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Pre-Release The Legend of Zelda: Tears of the Kingdom Pre-Release Discussion Thread

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Serif said:
Link's shooting up that forbidden sauce.
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Man I love all the different concepts from people that you always share!
 
Serif said:
I think this makes sense. That green 'magic meter' from the 2014 demo makes me think they had a more holistic magic mechanic planned instead of the Shiekah Slate cooldown (unless that green bar was stamina which I'm skeptical of), so reviving that idea seems like something they'd do. They've even brought back this idea of using vials to store energy.

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Link's shooting up that forbidden sauce.
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Have to say I’m extremely into displaying objects and equipment on the player, doubly so for meaningful visualizations of systems that would otherwise just be UI elements.

Splatoon’s visualizing ink via the rear tank or lifesaver (Salmon Run) is so good. I’m in love with the vials we can see in the key art for Tears and I hope it’s actually used cleverly to display total charges of the green stuff.
 
Heron said:
Aonuma should have listened - the motorbike was so out-of-place and bad. That whole DLC was strangely low-quality compared to the utter perfection of the main game. The horrible implementation of hard mode being the worst offender.

That one boss battle made up for it, but in general... disappointing.
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karmitt said:
Trial of the Sword was awesome. The shrines were awesome, as was the dungeon.

What was’t awesome was how it made no efforts to capture the sense of discovery and adventure that made the game so precious for many people. The content was (imo) haphazardly pasted into the map, and the discovery of the content was tedious and bore no resemblance to the game proper. They really just pasted tiny map .jpgs on pillars and said “go find them”

Also the One-Hit Obliterator segment being a barrier for entry was not a great choice.

Edit:
There was also a promise of more story during its announcement, and the amount of “story” was really negligible.
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i would not say that it was low quality (the dungeon and the shrines where some of the best, the boss fight to, mechanically the bike was fun, the sword trials where at least a good skill/resource check, and the one hit obliterator, while being a harsh challenge/wall was at least somewhat comparable to eventide, where you needed to use mechanics you usually dont or just be more resourcefull.

with that sad... yeah, the integration of all those things into the world was really really clunky. hard mode was bad, the mew armors felt pointless, since a) you could not improve them, and b) they ... didn't even look that good and where just sprinkles over the world instead of having sidequests by themselves. the whole "find the new shrines" segment was ... almost annoying? for somebody that loved the discovery and exploration aspect of BotW, including the Fotos (especially those...) ... this just fellt kinda forced.

Oh, and yeah, story... it was additional character context, but not really much story in my opinion. i would have prefered a Gaiden chapter, that had nothing to do with the main story. As it was, it reused to much (aestetcs, assets, even the big new boss, while being great, is a monk using some of Yiga/Kogas skills.), stuff that we have seen more then enough till the dlc was released.

Mechanically the strongest aspects of the game (shrines, boss, challenges, dungeon), but just... not Incorporated really well.

catonkatonk said:
I actually loved hunting for the memories. But the jpeg pillar thing from the DLC was one of the weakest parts of the whole game to me even still lollol
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I hope Master Mode and Trial of the Sword aren’t DLC again. They should be included in the base experience.

I kind of hope they remove the enemy regeneration mechanic, though. Just make enemies do double damage instead. The regeneration mechanic wasn’t a good way to pad out the difficulty. It just wasted your time.
 
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Layalseif said:
Who here wants Korok Seeds back or something equivalent?
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I do.

They were kind of an essential part in making every unique hero’s path feel worthwhile - no matter what path you took you’d have something to catch your eye and reward you.

I can understand getting sick of them after a while, or losing interest as they decreased in value, but they were a really fun part of the early journey. The question for the development team would be how to make them entertaining and satisfying to find even at 100 hours.
 
I was thinking about Nintendos patent for the warp mechanic again and how it was centered around sound. Then it dawned on me, what would it sound like if you were able to warp to another location or through a portal? Sound would be distorted or sped up as you went through the portal or warped and it would sound an awful lot like the weird distorted sound from the first trailer. I imagine if you warped several times in a row it would sound like a warped loop back and forth and to me that’s what the sound from the trailer could be.

On another note after just listening to that trailer again, we hear what sounds to be Ganondorfs heart beat throughout the trailer, how cool would that be if we got to play through that section. When we enter the cave we just hear a very faint heart beat, but as we get closer and closer to him it gets louder and louder to where it’s so loud once we find him that it’s almost deafening.
 
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sanstea said:
I actually would heavily prefer that any non-cutscene NPC conversations only have grunts because if you want to skip or go faster through them (which is what you usually do) you end up having just sentences weirdly cut off and you basically glitch through conversations. Grunts, body and facial animation plus text are a way smoother integration for these encounters in my opinion. I prefer it that way anyway - you could also just have the option to choose between the two but I don't think that is ever any option in any game.
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Also, not having to voice everything relieves pressure from the writers - easier to make changes until late in development, add weird and hard-to-find stuff, etc.. Just look at Morrowind (non-voiced) vs. Oblivion (fully voiced): both quality and quantity of writing takes a nosedive because everything had to be voiced (plus it slows down the pace of game so much.)

I'd go even further and hope there's a way to disable voices in cutscenes (because I don't expect they'll go back on that). I prefer doing my own "voice acting" and just enjoying the music - cutscene music budget in BotW was high compared to the rest of the game, but there's people talking over it. I honestly prefer Skyward Sword's approach: let the music do the talking.
karmitt said:
The DLC scored pretty low or middling at quite a few outlets. It wasn’t bad or broken as a whole, but it was so far removed from Breath of the Wild’s core loop that it continues to make me question just how much we can rely on Tears of the Kingdom to hit the mark. I’m just choosing to believe they parked any of the actually good or ambitious ideas for Tears at the expense of the DLC.
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Slight rant: DLC may be a bit of a weird proposition for EPD's organisation structure. In other studios it's a way to keep the part of the team that's not on pre-production for the next project busy until they can hop unto the new project when it goes into full production. For Nintendo, however, the folks that aren't on pre-production get reshuffled to other projects within EPD, so there's no need to find a way to keep them busy.

For the Zelda DLC it seems like they had the core designers without the artistic manpower. There mainly were new puzzles through the Shrines (recycled art), Divine Beast (recycled art and one new, awesome boss fight) and Trial of the Sword (recycled environments). That probably was what the core Zelda team was able to do on their own.

I hope that Tears has the content variety that Breath lacked a bit (which might've led to high hopes for the DLC), and that they either won't bother with DLC and leave the game as-is, or give it the scope it needs to be truly worthwhile.
 
Serif said:
I think this makes sense. That green 'magic meter' from the 2014 demo makes me think they had a more holistic magic mechanic planned instead of the Shiekah Slate cooldown (unless that green bar was stamina which I'm skeptical of), so reviving that idea seems like something they'd do. They've even brought back this idea of using vials to store energy.

p7pzwby067o91.jpg


Link's shooting up that forbidden sauce.
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King Rinkuto.
 
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karmitt said:
I do.

They were kind of an essential part in making every unique hero’s path feel worthwhile - no matter what path you took you’d have something to catch your eye and reward you.

I can understand getting sick of them after a while, or losing interest as they decreased in value, but they were a really fun part of the early journey. The question for the development team would be how to make them entertaining and satisfying to find even at 100 hours.
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the beauty of them was that you neither had to get them all to get something important and neither were you meant to get them all but you could get them all and they still gave you a small reward if you did. to me they're an essential part of the BotW appeal and experience. Stumbling through an unfamiliar area and noticing that familiar yet odd looking element in the environment and finding another one of these little guys IS that game in a nutshell.

however, don't just bring it back for its own sake. should we end up mostly in the sky, I don't want random collectibles hidden somewhere just cause we had them last time. the koroks worked because of the world they were in and how we engaged with that world.
 
I would love to see the Magic Meter return. I will be a very happy lad if we see the first glimpses of gameplay and there’s that classic green line under the hearts on the HUD. Pretty sad it was cut from both Twilight Princess AND Breath of the Wild 1. It’s time for redemption.
 
We've seen the green puddle reversing which could be something to do with magic refill, but what if you could have magic slowly refill in contact with any type of water? Would give a positive side to when it's raining for a change.
 
Sunshinemario said:
I would love to see the Magic Meter return. I will be a very happy lad if we see the first glimpses of gameplay and there’s that classic green line under the hearts on the HUD. Pretty sad it was cut from both Twilight Princess AND Breath of the Wild 1. It’s time for redemption.
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Hmmm bringing back the magic meter at this point would be kind of a downgrade tho, considering you could already use stuff like elemental weapons and arrows in BOTW.
 
BY2K said:
Hmmm bringing back the magic meter at this point would be kind of a downgrade tho, considering you could already use stuff like elemental weapons and arrows in BOTW.
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It wouldn’t be used for that.
Read what I was replying to, please.
Edit: oops, guess i forgot to quote it
 
Looking back at the time reversal patent application, it talks about co-op with other consoles towards the end, uniquely to that patent and not the other ones applied for at the same time. Doesn't mean that they will implement it, and it's also unique in bringing up cloud computing, but it made me wonder.
It also has 'leakage' as a potential object property alongside freezing/burning, might be a new thing unless the melting ice cubes count as leakage.
 
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Sunshinemario said:
I would love to see the Magic Meter return. I will be a very happy lad if we see the first glimpses of gameplay and there’s that classic green line under the hearts on the HUD. Pretty sad it was cut from both Twilight Princess AND Breath of the Wild 1. It’s time for redemption.
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Agreed. And let Link use more magical items, something in the vein of the spells of Zelda II or the lens of truth.
 
Kevin360 said:
Is that from the trailer?

I feel so behind on the marketing, and I’m pretty sure it is a lack thereof, but also feel like I don’t have the marketing media memorized like I have for Zelda games in the past.
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it's from the initial reveal

at the 44 second mark


bxDxxhn.gif
 
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Kevin360 said:
Is that from the trailer?

I feel so behind on the marketing, and I’m pretty sure it is a lack thereof, but also feel like I don’t have the marketing media memorized like I have for Zelda games in the past.
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Yeah, it's from the E3 2019 trailer. The image just has more brightness to it.
 
BY2K said:
But is it the entrance of a dungeon or just the entrance of where Ganondorf's body was being kept at?
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With context of what they showed and how long ago they showed it, yeah I'd say that particular entrance is intended for the intro story area. I still expect underground including that area will be a big focus though, and I mean I doubt you're going to be fixing the Goron's malice problem by being up in the sky.
 
BY2K said:
But is it the entrance of a dungeon or just the entrance of where Ganondorf's body was being kept at?
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whynotboth.gif

that lair/crypt with ganondorf's body could be your first dungeon or a "return to it later" dungeon

the initial reveal trailer was solely focused on the "awaken the corpse" scenario so it would be weird if it were just a completely different location
 
I wonder if the will expand the world's outskirts. If the dungeons are on areas we already know I would be dissapointed.
If they expanded BOTW world the area I'd like to see the most would be that area beyond Gerudo desert.
 
I feel like I am quite alone (at least on this forum) in the fact that I prefer the BotW dungeon style over previous 3D games. I love exploring the overworld, finding smaller riddles and puzzles and finding new cool places especially in the 3D games. I do like puzzles, but not 2 hour long puzzles like some dungeons are.

BotW was perfect for me in that sense - many more smaller dungeon like experiences in shrines and a few 30-60 minute bigger dungeons and a bigger last dungeon.

Just recently played through Skyward Sword which often is hailed for it's great dungeons, and it only reinforced my thoughts on the matter. I got bored and irritated at it at more than once before I beat most dungeons.
 
balgajo said:
I wonder if the will expand the world's outskirts. If the dungeons are on areas we already know I would be dissapointed.
If they expanded BOTW world the area I'd like to see the most would be that area beyond Gerudo desert.
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I mean, this is why we're still on the whole "underground" thing. There aren't just dungeons that manifest in places we've been to before since this is a fairly short time after the last game's events (compared to hundreds or thousands of years between games like before). Where at least some part of it is undergroud locations that can and have to be accessed through tunnels you somehow unearth in the familiar overworld (maybe related to getting fallen debris from the sky islands out of the way to reveal entrances) or something like that.
 
Mbolibombo said:
I feel like I am quite alone (at least on this forum) in the fact that I prefer the BotW dungeon style over previous 3D games. I love exploring the overworld, finding smaller riddles and puzzles and finding new cool places especially in the 3D games. I do like puzzles, but not 2 hour long puzzles like some dungeons are.

BotW was perfect for me in that sense - many more smaller dungeon like experiences in shrines and a few 30-60 minute bigger dungeons and a bigger last dungeon.

Just recently played through Skyward Sword which often is hailed for it's great dungeons, and it only reinforced my thoughts on the matter. I got bored and irritated at it at more than once before I beat most dungeons.
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Well, i’d say tough luck honestly. Of all the BOTW criticisms, i’m 99% confident the one they will respond to most is the dungeons, especially considering that last trailer has a part that shows a “7 trinkets” engraving, implying 7 dungeons.
Zelda team also has a tendency to overcorrect, just look at Wind Waker to TP, or SS to BOTW, both extreme responses to the criticisms of the last game. So yeah, pretty sure we’re getting the traditional Zelda dungeons this time again (and that’s not even my biggest BOTW critique, mind you)
They could definitely bring back shrines in some form, though.
 
Mbolibombo said:
I feel like I am quite alone (at least on this forum) in the fact that I prefer the BotW dungeon style over previous 3D games. I love exploring the overworld, finding smaller riddles and puzzles and finding new cool places especially in the 3D games. I do like puzzles, but not 2 hour long puzzles like some dungeons are.

BotW was perfect for me in that sense - many more smaller dungeon like experiences in shrines and a few 30-60 minute bigger dungeons and a bigger last dungeon.

Just recently played through Skyward Sword which often is hailed for it's great dungeons, and it only reinforced my thoughts on the matter. I got bored and irritated at it at more than once before I beat most dungeons.
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what BotW did with its shrines was absolutely perfect for the game that it was: a game about exploring and appropriating an unknown space and organically stumbling over new stuff constantly. doesn't mean this'll work for a game that is set up differently which is why TotK is not just BotW-but-the-map-is-new (like, for example, when you go from Assassin's Creed Origins to Odyssey) but having these landmasses in the sky and possibly places to go underground, your relationship and approach to that world changes and just littering it again with multiple dozens of mini puzzle rooms likely won't work as well. You can easily mix them, though. You can have a few larger spaces that are distinctly themed and isolated from the rest while having (fewer) puzzle box caves elsewhere for small chunks of that sort of gameplay.
 
Mbolibombo said:
I feel like I am quite alone (at least on this forum) in the fact that I prefer the BotW dungeon style over previous 3D games. I love exploring the overworld, finding smaller riddles and puzzles and finding new cool places especially in the 3D games. I do like puzzles, but not 2 hour long puzzles like some dungeons are.

BotW was perfect for me in that sense - many more smaller dungeon like experiences in shrines and a few 30-60 minute bigger dungeons and a bigger last dungeon.

Just recently played through Skyward Sword which often is hailed for it's great dungeons, and it only reinforced my thoughts on the matter. I got bored and irritated at it at more than once before I beat most dungeons.
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I love this feeling of the dungeon being a place that leaves me mental drained. After finishing one all I want to do is relax in the overworld with light puzzles and quests. It was also a good way to force me to stop playing as I almost never want to finish another in the same day.

Even if you are minority on this forum I believe a lot of people shares your preference given how BOTW ressonated with more people than other Zelda games.

TheMoon said:
I mean, this is why we're still on the whole "underground" thing. There aren't just dungeons that manifest in places we've been to before since this is a fairly short time after the last game's events (compared to hundreds or thousands of years between games like before). Where at least some part of it is undergroud locations that can and have to be accessed through tunnels you somehow unearth in the familiar overworld (maybe related to getting fallen debris from the sky islands out of the way to reveal entrances) or something like that.
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I was thinking about something like the shrines that, for some reason, emerged from underneath on some of the locations we already know. I hope they don't do that.
 
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balgajo said:
I love this feeling of the dungeon being a place that leaves me mental drained. After finishing one all I want to do is relax in the overworld with light puzzles and quests. It was also a good way to force me to stop playing as I almost never want to finish another in the same day.

Even if you are minority on this forum I believe a lot of people shares your preference given how BOTW ressonated with more people than other Zelda games.


I was thinking about something like the shrines that, for some reason, emerged from underneath on some of the locations we already know. I hope they don't do that.
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There could be stuff like cave-ins, sink holes, shifted landmasses due to earthquakes that create new locations we can discover that hide dungeons or entrances to dungeons, for example. That would also go well with caves/caverns/tunnels. The events that kick off the game and cause Hyrule Castle to rise up from the ground could "easily" facilitate all of this (and possibly more). The possibilities are plentiful :D
 
I liked the divine beasts too. Felt like there could have been 1 final big official temple to make a change but it's mainly the fact that there was only those 4. But tbh it was unique and fun. To be on the Vah Medoh or Vah Naboris's back and see the map move was insane.

They did hire new people for dungeon designing a few years ago so i think they will go back to bigger dungeons. I feel like people will appreciate Botw's dungeons more when they see it's not a forever formula. As a one time thing, the Beasts and shrines were a great idea. But i liked them knowing this would probably change again in the next game. They change so much from one Zelda game to the other that i doubt something so linked to the story like the shrines or divine beasts would stay. I think there could be some smaller dungeons and bigger ones. But i would maybe balance that number to 6-8 huge dungeons to 20-30 smaller ones instead of 4 medium dungeon and 120 shrines.
 
Golden said:
I liked the divine beasts too. Felt like there could have been 1 final big official temple to make a change but it's mainly the fact that there was only those 4. But tbh it was unique and fun. To be on the Vah Medoh or Vah Naboris's back and see the map move was insane.
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Hyrule Castle erasure!
 
Fuck Nintendo and fuck myself...XD
Just cancelled my PSVR2 pre-order. I'm still not strong enough to be able to ignore a Zelda launch to play it on a better way later.

Before buying a OLED model I will wait for the next direct just to be 100% sure they will not release a new hardware in a nearby date.
 
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It would be great if there was a full 7-dungeon linear quest and storyline, but that you could leave it to explore a large amount of new open world stuff whenever you want. Like BotW surrounding the core of a traditional Zelda.
 
Mbolibombo said:
I feel like I am quite alone (at least on this forum) in the fact that I prefer the BotW dungeon style over previous 3D games. I love exploring the overworld, finding smaller riddles and puzzles and finding new cool places especially in the 3D games. I do like puzzles, but not 2 hour long puzzles like some dungeons are.

BotW was perfect for me in that sense - many more smaller dungeon like experiences in shrines and a few 30-60 minute bigger dungeons and a bigger last dungeon.

Just recently played through Skyward Sword which often is hailed for it's great dungeons, and it only reinforced my thoughts on the matter. I got bored and irritated at it at more than once before I beat most dungeons.
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You’re not alone. The 4 beasts + 120 shrines formula was a stroke of genius. I’ll double down: I loved the shrines themselves, not once I’ve cared about them looking the same, and the more imaginative ones (multiple solutions physics based puzzles) are a league above the traditional Zelda dungeons.
That’s without mentioning how well they fit inside the game’s design philosophy.
 
About the 4 Divine beasts, what do you guys think will happen to them? I remember Zelda saying one of them stopped working in the ending. Also, the stone link uses to climb to the skies with the reverse power looks tooo similar to a stone used to construct the Divine beasts?
 
Mbolibombo said:
I feel like I am quite alone (at least on this forum) in the fact that I prefer the BotW dungeon style over previous 3D games. I love exploring the overworld, finding smaller riddles and puzzles and finding new cool places especially in the 3D games. I do like puzzles, but not 2 hour long puzzles like some dungeons are.

BotW was perfect for me in that sense - many more smaller dungeon like experiences in shrines and a few 30-60 minute bigger dungeons and a bigger last dungeon.

Just recently played through Skyward Sword which often is hailed for it's great dungeons, and it only reinforced my thoughts on the matter. I got bored and irritated at it at more than once before I beat most dungeons.
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Exploring and finding tons of mini dungeons throughout the world is amazing, but the issue I had with shrines is they're all structurally and thematically identical. You solve a puzzle and get a spirit orb, and if you go out of your way while solving the puzle you get a chest with a weapon in it. All while listening to the same music and looking at the same architecture and fighting the same mini guardians.

How awesome would it be to stumble across a mini dungeon and not know what it's going to look like, sound like, what kind of enemy you might face, or what the prize at the end will be? BotW had a handful of moments like that, such as Thyphlo Ruins, but TotK desperately needs more of them.
 
Cerlinho said:
About the 4 Divine beasts, what do you guys think will happen to them? I remember Zelda saying one of them stopped working in the ending. Also, the stone link uses to climb to the skies with the reverse power looks tooo similar to a stone used to construct the Divine beasts?
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I do think they had an idea for a sequel right when they made this sequel. That was too much of a tease. And i think that's why they announced the sequel early since it was kind of anticipated they might do a sequel. Usually Zelda game ends with a clear ending and this one was like "uh oh, something happened".

So i think ToTK might start right after Botw. I anticipate a cutscene of short shots of them trying to figure out what is happening and then going into that cave to discover Ganon. Link somewhat being taken to the Sky and starts his adventure there.
 
The dungeon at the end of Champions' Ballad is a top 10 Zelda dungeon of all time to me, so the Divine Beast model can definitely work. I'd even argue that it DOES work for most of the Divine Beasts, but the aesthetics, size and brevity of them work against the concept.
 
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Golden said:
I liked the divine beasts too. Felt like there could have been 1 final big official temple to make a change but it's mainly the fact that there was only those 4. But tbh it was unique and fun. To be on the Vah Medoh or Vah Naboris's back and see the map move was insane.

They did hire new people for dungeon designing a few years ago so i think they will go back to bigger dungeons. I feel like people will appreciate Botw's dungeons more when they see it's not a forever formula. As a one time thing, the Beasts and shrines were a great idea. But i liked them knowing this would probably change again in the next game. They change so much from one Zelda game to the other that i doubt something so linked to the story like the shrines or divine beasts would stay. I think there could be some smaller dungeons and bigger ones. But i would maybe balance that number to 6-8 huge dungeons to 20-30 smaller ones instead of 4 medium dungeon and 120 shrines.
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You are not alone. BotW is the most successful Zelda ever, and praised like OoT.

Anyone who believes Zelda “needs” to go back to past dungeons layouts are ignoring the reality.

One thing is to prefer the old dungeons and another one is to believe it is needed.

Personally, I liked the BotW approach and can’t wait to see what other kind of dungeons they are going to offer to us.
 
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