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StarTopic Future Nintendo Hardware & Technology Speculation & Discussion |ST| (New Staff Post, Please read)

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Shoulder said:
I actually think a TV only Switch wouldn’t even be as cheap as we think it would be.

For starters, you need to bundle it with the Pro Controller, which costs 70 dollars. Let’s assume they’re reusing the regular Switch dock as the base station for the TV only version; that costs 60 dollars. So already you’re at 130 dollars, and that’s before you need to make modifications to the base station such as I/O, microSD card slot, etc. Then you have the Switch internals itself, so the motherboard, ram, storage, cooling, etc, etc. All that stuff, and probably using the 64GB storage internals the the SWOLED has, so let’s say 50 bucks as a conservative estimate.

Tack on the R&D costs, and whatever else, and you have a Switch TV version that could be 180-200 dollars from the get go. Assume they then create another SKU without the controller itself, still probably 120-130 dollars I’d say.

Keep in mind, I’m using estimates based on what Nintendo provides on their own site for the dock itself, and the controller, plus what I imagine the whole internal hardware of the switch costs.

A simple 100 dollar Switch TV I think is grossly underpriced.
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The BOM of a Pro Controller is far, far below its MSRP, while the dock's pricing is irrelevant since the A/V out would be integrated into the main board. R&D is rarely if ever factored into the price of a console at retail. So if we say Switch internals, let's take a 32GB model, are 50$, and a Pro Controller is sub-50 BOM wise, then 99$ looks possible. Likely? Maybe not, but possible.
 
Concernt said:
The BOM of a Pro Controller is far, far below its MSRP, while the dock's pricing is irrelevant since the A/V out would be integrated into the main board. R&D is rarely if ever factored into the price of a console at retail. So if we say Switch internals, let's take a 32GB model, are 50$, and a Pro Controller is sub-50 BOM wise, then 99$ looks possible. Likely? Maybe not, but possible.
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I think this is where i respectually disagree. A Switch TV will not be bargain basement cut-down device. They already have that, it's called the Switch Lite.

@Shoulder has a point, that is, you lose more by cutting than keeping things in. There's a floor to pricing anyways. The issue with Switch home is I think fundamentally if a device like that exist, it will be for a 3rd performance profile and premium priced to compete with the other 2 home only consoles. They won't wan tto undercut hybrid market position with essentially a Fire TV version of the Switch.

Even when Switch 2 is out and they rejig a new SKU of the old Switch, I could see them just making cheaper versions of the Lite or Hybrid to sunset the console.
Actually a $120~ Lite could makes the most sense as an indie machine.
 
Dekuman said:
I think this is where i respectually disagree. A Switch TV will not be bargain basement cut-down device. They already have that, it's called the Switch Lite.

@Shoulder has a point, that is, you lose more by cutting than keeping things in. There's a floor to pricing anyways. The issue with Switch home is I think fundamentally if a device like that exist, it will be for a 3rd performance profile and premium priced to compete with the other 2 home only consoles. They won't wan tto undercut hybrid market position with essentially a Fire TV version of the Switch.

Even when Switch 2 is out and they rejig a new SKU of the old Switch, I could see them just making cheaper versions of the Lite or Hybrid to sunset the console.
Actually a $120~ Lite could makes the most sense as an indie machine.
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Adding an additional profile to target seems like a bad idea, I think. There is considerable precedent for Nintendo to release end of life cut down versions of systems, including those that cut key features.

That could be a further cut down Lite, but I think a TV only device is possible. It's possible that we already saw this device in the data mines as Calico, a TV only, digital only device based on the Tegra X1. But, as others have pointed out, that could have been purely test hardware with absolutely no commercial product being explored.
 
Shoulder said:
I actually think a TV only Switch wouldn’t even be as cheap as we think it would be.

For starters, you need to bundle it with the Pro Controller, which costs 70 dollars. Let’s assume they’re reusing the regular Switch dock as the base station for the TV only version; that costs 60 dollars. So already you’re at 130 dollars, and that’s before you need to make modifications to the base station such as I/O, microSD card slot, etc. Then you have the Switch internals itself, so the motherboard, ram, storage, cooling, etc, etc. All that stuff, and probably using the 64GB storage internals the the SWOLED has, so let’s say 50 bucks as a conservative estimate.
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You’re using MSRP prices. Everything is marked up so retailers can make a profit. Even if you want to use those prices for simplicity’s sake, JoyCons cost more than the Pro Controller, so wouldn’t exchanging them cause the price to drop?

Also, I disagree that Nintendo would bundle the Pro Controller because every game is compatible with JoyCons, and there are two for multiplayer.

Shoulder said:
A simple 100 dollar Switch TV I think is grossly underpriced.
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Sure, but like, I didn’t even imply this. For starters, a home-only version would be cheaper by virtue of not including a screen, battery etc. More importantly, the packaging would likely be smaller which makes shipping easier and cheaper.
 
Dekuman said:
I think this is where i respectually disagree. A Switch TV will not be bargain basement cut-down device. They already have that, it's called the Switch Lite.

@Shoulder has a point, that is, you lose more by cutting than keeping things in. There's a floor to pricing anyways. The issue with Switch home is I think fundamentally if a device like that exist, it will be for a 3rd performance profile and premium priced to compete with the other 2 home only consoles. They won't wan tto undercut hybrid market position with essentially a Fire TV version of the Switch.

Even when Switch 2 is out and they rejig a new SKU of the old Switch, I could see them just making cheaper versions of the Lite or Hybrid to sunset the console.
Actually a $120~ Lite could makes the most sense as an indie machine.
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I would get a TV only switch off I could also sick my hybrid switch to it as well.
 
Concernt said:
Adding an additional profile to target seems like a bad idea, I think. There is considerable precedent for Nintendo to release end of life cut down versions of systems, including those that cut key features.

That could be a further cut down Lite, but I think a TV only device is possible. It's possible that we already saw this device in the data mines as Calico, a TV only, digital only device based on the Tegra X1. But, as others have pointed out, that could have been purely test hardware with absolutely no commercial product being explored.
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Yes i agree, 3rd profile is a bad idea, which is why a Switch TV doesn't exist, because that's what it would have to be to not undermine the value proposition of the hybrid model, which is their most popular SKU by a wide margin, and for the pricing to make sense.

For the successor, a Switch 2 Home that has twice twice the performance, twice the RAM of the hybrid priced like a PS5 would be where they would land i would think if they go with a home console. But that's probably not in the cards yet.

If we see a more cut down model, i assume it will be the Lite of the OG model. And i assume it will just be a slightly nip and tuck on the case, maybe even smaller with a smaller LCD but essentially just passing on some of the savings of having mass produced the device and the SoC for many years and hoping each of those new hardware sales generate extra software sales on the back end as the console sunsets.
 
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Found the Switch 2's latest competitor

17_Legion_Go_Hero_Front_Facing_R.jpg
 
I’m not sure how a TV model is going to undermine the hybrid model’s value proposition. As we can see in a country like JP, the Lite is consistently outsold by OLED & OG; there are observable trends for the Lite & enough data to point to why it hasn’t exactly done more. All a TV model would be is appealing to a more limited audience. People are dreaming if they think this would be cheap &/or have a third more powerful profile.
 
Actually, a Switch only TV could be more powerful. It could be like de Switch in docked mode. More resolution, more FPS, etc.

The Switch 2 could still be hybrid but with only one configuration: handheld. So, no 4K in TV with Switch 2 in docked. But, if you have Switch TV, you could have that upgrade of quality. That way, it maintains two lines like Switch does: handheld and TV mode.

That way, they can give more value to the only TV Switch. Imagine playing the next Zelda in 4K/60fps in TV Switch or in 1080p/30fps in Switch 2. Not the same, but it happens with the current Switch like Bowser's Fury, which in handheld mode is 30 against 60 in docked mode.
 
I know Geoff said to temper expectations in regard to Gamescom, but that's only to do with official announcements right? There's still the possibility whispers come about due to Gamescom.
 
Tentacle-tropes said:
I’m not sure how a TV model is going to undermine the hybrid model’s value proposition. As we can see in a country like JP, the Lite is consistently outsold by OLED & OG; there are observable trends for the Lite & enough data to point to why it hasn’t exactly done more. All a TV model would be is appealing to a more limited audience. People are dreaming if they think this would be cheap &/or have a third more powerful profile.
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it won't if it's more expensive and more powerful, but I've outlined why they probably won't go there yet right now. I think a 3rd performance profile will be a drag and unpopular to 3rd parties.

Switching back to OG Switch (pun intended) Most of the posts I am seeing are expectations of savings from things Nintendo can cut out and low pricing resulting form that savings. A producct like that will cut into not just hybrid but Lite sales.

I think an OG Switch TV as envisioned , cheap, stripped down , and just generally offering bare bones docked experience with 32GB of NAND flash or whatever can move a few million, but the question isn't if it can sell those numbers but the opportunity costs to Nintendo of having that kind of product

I've pointed this out also is that a stirpped down Switch like that will open Nintendo to be unfavourably compared to its competitors in the high end (actual home consoles with 100 watt power draw, and on the low end, Google TV and Fire Stick devices which by now have far more capable SoCs and fully featured OS and streaming service) and it won't have its hybrid form factor as a value add.

I could be wrong here, but I see Nintendo's lack of a product like what people are calling for after 6+ years on the market as a sign tha they too see the same problem I am seeing. My view remains that any move back into a dedicated home console will be a fully featured, powerful premium priced product that shares the DNA/architecture of their hybrid console and is in the same family, but much more powerful. And as far as I know, there isn't any rumors of such a device.

For OG Switch, ship's sailed on that, and for Switch 2, they definately do not want to launch a home only console, the rumors/leak suggest it will be hybrid and it makes sense as it's what has worked for them, but i think it's possible they do something like a Switch Home Console down the road. I'm not ruling it out, but not as a cheaper alternative to the hybrid.
 
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Mr Swine said:
Any possibility that Nintendo includes a fan in the dock so they can push the SoC even higher at 15/20w or would it not help that much?
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From my experience with laptop coolers which provide additional fans, they mostly don't provide any real additional cooling outside of just elevating the machine to enable better air flow, with one exception.

opolar-lc06-laptop-cooler.jpg


This style of cooler that seals exhaust vents and sucks hot air out of the machine do provide some additional cooling. So if Nintendo could engineer a way for the exhaust vents to be in line with an additional exhaust fan and it provides a tight seal, they may get some extra thermal headroom, but how much that helps them clock the device higher when the internal space is so limited remains to be seen.
 
Eos said:
Actually, a Switch only TV could be more powerful. It could be like de Switch in docked mode. More resolution, more FPS, etc.

The Switch 2 could still be hybrid but with only one configuration: handheld. So, no 4K in TV with Switch 2 in docked. But, if you have Switch TV, you could have that upgrade of quality. That way, it maintains two lines like Switch does: handheld and TV mode.

That way, they can give more value to the only TV Switch. Imagine playing the next Zelda in 4K/60fps in TV Switch or in 1080p/30fps in Switch 2. Not the same, but it happens with the current Switch like Bowser's Fury, which in handheld mode is 30 against 60 in docked mode.
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That would add value to the TV Switch by removing value from the main hybrid product which most people buy.

That leaves two compromised products - a TV model that's still weaker than the competitors and a hybrid model that doesn't take full advantage of its hardware by offering a boosted profile when docked.

I don't see how that's more profitably to Nintendo than having one hybrid that's optimised to do as much as it reasonably can with the form factor.
 
A TV only Switch makes less sense than ever before. The Switch spearheaded the portable AAA gaming market, and that market has now reached new levels of mainstream acceptance. We now have several established brands offering modern AAA gaming portably, fully validating Nintendo's approach with the Switch. It's in the nature of 'core gamers' to always want the best performance, but it's clear now that portable gaming is 'good enough' for almost any need, and so Nintendo won't see any reasons to muddle their message with a significantly different-performing TV-only console version.
 
why would Nintendo sell a Home console or any other variant when it would just take away sales from the Hybrid model? imagine if Apple employed this sort of thinking...

why sell an iPad when it will just take away sales from the iPhone which has bigger profit margins.

it's about giving the consumer choice and getting them invested in the ecosystem. if there are different hardware options they should be seen as additional not subtractive revenue streams. i find a lot of this thinking to be in-line with how Nintendo have approached their business in the past ie backward, games fixed to one piece of hardware. there's no reason they have to be like that forever.
 
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TomNookYankees said:
Console only switch would a terrible idea unless it was even cheaper than the switch lite, but presumably it would be cheaper because of not needing to make screens for it, especially when the inclusion of its own screen was a big reason the WiiU was as expensive as it was.
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Yeah, that's what most realistic folks discussing it are considering. Get it as close to impulse-buy pricing as you can.
Thraktor said:
I was thinking about this, and although there are certainly ways in which a Switch TV would be cheaper to manufacture than other models (no screen, no battery, etc.), one limiting factor would be the cost of the controllers. Perhaps it would warrant the introduction of a cheaper controller with a few cost reductions, like removing the HD rumble. A Switch Amateur Controller, if you will.
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Cost of controllers is already factored into all current Switch BoMs, I don't see the issue. But it's not impossible that they do a "Lite Controller", as it were, just to ensure some room in margins for increases and decreases in part costs to keep them at maximum profitability. My thought was sub out the 40hr battery for a cheaper one and a longer charging cable to ensure continued wired play if consumers forget to plug it in.
ILikeFeet said:
hope only switch appeals to the same people as Vita TV
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Because those are completely analogous things, yep.
I've already slayed this tired retort, no sense in repeating myself.
Terrell said:
  • inexplicably-poor compatibility with the pre-existing Vita library at launch (only around 140 titles, or ~30% of the total Vita library at the time)
  • didn't come with a controller in the basic $100 configuration
  • 1GB internal storage, required unnecessarily-expensive proprietary memory cards to expand or buying the $150 config for an paltry extra 8GB and a DualShock 3
But sure, it's the idea itself that's the failure, not the piss-poor implementation.

Remember, this is the same company that screwed up their own "Classic mini" console release, as well, that had already proven to be successful by Nintendo.
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A TV-only model of a Nintendo hybrid actually has the opposite outcome of the main issue of the Vita TV and could play MORE games than the Lite.
Dekuman said:
I think the fundamental problem of a home-only Switch is it is a product in search of a market.

If you want a home-only Switch, it's the hybrid that is docked most of the time. A Lite model benefits from being lighter/smaller and filling in the gap vacated by the 3DS

People imagine a home only Switch being like a Google TV, Apple TV, or a Fire Stick thats relatively cheap (sub $150) or at least much cheaper than the hybrid model but i forsee lots of problems
1) it undercuts their hybrid model
2) why make a home only version and cut profit margins if you can just sell the hybrid version
3) a cheaper home only Nintendo console has had at best a mixed record of success, at worst, the lower price highlights its limitations vis-a-vis its competitors
4) besides, there's no agreement on what a home only Switch will fill. Is it a super powered pro version requiring a 3rd performance profile (and its accompanying additional work required which will annoy devs) or is it a cut down verion of the hybrid model only running in docked mode?

That's a lot of marketing, product positioning, and development hurdles to overcome and I can see why Nintendo never did release a Switch home.
Besides, my view is, if Nintendo does want to re-enter the home console market with a true home console, they will likely pick a chipset with a similar architecture, perhaps of the same generation and type as their Hybrid model, but it will be a completely different chip and the console itself would be sold at a premium, not sold cheaply. I'm thinking if the hybrid is on T239, the home console would be the larger variant of that chip (Orin?) with more cuda cores.
And again, we enter the space where devs have to develop and test for 3 profiles. I don't think that will fly, for now.

Maybe in the future Nintendo's hybrid consoles can dynamically scale performance based on the hardware it is running on from a base profile and devs only need to make small tweaks and optimizations, but we're probably not there yet.
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1) So does the Lite (especially when 3 of Nintendo's biggest-selling evergreens can't be played on the bloody thing, which would funnily enough not be a problem for a TV-only model).
2) Sub-$150 is with margin retention in mind. I cannot begin to express how much money Nintendo is making on every Switch sale right now, nor can I neglect to mention that well over half of the Switch's manufacturing cost is eaten up by 4-5 specific parts, of which 2 of them could be removed outright, never mind the several smaller ICs that can be done away with as they only exist to facilitate the docking ability and made a major contribution to Lite being $100 less at retail, or other parts being replaced by something far cheaper due to not factoring the thin form factor into the equation (example: replacing the heat pipe and blower with a heat sink and fan assembly).
3) Anyone who is somehow unaware of Nintendo hardware's limitations vis-a-vis its competitors has, at this point, never heard of Nintendo in their whole life; it's kinda been synonymous with their brand for nearly 20 years and Switch didn't stop that from being true, people just didn't care
4) Anyone hoping for a 3rd performance profile is hoping for a new SoC design and on this, I think everyone is in agreement that it is a LOT of engineering work to make that happen when it will still have a hard limit to how much better it will perform when it's effectively running base games from the main hardware lineup in the first place... even the Pro models Sony and MS released only amounted to one out of every 5 systems sold in the first year they were released, and I'm not so convinced Sony and MS will be able to pull off that magic trick of getting people to buy nominally better hardware mid-cycle a second time around.

But back to point one... there's a lot of contradiction flowing around. If the hybrid design is the selling point, how would a cheaper non-hybrid device undermine that? Does that not inherently suggest that the hybrid functionality isn't a selling point if a TV-only device can "undermine" it? Some folks need to really pick a lane here and decide which is true, because the hybrid design cannot be a selling point while also not being a selling point, it's legit one or the other.
Concernt said:
Modern fan designs COULD allow for it. Modern smartphone fans are pretty rare, but when they do show up they're tiny and near silent. I definitely think Nintendo could get one if they wanted to. The existing fan design doesn't really take advantage of any specific fin designs to reduce noise, and mainly runs quiet by not running very fast. Plus if I'm not mistaken, isn't that what OLED Model does, a smaller fan spun faster?
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No, Nintendo decreased the heatpipe and/or blower size with the OLED because the one they installed in OG Switches was actually more heat dissipation than the SoC actually required after the Mariko revision, so they took the opportunity when having to redesign the internals anyways to use smaller heat management parts.
Tentacle-tropes said:
I’m not sure how a TV model is going to undermine the hybrid model’s value proposition. As we can see in a country like JP, the Lite is consistently outsold by OLED & OG; there are observable trends for the Lite & enough data to point to why it hasn’t exactly done more. All a TV model would be is appealing to a more limited audience. People are dreaming if they think this would be cheap &/or have a third more powerful profile.
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Agreed on the last part. But if you can price such a TV-only model low enough, you wander much closer into "impulse buy" territory for a wider range of people (or just into the range of more modest household budgets), so I'm not sure how precisely limited the audience is and it wouldn't be knowable for certain until such a device exists, but there's enough reason to suggest it actually opens up the platform to a wider audience than it does right now.
 
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though the Lite doesn't sell nearly as well as the hybrid models, does that really mean it's not worthwhile? there's every chance that many of those Lite sales are not lost sales for the hybrid models. second Switches or something for a younger child (who may want the main one further down the line) there's value there for the ecosystem as a whole.

and just for entertainment sake - there seems to be confusion around whether a TV-only device would offer a more premium experience or be a cheaper cut-down model to account for lack of portable functionality. well, who says there could only ever be one tv oriented device?
 
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Terrell said:
No, Nintendo decreased the heatpipe and/or blower size with the OLED because the one they installed in OG Switches was actually more heat dissipation than the SoC actually required after the Mariko revision, so they took the opportunity when having to redesign the internals anyways to use smaller heat management parts.
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While the second part is true, that OLED Model needs less heat dissipation, since as you pointed out, they did go back and use a smaller fan, that means that they did, in fact, use a smaller fan at a higher speed, there is no "No" about it, it's literally what they did. It's a smaller fan. That spins faster (than the HAC-001(-01) model), and thus, they are not unfamiliar with using such a solution.

(I'll also note that the maximum speed of the fan isn't used for cooling in any extant model of Nintendo Switch, and instead gets spun up from time to time, presumably for dust or mechanical reasons.)

I will say, though, that having had a HAC-001(-01) Mariko model with the original cooling hardware, and now having an OLED Model (HEG-001), the original Switch design (with the Mariko SOC) was definitely quieter, which this explains.
 
HankyPanky said:
though the Lite doesn't sell nearly as well as the hybrid models, does that really mean it's not worthwhile? there's every chance that many of those Lite sales are not lost sales for the hybrid models. second Switches or something for a younger child (who may want the main one further down the line) there's value there for the ecosystem as a whole.
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Lite does not sell as well as regular Switch consoles not because of it's an inferior platform that people have no use for.

No, people just love bigger screens. New 3DS XL sold twice as much as small New 3DS in europe, despite the swappable plates the small 3DS offered. If Nintendo comes up with a New Switch Lite with bigger screen on somehow similar size console, it'll drive the Switch sales up nicely.
 
9-Volt said:
Lite does not sell as well as regular Switch consoles not because of it's an inferior platform that people have no use for.

No, people just love bigger screens. New 3DS XL sold twice as much as small New 3DS in europe, despite the swappable plates the small 3DS offered. If Nintendo comes up with a New Switch Lite with bigger screen on somehow similar size console, it'll drive the Switch sales up nicely.
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well some millions of people have a use for it or they wouldn't sell any.

again there seems to be this assumption that a cheaper, lower selling device somehow subtracts from the ecosystem instead of adding to it. i've given the example of a younger child, the parent buys it because they already have one Switch in the house or they don't want the TV being tied up and the price is slightly lower. not saying it's in any way superior (it's not) but clearly there's some sort of market for it which may not represent lost sales for more expensive models.

they could also release a Lite with a bigger/better screen which would be more successful, that is also true. by how much, who knows? more choice is a good thing though.
 
HankyPanky said:
well some millions of people have a use for it or they wouldn't sell any.

again there seems to be this assumption that a cheaper, lower selling device somehow subtracts from the ecosystem instead of adding to it. i've given the example of a younger child, the parent buys it because they already have one Switch in the house or they don't want the TV being tied up and the price is slightly lower. not saying it's in any way superior (it's not) but clearly there's some sort of market for it which may not represent lost sales for more expensive models.
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There's a market, a huge market but Nintendo needs a better product for it. It's past time Switch Lite got upgraded, to the standards OLED version had set. A Switch Lite OLED with a bigger screen (with little to no bezels) could help Switch to hit 150m with ease.

Late in life 3DS had its cheaper entry, 2DS, upgraded to New 2DS. Switch needs that one final sku too.
 
9-Volt said:
There's a market, a huge market but Nintendo needs a better product for it. It's past time Switch Lite got upgraded, to the standards OLED version had set. A Switch Lite OLED with a bigger screen (with little to no bezels) could help Switch to hit 150m with ease.

Late in life 3DS had its cheaper entry, 2DS, upgraded to New 2DS. Switch needs that one final sku too.
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well there i 100% agree there is absolutely a market beyond what Nintendo has already tapped into and more choice on the hardware side is the perfect way to expand the ecosystem.

the Switch has already been a huge success but it's only by thinking big they'll take it to the next level.
 
9-Volt said:
There's a market, a huge market but Nintendo needs a better product for it. It's past time Switch Lite got upgraded, to the standards OLED version had set. A Switch Lite OLED with a bigger screen (with little to no bezels) could help Switch to hit 150m with ease.

Late in life 3DS had its cheaper entry, 2DS, upgraded to New 2DS. Switch needs that one final sku too.
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The Lite is meant to be a cheaper product. A "premium cheap" product doesn't make too much business sense because the point is to reduce costs and extend sellability to a new segment. For a premium Lite to work, Nintendo has to find a large enough window of people who'd want this but not a hybrid unit. Given their (very) old breakdown of users, I'm not sure if that window is very large
 
ILikeFeet said:
The Lite is meant to be a cheaper product. A "premium cheap" product doesn't make too much business sense because the point is to reduce costs and extend sellability to a new segment. For a premium Lite to work, Nintendo has to find a large enough window of people who'd want this but not a hybrid unit. Given their (very) old breakdown of users, I'm not sure if that window is very large
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Pretty sure that this "new Lite" would continue the "entry level" system thing 2DS had started years ago. It still would be the cheapest console on market with $250 pricetag. New 2DS was also cheap compared to N3DSXL (though there was a price bump over regular 2DS), and managed to prolong 3DS life just a little. "New lite" effect on Switch hardware sales should be much bigger than N2DS had on "dead man walking" 3DS and Nintendo can always spice things up with more limited sku's.
 
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Concernt said:
While the second part is true, that OLED Model needs less heat dissipation, since as you pointed out, they did go back and use a smaller fan, that means that they did, in fact, use a smaller fan at a higher speed, there is no "No" about it, it's literally what they did. It's a smaller fan. That spins faster (than the HAC-001(-01) model), and thus, they are not unfamiliar with using such a solution.

(I'll also note that the maximum speed of the fan isn't used for cooling in any extant model of Nintendo Switch, and instead gets spun up from time to time, presumably for dust or mechanical reasons.)

I will say, though, that having had a HAC-001(-01) Mariko model with the original cooling hardware, and now having an OLED Model (HEG-001), the original Switch design (with the Mariko SOC) was definitely quieter, which this explains.
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Where are you getting that it spins at a higher speed?
 
Concernt said:
While the second part is true, that OLED Model needs less heat dissipation, since as you pointed out, they did go back and use a smaller fan, that means that they did, in fact, use a smaller fan at a higher speed, there is no "No" about it, it's literally what they did. It's a smaller fan. That spins faster (than the HAC-001(-01) model), and thus, they are not unfamiliar with using such a solution.

(I'll also note that the maximum speed of the fan isn't used for cooling in any extant model of Nintendo Switch, and instead gets spun up from time to time, presumably for dust or mechanical reasons.)

I will say, though, that having had a HAC-001(-01) Mariko model with the original cooling hardware, and now having an OLED Model (HEG-001), the original Switch design (with the Mariko SOC) was definitely quieter, which this explains.
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It's almost assuredly a smaller blower at the same max speed as the larger one previously used, it's just the pre-OLED Mariko models rarely to never had the blower ramp up to anywhere near its top speed because it was more heat dissipation capacity than actual heat generated after the Mariko revision. That's likely why it's louder now in your estimation, it's active at higher speeds with greater frequency because it needs to push a little harder being a smaller fan. But the part itself is not faster, it's just in more use.
 
Terrell said:
It's almost assuredly a smaller blower at the same max speed as the larger one previously used, it's just the pre-OLED Mariko models rarely to never had the blower ramp up to anywhere near its top speed because it was more heat dissipation capacity than actual heat generated after the Mariko revision. That's likely why it's louder now in your estimation, it's active at higher speeds with greater frequency because it needs to push a little harder being a smaller fan. But the part itself is not faster, it's just in more use.
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It's a smaller fan. That spins faster. I wasn't talking about, specifically, a fan with a higher MAXIMUM speed.

And that's what it does.
 
HankyPanky said:
imagine if Apple employed this sort of thinking...
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They did. Accidentally, but they did: the iPhone SE cannibalized iPhone Mini sales, to the point they discontinued it after just two generations. But we also have to add the fact that the battery life was pisspoor, even for Apple standards.

Back to Switch topic: we have to think like Nintendo: how can we add another Switch into a household that already has one? In this case, how can we convince Switch 2 owners to get another one? With a stationary Switch 2? What value does a Switch with no portability have? Will it play current gen games (PS5/Xbox)? If so, consumers that already have a PS5/Xbox and a Switch 2, how can we convince them to double dip on a stationary Switch 2 that will do exactly as their Sony/Microsoft console does? Nintendo games? The Switch 2 already does that, and I can play it on the go or dock it as it charges
 
ADR91 said:
What about preventing the Switch NG binaries from getting pirated through the compromised v1 Switch model's card reader ?
Click to expand...

They can be encrypted in a way only the Switch NG can read, so it's not a big problem if they do want to prevent it.

Pokemaniac said:
The controller has to support both regardless, since it's not in the carts.

It does seem likely that they'd want to stick with two sets of memory chips to not overly complicate things, but I do wonder if they'd want to do something about the possibly large gap in performance between Switch 1 carts and the internal and external memory of the new system.
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I meant the I/O-security-etc chip on the Switch game cards, ie the chip shown in the lower right here:

post-47079-0-07805400-1507294607.png


Technically not a NAND controller in the full sense, but it does seem to have some controller-like functionality, like handling cell refreshing. Anyway, my point was that the I/O circuitry on the cards themselves would need to be more complex and expensive to support both interfaces, which still stands.

My guess is that we won't see many (or any) cross-gen games which really leverage the higher storage speeds. Loading games off original Switch cards should be faster on Switch NG anyway, as there should be little to no decompression bottleneck between faster CPUs and the FDE. I wonder if it would be possible to increase the clock of the old SPI interface up to 100MHz (for 100MB/s) for cross-gen games. It shouldn't be a problem on the console side, as the replacement for the Lotus3 chip will have to handle much higher clocks anyway, but I don't know how feasible it would be to squeeze the extra performance out of the existing game card tech.
 
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