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StarTopic Future Nintendo Hardware & Technology Speculation & Discussion |ST| (Read the staff posts before commenting!)

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ItWasMeantToBe19 said:
There may not be US rate drops for a while that stabilize exchange rates. Consumer confidence has shot up in the last few months and so have wages, and that has kept inflation a bit higher than was expected so the interest rates will likely stay high for a while longer.
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19, I say this in the nicest way possible, but please do not post information that clearly does not match the reality of what's happening here in the US. Like, this is the same talking points that the democrats keep spewing and does not even remotely resemble the reality of things in the US. Between low wages, people having to take multiple jobs to make ends meet (in fact, there was a Tiktok going around about a woman's experience doing back to back working with only 3-4 hours at most and napping between one of her jobs, fairly recently), rise of cost of food (which does not even remotely correspond with said wages in crease, which are not as much as you may think), and the so-called "inflation" is just led by corporate greed (and that's all it ever is).

So please do not spread this misinformation in this thread. I'm literally a disabled man who is dealing with rise of Medicare costs, reduction of services provided by Medicare (removal of telehealth despite being cheaper), our governments have completely let a safety net expire (ACP) and completely ignored any lobbying by telecomms, and so many people live paycheck to paycheck, myself included, and does not resemble the reality of what you're saying.

Just stop.

Absolutely. Stop.
 
Shoulder said:
Yes, we have the holiday season, but if the March 2017 launch of Switch taught us anything, it's kinda showing the whole “must get X game out by holiday season” doesn’t necessarily mean you’re guaranteed maximum sales either.
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Besides, we live in an enlightened age of Amazon and day-one preorders, so just because it's not on store shelves for the Holidays doesn't mean that it'll completely miss out on seasonal sales.
 
Shoulder said:
We’ve never returned.
Click to expand...

I've seen the boards blow up multiple times in the past six months every time a podcast drops, but each time it has been slim pickens every time. The excitement surrounding an upcoming podcast has consistently surpassed the excitement post podcast. It is very curious though, obviously a lot of developers do have access to development hardware at this point, but it hasn't provided meaningful leaks. It does suck, because back in early February it seemed like an almost certainty that the reveal would happen this month in March. Now, who knows. I still think they will announce it prior to the investors meeting in May, but that could be a simple PR statement similar to when Nintendo announced that NX would release in March of 2017 and they would share additional information at a later date. We could be looking at a very similar strategy for the successor.
 
Mendinso said:
TL;DR on this, if it's alright I ask?
Click to expand...

Here's Rich's article:

www.eurogamer.net

Spec Analysis: PlayStation 5 Pro - the most powerful console yet

Tech specs for PlayStation 5 Pro have leaked - Digital Foundry verifies them and delivers analysis and further information.
www.eurogamer.net www.eurogamer.net

image.png
 
Goodtwin said:
I've seen the boards blow up multiple times in the past six months every time a podcast drops, but each time it has been slim pickens every time. The excitement surrounding an upcoming podcast has consistently surpassed the excitement post podcast. It is very curious though, obviously a lot of developers do have access to development hardware at this point, but it hasn't provided meaningful leaks. It does suck, because back in early February it seemed like an almost certainty that the reveal would happen this month in March. Now, who knows. I still think they will announce it prior to the investors meeting in May, but that could be a simple PR statement similar to when Nintendo announced that NX would release in March of 2017 and they would share additional information at a later date. We could be looking at a very similar strategy for the successor.
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A possible explanation is that there isn't that much to leak. Its an improved Switch, that's it.
 
Truno said:
Here's Rich's article:

www.eurogamer.net

Spec Analysis: PlayStation 5 Pro - the most powerful console yet

Tech specs for PlayStation 5 Pro have leaked - Digital Foundry verifies them and delivers analysis and further information.
www.eurogamer.net www.eurogamer.net

image.png
Click to expand...
They're repeating the PS4 Pro plan just. A li'l worse? I can sing the praises of PS5 engineering all day but this isn't looking like the best idea for anyone involved.

A smaller OS for a beefier console seems odd, and even if Switch 2's OS nearly quadruples in memory usage, that puts a hypothetical 16GB Switch 2 in a category with more memory available for games, while targeting lower resolution and fidelity. Will resource starved games even benefit from a system leaning on "do more graphics but we won't increase the memory"?

I know that's what PS4 Pro did, of course, but. To repeat that in an era where memory isn't the most expensive thing, just seems odd.
 
Quickly skimming through Nate's podcast, I think it is fair to say that pretty much all insiders are in the dark at this point. No one has any clue what Nintendo's plans are for the Switch 2. Hopefully we get some insight at the May investors meeting, but beyond that, I wouldn't be surprised if it remains crickets with next gen chatter for a while.

Come on GDC talk. Save us!

ItWasMeantToBe19 said:
There may not be US rate drops for a while that stabilize exchange rates. Consumer confidence has shot up in the last few months and so have wages, and that has kept inflation a bit higher than was expected so the interest rates will likely stay high for a while longer.

The Bank of Japan raised rates from -0.1% to 0.0% today and they said that's all they'll do.

So if Nintendo is waiting on a better exchange rate, uhhhhh.
Click to expand...
Even though the economy is doing better and we are past the inflation spike, I don't think that we will see any big rate drops for quite some time in the US. Money being as cheap as it was before was a factor that helped lead to increased inflation in the first place, but I am getting off track.

So yeah, I don't see exchange rates seeing any major changes in the coming months, but I'm just a keyboard analyst lol.
 
Concernt said:
They're repeating the PS4 Pro plan just. A li'l worse? I can sing the praises of PS5 engineering all day but this isn't looking like the best idea for anyone involved.

A smaller OS for a beefier console seems odd, and even if Switch 2's OS nearly quadruples in memory usage, that puts a hypothetical 16GB Switch 2 in a category with more memory available for games, while targeting lower resolution and fidelity. Will resource starved games even benefit from a system leaning on "do more graphics but we won't increase the memory"?

I know that's what PS4 Pro did, of course, but. To repeat that in an era where memory isn't the most expensive thing, just seems odd.
Click to expand...
for better or worse sony is sticking to their guns on being the most powerful all the time
 
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Truno said:
Here's Rich's article:

www.eurogamer.net

Spec Analysis: PlayStation 5 Pro - the most powerful console yet

Tech specs for PlayStation 5 Pro have leaked - Digital Foundry verifies them and delivers analysis and further information.
www.eurogamer.net www.eurogamer.net

image.png
Click to expand...
I'm a bit envious of the PS5 Pro believers/followers/hopeful/speculators, they got some sort of reliable confirmation of specs in the form of leaked documents(?) and corroboration from reputable folk like DF before Switch 2
 
Josh5890 said:
Quickly skimming through Nate's podcast, I think it is fair to say that pretty much all insiders are in the dark at this point. No one has any clue what Nintendo's plans are for the Switch 2. Hopefully we get some insight at the May investors meeting, but beyond that, I wouldn't be surprised if it remains crickets with next gen chatter for a while.

Come on GDC talk. Save us!
Click to expand...

I hate to say this as I dislike their obsession with secrecy, but I gotta give props to Nintendo for how elusive Switch 2 information is. If it wasn't for the NVIDIA hack we'd be completely in the dark. Hell, even the Gamescom rumors didn't give us that much info
 
Mendinso said:
19, I say this in the nicest way possible, but please do not post information that clearly does not match the reality of what's happening here in the US. Like, this is the same talking points that the democrats keep spewing and does not even remotely resemble the reality of things in the US. Between low wages, people having to take multiple jobs to make ends meet (in fact, there was a Tiktok going around about a woman's experience doing back to back working with only 3-4 hours at most and napping between one of her jobs, fairly recently), rise of cost of food (which does not even remotely correspond with said wages in crease, which are not as much as you may think), and the so-called "inflation" is just led by corporate greed (and that's all it ever is).

So please do not spread this misinformation in this thread. I'm literally a disabled man who is dealing with rise of Medicare costs, reduction of services provided by Medicare (removal of telehealth despite being cheaper), our governments have completely let a safety net expire (ACP) and completely ignored any lobbying by telecomms, and so many people live paycheck to paycheck, myself included, and does not resemble the reality of what you're saying.

Just stop.

Absolutely. Stop.
Click to expand...

I don't understand how I'm supposed to project interest rates changes if real wage data and consumer confidence data and unemployment data are apparently completely made up to be more positive than reality... Even though basically all businesses want lower interest rates right now and the Federal Reserve will go longer without dropping rates as long as unemployment etc data is strong.

Real wage data in the US has been good for a while and so has unemployment data, idk.
 
Eslayer said:
I'm a bit envious of the PS5 Pro believers/followers/hopeful/speculators, they got some sort of reliable confirmation of specs in the form of leaked documents(?) and corroboration from reputable folk like DF before Switch 2
Click to expand...

Someone on the inside keeps leaking information to Insider Gaming. I'm waiting for Sony to pinch them because sharing documents has to be somewhat traceable.

Gotta be careful when flying close to the sun.
 
Just watched Nate's podcast. I do agree, assuming we hear nothing sooner, that Nintendo has to say something in May at the investors/earnings meeting if Switch 2 is coming next fiscal year. My eyebrows also raised a bit when Nate mentioned he had heard talk that Nintendo was reaching out to developers/publishers for assets for Switch 2 games. If true, makes me think a summer reveal could be possible.
 
Goodtwin said:
I've seen the boards blow up multiple times in the past six months every time a podcast drops, but each time it has been slim pickens every time. The excitement surrounding an upcoming podcast has consistently surpassed the excitement post podcast. It is very curious though, obviously a lot of developers do have access to development hardware at this point, but it hasn't provided meaningful leaks. It does suck, because back in early February it seemed like an almost certainty that the reveal would happen this month in March. Now, who knows. I still think they will announce it prior to the investors meeting in May, but that could be a simple PR statement similar to when Nintendo announced that NX would release in March of 2017 and they would share additional information at a later date. We could be looking at a very similar strategy for the successor.
Click to expand...
The Nvidia hacks provided a huge chunk of information about the hardware that wasn't known for Switch until June-ish of 2016 when developers were willing to go on record with specificity about the chipset being TX1 and other aspects of the then NX likely from a SDEV unit.

Short of a new Switch 2 SDEV unit showing off a new hardware feature, RAM amount, and clock speeds there is nothing else of substance to leak until marketing or manufacturing gets involved.

Nintendo supposedly asking for assets is interesting. . . Seems early for a 2025 launch, but bring on the intrigue.
 
Josh5890 said:
Someone on the inside keeps leaking information to Insider Gaming. I'm waiting for Sony to pinch them because sharing documents has to be somewhat traceable.

Gotta be careful when flying close to the sun.
Click to expand...
Seems like Sony hasn't done a good enough job of spooking those in the know into not sharing anything
 
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Josh5890 said:
Someone on the inside keeps leaking information to Insider Gaming. I'm waiting for Sony to pinch them because sharing documents has to be somewhat traceable.

Gotta be careful when flying close to the sun.
Click to expand...
Are there even similar documents on the Nintendo dev portal for Switch 2 at this point?
 
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Mendinso said:
19, I say this in the nicest way possible, but please do not post information that clearly does not match the reality of what's happening here in the US. Like, this is the same talking points that the democrats keep spewing and does not even remotely resemble the reality of things in the US. Between low wages, people having to take multiple jobs to make ends meet (in fact, there was a Tiktok going around about a woman's experience doing back to back working with only 3-4 hours at most and napping between one of her jobs, fairly recently), rise of cost of food (which does not even remotely correspond with said wages in crease, which are not as much as you may think), and the so-called "inflation" is just led by corporate greed (and that's all it ever is).
Click to expand...
19 might be referring to statistics that's released officially by Bureau of Labor Statistics. While democrats might be using this as part of their campaign talking points, those statistics weren't made up.

The graph is showing compensation, on average, continues to be increased on an annual basis. With most recent yoy number being about 4%. Which unless I'm mistaken, would be slightly outpacing inflation (about 3.15% yoy at the moment)

That said, I do agree that there are numerous problems with our labor industry in general. Our labor force is being overworked and has been for a very long time - working too hard for too little. This is due to out of control, rampant corporate greed. This transcends "democrat"/"republican" politics. This is not a sustainable setup. Democrats for the most part want to see a return of unionization, which should rein in some of that corporate greed in theory - I fully support more unionization efforts out there. This has never been a recent thing, it has been happening for more than several years (the fight to increase minimum wages is not a few years old), and I think inflation in general has magnified the pains much more.
 
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Josh5890 said:
Quickly skimming through Nate's podcast, I think it is fair to say that pretty much all insiders are in the dark at this point. No one has any clue what Nintendo's plans are for the Switch 2. Hopefully we get some insight at the May investors meeting, but beyond that, I wouldn't be surprised if it remains crickets with next gen chatter for a while.

Come on GDC talk. Save us!


Even though the economy is doing better and we are past the inflation spike, I don't think that we will see any big rate drops for quite some time in the US. Money being as cheap as it was before was a factor that helped lead to increased inflation in the first place, but I am getting off track.

So yeah, I don't see exchange rates seeing any major changes in the coming months, but I'm just a keyboard analyst lol.
Click to expand...
With almost no new information and how secretive Nintendo is, that would mean the switch 2 will be like the second coming to christ.
Don't worry brothers and sisters, we will have news in the coming months or heck even maybe summer. (slight copium)
gentleman-giga-chad.gif


Lets at least think of the positive, we're not in the situation the Xbox bros are currently facing.
 
Truno said:
Click to expand...

"we saw with the rog ally for instance that the tflops number didn't make sense, it was inflated"
"the rog ally wasn't even in the same level of a series s"

I wonder: is this because games aren't using mixed precision (FP16 and FP32) and that's why the rog ally (and probably the PS5 pro) won't ever reach their maximum theoretical tflop performance mark?
 
Josh5890 said:
Even though the economy is doing better and we are past the inflation spike, I don't think that we will see any big rate drops for quite some time in the US. Money being as cheap as it was before was a factor that helped lead to increased inflation in the first place, but I am getting off track.

So yeah, I don't see exchange rates seeing any major changes in the coming months, but I'm just a keyboard analyst lol.
Click to expand...
I don't know if we ever really saw any "big rate drops", we don't see "big rate increases" either. It's usually very gradual.. in increments of 25, 50 or 75 basis points.

But I'm still looking forward to those "gradual rate drops", because I'm invested heavily (leveraged in fact) in long term treasuries.
 
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darthdiablo said:
19 might be referring to statistics that's released officially by Bureau of Labor Statistics. While democrats might be using this as part of their campaign talking points, those statistics weren't made up.

The graph is showing compensation, on average, continues to be increased on an annual basis. With most recent yoy number being about 4%.

That said, I do agree that there are numerous problems with our labor industry in general. Our labor force is being overworked and has been for a very long time - working too hard for too little. This is due to out of control, rampant corporate greed. This transcends "democrat"/"republican" politics. This is not a sustainable setup. Democrats for the most part want to see a return of unionization, which should rein in some of that corporate greed in theory - I fully support more unionization efforts out there. This has never been a recent thing, it has been happening for more than several years (the fight to increase minimum wages is not a few years old), and I think inflation in general has magnified the pains much more.
Click to expand...
There’s also the fact that, apparently, the main driving force of inflation nowadays is rent.

But that’s a topic for the Roost

—————

So the PS5 Pro is just another sort of revision like the PS4 Pro? I thought it was gonna be an animal with how they were describing it
 
Hermii said:
A possible explanation is that there isn't that much to leak. Its an improved Switch, that's it.
Click to expand...

I really think this is it. If it is indeed a more straight forward successor to the Switch, and we have all the data leaked on T239 from the Nvidia hack, then we basically know more than we did going into the October 2017 teaser trailer for Switch. I guess at this point I was really expecting/hoping to get more confirmation on various things. I'm honestly kind of burnt out on it and have lost some interest. That call all be reignited in a moments notice, but for the meantime, I need to keep chipping away at my backlog on Switch.
 
kasparov77 said:
"we saw with the rog ally for instance that the tflops number didn't make sense, it was inflated"
"the rog ally wasn't even in the same level of a series s"

I wonder: is this because games aren't using mixed precision (FP16 and FP32) and that's why the rog ally (and probably the PS5 pro) won't ever reach their maximum theoretical tflop performance mark?
Click to expand...
It's because AMD calculated it with dual-issue instructions, which basically no games actually use, effectively cutting the figure in half.
 
Just read through Rich's article, haven't watched the special yet, but all the info basically confirms the MLID leak (and he should take a thorough W on that). Here is my perspective.

TL;DR
Sony: "Mom, can we have RTX"
AMD: "We have RTX at home!"
Sony, Thanos voice: "Fine, I'll do it myself"

It's a Ray Tracing machine
The move to RDNA3+4 hybrid design over the RDNA1+2 design gives a significant RT boost to the system. This is clearly the primary driver of what's going on. Sony is saying that there is enough performance here to enable RT on PS5 games that lack it, and drive RT further on existing systems - add RT shadows on top of RT reflections.

Ignore the Giant TFLOPS Number
The term "fake FLOPS" pisses me off, but anyone thinking this is a 3x performance increase is wrong. It's like 45% according to Sony. This number is inflated by changes to RDNA3

PlayStation Spectral Super Resolution is interesting
Sony is saying that their upscaler runs on the base PS5. I don't understand quite what's going on here, but it seems like Sony is giving the finger to FSR, and going their own way with an AI guided solution that still runs on more traditional GPUs.

Their checkerboarding for PS4 was rad, even though few games used their custom hardware for it. I tend to give Sony the benefit of the doubt here.

The machine learning hardware is... confusing?
Sony is claiming 300 TOPS of ML in there. That's huge.

But it's unclear to me if this is the TOPS rating for the ML accelerator, or if it's some combined number between the GPU and the NPU. And why stick it in there for PSSR is you've also got a giant GPU and you're claiming your upscaler runs on base PS5 hardware?

I think this might be basically for 8k. If PSSR is a better path to 4k than FSR 2 on the base PS5 model, then it seems like it should be sufficient on the bigger machine. But it would make sense if it falls over under 8k loads, and needs the extra acceleration there.

The RAM Improvement is necessary, but minor
There is more RAM available to games, but it's not clear how that works. Rich speculates it's similar to the Xbox solution of having a pool of cheap, slow RAM to slide more of the OS into, opening up fast RAM for games. It sucks that this technology keeps coming back, but laws of physics and all that.

The memory clock is getting pushed for more bandwidth. My guess is that this is essentially a "free" upgrade that comes along with the move from N7 to N6 - more ability to push the memory controller with the node shrink.

The CPU Upgrade is the Same
It's still Zen 2, because total redesign just wasn't viable, I imagine, and Sony would rather invest that energy in the RT upgrades. Moving from N7 to N6 let them push clocks a little, and so they've done it. But it's not transformative.
 
oldpuck said:
Sony is saying that their upscaler runs on the base PS5. I don't understand quite what's going on here, but it seems like Sony is giving the finger to FSR, and going their own way with an AI guided solution that still runs on more traditional GPUs.
Click to expand...
Oooh, it says that? Those may be great news actually, there are a couple exclusives that rely on FSR upscaling as of today... If they removed it on favour of PSSR as part of the lineup of Pro patches I suppose, wouldn't those games look significantly better even on the base model?
 
Steve said:
Maybe it's a sign to complete my backlog, after the internal delay announcement i decided to finish Xenoblade 3 (which i did, it's peak fiction) i have come to realize i have couple of games to finish.
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This is what i decided to do. There are so many games on my switch backlog that I overlooked that I am falling in love with. one of them being Super Metroid. Metroid Prime is my favorite game ever and iv tried super metroid before on Wii U virtual console but for some reason the wall jumping was so damn difficult to me. This time im getting super immersed into it and This is the first time I feel like im legit living in the games universe since like When I first played Metroid Prime. I am so sucked into the Metroid isolationist environment and it really feels like Im alone on alien planet. The vibes the games gives off with its Atmosphere and soundtrack is just soooo damn immersive to me.

I have so many games to try again that I never fully go into. I think ill be fine waiting till 2025 for Switch 2. Hopefully Switch 2 launches with the next 3d Mario, Thats my most looked forward to game right now.
 
Darknut85 said:
Even Nate is depressed…
Click to expand...

I will ALWAYS love Nintendo's IP but yeah I moved onto PS5 these days (will be getting the Pro as well). I agree entirely with Nat and MVG here.

The Switch is at the end of the day, a toy but as an enthusiast, it's been greatly disappointing that Nintendo not only won't move in but has yet to say anything about Switch 2. Since I know there is nothing I can do about it, I decided to simply move on from the Nintendo ecosystem. I'm basically done with my Switch.
 
Lancelot said:
Oooh, it says that? Those may be great news actually, there are a couple exclusives that rely on FSR upscaling as of today... If they removed it on favour of PSSR as part of the lineup of Pro patches I suppose, wouldn't those games look significantly better even on the base model?
Click to expand...
Maybe, maybe not. One possibility is that PSSR is a better technology over all, and those games will see improvements.

A more likely possibility is that it's "about the same" on the base model, but much faster on the Pro model because of the extra ML hardware. Sony makes it work on both not to compete with FSR, but so developers only have one code path to develop and test for, rather than using different upscalers on different models of Playstation
 
oldpuck said:
Maybe, maybe not. One possibility is that PSSR is a better technology over all, and those games will see improvements.

A more likely possibility is that it's "about the same" on the base model, but much faster on the Pro model because of the extra ML hardware. Sony makes it work on both not to compete with FSR, but so developers only have one code path to develop and test for, rather than using different upscalers on different models of Playstation
Click to expand...
That makes perfect sense. Hopefully it is more stable even without ML acceleration, if future and certain existing games will look better on all models because of this... I'd call that an absolute win!
 
Bulborb said:
This is what i decided to do. There are so many games on my switch backlog that I overlooked that I am falling in love with. one of them being Super Metroid. Metroid Prime is my favorite game ever and iv tried super metroid before on Wii U virtual console but for some reason the wall jumping was so damn difficult to me. This time im getting super immersed into it and This is the first time I feel like im legit living in the games universe since like When I first played Metroid Prime. I am so sucked into the Metroid isolationist environment and it really feels like Im alone on alien planet. The vibes the games gives off with its Atmosphere and soundtrack is just soooo damn immersive to me.

I have so many games to try again that I never fully go into. I think ill be fine waiting till 2025 for Switch 2. Hopefully Switch 2 launches with the next 3d Mario, Thats my most looked forward to game right now.
Click to expand...
Super Metroid's wall jump doesn't work well if you're rolling your thumb on the d-pad. It breaks when it detects an up or down input. One of my favorite patches is here - https://metroidconstruction.com/hack.php?id=161

I think that Zero Mission significantly improved the controls.
 
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