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StarTopic Nintendo First Party Software Development |ST| Nintendo Party Superstars

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ILikeFeet said:
Gio Corsi of Playstation fame, is joining NoA as third party Portfolio Management

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Does that mean Nintendo of Japan has outsourced relations with western game companies to Nintendo of America? Ie its up to Nintendo of America to get US third parties to port their games to Switch/Switch 2?

Or maybe Nintendo of America has always had those relations outsourced to them by Nintendo of Japan?
 
Neves said:
The question is if Nintendo would be interested in buying them.
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A 39 man studio with no IP can't cost more than neglible amounts for Nintendo to buy. I mean a single Mario sports title from Camelot on Switch 2 probably nets Nintendo 100 times more in revenue then it would cost Nintendo to buy them.
 
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Neves said:
The question is if Nintendo would be interested in buying them.
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I think Camelot would be low-cost/high-return enough to make that a "leans likely" scenario at least

Fewer than 50 employees, but their Mario sports games have been selling in the multimillions on Switch, so if the alternative is the Takahashis possibly selling to someone else I don't see why Nintendo wouldn't want to lock that relationship down
 
BlackthornOrion said:
If I had a nickel for every Playstation employee who joined NoA to work on their AAA 3rd party relations, I'd have 2 nickels. Which isn't a lot, but it's interesting it's happened twice

www.nintendolife.com

Former God Of War Ragnarok Gameplay Producer Joins Nintendo

Will help drive Nintendo's third party relationships
www.nintendolife.com www.nintendolife.com
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I remember that. Does that mean she’s leaving Nintendo, or are they two different positions?

crashazo said:
I think it's 50/50.
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If the founders ever want to sell, there’s no reason why Nintendo doesn’t want to buy. This is not a classic acquisition, they are long-standing partners, as was the case for next level games or SRD.
 
boodream said:
I remember that. Does that mean she’s leaving Nintendo, or are they two different positions?
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I'm fairly sure they're two different positions; fwiw her LinkedIn still lists her as being with Nintendo, at least

Hanna Foell apparently joined as a "senior manager of partner management", while Gio Corsi says he's "joined the Nintendo of America AAA 3rd party portfolio management crew". I'd expect there's some overlap there in goals/responsibilities, but I don't think it's necessarily a one-in/one-out situation
 
Mer.Saloon said:
I cant undersrand how Camelot even functions as a studio with that little staff. Have they been shedding employees or just not growing at all?
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They've been shedding employees for the past few years, but this new total is actually an uptick.

April 2021 - 45 employees
June 2022 - 37 employees
March 2023 - 35 employees
April 2024 - 38 employees

EDIT: Honestly, it looks like that 2021 number might have been the studio at its biggest when quickly glancing at what's immediately available.
 
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Andre3333456 said:
I have a feeling that Camelot might shut down in the future.
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I doubt it. They've said on their website that their long-term vision is to attract and train new talent, so I'm sure they'll survive for a little bit after the Takahashi brothers retire.
Neves said:
The question is if Nintendo would be interested in buying them.
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The real question is if Camelot would even want to sell. Probably, but they've also wanted to further expand into the mobile space using their experience in UI design to tap into new markets - and they've already done so in the past. Being fully bought out by Nintendo may prevent that strategy. Granted, that could all change, so it's not a real blocker in the long run.
 
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SkaizoAgain said:
What exactly does third party portfolio management do? Is it just getting third parties on your system or does it involve more?
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It’s that but also stuff they do for companies like Capcom/SE, as an example. Probably easier to do some of these things with a more senior locale representative who has been on that side of the industry. You can also think of it like with their Indies relation team setup during the WiiU; and what they did.
On another topic, Camelot will most likely be fine. They have a steady contract w/Nintendo with games that sell multiple millions. If they need more help then they can outsource more or Nintendo can step in with some of their support studios. GS is only happening if it’s outsourced completely to another company.

The issues with Camelot lay outside of their headcount & lay in resource management.
 
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But who should take on Golden Sun? Particularly a remake of the first two games as one which IMO is the wisest idea?

They could bring back the entire Mario RPG remake crew from ArtePiazza and Cattle Call, etc. Both were 16-bit pre-rendered JRPGs and they seemingly nailed the move to 3D for Mario. Sure SE was clearly a link but I doubt it's necessary this time.

8ing could also lend a hand if they want. Like either way Camelot leads but 8ing could do the bulk of development? But however they're not super experienced with JRPGs, are they?

Grezzo is obvious, sure but like Good-Feel they've been away from Nintendo for years since Miitopia Switch to all of the sudden GF ends up doing Peach Showtime out of nowhere. :p Besides, feels like Grezzo + Nintendo mostly = Zelda. Still maybe they're involved with Luigi's Mansion 2 HD like the 3DS port (demake?) of the original.
 
Mario tennis and Mario golf fell into a somewhat sad routine, in addition to lacking content. However, to develop these games in the HD development era with such modest numbers, with relatively contained development times, is absolutely impressive.

But this is at the expense of innovation and originality, which is a shame. I mean, I don’t expect an incredible revolution when I play Mario tennis obviously, but it’s really a series that is now in autopilot and it would deserve much better than that.
 
boodream said:
Mario tennis and Mario golf fell into a somewhat sad routine, in addition to lacking content. However, to develop these games in the HD development era with such modest numbers, with relatively contained development times, is absolutely impressive.

But this is at the expense of innovation and originality, which is a shame. I mean, I don’t expect an incredible revolution when I play Mario tennis obviously, but it’s really a series that is now in autopilot and it would deserve much better than that.
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Honestly it would probably be better if they give it the once a console treatment & spend the entirety of the console lifecycle adding content & refinement to both of these games.
 
Danny said:
Does that mean Nintendo of Japan has outsourced relations with western game companies to Nintendo of America? Ie its up to Nintendo of America to get US third parties to port their games to Switch/Switch 2?

Or maybe Nintendo of America has always had those relations outsourced to them by Nintendo of Japan?
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No, they've always had these positions at NOA. Nothing new here. This is only newsworthy because he worked at Playstation before and his dad's name is Mario apparently.
 
TheMoon said:
No, they've always had these positions at NOA. Nothing new here. This is only newsworthy because he worked at Playstation before and his dad's name is Mario apparently.
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He was pretty instrumental in getting Yakuza brought over to the West though while at PlayStation, so that's something else.
 
gio%2Bcorsi%2Band%2Bvita.gif


this man probably pushed vita more in the west than SIE America themselves
 
boodream said:
Mario tennis and Mario golf fell into a somewhat sad routine, in addition to lacking content. However, to develop these games in the HD development era with such modest numbers, with relatively contained development times, is absolutely impressive.

But this is at the expense of innovation and originality, which is a shame. I mean, I don’t expect an incredible revolution when I play Mario tennis obviously, but it’s really a series that is now in autopilot and it would deserve much better than that.
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It might not be innovation you like but both were very innovative, especially tennis aces which is still pretty alive and the bests Mario tennis, it just sheds a lot do the Mario goofy ness for a more serois competitive online game.

And I can see why people might not like that since it goes comeplte against what the rest of the series was doing.
 
Djehuty said:
It might not be innovation you like but both were very innovative, especially tennis aces which is still pretty alive and the bests Mario tennis, it just sheds a lot do the Mario goofy ness for a more serois competitive online game.

And I can see why people might not like that since it goes comeplte against what the rest of the series was doing.
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What you raise is very interesting. To tell the truth, I really like Aces, I'm still spending time on it, so I can only agree with you that the game is a lot of fun.

But in terms of content, I find they could do much, much more, and that's frustrating.
 
boodream said:
What you raise is very interesting. To tell the truth, I really like Aces, I'm still spending time on it, so I can only agree with you that the game is a lot of fun.

But in terms of content, I find they could do much, much more, and that's frustrating.
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Aces' single-player beats GBC and Power Tour's single-player by a long shot at the very least. I don't find their single-player campaigns anywhere near as interesting as Aces, which has actual real boss fights and a tighter pace instead of just matches and the occasional minigame with a nothing story.
 
Evil Lucario said:
Aces' single-player beats GBC and Power Tour's single-player by a long shot at the very least. I don't find their single-player campaigns anywhere near as interesting as Aces, which has actual real boss fights and a tighter pace instead of just matches and the occasional minigame with a nothing story.
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I really like Power Tour. The music alone is wonderful. Even if I play Aces a lot, I don't feel the same. But maybe that's just nostalgia.
 
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boodream said:
If the founders ever want to sell, there’s no reason why Nintendo doesn’t want to buy. This is not a classic acquisition, they are long-standing partners, as was the case for next level games or SRD.
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The difference is that NLG and SRD had interesting things to offer in the technical side.

Camelot doesn't have that.
 
KCannon said:
The difference is that NLG and SRD had interesting things to offer in the technical side.

Camelot doesn't have that.
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I'd say any sub-50 person studio that can put out 2 HD games, one a 4+ million seller and the other a 2+ million seller, just 3 years apart has to be doing something technically interesting

e: For context, at a quick glance (assuming Google isn't just serving up AI BS these days), Camelot has fewer employees than even the likes of Wayforward, Playtonic, or Inti Creates. I know the consensus is that the recent Mario sports games are mid and Camelot is an incompetent developer, but looking at the fidelity of their games and the speed at which they can make them, it's obvious Camelot's doing something right that most studios of their size probably couldn't replicate very easily
 
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I'd be more worried about Mario Golf continuing as a series, than Camelot itself. Golf is the lowest selling Mario sports on Switch, got discounted pretty quickly and you could tell their heart wasnt in it.
 
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boodream said:
What you raise is very interesting. To tell the truth, I really like Aces, I'm still spending time on it, so I can only agree with you that the game is a lot of fun.

But in terms of content, I find they could do much, much more, and that's frustrating.
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I’m reading it back I’m so sorry for the spelling.

Aces was very focused on the online experience and it shows, the rest is kinda meh but the actual match to match online is smooth as butter, not too mention a large reorder with tons of different play styles.

Mario golf attempted both and it’s fine, a lot of random side party modes.

Strikers well clealry not online since it’s not 4v4 so they clearly put in a lot of single player content right?

14 characters in a 4v4 game
1 stage.
No single player
Removed mechanics and lowered item count

I don’t even know what they were thinking. It feels so pointless and aimless, like from the start non cared about the project, I can’t say the same for what Camelot is doing even if it’s not done in a way a people like (free updates)

I’m fine with the updates but I hope their next game with longer dev time can launch bigger

As a studio they are in no trouble, like 8mil sales on the switch with 40 employees, they’re fine.
 
Aces had the massive benefit of building directly off Ultra Smash. More room to itterate and experiment when the base gameplay and many assets were already done. There's some confusing decisions (their insistence on limiting the base roster to 16 characters starting from Tennis Open onward; locking 2/3 post-launch minigame modes to motion controls only; never adding the boss arenas as regular courts for more variety despite showing this in a pre-release Direct; needing to patch in a CG intro cutscene nearly a year after launch...) but I think overall the game ended up in a good place. The gameplay is solid, the final roster is decently large, and there's just enough variety in small side modes to be acceptable.

Super Rush didn't have the same benefit since there wasn't any Mario Golf for Wii U, and it really shows. While the new abilities introduced in Aces added more complexity and depth, I feel Speed Golf only simplified the gameplay further by incentivising speed over accuracy, and more crucially it impacted course design by requiring that everything was walkable; something that can't entirely go away even if you switch modes. Aces' story mode isn't particularly long either, but Super Rush just abruptly ends at a point; all (three) of the boss battles are shoved into the last hour, and the final area is the shortest by far (no side content, and you only have to play the front 9). In terms of post-launch support they poured everything into beefing up the course count (still appreciated, some of them are pretty solid too), but in turn the character roster suffered. Starting at 16 (+ Mii) and adding just 5 more post-launch; compared to Aces ending with a total of 30, 21-22 doesn't look so good, even if picks like Pauline, Chargin' Chuck, King Bob-omb, Ninji and Wiggler were nice additions. Mode selection was close to being something much better too; expanding on Battle Golf (could've been a strong showing for Speed Golf, but instead you'll see everything the mode has to offer within just a few matches) or adapting some story mode-exclusive features into the multiplayer experience (XC Golf comes to mind as something that could really justify both Speed Golf and the course design it forced, yet it's locked to a single course in story mode) would've helped a lot. Overall the game feels a little half-baked and not quite fully thought-out, in ways even Aces doesn't; and yet that still doesn't even compare to the poor state of Battle League...

Camelot really do a lot for such a small team though; i'd hope next time they get whatever they need (whether it be time, resources or support) to make a meatier game. Right now I don't have much desire or need for more Mario Tennis and Golf, so if they're jumping back into Mario Sports and not doing something else they'll really need to do something special to make the next one stand out.
 
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I like a good arcadey sports title, but the Switch Mario sports games never fully clicked with me because 1) they're very bland in design compared to past games, particularly the GC/GBA era, and 2) aspects of the games are just too difficult and I ended up hitting walls in them pretty early on in their respective story modes.

I think I ended up enjoying Golf the most as you can at least go through courses individually. Tennis I think is better as an in-person multiplayer experience (the online didn't do much for me and there's a lack of variety in single player content). Strikers I need to spend more time with eventually but I pushed it to once side for bigger games.
 
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I haven't played Rush, but I bought Aces and I can say for sure that it was the best Mario sports game in years. Super fun MP that I lost hours playing online because the gameplay was super fun, which they nailed. Overall I think tennis is in a good path if they build on what they made in that one
 
Camelot just needs to build off of their last two games. Refine the gameplay & multiplayer. If the models are in a library perhaps they can offer more content. I would eschew single player campaign in favor of single player modes. Perhaps down the line after both games release it could be a big expansion like what Splatoon does.
 
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Danny said:
Or maybe Nintendo of America has always had those relations outsourced to them by Nintendo of Japan?
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This. NCL might make an initial pitch to Western devs themselves, but it's really up to NOA to follow through with the rest. People need to let go of this nonsense about NCL rulling everything from above.
 
BlackthornOrion said:
I'd say any sub-50 person studio that can put out 2 HD games, one a 4+ million seller and the other a 2+ million seller, just 3 years apart has to be doing something technically interesting

e: For context, at a quick glance (assuming Google isn't just serving up AI BS these days), Camelot has fewer employees than even the likes of Wayforward, Playtonic, or Inti Creates. I know the consensus is that the recent Mario sports games are mid and Camelot is an incompetent developer, but looking at the fidelity of their games and the speed at which they can make them, it's obvious Camelot's doing something right that most studios of their size probably couldn't replicate very easily
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But is Camelot really making those games by themselves? I was under the impression they outsource quite a bit, especially since, as mentioned before, their last games have released in a rather barebones state, and costs will continue to raise. And they're not the only studio that does Mario sports either.

In any case, when I say "technical", I mean in the sense of having some interesting technology that Nintendo could benefit from. NLG has outstanding animation software, meaning the studio has value beyond its manpower. Studios usually get bought because of that or due to a valuable IP.

As far as I'm aware, Camelot's major achievement in the videogame space seems to be Waluigi existing.
 
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KCannon said:
But is Camelot really making those games by themselves? I was under the impression they outsource quite a bit, especially since, as mentioned before, their last games have released in a rather barebones state, and costs will continue to raise. And they're not the only studio that does Mario sports either.

In any case, when I say "technical", I mean in the sense of having some interesting technology that Nintendo could benefit from. NLG has outstanding animation software, meaning the studio has value beyond its manpower. Studios usually get bought because of that or due to a valuable IP.

As far as I'm aware, Camelot's major achievement in the videogame space seems to be Waluigi existing.
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no company makes games by themselves anymore. but Camelot is still coordinating all the outsourcing. they are still worth their salt. if Nintendo wanted more fully featured games, they could put up more support themselves

NLG doesn't offer much to nintendo if they didn't make multiple multi-million sellers. they're great with animation, but it's not like Nintendo is using that for anything nor something they couldn't get elsewhere. NLG's value comes from their staff being capable of falling in with the Nintendo mindset and being able to craft highly sellable games. Camelot has also shown that ability
 
KCannon said:
But is Camelot really making those games by themselves? I was under the impression they outsource quite a bit, especially since, as mentioned before, their last games have released in a rather barebones state, and costs will continue to raise. And they're not the only studio that does Mario sports either.

In any case, when I say "technical", I mean in the sense of having some interesting technology that Nintendo could benefit from. NLG has outstanding animation software, meaning the studio has value beyond its manpower. Studios usually get bought because of that or due to a valuable IP.

As far as I'm aware, Camelot's major achievement in the videogame space seems to be Waluigi existing.
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I mean it took ages for another Strikers to come out & that isn’t any better in the content department. Outside of Camelot there really isn’t anyone who consistently makes Mario Sports games. The issues w/Mario Sports titles are strategy & resource allocation.
 
Is the EPD8 2D Project still a thing? (i.e. it's a game we don't know about and was not just collaborative work on Mario Wonder)

This 2D game would be another project in addition to the 3D Mario title expected at Switch 2's launch?
 
VintoWin said:
Is the EPD8 2D Project still a thing? (i.e. it's a game we don't know about and was not just collaborative work on Mario Wonder)

This 2D game would be another project in addition to the 3D Mario title expected at Switch 2's launch?
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nobody knows for sure what they were specifically hiring for.
 
VintoWin said:
Is the EPD8 2D Project still a thing? (i.e. it's a game we don't know about and was not just collaborative work on Mario Wonder)

This 2D game would be another project in addition to the 3D Mario title expected at Switch 2's launch?
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Not enough people from EPD8 worked on Wonder for it to be Wonder.

I gave my personal rankings on the possibilities a month ago.

famiboards.com

Nintendo First Party Software Development |ST| Nintendo Party Superstars

So no citation, but Centro Leaks seems to know who is involved with Pokemon Works. they really should put board of directors because most people will think of game directors
famiboards.com famiboards.com
 
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