Rumour Metroid Prime remaster/remake planned for 2022 (UPDATE: new rumor from Jeff Grubb, see threadmarks)

[Nabbit]

I'm a sensitive soul and usually stick to colorful E-rated games, so I prefer the low-fi Metroid and Metroid II to pretty much every other Metroid I've played. The rest are more intense and violent compared to the games I usually play. Granted the NES and GB entries are plenty creepy but the modern games are a bit too visceral to me.

Heck my favorite Metroid game these days is probably the under-appreciated attraction in Nintendo Land.

 

[Serif]

Playing Dread right now and it just sunk in that due to the gap between titles - its technically the first HD Metroid game. And still the only one. I realize I am very late to this realization lmao

Makes me further appreciate the direction they went with, I love the huge zoomouts when Samus approaches a tram and she occupies a tiny portion of the screen, and those fucking beautiful map and save rooms.

 

[TheSpaceBetween]

Yeah! The whole album is done conceptually as if it were a near-2 hour long Metroid movie score, essentially - almost every album track uses multiple pieces from throughout the series and blends them together into hybrid electronic/orchestral remixes that are just really well done.

Edge of the Labyrinth is a personal favorite of mine.

While I was listening I was just thinking how it'd be perfect for a Metroid movie. Another dream, heh.

 

[Psyborg]

I too, would like to be told, pretty definitely, that Metroid Prime Remaster is going to be a holiday title.

#reassurance

 

[Phendrift]

I feel like a lot of concessions were made just trying to reinvent Metroid somewhat and make it financially successful enough to push Dread and other future games again. And sadly that meant adding iconic things (oh no it's Ridley!) over being more respectful to the source themes (oh no did I fuck up...?)

I actually applaud them for not putting Ridley in Dread because I thought it was a surefire thing. Like I would’ve thought it would be something they’d market the shit out of especially after Ridley was in fucking 30 million selling Smash Bros as a playable character. I would not have been surprised at all to see some big Samus Ridley fight hyped up in a trailer

Yeah they put Kraid but I actually thought that was good. Evening the scales a bit between him and Ridley.

I don’t mind the series having returning iconic monsters - it kinda needs that iconography considering it doesn’t rely on side characters a lot. But it was just REALLY overbalanced in favor of Ridley

Bring back Crocomire!

 

[Phendrift]

Also on the subject of OSTs - I’ve been thinking.

The reason I think prefer the OSTs of Fusion, Other M and Dread less is that they’re more dissonant and less melodic because those games all emphasize horror.

Yes, all Metroid games have a sense of danger, but those three really double down on the space horror aspects.

Lots of the Prime trilogy actually emphasizes natural beauty - yes you’re isolated and alone, but that allows you to take in the environment. There’s moments where you can take a breather in between the Dread. And that’s where those melodic, ethereal tracks come in.

I don’t really know if that makes sense. And I still do think Dread’s OST being underwhelming does have to do in part with the fact that it was simply new composers. But I do recognize that in general - the horror emphasizing games in the series have been my musical disappointments

I hope prime 4 isn’t full-on all tense dread all the time. Let me soak in the natural flora and fauna, uncover the remains of an ancient civilization.

Hopefully that makes sense lol

 

[ElisaurusWrecks]

I actually applaud them for not putting Ridley in Dread because I thought it was a surefire thing. Like I would’ve thought it would be something they’d market the shit out of especially after Ridley was in fucking 30 million selling Smash Bros as a playable character. I would not have been surprised at all to see some big Samus Ridley fight hyped up in a trailer

Yeah they put Kraid but I actually thought that was good. Evening the scales a bit between him and Ridley.

I don’t mind the series having returning iconic monsters - it kinda needs that iconography considering it doesn’t rely on side characters a lot. But it was just REALLY overbalanced in favor of Ridley

Bring back Crocomire!

But Croc is so cute, especially all his lil mini Crocs. I don't wanna murder him again, he wasn't even guarding Tourian he was just... There, lmao

 

[NintendoPrime]

The only thing that I find remotely interesting here is that if Jeff is right, and he's not always right (still waiting on TP/TWW HD) - but let's say this one is happening.

They can't be waiting until September to announce it, can they? I know I know, they basically did that with Age of Calamity. But it would feel strange to not give us that news sooner, no?

 

[Zalman]

The only thing that I find remotely interesting here is that if Jeff is right, and he's not always right (still waiting on TP/TWW HD) - but let's say this one is happening.

They can't be waiting until September to announce it, can they? I know I know, they basically did that with Age of Calamity. But it would feel strange to not give us that news sooner, no?

They could wait. Let's say it's releasing in early November. That would give them two full months if there's a Direct in early September.

If it's an October game, they're cutting it a bit close. But we've seen Nintendo do that as well.

Bottom line is, we have no idea. They could also decide to push it to early next year. As much as I would like to play it soon, that's honestly a scenario I would consider if I were them, especially if Bayonetta 3 is also still releasing in 2022. October is already packed with high-profile third-party titles.

 

[xghost777]

I like that between the last time I looked at this thread and now it just morphed into a general Metroid appreciation thread.

 

[Pennington]

Metroid Prime and Metroid Dread are almost polar opposites in interpreting the style of a Metroid game. For example Prime is slow, Dread your only movement option is running! How will the new fans garnered from Dread react to a game like Prime?

 

[Aurc]

Metroid Planets Zebeth map cleared! Not the greatest end result, but it was a ton of fun! Definitely going to do another pass on hard, and then tackle the other maps. Truly brilliant work by VacantShadeGames. Thanks again for reminding me of this project's existence, @ElisaurusWrecks!

I really liked the changes to physics, improved animations, remixes of the classic themes, and especially the quality of life stuff, like the addition of a map (this was huge, obviously), holding a button to select missiles (like in the later games), and being able to respawn at the start of an area, in case you want to leave it quickly. I think there's only one gripe I ended up having with it, and it's very minor: the remixed escape theme featured here isn't based on the full length version from NES Metroid, but the Zero Mission version, which cuts out part of the song (the triumphant bit, I'm sure you know what I mean).

Yeah, I hear you. All of the complaints about the originals are totally justified. They're old games that were a product of their time in many ways. They're not very playable by today's standards, even though they were incredibly influential. Unless someone is a big fan of games of that era I would never recommend someone new to the series try them out. There's something about them that just puts me in a trance though. The simple graphics and analogue synth soundtracks are able to convey a certain mood and ambience that just draws me in. After The Tunnel, Metroid 2's sound track is mostly bleeps and blops and sound effects, but I love it. I'm really into industrial noise type music. I feel like the first two games especially had strong horror vibes. The environments were really meant to feel "alive" and it's amazing that they accomplished that so fully with the limitations of technology at the time.

I can easily clear both games without too much trouble these days... The initial playthrough's were pretty brutal for me (I think I beat them for the first time in the late 00's...), but once you get the hang of it it's not that bad. I even drew myself maps at the time haha. Good times.

As someone who got into Metroid with the GBA games as a kid, yeah, I've definitely always found it rough to go back to the OG 1 and 2. That gap in my Metroid fan experience has always bothered me a little, but only now am I getting around to rectifying that, all these years later. Hunters was another game I always meant to play, and I finally did get around to playing it last year!! ...But the game was pretty poopy, unfortunately. I don't think I'll feel that way about Metroid 2, thankfully.

The pitch black backgrounds of NES Metroid really do go a long way in making Zebes feel dark, cavernous, and foreboding, in a way that isn't quite present in Zero Mission, so I do understand why you prefer the original. That element, plus everything else working in tandem with it (art direction, sound design, etc.) create a whole different vibe than the remake I grew up with. I can respect your preference for the originals.

Oh wow, awesome! Glad you heard about it too! The whole album is just amazing, been listening to it over and over since early downloads came out. Can't wait to see what the Dread album is going to be like - I really think he has potential to breathe life into some of those themes.

I too have the physical stuff coming and can't wait for the CD to get here. I also recently got Lacey Johnson's Next Mission CD delivered and it pretty much has just constantly shared a spot in my car's CD player alongside Frank Klepacki and Tiberian Sons' Command and Conquer tribute album. Pretty soon I'll fill the entire 6 disk changer with pure video game goodness!

Yeah, I'm really looking forward to Sam's take on the Dread OST! He'll surely be able to do something neat with it. Thank you for mentioning Lacey Johnson's Next Mission, as well -- that's an album I'd not yet heard of! A quick Google search later, I'm digging what I'm hearing.

 

[Aostia82]

The most exciting part of prime HD being released this year is that we are finally getting a Prime 4 trailer too, right?

 

[Kaka]

The most exciting part of prime HD being released this year is that we are finally getting a Prime 4 trailer too, right?

Your post automatically made me think of that Anakin and Padme meme lol

 

[YolkFolk]

Metroid Prime and Metroid Dread are almost polar opposites in interpreting the style of a Metroid game. For example Prime is slow, Dread your only movement option is running! How will the new fans garnered from Dread react to a game like Prime?

The same as those going from Super to Prime.

 

[Aether]

Oh yeah. A metroid with the playability of the other 2D metroid but the opressive feeling of the first 2 would be a dream. but we just never will get a dark metroid. Heck, Dread was kind of marketed as a "horror" entry in the series, and it was the least frightening for me since Fusion.

The early ones had this feeling of being lost at an alien planet, Fusion hat that feeling thanks to the SA-X. The emmies where just toys compared to that, and the world and its music did not comvey "dread" to me.

Axiom Verge came closer, but it was kinda more in the scifi / eldritch kinda way, less in the alien kinda way. And it sticked to close to NES aestetics for me.

 

[Joe]

I like that between the last time I looked at this thread and now it just morphed into a general Metroid appreciation thread.

I would love to have a general Metroid thread tbh

 

[Aurc]

I would love to have a general Metroid thread tbh

I already mentioned this in post #359, but I'll be posting the Metroid Community ST soon. I just want to put a bit of effort into the OP. That's the only thing holding it up.

 

[Joe]

I already mentioned this in post #359, but I'll be posting the Metroid Community ST soon. I just want to put a bit of effort into the OP. That's the only thing holding it up.

I'm excited for it!

 

[Crusters]

Metroid Prime and Metroid Dread are almost polar opposites in interpreting the style of a Metroid game. For example Prime is slow, Dread your only movement option is running! How will the new fans garnered from Dread react to a game like Prime?

Prime, other m, and federation forces proved the heart of the series, the thing that absolutely must be maintained to feel like a Metroid game instead of a game using the Metroid brand, is not the moment to moment mechanics, but the world and progression design.

Prime had none of the control and movement of the classic entries, it's conversion to 3d even completely changed how samus moved, to a much weighter character. However it's world and progression design was maintained, and the game was held in high esteem.

Other M, even with it's restrictive control, did a very good job of translating the familiar 2d Metroid control and movement to 3d. (Compared to Prime, it's not a contest). It's level and world design was a mimicry of traditional Metroid, but fans familiar with the series very quickly caught on to it just being a veneer. And it wasn't particularly held in high esteem.

Federation forces had the mechanics and movement of the prime series. But again, it's world and level design were not maintained from Metroid, and it was not held in particularly high esteem.

The moment to moment mechanics can be flexible, as long as they are well implemented for what they are, people will adapt. The world and progression design, is the heart of the series, and has to be nailed.

What will make or break prime 4, won't be the movement and mechanics. It will be how well they handle the world and progression design. The loop of exploring ti find a new power up, and using that power up to explore newer areas and find the next power up.

 

[TheSpaceBetween]

The most exciting part of prime HD being released this year is that we are finally getting a Prime 4 trailer too, right?

They have to at least acknowledge it again. I really hope it's something more than just, "We're still working on it, we promise!"

 

[Aurc]

What I'm hoping for the most out of Prime 4, is for Samus to control exceptionally well, both in terms of her mobility, and combat prowess. I think Dread has the best controls and feel of any game in the series, so if Retro could somehow convey Samus's power and speed in the way MercurySteam did (but obviously in a manner more suited to the first-person adventures that the Prime games are), I'd be really stoked about that. The standard for first-person controls has shifted a bit since Corruption, with games like Titanfall 2, Doom Eternal, Halo Infinite, etc. reemphasizing the joy of deftly navigating a space using dashing, sliding, wall running, grapple hooking, and so on. Basically, things that just so happen to be perfectly suited to Samus's character. She's already capable of all of the above (praise Dread for taking the initiative to expand on her movement!), with the exception of wall running... and if they ever give her the ability to do that, I'll flip my lid, in the best way possible. It's just a matter of interpreting the game feel we love in the 2D games, but for the 3D / first-person space.

 

[Crusters]

What I'm hoping for the most out of Prime 4, is for Samus to control exceptionally well, both in terms of her mobility, and combat prowess. I think Dread has the best controls and feel of any game in the series, so if Retro could somehow convey Samus's power and speed in the way MercurySteam did (but obviously in a manner more suited to the first-person adventures that the Prime games are), I'd be really stoked about that. The standard for first-person controls has shifted a bit since Corruption, with games like Titanfall 2, Doom Eternal, Halo Infinite, etc. reemphasizing the joy of deftly navigating a space using dashing, sliding, wall running, grapple hooking, and so on. Basically, things that just so happen to be perfectly suited to Samus's character. She's already capable of all of the above (praise Dread for taking the initiative to expand on her movement!), with the exception of wall running... and if they ever give her the ability to do that, I'll flip my lid, in the best way possible. It's just a matter of interpreting the game feel we love in the 2D games, but for the 3D / first-person space.

I feel retros big litmus test is going to be getting rid of the spider ball track and the restrictive crutches of similar ilk, Spider ball tracks, wall jump pads, etc, and replacing these and as many other lock and key/open or closed progression gates as possible, with actual analog progression, like being able to jump farther, or morph ball bosting off of ramps. Things that just work and players can actually use, instead of being a glorified light switch/lock and key.

That and toning the puzzle boss aspect way the heck down, and having actual fights.

I'm pretty confident this will be met with flying colors, as the ability to do these complex kind of movement and ability systems has come A very very very long way since gen 6, and even gen 7.....

And the people most responsible for both these aspects that became more and more pronounced as the series went on, left retro to form armature, where these aspects are front and center in full force in games like the 2d Arkham.

 

[Zeal543]

What I'm hoping for the most out of Prime 4, is for Samus to control exceptionally well, both in terms of her mobility, and combat prowess. I think Dread has the best controls and feel of any game in the series, so if Retro could somehow convey Samus's power and speed in the way MercurySteam did (but obviously in a manner more suited to the first-person adventures that the Prime games are), I'd be really stoked about that. The standard for first-person controls has shifted a bit since Corruption, with games like Titanfall 2, Doom Eternal, Halo Infinite, etc. reemphasizing the joy of deftly navigating a space using dashing, sliding, wall running, grapple hooking, and so on. Basically, things that just so happen to be perfectly suited to Samus's character. She's already capable of all of the above (praise Dread for taking the initiative to expand on her movement!), with the exception of wall running... and if they ever give her the ability to do that, I'll flip my lid, in the best way possible. It's just a matter of interpreting the game feel we love in the 2D games, but for the 3D / first-person space.

Prime is not trying to be an FPS and it benefits more from being a more slow, methodical game rather than a fast paced one. Focus on speed and action is one of the reasons why the level design in 2D metroids deteriorated after super (and why prime 3's wasn't as good as 1/2s)

 

[ILikeFeet]

That and toning the puzzle boss aspect way the heck down, and having actual fights.

I don't think the gunplay in Metroid Prime has been the best, but given that it's never been a proper fps, that's sort of excusable. don't think it'll be alright nowadays. as mentioned, there are many games that do both exploration and shooting very well (mainly because the shooting was the focus).

improving the shooting might be a double edged sword though. not good enough and it's derided as a weak link; too good and people want more of it and you have the risk of designated combat rooms instead of something more natural

 

[Goht]

Since we're doing Metroid General Discussion I wanted to share this 3D printed Samus magnet I did a while back. Bonus Duck Hunt magnet.

I'd love to fill up my fridge with Nintendo characters but I'm usually missing at least one color to make it work.

 

[Kevin]

The only thing that I find remotely interesting here is that if Jeff is right, and he's not always right (still waiting on TP/TWW HD) - but let's say this one is happening.

They can't be waiting until September to announce it, can they? I know I know, they basically did that with Age of Calamity. But it would feel strange to not give us that news sooner, no?

I think if Metroid Prime remaster is coming this year, it will have to be announced soon. I guess the current speculation is a July General Direct. I remain uncertain to say the least. I figured either July or September at this point. September feels to late to announce a Metroid Prime remaster if it's coming this year unless maybe if they slot it into November/December and do a bunch of blow out media coverage for it. Could work!

As for the much desired TP/TWW HD ports, at this point I don't think they are coming or planned for Switch as it stands right now. I think it's possible Nintendo could release them in 4K/60 on the new hardware eventually which would help justify their $60 each price point you know they will want to go for but I don't see those coming this year and probably not next year either. Maybe 2024. This is with the assumption that the Switch Pro/4K model launches next Spring with the sequel to Breath of the Wild in the Spring. Those Zelda HD Remasters would likely come a year later if not further out. All speculation of course!

 

[Crusters]

I don't think the gunplay in Metroid Prime has been the best, but given that it's never been a proper fps, that's sort of excusable. don't think it'll be alright nowadays. as mentioned, there are many games that do both exploration and shooting very well (mainly because the shooting was the focus).

improving the shooting might be a double edged sword though. not good enough and it's derided as a weak link; too good and people want more of it and you have the risk of designated combat rooms instead of something more natural

Retro used legacy controls and a lock on instead of dual analog aiming because the GameCubes c stick made a terd awful second analog for aiming.

After GameCube, It was the base standard setter for shooter controls on Wii, 2 consoles ago with corruption.

Metroid is flexible with controls and movement as long as they are well done, the series began life with the action part of it's design comparable to games like contra, this is not a new or foreign concept to metroid, as long as they don't screw up world and progression design, and that includes power up design.

I have not seen anything from any Nintendo studio that would cause any concern for being able to grok these basic mechanics, and I don't feel being forced to use a GameCube controller 20 years ago has any bearing on anything today.

This isn't something I am concerned with.

 

[Magic-Man]

Prime is not trying to be an FPS and it benefits more from being a more slow, methodical game rather than a fast paced one. Focus on speed and action is one of the reasons why the level design in 2D metroids deteriorated after super (and why prime 3's wasn't as good as 1/2s)

Didn't Dread already solve this problem? It had a ton of action but the level design was great too.

 

[Aurc]

I feel retros big litmus test is going to be getting rid of the spider ball track and the restrictive crutches of similar ilk, Spider ball tracks, wall jump pads, etc, and replacing these and as many other lock and key/open or closed progression gates as possible, with actual analog progression, like being able to jump farther, or morph ball bosting off of ramps. Things that just work and players can actually use, instead of being a glorified light switch/lock and key.

I'm glad you brought this up, because you're absolutely right: designated Wall Jump surfaces and the like are kind of a buzz kill, considering the 2D games aren't so restrictive with where you're "allowed" to use your abilities. I do understand that some level of ability restriction is inevitable, especially if they plan on making the play areas even larger, but I just hope those restrictions can be woven into the gameplay in a more organic way, this time around. Grab Ledges in particular are extremely silly and jarring, now that I think about them. Let's leave the glowy green ledges in 2007, and just let Samus pull herself up wherever she needs to.

That and toning the puzzle boss aspect way the heck down, and having actual fights.

Yet another one of Dread's strong points. Both it, and Samus Returns did well to treat combat as a respectable pillar of the gameplay, as opposed to something that only really takes a backseat to exploration. Raven Beak is probably the best boss in the series, with Kraid and Experiment No. Z-57 also worth mentioning. Although Metroid has never been known for particularly standout boss fights, I appreciate recent efforts to improve upon that aspect of the games.

 

[Zeal543]

Didn't Dread already solve this problem? It had a ton of action but the level design was great too.

I don't agree, the game boxes you in way too much and the emmi zones are a big detriment to exploration by needing to have large areas designed around stealth/chases. Even with sequence breaking, there are a lot of stops to prevent you from doing more.

 

[Crusters]

Prime is not trying to be an FPS and it benefits more from being a more slow, methodical game rather than a fast paced one. Focus on speed and action is one of the reasons why the level design in 2D metroids deteriorated after super (and why prime 3's wasn't as good as 1/2s)

It really doesn't, the 2d Metroid games were always pretty dang fast, the entries of declining quality didn't really change anything there. What they changed was the heart of the series, the world and progression design.

The team could still do it in fusion. There was a secret room you could only get to with very skillfull sequence breaking. But it literally only existed to slap you in the face and tell you to piss off and follow the path, and only the path. They knew what they were doing in zero mission when they had very precise alternate sequences and practically no actual sequence breaking (even if you did, your power up wouldn't activate).

And prime was not immune either. There was a huge disconnect between NA and the PAL prime base, because they both played different versions of the game. PAL users could not explore or sequence break at all compared to the original NA release, nearly every neat thing that was found that allowed a player to express their agency and leave the beaten path, was surgically removed (upon original release, players choice and subsequent releases gave everybody the nerfed version, as did trilogy).

Speed and action in games like corruption, fusion zero mission and other m wasn't a cause. It was at most a byproduct. It wasn't just Metroid that was facing this deteriorating either, every Nintendo game with remotely similar attributes was circling the drain in the same way, including Zelda.

Aunoma finally let the cat out of the bag on this one in an interview after the success of breath of the wild.

It wasn't an accident. It was very much on purpose. He gave many interviews where he talked about 'breaking tradition's. In several of them he spoke about the company culture that had arisen, and become tradition, where the designer was supposed to control the game experience, control what the player does, and where they go, and when. And any time a player did something that was NOT what, where, or when they wanted the player to do it, they considered it a mistake, a glitch, that had to be removed...

They literally, actively, hated explorers, sequence breakers and stunt players.

And they did so voraciously, with increasing efficiency, from the N64 to the Wii u, all the way up to breath of the wild.

Today's Nintendo does not appear to be obsessed with the tradition of overbearing control that caused the deterioration of Metroid.

 

[Mr_No_U]

Since we're doing Metroid General Discussion I wanted to share this 3D printed Samus magnet I did a while back. Bonus Duck Hunt magnet.

I'd love to fill up my fridge with Nintendo characters but I'm usually missing at least one color to make it work.

Metroid Quack

 

[Zeal543]

It really doesn't, the 2d Metroid games were always pretty dang fast, the entries of declining quality didn't really change anything there. What they changed was the heart of the series, the world and progression design.

The team could still do it in fusion. There was a secret room you could only get to with very skillfull sequence breaking. But it literally only existed to slap you in the face and tell you to piss off and follow the path, and only the path. They knew what they were doing in zero mission when they had very precise alternate sequences and practically no actual sequence breaking (even if you did, your power up wouldn't activate).

And prime was not immune either. There was a huge disconnect between NA and the PAL prime base, because they both played different versions of the game. PAL users could not explore or sequence break at all compared to the original NA release, nearly every neat thing that was found that allowed a player to express their agency and leave the beaten path, was surgically removed (upon original release, players choice and subsequent releases gave everybody the nerfed version, as did trilogy).

Speed and action in games like corruption, fusion zero mission and other m wasn't a cause. It was at most a byproduct. It wasn't just Metroid that was facing this deteriorating either, every Nintendo game with remotely similar attributes was circling the drain in the same way, including Zelda.

Aunoma finally let the cat out of the bag on this one in an interview after the success of breath of the wild.

It wasn't an accident. It was very much on purpose. He gave many interviews where he talked about 'breaking tradition's. In several of them he spoke about the company culture that had arisen, and become tradition, where the designer was supposed to control the game experience, control what the player does, and where they go, and when. And any time a player did something that was NOT what, where, or when they wanted the player to do it, they considered it a mistake, a glitch, that had to be removed...

They literally, actively, hated explorers, sequence breakers and stunt players.

And they did so voraciously, with increasing efficiency, from the N64 to the Wii u, all the way up to breath of the wild.

Today's Nintendo does not appear to be obsessed with the tradition of overbearing control that caused the deterioration of Metroid.

I would not consider metroid 1-3 to be fast paced, and dread still had a lot of restriction in terms of exploration even with sequence breaking present. Prime doesn't need to rely on sequence breaks because the main game has enough freedom, you are rarely if ever locked out from how you progress through the world aside from the upgrades you possess.

 

[HockeyBird]

Metroid Prime was pretty fast paced for a console FPS, especially for its time. Metroid Prime was considered one, if not, the first first person game to get platforming right. Samus can double jump and dash to the side which made actually boss fights in first person enjoyable. I also think people misremember how fast the 2D Metroids were. In the first three games, Samus is pretty floaty and slow throughout most of the experience. People are assuming that late game Samus, who has the screw attack and shine sparks, is the normal experience.

Now the first Metroid Prime didn't get any of the late level power ups that make platforming trivial, but on the whole, I found Metroid Prime to get faster paced through most of the experience than the original 2D Metroid games.

 

[Crusters]

I would not consider metroid 1-3 to be fast paced, and dread still had a lot of restriction in terms of exploration even with sequence breaking present. Prime doesn't need to rely on sequence breaks because the main game has enough freedom, you are rarely if ever locked out from how you progress through the world aside from the upgrades you possess.

What are you comparing them too?

Not sure what restrictions you are talking about with dread, practically every aspect of the game is breakable. You can even skip some emmis and boss fights.

Samus moves much faster than the vast majority of contemporary 2d side scrolling characters, particularly from side scrolling shooters, even with supers floaty jumps.

None of the games rely on sequence breaks, sequence breaks are a natural byproduct that arises from the freedom you described. In order to remove the sequence breaks, you have to remove the cause of them. The freedom.

 

[Zeal543]

What are you comparing them too?

Not sure what restrictions you are talking about with dread, practically every aspect of the game is breakable. You can even skip some emmis and boss fights.

Samus moves much faster than the vast majority of contemporary 2d side scrolling characters, particularly from side scrolling shooters, even with supers floaty jumps.

None of the games rely on sequence breaks, sequence breaks are a natural byproduct that arises from the freedom you described. In order to remove the sequence breaks, you have to remove the cause of them. The freedom.

I'm comparing them to fusion and beyond 2d metroids. Dread has several instances of locking you out of large portions of the rest of the game for the main game, without the sequence breaking the game would be almost fusion levels of linear even if it hides it better. Sequence breaking is nice but the instances of those are limited by too many bottlenecks in progression as well (tying powerups to emmis is the biggest offender). You can skip a few stuff but there's nothing like reverse boss order from zm or super

 

[Phendrift]

I like the puzzle bosses in Prime :/ I don’t want bullet spongey FPS bosses

 

[TheSpaceBetween]

I think Samus' movement is fine. If you want to go fast, you use the boostball. I don't think Doomguy type movement would work well with the level design of the Prime games. They're about carefully studying your environment, and noticing little details on how to proceed, not speeding through everything. Prime isn't meant to be just Metroid in 3D, it's an entirely different take on the series, just like 3D Mario is for the most part.

I think the puzzle bosses were a result were a result of the shooting not being the best in the Prime games. I do love a lot of them, but Prime 1 especially had really underwhelming bosses. Echoes had a lot of really creative ones, with Quadraxis being the pinnacle. With Prime 3, the combat was MUCH better due to being designed around the motion controls, and allowed them to have the AMAZING arcadey fights against the Hunters. They are my favorite bosses in the series by far (the amazing music with Rundas/Gandrayda made them even more hype).

I'm comparing them to fusion and beyond 2d metroids. Dread has several instances of locking you out of large portions of the rest of the game for the main game, without the sequence breaking the game would be almost fusion levels of linear even if it hides it better. Sequence breaking is nice but thr instances of those are limited by too many bottlenecks in progression as well (tying powerups to emmis is the biggest offender). You can skip a few stuff but there's nothing like reverse boss order from zm or super

This was actually my biggest hangup about Dread. Every time I got a new power up I was all excited to backtrack and item hunt, but the game is just like NOPE.

 

[Erimgard]

You can't go full-on Reverse Boss Order, no, but the game also has many more regions and bosses than Super, so that's a much bigger ask. Quite a few bosses in the game can be skipped or played out of order. There were definitely a few too many instances of a door locking behind me, but there are quite a few alternate routes through the game once you understand the map and sequence break possibilities. More will be found in time with glitches, too.

Many of the things that make Super so open are the result of unintended glitches discovered through years of experimentation. Dread community is finding new stuff all the time.

 

[Deleted member 341]

While I hope that Metroid Prime 4 will come with a modernized and faster approach to combat for me it will all be about exploration, level design, upgrades and items. The combat is secondary to me because Prime is so much more.

 

[Samus95]

While I hope that Metroid Prime 4 will come with a modernized and faster approach to combat for me it will all be about exploration, level design, upgrades and items. The combat is secondary to me because Prime is so much more.

Yes but when it happens it needs to as fast and hard hitting as a Doom Eternal

I hope that you can hit enemies with the cannon like in Returns and Dread

 

[Phendrift]

What FPS’ have good boss design?

Like I never see any brought up, instead I’ve seen the genre kind of roasted for its boss selection

I’d much prefer Prime’s approach than bullet sponges

 

[Deleted member 341]

What FPS’ have good boss design?

Like I never see any brought up, instead I’ve seen the genre kind of roasted for its boss selection

I’d much prefer Prime’s approach than bullet sponges

I really liked Dooms (2016) design philosophy. Really enjoyable and satisfying to kill all these assholes from hell.

 

[IronTed]

On one hand Jeff is a source I trust, on the other it's hard to believe this after how many times people claimed some variation of "MPT is coming". Regardless, because I am shameless I will end up buying whatever remaster/port/etc Nintendo puts out.

 

[HockeyBird]

What FPS’ have good boss design?

Like I never see any brought up, instead I’ve seen the genre kind of roasted for its boss selection

I’d much prefer Prime’s approach than bullet sponges

I think Destiny has some decent bosses but you kind need to play them with other people. The problem with bosses in most FPS games is the lack of defensive options and the perspective. Often to avoid getting damaged by bosses, you literally have to turn your back and run and jump away. However, that means you don't know where the boss is. Metroid Prime bosses are fun because Samus has a sideway dodge and a lock on system which helps you maneuver around a boss while keeping it in your sight. Combat in the Prime series is more like Zelda than it is a traditional FPS. Actually aiming is secondary.

 

[Zeal543]

What FPS’ have good boss design?

Like I never see any brought up, instead I’ve seen the genre kind of roasted for its boss selection

I’d much prefer Prime’s approach than bullet sponges

dunno what this nonsense is about prime not having good bosses, prime 2 has the best battles in the series

 

[Koren Lesthe]

dunno what this nonsense is about prime not having good bosses, prime 2 has the best battles in the series

Prime 2 & Prime 3 in Hypermode difficulty was a nightmare ^^. I never beat Prime 3 in Hypermode, always died because of Phazon corruption in the final boss form (no more ’health’ so it’s either you or it). An extremely stressful boss battle.

 

[Dark Cloud]

On one hand Jeff is a source I trust, on the other it's hard to believe this after how many times people claimed some variation of "MPT is coming". Regardless, because I am shameless I will end up buying whatever remaster/port/etc Nintendo puts out.

Plans change. Why is this always being put on insiders? Jeff isn’t the one making development decisions at Nintendo. It changed according to all insiders they changed and focused on Prime 1.

 

[IronTed]

Plans change. Why is this always being put on insiders? Jeff isn’t the one making development decisions at Nintendo. It changed according to all insiders they changed and focused on Prime 1.

Plans change, people also get stuff wrong. Why is it unreasonable to be more cautious after how all of this has developed?