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Pre-Release The Legend of Zelda: Tears of the Kingdom Pre-Release Discussion Thread

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maidhhc said:
Would be fun if they created just one amazing traditional-style Zelda dungeon with locks and keys, unclimbable walls, minimal Zonai stuff, a traditional item and a boss with a vulnerable eye, and just hid it somewhere in the world for us to find. One breathtaking traditional dungeon to please the old stock, and then plenty of boundary-pushing multi-option puzzle dungeons based on the new mechanics for progressing the main story .
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I mean, technically they had unclimbable walls in BotW already. Inside the Shrines.
 
maidhhc said:
I'll have to try that game 😉
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All they needed to do was to Fuse (ha!) the unclimbable walls from Shrines (iirc also the Divine Beasts) and those three big labyrinths (which totally were tests to see how traditional dungeons could work in the BotW gameplay).

Boom. Dungeons.
 
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Mr_No_U said:
Getting close to that 2 weeks mark…
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Man, like 5 months ago I pitched a TotK website theme for the site to Belly, but I think he was too busy, and I never had enough cool ideas besides making Yeahs! into rupees, making the top of each page sky blue and then transition to green and then red as you scroll to the bottom, and maybe one other thing.

But now I’m wishing I put more thought into it because this would be a great time to release it.

Edit : @bellydrum if we gather up some good ideas for a TotK website theme, would this be tough or time intensive for an admin (probably Jaysc) to create?
 
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Awesomegames23 said:
Man, like 5 months ago I pitched a TotK website theme for the site to Belly, but I think he was too busy, and I never had enough cool ideas besides making Yeahs! into rupees, making the top of each page sky blue and then transition to green and then red as you scroll to the bottom, and maybe one other thing.

But now I’m wishing I put more thought into it because this would be a great time to release it.
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A TOTK theme would be really cool to see actually. How long does it usually take for a theme to be implemented? Just curious
 
takriel said:
Haven't watched the previews, but it's gotta, right?
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Bonejack said:
It certainly feels like it's going to make BotW obsolete in almost every way.
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Lelouch0612 said:
For postgame yes, but I could see a lot of TotK new joiners loving it, and then going to Breath of the Wild.
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Is it weird that I find this a tinge conflicting?

I'm over the (blood) moon hyped for ToTK. But at the same time, BoTW is my favorite game of all time. So the idea of a sequel somehow diminishing that original experience is..... bittersweet I guess? I don't know, it's a weird position to be in. Does anyone else feel this way?

In my brain I keep telling myself they are basically a combined experience. But I also think back to Super Mario Galaxy and Super Mario Galaxy 2, which on recent replays I find myself wishing one had the superior gameplay experience and that two had the vibes of one. I wonder if that is how I will feel about ToTK and BoTW in the future.
 
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zamto said:
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The fact that it was 1987 makes me feel so, so old. I can remember walking to the video store and finding this game called Legend of Zelda so I rented it so I could check it out. Only had it for two days but I knew 2 things: two days was nearly enough and that I was in love with the game. Realizing that I've been in love with this franchise for 35 years is mind blowing.
 
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karmitt said:
It’s interesting because we’re butting against them requiring 32GB cards.

Had wondered if that factored into the $70 price tag, but if they were that close to fitting it into a 16GB card they’d move heaven and earth to get there.
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32GB card are more expensive to make, i check out the Tears of the Kingdom eShop page and now it file size sit at 15.9GB
 
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Awesomegames23 said:
Man, like 5 months ago I pitched a TotK website theme for the site to Belly, but I think he was too busy, and I never had enough cool ideas besides making Yeahs! into rupees, making the top of each page sky blue and then transition to green and then red as you scroll to the bottom, and maybe one other thing.

But now I’m wishing I put more thought into it because this would be a great time to release it.

Edit : @bellydrum if we gather up some good ideas for a TotK website theme, would this be tough or time intensive for an admin (probably Jaysc) to create?
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Okayge said:
A TOTK theme would be really cool to see actually. How long does it usually take for a theme to be implemented? Just curious
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There have been some staff discussions (and plans) about how to celebrate the TOTK launch on the site. I'll bring the theme idea to the rest of staff.
 
maidhhc said:
Would be fun if they created just one amazing traditional-style Zelda dungeon with locks and keys, unclimbable walls, minimal Zonai stuff, a traditional item and a boss with a vulnerable eye, and just hid it somewhere in the world for us to find. One breathtaking traditional dungeon to please the old stock, and then plenty of boundary-pushing multi-option puzzle dungeons based on the new mechanics for progressing the main story .
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I'm fine with evolved dungeons that are themed, but I agree, it would be awesome to have a single secret traditional dungeon.
 
I do feel like people look at old dungeons with rose tinted glasses. Sure they were fun, but so spectacularly linear. I feel like TOTK is going to approach dungeons in a completely different way. So much more open-ended and inviting of interpretation and game style, it's plain wrong to suggest this isn't the best the series has ever been.
 
Sabre said:
I do feel like people look at old dungeons with rose tinted glasses. Sure they were fun, but so spectacularly linear. I feel like TOTK is going to approach dungeons in a completely different way. So much more open-ended and inviting of interpretation and game style, it's plain wrong to suggest this isn't the best the series has ever been.
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This is ridiculous. I just played Skyward Sword yesterday and enjoy it more than Breath of the Wild. You don't get to tell me that I'm "plain wrong" to suggest that open ended gameplay isn't the best the series has ever been. It's an acceptable compromise for me, but I'm not going to gush over something that's not my preference.

I prefer linearity. Yes, people like me exist.
 
brainchild said:
Based on the preview footage, it looks like specularly reflective metals are in the open world now, further confirming higher resolution cubemaps. These were previously only seen in Shrines and the cubemaps were very low res. Now the outdoor environments are clearly reflected on these materials. This is gonna be really handy when I start analyzing my copy of the game.

Also, volumetric lighting got a boost as well.
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God I miss your video analyses
 
brainchild said:
This is ridiculous. I just played Skyward Sword yesterday and enjoy it more than Breath of the Wild. You don't get to tell me that I'm "plain wrong" to suggest that open ended gameplay isn't the best the series has ever been. It's an acceptable compromise for me, but I'm not going to gush over something that's not my preference.

I prefer linearity. Yes, people like me exist.
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I'm suggesting we will get the best of both worlds, a linear space with multiple approaches. One could argue that's objectively better than a paint by numbers static set. Also, having a preference for SS over BOTW is a little strange to me, I'd argue SS is probably the weakest in the series.
But people are allowed their opinions. I rescind my 'plain wrong' ;)
 
bellydrum said:
God I miss your video analyses
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Aw, thanks. I appreciate your appreciation of them. I don't know that I will ever do video analyses again (that whole experience at GameXplain really soured me on that, plus I probably won't have the time), but some time after I've finished TOTK, I definitely plan to provide an analysis here, which may or may not include screenshots and short video clips, but I haven't decided how I want to do it yet.
 
Sabre said:
I do feel like people look at old dungeons with rose tinted glasses. Sure they were fun, but so spectacularly linear. I feel like TOTK is going to approach dungeons in a completely different way. So much more open-ended and inviting of interpretation and game style, it's plain wrong to suggest this isn't the best the series has ever been.
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in a world where Naughty Dog games are considered the best of the best, the hunger for linear pieces is just as strong as its ever been
 
Sabre said:
I'm suggesting we will get the best of both worlds, a linear space with multiple approaches. One could argue that's objectively better than a paint by numbers static set. Also, having a preference for SS over BOTW is a little strange to me, I'd argue SS is probably the weakest in the series.
But people are allowed their opinions. I rescind my 'plain wrong' ;)
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I think we should stop trying to make this an objective thing in the first place, as what we're talking about is inherently subjective.

But even assuming that what you said is true, in my experience, level design with clear structure that allows for multiple approaches, while pretty good, has never been able to compare with linear gameplay for me personally, though I'm ok with that.

In my opinion, the real solution is to splinter the franchise like they did with Mario (Sunshine, Odyssey vs Galaxy, 3D World). If we got traditional Zelda and open air Zelda, the complaints from classic Zelda fans would literally disappear over night. Of course, Nintendo will probably never do this, but one can dream.
 
ILikeFeet said:
in a world where Naughty Dog games are considered the best of the best, the hunger for linear pieces is just as strong as its ever been
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And it has been 12 years! since our last one.

It’s my biggest ‘want’ for TotK and if we don’t get it (or at least some elements) then I for one will be disappointed. Not necessarily in the game itself, but what could’ve been.
 
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brainchild said:
I think we should stop trying to make this an objective thing in the first place, as what we're talking about is inherently subjective.

But even assuming that what you said is true, in my experience, level design with clear structure that allows for multiple approaches, while pretty good, has never been able to compare with linear gameplay for me personally, though I'm ok with that.

In my opinion, the real solution is to splinter the franchise like they did with Mario (Sunshine, Odyssey vs Galaxy, 3D World). If we got traditional Zelda and open air Zelda, the complaints from classic Zelda fans would literally disappear over night. Of course, Nintendo will probably never do this, but one can dream.
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But wouldn't that just dilute the vision? I mean we already have to wait 5~ years per entry? Also one of the biggest compliments about TLOU2 was them opening up the world slightly to breathe. That open section with Ellie where you can explore the town was phenomenal, a good example of hybrid linearity.
But again, yes, I agree we're talking subjectively and not objectively. My verbiage is a little obnoxious. My bad.
 
Played Skyward Sword last week up until the Sand Ship. Those dungeons have an incredible amount of flow that only few BotW environments have (the Blue Flame one comes to mind, as well as the Final Trial).

Would be great if TotK's "dungeons" (in all shapes and sizes) would run the gamut between non-linear (Divine Beasts), wide-linear (Zora's Domain, Yiga Hideout) and lock-and-key design (Skyward Sword). BotW already experimented somewhat with differing types of challenges like this.
brainchild said:
Aw, thanks. I appreciate your appreciation of them. I don't know that I will ever do video analyses again (that whole experience at GameXplain really soured me on that, plus I probably won't have the time), but some time after I've finished TOTK, I definitely plan to provide an analysis here, which may or may not include screenshots and short video clips, but I haven't decided how I want to do it yet.
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Your posts on BotW's technical makeup (and the TotK cloud billboarding talk) were highlights of the purple place for me, especially because Digital Foundry never did a dedicated BotW vid. A shame they're stuck on there though :p .
 
Sabre said:
I do feel like people look at old dungeons with rose tinted glasses.
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I don't know. I can still replay all those old games and still enjoy their dungeons very much. I can't make myself replay the Beasts. I didn't enjoy them. My replays of BotW have me playing through the Great Plateau then my interest dropping as soon I get off because the story doesn't have many parts that I want to see again and there are no dungeons to look forward to. I'm going to be disappointed if dungeons are more like the Beasts than traditional dungeons.
 
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brainchild said:
Aw, thanks. I appreciate your appreciation of them. I don't know that I will ever do video analyses again (that whole experience at GameXplain really soured me on that, plus I probably won't have the time), but some time after I've finished TOTK, I definitely plan to provide an analysis here, which may or may not include screenshots and short video clips, but I haven't decided how I want to do it yet.
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Yeah, I don't blame you for feeling that way given your past experiences with GX. Regardless, I'm happy to see you around, and I'm sure plenty of other people here appreciate your thoughts and observations.
Are you as excited for this game as I am? I feel like I'm only just now getting over the fact that it's not releasing on updated hardware; the game does look gorgeous.
 
On my replay of SS I found a few of the dungeons much shorter and simpler than I remember. The first 3 are all pretty small tbh. I remember looking at the Earth Temple map like “damn, that’s it?!”

Ancient Cistern, Sandship and Sky Keep still GOATed though. I’d particularly like the Sky Keep concept to come back
 
Phendrift said:
On my replay of SS I found a few of the dungeons much shorter and simpler than I remember. The first 3 are all pretty small tbh. I remember looking at the Earth Temple map like “damn, that’s it?!”

Ancient Cistern, Sandship and Sky Keep still GOATed though. I’d particularly like the Sky Keep concept to come back
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There's something to love about every SS dungeon. TIME FOR A RANT

Skyview has that lovely contrast between the cramped beginning and wide open middle segment, Earth has fun Beetle shenanigans and excellent music, Mine has incredible aesthetics (music stresses me out though), Cistern is a dungeon with a killer plot twist, Fire Sanctuary has great indoor-outdoor variation, and Sky Keep is a cute thematic mishmash with a horrible gimmick

also i can't hear the word goated anymore in any voice but trump's after watching so many "usa presidents are buddies making a gaming tierlist" videos
 
Zedlars said:
Putting the pre-release hype aside, do you guys think this will enter the best Zelda ever made category? Surpassing OoT and Majora's Mask??

BOTW was loved, but is rarely in the top 3 Zelda conversations I've noticed.
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Uhhh I don’t know where you’re looking but BotW definitely already did that lol

I was look at Zelda ranking articles the other week and almost unanimously the top 3 was a mix of ALTTP, OOT and BotW in no particular order
 
Zedlars said:
Putting the pre-release hype aside, do you guys think this will enter the best Zelda ever made category? Surpassing OoT and Majora's Mask??

BOTW was loved, but is rarely in the top 3 Zelda conversations I've noticed.
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needs dungeons for that. and more setpieces for the story. I liked the story and storytelling of BotW, but it was greatly lacking in really distinct pieces
 
We briefly went over our rankings of Zelda games a couple weeks ago and BotW was consistently in the top 3.

For me it’s:

OoT=TP>MM>SS(remake)>BotW>WW

To be very clear, these are all amazing games and there isn’t a huge lot between them. OoT and TP are as close to 10 as possible and WW is probably a 9. Also, the placement of the middle three are quite fluid, depending on which I’ve played most recently 😅
 
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Phendrift said:
On my replay of SS I found a few of the dungeons much shorter and simpler than I remember. The first 3 are all pretty small tbh. I remember looking at the Earth Temple map like “damn, that’s it?!”

Ancient Cistern, Sandship and Sky Keep still GOATed though. I’d particularly like the Sky Keep concept to come back
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I had exactly the same experience, had a much better memory of SS dungeons but on a replay they felt extremely simple and a lukewarm experience at best. I also remember appreciating a lot the “gamification” of the overworld segments pre-dungeons but after BOTW the difference in scale and vision is abysmal And I was actually pissed at how limited these “levels” were.

I have a hunch TOTK will actually be the chance for Anouma to get this right because the sky islands and/or dungeons are the perfect setup for something similar - with the tremendous breadth of the world/mechanics they’ve built since to back it up this time.

As a player that was able to appreciate almost every aspect in every Zelda title but recognized the series was in a downward spiral pre-BOTW I am not really worried of any particular part of the experience missing, but I really hope they manage this time to deliver something that every Zelda fan can love, and from what I’ve seen they are not that far.
 
Phendrift said:
Uhhh I don’t know where you’re looking but BotW definitely already did that lol

I was look at Zelda ranking articles the other week and almost unanimously the top 3 was a mix of ALTTP, OOT and BotW in no particular order
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Fair enough. I just noticed it got docked massively on many lists because of the lack of dungeons, set pieces, great bosses etc
 
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Sabre said:
But wouldn't that just dilute the vision? I mean we already have to wait 5~ years per entry? Also one of the biggest compliments about TLOU2 was them opening up the world slightly to breathe. That open section with Ellie where you can explore the town was phenomenal, a good example of hybrid linearity.
But again, yes, I agree we're talking subjectively and not objectively. My verbiage is a little obnoxious. My bad.
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I'm fine with more open environments. I was referring to the gameplay being linear. They would certainly need a separate team to make sure there were enough resources for both types of Zelda games.


manfromthedam said:
Played Skyward Sword last week up until the Sand Ship. Those dungeons have an incredible amount of flow that only few BotW environments have (the Blue Flame one comes to mind, as well as the Final Trial).

Would be great if TotK's "dungeons" (in all shapes and sizes) would run the gamut between non-linear (Divine Beasts), wide-linear (Zora's Domain, Yiga Hideout) and lock-and-key design (Skyward Sword). BotW already experimented somewhat with differing types of challenges like this.

Your posts on BotW's technical makeup (and the TotK cloud billboarding talk) were highlights of the purple place for me, especially because Digital Foundry never did a dedicated BotW vid. A shame they're stuck on there though :p .
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Thanks, Tim! As always, your recent videos have been a joy to watch/listen to and I'm so happy to see the success of your channel so far.

I think Digital Foundry have done BOTW analysis videos, but they've mainly been comparison videos or stress tests. I'm sure this time they'll have a main feature for Tears of the Kingdom though.

Blue flame and Final Trial are definitely noteworthy efforts in Breath of the Wild. I consistently see classic Zelda fans praise them, so they definitely struck something that a lot of other Shrines didn't.

Phendrift said:
On my replay of SS I found a few of the dungeons much shorter and simpler than I remember. The first 3 are all pretty small tbh. I remember looking at the Earth Temple map like “damn, that’s it?!”

Ancient Cistern, Sandship and Sky Keep still GOATed though. I’d particularly like the Sky Keep concept to come back
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I had a similar experience, though I feel that the pre-dungeon areas help in keeping those dungeons from being disappointingly short. I like how there's always something to do, even outside dungeons.

That being said, I enjoy having more downtime and negative space as I've gotten older, so Twilight Princess is even more enjoyable for me now than it was back then, and I really liked it back then.

I think the perfect traditional Zelda for me would to take the best elements of all the classic Zelda games with a heavy focus on dungeons and make sure there is enough breathing room in-between beats. Also, more mini games. I really love fun diversions to break things up.
 
Zedlars said:
Putting the pre-release hype aside, do you guys think this will enter the best Zelda ever made category? Surpassing OoT and Majora's Mask??

BOTW was loved, but is rarely in the top 3 Zelda conversations I've noticed.
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Idk where youve been but i regularly see botw as one of the best games of all time

And also im a classic zelda fan who loved botw's dungeons (and yes it did have dungeons )
 
I'm really not sure why people get stuck on this dungeons thing here -- they've shown off new types of puzzles, new mechanics, and new boss battles, and people go "Okay that's all the things I want, but is there also a specific enclosed and themed area for me to do all those things in?"

Like, probably not. The whole game is the dungeon, guys.
 
bellydrum said:
Yeah, I don't blame you for feeling that way given your past experiences with GX. Regardless, I'm happy to see you around, and I'm sure plenty of other people here appreciate your thoughts and observations.
Are you as excited for this game as I am? I feel like I'm only just now getting over the fact that it's not releasing on updated hardware; the game does look gorgeous.
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I wasn't excited when I thought it was just going to be a sandbox but not that I know there are lots of puzzles on the sky islands and that this is shaping up to be an open air version of Skyward Sword, I'm incredibly excited! I think I will experience this game to its fullest potential if I take it for what it is and not what I wanted it to be.
 
brainchild said:
I wasn't excited when I thought it was just going to be a sandbox but not that I know there are lots of puzzles on the sky islands and that this is shaping up to be an open air version of Skyward Sword, I'm incredibly excited! I think I will experience this game to its fullest potential if I take it for what it is and not what I wanted it to be.
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Out of curiosity, what exactly did you want it to be? You obviously have experience in the industry - describe your absolute perfect entry into the series?
 
touchfuzzy said:
I'm really not sure why people get stuck on this dungeons thing here -- they've shown off new types of puzzles, new mechanics, and new boss battles, and people go "Okay that's all the things I want, but is there also a specific enclosed and themed area for me to do all those things in?"

Like, probably not. The whole game is the dungeon, guys.
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I get that, but at the same time that enclosed themed area is exactly what a lot of people really really want. Kind of like what Elden Ring did: For example Raya Lucaria is a magical academy castle you can see in the distance from miles around, it’s this sort of “ooh that looks really cool and I can’t wait to go there” and you have to work out how to get to it and get inside. And then once you do it’s a self-contained dungeon that feels distinct and unique. That’s precisely what I want in TOTK, or at least a Zelda-fied version of that.

It’s not a deal-breaker, I’m super excited for the game and it looks great. But I don’t think that wanting something like that experience in a new Zelda game is outlandish or anything.
 
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