Spoiler The Legend of Zelda: Tears of the Kingdom - Pre-Release Spoiler Discussion Thread (Tag Story Spoilers)

[Starphanluke]

Spoiler

Man, I just want Nintendo to give us answers idk why there are peeps who get peeved at fans talking about the timeline either. We do it because it’s fun and interesting and if gives each game its own piece/place in something grand and exciting. Having the games just be a standalone story that fits into nothing would be less impactful imo.

Spoiler

Yeah, I don't care much about the timeline in the sense of the chronological order of things, but I think the sense of history that accompanies the different games being connected is definitely a plus. As much as I like Breath of the Wild, and Tears of the Kingdom seems great too, "everything not in these two games has nothing to do with this version of Hyrule" seems more reductive than beneficial. Seeing different versions of Hyrule over time enhances the setting to me.

Spoiler

I totally get both of these points of view, especially as a Timeline nerd myself. But I'm at the point where it's clear they want to take the story of the series in a new direction entirely, and wish they would just pull the plug and actually commit to the new timeline altogethee. As a Transformers fan who has seen a million reboots, I've learned over time it does nothing to diminish the old stories.

But yeah, the most frustrating thing of all is Nintendo's unwillingness to answer.

 

[Jarvio]

More questions:

Spoiler

1 - So hold on a minute, the imprisoning war mentioned at the start of the game is NOT the same imprisoning war as ALTTP?
2 - Still didn't get a concrete answer on the official NAMES of the 5 elemental dungeons. What are the individual names of each of these dungeons?
3 - Are the divine beasts in the game in any form?

 

[LegendHero]

Spoiler

I totally get both of these points of view, especially as a Timeline nerd myself. But I'm at the point where it's clear they want to take the story of the series in a new direction entirely, and wish they would just pull the plug and actually commit to the new timeline altogethee. As a Transformers fan who has seen a million reboots, I've learned over time it does nothing to diminish the old stories.

But yeah, the most frustrating thing of all is Nintendo's unwillingness to answer.

Spoiler

That isn't clear to me, though I'm not saying you must agree with me. The weight of the past and legacy are big themes of these recent games, these are the first games to really emphasize the idea that Ganon has been an ever-present threat in Hyrule's history, too. I don't think they'd do that if they were trying to make this a hard reboot.

 

[Gingerbread Man]

Spoiler

If the era of Rauru and Sonia is anywhere in the existing timeline, where can it actually fit without issue? I agree that I don't think this is intended to be a reboot, and in that case it can't just happen between [the last game of each timeline branch] and Breath of the Wild, unless all prior history of Hyrule has been lost (which doesn't appear to the case for a few reasons, including the descriptions of items from past games). The existance of Ganondorf instead of Demise makes placing it before Skyward Sword difficult, and the absence of Link makes placing it between SS and MC difficult too. The Imprisoning War in this game certainly can't be the ALttP backstory Imprisoning War either, so, where does it all fit, if it is even intended to fit? It would be a lot easier to fit these elements in if Rauru wasn't specifically said to be the first King of Hyrule.

Spoiler

Does Rauru know about the Triforce / Master Sword? This would help clarifies if OoT!Rauru and TotK!Rauru is meant to be the same person.

I think it's either a soft reboot or between SS and MC. We have a precedent for a Hero not appearing in Wind Waker backstory. Or perhaps an incarnation of Link was there but had no access to the Master Sword. In the backstory of MC, the Hero of Men needed the help of the Minish and another legendary sword.

If OoT!Rauru and TotK!Rauru are two different persons, I think this could work:

• SS
• Hylians from Skyloft populate the surface, which is named Hyrule.
• Era of Chaos. TP backstory, Interloper War, OoT!Rauru hides the Triforce in the Sacred Realm and seals the entrance with the Master Sword
• At this point, knowledge about the Triforce begins to fade away
• The Zonai descends from the sky and integrates with the Hylian
• Rauru and Sofia are the first King and Queen of Hyrule
• Imprisoning War against Ganondorf I
• Era of Prosperity
• MC backstory
• MC
• OoT
• Imprisoning War against Ganondorf II

More questions:

Spoiler

1 - So hold on a minute, the imprisoning war mentioned at the start of the game is NOT the same imprisoning war as ALTTP?
2 - Still didn't get a concrete answer on the official NAMES of the 5 elemental dungeons. What are the individual names of each of these dungeons?
3 - Are the divine beasts in the game in any form?

Spoiler

The context of the two Imprisoning Wars is different. They are both against (an incarnation of) Ganondorf and involve the Seven Sages of that era. But in TotK, Ganondorf was not after the Triforce, but rather the Zonai's magical stone.

Four Sword Adventures is also very close to being yet another Imprisoning War (and it likely was, early in the development, before they simplified the plot).

 

[wob902]

Hello!

I recently joined this forum to contribute to one of my favourite video game communities & I have 2 questions regarding TotK.

Before I ask them, I would like to know what counts as a potential spoiler-related question that I would have to hide, as I have questions regarding a game mechanic from BotW and a minor question regarding a NPC.

I am looking forward to a response. Thanks in advance.

 

[The Captain]

Spoiler

Does Rauru know about the Triforce / Master Sword? This would help clarifies if OoT!Rauru and TotK!Rauru is meant to be the same person.

I think it's either a soft reboot or between SS and MC. We have a precedent for a Hero not appearing in Wind Waker backstory. Or perhaps an incarnation of Link was there but had no access to the Master Sword. In the backstory of MC, the Hero of Men needed the help of the Minish and another legendary sword.

If OoT!Rauru and TotK!Rauru are two different persons, I think this could work:

• SS
• Hylian from Skyloft populates the surface, which is named Hyrule.
• Era of Chaos. TP backstory, Interloper War, OoT!Rauru hides the Triforce in the Sacred Realm and seals the entrance with the Master Sword
• At this point, knowledge about the Triforce begins to fade away
• The Zonai descends from the sky and integrates with the Hylian
• Rauru and Sofia are the first King and Queen of Hyrule
• Imprisoning War against Ganondorf I
• Era of Prosperity
• MC backstory
• MC
• OoT
• Imprisoning War against Ganondorf II

Spoiler

The context of the two Imprisoning Wars is different. They are both against (an incarnation of) Ganondorf and involve the Seven Sages of that era. But in TotK, Ganondorf was not after the Triforce, but rather the Zonai's magical stone.

Four Sword Adventures is also very close to being yet another Imprisoning War (and it likely was, early in the development, before they simplified the plot).

Spoiler

ooh I like this take, so this Ganondorf (that was sealed and forgotten) would be the first real direct incarnation of Demise and the other dorfs were just kinda like halfbaked/not full manifestation of Demises true power but since the curse must go on they reincarnated regardless?

 

[NabiscoFelt]

Ooh this one is fun. Double spoilering this since technically the mechanic this expands on is a spoiler (though it has been seen in official information)

Spoiler: Mechanic spoiler

Cool autobuild schematic

Spoiler: The schematic

The bike is back, now with extra lasers

 

[brainchild]

I've been hearing a lot of people say that Recall and Ascend make puzzles that require you to use those abilities feel more like traditional puzzles and that's exciting. I wonder how many puzzles require the use of Recall and Ascend. I'm assuming most of them are going to be in the Shrines, but it would be cool if a lot of them were like that.

 

[Tlozbj]

Spoiler

Does Rauru know about the Triforce / Master Sword? This would help clarifies if OoT!Rauru and TotK!Rauru is meant to be the same person.

I think it's either a soft reboot or between SS and MC. We have a precedent for a Hero not appearing in Wind Waker backstory. Or perhaps an incarnation of Link was there but had no access to the Master Sword. In the backstory of MC, the Hero of Men needed the help of the Minish and another legendary sword.

If OoT!Rauru and TotK!Rauru are two different persons, I think this could work:

• SS
• Hylians from Skyloft populate the surface, which is named Hyrule.
• Era of Chaos. TP backstory, Interloper War, OoT!Rauru hides the Triforce in the Sacred Realm and seals the entrance with the Master Sword
• At this point, knowledge about the Triforce begins to fade away
• The Zonai descends from the sky and integrates with the Hylian
• Rauru and Sofia are the first King and Queen of Hyrule
• Imprisoning War against Ganondorf I
• Era of Prosperity
• MC backstory
• MC
• OoT
• Imprisoning War against Ganondorf II

Spoiler: Timeline discusion

Yeah, this seems like the most fitting scenario, and gives more sense to why Twinrova surrogated OoT Ganondorf. He would just be a vessel for the Malice that Twinrova could get to bring back TotK Ganondorf.


However, after that wink wink moment from Aonuma and Fujibayashi, the time of Queen Sonia and King Rauru can also fit into the Imprisoning War we already know from ALttP's backstory, which even by the time had been fumbled by oral tradition. Which was even worse by ALBW's time as it had been mixed into a single story that ran from the Era of Chaos until the end of ALttP.

The "foundation of Hyrule" mentioned in the opening mural being then the beginnings of the foundation of ALttP's and the Downfall timeline's Kingdom of Hyrule. Since by HH and ALttP, it is pretty much said that the "Kingdom of the Gods" of OoT's time was no more.

Until the era of the Hero of Time, the kingdom of Hyrule was mostly inhabited by the Hylian people, whose existence was linked to their goddess, Hylia. Hylians possessed a special power: it was said thay their long ears allowed them to hear the voice of the gods.

However, the kingdom fell into ruin during the Imprisoning War, and the bloodline of the Hylians weakened with the ages, until their existence was naught but a thing of the past. The Sages' power waned, and Hyrule, once called the Kingdom of the Gods, became nothing more than an ancient legend

Sahasralah's wife in ALttP also suggest as much with how the Hylia people are no more and all that remains are treasures/relics they left across the land.

What? Master Sword? Well, I
don't remember the details
exactly, but...

Long ago, a prosperous people
known as the Hylia inhabited
this land...
Legends tell of many treasures
that the Hylia hid throughout
the land...
The Master Sword, a mighty
blade forged against those
with evil hearts, is one of
them. People say that now it
is sleeping deep in the forest...

 

[Starphanluke]

Spoiler

Does Rauru know about the Triforce / Master Sword? This would help clarifies if OoT!Rauru and TotK!Rauru is meant to be the same person.

I think it's either a soft reboot or between SS and MC. We have a precedent for a Hero not appearing in Wind Waker backstory. Or perhaps an incarnation of Link was there but had no access to the Master Sword. In the backstory of MC, the Hero of Men needed the help of the Minish and another legendary sword.

If OoT!Rauru and TotK!Rauru are two different persons, I think this could work:

• SS
• Hylians from Skyloft populate the surface, which is named Hyrule.
• Era of Chaos. TP backstory, Interloper War, OoT!Rauru hides the Triforce in the Sacred Realm and seals the entrance with the Master Sword
• At this point, knowledge about the Triforce begins to fade away
• The Zonai descends from the sky and integrates with the Hylian
• Rauru and Sofia are the first King and Queen of Hyrule
• Imprisoning War against Ganondorf I
• Era of Prosperity
• MC backstory
• MC
• OoT
• Imprisoning War against Ganondorf II

Spoiler

The context of the two Imprisoning Wars is different. They are both against (an incarnation of) Ganondorf and involve the Seven Sages of that era. But in TotK, Ganondorf was not after the Triforce, but rather the Zonai's magical stone.

Four Sword Adventures is also very close to being yet another Imprisoning War (and it likely was, early in the development, before they simplified the plot).

Spoiler

I think this is why I'm standing so firmly in the reboot camp. Even in the days of early timeline theories, we never had to bend over backwards this much to make the game fit. And trying to fit these games in the rest dimishes the story of this game AND those games (diluting Ganondorf as a villain, repeated events in the same timeline). It just... doesn't work for me. There are so many parts of this game that are retelling events of other games, and even reusing characters (Rauru, Ganondorf), that the simplest explanation is its a new Hyrule. One with less enphasis on the Triforce.

If Nintendo ends up saying it's on the timeline, that's cool. But I think this story is best served by being its own thing entirely.

 

[Starllitsy]

Spoiler

There are any mentions to the names of the old sages? their masks implies that they are Nabooru, Ruto, Darunia and Medli

 

[Gingerbread Man]

Spoiler

I think this is why I'm standing so firmly in the reboot camp. Even in the days of early timeline theories, we never had to bend over backwards this much to make the game fit. And trying to fit these games in the rest dimishes the story of this game AND those games (diluting Ganondorf as a villain, repeated events in the same timeline). It just... doesn't work for me. There are so many parts of this game that are retelling events of other games, and even reusing characters (Rauru, Ganondorf), that the simplest explanation is its a new Hyrule. One with less enphasis on the Triforce.

If Nintendo ends up saying it's on the timeline, that's cool. But I think this story is best served by being its own thing entirely.

Spoiler

Eh, the possibility of a sane timeline was thrown out of the window when they rewrote FSA (and possibly TP) story losing the link to ALTTP. So even without BotW-TotK, we have a "what if" timeline and two extremely similar but unrelated events (FSA and Downfall Timeline Imprisoning War).

I agree that adding another Imprisoning War to the mix and having multiple characters share the name is unnatural and contrived, but no more than the post-SS official timeline.

With that said, I've argued even before Hyrule Historia that Zelda timelines make perfect sense as a set of independent story arcs, with OoT being part of two:

1. OoT - ALTTP - LA - ALBW - Zelda 1 - AoL
2. OoT - WW - PH - ST
\ - MM - TP
3. MC - FS - FSA

With the Oracle games somewhere and SS "before everything else". BotW - TotK is a fourth story arc.

But trying to fit everything together without taking the thing too seriously is fun.

Spoiler: Timeline discusion

Yeah, this seems like the most fitting scenario, and gives more sense to why Twinrova surrogated OoT Ganondorf. He would just be a vessel for the Malice that Twinrova could get to bring back TotK Ganondorf.


However, after that wink wink moment from Aonuma and Fujibayashi, the time of Queen Sonia and King Rauru can also fit into the Imprisoning War we already know from ALttP's backstory, which even by the time had been fumbled by oral tradition. Which was even worse by ALBW's time as it had been mixed into a single story that ran from the Era of Chaos until the end of ALttP.

The "foundation of Hyrule" mentioned in the opening mural being then the beginnings of the foundation of ALttP's and the Downfall timeline's Kingdom of Hyrule. Since by HH and ALttP, it is pretty much said that the "Kingdom of the Gods" of OoT's time was no more.



Sahasralah's wife in ALttP also suggest as much with how the Hylia people are no more and all that remains are treasures/relics they left across the land.

Spoiler

So the timeline would be OoT Downfall ending -> TotK Imprisoning War -> ALTTP? Even circling "Rauru is the first king of Hyrule" and the fact that OoT and TotK past would be very close, we have a major problem with the Master Sword. As far as I saw online, nobody in TotK past knows about it. But by the time of ALTTP, they know they need the Master Sword to defeat Ganon, implying it's been used before (same in TP and WW, by the way -- in both games, members of the Royal Family know where the Master Sword is).

This whole "Where was the Master Sword during TotK Imprisoning War?" question leaves us with three possible placements:

• Before SS. The Master Sword hasn't been forged yet. But it would very hard to reconcile everything with SS lore.
• Between the Interloper War and Minish Cap backstory. OoT!Rauru hid the Master Sword and the Triforce in the Temple of Time. Nobody knows about them, not even OoT!Zelda. Heroes around this time resorted to the Picori / Four Sword (MC backstory, MC, FS).
• After everything else, with both the Master Sword and the Triforce long forgotten, and Rauru as the first King of a New Hyrule. It doesn't really work, considering both in BotW and TotK everyone knows about past Zelda games and the Master Sword, at least in terms of legends.

As for OoT!Rauru and TotK!Rauru sharing the name... Well, they are both Sages of Light. Perhaps "Rauru" means "Light" in Ancient Hylian.

 

[LegendHero]

Spoiler

I think this is why I'm standing so firmly in the reboot camp. Even in the days of early timeline theories, we never had to bend over backwards this much to make the game fit. And trying to fit these games in the rest dimishes the story of this game AND those games (diluting Ganondorf as a villain, repeated events in the same timeline). It just... doesn't work for me. There are so many parts of this game that are retelling events of other games, and even reusing characters (Rauru, Ganondorf), that the simplest explanation is its a new Hyrule. One with less enphasis on the Triforce.

If Nintendo ends up saying it's on the timeline, that's cool. But I think this story is best served by being its own thing entirely.

Spoiler

As soon as Ocarina came out and told a version of ALttP's backstory where a hero existed to use the Master Sword and Ganondorf didn't get the whole Triforce and the Sages weren't all Hylian, that was never really the case. You mentioned Transformers before, and I don't know about all the newer versions but I am quite familiar with Beast Wars, and BotW/TotK seems to be doing the same thing it did with the Gen 1 Transformers stuff. As I'm sure you know, Beast Wars referenced different versions of Gen 1 continuity and even events that had never been seen before, but it was still a version of Generation 1. And the fact that there were multiple Optimuses and Megatrons and they even absorbed the souls of their forebears didn't render Generation 1 a fake legend in Beast Wars. Again, Zelda has already had multiple versions of Zelda and Link exist at the same time, and tons of characters with similar names and designs across different times, like Malon and Talon, Tingle, Beedle, etc. None of this is beyond the pale for Zelda, and we know there's been a bunch of Ganon-related incidents in this version of the continuity, so it's inherently not "just" the events of these BotW and TotK that exist in this continuity. Instead of a bunch of nebulous "Great Calamities", it seems more likely that some of these events were connected to the previous games.

Of course, I'm not saying it's impossible I'll agree with you once we know more. But I don't think the idea that all the connections to previous games are significant is such a stretch.

 

[Tlozbj]

Spoiler

Eh, the possibility of a sane timeline was thrown out of the window when they rewrote FSA (and possibly TP) story losing the link to ALTTP. So even without BotW-TotK, we have a "what if" timeline and two extremely similar but unrelated events (FSA and Downfall Timeline Imprisoning War).

I agree that adding another Imprisoning War to the mix and having multiple characters share the name is unnatural and contrived, but no more than the post-SS official timeline.

With that said, I've argued even before Hyrule Historia that Zelda timelines make perfect sense as a set of independent story arcs, with OoT being part of two:

1. OoT - ALTTP - LA - ALBW - Zelda 1 - AoL
2. OoT - WW - PH - ST
\ - MM - TP
3. MC - FS - FSA

With the Oracle games somewhere and SS "before everything else". BotW - TotK is a fourth story arc.

But trying to fit everything together without taking the thing too seriously is fun.

Spoiler

So the timeline would be OoT Downfall ending -> TotK Imprisoning War -> ALTTP? Even circling "Rauru is the first king of Hyrule" and the fact that OoT and TotK past would be very close, we have a major problem with the Master Sword. As far as I saw online, nobody in TotK past knows about it. But by the time of ALTTP, they know they need the Master Sword to defeat Ganon, implying it's been used before (same in TP and WW, by the way -- in both games, members of the Royal Family know where the Master Sword is).

This whole "Where was the Master Sword during TotK Imprisoning War?" question leaves us with three possible placements:

• Before SS. The Master Sword hasn't been forged yet. But it would very hard to reconcile everything with SS lore.
• Between the Interloper War and Minish Cap backstory. OoT!Rauru hid the Master Sword and the Triforce in the Temple of Time. Nobody knows about them, not even OoT!Zelda. Heroes around this time resorted to the Picori / Four Sword (MC backstory, MC, FS).
• After everything else, with both the Master Sword and the Triforce long forgotten, and Rauru as the first King of a New Hyrule. It doesn't really work, considering both in BotW and TotK everyone knows about past Zelda games and the Master Sword, at least in terms of legends.

As for OoT!Rauru and TotK!Rauru sharing the name... Well, they are both Sages of Light. Perhaps "Rauru" means "Light" in Ancient Hylian.

Spoiler

Yeah that would be the scenario if we take the wink wink of Aonuma and Fujibayashi as serious, including the "how even Link's name is a link to that past" joke. Though, that was one detail I hadn't seen, of them not knowing about the Master Sword in TotK's past. In which scenario, does throws things back to the foundation of Hyrule in question being that of the "Kingdom of the Gods" after the Era of Chaos. Which at the end works too.

Though the Rauru naming may not be that much of an issue. At the time, Hyrule Historia still left the methods by which Rauru sealed the Sacred Realm away as mystery, only saying it was by powers stronger than time and the Master Sword. The backstory is vague enough to fit the Zonai history from the mural, with OoT!Rauru then taking the name of TotK!Rauru in his honor. Afterall, he is no stranger to taking pseudonyms based on important figures of Hyrule.

 

[Deleted member 2]

Spoiler: 100% Shrine Completon Bonus

This is a massive one for lore enthusiasts:

Spoiler: Sidequest I haven't seen much talk about

Really hope you don't have to collect every figure for 100% like certain past games, lol.

I HOPE YOU DO

 

[NabiscoFelt]

I HOPE YOU DO

Spoiler

Technically you will anyways since Compendium is required for completion, probably, and you get these for enemy compendium pictures

 

[xghost777]

Hey everyone, the game is officially out so we will be closing the pre-release spoiler thread now. Hope you all enjoyed it and you can continue conversations in the official spoiler thread here:

The Legend of Zelda: Tears of the Kingdom Spoiler Thread

Hey everyone, welcome to the spoiler thread for The Legend of Zelda: Tears of the Kingdom! When you have beaten the game, this is the place to talk all of the spoilers you want! Staff is making this the official spoiler thread now with the game officially out. My personal copy hasn’t arrived...

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