Pre-Release Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door (2024) — Pre-release Discussion Thread

[Kaizo]

Petal Meadows is just PM64 Chapter 1 with a dragon and Keelhaul Key is just PM64 Chapter 5 with a pirate theme so I'd be hard pressed to call them unique. Pirates weren't even a new trope to Mario at that point.

I’m glad you brought up pirates, because I actually have my own theory to share that I don’t know where else to post.

So, in Super Mario RPG, there is Johnny and his band of sharks - the Bandana Reds and Bandana Blues, obviously being the pirate threat of that game. In TTYD, there is Cortez and the embers. The embers are considered to be something like spirits / ghosts of past things - considering their pirate theme and the same angry yellow eyes the Bandana Sharks have, I propose perhaps these are those same sharks post-mortem. At the very least, I feel like Johnny’s sharks have to have been heavy inspiration for these embers.

 

[isaacmaltes]

Japanese commercials are up.

I never really minded the white outlines but I will say,

seeing Paper Mario with fluid animation again fills me with so much glee. The 2-frame “stop-motion” style of Color Splash’s animations always felt like such a downgrade

 

[Cheetah6442]

I never really minded the white outlines but I will say,

seeing Paper Mario with fluid animation again fills me with so much glee. The 2-frame “stop-motion” style of Color Splash’s animations always felt like such a downgrade

Sticker Star was the first game to have stop motion animation, then CS and TOK followed suit.

 

[isaacmaltes]

Sticker Star was the first game to have stop motion animation, then CS and TOK followed suit.

Sticker Star still had puppetry style fluid animation for a few characters, like Mario’s animation for peeling stickers.

 

[ze_]

I never really minded the white outlines but I will say,

seeing Paper Mario with fluid animation again fills me with so much glee. The 2-frame “stop-motion” style of Color Splash’s animations always felt like such a downgrade

I didn't particularly mind because they used that new template to make Mario more expressive, but now we have a Mario that's every bit as expressive that also looks more flush with the environment. Watching his cap gently bounce on his head as he walks about is kinda mesmerizing.

 

[MondoMega]

 

[Jersh]

There's that Paper Mario 64 title screen theme again. I wonder what it's doing in this game (not complaining though!).

Is it just me, or does Mario fall much slower after getting bit by a Nibbles?

 

[MondoMega]

There's that Paper Mario 64 title screen theme again. I wonder what it's doing in this game (not complaining though!).

We heard it in one of the previews; it plays during the intro, while the camera is focused on Parakarry.




Given every partner has a unique character theme in the remake, I wonder if this is treated like the OG partner theme, and they've restored the unused (besides Lady Bow) cameos in the post-game for this music to play during.

 

[Mekanos]

I'm really loving how Pirate's Grotto is looking in the remake with the lighting, it adds a lot of atmosphere to it.

 

[Dragoncaine]

I'm really loving how Pirate's Grotto is looking in the remake with the lighting, it adds a lot of atmosphere to it.

Chapter 5 has been looking visually sumptuous in all the footage we've seen so far, 100%!

 

[ComradeKoopa]

I'm so conflicted. TTYD is my favorite game of all time and I want to play this the second it comes out, but 30FPS games give me headaches and nausea... Part of me wants to wait for the successor and a possible FPS boost but I feel like that's unlikely since some of the mechanics are frame-dependent. Anyone else in the same boat?

 

[bloopland33]

I'm so conflicted. TTYD is my favorite game of all time and I want to play this the second it comes out, but 30FPS games give me headaches and nausea... Part of me wants to wait for the successor and a possible FPS boost but I feel like that's unlikely since some of the mechanics are frame-dependent. Anyone else in the same boat?

Unless they botched the character designs or something (and even then) pretty much nothing was gonna stop me from getting a TTYD re-release day 1

 

[ComradeKoopa]

Unless they botched the character designs or something (and even then) pretty much nothing was gonna stop me from getting a TTYD re-release day 1

I'm still getting it day one as well. I'm hoping the frame rate doesn't affect me too much, but if it does, I'll hold onto it and hope for a patch on the successor (or push through the nausea lol). I'm way too excited for the new OST.

 

[bloopland33]

I'm still getting it day one as well. I'm hoping the frame rate doesn't affect me too much, but if it does, I'll hold onto it and hope for a patch on the successor (or push through the nausea lol). I'm way too excited for the new OST.

Oh I gotcha. Yeah, I’m not a big game replayer, but honestly if it gets patched, I may just replay it. Yeah, you could always do half now and half later! Hopefully we’ll have some semblance of Nintendo’s plan for enhancement patches later this year, so maybe confirmation could come sooner than the console’s launch

 

[mazi]

 

[Mekanos]

Really love this remix. Can’t wait to experience the rest of the soundtrack.

 

[Brofield]

Game releases when I'm out of the country, but I think it's probably for the best I wait until I get back so I can fully enjoy the game on a nice TV without being jetlagged lol

 

[Dragoncaine]

That track in full is gonna be a stunner

 

[VintoWin]

Are reviews dropping the day of?

EDIT: nvm leaker said May 21st.

 

[SeaBusCBus]

I'm not sure if I'm just extra noticing it or what, but it feels like Nintendo social media is pushing TTYD HARD

 

[ngpdrew]

I'm not sure if I'm just extra noticing it or what, but it feels like Nintendo social media is pushing TTYD HARD

I feel like this is pretty normal behavior for a light year. They don't have much to push (right now) so you may as well lean hard on what you do have, kind of like how they pushed TOK pretty hard in 2020 and even Dread to a lesser extent in 2021.

 

[Phendrift]

Know it’s getting close when I’m having dreams about it lol.

Dreamed I was watching someone play the end of Chapter 2 and they were fighting all 3 of Crump, Beldam and Grodus (?!) at once. They got the Crystal Star right after

But dream me knew that was wrong, I was like, where’s Magnus? Lol

 

[DecoReturns]

can’t wait to destroy enemies with Yoshi and Vivian again.

 

[Leo]

I'm getting hyped for the game, so I guess I'll take the opportunity to play TOK while everyone plays TTYD. I'll get TTYD down the line when it's cheaper.

 

[ohlawd]

I did a thing. I bought Tales of Symphonia Remastered on my Series X; another GameCube classic that was 60 FPS but future ports of it are stuck at 30 FPS. I finished it no problem though I did have experience already with the PS3 port.

Getting that 30 FPS resistance built up for TTYD next week

 

[ComradeKoopa]

I did a thing. I bought Tales of Symphonia Remastered on my Series X; another GameCube classic that was 60 FPS but future ports of it are stuck at 30 FPS. I finished it no problem though I did have experience already with the PS3 port.

Getting that 30 FPS resistance built up for TTYD next week

I've scoured the internet looking for other ports/remasters that halve their original frame rate and came up with nothing, thinking TTYD was unprecedented. I guess it's good to know it isn't the first lol

 

[scamander]

I've scoured the internet looking for other ports/remasters that halve their original frame rate and came up with nothing, thinking TTYD was unprecedented. I guess it's good to know it isn't the first lol

The difference is that Tales of Symphonia is a port of a pretty bad PS3 remaster with a bunch of new bugs and problems on top of the ones introduced on PS3. TTYD on the other hand is a full-on remake the developers clearly put a lot of love in. They just made the conscious choice to prioritize visuals and effects over having a higher frame rate, because they clearly are of the opinion that's the best choice for the game. You can have a different opinion of course, but if you seriously claim this is a cash grab remaster comparable to Tales of Symphonia it's clear you are not interested in a factual discourse. The whole fake online outrage that's being fueled by video game youtubers and influencers for their personal gain is embarrassing.

 

[Tye]

I've scoured the internet looking for other ports/remasters that halve their original frame rate and came up with nothing, thinking TTYD was unprecedented. I guess it's good to know it isn't the first lol

As already mentioned above, this game isn’t a port or remaster, it’s a full remake. And with that in mind, this isn’t even the first remake of a Nintendo game to halve its frame rate, either—there’s Pokémon Omega Ruby / Alpha Sapphire, for example.

 

[ComradeKoopa]

The difference is that Tales of Symphonia is a port of a pretty bad PS3 remaster with a bunch of new bugs and problems on top of the ones introduced on PS3. TTYD on the other hand is a full-on remake the developers clearly put a lot of love in. They just made the conscious choice to prioritize visuals and effects over having a higher frame rate, because they clearly are of the opinion that's the best choice for the game. You can have a different opinion of course, but if you seriously claim this is a cash grab remaster comparable to Tales of Symphonia it's clear you are not interested in a factual discourse. The whole fake online outrage that's being fueled by video game youtubers and influencers for their personal gain is embarrassing.

Then I suppose it's a good thing that's not what I'm doing! I'm not familiar with Tales of Symphonia or its remaster, I was just interested in how common a frame rate halving is with ports and remasters.

As already mentioned above, this game isn’t a port or remaster, it’s a full remake. And with that in mind, this isn’t even the first remake of a Nintendo game to halve its frame rate, either—there’s Pokémon Omega Ruby / Alpha Sapphire, for example.

Interesting, so it's definitely not the first time this has happened. It's still disappointing but a lot less so compared to the other examples here, all things considered.

 

[ngpdrew]

I've scoured the internet looking for other ports/remasters that halve their original frame rate and came up with nothing, thinking TTYD was unprecedented. I guess it's good to know it isn't the first lol

There's a simple reason for that: It wasn't even that long ago that games were routinely 30 FPS. It would have been awkward to halve that frame rate.

 

[ComradeKoopa]

There's a simple reason for that: It wasn't even that long ago that games were routinely 30 FPS. It would have been awkward to halve that frame rate.

Undoubtedly. And that's a good point I hadn't considered. I'm sure a master list of ports and remasters would skew predominantly 30FPS for the original titles.

 

[ngpdrew]

Undoubtedly. And that's a good point I hadn't considered. I'm sure a master list of ports and remasters would skew predominantly 30FPS for the original titles.

Now I really wish someone remade Ocarina of Time at a silky smooth 10 frames per second.

 

[JazzyFuture]

As much as I would prefer 60fps (I think they definitely could have gotten away with making battle visuals less intensive to get 60fps there with a 30fps overworld at least), I think it's a rather pointless thing to argue about because 30fps is still plenty playable as long as it's stable. I mean, TTYD and Super are the only Paper Mario games that run at 60, and TTYD is the only turn based one to do so. All 4 of the 3DS Mario & Luigi games were also 30 over the GBA and DS entries' 60, and those played just fine.

Obviously this is the one game with superguarding, but I don't think that's gonna be too much of an issue, they had to have adjusted it, and it'll probably be fine.

 

[ComradeKoopa]

As much as I would prefer 60fps (I think they definitely could have gotten away with making battle visuals less intensive to get 60fps there with a 30fps overworld at least), I think it's a rather pointless thing to argue about because 30fps is still plenty playable as long as it's stable. I mean, TTYD and Super are the only Paper Mario games that run at 60, and TTYD is the only turn based one to do so. All 4 of the 3DS Mario & Luigi games were also 30 over the GBA and DS entries' 60, and those played just fine.

For most people this is true, but I unfortunately belong to the minority of people who are sensitive to low frame rates. I'll be fighting headaches and nausea my entire playthrough. That's the monkey's paw of OLED instant response time...

Obviously this is the one game with superguarding, but I don't think that's gonna be too much of an issue, they had to have adjusted it, and it'll probably be fine.

I believe the remaster makes the super guard window 16 milliseconds longer compared to the original, which I'd argue is negligible to most people except maybe challenge runners.

 

[Cheetah6442]

The difference is that Tales of Symphonia is a port of a pretty bad PS3 remaster with a bunch of new bugs and problems on top of the ones introduced on PS3. TTYD on the other hand is a full-on remake the developers clearly put a lot of love in. They just made the conscious choice to prioritize visuals and effects over having a higher frame rate, because they clearly are of the opinion that's the best choice for the game. You can have a different opinion of course, but if you seriously claim this is a cash grab remaster comparable to Tales of Symphonia it's clear you are not interested in a factual discourse. The whole fake online outrage that's being fueled by video game youtubers and influencers for their personal gain is embarrassing.

Here's the thing tho. From what I heard a few days ago, TTYD and I think Super(could be wrong as far as the latter is concerned), was/were the only game(s) in the series to be 60fps. PM64, SPM(if I'm wrong about the 60fps part), PMSS, PMCS, and PMTOK are all 30fps.

For most people this is true, but I unfortunately belong to the minority of people who are sensitive to low frame rates. I'll be fighting headaches and nausea my entire playthrough. That's the monkey's paw of OLED instant response time...

I believe the remaster makes the super guard window 16 milliseconds longer compared to the original, which I'd argue is negligible to most people except maybe challenge runners.

I argue the remake making the Superguarding window long, but not too long is a perfect balance since it won't be too lenient.

 

[ComradeKoopa]

Here's the thing tho. From what I heard a few days ago, TTYD and I think Super(could be wrong as far as the latter is concerned), was/were the only game(s) in the series to be 60fps. PM64, SPM(if I'm wrong about the 60fps part), PMSS, PMCS, and PMTOK are all 30fps.
I argue the remake making the Superguarding window long, but not too long is a perfect balance since it won't be too lenient.

The alternative would be a 1 out of 30 frames window, making the entire duration 33 milliseconds compared to the original 50 milliseconds. That would've been too difficult, in my opinion, especially since one's reaction time could be affected by the lower frame rate compared to the original.

 

[Phendrift]

Safe to assume the regular unlocks for star pieces and shines remain the same, and that this stuff automatically unlocks?

 

[Dragoncaine]

Safe to assume the regular unlocks for star pieces and shines remain the same, and that this stuff automatically unlocks?

That's what I'm expecting, yeah. All the old hits, plus some new unlockables that I will fondly gaze at a few times and never visit again lol (it is definitely cool, though)!

 

[Cheetah6442]

Safe to assume the regular unlocks for star pieces and shines remain the same, and that this stuff automatically unlocks?

That's what I'm expecting, yeah. All the old hits, plus some new unlockables that I will fondly gaze at a few times and never visit again lol (it is definitely cool, though)!

The My Nintendo News preview basically confirmed that you unlock art pieces/concepts by collecting every Star Piece from that chapter and when it comes to music tracks, every Shine Sprite in that chapter. Also, by finishing that chapter(for both cases to be specific).

Preview: Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door for Nintendo Switch

The Nintendo Switch remake of Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door seems to be the definitive way to play the beloved GameCube classic.

mynintendonews.com

 

[ILikeFeet]

 

[Simba]

I hope my copy preloads tomorrow.

I know they changed some of the dialogue, I wonder if the infamous Hooktail dialogue is still in it.

 

[Mekanos]

I hope my copy preloads tomorrow.

I know they changed some of the dialogue, I wonder if the infamous Hooktail dialogue is still in it.

If you're talking about the foot one, don't worry, it's there

 

[ohlawd]

I hope my copy preloads tomorrow.

it should. tomorrow is the one week off mark

 

[Simba]

If you're talking about the foot one, don't worry, it's there

sometimes i wonder what the writers were thinking

 

[yntsire]

sometimes i wonder what the writers were thinking

...you know what.

 

[MondoMega]

 

[Cheetah6442]

If anyone is wondering why Bowser's voice sounds weird here, that's because these are voice samplings from his old/previous voice actor
Scott Burns, not Kenny James, which is his current voice actor.

 

[Jersh]

The alternative would be a 1 out of 30 frames window, making the entire duration 33 milliseconds compared to the original 50 milliseconds. That would've been too difficult, in my opinion, especially since one's reaction time could be affected by the lower frame rate compared to the original.

They could also poll the controller at 60 Hz and leave it at the original 50 ms.

 

[ComradeKoopa]

They could also poll the controller at 60 Hz and leave it at the original 50 ms.

Huh... That's interesting, I've never heard of that before! I didn't even know that was possible. With that on the table, it could very well still be 50ms as all estimations have been based on frame-by-frame analysis of footage. Either way I don't think it's a huge deal, but parity with the original is obviously optimal.

 

[Jersh]

Huh... That's interesting, I've never heard of that before! I didn't even know that was possible. With that on the table, it could very well still be 50ms as all estimations have been based on frame-by-frame analysis of footage. Either way I don't think it's a huge deal, but parity with the original is obviously optimal.

Yeah, tying inputs to frames 1:1 is a bit dated. It made enough sense in the earlier, single core CPU days where basically all code ran in a single loop (generally: read all inputs, compute how everything should react, draw the frame, repeat; this is why old games tend to slow down when they drop frames instead of just getting choppy) - especially when the CPU had a heavier hand in the rendering process - but that's not really the case in modern game engines. If you want subroutines to run at a faster rate than the frame rate, that's plenty doable.

Just a matter of whether they actually did, lol. It's fully possible it is 66.67 ms now.