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Rumour What happened to Super Mario Oddysey 2?

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Deleted member 4629

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(Sorry if i'm posting this in the wrong place, or if my wording is a little off, i am new here)
((SPOILERS!!! LEAKS DISCUSSED HERE!!!))
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It is November 2017. A brand new 3D Mario game, Super Mario Oddyssey has just released for the brand new Nintendo Switch. SEGA also just released a brand new mainline Sonic game for all current platforms.

It is November 2019. A leak appears on 4chan detailing two new games: Super Mario Oddysey 2, and Sonic Frontiers. (See picture related for the leak).
It is April of 2023. Sonic Frontiers from said leak got confirmed to be real, and it has been out for almost half a year now and it is recieving updates. Meanwhile...Nothing about Super Mario Oddysey 2.

...What is up with that? I understand that Nintendo likes to take their sweet time to polish their games, which i respect. But still, Breath of the Wilds sequel Tears of the Kingdom is releasing in about a month, and both released in 2017 so they probably have a similar amount of development time. I know that Nintendo released 3D All Stars and 3D World + Bowsers Fury in 2020 and 2021 respectively, i thought that that could've delayed Odyssey 2's development but at the same time SEGA also released a Sonic Colors during Forces and Frontiers, so is that really an argument?

I was honestly convinced to the very bone Super Mario Oddysey 2 would be revealed during the Nintendo Direct in February, after all, it'd been so long since the last original 3D Mario game, there has to be a new one, right? Well i think we all know how that went down. And now there are (very credible) rumors that Nintendo's latter half of 2023 will be very soft. I don't think a new 3D Mario game would be part of a soft latter half, so does that rule Mario Oddysey 2 out in 2023?

Did the leaker make up the Odyssey 2 part? Is Nintendo saving Oddysey 2 for a later year? I don't know. I'm not sure, what do you think?
 
Here are the other images from the leak.
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At this point Odyssey 2 isn't happening because they would have announced it already, I highly doubt covid would have delayed this much.
 
Reworked it into an entirely new game, most likely. Probably gonna be their big launch title for the next console, whatever it is.
 
Pretty sure it never existed.
At this point they're for sure doing a new concept for the next 3D Mario title.
 
Reworked, cancelled. I bet there were a ton of games from nintendo that got a decent way into development but got canned, and we dont know about them.
 
Whatever new Mario was it got probably reworked to Bowser's Fury and fleshed out by NST. EPD Tokyo splitting to make 2 games, moving to new place, ditching their long running engine and all that in covid was probably tough. New 3D Mario likely started somewhere around 2019.

I am curious about Isle Delfino on the globe, probably a fun little easter egg.
 
Huge missed opportunity for a Galaxy 2 like sequel.

We could’ve been utterly feasting this year with TOTK and an Odyssey 2 that goes even crazier than the first
 
Skittzo said:
IIRC this rumor came from a focus group style pitch session presented by Sega, where they threw out a bunch of made up game concepts with one real game thrown in (Sonic Frontiers) to gauge the group's reactions.
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Bowser Sr. said:
It never existed. That kind of interest research poll always includes fake games along with the real thing they are trying to get reactions to, considering Sonic ended up being real you can assume Odyssey 2 is not.
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@Dutchie here's the answer
 
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Skittzo said:
IIRC this rumor came from a focus group style pitch session presented by Sega, where they threw out a bunch of made up game concepts with one real game thrown in (Sonic Frontiers) to gauge the group's reactions.
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Bowser Sr. said:
It never existed. That kind of interest research poll always includes fake games along with the real thing they are trying to get reactions to, considering Sonic ended up being real you can assume Odyssey 2 is not.
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This is totally it. This poll was likely created by a team working for SEGA to gauge interest in the then in-development Sonic Frontiers. They threw in fake games like Odyssey 2 as a way to test how people would react to Sonic in comparison something Nintendo could have reasonably been working on.
 
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Thank all of you for your reactions! Very insightful. I never expected SEGA to make up a game just like that, hahaha.
 
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LukasManak22 said:
Whatever new Mario was it got probably reworked to Bowser's Fury and fleshed out by NST. EPD Tokyo splitting to make 2 games, moving to new place, ditching their long running engine and all that in covid was probably tough. New 3D Mario likely started somewhere around 2019.

I am curious about Isle Delfino on the globe, probably a fun little easter egg.
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it seems pretty uncharacteristic of EPD Tokyo to actually cancel a mainline Mario game or turn it into an expansion. I'd say the more likely thing that happened is that the next game is so ambitious from a production standpoint it needed 5-6 years of development (maybe it's even finished at this point, just saved for the holidays)
 
Phendrift said:
Huge missed opportunity for a Galaxy 2 like sequel.

We could’ve been utterly feasting this year with TOTK and an Odyssey 2 that goes even crazier than the first
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who even knows at this point. If TOTK took 6 years and they went for it, maybe Odyssey 2 took as much
 
entut1 said:
it seems pretty uncharacteristic of EPD Tokyo to actually cancel a mainline Mario game or turn it into an expansion. I'd say the more likely thing that happened is that the next game is so ambitious from a production standpoint it needed 5-6 years of development (maybe it's even finished at this point, just saved for the holidays)
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Nintendo cancels all kinds of projects, we just don't see it. Even EPD Tokyo could have cancelled/reworked something. There are people over at EPD who aren't credited in years because likely they're projects got cancelled. Development of Nintendo Switch Sports is the latest example when they got into wrong direction, or the cancelled 1-2 Switch sequel.
 
LukasManak22 said:
Nintendo cancels all kinds of projects, we just don't see it. Even EPD Tokyo could have cancelled/reworked something. There are people over at EPD who aren't credited in years because likely they're projects got cancelled. Development of Nintendo Switch Sports is the latest example when they got into wrong direction, or the cancelled 1-2 Switch sequel.
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I guess? Bowser's Fury is like an add-on to Wii U port, except it's the biggest of them. If EPD Tokyo conceptualized that (they did), it probably didn't take more than a year at best, there's not enough new ideas there for a full game.
 
It could be the theme park and movie opening and COVID all were a 1-2-3 punch that threw the time line for the next Mario completely off course.

The Mario theme park world is very obviously 1-1 based on the Mario 3D World aesthetic, so that meant Mario 3D World port had to come first and it also had to release alongside the theme park opening, which it basically did.

For the Mario movie, maybe they did not want to overshadow the movie and have different power ups in things in a new Mario game that wouldn't be referenced by the movie.

Then just add in general COVID shut down stuff.

I'll throw in another possible curve ball too ... when Nintendo made the deal for the Mario theme park, it looks like they also made a deal for a Donkey Kong theme park, but the problem is Nintendo doesn't have a game to go with a Donkey Kong theme park (as Retro was on Metroid Prime 4).

So I suspect what has happened is one of the two teams at EAD Tokyo may have been put on a Donkey Kong game because they need that sooner.
 
entut1 said:
I guess? Bowser's Fury is like an add-on to Wii U port, except it's the biggest of them. If EPD Tokyo conceptualized that (they did), it probably didn't take more than a year at best, there's not enough new ideas there for a full game.
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It could have been way larger, they just left this out and give it to NST to make it as a 3D World expansion. New 3D Mario probably started development in 2019, it's the same as EPD9.
 
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At this point, I am sure Odyssey 2 or whatever the next mainline Mario game will be is being patiently developed for the Switch's successor.
 
Could be a blessing in disguise. I was not a fan of many of Odyssey’s meandering tropes and I much preferred the gameplay of Bowser’s Fury (2021). I hope they are heading full into that direction for the next game.
 
Sunshinemario said:
Could be a blessing in disguise. I was not a fan of many of Odyssey’s meandering tropes and I much preferred the gameplay of Bowser’s Fury (2021). I hope they are heading full into that direction for the next game.
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On the other hand Odyssey is the best selling 3D Mario by about three country miles, even dwarfing Mario 64 and Mario Galaxy. I suspect they're going to forget that any time soon.
 
Super Mario Odyssey was released holiday 2017, Breath of the Wild was released early 2017.

Both of those games had ~4 years of development. BotW started early 2013, Odyssey late 2013.

BotW was formally revealed in 2014. Odyssey was formally revealed the very year it released.

Tears of the Kingdom is releasing next month, more than 6 years after its predecessor, and was revealed almost 4 years before release.

We can apply the very same "rules" to 3D Mario, and Odyssey 2/next 3D game wouldn't happen until this holiday or Q1 2024. Add the possibility of 3D Mario entering development by 2019(instead of TotK which was early 2018 from hirings), and it will be holiday 2024.

And no, it isn't anything absurd. It's the combo of Switch development cycles being longer than ever, sequels getting more ambitious than their predecessors(see TotK), "it's a sequel so it will be done faster" not being true(see TotK, again), COVID hitting hard game development (see Fire Emblem Engage originally being planned for December 2020), and probably it also being cross gen with Switch 2, and you see what happened.

We tend to really underestimate 3D Mario's development time. If Nintendo used the same strategy of marketing for Mario that they used for TotK(assuring there are games coming + allowing for massive hirings), we'd have had the next 3D Mario announced back in late 2020 and the release happening in 2024. The thing is they'll probably just wait for September 2023 or February 2024 or even June 2024 if the game is holiday 2024.

Tbh I think the Mario movie breaking every record possible and setting the world on fire will allow for a record breaking release of a 2D Mario this year, and, I hope, at least the announcement of the 3D Mario for 2024.

Also, the rumors about the "no heavy hitters" in H2 are the farthest possible thing from credible, lol. We clearly saw those were just assumptions based of Nintendo not participating of E3 plus they probably knowing the games of February Direct and assuming those were for the whole year and not just for a stacked H1.
 
As I recall, the return journey dealt with in The Odyssey lasts around ten years, so we still have a few years yet.
 
The specific slide this thread is about has obviously already been explained; don’t need to address it.

At this point the next 3D Mario is probably waiting on the next Nintendo hardware. 3D Zelda isn’t going to be available for at least half a decade now; they need a heavy hitter like that for the launch year, if not just THE big launch title.

For 2D Mario I still don’t think it’s impossible for it to slip into this year or H1 2024, before the next console launches. Started developed around when Splatoon 3 did from what we know; and they might want to capitalize on the massive install-base for one last major Mario release.
 
I'd like to think it's coming at the launch of the next console. While Odyssey isn't perfect I'd totally take a sequel to it over a follow up to 3D World or another game like Bowser's Fury. 3D World/Land is too strictly linear, and BF felt way way way too open.
 
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Clov said:
Metroid? Mario? Doesn't matter Yamanoi, Yakuman's bigger than both!
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To be honest, we should be talking about fair comparisons. Yakuman is indeed bigger than both. Just like how Birdo is more important to Mario lore than Geno by about 1000x.
 
Yamanoi said:
Metroid has more prestige than Mario.
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Super Mario Odyssey has a 97 on the number website. Metroid Prime Remastered is sitting at a 94, which is honestly pathetic for a big four property. Hope to see better from Retro Studios in the future.
 
Aurc said:
Super Mario Odyssey has a 97 on the number website. Metroid Prime Remastered is sitting at a 94, which is honestly pathetic for a big four property. Hope to see better from Retro Studios in the future.
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See you in the Metroid Prime 4 review thread in 2040.
 
Marce-chan said:
We can apply the very same "rules" to 3D Mario, and Odyssey 2/next 3D game wouldn't happen until this holiday or Q1 2024. Add the possibility of 3D Mario entering development by 2019(instead of TotK which was early 2018 from hirings), and it will be holiday 2024.
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This is not the rule as TotK was very likely slated for a late 2021 release (before pandemic) and late 2022 oficially when the pandemic was happening, then it was oficially delayed by half a year. You are forgetting that they are also working on a 2D game. If they at the earliest fully started in 2019 (after they scrapped Bowser's Fury). Tokyo games are either way revealed way closer to their release.

If they started in 2019, they probably knew it would not release on this Switch (if they are not planning cross-gen). It's the same as with Odyssey, they knew from the beginning it's the Switch title but until they had the devkits they worked it on WIi U specs, could be the same situation here.
 
Koizumi was allowed to peek into Aonuma's TotK dev rooms and was so blown away by what he saw that he went back to the concept phase for the next Mario game.

winkwink
 
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if Bowser Fury was any hint as to what the future of 3D Mario might look like, the long wait might be also due to bigger ambitions in terms of scale while keeping that same polish and 60 fps which would obviously take time to get right.

As Nintendo shows more of TOTK you can clearly see why the game took awhile to develop and I wouldn't be surprised if the same will be said of the next 3D Mario entry.

At least that's my assumptions alongside other "rumors" that have been floating around such as an engine change from EPD Tokyo own proprietary one to Lunchpack which is also shared with some other teams at Nintendo EPD (unless I'm mistaken, Zelda also has its own engine separated from the rest).

Wouldn't be surprised if we get 2D Mario first too tbh, it'd capitalize well on the insane install base for the current hardware.
 
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