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StarTopic Future Nintendo Hardware & Technology Speculation & Discussion |ST| (Read the staff posts before commenting!)

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So I haven't kept up in here in awhile but skimming through recent posts, it's rumored the the Switch 2 will be close to an Xbox Series S + DLSS? How reliable do we feel this information is?
 
wild speculation - T239 is about to enter mass production and it doesn't take much of an Uncle to relay this somewhere along the line. and here we are! seems like Samsung will be responsible for most of the components and Nintendo gets a good discount. the 1080p appeared in a test document somewhere and it seemed to build credibility around them using a 1080p panel this time. that for sure sounds more next-gen than 720p and if DLSS is available in handheld mode without much of a cost, that would be fantastic. either way Samsung won't be a problem for the screen.
 
I clearly see the difference between 720p and 1080p even on a small screen. But I do not find the difference significant enough to be anything else than a second order issue, and I'd take 720p/60fps any day over 1080p/30fps.

With that being said, I've already said that I know believe that Nintendo could go for 1080p just because they have DLSS which works well at upscaling from a lower resolution, and a 1080p screen is a really low hanging fruit from a marketing viewpoint.
 
Kevin said:
So I haven't kept up in here in awhile but skimming through recent posts, it's rumored the the Switch 2 will be close to an Xbox Series S + DLSS? How reliable do we feel this information is?
Click to expand...
I personally expect it to yield visuals close but clearly inferior to what the series S does, even factoring DLSS.
Image quality could sometimes be better, but there's more to visuals than just resolution.
 
ReddDreadtheLead said:
So, like HDR formats, a multi game suspend would be cool to have.

At least 2 games to suspend at a moment

Hm, a “raise to wake” like function would be small, but nice to have.

An integrated note app or something to write in, game related?

Or like, if you take a screenshot of a game you can save it under a note and write down something to keep in mind for whatever it needs it for.

The Bluetooth Audio being part of the submenu when you hold the home button, that if you have one set already paired for the system you can just pair it but tapping it. Would be nice if they just did this with the current switch, but let’s assume they are saving this for the 2 for “???” Reasons I won’t bother trying.
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1: HDR, but only if the display on the system supports it.

2: Themes.

3: Improved home menu (not a major redesign, just move some icons around like All Software being to the far left, filled-in icons for coloured applets to match the NSO icon.)

4: Two game resume, pretty please.

5: Improved Quick Home with Bluetooth, controller pairing, friends list and recording options. Oh, and invites.

6: Improved applets, like feature parity between the NSO Applet and the mobile phone NSO App. Including system voice chat, as an option.

7: Games can update and download even when a game is using communication features.


I have fairly few complaints when it comes to Nintendo Switch OS, at least the consumer facing UI.
 
damn I have to be careful using certain comparisons considering that I have triggered certain users.
anyway I'll stop here before it becomes a drama and wait for the official announcement of Nintendo on switch 2 and on the price
 
Shish said:
damn I have to be careful using certain comparisons considering that I have triggered certain users.
anyway I'll stop here before it becomes a drama and wait for the official announcement of Nintendo on switch 2 and on the price
Click to expand...
Literally what? Where's the drama? 😆
 
My Tulpa said:
Yes, the $350 OLED model was a disaster...

Anyways, this new Drake power upgrade could easily be $400-$500 and be just fine. It's not a new console designed to replace the previous systems, it's a continuation of the family of Switch devices. It doesn't need to be the best-selling Switch when adding up the LTD sales of Switch's.

Its purpose more would be to keep Switch gaming by hardware enthusiasts high over the next few years which would otherwise have declined without the upgrade.

The 3ds was literally where most of Nintendo software support was focused on and away from the DS/DSi, so the 3ds uptake as quickly as possible was very important. Won't be the case for this Drake Switch.
Click to expand...
Drake 1, Switch 2, same potato different slices. We're all talking about the same device. It's just a matter of how they market it. This late in the game I think it's more likely to be positioned as a successor, even if it's initially a soft successor with a long cross gen period, like Xbox Series X|S.
 
YolkFolk said:
Remember this? Summer 2019.

kotaku.com

Miyamoto Still Wants To Reinvent The Controller

While the standard buttons-and-joystick video game controller has made a fairly decisive return to Nintendo’s games on the Switch, that doesn’t mean Nintendo is done trying to reinvent the way we interact with video games.
kotaku.com kotaku.com
Click to expand...
Drake will plug directly into your brain.
Shish said:
$400 is too much, look what happened to the 3ds when it cost $100 more than the ds at launch, the launch was a disaster and they had to drop the price to $169, if they had listened to Reggie the 3ds would have sold better
www.nintendolife.com

Reggie Fils-Aimé Wanted The 3DS To Launch At $199, But Was Rebuffed

"With 3DS, we did not let the poor sales performance linger"
www.nintendolife.com www.nintendolife.com
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There were many problems with the 3DS launch, price was just the most easily fixed.
The OLED Switch sells incredibly well at $349 and that’s just a different screen, this will be a full generational leap. You also have to take into account the cost of making the device, they likely won’t be able to sell for under $399 without taking a loss on each unit.
My Tulpa said:
Yes, the $350 OLED model was a disaster...

Anyways, this new Drake power upgrade could easily be $400-$500 and be just fine. It's not a new console designed to replace the previous systems, it's a continuation of the family of Switch devices. It doesn't need to be the best-selling Switch when adding up the LTD sales of Switch's.

Its purpose more would be to keep Switch gaming by hardware enthusiasts high over the next few years which would otherwise have declined without the upgrade.

The 3ds was literally where most of Nintendo software support was focused on and away from the DS/DSi, so the 3ds uptake as quickly as possible was very important. Won't be the case for this Drake Switch.
Click to expand...
Drake is a next generation system, not a simple mid gen update.
MusicProposition said:
what excites me about this (if it’s true) is that this means a 2023 launch right? I don’t think they’d start producing the chips now if they’re planning to release it next year
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Tweet doesn’t say it’s going into production now.
 
YolkFolk said:
Remember this? Summer 2019.

kotaku.com

Miyamoto Still Wants To Reinvent The Controller

While the standard buttons-and-joystick video game controller has made a fairly decisive return to Nintendo’s games on the Switch, that doesn’t mean Nintendo is done trying to reinvent the way we interact with video games.
kotaku.com kotaku.com
Click to expand...
Nintendo buys Neuralink. Switch 2 is a chip in your brain.

Meh, I'll take it when it comes in a suppository.
 
Kevin said:
So I haven't kept up in here in awhile but skimming through recent posts, it's rumored the the Switch 2 will be close to an Xbox Series S + DLSS? How reliable do we feel this information is?
Click to expand...
There is no such rumor.

People are getting ahead of themselves with regard to speculation based on bits and pieces of verified info and unverified info. As per usual.
 
MusicProposition said:
what excites me about this (if it’s true) is that this means a 2023 launch right? I don’t think they’d start producing the chips now if they’re planning to release it next year
Click to expand...
They do use future tense, "will" rather than "is", but given this chip has been taped out for a year, tested and verified for nearly as long, and has had software being made for a finalised chip with finalised PCIe lane speeds for months now, it's likely the chip is already in production, if not completely certain, and it's more a matter of when it ramps up. Factory Uncle thinks soon. I also think soon. Costs money to sit on designs. Costs money to sit on components. Opportunity cost to not launch it as early as you can. So I'd say it's coming sooner than later, as in, announced Summer released Autumn.
 
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Skittzo said:
There is no such rumor.

People are getting ahead of themselves with regard to speculation based on bits and pieces of verified info and unverified info. As per usual.
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Isn't that what a rumour is? Rumours are by definition unverified. When they are verified they become leaks.
 
Skittzo said:
No, there is no rumor saying Switch 2 will be XSS + DLSS in power.

There is a rumor saying it will be made on Samsung's 5nm node, which is not at all the same thing.
Click to expand...
Yes there is!

The Switch 2 will be XSS + DLSS in power!

There's your rumour!

Semantics, Skittzo, pure semantics.
 
bixente said:
Bottom line, considering what teams like Monolith, Next Level, and EPD are capable of on Switch (and Wii U for that matter), they'll craft absolutely stunning looking games on Drake.
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My expectations are, maybe to the surprise of some, pretty low in this regard!

I don't expect EPD or Monolith Soft to deliver anything revolutionary, but rather similar graphical fidelities at higher resolutions.

I don't think that's necessarily a bad thing. Dolphin Shoals still looks incredible to my eye at 1080p. At 4K I have no doubt it would stand up to scrutiny even next to Forza Horizon 5.
 
Some have mentioned HDR, I see the biggest barrier to getting HDR not being the GPU but being peak brightness.

HDR needs 400 nits minimum for HDR, I think 500+ would be required for decent HDR and that would really hit the battery life hard. The switch OLED is estimated to have 350-375 nits peak as a comparison.
 
Kenka said:
May I suggest you leave this thread for 15 minutes?

Come back fresh. There is tons of stuff to discuss, still.
Click to expand...
Where did this come from? I've hardly upset anyone by saying a rumour is a matter of semantics. If one needs a break by all means take it, but I can't do that for you.
 
Concernt said:
My expectations are, maybe to the surprise of some, pretty low in this regard!

I don't expect EPD or Monolith Soft to deliver anything revolutionary, but rather similar graphical fidelities at higher resolutions.

I don't think that's necessarily a bad thing. Dolphin Shoals still looks incredible to my eye at 1080p. At 4K I have no doubt it would stand up to scrutiny even next to Forza Horizon 5.
Click to expand...
When has Nintendo ever not properly utilized their own hardware??? There’s no reason to think they won’t take advantage of this huge leap in power.
 
Concernt said:
There are many other ways to optimise a system's battery life, or outright improve it. Nintendo is no stranger to bigger batteries to achieve better battery life, like with DSi XL. Or the same size of battery with more capacity. A redesigned, smaller motherboard with more room for a battery. More energy efficient RAM and support circuitry. More energy efficient displays. A combination of these. Node shrinks aren't the be-all-end-all of battery life improvements and never have been
Click to expand...
While battery improvements are nice, they're currently on the order of minutes of game time. And "more energy efficient RAM" is not a likely gain to come in the next generation either - RAM is dependent on node shrinks, and is hitting the same scaling issues as everything else, only more so.

The only likely paths to increased power efficiency over the course of the generation are screen improvements and node shrinks. I don't think switching from 5LLP to a Samsung 3nm process is totally impossible, but I truly doubt it would be a cost effective move for something like a REDACTED Lite.

I expect Nintendo to understand all this and to position clocks conservatively, closer to Mariko power draw, rather than Erista. They can open up additional clocks later if they decide they need more power, but they can't put the cat back in the bag.
 
ShaunSwitch said:
Some have mentioned HDR, I see the biggest barrier to getting HDR not being the GPU but being peak brightness.

HDR needs 400 nits minimum for HDR, I think 500+ would be required for decent HDR and that would really hit the battery life hard. The switch OLED is estimated to have 350-375 nits peak as a comparison.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I unfortunately think this is a Switch 3 feature for handheld mode.
 
0
oldpuck said:
While battery improvements are nice, they're currently on the order of minutes of game time. And "more energy efficient RAM" is not a likely gain to come in the next generation either - RAM is dependent on node shrinks, and is hitting the same scaling issues as everything else, only more so.

The only likely paths to increased power efficiency over the course of the generation are screen improvements and node shrinks. I don't think switching from 5LLP to a Samsung 3nm process is totally impossible, but I truly doubt it would be a cost effective move for something like a REDACTED Lite.

I expect Nintendo to understand all this and to position clocks conservatively, closer to Mariko power draw, rather than Erista. They can open up additional clocks later if they decide they need more power, but they can't put the cat back in the bag.
Click to expand...
Possibly, but that doesn't mean they would limit those in TV mode.

And that's a big "possibly".
 
ArchedThunder said:
When has Nintendo ever not properly utilized their own hardware??? There’s no reason to think they won’t take advantage of this huge leap in power.
Click to expand...
Better assets take more time to make, this distends development times. They may elect to take advantage of the hardware in other ways, like maintaining their current level of fidelity in order to reach exceptionally high resolutions and steady framerates.
 
Concernt said:
Better assets take more time to make, this distends development times. They may elect to take advantage of the hardware in other ways, like maintaining their current level of fidelity in order to reach exceptionally high resolutions and steady framerates.
Click to expand...

Nintendo has shown very little interest in that and already has seen their development pipeline collapse into 5-7 year hell pits like all other AAA devs.
 
ShaunSwitch said:
Some have mentioned HDR, I see the biggest barrier to getting HDR not being the GPU but being peak brightness.

HDR needs 400 nits minimum for HDR, I think 500+ would be required for decent HDR and that would really hit the battery life hard. The switch OLED is estimated to have 350-375 nits peak as a comparison.
Click to expand...
Possibly, but HDR is more than just peak brightness. It could fail to be "HDR CERITIFIED", but still allow games to take advantage of the wider colour gamut made available by additional bitdepth. Bright spots and dark spots don't regale me in the HDR space nearly as much as its ability to reduce or remove banding.
 
ShaunSwitch said:
Some have mentioned HDR, I see the biggest barrier to getting HDR not being the GPU but being peak brightness.

HDR needs 400 nits minimum for HDR, I think 500+ would be required for decent HDR and that would really hit the battery life hard. The switch OLED is estimated to have 350-375 nits peak as a comparison.
Click to expand...
Peak brightness is a particular bugbear of OLEDs. An IPS screen would have no problem reaching HDR levels.

edit: also, there are plenty of mobile OLED screens perfectly capable of displaying HDR. whether or not Nintendo wants to spend the extra money is another question.
 
0
With these new power estimates based on 5LPP, put me in the “1080p LCD” camp. 7”, no frills, LCD. It would definitely reduce the delta between handheld mode (now 1080p, was 720p), and the new docked mode (now 4K, was 1080p). Keeping the differences between handheld and docked smaller is pretty beneficial.

Now, when “Nintendo is gonna Nintendo”, comes in 2026 when they release Drake “OLED/HDR/VRR/QRSTUV“, I’m guessing.
 
Shish said:
damn I have to be careful using certain comparisons considering that I have triggered certain users.
anyway I'll stop here before it becomes a drama and wait for the official announcement of Nintendo on switch 2 and on the price
Click to expand...
How dare you, sir.

Concernt said:
Drake 1, Switch 2, same potato different slices. We're all talking about the same device. It's just a matter of how they market it. This late in the game I think it's more likely to be positioned as a successor, even if it's initially a soft successor with a long cross gen period, like Xbox Series X|S.
Click to expand...

Why would Nintendo want to position this as a successor? Rather than an upgrade model meant to lengthen the lifecycle of the Switch?

If by "soft successor with a long cross gen" you mean in practice it's going to be like iterative iphones type relationships, i suppose you could look at it that way.

But im pretty sure all big Nintendo games being revealed in 2025 are still going to run on the OLED and Lite. No good reason they shouldnt/wouldnt.

ArchedThunder said:
Drake is a next generation system, not a simple mid gen update.
Click to expand...

In terms of hardware power differentials, sure. But hardware differentials dont dictate how a console is positioned/marketed.

I just dont think Nintendo will use it more than taking current Switch Tx1+ profile games and having them output with much better graphics/performance with the new model. No reason not continue to still target, and release, the variable 540p-1080p, variable 30fps profiles in their game/services development.

The next console after this Drake one can be the one to break away their game development focus like that, im sure. No reason to do that now with how insanely high Switch gaming engagement still is now. Got a lot of life left in it, longer than a usual lifecycle (as Nintendo has said many times). Drake will certainly help keep that engagement high.
 
Concernt said:
Possibly, but HDR is more than just peak brightness. It could fail to be "HDR CERITIFIED", but still allow games to take advantage of the wider colour gamut made available by additional bitdepth. Bright spots and dark spots don't regale me in the HDR space nearly as much as its ability to reduce or remove banding.
Click to expand...
And if it at least has this capability in handheld, even if the nits are lower, games could at least be designed to output HDR in docked mode.
 
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Cuzizkool said:
With these new power estimates based on 5LPP, put me in the “1080p LCD” camp. 7”, no frills, LCD. It would definitely reduce the delta between handheld mode (now 1080p, was 720p), and the new docked mode (now 4K, was 1080p). Keeping the differences between handheld and docked small is pretty beneficial.

Now, when “Nintendo is gonna Nintendo”, comes in 2026 when they release Drake “OLED/HDR/VRR/QRSTUV“, I’m guessing.
Click to expand...
If battery life is a concern and they are sourcing other components from Samsung, an OLED display would make a lot of sense.
 
NateDrake said:
Mike Odyssey is using the thread, as well.

A week's worth of content based on whatever is posted here.

Thought... didn't they claim it was in mass production? This information conflicts with that.
Click to expand...
Just to play devil's advocate some parts can be in mass production while others aren't. Unless they specifically claimed the chip was.
 
My Tulpa said:
How dare you, sir.



Why would Nintendo want to position this as a successor? Rather than an upgrade model meant to lengthen the lifecycle of the Switch?

If by "soft successor with a long cross gen" you mean in practice it's going to be like iterative iphones type relationships, i suppose you could look at it that way.

But im pretty sure all big Nintendo games being revealed in 2025 are still going to run on the OLED and Lite. No good reason they shouldnt/wouldnt.



In terms of hardware power differentials, sure.

I just dont think Nintendo will use it more than taking current Switch Tx1+ profile games and having them output with much better graphics/performance with the new model. No reason not continue to still target the variable 540p-1080p, variable 30fps profiles in their game/services development.

The next console after this Drake one can be the one to break away their game development focus like that, im sure. No reason to do that now with how insanely high Switch gaming engagement still is now. Got a lot of life left in it, longer than a usual lifecycle (as Nintendo has said many times). Drake will certainly help keep that engagement high.
Click to expand...
I think "no reason" is overstating things. I do think, barring a shift in corporate leadership, that if games CAN run on the base Switch they will, for quite some time, but games that cannot, or can't without huge reworks, simply won't.
 
My Tulpa said:
Yes, the $350 OLED model was a disaster...

Anyways, this new Drake power upgrade could easily be $400-$500 and be just fine. It's not a new console designed to replace the previous systems, it's a continuation of the family of Switch devices. It doesn't need to be the best-selling Switch when adding up the LTD sales of Switch's.

Its purpose more would be to keep Switch gaming by hardware enthusiasts high over the next few years which would otherwise have declined without the upgrade.

The 3ds was literally where most of Nintendo software support was focused on and away from the DS/DSi, so the 3ds uptake as quickly as possible was very important. Won't be the case for this Drake Switch.
Click to expand...

You don’t know this though.
 
Skittzo said:
Just to play devil's advocate some parts can be in mass production while others aren't. Unless they specifically claimed the chip was.
Click to expand...
The headline was, "Nintendo Switch 2 in Mass Production" and claimed the chip was in full production.

My Tulpa said:
There is a rumor saying Switch 2 will be XSS + DLSS in power. I read it a couple pages back by a reasonable poster who played around with all these rumored specs.
Click to expand...

That doesn't make it a rumor. It makes it a possibility based on rumored specs and speculation.
 
Skittzo said:
No, there is no rumor saying Switch 2 will be XSS + DLSS in power.

There is a rumor saying it will be made on Samsung's 5nm node, which is not at all the same thing.
Click to expand...

There is a rumor saying Switch 2 will be XSS + DLSS in power. I read it a couple pages back by a reasonable poster who played around with all these rumored specs.
 
NateDrake said:
The headline was, "Nintendo Switch 2 in Mass Production" and claimed the chip was in full production.
Click to expand...
Ah then I (thankfully) missed that nonsense.
My Tulpa said:
There is a rumor saying Switch 2 will be XSS + DLSS in power. I read it a couple pages back by a reasonable poster who played around with all these rumored specs.
Click to expand...
You're conflating rumor with speculation. There is a rumor that it is made on the Samsung 5nm node, the speculation based on that rumor (and on extremely dubious clock speeds found in a mostly unrelated file of the NVN leak) suggests it might get somewhere close to XSS GPU.

That is not a rumor, that is someone using a few rumors to try and come up with a possible outcome scenario. There is a difference.
 
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