRAPHIX core market. I find it harder to believe that Nintendo could deliver the same game across 2 consoles that are over 6x performance difference between them, and then use that to drive console sales to their "i don't care how dogshit it looks, i wants pokeman" market

But maybe that is a lack of imagination on my part. :)

I will say, gently, that the same crowd who seem to think that Nintendo can and will launch the console quickly, with a cross-gen library, are the often the same folks who seem to be most optimistic about the device's core performance. I don't care if it's the TARDIS, if the library is substantially cross-gen, then you and David Tennant are going to be playing lightly uprezzed Switch games together.

The PS4 still had legs by the time the PS5 came out and it made sense to run on them. But I feel like the move here is, instead, to simply run out the Switch's legs entirely before moving on. I could be wrong!
Yea, I gotta admit that cross-gen can be a risky gambit for Nintendo's market. But I do think it is doable, and that gameplay-related bonuses/additions is the how. I'm just not creative enough for more examples :unsure:
(because really; "large number of players in the same instance!" for Wonder is just brute force scaling up the amount of stuff to calculate, right? :p)
 
I feel like they are going all in on metroid 4. They know they need this. Botw went big and brought in a lot of new players. They changed conventions, added voice acting, did their own take on an open world. I've been there since OOT. It felt different from the formula but had enough to make it feel like part of the fam.
They will figure it out for MP4. Kind of how MP brought MP into the modern lexicon when people thought 1st person would never work. The reason I actually chimed in is I heard they hired some writers with some known bodies of work. Read this a while ago, so I can't remember the details. But it seemed like they were getting abit serious with the story aspects. Hoping for more bests like Dread, but even more. I guess they eent this toute with prime 3 already. Looking up yhose writer details Will make for a good google deep dive. I am one of these people who preordered mp4 when amazon still had the preorder deal. Anyway, I feel Nintendo are gonna make this a modern evolution of the mp franchise being aware of what gamers expect in 202X but in a nintendo way. I also feel they have taken a gamble and are betting on this to fill that void that nintendo gamers or cross platform gamers can get excited about. Plus all the backlog of switch games. Nintendo always benefits from bc. Wii and their hand held divisions.

Edited: clarity, grammer, typos.
This is exactly what I’m talking about. People place incredibly lofty expectations on Metroid and then get disappointed when they don’t meet them (like saying Dread’s sales are disappointing even when it’s literally the best selling Metroid). Games like BOTW don’t grow on trees. Probably best if we wait to see a trailer until we decide exactly what this game is.
 
I feel like they are going all in on metroid 4. They know they need this. Botw went big and brought in a lot of new players. They changed conventions, added voice acting, did their own take on an open world. I've been there since OOT. It felt different from the formula but had enough to make it feel like part of the fam.
They will figure it out for MP4. Kind of how MP brought MP into the modern lexicon when people thought 1st person would never work. The reason I actually chimed in is I heard they hired some writers with some known bodies of work. Read this a while ago, so I can't remember the details. But it seemed like they were getting abit serious with the story aspects. Hoping for more bests like Dread, but even more. I guess they eent this toute with prime 3 already. Looking up yhose writer details Will make for a good google deep dive. I am one of these people who preordered mp4 when amazon still had the preorder deal. Anyway, I feel Nintendo are gonna make this a modern evolution of the mp franchise being aware of what gamers expect in 202X but in a nintendo way. I also feel they have taken a gamble and are betting on this to fill that void that nintendo gamers or cross platform gamers can get excited about. Plus all the backlog of switch games. Nintendo always benefits from bc. Wii and their hand held divisions.

Edited: clarity, grammer, typos.
Without knowing who the writers are or their works it’s hard to gauge that statement. We’ve seen moves like that in the past so it doesn’t always mean much. Ultimately the trailer will answer some of our questions but I’m gonna remain skeptical till then.
I would say it would probably behoove Nintendo, if MP4 is a launch title, to have something with a wide reach & able to sell in all territories.
 
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Its going to be crippling depressing if we reach February 2024 and still have heard nothing about this supposed device
At that point, it'll be a Holiday release. I can only hope they have some way to offset the diminishing returns in sales until then. While they're doing much better than during the last years of the Wii, I really don't like that they seem to be coasting. I guess Covid really threw things off track, but still.
 
This is exactly what I’m talking about. People place incredibly lofty expectations on Metroid and then get disappointed when they don’t meet them (like saying Dread’s sales are disappointing even when it’s literally the best selling Metroid). Games like BOTW don’t grow on trees. Probably best if we wait to see a trailer until we decide exactly what this game is.
What exactly is wrong with their post? I understand the frustration, but I think this is a little much.
 
Just because Metroid hasn't hit Mario or Zelda numbers, doesn't mean it can't break out of its old sales range. It doesn't even matter if it's a launch title or not.
For that to happen nintendo would need to figure out a way to get Metroid to sell really well japan.
 
This is exactly what I’m talking about. People place incredibly lofty expectations on Metroid and then get disappointed when they don’t meet them (like saying Dread’s sales are disappointing even when it’s literally the best selling Metroid). Games like BOTW don’t grow on trees. Probably best if we wait to see a trailer until we decide exactly what this game is.
Whether Nintendo would ever do this or not given how they have to release games pretty much every month unlike Sony, but PS5 did launch with Spider-Man AND Demon's Souls (and Sackboy) - I could see a possibility where Successwitch launches with 3D Mario (which now 2D Mario is coming this year is fairly clearly a launch game) & cross gen/back compat Metroid Prime 4 together
 
Whether Nintendo would ever do this or not given how they have to release games pretty much every month unlike Sony, but PS5 did launch with Spider-Man AND Demon's Souls (and Sackboy) - I could see a possibility where Successwitch launches with 3D Mario (which now 2D Mario is coming this year is fairly clearly a launch game) & cross gen/back compat Metroid Prime 4 together
Successwitch... cute name, though it just makes me think of a witch that is successful.

I googled "successful witch" and got this.

GUEST_b22a114f-f1df-4e99-9d11-77d8a127a5d4


...wait, what were we talking about?

But yes, Prime 4 released alongside 3D Mario is a smart and sensible choice. I just don't see it being this massive deviation that will bring in tons of new fans, and that's fine. A good ecosystem means not every game needs to be a 10m+ hit.
 
One final comment about Prime 4.

They can easily release their new HW by mid October with new 3D Mario (around 20th like SMBW) and then by early December, Prime 4. And well we must not forget probably a Pokémon RPG (that surely will be a cross-gen game) for mid november thats the usual spot they like to release their titles.
 
One final comment about Prime 4.

They can easily release their new HW by mid October with new 3D Mario (around 20th like SMBW) and then by early December, Prime 4. And well we must not forget probably a Pokémon RPG (that surely will be a cross-gen game) for mid november thats the usual spot they like to release their titles.
Pokémon is not gonna have a new game until november 2024.

Also 3D Mario + Super Mario RPG + Mario Wonder in 2 months it’s toooooo much.
 
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