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StarTopic Future Nintendo Hardware & Technology Speculation & Discussion |ST| (New Staff Post, Please read)

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Shubshub said:
It looks like it was officially released in 2022 in collaboration with Tencent, Also its region locked (As expected)



And according to this tweet this is the entire library
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Pretty darn certain that's not what that tweet says.

Here's a Reuters article from Jan 2021 saying it was released December 2019 - the article is about how Nintendo had shipped it's millionth Switch console to China.

 
bmfrosty said:
I just checked my 2015 one, and it's damn heavy. It died earlier this year, and I'm sad to say that the one I replaced it with has 2GB of RAM, and isn't nearly as good.

I should shuck it and see if there are any weights in it. It's in a metal case and way overbuilt.

Honestly, if Nintendo did a TV box out of Switch 2 hardware, I'd expect it to be built more like the NES or SNES mini.
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I actually didn't realize, but that's even more impressive in my opinion. It was $100 cheaper a full two years before the Switch even released.

I can totally see a Shield TV-esque box version being significantly cheaper than a handheld. So what if we get a dock that has both a SoC and networking as well as dock capabilities for both Switch and Switch 2?

I gave it some more thought and perhaps Nintendo not doing any sort of gimmick for the Switch 2 also makes sense because then crossgen games would have the exact same control scheme. Pro controllers would automatically work for Switch 2 too. The more I sit with the idea, the more it makes sense to me.

And I guess I could still see them adding cameras to Switch 2, but it definitely seems less likely in the scenario I presented.
 
BingBong43 said:
And I guess I could still see them adding cameras to Switch 2, but it definitely seems less likely in the scenario I presented.
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Cameras are interesting, but less interesting than they were on dedicated handheld.

I just realized that some versions of the Shield have a hard drive. Mine does not. Newer versions do not, but mine is a model that shares a case with ones that have a hard drive. I have a spudger and security screwdrivers, so it looks like it should be relatively easy to disassemble. I'll try and do it this weekend. Maybe I'll finally get around to installing hall effect joysticks in a pro controller too. I have 3 pro controllers that eventually got stick drift. I really hope that the Switch 2 has hall effect joysticks.
 
bmfrosty said:
Cameras are interesting, but less interesting than they were on dedicated handheld.

I just realized that some versions of the Shield have a hard drive. Mine does not. Newer versions do not, but mine is a model that shares a case with ones that have a hard drive. I have a spudger and security screwdrivers, so it looks like it should be relatively easy to disassemble. I'll try and do it this weekend. Maybe I'll finally get around to installing hall effect joysticks in a pro controller too. I have 3 pro controllers that eventually got stick drift. I really hope that the Switch 2 has hall effect joysticks.
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Oh without a doubt. If they don't improve the joysticks on the new device/controller I'll be deeply disappointed.

I guess I could still see them selling a new Switch with a camera without it negatively impacting forward compatibility. Camera use in games would be such a niche usecase anyway. Nintendo is likely the only major developer to use a gimmick like that regardless of how its implemented.
 
BingBong43 said:
Oh without a doubt. If they don't improve the joysticks on the new device/controller I'll be deeply disappointed.

I guess I could still see them selling a new Switch with a camera without it negatively impacting forward compatibility. Camera use in games would be such a niche usecase anyway. Nintendo is likely the only major developer to use a gimmick like that regardless of how its implemented.
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Now sure. A few years ago Microsoft insisted on it, and it was a mess.
 
My Tulpa said:
So until then, the best expectation is that this will be the low powered, low clocked DLSS machine that it seems to be. And therefore, no reason why not to keep the Lite/OLED targets for their big games for the next 5 years or so.
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Ya, that’s not going to happen.
Nintendo isn’t going to continue to design all of their big titles with the switch in mind and make two versions of every game.
The realistic scenario is there might be some cross platform titles, maybe, like some Kirby games or what not, but I’d bet my money more on anything released for switch 2 is exclusive to that system and then they’ll still make some titles here and there for base switch, which will be able to be played on switch 2 due to backwards compatibility.

I’m honestly not envisioning any dual releases, that might confuse buyers.
 
Lord Azrael said:
wtf did I just read in this thread. Feel absolutely matters, yes... to a device you'll actually be handling. A controller feeling cheap/light would be a bad. A console that sits under your TV, never to be touched? As long as the build quality isn't complete shit, no one's gonna care. Nintendo is a known quantity, ain't nobody out there dismissing them because their console is lighter. The size of Switch's contemporaries is one of the sore sticking points that people dunk on them for. Go back even just a few generations and consoles were a fraction of the weight.
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And it's also, in part, why I love the Switch so much. Yeah it's great as a portable system, but I also love it as a portable home console. I know that sounds insane, but I can just chuck everything in a bag and it won't take up much space. It's so damn convenient.
 
My Tulpa said:
I don’t think Nintendo is looking to make a 3D Mario that requires “more RAM” any time soon. I’m glad to be proven wrong, I just don’t see it for a variety of reasons I won’t bore you with repeating :p

As far as we know, from what we know about the new Switch hardware, is it’s everything necessary to have a 15W device with extremely low GPU/CPU clocks run 4k DLSS adequately given those restrictions.

Maybe I’m missing something, but that’s it.

Now, if the new hardware has something more…some new “gimmick” or hardware function that changes gameplay and can’t possibly work on the current Switches…then I’ll agree with you of making a new 3D Mario that can’t run on the OLED.

But we know nothing that suggests that.

So until then, the best expectation is that this will be the low powered, low clocked DLSS machine that it seems to be. And therefore, no reason why not to keep the Lite/OLED targets for their big games for the next 5 years or so.



“pro” in the sense of it being upgraded hardware to the ecosystem that extends the engagement in Switch software for more years than would have been otherwise without it? Yes.

I expect most of the big Nintendo published releases in 2027 to be playable on the Lite/OLED.

3rd party publishers? Who knows what they will do, and it really doesn’t matter.



No, I don’t think it will be marketed as either a “pro” or a “traditional successor” lol

Nintendo will have their own, unique way in showing us what the new hardware actually does for Switch gaming. But they will make it clear in some way that the current models will still get software indefinitely.



Well it certainly isn’t going to be called “Switch 2” :p

But I can’t wait for my reaction too!



3rd party devs aren’t abandoning the Switch. The types of multiplats you didn’t get in 2022 are the same types you didn’t get in 2018. Guess what? All those games in 2022/2023 that released on the XboxOne? They skipped the Switch. So it’s not really about the “power”. Publishers of certain games have made the calculation loooong ago if spending resources on porting a Switch version of their already constructed development time game worth it.

But again, I’m not talking about how major AAA 3rd party will treat the new hardware. They will make the poor decisions, for the most part, that they usually do when it comes to Nintendo machines.

I’m talking about how Nintendo will treat it.



I think to absolutely say Nintendo will treat this new hardware exactly like Sony treated their ps4->ps5 transition is absolutely bonkers.




I’ve read every single page of this thread. Most of the thread is the same back and forth countless of times :p



No it would be more than that. DLSS of BotW/TotK to 4k/60fps on this hardware would still allow compute power left over to push higher graphical IQ as well, like some light ray tracing for example.

The games will look much more impressive than JUST higher resolution and a steady 60fps frame rate.
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I'd genuinely love to see your version play out just for how mad it would be.

Just don't see a scenario where Nintendo develop a brand new system with a bespoke SoC with more power and capabilities than a PS4, only to unveil it and be like 'surprise bitches, here's the 'New' Nintendo Switch heh heh'.

Pro consoles can work, but not when the main system is in continuous end of life decline….unless you invent Pokémon at the tail end of course…!

Nintendo will want this console to sell 100m+ units. You won't get that with an iteration of the current Switch since a huge % of the audience wouldn't want to upgrade for the mostly same games but at better resolution.

I know you think this machine will just play Switch 1 games at a higher res but that would be a huge waste of what this hardware can do. It would be like having a PS4 Pro and only running PS3 games at 1440p/4K on it.

You mention Nintendo not wanting to make a Mario game using more RAM but they’ve done that almost every single time they release a new console.

Furthermore, the R&D to manufacture and put out this machine will have been huge. Another reason they can't just sell 'pro' numbers. This can’t just be another Switch option like the Lite or OLED.

Surely then this new system will be marketed as Nintendo's next generation console to ensure the market share is retained and people carry on buying Nintendo hardware and games for the next 7 years. I'm sure there will be a cross gen period and some older games will get patches (as with PS4 > PS5), but I also think there will be a surprising amount of exclusives right out of the gate.

If Nintendo go the route you think, we could be looking at a 3DS style launch with big sales, a big drop off and then a major adjustment being required as they try to convince people this is actually the next gen.
 
My Tulpa said:
By your estimations.

I think it’s erroneous to base everything on such a small sample size, even if it’s the holiday period.

You suspiciously ignore that the first half of this year, Switch sales were up YoY. Sure, the second half will be down, but not so much to wipe that out and end up as “disastrous”

You are looking at actual sell through numbers for only Oct and Nov in two territories and erroneously extrapolating final sell in numbers.

For example, Famitsu Switch sales for 2022 Q3 were about 1 million lower than actual shipment sales Nintendo posted for Q3 Japan in their financials.

If you do want to extrapolate the 35% drop in Japan holiday sales, and Japan still being ~25% of Switch sales as usual, you are looking at 6 million Switch sales for the holiday as the low end.

That would put Switch sales at about 13 million by the end of 2023 and then even with just 2 million for Q4 to hit 15 million. 2 million being the worst q4 ever for Switch.
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1. Nowhere did I say that this fiscal year as a whole or fiscal Q1+Q2 has been bad. I've only singled out fiscal Q3 2023/2024. Like I said, fiscal Q3 has always been the strongest for Nintendo in terms of unit sales for hardware and software outselling the other quarters. How do you think it will look on mainstream media and financial press when fiscal Q3 underperforms fiscal Q1+Q2, or when Nintendo revises their fiscal year target to 13M? You can refer to the stock movement in early February 2023.

2. When Nintendo sets targets/projections for hardware/software, they base it on their own data and set it on the belief that they have a high possibility of achieving it. Of course, there have been times in the past where they have either surpassed those targets or fell short. The targets are not meant to be taken lightly in the stock market, if a company falls shorts of a target, it is seen as a failure and a reason to dump the stock. Reverse happens if they surpass it. Furukawa saying "it will be hard to hit 15M" is just telling everyone to temper their expectations but the market doesn't care about the message or reason and will react accordingly to the numbers released.

3. I've only mentioned data that is publicly available because I can't quote the people that I usually speak to downstream who know how the Switch is moving in different markets. But they said the same thing. So it's not unreasonable to extrapolate the numbers on a global scale. Obviously, I don't think it's exactly 40% YOY down because I don't have the full numbers from every market, but not going to be surprised if it's +- a few percentage points when the fiscal earnings are out next month.
 
Shubshub said:
I wish people would be more hesitant or against having Digital Only consoles, It does nothing for the consumer you lose so much
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I'd be more against it if cartridge loading times weren't abysmal. If this isn't improved for the next system then I at least hope there's a way to transfer Switch 1 physical games into Switch 2 digital games.
 
0
theguy said:
32GB?! what the hell
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What makes a bit less sense to me is that it's also still LPDDR5 memory. That shit will drain battery in minutes. What's funny is that MSI laptops infamously are pretty badly optimized compared to other manufacturers, especially ASUS and Lenovo, so unless they did something insane with optimizing, I cannot recommend the MSI Claw less.

It'll also probably cost a very pretty penny, so yeah... just don't.
 
My Tulpa said:
I don’t think Nintendo is looking to make a 3D Mario that requires “more RAM” any time soon. I’m glad to be proven wrong, I just don’t see it for a variety of reasons I won’t bore you with repeating :p

As far as we know, from what we know about the new Switch hardware, is it’s everything necessary to have a 15W device with extremely low GPU/CPU clocks run 4k DLSS adequately given those restrictions.

Maybe I’m missing something, but that’s it.

Now, if the new hardware has something more…some new “gimmick” or hardware function that changes gameplay and can’t possibly work on the current Switches…then I’ll agree with you of making a new 3D Mario that can’t run on the OLED.

But we know nothing that suggests that.

So until then, the best expectation is that this will be the low powered, low clocked DLSS machine that it seems to be. And therefore, no reason why not to keep the Lite/OLED targets for their big games for the next 5 years or so.



“pro” in the sense of it being upgraded hardware to the ecosystem that extends the engagement in Switch software for more years than would have been otherwise without it? Yes.

I expect most of the big Nintendo published releases in 2027 to be playable on the Lite/OLED.

3rd party publishers? Who knows what they will do, and it really doesn’t matter.



No, I don’t think it will be marketed as either a “pro” or a “traditional successor” lol

Nintendo will have their own, unique way in showing us what the new hardware actually does for Switch gaming. But they will make it clear in some way that the current models will still get software indefinitely.



Well it certainly isn’t going to be called “Switch 2” :p

But I can’t wait for my reaction too!



3rd party devs aren’t abandoning the Switch. The types of multiplats you didn’t get in 2022 are the same types you didn’t get in 2018. Guess what? All those games in 2022/2023 that released on the XboxOne? They skipped the Switch. So it’s not really about the “power”. Publishers of certain games have made the calculation loooong ago if spending resources on porting a Switch version of their already constructed development time game worth it.

But again, I’m not talking about how major AAA 3rd party will treat the new hardware. They will make the poor decisions, for the most part, that they usually do when it comes to Nintendo machines.

I’m talking about how Nintendo will treat it.



I think to absolutely say Nintendo will treat this new hardware exactly like Sony treated their ps4->ps5 transition is absolutely bonkers.




I’ve read every single page of this thread. Most of the thread is the same back and forth countless of times :p



No it would be more than that. DLSS of BotW/TotK to 4k/60fps on this hardware would still allow compute power left over to push higher graphical IQ as well, like some light ray tracing for example.

The games will look much more impressive than JUST higher resolution and a steady 60fps frame rate.
Click to expand...
Would you admit that you were wrong if the new system is announced with first party games exclusive for it?
 
My Tulpa said:
I don’t think Nintendo is looking to make a 3D Mario that requires “more RAM” any time soon. I’m glad to be proven wrong, I just don’t see it for a variety of reasons I won’t bore you with repeating :p

As far as we know, from what we know about the new Switch hardware, is it’s everything necessary to have a 15W device with extremely low GPU/CPU clocks run 4k DLSS adequately given those restrictions.

Maybe I’m missing something, but that’s it.

Now, if the new hardware has something more…some new “gimmick” or hardware function that changes gameplay and can’t possibly work on the current Switches…then I’ll agree with you of making a new 3D Mario that can’t run on the OLED.

But we know nothing that suggests that.

So until then, the best expectation is that this will be the low powered, low clocked DLSS machine that it seems to be. And therefore, no reason why not to keep the Lite/OLED targets for their big games for the next 5 years or so.



“pro” in the sense of it being upgraded hardware to the ecosystem that extends the engagement in Switch software for more years than would have been otherwise without it? Yes.

I expect most of the big Nintendo published releases in 2027 to be playable on the Lite/OLED.

3rd party publishers? Who knows what they will do, and it really doesn’t matter.



No, I don’t think it will be marketed as either a “pro” or a “traditional successor” lol

Nintendo will have their own, unique way in showing us what the new hardware actually does for Switch gaming. But they will make it clear in some way that the current models will still get software indefinitely.



Well it certainly isn’t going to be called “Switch 2” :p

But I can’t wait for my reaction too!



3rd party devs aren’t abandoning the Switch. The types of multiplats you didn’t get in 2022 are the same types you didn’t get in 2018. Guess what? All those games in 2022/2023 that released on the XboxOne? They skipped the Switch. So it’s not really about the “power”. Publishers of certain games have made the calculation loooong ago if spending resources on porting a Switch version of their already constructed development time game worth it.

But again, I’m not talking about how major AAA 3rd party will treat the new hardware. They will make the poor decisions, for the most part, that they usually do when it comes to Nintendo machines.

I’m talking about how Nintendo will treat it.



I think to absolutely say Nintendo will treat this new hardware exactly like Sony treated their ps4->ps5 transition is absolutely bonkers.




I’ve read every single page of this thread. Most of the thread is the same back and forth countless of times :p



No it would be more than that. DLSS of BotW/TotK to 4k/60fps on this hardware would still allow compute power left over to push higher graphical IQ as well, like some light ray tracing for example.

The games will look much more impressive than JUST higher resolution and a steady 60fps frame rate.
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I've read what you say and I think I completely agree with you. Nintendo has stated multiple times that they're going to continue to support Switch, they won't be bound by the tradition notion of console life cycles, and that they intend for a "smooth transition" between devices.

At this point, I think Nintendo will release a standalone box/dock so that current Switch owners can supplement their device, while folks who want a new handheld will be able to buy both the hypothetical box/dock and handheld.

I think they'll drop the price of the OLED Switch to $299, the OG Switch will be $199, and the Switch Lite could go as low as $99-$149.

The Super Switch will be $349/$399 to start with a new set top box/dock peripheral being sold for $199 that works with both. This new box/dock will allow you to store more games, stream games to the TV with your device of choice in your hand, and possibly even come equipped with a camera for kinect-esque experiences. I also bet there will be some sort of special tech magic that only the Switch 2 can take advantage of in this hypothetical box/dock. Something that will really only get utilized by Nintendo when they're prepared to retire the OG Switch around 2027. At that point they can sell folks just a standalone handheld Switch 2 for less than the introductory package that had the dock to begin with.

I also have a feeling in my gut that the first iterations of the Super Switch will actually be lacking in things like screen quality and battery life. I bet we see just LCD models to start and as many corners cut on the quality of the device as possible to keep it affordable. We'll see a revamped OLED model two years after launch with perhaps a price drop across the family and maybe a retiring of the OG Switch and Lite. I am also of the mind that keeping the OG Switch around means that the Super Switch won't have any sort of joy-cons. It'll be a unified form factor that feels like a cross between a Switch OLED and a Switch Lite. I feel keeping the OG joy-cons around and the evidence that Nintendo updated their production lines for them somewhat recently means that they'll stick around as budget controllers that work for little hands and budget models. I also feel like ditching the joy-cons for Switch 2 will ultimately save on money and let them position is as feeling like an iterative upgrade from your wallet's perspective while still having the latest SoC and feature set.

I bet Nintendo intends to unveil a massive revamp to their eShop that all Switches can enjoy and I bet there will be a lot of fun new asymmetrical experiences possible with Switches working in tandem with the set top box and Switch 2.

I also had an epiphany the other day when playing the new Nicktoons Brawl with a friend over remote shareplay. I was on my PS4 and they were hosting on their PS5. It suddenly dawned on me halfway through the game that I was technically playing a PS5 game on my PS4. I then realized that if Nintendo were to release some sort of capable companion set top box, it would also possibly open up a lot of cool doors for letting OG Switch owners stream and play multiplayer Switch 2 titles from a docked Switch 2. That is a level of experiential marketing that I don't think I've ever seen before. Nintendo can entice their 132 million Switch owners to upgrade by letting them sample the better graphics on their hardware or at home whenever they're playing together.

Sorry to kind of go off on a tangent but I was discussing camera inclusion in the device way earlier before I think I saw others discussing it and now with everyone's predictions are in full swing, I kind of want to get mine all in one place to reference after the announcement. :D
 
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Mobius said:
Would you admit that you were wrong if the new system is announced with first party games exclusive for it?
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I think it'll be sort of a monkey's paw of both of what you're saying.

I bet Nintendo intends for all their major releases to come to Switch 1 for at least three more years, but I bet all of the Switch 2 "versions" come with features and capabilities that are only possible on the new device. Think of the differences between the super popular games from 2023 that released in their entirety on PS4/PS5/Xbox but had major graphical downgrades, forced loading in large areas, and entirely missing features in their (delayed) Switch release. I bet each game comes out for both but the Switch versions are so clearly lacking in either graphical fidelity, online social features, or flat out gimmick (think camera/scroll wheel or something) implementation that sure, you could technically play all the upcoming games on the OG Switch, but you'd absolutely be getting the inferior version. And I bet Nintendo will shove that fact into the face of Switch 1 owners at all opportunities to push them to upgrade to the latest handheld.

Edit - removed mentions of The Game That Shall Not Be Named. I hope my edit will suffice.
 
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BingBong43 said:
I think it'll be sort of a monkey's paw of both of what you're saying.
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We can very likely expect superior version of Switch 1 games on Switch 2 sure, but most here also expect some titles that won't release at all on Switch 1 like hopefully the next Mario Kart.

It would be sad to not see any games exploiting the full potential of the hardware due to any possible limitation of the Swicth 1 hardware during the "cross platform development phase".

There is more than just resolution and framerate.
 
pelusilla6 said:
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I love myself some 1-hour battery!

My Tulpa said:
So until then, the best expectation is that this will be the low powered, low clocked DLSS machine that it seems to be. And therefore, no reason why not to keep the Lite/OLED targets for their big games for the next 5 years or so.
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I would disagree with you... Low power devices are no longer necessarily weak or not capable as they used to be before. Some years ago, a 15W device was a super light gaming/web browsing sort of processor. Nowadays, we are seeing it reach decent 1080p AAA gaming on consumer-level devices. Switch 2's SoC being low clocked with nowaday's tech (not only DLSS, but all the other shader/mesh/etc stuff) might just be enough of a big jump between the first iteration.
My main point is that Nintendo sees the need for a more powerful device and likely no longer will hold itself with "gimmicks" alone, but use technology to improve the handheld/docked capabilities and use of that improved power in the design of their new games that eventually will not hold on the Switch 1. I do think they will have cross-platform games though, as is the case with a lot of PS4/PS5 and XONE/Series games that've been released in the past, but i think their huge blockbusters will focus on the new console.

If i were to exemplify by loosely predicting: First Pokémon game after the Switch 2 launch will be cross-platform, the ones after that won't (and will be fully design and developed around Switch 2's tech), etc. I don't think they will jump the wagon from Switch 1 too soon (that's 100m+ people willing to buy your new game!) but they will eventually cut it loose to allow for bigger experiences on their new console.

And they absolutely will still release Switch 1 games. The 3DS got an entire Kirby remaster (or port... not sure) and Metroid game, and that wasn't even backwards compatible to play on the Switch. Just two great games on their old, "EOL" device. We'll see!
 
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Mobius said:
We can very likely expect superior version of Switch 1 games on Switch 2 sure, but most here also expect some titles that won't release at all on Switch 1 like hopefully the next Mario Kart.

It would be sad to not see any games exploiting the full potential of the hardware due to any possible limitation of the Swicth 1 hardware during the "cross platform development phase".

There is more than just resolution and framerate.
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I agree with you.

But that's the thing, I think this strategy gives Nintendo at least three more years of Switch caliber games with MASSIVE graphical upgrades while also letting their development teams cook longer on bigger stuff for later in Switch 2's lifecycle.

We've seen industry wide that the era of massive AAA titles may be coming to an end. It's not sustainable, and Nintendo is better at development logistics than just about any other company in the game.

Having a three+ year crossgen period while building out an enticing current gen third party library and then coming out swinging with true Nintendo AAA Switch 2 exclusives starting in 2026 just makes sense on all fronts. It also gives Nintendo a lot of time to transition their focus to getting more NSO subscriptions which is where the real sustainable money will be.

Also whose to say the "gimmick" isn't the other main draw to the new device? Maybe it's modular and can have a detachable screen for DS/3DS games? Maybe it's got a camera and a bunch of AR/social features not possible on the Switch 1? I'm sure there is plenty it can do that Switch 1 won't be able to do, but that doesn't eliminate the possibility that all of Nintendo's major titles could still release on both devices for the foreseeable future.

Switch games with variable resolution immediately run better on more capable hardware and I think the possibilities of what could be made with Switch 1 titles running as scaffolding with this new device will still blow your mind. What comes to mind for me is the difference in quality between the Switch version of Dead by Daylight versus the PC/PS5 version. The Switch 2 will instantly be able to provide that level of graphical leap for the entire Switch library on day one. Don't get me wrong, there will absolutely be third party titles that only come to Switch 2 right out of the gate. I just am saying that Nintendo will keep targeting Switch 1 for years to come while letting Switch 2 make the games melt our faces with beauty anyway.
 
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BingBong43 said:
I agree with you.

But that's the thing, I think this strategy gives Nintendo at least three more years of Switch caliber games with MASSIVE graphical upgrades while also letting their development teams cook longer on bigger stuff for later in Switch 2's lifecycle.

We've seen industry wide that the era of massive AAA titles may be coming to an end. It's not sustainable, and Nintendo is better at development logistics than just about any other company in the game.

Having a three+ year crossgen period while building out an enticing current gen third party library and then coming out swinging with true Nintendo AAA Switch 2 exclusives starting in 2026 just makes sense on all fronts. It also gives Nintendo a lot of time to transition their focus to getting more NSO subscriptions which is where the real sustainable money will be.

Also whose to say the "gimmick" isn't the other main draw to the new device? Maybe it's modular and can have a detachable screen for DS/3DS games? Maybe it's got a camera and a bunch of AR/social features not possible on the Switch 1? I'm sure there is plenty it can do that Switch 1 won't be able to do, but that doesn't eliminate the possibility that all of Nintendo's major titles could still release on both devices for the foreseeable future.

Switch games with variable resolution immediately run better on more capable hardware and I think the possibilities of what could be made with Switch 1 titles running as scaffolding with this new device will still blow your mind. What comes to mind for me is the difference in quality between the Switch version of Dead by Daylight versus the PC/PS5 version. The Switch 2 will instantly be able to provide that level of graphical leap for the entire Switch library on day one. Don't get me wrong, there will absolutely be third party titles that only come to Switch 2 right out of the gate. I just am saying that Nintendo will keep targeting Switch 1 for years to come while letting Switch 2 make the games melt our faces with beauty anyway.
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I don't think that's how it works, targeting Switch 1 will inherently keep these games from melting faces as you said. That's the whole point of crossgen, limiting what can be made for the sake of a bigger audience... And even then, this theory honestly doesn't hold up when looking at the specs we've been talking about for years now. You just don't introduce a generational leap and a half to hold it back indefinitely with another device ten times as weak, only on a single department like it is the gpu.

If this is a Pro... then PS4 was a Pro over the PS3 as well. This idea just sounds that ridiculous when putting it on perspective with the specs already out there (fr look at the numbers, the people of fami figured them out for a reason).
 
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BingBong43 said:
Having a three+ year crossgen period while building out an enticing current gen third party library and then coming out swinging with true Nintendo AAA Switch 2 exclusives starting in 2026 just makes sense on all fronts. It also gives Nintendo a lot of time to transition their focus to getting more NSO subscriptions which is where the real sustainable money will be.
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What are the fronts it makes sense on? I keep seeing this idea of Switch 2 being a glorified Switch Pro thrown around, and ultimately I cannot wrap my head around that line of thinking. I'd really love to hear what someone else thinks, because transitioning focus to getting more NSO subs feels like a really weird thing to say they should focus on? I don't really understand how that relates to a crossgen period.
BingBong43 said:
Switch games with variable resolution immediately run better on more capable hardware and I think the possibilities of what could be made with Switch 1 titles running as scaffolding with this new device will still blow your mind. What comes to mind for me is the difference in quality between the Switch version of Dead by Daylight versus the PC/PS5 version. The Switch 2 will instantly be able to provide that level of graphical leap for the entire Switch library on day one. Don't get me wrong, there will absolutely be third party titles that only come to Switch 2 right out of the gate. I just am saying that Nintendo will keep targeting Switch 1 for years to come while letting Switch 2 make the games melt our faces with beauty anyway.
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I mean, the bolded is just completely incorrect, right? Without per-game patches, it would only max out at the upper limit that was already set, which is... Not going to be anywhere near the jump you're implying. And I sincerely doubt the entire Switch library will be getting patches.

I don't know, this just sounds like a really elaborate way for Nintendo to save me $400.
 
Estew said:
What are the fronts it makes sense on? I keep seeing this idea of Switch 2 being a glorified Switch Pro thrown around, and ultimately I cannot wrap my head around that line of thinking. I'd really love to hear what someone else thinks, because transitioning focus to getting more NSO subs feels like a really weird thing to say they should focus on? I don't really understand how that relates to a crossgen period.

I mean, the bolded is just completely incorrect, right? Without per-game patches, it would only max out at the upper limit that was already set, which is... Not going to be anywhere near the jump you're implying. And I sincerely doubt the entire Switch library will be getting patches.

I don't know, this just sounds like a really elaborate way for Nintendo to save me $400.
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it's a lot of unsubstantiated nonsense. these folks want a particular future and are trying to make the known info fit
 
Estew said:
What are the fronts it makes sense on? I keep seeing this idea of Switch 2 being a glorified Switch Pro thrown around, and ultimately I cannot wrap my head around that line of thinking. I'd really love to hear what someone else thinks, because transitioning focus to getting more NSO subs feels like a really weird thing to say they should focus on? I don't really understand how that relates to a crossgen period.

I mean, the bolded is just completely incorrect, right? Without per-game patches, it would only max out at the upper limit that was already set, which is... Not going to be anywhere near the jump you're implying. And I sincerely doubt the entire Switch library will be getting patches.

I don't know, this just sounds like a really elaborate way for Nintendo to save me $400.
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Oh of course with game patches sure. I just meant it would be capable of running games at much better graphical fidelity.

And I'm not saying that Switch 2 will just be a pro. I'm saying that Nintendo's strategy will be to essentially treat it like a pro and drip feed us content that works on both Switch and Switch 2 until they're ready to phase out Switch 1 completely. Only then will Nintendo themselves start releasing games that take full advantage of the Switch 2 hardware.

I fully think Nintendo will let third parties take the reigns on getting folks drawn to the device by making sure more upcoming releases also get their moment on Switch 2, but I also think Nintendo will still back support Switch 1 with all their major titles until at least 2026. I can see a major new Zelda, Mario, or Pokemon title in 2026/2027 being the first game to truly show us what Switch 2 can be done when Nintendo uses it to its full capability. I just don't expect Nintendo to launch the device with those experiences ready to go. I think they mean it when it will be a smooth transition.
 
BingBong43 said:
I agree with you.

But that's the thing, I think this strategy gives Nintendo at least three more years of Switch caliber games with MASSIVE graphical upgrades while also letting their development teams cook longer on bigger stuff for later in Switch 2's lifecycle.

We've seen industry wide that the era of massive AAA titles may be coming to an end. It's not sustainable, and Nintendo is better at development logistics than just about any other company in the game.

Having a three+ year crossgen period while building out an enticing current gen third party library and then coming out swinging with true Nintendo AAA Switch 2 exclusives starting in 2026 just makes sense on all fronts. It also gives Nintendo a lot of time to transition their focus to getting more NSO subscriptions which is where the real sustainable money will be.

Also whose to say the "gimmick" isn't the other main draw to the new device? Maybe it's modular and can have a detachable screen for DS/3DS games? Maybe it's got a camera and a bunch of AR/social features not possible on the Switch 1? I'm sure there is plenty it can do that Switch 1 won't be able to do, but that doesn't eliminate the possibility that all of Nintendo's major titles could still release on both devices for the foreseeable future.

Switch games with variable resolution immediately run better on more capable hardware and I think the possibilities of what could be made with Switch 1 titles running as scaffolding with this new device will still blow your mind. What comes to mind for me is the difference in quality between the Switch version of Dead by Daylight versus the PC/PS5 version. The Switch 2 will instantly be able to provide that level of graphical leap for the entire Switch library on day one. Don't get me wrong, there will absolutely be third party titles that only come to Switch 2 right out of the gate. I just am saying that Nintendo will keep targeting Switch 1 for years to come while letting Switch 2 make the games melt our faces with beauty anyway.
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Nintendo is not going years without true exclusives for Switch 2 while being cool with 3rd party doing it. Third party isn’t selling consoles. Nintendo, the console maker, needs to have exclusives games day 1. We buy their systems for their games. Everything else is secondary
 
Dark Cloud said:
Nintendo is not going years without true exclusives for Switch 2 while being cool with 3rd party doing it. Third party isn’t selling consoles. Nintendo, the console maker, needs to have exclusives games day 1. We buy their systems for their games. Everything else is secondary
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Again, I bet crossgen games still have plenty of compelling features and graphical improvements to make them exciting enough as Switch 2 games. I just think Nintendo will fully offer Switch 1 versions of these games for at least the next three years.
 
Nintendo here: so, we are manufacturing this brand new 400$ machine but don't worry, all the new games coming for it will be hampered until 2026 when we finally decide to ditch switch 1 for good! After that than yes, we will unleash the switch's 2 full potential! Tune in again in 2 years!
 
BingBong43 said:
Oh of course with game patches sure. I just meant it would be capable of running games at much better graphical fidelity.

And I'm not saying that Switch 2 will just be a pro. I'm saying that Nintendo's strategy will be to essentially treat it like a pro and drip feed us content that works on both Switch and Switch 2 until they're ready to phase out Switch 1 completely. Only then will Nintendo themselves start releasing games that take full advantage of the Switch 2 hardware.

I fully think Nintendo will let third parties take the reigns on getting folks drawn to the device by making sure more upcoming releases also get their moment on Switch 2, but I also think Nintendo will still back support Switch 1 with all their major titles until at least 2026. I can see a major new Zelda, Mario, or Pokemon title in 2026/2027 being the first game to truly show us what Switch 2 can be done when Nintendo uses it to its full capability. I just don't expect Nintendo to launch the device with those experiences ready to go. I think they mean it when it will be a smooth transition.
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I think Nintendo’s AA smaller games will occasionally be cross gen, but not there big AAA games other than maybe this year’s Pokémon game, I don’t think we will see a Pokémon game in 2025 unless they rush it out and it’s really bad and underwhelming generation 10, even worse if it’s cross gen. Like I think Metroid prime 4 and this years Pokémon will be cross gen and the last AAA Nintendo games on switch 1.
 
BingBong43 said:
Again, I bet crossgen games still have plenty of compelling features and graphical improvements to make them exciting enough as Switch 2 games. I just think Nintendo will fully offer Switch 1 versions of these games for at least the next three years.
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kinda hard to do that without making a new renderer that leverages the new features. part of the disdain that ray tracing got early on was for this reason
 
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I believe that Nintendo will deliver a graphical leap, but not as high as some expect, instead they will focus on running everything in 4K@60. While at least in the first few years, third parties will show the real potential of the Switch 2.
What I'm most looking forward to is seeing what Nintendo will deliver to us in terms of Ray Tracing, even though the power of the Hardware itself is not very great in this aspect, I believe that the classic Nintendo optimization will extract a lot from the T239's dedicated cores.
 
BingBong43 said:
Again, I bet crossgen games still have plenty of compelling features and graphical improvements to make them exciting enough as Switch 2 games. I just think Nintendo will fully offer Switch 1 versions of these games for at least the next three years.
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To be clear, what are you envisioning for "graphical improvements" in that scenario for the most part, beyond FPS improvements?
 
BingBong43 said:
Again, I bet crossgen games still have plenty of compelling features and graphical improvements to make them exciting enough as Switch 2 games. I just think Nintendo will fully offer Switch 1 versions of these games for at least the next three years.
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I think that might be the issue after all. Switch games are already behind what last gen consoles could do by a significant margin, what new "compelling features and graphical improvements" could make them seem exciting of being on Switch 2, other than jumping to last gen standards across the board...? What you're looking for ain't any of that, but a full on overhaul that only being exclusive can provide, just like UC4 and KSF did for their time. A few new textures and another lightning model aren't going to get you there, that's just how outdated their current pipeline is.
 
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dsm said:
Nintendo here: so, we are manufacturing this brand new 400$ machine but don't worry, all the new games coming for it will be hampered until 2026 when we finally decide to ditch switch 1 for good! After that than yes, we will unleash the switch's 2 full potential! Tune in again in 2 years!
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Have you seen the state of Pokemon lately? Mario Wonder wasn't any more graphically impressive than NSMBU. And TotK is no more beautiful than a 7 almost 8 year old game running on dated hardware. Nintendo has absolutely no problem letting graphics take a back seat. I think y'all are severely underestimating the wow factor that will happen once the entire Switch library gets brought up to modern standards and I bet Nintendo doesn't intend to charge as much for this as folks as suggesting. It will likely be THE primary draw to the new device.

Also yes, this device will absolutely be capable of experiences that aren't at all possible on the OG Switch. I'm not saying it won't be. I'm just saying, from a marketing, development, resource, and precedence sense...its likely Nintendo will lean hard on this whole crossgen situation until they are truly ready to retire the Switch 1. Those years will be spent making all the Switch 1 versions of games looks super unappealing compared to their Switch 2 counterparts while also including stuff like online or camera junk or whatever that Switch 1 simply can't do.

I'm just also saying Nintendo is saving the face melting 4k Mario Switch 2 exclusive for a few years yet. I'll happily be wrong but I don't think I am.
 
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LinkURL said:
I believe that Nintendo will deliver a graphical leap, but not as high as some expect, instead they will focus on running everything in 4K@60. While at least in the first few years, third parties will show the real potential of the Switch 2.
What I'm most looking forward to is seeing what Nintendo will deliver to us in terms of Ray Tracing, even though the power of the Hardware itself is not very great in this aspect, I believe that the classic Nintendo optimization will extract a lot from the T239's dedicated cores.
Click to expand...
Switch 2 ain't running 4K even with DLSS, let alone 60 FPS most of the time, the costs are still crazy high. Third parties showing off what the hardware can do would be a pretty poor image for their first party studios to have, it isn't even true for the other consoles.
 
darthdiablo said:
To be clear, what are you envisioning for "graphical improvements" in that scenario for the most part, beyond FPS improvements?
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Yes and no. I bet some games get their own definitive version on Switch 2 that couldn't possibly run on Switch 1 and then I bet there are some games that simply get the benefit of FPS and resolution improvements for being on the new hardware. I also think there could be instances where Switch 2 versions of games take advantage of whatever potential gimmick Nintendo has up their sleeve if there is one, leaving Switch 1 owners feeling like they're playing the inferior version even if it is just crossgen with minimal developmental differences.

Stuff like how BotW was wildly thought to be better with the benefit of the Wii U gamepad, I imagine Switch 2 will air on the side of getting these types of benefits in cross gen games. Better online networking. Better social feature implementation. The Switch 1 versions will be the ugly stepchildren that exist for folks who will ride out their Switch Lites and OLEDs for years to come.
 
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BingBong43 said:
Have you seen the state of Pokemon lately? Mario Wonder wasn't any more graphically impressive than NSMBU. And TotK is no more beautiful than a 7 almost 8 year old game running on dated hardware. Nintendo has absolutely no time letting graphics take a back seat.
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That's only because the Switch wasn't a jump over the Wii U as it is. They're both in the same ballpark, there isn't any more room to push visuals over the Wii U (and even then, games like Pikmin 4 definitely did). Nintendo platforms have been running at Wii U's ballpark for over a decade now, this will not be the case for the Switch 2, which is the jump that should matter to us right now.
 
Lancelot said:
Switch 2 ain't running 4K even with DLSS, let alone 60 FPS most of the time, the costs are still crazy high. Third parties showing off what the hardware can do would be a pretty poor image for their first party studios to have, it isn't even true for the other consoles.
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It has already been proven in the group that it would be possible to run DLSS in parallel to normal rendering, increasing only the input lag but keeping the frame rate high, and even so we have no real data on the rendering time of DLSS on the T239, only estimates which have already proven to be quite flawed. I really think it's very difficult for NVidia to build a SoC whose biggest asset is to use its proprietary upscale technology and still do it in such a way that it doesn't reach 4K@60.
 
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