• Hey everyone, staff have documented a list of banned content and subject matter that we feel are not consistent with site values, and don't make sense to host discussion of on Famiboards. This list (and the relevant reasoning per item) is viewable here.
  • Do you have audio editing experience and want to help out with the Famiboards Discussion Club Podcast? If so, we're looking for help and would love to have you on the team! Just let us know in the Podcast Thread if you are interested!

Discussion The Super Mario Bros. Movie impressions/previews thread

Status
Not open for further replies.
Reader mode
So Mario is doing 3.7/5 on Letterboxd right now, with like 80 ratings. Sonic 2 around that point was doing 3.3-3.4. Maybe the 70% cause isn't totally lost...
 
Last edited:
For the non-american, non-film-review-scene-outside-of-rottentomatoes-following Bonejack: What is Letterboxd?
 
Bonejack said:
For the non-american, non-film-review-scene-outside-of-rottentomatoes-following Bonejack: What is Letterboxd?
Click to expand...
I‘m not american either. Letterboxd is a review site for films only where you can keep a diary of films you watched. There are many critics, some influencer and private users like myself. Though the current score of the Mario movie isn‘t really representative in any way at the moment, many of those "reviews" right now are probably from people that haven‘t even seen the movie.
 
When it was announced that Illumination would create the Mario Movie, I basically pegged it as gorgeous but shallow crowd pleaser with cheap humor. This seems to be trending slightly above my expectations so I'm positively surprised. I already have tickets with my sons for the 4D screening this Friday regardless, like I would ever miss out on a Mario movie even if it was a 0% Rotten.
 
0
I think Nintendo likely wanted to be sure that Mario safely transitions into movies with this 1st entry. They always have other entries to improve plot, but im sure they want to make sure their mascot is properly represented on the 1st go and these reviews seem to show that it easily does that. Rather it goes this way than falling flat with a plot that tries to do too much.
 
I have tickets to see the movie with my kids tomorrow afternoon, hyped!
 
0
Clov said:
I can understand not expecting deep characters in a Mario film. But why shouldn't a Mario FILM have good cinematography and good writing? Ideally, any movie should! Surely you're not saying that instead of judging a movie on having interesting shots and good writing, we should judge it only on jokes and how close it is to the games? Just because it's Mario?
Click to expand...

I mean ... yes?

"Good writing" doesn't randomly come from nowhere either, it's reliant on having story depth which the source Mario material just doesn't have. Which is fine.

Neither does James Bond, I don't go into a James Bond movie looking for great writing/emotional depth.

It depends what you want out of a movie.
 
having a deep meaning story usually comes through trying to have a focal point to get across. the issue with Mario is that the focal point was always the gameplay over story. Mario is a video game-ass video game, so it's inherently shallow. there's always Paper Mario and Mario and Luigi, but those came long after Mario was established. the IP isn't yet established in the movie space, so taking things slow makes sense before becoming more daring akin to the PM and M&L series.

not to mention, I think Nintendo would want to avoid deeper questions to be asked, like "what does it mean to be a hero", ect from taking up too much time because that's never really been Mario's thing. maybe when they do Zelda, they can start delving into deeper concepts because the game already does that. just look at Twilight Princess, Breath of the Wild, and Majora's Mask (and that's not to discount stuff like Wind Waker's Ganon, and Skyward Sword)
 
I'm not sure if you can even call ML or PM games "deeper Mario stories" since those intense themes the story touches on as part of those games isn't actualy connected to Mario at all right? "Oh the Bob Omb's wife died" is fatalist and all but it's something entirely unrelated to the cores of the Mario series and is not connected to anything else in the game, and never does ML explore deeper themes of brotherhood outside of the basic "Mario and Luigi would move mountains for each other" which this movie is doing too. The usual set up for those games is that there's a nasty baddie making trouble and Mario and Luigi have to deal with it while fun slapstick moments and snarky dialogue passes thru. They're actualy quite shallow for RPG stories that last 20 hours or more of playtime and the moments that flirt with something heavier is entirely dettached from the core characters.

"Shallow plot that is a vehicle for character interaction and action" is very much what Mario RPG games try to do most of the time, the movie (and specifically the first mainstream film trying to set up the basics) doing that too feels natural to me, the only real question is if said interactions, humor and action set pieces will be executed in endearing and fun ways IMO (Illumination being in charge makes me wary they'll manage, but the directors are two guys I do like so we'll see who weighs harder there)
 
Bowser Sr. said:
I'm not sure if you can even call ML or PM games "deeper Mario stories" since those intense themes the story touches on as part of those games isn't actualy connected to Mario at all right? "Oh the Bob Omb's wife died" is fatalist and all but it's something entirely unrelated to the cores of the Mario series and is not connected to anything else in the game, and never does ML explore deeper themes of brotherhood outside of the basic "Mario and Luigi would move mountains for each other" which this movie is doing too. The usual set up for those games is that there's a nasty baddie making trouble and Mario and Luigi have to deal with it while fun slapstick moments and snarky dialogue passes thru. They're actualy quite shallow for RPG stories that last 20 hours or more of playtime and the moments that flirt with something heavier is entirely dettached from the core characters.

"Shallow plot that is a vehicle for character interaction and action" is very much what Mario RPG games try to do most of the game, the movie (and specifically the first mainstream film trying to set up the basics) doing that too feels natural to me, the only real question is if said interactions, humor and action set pieces will be executed in endearing and fun ways IMO
Click to expand...

I think you're pretty much correct on that. The Mario games, even the RPG games don't ever really get into a "deep" story, which is fine. In part that would hinder the game play.

I think the other reason Miyamoto hasn't allowed it is because it would create tremendous baggage for the Mario character over years and years, like you would have people asking "yeah but what about the Mario game from 10 years ago where Mario was revealed to be XYZ and XYZ happened to him, why doesn't he remember any of that?" ... it would just become a mess.
 
Bowser Sr. said:
I'm not sure if you can even call ML or PM games "deeper Mario stories" since those intense themes the story touches on as part of those games isn't actualy connected to Mario at all right? "Oh the Bob Omb's wife died" is fatalist and all but it's something entirely unrelated to the cores of the Mario series and is not connected to anything else in the game, and never does ML explore deeper themes of brotherhood outside of the basic "Mario and Luigi would move mountains for each other" which this movie is doing too. The usual set up for those games is that there's a nasty baddie making trouble and Mario and Luigi have to deal with it while fun slapstick moments and snarky dialogue passes thru. They're actualy quite shallow for RPG stories that last 20 hours or more of playtime and the moments that flirt with something heavier is entirely dettached from the core characters.

"Shallow plot that is a vehicle for character interaction and action" is very much what Mario RPG games try to do most of the time, the movie (and specifically the first mainstream film trying to set up the basics) doing that too feels natural to me, the only real question is if said interactions, humor and action set pieces will be executed in endearing and fun ways IMO (Illumination being in charge makes me wary they'll manage, but the directors are two guys I do like so we'll see who weighs harder there)
Click to expand...
This is well true enough. The Mario RPG games don't have particularly deep stories at all. All of the games are basically a spin on "save the princess and/or stop the guy trying to take over the world". Mario is never the character who goes through a character arc throughout these stories, it's always the side cast and it's only done so in fragments. There's never any big emotional denouement or core central theme we circle back to once the big bad is defeated; ironically one of the few times I can think of that being the case is The Origami King.

What I think most people really are trying to say when they claim those games have good stories is that they offer a space to build a greater degree of charm and whimsy because of their narratives exploring aspects of the Mario world in detail that we're usually just left to think about as background elements. TTYD and the earlier M&L games tend to be held in higher esteem because they tend to provide unique new things that we as fans of the Mario games haven't seen before, but ultimately the RPG series are still primarily driven by wit more than they are drama. If anything I think this is something the movie isn't doing much differently than the RPG games in the slightest; the Jungle Kingdom subplot looks like it could've been straight out of one of the RPGs if DK was ever actually in them, because the idea of Mario trying to rally a team up to take down the big bad isn't something he ever does in the platformers.

The one time any of the RPG adjacent games delved into an attempt at a deeper narrative was Super Paper Mario, and if Nintendo is to be believed people at large pushed back against it hard.
 
Machrider said:
I think you're pretty much correct on that. The Mario games, even the RPG games don't ever really get into a "deep" story, which is fine. In part that would hinder the game play.

I think the other reason Miyamoto hasn't allowed it is because it would create tremendous baggage for the Mario character over years and years, like you would have people asking "yeah but what about the Mario game from 10 years ago where Mario was revealed to be XYZ and XYZ happened to him, why doesn't he remember any of that?" ... it would just become a mess.
Click to expand...
tbf fans are gonna do that anyways
 
0
Decoyman said:
This is well true enough. The Mario RPG games don't have particularly deep stories at all. All of the games are basically a spin on "save the princess and/or stop the guy trying to take over the world". Mario is never the character who goes through a character arc throughout these stories, it's always the side cast and it's only done so in fragments. There's never any big emotional denouement or core central theme we circle back to once the big bad is defeated; ironically one of the few times I can think of that being the case is The Origami King.

What I think most people really are trying to say when they claim those games have good stories is that they offer a space to build a greater degree of charm and whimsy because of their narratives exploring aspects of the Mario world in detail that we're usually just left to think about as background elements. TTYD and the earlier M&L games tend to be held in higher esteem because they tend to provide unique new things that we as fans of the Mario games haven't seen before, but ultimately the RPG series are still primarily driven by wit more than they are drama. If anything I think this is something the movie isn't doing much differently than the RPG games in the slightest; the Jungle Kingdom subplot looks like it could've been straight out of one of the RPGs if DK was ever in them.

The one time any of the RPG adjacent games delved into an attempt at a deeper narrative was Super Paper Mario, and if Nintendo is to be believed people at large pushed back against it hard.
Click to expand...
Right, and I would agree with anyone that loves the flavorful scenarios those games give, but I feel like those flavorful scenarios in movie form are things that we would be seeing as possible directions on sequels instead of "the first film". Like Mario Odyssey's globetrotting or Sunshine's tropical atmosphere are things that are specifically fun because we already had the standard Mario landmarks with the games that came before them. Paper Mario's "What if Bowser got the power of the stars and WON?!" set up only works because Mario already has a history of beating him up by now, etc. For this film, which is Mario Begins of sorts, I think this simple tale is the sensible path to take, and like you said, it even has hints of something akin to the "contextualization of elements into a richer world" that the early RPGs did since we get the jungle kingdom and Brooklyn and what not.
 
0
UnassumingLocalGuy said:
Can't wait for the thousand headlines with some variation of "Mario jumps/stomps/levels up to the top of the box office"
Click to expand...
Every film journalist has two images saved on their desktop, waiting to see how things pan out.

2a530842d2cb8bd2e017fd770a456c34.png


Or

mario-movie-money.jpg
 
WestEgg said:
Every film journalist has two images saved on their desktop, waiting to see how things pan out.

2a530842d2cb8bd2e017fd770a456c34.png


Or

mario-movie-money.jpg
Click to expand...
First one for when the reviews come in a few hours and they're very middling, the second one for when we get the box office numbers. :D
 
0
YolkFolk said:
Jeez. Has Kotaku always been this child-like? The writer almost sounds like they’re having a fanboy temper tantrum.

kotaku.com

Super Mario Bros. Movie Fans Knock Seth Rogen For Barely Trying

The voice actor for Donkey Kong is catching heat for not doing ‘a voice’ or dressing up
kotaku.com kotaku.com
Click to expand...
kotaku.com

Retro's Next Big Game Is Another Damn Donkey Kong Country

Donkey Kong Island is overrun by Vikings in Donkey Kong Country: Tropical Freeze, which will be a retail release and a Wii U eShop download when it arrives later this year.
kotaku.com kotaku.com

I will forever publicly shame these outlets for throwing a temper tantrum over this wonderful game.
 
Seth Rogen is a really cool dude, really genuine and gives no fucks, straight up and honest about smoking weed every day basically all day too.
 
Machrider said:
I mean ... yes?

"Good writing" doesn't randomly come from nowhere either, it's reliant on having story depth which the source Mario material just doesn't have. Which is fine.

Neither does James Bond, I don't go into a James Bond movie looking for great writing/emotional depth.

It depends what you want out of a movie.
Click to expand...

A story can be simple but well written. And a movie can have good cinematography even without a great script.

You're basically saying that as long as you laugh and recognize things, even if the movie fundamentally fails at having the basic aspects that make any movie good, you'll like it. Which is fine I guess, I just would prefer it to be a good movie first and foremost.
 
Clov said:
A story can be simple but well written. And a movie can have good cinematography even without a great script.

You're basically saying that as long as you laugh and recognize things, even if the movie fundamentally fails at having the basic aspects that make any movie good, you'll like it. Which is fine I guess, I just would prefer it to be a good movie first and foremost.
Click to expand...

I'm saying "good scripts" are rare. It's probably the hardest thing to do in the creative arts ... to write a good movie script and have a story that doesn't falter for 2 hours but yet also doesn't bore or meander.

It's not easy and it's much harder frankly when you basing it on a video game property that has little story meat to draw from. Almost every good director/writer who are the best of the best, the best in the world have some stinkers, whereas if you look at game development, most of the top studios for their main line games tend to have no problem pumping out high scoring games every time out.

A script if you make even one mistake with a character or a plot point or even one or two scenes drag too much ... it can start to sink your entire movie.

If you're a musician 6/10 tracks on your album can be kinda middling/average but if 4/10 are stone cold classics that's considered a legendary album.
 
Machrider said:
I'm saying "good scripts" are rare. It's probably the hardest thing to do in the creative arts ... to write a good movie script and have a story that doesn't falter for 2 hours but yet also doesn't bore or meander.

It's not easy and it's much harder frankly when you basing it on a video game property that has little story meat to draw from. Almost every good director/writer who are the best of the best, the best in the world have some stinkers, whereas if you look at game development, most of the top studios for their main line games tend to have no problem pumping out high scoring games every time out.

A script if you make even one mistake with a character or a plot point or even one or two scenes drag too much ... it can start to sink your entire movie.

If you're a musician 6/10 tracks on your album can be kinda middling/average but if 4/10 are stone cold classics that's considered a legendary album.
Click to expand...

I just can't really agree with this. I've seen plenty of movies with good scripts. It's not that rare, and even if they were, I wouldn't lower my own standards just because I like playing Mario games.

I feel like asking for a good script isn't asking for much. It's really such a simple thing. But if you don't expect it, I guess that's good for you.
 
Machrider said:
I'm saying "good scripts" are rare. It's probably the hardest thing to do in the creative arts ... to write a good movie script and have a story that doesn't falter for 2 hours but yet also doesn't bore or meander.

It's not easy and it's much harder frankly when you basing it on a video game property that has little story meat to draw from. Almost every good director/writer who are the best of the best, the best in the world have some stinkers, whereas if you look at game development, most of the top studios for their main line games tend to have no problem pumping out high scoring games every time out.

A script if you make even one mistake with a character or a plot point or even one or two scenes drag too much ... it can start to sink your entire movie.

If you're a musician 6/10 tracks on your album can be kinda middling/average but if 4/10 are stone cold classics that's considered a legendary album.
Click to expand...
The Lego Movie is proof that you can have a very well made film, with good writing, while also being a vehicle for merchandising.
 
Clov said:
I just can't really agree with this. I've seen plenty of movies with good scripts. It's not that rare, and even if they were, I wouldn't lower my own standards just because I like playing Mario games.

I feel like asking for a good script isn't asking for much. It's really such a simple thing. But if you don't expect it, I guess that's good for you.
Click to expand...

It's more rare than people think. There are about 400 theaterical releases on a yearly basis, of those I'd say the total amount of movies that score over 80% on rotten tomatoes is like maybe 30-40? Not even 10%?

It's not like the other 90% didn't try, it's just hard.
 
Machrider said:
It's more rare than people think. There are about 400 theaterical releases on a yearly basis, of those I'd say the total amount of movies that score over 80% on rotten tomatoes is like maybe 30-40? Not even 10%?

It's not like the other 90% didn't try, it's just hard.
Click to expand...

Isn't that down to more than just script? A movie can also score low because of poor acting, cinematography, editing, special effects... there's plenty of other reasons why a movie could be bad.
 
0
NarohDethan said:
The Lego Movie is proof that you can have a very well made film, with good writing, while also being a vehicle for merchandising.
Click to expand...

1 example out of like 50 test cases doesn't really prove the point. Yeah it's great that one single film is a classic, but they weren't able to even repeat that for the sequel. The second movie has a terrible audience rating too ... not sure what happened there.

But that just goes to show ... if "make the script good" is so easy, why is it so hard for even proven writers who even have a proven working concept?

Ghostbusters 1 is a classic everyone agrees. But Ghostbusters 2 was considered a disappointment even with the same exact writer, director, cast, everything.

There isn't a set formula for making a good script, there's just too many variables, even if you think you have the "formula" figured out, when it comes to telling a new story, a lot of things completely change and now you have a whole other set of issues that can become story problems.

People really ought to appreciate good/great movies and TV more than they do because it's not easy to do.

And in this case when you're talking about trying to craft some kind of compelling narrative from a video game that has no narrative (basically), it was always an uphill mountain to climb in freezing temperatures.
 
Clov said:
I just can't really agree with this. I've seen plenty of movies with good scripts. It's not that rare, and even if they were, I wouldn't lower my own standards just because I like playing Mario games.

I feel like asking for a good script isn't asking for much. It's really such a simple thing. But if you don't expect it, I guess that's good for you.
Click to expand...
Eh, I think for this specific movie, I wasn't expecting anything but I was expecting the most "safe" movie out there. It was Nintendo's return to making a Mario movie after the far worse panned Live-Action one and they paired with Illumination, known for making profitable films more than critically acclaimed movies. Honestly, I was expecting this to have found the mathematically proven safest film in the history of film.

So hearing it has a more threadbare plot with focus on kiddy humor sounds about right, honestly.
 
0
Machrider said:
1 example out of like 50 test cases doesn't really prove the point. Yeah it's great that one single film is a classic, but they weren't able to even repeat that for the sequel. The second movie has a terrible audience rating too ... not sure what happened there.

But that just goes to show ... if "make the script good" is so easy, why is it so hard for even proven writers who even have a proven working concept?

Ghostbusters 1 is a classic everyone agrees. But Ghostbusters 2 was considered a disappointment even with the same exact writer, director, cast, everything.

There isn't a set formula for making a good script, there's just too many variables, even if you think you have the "formula" figured out, when it comes to telling a new story, a lot of things completely change and now you have a whole other set of issues that can become story problems.

People really ought to appreciate good/great movies and TV more than they do because it's not easy to do.

And in this case when you're talking about trying to craft some kind of compelling narrative from a video game that has no narrative (basically), it was always an uphill mountain to climb in freezing temperatures.
Click to expand...
Because sequels are notoriously difficult to nail in films. Making a good movie and making a good sequel are not the same thing.
 
This is just silly. Expecting a movie to be well written is not unreasonable! Neither is expecting a movie to have good cinematography. I'm hoping that this has both, because great movies often do!
 
Also I don't see enough people shitting on Seth Rogen. Like, PLEASE act
 
0
Dusa said:
Because sequels are notoriously difficult to nail in films. Making a good movie and making a good sequel are not the same thing.
Click to expand...

It just goes to show that making a good script period is hard, even the best screenwriters tend to have some stinkers and many can't make a sequel to an already proven set of characters the audience loves already.
 
Machrider said:
It just goes to show that making a good script period is hard, even the best screenwriters tend to have some stinkers and many can't make a sequel to an already proven set of characters the audience loves already.
Click to expand...
Well, yeah, it's not easy, otherwise everyone would do it. But blaming the content for bad directorial/writing choices is weak.
 
Dusa said:
Well, yeah, it's not easy, otherwise everyone would do it. But blaming the content for bad directorial/writing choices is weak.
Click to expand...

I haven't really heard from the reviews that the directing/writing choices are weak ... the subject material is just thin. It's a Mario ... movie. Not a Mario movie ... trying to also be the Godfather or even E.T. or even (insert Disney movie you like).

It's just a Mario movie.

Mario being a video game that has virtually no plot or even much personality for any of its characters to begin with (so not really much there for a screenwriter to look at and go "yeah I'll just take this").
 
Clov said:
This is just silly. Expecting a movie to be well written is not unreasonable! Neither is expecting a movie to have good cinematography. I'm hoping that this has both, because great movies often do!
Click to expand...
I don't think it's unreasonable, I do think it was just unlikely the Mario Movie was ever going to be anything approaching great because it always seemed the main goal was to be "competent" rather than "great". Which is a shame but then again, Mario himself was never going to be a great main protagonist anyways. The dude isn't a good person to base your movie on. Even Luigi would have been a better choice for a character to have growth. Mario kind of just...reacts to everything even in games with good story.

Basically, Nintendo are cowards and Vivian should have been the star of the Mario Movie.
 
Reader mode
Status
Not open for further replies.


Back
Top Bottom