I honestly can't tell if that last part is referring to people who dislike BotW or people who dislike Souls games
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Discussion Anyone else want botw 2 to be just a little more challenging after playing elden ring?
- Thread starter BlueManifest
- Start date
SuperFakerBros
Anti-Artistic Integrity
Lol dislike BotWI honestly can't tell if that last part is referring to people who dislike BotW or people who dislike Souls games
I get what you mean but i don't really agree. If the main goal and baddie isn't the strongest enemy in the game, then it makes the story and the whole process of preparation kind of lame. That final Beast Ganon was cinematic, but that whole final battle moment was missing a phase or some challenge. It was mainly just things we've already seen along the journey and nothing new. I get the point behind that, but like.. c'mon. What's the point of having a final boss that is easy and you don't have to prepare to win. It just makes me leave the game unsatisfied.
Zelda games have always have atleast good final boss. I'm thinking Oot, TP, WW, SS, etc. Botw was lacking in that department, and it's pretty weird since the whole story and adventure was positioned as an epic and grandiose adventure just to fall off in the end battle.
Harina
burn me at the stake
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Have you fought Gannon without clearing the beasts? Might be what you're looking for.
Sailor Moon
magical girl
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I never got past the beginning part of BOTW, so no, please, or at least give us a pause button and an easy mode.
I mean, that was the battle before the beast ganon victory lap. He was strong, had to make sure you had your party skills down, and if you didn’t do a divine beast, much harder even.
You beat him. Done.
That last bit was your victory lap and I enjoy that because the stress and skill check was done with.
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- He
Not gonna lie, I 100% agree with this.
In fact, the irony is that even From Soft seems to understand this at times, considering Dark Souls and Bloodborne have some of their easiest base-game bosses as the final boss (not counting the optional "true" final boss in BB).
This is also one of the reasons I really like classic Castlevania. You just did this hard as fuck level and, instead of what most modern games imitating challenging NES games do nowadays, where the boss is just as hard if not 10x harder than the level, the boss is instead pretty easy and usually a victory lap. Of course, this is arguably because the bosses are ... well, not traditionally good. But that's fine
Hero of Hyrule
Frieren the Slayer
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BotW is as challenging as Zelda needs to be
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Passive aggressive remarks? I just don't care for the game, lol. I'd say I'm critical of it. Is that not cool, or something? I only ever recall doing so a couple of times, so I'm surprised you make it a point to recall those instances, but it is a smaller forum. There's plenty to criticize BotW over, in my view. I don't uphold other games to a silly extent, when I talk about BotW.Well, if I did agree with him, I'd have liked his post about how Elden Ring being beloved is forced or the game is amateurish or whatever instead of your response to him so, no, not really. Most folk who like any game are generally just normal people and don't post on gaming forums
But you do make passive aggressive marks against BotW here and there and always knock it down whenever you're making any comment on it. It's really not any different from Kreese is doing with Elden Ring. Also it's not just a month of Elden Ring being praised. This goes back to 2011 with Dark Souls, where a minority but very vocal subsection of the fanbase always put the games on a pedestal and knocked other games down for not being the same thing or offering something similar, from Zelda to Elder Scrolls to The Witcher and so on, and defending them against any and all criticism by shielding it as From Software's artistic vision or integrity, a defense I never see for any other game or series despite being no less valid there. That's what I mean when I say whatever circlejerk BotW has is nothing compared to what the Souls games get
I can't find anything about FromSoft citing BotW as an influence, but that was just after a brief Google search. Maybe you could produce something like that. I don't see anything BotW has in common with ER, outside of what I'd previously mentioned (an open world with minimal handholding). They're quite different from each other.
I wouldn't argue that FromSoft have produced an open world on the level of complexity as BotW, because they haven't. If we're judging under criteria of mechanical intricacy, and the way the various systems interlock to give the player a sense of freedom, and create emergent gameplay, you're right, BotW is the clear winner. ER isn't trying to beat BotW at that specific thing, though. I think from a content perspective, and the moment-to-moment gameplay, ER triumphs. Enemy variety is far higher, leading to greater encounter diversity. Dungeons are large, expansive, and plentiful, which is an area people say BotW faltered. The overwhelming majority of rewards are unique, and don't have durability bars, making exploration highly rewarding for the player. Yes, it's a game primarily focused on combat, but for players that would rather have compelling combat than exploration they may not consider worthwhile, it's a solid contender.
Again, I don't mind that you're in love with BotW. You wouldn't be the first. It's just weird to go around calling it forced that people would say ER has the overall better world. I don't think it's a blowout in either direction. Just depends on what you're looking for from the experience. We can talk about this all day, but the wider playerbase does believe that ER is a valid contender, so it's somewhat pointless.
Who "warned" you, exactly? That's rich. One of "those" posters... because I said Metroid Dread's graphics are subpar?
They are, though?Look, I shouldn't have to entertain this nonsense, or prove some sort of "cred", but I've been a Metroid fan for pretty much my whole life. I've been waiting two decades for Metroid 5 to finally come. No, it's not a looker, and I don't see how you could argue otherwise. I still finished it several times (Dread Mode, 0%, etc.), and think it's a great game. I even made the ST on this very site! My GOTY 2021. I said the graphics were stinky. So what? Why get this way over graphics, of all things?
Petty snipes because I made some remark weeks ago, lol. Good to know you'll be remembered as a problematic poster if you're a BotW or Metroid Dread graphics h8r.
Crusters
Koopa
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Nah, I wouldn't mind the next eldin ring being a little harder though.
Definitely, finding armor was definitely the best reward in the game, everything else was nice, but it shouldn't be the main motivation, no one plays Metroid anxiously anticipating the next missile expansion.
More of the good stuff.
I hope they don't fix the botw combat/traversal meta. I hope they don't ruin it by trying to 'go in on it' either.
Supreme Overlord
Look on my Works, ye Mighty, and despair!
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Previously, I had addressed the thread through a quick barrage of loosely-connected thoughts regarding the nature of altering difficulty, in that the issue cannot be truly addressed without considering the ways difficulty is altered and the reasons these particular changes are made, as summarized here:
However, I am unconvinced this is an adequate approach to the topic, as there is more underlying the questions at hand. As there is a lot more to sift there, let us delve into a quick exploration, shall we?
The topic at hand has been presented as dealing with the difficulty level of games, especially that of Zelda games, but I suspect it might better be framed around the idea of user engagement. Now, it seems that sometimes difficulty is used as shorthand for engagement; working through a difficult segment of a game, after all, often requires the player to be engaged, lest the entire endeavor end in tragedy. The inverse plays a role as well, where a player might reject an easier game because they feel less involved in it.
But that doesn't necessitate that making something difficult must also increase the level of engagement provided, nor that decreasing difficulty will automatically provide less -- such an assertion would be fallacious. It does, however, present a suggestion of what underlying factors might form the base of the request, that the original poster simply doesn't find aspects of the game engaging.
In such a case, we might look not to the request for increased difficulty, but rather to the different elements and changes that would create such an effect. These changes might not even require an increase in overall difficulty in order to address the root of the complaint.
One element I'd noted in my previous post is crafting an element of strategy into the various encounters, whether through changes to how food consumption works (real-time-not-a-free-action, or perhaps only varieties one might theoretically be able to chow on in high-intensity situations, or even relegating the activity to campfires or places in town) or through new combinations of enemies with different attributes, strengths, and weaknesses in strategically diverse locales.
Given Souls style combat is intrinsically tied to this thread, one might note that the combat in those games is governed by its own structure, a methodical dance that demands engagement. This doesn't even require those to be difficult, necessarily. Some might find these games engaging even if they don't find them especially difficult; others might find them both especially boring and also difficult.
In the same way, one person might revel in the engagement of deciphering where to go and what to do, and another might be entirely disconnected. And the perceived difficulty involved, or lack thereof, could affect both differently.
Which can bring us back to Breath of the Wild. Changes might help some people become more engaged, but they might also detract for others. It's not as simple as saying we need an increase in difficulty or in engagement.
Thoughtless difficulty increases are oft detrimental in implementation. Consider the phenomenon of the bullet sponges, tweaked to make a game harder, but also liable to do nothing good for engagement.
In summary, to say something needs to be made more difficult doesn't inherently point to what improvements could be made. Sometimes it could even be detrimental.
So we've covered that the level of difficulty itself might not always be the ultimate source of complaints, but the subject remains an oft-debated source of contention. This, again, isn't as simple as often presented, and this isn't an attempt to give an ultimate position to which we must adhere.
For a start, though, there are myriad reasons someone might not be able to or want to make their way through a difficult game, even if they'd enjoy it otherwise, and even if the response is to simply get good at it, be these reasons related to a person's physical or mental capabilities or even external time constraints making the process less rewarding.
And, again and related, "increased difficulty" or even "levels of difficulty" might be catch-all as a term, but it makes for a poor one-size-fits-all. After all, different people will struggle with different things for different reasons.
One way around this is through property sliders, allowing the player to alter different properties individually. This might be as simple for someone as changing the input or output of damage. It could be that puzzles of a certain sort are troublesome for a particular reason. A system of this sort could be am option for many games.
A game could adapt to the way you play, analyzing different aspects of your performance, altering different factors to accommodate.
Kid Icarus: Uprising used its Fiend's Cauldron to allow the player to alter the difficulty of individual stages. Even a game like Zelda, despite lacking in individual stages, could adapt a similar concept, with sites littered about to be interacted with to that end.
As for Breath of the Wild one complaint that seems to be brought up a lot -- perhaps in part resultant from the go-anywhere-do-anything-anytime approach -- is a lack of difficulty progression, where Link becomes more capable and equipped to deal with the game's challenges but the world doesn't throw additional challenge to overcome in response.
And some of this, if the same overall design philosophy remains, could be alleviated through the aforementioned responsive analysis, where the game responds to what the player has accomplished, what they breeze through and what causes difficulty.
And then there's the possibility of areas that are more or less challenging, pockets to alter the flow and create a less homogenous world.
However, it is worth recognizing that, unless difficulty levels remain static, with no curve or progression, you always run the risk of someone being able to play the game but unable to complete all the content. And if some form of reward is tied to this content for whatever reason -- lore, thematic connection, et cetera -- you thus run the risk of someone being unable to access whatever that might be.
This, of course, follows from a general difficulty progression, or perhaps pockets of increased difficulty, disconnected from any implementation of difficulty or accessibility settings, which could affect the overall difficulty but might not ameliorate this factor for everyone.
However, I am unconvinced this is an adequate approach to the topic, as there is more underlying the questions at hand. As there is a lot more to sift there, let us delve into a quick exploration, shall we?
On the Subject of Difficulty and Engagemenr
The topic at hand has been presented as dealing with the difficulty level of games, especially that of Zelda games, but I suspect it might better be framed around the idea of user engagement. Now, it seems that sometimes difficulty is used as shorthand for engagement; working through a difficult segment of a game, after all, often requires the player to be engaged, lest the entire endeavor end in tragedy. The inverse plays a role as well, where a player might reject an easier game because they feel less involved in it.
But that doesn't necessitate that making something difficult must also increase the level of engagement provided, nor that decreasing difficulty will automatically provide less -- such an assertion would be fallacious. It does, however, present a suggestion of what underlying factors might form the base of the request, that the original poster simply doesn't find aspects of the game engaging.
In such a case, we might look not to the request for increased difficulty, but rather to the different elements and changes that would create such an effect. These changes might not even require an increase in overall difficulty in order to address the root of the complaint.
One element I'd noted in my previous post is crafting an element of strategy into the various encounters, whether through changes to how food consumption works (real-time-not-a-free-action, or perhaps only varieties one might theoretically be able to chow on in high-intensity situations, or even relegating the activity to campfires or places in town) or through new combinations of enemies with different attributes, strengths, and weaknesses in strategically diverse locales.
Given Souls style combat is intrinsically tied to this thread, one might note that the combat in those games is governed by its own structure, a methodical dance that demands engagement. This doesn't even require those to be difficult, necessarily. Some might find these games engaging even if they don't find them especially difficult; others might find them both especially boring and also difficult.
In the same way, one person might revel in the engagement of deciphering where to go and what to do, and another might be entirely disconnected. And the perceived difficulty involved, or lack thereof, could affect both differently.
Which can bring us back to Breath of the Wild. Changes might help some people become more engaged, but they might also detract for others. It's not as simple as saying we need an increase in difficulty or in engagement.
Thoughtless difficulty increases are oft detrimental in implementation. Consider the phenomenon of the bullet sponges, tweaked to make a game harder, but also liable to do nothing good for engagement.
In summary, to say something needs to be made more difficult doesn't inherently point to what improvements could be made. Sometimes it could even be detrimental.
On Levels of Difficulty and the Multifold Path
So we've covered that the level of difficulty itself might not always be the ultimate source of complaints, but the subject remains an oft-debated source of contention. This, again, isn't as simple as often presented, and this isn't an attempt to give an ultimate position to which we must adhere.
For a start, though, there are myriad reasons someone might not be able to or want to make their way through a difficult game, even if they'd enjoy it otherwise, and even if the response is to simply get good at it, be these reasons related to a person's physical or mental capabilities or even external time constraints making the process less rewarding.
And, again and related, "increased difficulty" or even "levels of difficulty" might be catch-all as a term, but it makes for a poor one-size-fits-all. After all, different people will struggle with different things for different reasons.
One way around this is through property sliders, allowing the player to alter different properties individually. This might be as simple for someone as changing the input or output of damage. It could be that puzzles of a certain sort are troublesome for a particular reason. A system of this sort could be am option for many games.
A game could adapt to the way you play, analyzing different aspects of your performance, altering different factors to accommodate.
Kid Icarus: Uprising used its Fiend's Cauldron to allow the player to alter the difficulty of individual stages. Even a game like Zelda, despite lacking in individual stages, could adapt a similar concept, with sites littered about to be interacted with to that end.
As for Breath of the Wild one complaint that seems to be brought up a lot -- perhaps in part resultant from the go-anywhere-do-anything-anytime approach -- is a lack of difficulty progression, where Link becomes more capable and equipped to deal with the game's challenges but the world doesn't throw additional challenge to overcome in response.
And some of this, if the same overall design philosophy remains, could be alleviated through the aforementioned responsive analysis, where the game responds to what the player has accomplished, what they breeze through and what causes difficulty.
And then there's the possibility of areas that are more or less challenging, pockets to alter the flow and create a less homogenous world.
However, it is worth recognizing that, unless difficulty levels remain static, with no curve or progression, you always run the risk of someone being able to play the game but unable to complete all the content. And if some form of reward is tied to this content for whatever reason -- lore, thematic connection, et cetera -- you thus run the risk of someone being unable to access whatever that might be.
This, of course, follows from a general difficulty progression, or perhaps pockets of increased difficulty, disconnected from any implementation of difficulty or accessibility settings, which could affect the overall difficulty but might not ameliorate this factor for everyone.
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- He/Him
Metroid is a totally different type of game, but people do anticipate the major upgrades (Space Jump, Super Missile, various beams, etc.), to where folks even felt anxious about not getting the Morph Ball as early in Dread as it's acquired in the others. If there were ever an open world Metroid title, with Samus exploring mini dungeons or shrines, and the rewards for doing such side content felt inadequate, I do think you'd see some complaints.
There is absolutely no need to target another user in such a hostile manner like this. Please use the ignore button or report if there is a genuine concern about the true intentions of another user - Donnie, Mazi, blondkayvon
Passive aggressive remarks? I just don't care for the game, lol. I'd say I'm critical of it. Is that not cool, or something? I only ever recall doing so a couple of times, so I'm surprised you make it a point to recall those instances, but it is a smaller forum. There's plenty to criticize BotW over, in my view. I don't uphold other games to a silly extent, when I talk about BotW.
I can't find anything about FromSoft citing BotW as an influence, but that was just after a brief Google search. Maybe you could produce something like that. I don't see anything BotW has in common with ER, outside of what I'd previously mentioned (an open world with minimal handholding). They're quite different from each other.
I wouldn't argue that FromSoft have produced an open world on the level of complexity as BotW, because they haven't. If we're judging under criteria of mechanical intricacy, and the way the various systems interlock to give the player a sense of freedom, and create emergent gameplay, you're right, BotW is the clear winner. ER isn't trying to beat BotW at that specific thing, though. I think from a content perspective, and the moment-to-moment gameplay, ER triumphs. Enemy variety is far higher, leading to greater encounter diversity. Dungeons are large, expansive, and plentiful, which is an area people say BotW faltered. The overwhelming majority of rewards are unique, and don't have durability bars, making exploration highly rewarding for the player. Yes, it's a game primarily focused on combat, but for players that would rather have compelling combat than exploration they may not consider worthwhile, it's a solid contender.
Again, I don't mind that you're in love with BotW. You wouldn't be the first. It's just weird to go around calling it forced that people would say ER has the overall better world. I don't think it's a blowout in either direction. Just depends on what you're looking for from the experience. We can talk about this all day, but the wider playerbase does believe that ER is a valid contender, so it's somewhat pointless.
Who "warned" you, exactly? That's rich. One of "those" posters... because I said Metroid Dread's graphics are subpar?
Look, I shouldn't have to entertain this nonsense, or prove some sort of "cred", but I've been a Metroid fan for pretty much my whole life. I've been waiting two decades for Metroid 5 to finally come. No, it's not a looker, and I don't see how you could argue otherwise. I still finished it several times (Dread Mode, 0%, etc.), and think it's a great game. I even made the ST on this very site! My GOTY 2021. I said the graphics were stinky. So what? Why get this way over graphics, of all things?
Petty snipes because I made some remark weeks ago, lol. Good to know you'll be remembered as a problematic poster if you're a BotW or Metroid Dread graphics h8r.
There are no petty snipes. Somebody warned me about what kind of poster you were after you aroused my suspicions, and the more I hear you speak the more it confirms it to me. I've already sniffed you out, so don't speak to me like I owe you any explanations or the time to properly to hear out your queries.
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If being critical of a particular game's (one I love, no less) graphics is enough to "arouse your suspicions", I don't even know what to say in response to that, other than that I just have to shrug my shoulders at hearing I've offended you, if all it really took was something that innocuous. That's on you, not me. It's a pretty common thing to lament the way Metroid Dread ended up looking, purely in terms of graphical fidelity, so it's weird that you ended up getting this bent up about one dude saying what so many others also were (hardcore fans like myself included). Gotta make it personal because someone criticized one of your favorite pieces of plastic, eh? Sad, but it often comes back to that, so not surprising.
Throughout this thread, you've deliberately made inflammatory remarks: Elden Ring is "amateurish", and those that uphold it above Breath of the Wild are just "forcing" it. You say the comparisons are being "pushed down your throat". My guy, you've seemingly got a whole complex about this particular comparison of the two games in question. I may not like BotW (and make no attempt to hide that), but I recognize that it does certain things exceptionally well, and have already conceded that whether players prefer BotW, or ER, depends entirely on what they're looking for out of the experience. BotW isn't a bad game at all, and I wouldn't call it amateurish just because I don't care for it on a personal level. On the other side, I do like ER, but I have some serious issues with it, and I'd say it's actually my least favorite FromSoft game, of the ones I've played (that being this one, Demon's Souls, Bloodborne, and Sekiro).
I don't expect any sort of genuine response, or engagement with my points. Just replying for the sake of posterity.
I don't wish to continue to humour you or this.
Please stop directing any posts towards me and don't address me again.
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You didn't have to respond. I told you that I wasn't expecting a response. Just put me on ignore, it's what that function is there for. Let's leave it at that.
Edit to add: I otherwise always speak in a way conductive to discussion and it's out of character for me to be offended by the presence of another user.
I care about this site so I'm not going to ignore your posts if I feel that they could be a determent here as it's been mentioned to me they have, but there is no need for the two of us to engage further.
Good day.
I care about this site so I'm not going to ignore your posts if I feel that they could be a determent here as it's been mentioned to me they have, but there is no need for the two of us to engage further.
Good day.
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You claim to care about the site, but your posts in this thread haven't been conducive to an actual discussion. You want to disengage, but you keep trying to get the last word in. You won't use the ignore function, because reasons.
If you're ever interested in making up, and putting this behind us, DM me. I'm always down to mend bridges.
Crusters
Koopa
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- He/him
They really aren't all that different at all. Especially not this part. Well, until botw anyways.
There's currently no complaints in Metroid games because the missile packs aren't the main collectable power up feature.
Botw front loaded all of the interesting power up features into the first 30 minutes, and from there it's the games equivalent of missile expansions, heart, stamina, and item slots, for the rest of the game.
The next best thing you get is armor sets, and their passive powers. Nowhere near as good as a rune ability/power up, and no where near as many features like this as would have been desired for a world that size
All Metroid games (barring the obvious like pinball and ff) are, and have been open world since the beginning, as they don't have discreet levels, they use their maps to create a coherent persistent virtual world. Same with Zelda's. They just aren't sandbox progression designs.
SuperFakerBros
Anti-Artistic Integrity
Meh, it's not worth it. After Era, I'm kinda done with that sort of stuff
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I've never heard Metroid referred to as open world. I guess from a certain point of view, it could be considered as such, but not in the same sense of something like BotW. Metroid has barriers in place to prevent the player from reaching areas prematurely. Granted, there is sequence breaking, but there are limits to it, and it's not considered the "intended" progression. If we ever got BotW, but Metroid, I think it'd be really neat challenge for the devs to implement some sort of reward that isn't just energy, missile, Power Bomb, etc. tanks. In the 2D and Prime games, those work just fine.
Oh, people are absolutely free to be critical of Elden Ring. You just don't see me calling BotW amateurish, or that it's forced for people to like it more than the other game it's being compared to. Already touched on that, multiple times. I think those remarks are just blatantly made in bad faith, and come across as someone sitting on a high horse, looking down at the peons that dare prefer one game over the other.
SuperFakerBros
Anti-Artistic Integrity
I said I wouldn't bother but oh well
I really couldn't careless what you prefer or don't prefer. I believe I've made that very clear. You may not say that sorta stuff but you'll certainly say it's overrated or make a snarky snide remark to someone for finding the game great or go on about how much you don't like it. Forgive me if I don't find you similar to other people whom you might find to be Elden Ring or Souls or whatever hater
Crusters
Koopa
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Aye. Progression. That's progression design, not world design. Lot of neat stuff that can be done by trying different combinations of those two things.
You can have the same exact world map, and soley using progression gating, create a dozen different paths through that world which completely change the experience.
I feel lost here, when I think rewards in Zelda and Metroid, it's charge shots, hook shots, spin attacks, bombs, bow, grapple beam, ice arrows/beam
Things like e tanks and expansions are far down the second fiddle mundane bag. Even in the 2d and prime games. The first time you get them though, is another story.
That being said new power ups, or completely new ways to use power ups, are absolutely going to be needed going forward, not just for a botw-esque style Metroid, but for 2d and prime style Metroid as well. These games are their power ups, so much so that the very worlds are shaped and designed by the capabilities of said power ups.
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I don't honestly care that much either, mate. It's all video game talk, at the end of the day. People will be cool with inflammatory commentary about their preferred "team", while pointing fingers at the opposing one. Yes, I've said BotW is overrated. What gives? I certainly won't act like you're less than me for enjoying it.
Like the other poster, you're opting to bring up commentary I'd made in other threads, just to win some argument. I try not to ever make it personal, unless it's an extreme case. Being on someone's shit list for saying Metroid Dread isn't a looker is certainly something I didn't anticipate.
The grudges people hold.
SuperFakerBros
Anti-Artistic Integrity
You do know that when I said what you're doing isn't dissimilar to Kreese, it's also because I disagree with what he's doing, right? He was already told off for it, which is why I didn't add on to it. Regarding that last point in your paragraph, you mean like how you yourself are trying to place me on an opposing team because of my own preferences?
Well it's related to the point I'm making. That you have a history of doing it
Meh, I wouldn't hold a grudge for that eitherBeing on someone's shit list for saying Metroid Dread isn't a looker is certainly something I didn't anticipate.
I don't honestly care that much either, mate. It's all video game talk, at the end of the day. People will be cool with inflammatory commentary about their preferred "team", while pointing fingers at the opposing one. Yes, I've said BotW is overrated. What gives? I certainly won't act like you're less than me for enjoying it.
Like the other poster, you're opting to bring up commentary I'd made in other threads, just to win some argument. I try not to ever make it personal, unless it's an extreme case. Being on someone's shit list for saying Metroid Dread isn't a looker is certainly something I didn't anticipate.
I thought you wanted to drop this yet you continue to reference me in three consecutive posts and then go on to talk about grudges?
You're very disingenuous as I was warned by another poster. This is why I think your presence is toxic here. Not because you shit on Metroids graphics. I'm not surprised in the least this place has attracted some of your kind.
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Dude. You just cannot help yourself. You were the one that wanted to disengage, not me. I was responding to your points, and then you said you didn't wanna talk to me anymore. This has been dragged out to a comical extent. If you wanna talk more shit, take it to my DMs. Or ignore me. I honestly don't give a fuck. Just make up your mind.
How are you speaking to me right now as if you didn't just bring me up in three consecutive posts in a negative context... after saying you wanted to make up? I told you not to address me again, but you continued to do so.
By the way, I don't want to make up with you. I think the only reason you're here is to be a nuisance as I was told and as you continue to prove.
By the way, I don't want to make up with you. I think the only reason you're here is to be a nuisance as I was told and as you continue to prove.
- Pronouns
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The DLC was mostly bad. They just flexed their puzzle skills hard and wrapped it up in an unfortunate package.
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(Forum drama, scroll past to ignore.)
I never agreed not to allude to you holding a weird grudge, 'cuz you definitely do. I find that super bizarre, in addition to the repeated mentions of some rando user "warning" you about me. If only this mystery person had the Korok Seeds to come forward themselves, but alas.
I legit don't get how you're this bent outta shape over someone's video game takes. You'd think I was out here firing off on someone's mother, or whatever. I referred to you in a negative context because all you've done is behave in that way. You'll get back exactly the level of decency and respect you put in, and by that estimation, I owe you absolutely nothing, my man. You and me making up is all dependent on you admitting you're overreacting about all this. If you ain't willing to meet me halfway, I ain't gonna lose sleep over it.
I legit don't get how you're this bent outta shape over someone's video game takes. You'd think I was out here firing off on someone's mother, or whatever. I referred to you in a negative context because all you've done is behave in that way. You'll get back exactly the level of decency and respect you put in, and by that estimation, I owe you absolutely nothing, my man. You and me making up is all dependent on you admitting you're overreacting about all this. If you ain't willing to meet me halfway, I ain't gonna lose sleep over it.
D
Deleted member 2
Guest
Can you all just stop now? Seriously. Stop.
D
Deleted member 2
Guest
It's fine to get on each others' nerves. It'll happen to good people hanging around each other long enough.
But at this point you're both clogging up the discussion and it's embarrassing. I don't want to see it anymore.
If you really want to "own" someone, be the better famiposter and treat the other with genuine kindness and forgive them. That'll show 'em.
But at this point you're both clogging up the discussion and it's embarrassing. I don't want to see it anymore.
If you really want to "own" someone, be the better famiposter and treat the other with genuine kindness and forgive them. That'll show 'em.
- Pronouns
- He/him
If anything, after Elden Ring, I want all my games to be a cake walk for at least a year lol.
Malenia and Radagon broke me.
Malenia and Radagon broke me.
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Thanks man. I think that's a good place to leave it (for real this time). You're right. I apologize, everyone.
I'm just looking out for the community but I guess you already have mods for that and this fighting is not helping much. My bad.
Stay well, everyone.
I'm with you OP, Elden Ring is great and there's no shame in taking inspiration from the best. Part of what made the first BOTW great was the influence from other games; I don't wish for Nintendo to exist in a vacuum "doing their own thing", this is too much of a narrowminded viewpoint.
Also, while BOTW had tons of cool tricks which could have made combat unique, actual combat was so easy that I ended up never having to use those, and they remained exactly that: tricks, rather than full gameplay mechanics. I hope that the combat will be hard enough to force you to be more strategic rather than just brute forcing a moblin camp; and in this case, using the wind to burn a field, rolling a rock down a slope, bombing a camp by exploding the ballons holding a charge above it etc... would become really useful approaches.
I'm hopeful that they will expand on this, as the Master Mode and the trial of the sword were a bit like that, though the difficulty sometimes felt a bit showhorned rather than organic to the game; which is understandable as those modes were afterthoughts and not part of the original experience.
Also, while BOTW had tons of cool tricks which could have made combat unique, actual combat was so easy that I ended up never having to use those, and they remained exactly that: tricks, rather than full gameplay mechanics. I hope that the combat will be hard enough to force you to be more strategic rather than just brute forcing a moblin camp; and in this case, using the wind to burn a field, rolling a rock down a slope, bombing a camp by exploding the ballons holding a charge above it etc... would become really useful approaches.
I'm hopeful that they will expand on this, as the Master Mode and the trial of the sword were a bit like that, though the difficulty sometimes felt a bit showhorned rather than organic to the game; which is understandable as those modes were afterthoughts and not part of the original experience.
Simba1
Bob-omb
I don't see problem with difficulty of Zelda BotW,
But I think that rewarding in game is underwhelming, world quests will end up with discovering new shrine, finishing every new shrine will end end up with new orb, other kind of quests will end up simple with rupes...it became very fast predictable, game really lacs diversity and exitment (players not knowing what reward will be) when comes to rewarding.
But I think that rewarding in game is underwhelming, world quests will end up with discovering new shrine, finishing every new shrine will end end up with new orb, other kind of quests will end up simple with rupes...it became very fast predictable, game really lacs diversity and exitment (players not knowing what reward will be) when comes to rewarding.
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OP
OP
BlueManifest
Bob-omb
This is why difficulty is so important, it makes it so have to use things in order to win fights, without difficulty you just resort to the quickest way to kill them instead of the most unique way to kill them
Yes. And combined with the lack of enemy diversity, it made for a repetitve experience from a combat viewpoint.
Lynels were pretty cool because they at least forced you to be a bit creative; nothing crazy, but using ascending current mid-fight to throw an arrow to their face is pretty cool for example. I would have liked more enemies like this.
I enjoyed BOTW a lot for what it brought to the series, a lot of which (but not all of course) was borrowed from other games; I hope they continue to borrow the best ideas left and right for the sequel, and Elden Ring is a great example among others.
YolkFolk
Tingle
Funnily enough, Elden Ring borrowed a shit ton of original design from Breath of the Wild - one of the greatest games ever made. It’s all the better for it as well.
Glio
Octorok
- Pronouns
- He/Him
The problem is that we are talking about games with totally different focuses. I can't think of anything you can do in Elden Ring other than kill stuff. In BOTW you can play for hours without having to fight.
Of course their combats are different. How can they not be?
Of course their combats are different. How can they not be?
MarcelRguez
Typefaces enjoyer
- Pronouns
- They/Them
For those who have played Elden Ring: what are some examples of enemies that incentivize a different combat strategy than usual? I'm trying to think of examples from other Souls games, but there aren't that many that come to mind. The mimics and the brainsuckers in Bloodborne, maybe?
Besides, they definitely can design enemies that accomodate various strategies without making the game harder, necessarily. Think of the hinox with wooden armor you can set on fire, for instance.
The way I see it, this is completely backwards. The higher the difficulty, the more efficient you have to be in combat if you don't want to lose time and progress, and Souls games are a perfect example of this. If anything, regular enemies not posing that big of a threat and being easy to bully is what makes it fun to test things out on them.
Besides, they definitely can design enemies that accomodate various strategies without making the game harder, necessarily. Think of the hinox with wooden armor you can set on fire, for instance.
Glio
Octorok
- Pronouns
- He/Him
I agree with you. In difficult games I look for the most mathematically efficient strategy and I don't change it for anything. In easy games I can afford to experiment.
Example: Playing Uncharted 4 on easy when you can hook vs Playing Uncharted 4 on hard when you can't get out of cover for a second.
In Souls games I look for a strategy and I don't change it throughout the game because, really, I don't need it, if it's optimal I'm just going to use that. In BOTW I can see a group of bokoblins and think "Okay, how can I make it fun this time?".
OP
OP
BlueManifest
Bob-omb
Just looking at ff15 and how easy it was, I never used magic because 90% of the time it was faster to just use warp strike, there were hardly any enemies I felt like I had to use magic. It was just a waste of time to use it
If the game was harder I might have been like I need to try more tools to try to take this enemy down because warp strike alone isn’t cutting it
I only use what have to win
