All of these listings are shipments between Nvidia's offices, all either coming from or going to NVIDIA Graphics Private Limited in India, so that appears to be the common denominator.FYI if I'm understanding all this stuff correctly shipments of devkits showing up here does not necessarily mean they're being shipped to development partners. A lot of these shipments appear to be from one branch of Nvidia to another.
As for the T239’s codename, here’s the leaker speaking Kopite7kimi from the fact that the designation “Black Knight” is the “code name of the code name”. We recently encountered the term “Carpa X1” in relevant sources. This is apparently a hardware-based developer platform from Nvidia, which is already using the T239 SoC to take the first steps towards software development for the new chip.
* Hidden text: cannot be quoted. *
You might want to check my post above.FYI if I'm understanding all this stuff correctly shipments of devkits showing up here does not necessarily mean they're being shipped to development partners. A lot of these shipments appear to be from one branch of Nvidia to another.
Do you know is there any significance to it also being an X1 designation, or is that just for anything in the T000 line? Sorry if it's a stupid questionSorry, I was free associating and didn't show my work.
ARPA and CARPA (const ARPA) are AI language models. Nvidia Riva works with them pretty extensively. Not my domain at all, but it was just the first association my brain made between CARPA and Nvidia.
It's more likely that CARPA is a totally unrelated code name - like CAR in reference to it being descended from the automobile hardware - but my brain immediately tripped over that association
- CARPA X1 shipments are listed between July 28, 2022 and May 30, 2023
A.I should be the new gimmick. It is exploding right now. DLSS is A.I. We know that’s part of the new Switch. The marketing should lean into that.
They could also implement ChatGPT or similar Large Language Model (custom self-built or 3rd party) on an OS level for the new Switch. Or even build a game around it.
As LiC mentioned, X1 seems to be a version numbering scheme inside Nvidia, and it's otherwise coincidenceDo you know is there any significance to it also being an X1 designation, or is that just for anything in the T000 line? Sorry if it's a stupid question
Instructions unclear, I managed to get lost under 200 meters below the ice of Antarctica…Here's a summary of what I posted about the shipment listings across a few pages.
0: The original post, linking to a tweet from an unreliable Korean rumormonger that was screenshotting a publicly available website with a shipping/customs record related to T239, but providing no context for its apparent claim about T239 using 8nm.
1: Breaking down what the various terms mean in the T239 "test board" description I found while searching, and how it has nothing to do with the foundry/process node.
2: Responding to the screenshot of the "T239 SW development platform CARPA X1" description that was in the original tweet, which also has nothing to do with the foundry/process node, but is potentially interesting. I mentioned that someone else had already found this particular listing in September 2022, probably spurred by everybody discussing the Linux commits and the CPU cores.
3: Comparing to another listing for an RTX 4080 test board sent to the same company, confirming a 128-bit memory bus for T239 and also showing that test boards were being sent for some products even after they were publicly released. Clarifying why the original tweet probably wasn't supposed to be about about the process node anyway.
4: Identifying that all the shipments were between different branches of Nvidia, with all of them either coming from or going to their office in India. Showing that the dates for the "test boards" went from April 2022 to November 2022, and the dates for the "software development platform" went from July 2022 to May 2023, which matches up with the timeline we already inferred for physical production of T239 in 2022.
6: Clarifying how the part number for the test board is related to ones used for T234/Orin during its development.
7: Attempting to recap things because the discussion was already fragmented.
8: Explaining what a DDK (device driver kit) is as my guess for the "software development platform" shipments. Clarifying that Carpa is not the known codename of Nintendo's hardware or its motherboard.
9: Identifying devkit-related listings from during the Switch 1's development, and comparing to the T239 "software development platform" listing, suggesting that the latter could be shipments of devkits for Nintendo's new hardware.
10: I should probably make a hub post.
11: Yup.
12: You are here.
Nintendo’s version of Siri?
A Nintendo Siri would be called Navi.
HEY, LISTEN!
On topic, finally some news to break the less important discussions.
I played a little of the last Forza. That seemed like a good style. Multiplayer Kart Racing where you run around a bunch of landscape and find a bunch of random courses and join a bunch of random races.Mario Kart however doesn't need to be open world, I do think it's time though that it gets a Diddy Kong Racing/Crash Team Racing style storymode though...
People in their late 30s or early 40s are ‘elderly’ now? Wow.Just gonna say it, so many types of linear game for the most part are bloody woeful and are relics from the time movement on screen could only cover from left to right and up or down, which is why they seem to be more popular with elderly gamers (born ~1985 or earlier)
Nintendo's open-world Zelda formula is something that should keep being built up on whether it's true open-world or just open-zone to the point you may as well have been sucked into the screen because they've tapped into something genuinely special
If 10 years is retro, we're retro retro retro retro.People in their late 30s or early 40s are ‘elderly’ now? Wow.
/hits NES ‘reset’ button with walking stickIf 10 years is retro, we're retro retro retro retro.
Let's get you to bed, @PixelKnight.People in their late 30s or early 40s are ‘elderly’ now? Wow.
Someone suggested to me that it might actually be Nintendo's versioning scheme rather than Nvidia's. The examples I pointed out were all Nintendo boards for Switch 1 (albeit co-developed with Nvidia), and I believe there are other historical examples like CTR-MOTHER-X0/X1 and CTR-TEG2-PMIC-X2 for 3DS. So that could be another point in favor of Carpa being Nintendo's property.As LiC mentioned, X1 seems to be a version numbering scheme inside Nvidia, and it's otherwise coincidence
Thanks dearie. That new Star Wars ‘sequel’ is showing at the cinema tomorrow, isn’t it? The Empire Strikes Back? Maybe if my back doesn’t hurt we can go and spend a few pennies on popcorn! I do like that rogue Han Solo. He’s a card.Let's get you to bed, @PixelKnight.
NGL, that'd be pretty convenient to use if implemented correctly.A Nintendo Siri would be called Navi.
HEY, LISTEN!
On topic, finally some news to break the less important discussions.
A few more things about the shipping info. These websites want you to pay to access the data, but some more information can be searched up for free, and some redactions can be circumvented.
Most if not all of these T239 listings are being exported by NVIDIA Corporation and imported by NVIDIA Graphics Private Limited, which is Nvidia's branch in India. It's presumably due to customs requirements for India or just SOP for this specific company that these show up so consistently, while other kinds of Nvidia- or Nintendo-relevant shipping that one could imagine don't seem to.
If the dates are to be believed, Nvidia is frequently shipping them all kinds of stuff, including retail and test boards for products both before and after public release. For that reason, I don't think the dates are super meaningful, as seeing a test board or prototype in one of these listings demonstrably doesn't mean that product is currently still in development. But, just to document the relevant ones:
These dates match up well with the implied timeline of T239 sampling (or otherwise physically existing) around April 2022, per the interpretation of some Linux commits by oldpuck and others, and being finalized sometime that year.
- 699-12423-1099-TS1 shipments are listed between April 27, 2022 and August 20, 2022
- 699-12423-1099-TS2 shipment is listed on September 19, 2022
- 699-12423-1099-TS3 shipments are listed on October 31, 2022 and November 10, 2022
- CARPA X1 shipments are listed between July 28, 2022 and May 30, 2023
By the way, Carpa X1 has nothing to do with Tegra X1. Carpa is presumably a codename, but X1 is a common type of revision number which we know Nvidia uses (such as on the SDEV-CPU-X0 prototype board posted in this thread before; more Switch-related examples here).
So, what is Carpa? Based on the description of "T239 SW DEVELOPMENT PLATFORM CARPA X1," I speculated it could be another dev board with a DDK included. Well, the HSN code for the E2423 boards classifies them as basically just an electronic device in the "other" subcategory, but the code for Carpa puts it in the "video game consoles and machines" category. It would be tempting to assume this is related to Nintendo devkits, but Nvidia probably wouldn't primarily refer to those as a "T239 software development platform." I think it's possible it is another test board and/or DDK, and the HSN code is either just a bucket it got lumped into, or this could be for an actual Nvidia product such as a Shield TV. But even then, I feel like it would have a more identifiable codename and not mention T239 specifically in that case. So I'm not sure about this one.
One other difference to note is that the E2423 boards have China or the United States as their country of origin, while the Carpa shipments have Japan (all have India as the destination). The listings from China appear to be from NVIDIA Singapore Pte Limited, which is evidently in Hong Kong, not Singapore. The United States and Japan COO listings are supposedly both exported by NVIDIA Corporation.
The Wii U, PS4, and Xbox One, can, in traditional terms, be considered retro. Though after the leap between the 5th and 6th generations, the term "retro" becomes harder to reconcile as the years go on with diminishing returns in graphics.If 10 years is retro, we're retro retro retro retro.
Sure, to be more precise I could have said there were 3 listings in July 2022 and 3 in May 2023. Those are still shipments "between" the dates I said, though.Just wanted to clarify, you say:
But as far as I can find, those are the only dates of the shipments (if these free websites are giving accurate and complete records that is). Of course my assumption could be wrong.
- CARPA X1 shipments are listed between July 28, 2022 and May 30, 2023
海关数据_航运数据_提单数据_关单数据_纽佰德数据
纽佰德数据系统三天更新一次,包含美国海关数据、印度海关进出口数据、俄罗斯海关数据在内的总共超过60个数据源。数据分为关单数据,提单数据、航运数据、一带一路国家贸易数据与欧亚大陆运输数据。www.nbd.ltd
You can also search for T239 on the same site, and within the 10 results (which I assume are the 10 most recent entries) you get 2 that are Carpa X1 and the rest are unrelated, except one (maybe/probably). I don't know what you can infer from this, but I just thought I would throw it out there.
And then here are the (again, assuming) most recent listings on that site as of July 31st for Nvidia Corporation: https://www.nbd.ltd/trader/info/NBDD3Y526544502
But it's just Jetson, Orin related stuff.
Start with this post that begin the recent discussion. "Connor" (unreliable) posted a screenshot in a tweet. I searched for parts of text in the screenshot, leading to a shady shipment aggregator website where "Connor" got the screenshot from. So LiC was trying various things with the search on that website.Where is this information coming from? Did I miss something?
Where does "T239 SW DEVELOPMENT PLATFORM CARPA X1" appear?
Sure, to be more precise I could have said there were 3 listings in July 2022 and 3 in May 2023. Those are still shipments "between" the dates I said, though.
Because of the 10 result limit, you have to use more specific queries. If you search for 699-12423-1099-TS1, then TS2 and TS3 separately, you can see the full date range I described for the E2423 test boards. You can also use the importer and exporter filters to determine who the shipping parties really are, even though they're redacted when the results are returned.
I also cross-referenced a lot with the other site that the first listing was found on, which has similar limitations without paying for the info, but between the two of them you can determine more about the listings.
There's a lot of junk and unrelated things that will come up on these sites, especially when using short and non-unique strings like "T239." So anyone searching should bear that in mind. And at the same time the results clearly only represent a fraction of what these companies are actually shipping, hence why I keep calling out the common denominator of the India office for NVIDIA Graphics Private Limited.
1X20'TOTAL: 2800 PIECES (10 PALLETS) NEW RINGFIT ADVENTURE HS CODE: 95045090 FREIGHT PREPAIDSCAC : PWTD H AMS BL NO : MIA230801201
Amen.Please take these conversations elsewhere. I get that sometimes we go off-topic and I'm cool with that, but I missed actual hardware news which was covered in multiple posts, because of a multi-day conversation about Smash's roster, and a second thread about open world games.
Talking about how Nintendo might utilize this hardware in the future, totally valid, but at the point at which the software conversation is unrelated to the hardware underneath, is dominating the conversation, and is making the actual thread hard to follow it has gone overboard.
I'm not mad, I'm not calling anyone out specifically. Just quoting the people who recently posted. You're all great - in fact, that's part of the problem. I don't want to ignore any of you, but it's making the thread unfollowable.
Good post to use bookmark feature for.Here's a summary of what I posted about the shipment listings across a few pages.
0: The original post, linking to a tweet from an unreliable Korean rumormonger that was screenshotting a publicly available website with a shipping/customs record related to T239, but providing no context for its apparent claim about T239 using 8nm.
1: Breaking down what the various terms mean in the T239 "test board" description I found while searching, and how it has nothing to do with the foundry/process node.
2: Responding to the screenshot of the "T239 SW development platform CARPA X1" description that was in the original tweet, which also has nothing to do with the foundry/process node, but is potentially interesting. I mentioned that someone else had already found this particular listing in September 2022, probably spurred by everybody discussing the Linux commits and the CPU cores.
3: Comparing to another listing for an RTX 4080 test board sent to the same company, confirming a 128-bit memory bus for T239 and also showing that test boards were being sent for some products even after they were publicly released. Clarifying why the original tweet probably wasn't supposed to be about about the process node anyway.
4: Identifying that all the shipments were between different branches of Nvidia, with all of them either coming from or going to their office in India. Showing that the dates for the "test boards" went from April 2022 to November 2022, and the dates for the "software development platform" went from July 2022 to May 2023, which matches up with the timeline we already inferred for physical production of T239 in 2022.
5: Clarifying how the part number for the "test board" is related to ones used for T234/Orin during its development.
6: Attempting to recap things because the discussion was already fragmented.
7: Explaining what a DDK (device driver kit) is as my guess for the "software development platform" shipments. Clarifying that Carpa is not the known codename of Nintendo's hardware or its motherboard.
8: Identifying devkit-related listings from during the Switch 1's development, and comparing to the T239 "software development platform" listing, suggesting that the latter could be shipments of devkits for Nintendo's new hardware.
9: I should probably make a hub post.
10: Yup.
11: You are here.
Sure, it's possible there were anywhere between 2 and 6 shipments. Given the nature of the data, I would not put a lot of stock in any specific patterns or details, just the broad strokes. And on that note, the dates are mostly important to know how early some hardware may have physically existed, which is at least July 2022 for Carpa.True. But I wonder that even though there are 6 records, there were only 2 actual shipments. There's typically an excessive amount of paperwork for this stuff and having multiple/duplicate listings for the same shipment would not surprise me. And the fact that the first listing for both is two days prior to the others has me suspecting that could be the case. Not that it really matters at all. I don't really know why I'm nitpicking lol sorry. Carry on.
I'd rather it be done on a modified Sun/Moon or Sword/Shield engine since -- a lot of the original game was like "look at what we're doing with the camera" but that's me.I would rather it not exist at all than be... that.
HD2D is fate worse than vaporware.What do you mean by that?
HD2D is on the same level as UE demos with Nintendo characters for me. HD2D looks just ok, post processing does wonders for some people though.HD2D is fate worse than vaporware.
Please take these conversations elsewhere. I get that sometimes we go off-topic and I'm cool with that, but I missed actual hardware news which was covered in multiple posts, because of a multi-day conversation about Smash's roster, and a second thread about open world games.
Talking about how Nintendo might utilize this hardware in the future, totally valid, but at the point at which the software conversation is unrelated to the hardware underneath, is dominating the conversation, and is making the actual thread hard to follow it has gone overboard.
I'm not mad, I'm not calling anyone out specifically. Just quoting the people who recently posted. You're all great - in fact, that's part of the problem. I don't want to ignore any of you, but it's making the thread unfollowable.
Its the equivalent of precambian to the modern gaming worldPeople in their late 30s or early 40s are ‘elderly’ now? Wow.
not even any otherworldly demons beyond human comprehension?Instructions unclear, I managed to get lost under 200 meters below the ice of Antarctica…
send help
All this ice and nothing to climb
I feel attackedIts the equivalent of precambian to the modern gaming world
I agree with you 100%. It drives me up a wall to see people coming in here every few pages and asking the rest of us to summarize what's been going on because they can't be arsed to catch themselves up. That, plus the number of circular conversations spurred by people posting the same news repeatedly (again, because they can't be bothered to keep up), has really made this thread kind of a chore.The off-topic discussions are one thing, but the issues are also caused by a posters who do not bother to keep up with the discussion who then circle back to things that have already been discussed or debunked.
If things are quiet, we can let them be quiet. You don’t have to share random clickbait YouTube videos just because no one else has. You don’t have to start tagging Nate just because he hasn’t posted in a while. And you don’t have to drum up off-topic conversations to keep people engaged in the thread.
FTFY. I bookmark any technical analysis/speculation from this thread. Always a good read.Goodpostthread to use bookmark feature for.
Would the CARPA device have been going to India for testing? Or would Nvidia India do some other sort of devkit assembly pre-Foxconn taking over as a part of regular manufacturing?Sure, it's possible there were anywhere between 2 and 6 shipments. Given the nature of the data, I would not put a lot of stock in any specific patterns or details, just the broad strokes. And on that note, the dates are mostly important to know how early some hardware may have physically existed, which is at least July 2022 for Carpa.
The problem is there's only a very small handful of people here in any way qualified or with the expertise to meaningfully speculate and give an impression of what the NG will be like, there's an even smaller number of people with inside connections to provide any kind of significant updates, and so far none have really been significant or lead to any conclusions that weren't already being formed almost two years ago with the gigaleakThere is barely any threshold what stupid rumor is being floated here. And since too many people respond, this isn't even remedied by ignoring those certain individuals. This thread is Famiboard's containment zone for anything that alleviates boredom as long as actual news, i.e. Nintendo announcing stuff, is in short supply.
These shipments are all infrequent and often single-digit quantity, never more than double-digit. Whatever they're for is not part of a supply chain or manufacturing process. I think that RMA/defect analysis is a possible reason for some of the late shipments of already released products. Other more current products could be sent for validation, or use in software development, writing automated tests, who knows. But the test boards and maybe-devkit units being sent are already as "complete" as they're going to get when they're loaned out to the India office.Would the CARPA device have been going to India for testing? Or would Nvidia India do some other sort of devkit assembly pre-Foxconn taking over as a part of regular manufacturing?
The cinema? Don’t you mean the “talkies”Thanks dearie. That new Star Wars ‘sequel’ is showing at the cinema tomorrow, isn’t it? The Empire Strikes Back? Maybe if my back doesn’t hurt we can go and spend a few pennies on popcorn! I do like that rogue Han Solo. He’s a card.
To me it's an issue of too many people treating this thread as a chatroom instead of practicing more proper forum etiquette. I can understand being daunted by something like 10 new pages to read but it should be common courtesy to at least skim the last few pages before asking what people are talking about. Think about posting for posterity.I agree with you 100%. It drives me up a wall to see people coming in here every few pages and asking the rest of us to summarize what's been going on because they can't be arsed to catch themselves up. That, plus the number of circular conversations spurred by people posting the same news repeatedly (again, because they can't be bothered to keep up), has really made this thread kind of a chore.
And I say this as someone who rarely contributes anything meaningful.