Mister Gideon
Piranha Plant
It seems like their translation of the original dialogue is accurate but their understanding of the English version is way off.
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Spoiler Xenoblade 3: Future Redeemed SPOILER THREAD | The outcome was patently obvious.
- Thread starter Linkstrikesback
- Start date
I said to take it with a huge grain of salt but I do think it sheds light on where N's bizarre assumption that Ghondor sided with him comes from, particularly strange in the English script since it's clear Ghondor is just opposing him the whole way there. In the original script there's a ton of omitted subjects which makes the whole conversation extremely ambiguous, but it's hard to properly carry over this level of ambiguity to English. Neither translation is "wrong" because ultimately assumptions have to made in every single sentence about what exactly is being referred to at any time. In the original Japanese it makes sense for N to be confused since it's very much intended to be confusing.
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Hauke_von_Arding
Moblin
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- he/him
I think A says on some point in the DLC: "If somebody in this would is allowed to be called A, it's me." So it's pretty much in poijnt that there is NO consul or moebius A because the A belongs just to Ontos
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Finished it last night and as someone who's never played any of the Saga games, my knee jerk reaction was that the fused Aionios was Mira, and the blue light was the White Whale crashing down. Although it hit me almost immediately after that that didn't really make any sense lol
While all the lore connections are really fascinating, I hope none of it actually ties in explicitly. I don't really have any interest in playing the Saga games at all. Though considering how standalone 3 was, almost to a fault, despite being a mashup of 1 and 2, I trust that Takahashi will keep everything comprehensible to Xenoblade fans. As much as I want a continuation to X, since it's my favorite in the series from a gameplay perspective by far, I'll gladly settle for sci-fi space opera or whatever this leads to
While all the lore connections are really fascinating, I hope none of it actually ties in explicitly. I don't really have any interest in playing the Saga games at all. Though considering how standalone 3 was, almost to a fault, despite being a mashup of 1 and 2, I trust that Takahashi will keep everything comprehensible to Xenoblade fans. As much as I want a continuation to X, since it's my favorite in the series from a gameplay perspective by far, I'll gladly settle for sci-fi space opera or whatever this leads to
Yeah, if there's something that you can probably take from all this is that next game will go heavier on the sci-fi. Even the Xenogears reference was something space related, and that game wasn't really focused on that.
HockeyBird
Villager
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Riku playing that long con, acting ignorant
Hero of Winds
Piranha Plant
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Finished Future Redeemed earlier today and I'm still trying to wrap my head around everything. What a ride this series has been, even if I got into it a bit late. Now I'm thinking about starting X, or maybe going back and playing Xenogears/Saga. Might have to wait until after Zelda though, haha
One thing I was hoping that FR would concretely explain is how Noah and Mio reentered the cycle. Did I miss something there, or is it still just kind of a mystery?
One thing I was hoping that FR would concretely explain is how Noah and Mio reentered the cycle. Did I miss something there, or is it still just kind of a mystery?
D
Deleted member 2
Guest
It was never explained, only lampshaded in chapter 6
Mister Gideon
Piranha Plant
It’s maybe, kind of, sort of, if you squint, hinted at? Ghondor (as in N’s son, ya dags) says this when he’s training Mathew and Na’el:
“When your concentration is lacking, the body and spirit drift apart. Only when you've mastered the power of Ouroboros will you find balance... Nay, you will become one with your very selves.”
He then uses some aspect of his inherited Ouroboros power on his deathbed to… split A and Alpha apart.
“When your concentration is lacking, the body and spirit drift apart. Only when you've mastered the power of Ouroboros will you find balance... Nay, you will become one with your very selves.”
He then uses some aspect of his inherited Ouroboros power on his deathbed to… split A and Alpha apart.
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Given that Origin operates off of and responds strongly to entity's emotions (as that is what birthed Z and helped build Aionios as we know it), I think it also responding to N and M's emotions and producing Noah and Mio isn't too big of a stretch imo. Its even less of a stretch when you consider who is operating origin behind the scenes (Rex, Shulk, and A). There's even some textual evidence for the last part. Noah and Mio are referred to as the hope of the world at one point, and while walking into the avatar rift, A tells Shulk and Rex that their hope lives on. It seems to me that the feelings of Rex, Shulk, N, and M collectively are what brought Noah and Mio back into the cycle.
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SpaceGodzilla
Did You Get that Thing I Sent You?
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- him
from the community is seems to be agreed upon to just call the combined world Earth for now
SpaceGodzilla
Did You Get that Thing I Sent You?
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- him
also, my two cents on the references to the other Xeno games to me just confirms there is a Xeno multiverse and we're just seeing how the Zohar changes each reality
Mr.Fletcher
Bob-omb
It’s kind of explained in a side quest I believe. Some people were ‘sucked in’ some weren’t, or something like that.
Basically, it came down to chance.
EtherPenguin
Koopa
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If you talk to Linka after finishing all request board quests to add her to the Community, she'll tell you that a small number of people weren't assimilated but she has no idea why and leaves it up to kismet ("we must be here to serve some purpose" type of stuff).
My understanding was that everyone is stored as data in Origin just not assimilated into the cycle. But maybe I'm off base. Riku also says the spirits of people close to him and Melia reside with Lucky Seven and we know the sword is crafted from Origin metal.
Hauke_von_Arding
Moblin
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- he/him
It's explained if you max Linka's affinity. Some people are just randomly out of the cycle and exist as ageless beings in this world. Like Rex, Shulk, Linka, Panacea, Riku. And Giorgio or Gorgie (Because Gorgie remembers that Giorgio is her grandfather)
EtherPenguin
Koopa
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- He/Him
Speaking of Georgie, do we think she's Paola's daughter or is Giorgio supposed to have an older kid we just never saw? Paolo was 10 in xc1 and Georgie's 19, if we assume Paola had a kid young like at 18 that would put the time of the collision a minimum of 27 years after the ending of xc1.
Mr.Fletcher
Bob-omb
O’Donnell can sound a little old sometimes - but he captures the spirit of Rex really well. I think the casting is great overall.
Matthew has a few wooden moments but is likeable. Hats off to Sadler too who can at times sound eerily close to Skye Bennett, but sounds distinct.
A is great. She walks a really fine line throughout and does it excellently. Nikol’s Va gets the job done.
I scoped him out on Twitter and he’s really talented - unfortunately I don’t think this role asks too much of him.
Matthew has a few wooden moments but is likeable. Hats off to Sadler too who can at times sound eerily close to Skye Bennett, but sounds distinct.
A is great. She walks a really fine line throughout and does it excellently. Nikol’s Va gets the job done.
I scoped him out on Twitter and he’s really talented - unfortunately I don’t think this role asks too much of him.
JR436
Probably looks better in a dress.
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- He
Agreed completely. His cry of "Double Spinning Edge!" mimics Al Weaver almost perfectly.
....which is useful, given how much you use it.
Mister Gideon
Piranha Plant
Interesting that the three founders of the city who elected not to have statues and keep their identities secret are the three who either are, or could be, still alive - Linka, Panacea and Riku.
We can probably assume there was some kind of intent or choice behind a lot of the specific people who weren’t absorbed into Origin - a significant number of them are either notorious pains in the arse for successfully fighting against fate, changing the world and leading people, and the ones with no history of that (Linka, Panacea, Riku) would ultimately prove vitally important to the creation of the second city and setting the stage for Noah and Mio’s group to eventually reactivate Origin.
We can probably assume there was some kind of intent or choice behind a lot of the specific people who weren’t absorbed into Origin - a significant number of them are either notorious pains in the arse for successfully fighting against fate, changing the world and leading people, and the ones with no history of that (Linka, Panacea, Riku) would ultimately prove vitally important to the creation of the second city and setting the stage for Noah and Mio’s group to eventually reactivate Origin.
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- Hmmm
The one that is similar to the Titanic song is Beyond the Sky. The ending theme of FR is also my favorite.
Machine Doogs
...love games?
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I like a lot of stuff from Miiks youtube channel. I have no idea how well known they are in the Xeno community, but they actually get into some interesting lore theory that I don't see many other places.
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So throughout Future Redeemed several people have weapons with the ability to destroy flame clocks, but they end up going away so the people of the City no longer have this capability...
This is the face of a man who watched kids murder each other for a few centuries until he met a nice enough guy to entrust with a sword that could harm flame clocks.
This is the face of a man who watched kids murder each other for a few centuries until he met a nice enough guy to entrust with a sword that could harm flame clocks.
Xenoblade 3
Xenoblade 2 Enjoyer
Yeah their videos have interesting interpretations of the lore
Hero of Winds
Piranha Plant
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I really loved Rex and A's voice work, they both knocked it out of the park. It's to the point that I wish they were both part of a 'full' Xenoblade game so I could hear more of them lol. And shoutout to Adam Howden who's still as great as ever as Shulk.
Personally, I kind of felt Glimmer's VA was the weakest. There's just certain scenes where I felt she should've sounded more emotional but instead sounded bored. She definitely does channel Skye Bennett really well at times though.
Mr.Fletcher
Bob-omb
I’ve been working my way through a bunch of quests in the last few days and I love all the little callbacks.
I may have my issues with some of the late game storytelling, but I think the characters are done justice - particularly Rex.
I love how they infer that Rex developed a passion for cooking after the events of XC2.
And while the quests are filler, the little shot of Rex smiling as he watches Glimmer tuck into his final meal is lovely.
Also adored how Rex was trying to serve up Linka’s favourite dish for her birthday, based on something Zeke cooked up for him. To see him struggle to keep it a secret, get what he needs for the dish and ultimately realise he’s got the wrong ingredients is priceless. And for Linka to say ‘dad wasn’t always the best with details’ before saying she’s glad to be learning from Rex… who himself saw Zeke as a mentor. It just warms my heart.
Seeing Shulk and Nikol rebuild the ether furnace was cool as well, as was seeing Shulk talk about about Reyn and Sharla.
But I do think - and I say this as a Rex fanboy, so your mileage may vary - Rex is moved on a bit more than Shulk as a character by this DLC.
He’s got a lot of dad energy going on, but he’s also still very much Rex. To see him get excited trying to track down the graffiti breadcrumb trail was fun. Add in the cooking, carving up the monster’s corpse for Glimmer’s strings, his general demeanour and so on.
I feel like Rex is really enriched through this DLC. Even when Rex calls Glimmer kiddo, only to be corrected and him sort of be ‘oh right, Glimmer, I know’ - it almost feels like that’s what he used to call her back in the day when she was a young girl.
I also think, outside of ‘I’m really feeling it’, Rex is a lot more meme-y than Shulk so the game gets a smile out of me every time it references his dialogue from 2.
Again, no hate on Shulk, I like him a lot. But because he is more of a reserved character he just feels a little less interesting to me in this DLC.
But I will have one moan. It honestly feels like the Lucky Seven stuff was thrown in there to pay off a nod in the base game. Not really a satisfying answer and completely buried. So odd… it feels utterly pointless.
It’s shame this is a lower budget affair because when she does breakdown after being scolded by Rex and starts shouting ‘I won’t let the enemy get into my head…’ the VA was absolutely going for it, but the fidelity of animation wasn’t there to support one of her best moments.
I may have my issues with some of the late game storytelling, but I think the characters are done justice - particularly Rex.
I love how they infer that Rex developed a passion for cooking after the events of XC2.
And while the quests are filler, the little shot of Rex smiling as he watches Glimmer tuck into his final meal is lovely.
Also adored how Rex was trying to serve up Linka’s favourite dish for her birthday, based on something Zeke cooked up for him. To see him struggle to keep it a secret, get what he needs for the dish and ultimately realise he’s got the wrong ingredients is priceless. And for Linka to say ‘dad wasn’t always the best with details’ before saying she’s glad to be learning from Rex… who himself saw Zeke as a mentor. It just warms my heart.
Seeing Shulk and Nikol rebuild the ether furnace was cool as well, as was seeing Shulk talk about about Reyn and Sharla.
But I do think - and I say this as a Rex fanboy, so your mileage may vary - Rex is moved on a bit more than Shulk as a character by this DLC.
He’s got a lot of dad energy going on, but he’s also still very much Rex. To see him get excited trying to track down the graffiti breadcrumb trail was fun. Add in the cooking, carving up the monster’s corpse for Glimmer’s strings, his general demeanour and so on.
I feel like Rex is really enriched through this DLC. Even when Rex calls Glimmer kiddo, only to be corrected and him sort of be ‘oh right, Glimmer, I know’ - it almost feels like that’s what he used to call her back in the day when she was a young girl.
I also think, outside of ‘I’m really feeling it’, Rex is a lot more meme-y than Shulk so the game gets a smile out of me every time it references his dialogue from 2.
Again, no hate on Shulk, I like him a lot. But because he is more of a reserved character he just feels a little less interesting to me in this DLC.
But I will have one moan. It honestly feels like the Lucky Seven stuff was thrown in there to pay off a nod in the base game. Not really a satisfying answer and completely buried. So odd… it feels utterly pointless.
I’m personally at the opposite end, in that I thought she was emotional when she needed to be, but monotone in a Mythra-style way at other times. I can see why it might not work for some, but I really liked it.
It’s shame this is a lower budget affair because when she does breakdown after being scolded by Rex and starts shouting ‘I won’t let the enemy get into my head…’ the VA was absolutely going for it, but the fidelity of animation wasn’t there to support one of her best moments.
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- Pronouns
- Hmmm
For me Xenoblade 3 is not canon. I could talk about all the things I don't like about Xenoblade 3 but I'll just say that the merging of the 2 worlds doesn't make sense. I think it's the best Xenoblade but that it was all a bad dream of Riki or Tora.
I've made my own canon story of what happened after XB1 and XB2: the 2 worlds never merged, but they communicated thanks to the cores and made a conduit between the 2 worlds...
I've made my own canon story of what happened after XB1 and XB2: the 2 worlds never merged, but they communicated thanks to the cores and made a conduit between the 2 worlds...
I go back and forth on this, admittedly.
It does feel like a weird thing where Monolith Soft intentionally put the nod in there to create a mystery that would be solved in the DLC. But the mystery isn't relevant to the DLC, so it feels... cheap?
On the other hand, Future Redeemed is practically a giant fan service lore dump as it is, so... it's not exactly out of place, either. I dunno. I kinda liked the mystery while it was there, too.
I wanted to know where N's sword came from, and they even foreshadowed a reveal of that with Z. Then it went unmentioned for the rest of the game, only being so much as alluded to with that camera cut at the end. Kind of annoying that we'll seemingly never know what was up there.
Mr.Fletcher
Bob-omb
I think, for me, it's another one of those little storytelling hiccups that permeates XC3 for me. The backstory of Lucky Seven being reduced to a non-voiced, easy to miss, point of interest conversation in a DLC feels like a missed opportunity.
We can assume that Rex and Shulk have weapons that are. at least in part, built using Origin metal, otherwise how can they destroy the clocks? But that's never said. I saw someone speculate that they were using ouroboros power - but that can't be right, because Noah and Mio can't cut them while transformed.
These are, generally, little things, but they all stack on each other. And that's before you talk about Noah and Mio's resurrection, and the return (seemingly) of Logos and Pneuma - all crucial, but all unexplained. Can you piece something together? Yeah, but still.
The game asks you to interpret an awful lot. I just wish we had more concrete answers - I don't need everything answered but I do feel like certain parts should have had a bow on top.
But I'm not looking to dog on XC3 because I genuinely loved a lot of it - despite how critical I come across. However, how they fumble around and wrap up Lucky Seven's 'origin' is kind of par for the course and represents some of my issues with the base game.
I am really enjoying Future Redeemed though. Defeating a multi-universe threat in Alpha and setting in motion the events of the main game feel really meaningful. Despite being set in the same world, what you do in this game feels a bit more satisfying to me.
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They're Monados, is the only guess I have.
yes, I consider the Aegis a Monado even though it's never stated
Mr.Fletcher
Bob-omb
Except Shulk built his Monado Rex in the old world before Future Connected and Rex does not have the Aegis swords.They're Monados, is the only guess I have.
yes, I consider the Aegis a Monado even though it's never stated
Logic!
- Pronouns
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but then.... what's he wielding in FR?and Rex does not have the Aegis swords.
Logic!
BradenAndEggs
Like Like
Except Shulk built his Monado Rex in the old world before Future Connected and Rex does not have the Aegis swords.
Logic!
Since they destroyed flame clocks in a cutscene, they probably built new versions of their weapons out of Origin metal.
If I were to get super detail oriented about it, Melia looks at Shulk's original Monado REX+ at the end of Xenoblade 3. There would be no way she would have the Monado REX+ if Shulk were using the same one in Future Redeemed since he would never have had a chance to pass the Monado REX+ he's using to Melia. Also, Rex's Firelight swords are visibly different than Pyra and Mythra's blade weapons, so we know Rex has (actually most likely Riku since he's in charge of weapon upgrades in the game) built replacements that can destroy a flame clock.
Also, Riku and Shulk have that cutscene in the Black Mountains comparing the Monado REX+ that Shulk is using to the wrapped-up Lucky Seven. Maybe there's something there, but honestly, a lot of what Riku/Shulk was saying at that moment (to me) seemed metaphorical. Maybe it wasn't.
Mr.Fletcher
Bob-omb
Poor Rex and Shulk, they don't even get their own weapons with amiibos. Noah is too greedy.
EtherPenguin
Koopa
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- He/Him
My understanding was definitely that the blade version of the Monado REX was made from origin metal and the actual one was in Melia's castle. During that discussion at Three Sage Summit, Shulk and Riku compare Lucky Seven and the Monado REX saying they both contain souls of people close to them implying it was made of Origin Metal. And obviously, Rex's swords aren't the original since they lack the Aegis cores.
Admittedly, I don't really understand how blades work in Aionios. Originally it seemed like something Keves and Agnus soldiers just summon out of nowhere. But then Noah uses Lucky Seven as a blade which was a real existing thing that was crafted and forged. Shulk's new Monado REX is presumably the same deal. And Matthew says his gauntlet came from his grandfather. Riku even asks him where it came from as if it's normal for a Blade to come from somewhere other than being an Iris manifestation. So does a Blade need to be an existing weapon and the user just 'absorbs' it into hammerspace to be re-summoned through their irises? Is it a mix of both where you can convert an actual existing weapon into a Blade, but most Keves and Agnus soldiers just manifest theirs out of nothing? If actual weapons are being manufactured for Keves and Agnus to be turned into Blades, why did the one child Noah used as a training sword look different than the swords being summoned as Blades?
Admittedly, I don't really understand how blades work in Aionios. Originally it seemed like something Keves and Agnus soldiers just summon out of nowhere. But then Noah uses Lucky Seven as a blade which was a real existing thing that was crafted and forged. Shulk's new Monado REX is presumably the same deal. And Matthew says his gauntlet came from his grandfather. Riku even asks him where it came from as if it's normal for a Blade to come from somewhere other than being an Iris manifestation. So does a Blade need to be an existing weapon and the user just 'absorbs' it into hammerspace to be re-summoned through their irises? Is it a mix of both where you can convert an actual existing weapon into a Blade, but most Keves and Agnus soldiers just manifest theirs out of nothing? If actual weapons are being manufactured for Keves and Agnus to be turned into Blades, why did the one child Noah used as a training sword look different than the swords being summoned as Blades?
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I always assumed that "newly-born" soldiers are given training weapons until they find one that fits their preferred fighting style; they are then given a standard-issue weapon that's integrated to their Iris for quick deployment.
Mister Gideon
Piranha Plant
Early on we see the crew find crates of clothes from the city, they try them on and later they’re able to manifest them in the same way as blades when they change classes, so we know real, tangible items can be stored and retrieved by soldiers.
As with a bunch of things in Aionios I wonder if it’s based on Alrest’s core crystal tech. Blades in Alrest were able to summon weapons to wield from nowhere, and even replace them if they were destroyed. Mathew mentions how he thinks people from the city view Ouroboros as behind the times because everyone’s “rocking those sweet new amps. It really opens up options for your Blade.” I’m guessing whatever amps are, they’re related to the ability to store and summon weapons and gear.
Hell, maybe when we’re collecting items for people in different colonies via the Collectopaedia cards, we’re literally sending those items to the recipients via the Iris system.
As with a bunch of things in Aionios I wonder if it’s based on Alrest’s core crystal tech. Blades in Alrest were able to summon weapons to wield from nowhere, and even replace them if they were destroyed. Mathew mentions how he thinks people from the city view Ouroboros as behind the times because everyone’s “rocking those sweet new amps. It really opens up options for your Blade.” I’m guessing whatever amps are, they’re related to the ability to store and summon weapons and gear.
Hell, maybe when we’re collecting items for people in different colonies via the Collectopaedia cards, we’re literally sending those items to the recipients via the Iris system.
SiG
Chain Chomp
So, just wondering for the people over here: Do you prefer the fixed classes of Future Redeemed, or the ability to change classes as per base game?
I know I might be in the minority, but I do prefer Future Redeemed's more finely tuned fixed classes. Okay, maybe "finely tuned" wasn't the word I was looking for... (considering Rex), but I do feel I still have the flexibility of kitting my characters without being overwhelmed with needing to experiment each of the different classes on them.
I know I might be in the minority, but I do prefer Future Redeemed's more finely tuned fixed classes. Okay, maybe "finely tuned" wasn't the word I was looking for... (considering Rex), but I do feel I still have the flexibility of kitting my characters without being overwhelmed with needing to experiment each of the different classes on them.
Mr.Fletcher
Bob-omb
I still think Torna has the bones of the perfect Xenoblade combat system.
Driver combos, blade combos, fusion combos, flashy moves, crunchy screen vibrations and the most satisfying chain attack in the series…
… it shares all these elements with XC2, but goes beyond that game with red health encouraging you to switch party members, a slicker driver combo system and unique talent arts for each character.
It marries all the interlocking systems of XC2, with a faster pace, incentivised party switching and more unique characters.
I say all this to inform why I prefer Future Redeemed’s take on XC3’s combat. Some classes in XC3 were crap but they had one good art or skill you wanted so you could pop it into a custom class. There was so much chopping and changing as a result.
Future Redeemed combat fits its length better than XC3’s in my opinion.
Driver combos, blade combos, fusion combos, flashy moves, crunchy screen vibrations and the most satisfying chain attack in the series…
… it shares all these elements with XC2, but goes beyond that game with red health encouraging you to switch party members, a slicker driver combo system and unique talent arts for each character.
It marries all the interlocking systems of XC2, with a faster pace, incentivised party switching and more unique characters.
I say all this to inform why I prefer Future Redeemed’s take on XC3’s combat. Some classes in XC3 were crap but they had one good art or skill you wanted so you could pop it into a custom class. There was so much chopping and changing as a result.
Future Redeemed combat fits its length better than XC3’s in my opinion.
Tye
All-around Nintendo enjoyer
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- they/them
100% fixed classes. The less time I have to spend messing with builds, the better. I know many people prefer to have more options, but I prefer when things are kept more simple and manageable and therefore not too overwhelming. Besides, there’s already the gems and accessories for customization, anyway.
D
Deleted member 2181
Guest
I much prefer the near 100% customisation of the base game. I like near-limitless possibilities to experiment with. The fact that you can then use this customisation to actually make the combat more dynamic and fun helps too. I really liked Future Redeemed's combat until the superbosses, at which point the limitations forced me to fight long, boring fights.
Mr.Fletcher
Bob-omb
I’ve just hit level 78 and I really don’t know what they were thinking with some of the super bosses.
They can take a battering and one shot several party members at a time. The balance feels completely off compared to the rest of the game and endgame content in the other titles.
They can take a battering and one shot several party members at a time. The balance feels completely off compared to the rest of the game and endgame content in the other titles.
EtherPenguin
Koopa
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- He/Him
I have a lot of affinity for characters having set movesets, or at least a main theme to their kit and a personal weapon. At the same time I have lots of fun with customization systems. It's not a one-size-fits-all thing and really just what makes different games feel like different games. I wrote a lengthy post in the prerelease thread for FR about this:
famiboards.com
And like I said in that post, while I have a lot of affinity toward character's having personalized movesets, you still need to give the characters some different directions they can grow and build around their core theme. Stuff like FF4, Chrono Trigger, Xenogears, Torna, and Future Redeemed is way to rigid for my taste. My ideal way of handling "each character has a core identity" is to treat characters more like Diablo classes where they have different talent trees and a whole host of builds within one class. A barbarian can never learn necromancer skills but still, a whirlwind barbarian is going to play differently than a frenzy barbarian. Dragon Quest 8 and 11 kind of lean in that direction. Etrian Odyssey games are pretty good at this as well.
I would also point to Xenoblade 1 as a vastly better take on fixed characters than Torna or FR. You still have customization in party composition, which 8 of your 16 arts to take into battle, skill links, and a more open-ended equipment system than anything that came after X with five equip slots and a possible total of eight gem slots.
And with class systems, every class system is going to be different. I can like class systems while also saying I wasn't particularly fond of 3's take on it. I don't like how there's no real way to grow a class. Once you get it, you already have every art and skill that class will ever learn. The master arts and skills are weirdly chosen. It's rare you get a class like the Signifer that gives away that class's bread and butter moves as master arts. Half the time it's generic stuff that doesn't really synergize in interesting ways with other classes' kits. Or obvious go to arts, like of course, you're going to stick Cross Impact on your attackers and tanks' palette the majority of the time. Of course, your gonna stick Multiblast and Advanced Cooldown on your Agnus healers.
I greatly preferred X's class system where it feels like I'm actually working toward a build that I actually want and could see myself using late game. In 3 it's more like you're on a neverending carasoul of swapping around classes until all the characters look the same.
I'm also always in favor of unique character building mechanics and ones that only work with the story and world the game is set in. Stuff like Drivers and Blades in 2, feeding your MAGs in Phantasy Star Online, mana eggs in Grandia, materia in FF7, immortals party members learning from mortal party members in Lost Odyssey, or Shadow Hearts Covenant making it so each party member has their own unique way of learning skills. Fully customizable main character + fixed class party members is always good too.
Xenoblade 3 - DLC #4 Trailer - Release April 25th
I hope we get an epilogue showing the XC3 cast communicating after the ending of XC3 I would love this so much. The icing on the icing on the cake.
famiboards.com
And like I said in that post, while I have a lot of affinity toward character's having personalized movesets, you still need to give the characters some different directions they can grow and build around their core theme. Stuff like FF4, Chrono Trigger, Xenogears, Torna, and Future Redeemed is way to rigid for my taste. My ideal way of handling "each character has a core identity" is to treat characters more like Diablo classes where they have different talent trees and a whole host of builds within one class. A barbarian can never learn necromancer skills but still, a whirlwind barbarian is going to play differently than a frenzy barbarian. Dragon Quest 8 and 11 kind of lean in that direction. Etrian Odyssey games are pretty good at this as well.
I would also point to Xenoblade 1 as a vastly better take on fixed characters than Torna or FR. You still have customization in party composition, which 8 of your 16 arts to take into battle, skill links, and a more open-ended equipment system than anything that came after X with five equip slots and a possible total of eight gem slots.
And with class systems, every class system is going to be different. I can like class systems while also saying I wasn't particularly fond of 3's take on it. I don't like how there's no real way to grow a class. Once you get it, you already have every art and skill that class will ever learn. The master arts and skills are weirdly chosen. It's rare you get a class like the Signifer that gives away that class's bread and butter moves as master arts. Half the time it's generic stuff that doesn't really synergize in interesting ways with other classes' kits. Or obvious go to arts, like of course, you're going to stick Cross Impact on your attackers and tanks' palette the majority of the time. Of course, your gonna stick Multiblast and Advanced Cooldown on your Agnus healers.
I greatly preferred X's class system where it feels like I'm actually working toward a build that I actually want and could see myself using late game. In 3 it's more like you're on a neverending carasoul of swapping around classes until all the characters look the same.
I'm also always in favor of unique character building mechanics and ones that only work with the story and world the game is set in. Stuff like Drivers and Blades in 2, feeding your MAGs in Phantasy Star Online, mana eggs in Grandia, materia in FF7, immortals party members learning from mortal party members in Lost Odyssey, or Shadow Hearts Covenant making it so each party member has their own unique way of learning skills. Fully customizable main character + fixed class party members is always good too.
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BradenAndEggs
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I like that the depth is there, but I also like that you can ignore it. Coming from a dummy who hits “auto build” on the characters, I would prefer fixed classes. I think of the classes as more of an extension of the character’s personality anyway. After getting each character fusion arts in X3, I kept them on their default classes most of the time outside of grinding for ascension quests.
Even in Xenoblade 2 I never used a blade that wasn’t in a main story cutscene because I wanted to stick to “canon” blades for each character. Plus the more obvious reason: too much character building flexibility can be overwhelming for me. Like I said, I’m glad the customization is there for people who like finding the best character/blade combinations even if I don’t engage with it.
I just need a dps, tank, and healer! lol
