Mr Swine
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Must be packed with cutscenes then if the game is that big
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News Sonic Origins releasing on June 23rd!
- Thread starter Robin64
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Must be packed with cutscenes then if the game is that big
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Actually I wonder...
Sega said the collection runs in 4k, which yeah I know the Switch can't output BUT what if they upgraded the textures and such so that they'd display better in 4k and that, along with the cutscenes, blew the filesizes way up? And then afterwards they decided to just release it like that on Switch, set at a lower output resolution but still packing the high-res assets and video files?
Tailzo
Paratroopa
I'm not sure how much being able to output at 4K matters for this game, since my PS5 doesn't seem to accept Sega Saturn USB pads, while my Switch does. I guess I'll double dip sooner or later no matter what version I start with.
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Yeah tbh I'm surprised to see Sega advertising that a pixel art game renders in 4k, unless it's one of those buzzwords they wanted to be able to include in the marketing. I'm just trying to figure what would balloon the filesize with my limited understanding of game dev and I've seen a lot of talk in the hardware thread about how 4k-quality textures cause a significant bump in filesize.
I'm just grasping at straws, really.
I mean, I'm still gonna download it so it doesn't really make much difference.
Tailzo
Paratroopa
Would you get the Switch version first, or does it make sense to get another version for «4K»? I guess a 4K version of a pixel art game would look sharper on my oled, right?Yeah tbh I'm surprised to see Sega advertising that a pixel art game renders in 4k, unless it's one of those buzzwords they wanted to be able to include in the marketing. I'm just trying to figure what would balloon the filesize with my limited understanding of game dev and I've seen a lot of talk in the hardware thread about how 4k-quality textures cause a significant bump in filesize.
I'm just grasping at straws, really.
I mean, I'm still gonna download it so it doesn't really make much difference.
Mr Swine
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The game is using 2D pixels so I don’t think that the game size would balloon like that if it’s running at 4k
Serif
𝕽𝖊𝖓𝖊𝖌𝖆𝖉𝖊 𝕬𝖓𝖌𝖊𝖑
Depends on how far you sit from your set. I own like 20+ pixel art games on Switch and they look great on my 65'' LG CX.
I'm kind of ... obsessed with getting better scaling so I compared 1080p pixel art games at sharpness level 20 and they look indistinguishable from 4K pixel art games on PC at a normal viewing distance of 7-9 feet.
If your TV/monitor does integer scaling then it'd be even better since it'd be scaling each 1080p pixel 4 times to 4K and pixel art games look exactly like native 4K.
Tailzo
Paratroopa
I have a CX and a C9, most of the time switch game look fine to me.
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Although I do remember that after playing games like Octopath traveler (2d and 3d) or Dragon Quest Builders 2 on Switch, and then later replaying them on xbox series x, I must say they looked much cleaner on the latter console.
With Sonic Mania I triple dipped with PC, Switch physical and Switch digital. So I never got to see it in 4k.
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Keep in mind though, Octopath isn't a 2D game. It's sprites moving in a 3D polygonal environment with a bunch of lighting and depth of field effects. I've seen comparison shots and can see what you mean about it being sharper on Xbox. But Sonic Origins is a fully 2D game. No 3D environments, no scaling, no depth of field. Purely pixels. And I see no reason why that would be terribly different from 1080 to 4k, especially since the sprites and tilesets were made for.. I guess the equivalent of 224p (that doesn't exist but just for comparison's sake)
Granted, I don't even have a 4k tv so I wouldn't know, I just know what it's like in image software to enlarge pure pixelart vs photolike images (which Octopath would fall under, because of how it's rendered).
TL;DR: it should look better than Octopath but I'm not 100% sure
Tailzo
Paratroopa
I think you’re right. And playing with a sega saturn pad will be great.
fiendcode
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Namco's been pretty good with their other retro collections (Namco Museum Switch, Namco Museum Archives). Konami (Arcade, Castlevania, Contra) and Capcom (Arcade, Mega Man, Street Fighter) and SNK (pre-Neo Geo, NGPC, Samurai Shodown) have all been pretty decent too tbh.
It is quite a shift for Sega though after that putrid Genesis collection.
Tailzo
Paratroopa
....I liked that huge ps3 genesis collection. I know it wasn't perfect, but it felt like a steal at the price I bought it. The later switch collection however, I never bought. it seemed less of a goog deal.
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Good catch!!
Jahranimo
Starman
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Why did people think this again? I swear lol
That showcase was great imo. Even in that Angel Island Zone intro for Sonic 3 I noticed they added sound effects to Sonic jumping and transforming into Super Sonic briefly. Nice touch that wasn't in the original Genesis releases or other re-releases.
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Because the Origins reveal trailer had fine print at the end that said 60fps would only be available on Xbox, PlayStation, and PC. Colors Ultimate had the same fine print, and indeed ended up being 30fps on Switch.
Mr Swine
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Why wouldn’t a 2D game run at 60fps on switch When the taxman versions ran fine on worse hardware (smartphone)
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I have no idea why they wouldn't. All I knew was that Sega's own fine print went to the trouble of saying 60fps would be XB/PS/PC only. I thought it was unbelievable but I started asking questions back then because of that.
Also one of Sonic's social media managers asked the question on Twitter a little bit before the reveal about what fans want Sega to do about the fact that Switch games struggle to keep up with 3rd party software. Which all just kinda lumped together with Colors Ultimate made me wonder if Sega had just completely given up on optimising for Switch.
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This is a hilarious combination of statements.
Seriously though, I hope your Switch survives a while
Serif
𝕽𝖊𝖓𝖊𝖌𝖆𝖉𝖊 𝕬𝖓𝖌𝖊𝖑
Taxman's engine runs at 60 fps on Switch right now (Mania).
The PS3 collection rocks, and is polished and solid emulation.
The new collection, has shoddy emulation no matter the console. That and the horrible UI. Sure, it looks neat, but it is annoying as hell. NSO is the best way to play Genesis games right now (or the 3DS), thanks to M2. My only complaint about NSO is the lack of good filter. Their CRT filter is beyond blurry, like if I was playing Genesis through RF or composite, instead of RGB or heck, even component, which Genesis supports oddly enough. Which is a shame, because the 3DS collection and Ages games from M2 offer filter options so you can have CRT or even crisp RGB like scanlines.
Tailzo
Paratroopa
This is on me though
I forgot my switch under my bed for 2-3 weeks. And don’t tell my wife, but I haven’t vacuum cleaned under it during that time either
But yes, it sounded like my switch was telling me «no, what have you done, please let me die…»
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Oh noooo dustbunnies monching on the silicon
Tailzo
Paratroopa
I think so
Going to buy some compressed air
Switch is the only current gen console that supports the usb sega saturn pad, abd that was the reason I decided to get origins for that console.
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Sending good vibes to your air can
Jahranimo
Starman
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If anyone that played Sonic Mania or any of the Ages Sonic games on the Switch and suddenly believed the poor wording on a trailer, then I really don't know what to say at that point lol.
Water under the bridge by now but that just makes me chuckle.
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Katie Chrzanowski (the Sonic social media manager) just confirmed on stream for the first time that they won't be using all the original music tracks for Sonic 3 in Origins, but that Jun Senoue himself is refining and finishing up the original tracks that were written before Michael Jackson's involvement, even going as far as using old tapes of his to try and replicate the sound of the Genesis sound chip.
So there's that question finally answered.
So there's that question finally answered.
Raccoon
Fox Brigade
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Was debating Switch or PC, but provided this runs on Steam Deck I'll probably go for the latter and mod the original music in, since I don't see it taking long before someone releases a music mod.
Still, it'll be interesting to see what the refined prototype tracks sound like.
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Yeah nostalgia might make me miss the Jackson/Buxer tracks but I've heard the stuff that was originally written and I gotta admit it's pretty good. Has more of a Sonic 3D Blast Genesis vibe, which imo is a good thing.
EtherPenguin
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I don't see why they had to keep us in the dark so long lol. Well, it's disappointing but at least we know now. I'm still interested in picking it up regardless. Curious to hear what Senoue cooked up.
edit: wait are Senoue's tracks the ones that were on the 1997 PC port? Oh, I did not love that track for ice cap
edit: wait are Senoue's tracks the ones that were on the 1997 PC port? Oh, I did not love that track for ice cap
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To be honest while I generally think the original tracks are better the only ones I flat out don't really like are proto Ice Cap 1 and 2. I'm not actually a huge fan of original Carnival Night and proto may actually be better (though I'm similarly not a huge fan of the proto tracks either), and while I like original Launch Base better than prototype, I can't deny that proto Act 2 is really good.
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Yes. Though I'm hoping with Senoue re-doing them they'll come out sounding better than the weird MIDI versions that ended up in the PC port. I actually kinda prefer some of them to the Jackson versions, if I'm being honest.
Though yeah, the loss of the "Hard Times" version of Ice Cap would be the biggest hit to me, too. However, not to get hopes up too much, that was not a Jackson song. It was a song by another band that Jackson's producer worked on, so it's possible, maybe, that if Jackson's tracks couldn't be used (because his estate became incredibly fickle after his death) that doesn't necessarily rule out the Ice Cap song we all know and love. I wouldn't count on it being in, but there's still a chance. All Katie said was "We couldn't use all the original songs from the Genesis version" but no further detail regarding which are in or which are out.
We'll see.
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Why compare them to the PC MIDI versions when we know those were just converted from the proto tracks for MD.
I think Ice Cap needs the most touch up of the three (Carnival Night is great and Launch Base is okay), so i'm glad they aren't just being directly ripped from that leaked build (or a slightly later one if that exists).
Jahranimo
Starman
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I was referencing the MIDI versions because that's where @EtherPenguin knows those tracks from.
Agreed. Ice Cap is sadly the biggest gap in quality from the proto track to the Buxer track. I'd happily sacrifice every other Jackson/Buxer track in the game to keep the "Hard Times" version of Ice Cap.
YEP.
EtherPenguin
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Yea I only knew those tracks as the PC port soundtrack. I did not know they were taken from the original music for Sonic 3 before Jackson's involvement or that they were composed by Senoue. Chocolate_supra was just answering my question about that.
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Actually I don't think it can be said that they were totally composed by Senoue. The S3K music team has several names attached and Senoue was only one of them. He didn't become the prominent composer until 3D Blast and then obviously the Adventure games.
What he is confirmed to be doing, and maybe I wasn't clear on how I phrased it, is retooling those original beta tracks for Origins.
TheCongressman
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She did not say anything about MJ, lol. She just said 'original compositions' which could mean any of the music written in 1993, which is all of it.
We actually have no idea if she means prototype compositions, or release compositions.
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I... know? She referenced the questions fans have been asking about the MJ tracks, though. And in response to that, she said they couldn't use all the music from the original Genesis release. Which would mean they couldn't use the music the fans have been asking about, which would be the MJ tracks. She then went on to talk about the original beta tracks from 1993, actually said they're the ones from 1993, which was the year of the prototype version of Sonic 3 that those tracks are from. The difference between the music in that 1993 version and the 1994 release version is that one has the Jackson/Buxer tracks, the other doesn't. Hence my saying she referred to the tracks that were written before Jackson's involvement.
I'm not sure why you're lol'ing me.
TheCongressman
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Not laughing at what you are saying specifically, rather that Katie's wording is still so vauge that there's almost just as many questions now than before, and a lot of people are making big assumptions.
She didn't say music couldn't be used, she said certain sounds. Which could mean entire tracks, but again, could be samples.
She didn't say beta or prototype. She said Jun's working from original compositions from 1993. Could be any of the music.
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Oh wait
Oh shit
What if they were able to use the same music but just not the woo's and yeah's that are in the music because of them being Michael's voice?
Holy shit, the release music might actually still be in, just without the vocal samples, and Jun could simply be repolishing those tracks to use other Genesis sounds in place of the vocals!
OH MY GOD
charliedayconspiracyboard.jpg
Gingerbread Man
Paratroopa
Nitpicking, but I think they should have remastered Sonic Jam's 3D World as a hub. Kinda like the Pac-Man Museum hub. Shouldn't have been very expensive and technically it is a classic Sonic game! The menus they included, with various islands representing the four games, are cool, but Sonic Jam's world would have been the cherry on the top.
Chaotix and Ristar as (emulated, not remastered) bonus games would have also been nice.
Chaotix and Ristar as (emulated, not remastered) bonus games would have also been nice.
TheCongressman
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I totally understand why some people's immediate thought is that the tracks would have to be completely replaced, but we just don't know if that's actually the case from Katie's wording here. I think if they can reuse the release compositions, but with replaced samples, they'd rather do that.
They're absolutely trying to keep the details of why vauge. But seems like they're also unintentionally leaving out a lot of important details of the solution. I guess Jun isn't finished with the music which is why we haven't heard anything yet.
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Two weeks left, is hope he's at least close.
And yeah, I assumed the vagueness in the wording was her dancing around explicitly naming Jackson but you're right, they may be doing something different than we expected and can't say exactly what.
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