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Nintendo Switch RTX
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I still can’t believe we’re getting a 12SM portable.
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Discussion Switch 2's DLSS implementation code has been stolen/leaked from NVidia
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Kenka
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This, I don't accept.
So far, there isn't any indication in the leaks that imply that the hardware is a portable.
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snikdasnek
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So any new info pointing to a release date or are we still fairly confident in late 22/early 23? Or are we not confident in that at all? Whats the latest?
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Well, it's apparently still referred to as NX in the documentation. It'd be odd if it was drastically different from the base NX concept.
There's been nothing new about release timing for a while, but no change in confidence for late 22/early 23 at least that I've seen.
Sol
Moblin
Time frame is November 2022 - April 2023.
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snikdasnek
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Sounds good, I'm prepping for the pre-order wars as we speak
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Agreed.
Because Drake isn't a successor
I guess I post so much that I didn't even notice my tag changed.
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D
Deleted member 887
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State outright? No. Imply? Yes.
The custom chip has has GPU clock gating features forward ported from the X1, not available in other Ampere chips.
I did a little digging and was able to find some other references to FLCG in Android source, specifically in Tegra drivers. Looking into how the feature works, it could just be for the Switch's suspend implementation, but it seems unusual that you would just use the existing Ampere suspend abilities, unless you had some specific need to gate off parts of hardware, like in a portable device.
Perhaps it's for standby mode somehow? The Switch can partially wake up while in standby for downloads and save data backups.
Kenka
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Thank you. This is interesting, indeed.
Simba1
Bob-omb
I could also see lower price point for Switch Lite at some point or packed with game, but not below $149, not to mention $99.
Linkstrikesback
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It's a product from Nintendo. The last time they released a piece of hardware that didn't allow for off TV play was more than 15 years ago.
It's extremely unlikely Nintendo designs a piece of hardware ever again that isn't capable of natively being played away from a TV, because the portable market is where they've consistently found success. Even at times where the console side wasn't a drag on the business, it was still being ran circles around by the handhelds.
Kenka
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You give me an excuse to jump back in the topic: maybe the T239 is not meant for a portable but for a transportable, like a VR-headset.
It could be heavier than a Switch, more bulky than a Switch and still be used as a standalone device.
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Linkstrikesback
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Not impossible, I suppose, but I have trouble imagining it being worth spending so much energy on something that by its very nature is kind of against the Nintendo spirit of wanting people playing together, and also pretty limited in appeal unless they have some major breakthrough to turn VR from requiring a bunch of clunky equipment in to something as easy to use as a simple screen on a device, but I haven't the slightest clue how that could be achieved.
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Considering the market for VR, I doubt it. It’s still pretty small.
And a bulky/heavy VR headset isn’t exactly something they’d aim to do. They try to go for small and light unlike the other platforms that say “MORE POWER”
Kenka
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These points are valid.
But to add to the plausibility of this theory, I will add that the Oculus Quest 2 weighs in at 500g (which is too much) and a Switch 300g. A bulkier Switch that would be inbetween could be a valid candidate for a VR-headset.
Of course, there are other scenarios that would explain why T239 is bigger than what we expect for a unit that has the Switch's form factor.
Tentacle-tropes
Kremling
Bonus glasses free 3D
D
Deleted member 2548
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While I don't think that Nintendo will pursue VR in a serious manner with this Switch revision, it would be a neat bonus. The Switch already has proven its value between handheld and docked mode that if they got something like RE7VR, SUPERHOT VR or whatever in addition, I'd probably still check it out over picking up another dedicated device even if the weight / set up is less than ideal.
I feel like a Switch that does VR as well will be possible in a few years and is an advenue that Nintendo could easily go to if they want to. I feel like this could a gimmick strong enough to advertise a successor if it can just transform into a VR headset with the console itself.
It would also be the best way to make the VR market mainstream. It would be very simple and low cost compared to buying a PS5 and a PSVR 2.
It would also be the best way to make the VR market mainstream. It would be very simple and low cost compared to buying a PS5 and a PSVR 2.
Honestly, I would prefer Nintendo to go the other direction and pursue AR, which is really cool and lends itself to Nintendo and their design philosophy. They toyed with it in cute little ways with 3DS, and I enjoyed how Bravely Default used it, so would love a full scale expansion of that.
I can handle AR. I cannot handle VR (makes me sick)
I can handle AR. I cannot handle VR (makes me sick)
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AR would probably be more of a use case for AI too, which is something they'll likely try to experiment with using tensor cores.
I can definitely see this coming with a camera or two.
Dark Cloud
Warpstar Knight
I’m pretty sure I’ve said Nintendo will go the VR/AR route. I think more so AR. Nintendo was concerned about VR secluding you off to everyone else. If they can figure that out or if they’re not concerned about it then VR can work too.
That’s another issue I have with VR. It’s cool on small doses for me when I use PSVR, but I don’t like being secluded like that. Another reason I prefer handheld gaming in general.
ShadowFox08
Paratroopa
Dark Cloud
Warpstar Knight
Linkstrikesback
Starman
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I'm pretty sure Nintendo won't have any interest in exploring AR in a console again. They already tried it briefly with the 3DS, with some of the inbuilt software and Pokémon dream radar, the denpa men and then later Pokémon go and pikmin bloom, but it's just not the kind of thing that makes for immersive yet easy to understand new gameplay experiences which Nintendo is all about. Building a specific piece of hardware around the idea would be a bad idea, I'd be tempted to say Wii U level catastrophic mistake.
AR is good for editing in to fantasy scenes in movies to give a futuristic look how advanced our tech is vibe, but in real life it hits the same roadblock that it's way more of a pain in the arse than just putting things on a TV or handheld screen and there's no way around it being impractical for general use, and not having many actual applications to videogames outside of a very small, very limited number of genres
AR is good for editing in to fantasy scenes in movies to give a futuristic look how advanced our tech is vibe, but in real life it hits the same roadblock that it's way more of a pain in the arse than just putting things on a TV or handheld screen and there's no way around it being impractical for general use, and not having many actual applications to videogames outside of a very small, very limited number of genres
Dark Cloud
Warpstar Knight
Remember when VR was limited in the 90’s. Yeah things change and advance that we can’t imagine.
You can say VR and AR are issues now, yes I would agree. But they will evolve. AR seems not very immersive and VR you’re too secluded at the moment. Anything going outside of a screen in your hands will be not so immersive. I’m confident they’ll get there in the future.
You can say VR and AR are issues now, yes I would agree. But they will evolve. AR seems not very immersive and VR you’re too secluded at the moment. Anything going outside of a screen in your hands will be not so immersive. I’m confident they’ll get there in the future.
SiG
Chain Chomp
Dunno if I agree with you, given how Mario Kart Live was something totally out of the blue and didn't seem likely given what you've mentioned, yet they still released it...and on top of which, have given support for it in the form of free updates. And that is AR.
Linkstrikesback
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There's a fundamental difference between making a couple of small add on games and designing a console around a feature.
I would say looking at how well the brief flirts with AR on switch have done, like Mario kart live and Labo compared with all the much huger successes on Switch to see why pivoting to those as the primary thing for the console isn't a great idea.
The problem as far as I can see it is that it's practically impossible through sheer physics limitations to simultaneously make something that people are dreaming of when we talk about AR and the realities of what can be achieved. It's not possible to make big old holograms or whatever appear on your table without a very specifically designed room for it.
You'd have to somehow make it as effortless for the user to set up as plugging a cable or two in to your existing TV, or even less if we're talking about a handheld device, while also being universal to people's incredibly varied living arrangements, and no amount of technological evolution is going to get over that hurdle.
That's not to say there isn't plenty of room for AR experiences at things like the Nintendo world theme park in Japan, those are the kind of controlled experiences where that can thrive, but they're not going to become a financial success trying to do that in people's homes.
Fun fact: while it has a 2, there wasn't much more to this than different borders and a link cable port. It still couldn't do GBC games.
I love that we have people insisting it'll have a 2 to clearly mark its role as a successor and people arguing it's not quite a successor in the same thread. I think I once hypothesized that Nintendo would avoid a 2 specifically so that people who just bought a Switch wouldn't panic or be turned off of the ecosystem; I still stand by that.
D
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Sorry for doing a "Well Actually", but that's... the amusing thing about the Super Game Boy 2. You're correct mostly, but it's "technically" weaker. And by weaker, the CPU is now clocked properly and accurate on the device, so the games run at the proper speed, rather than slightly faster. Most people would never notice it too, which is kinda fascinating and likely why it didn't get caught originally.
Weird that Nintendo never fixed it on the original release, but eh.
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Update, there are apparently references to "abca2" where "abca" is Nintendo's designation for the hybrid form factor (notably not the OLED model form factor). Also with "hos" which refers to the Switch's OS.
So it seems this is a hybrid.
Serif
𝕽𝖊𝖓𝖊𝖌𝖆𝖉𝖊 𝕬𝖓𝖌𝖊𝖑
Switch tablet in a VR headset + wirelessly streaming the image so other people can see it can address the seclusion issue, especially if they have asymmetrical multiplayer.
I really liked the Switch VR implementations so far, I enjoyed my time with BotW and Captain Toad's VR modes. Actually, BotW's VR mode felt so much like Ocarina/Majora 3D, I genuinely said "wow" when I entered the final boss and could look up during the Ganon boss fights at the cocoon. And this is with a 720p screen with the game rendering at a headache-inducing res and framerate.
Selling a dedicated headset for the Switch tablet to slot into would work so well with the "Switching" concept, effectively adding a 4th configuration. Then further down the line they can release a dedicated VR device with the same chipset and foveated rendering.
I really liked the Switch VR implementations so far, I enjoyed my time with BotW and Captain Toad's VR modes. Actually, BotW's VR mode felt so much like Ocarina/Majora 3D, I genuinely said "wow" when I entered the final boss and could look up during the Ganon boss fights at the cocoon. And this is with a 720p screen with the game rendering at a headache-inducing res and framerate.
Selling a dedicated headset for the Switch tablet to slot into would work so well with the "Switching" concept, effectively adding a 4th configuration. Then further down the line they can release a dedicated VR device with the same chipset and foveated rendering.
Kenka
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Here we go!
ReyVGM
Game Endings Master
OP
OP
Dcubed
Paratroopa
I'm betting that it was originally a cost-saving measure, but it ended up bothering the designers (and Japanese consumers) to such an extent that they rushed out the "bug-fixed" SGB2 for Japanese release; but then it ended up langushing in limbo within Nintendo's warehouses for years and years because they needed to get rid of their SGB1 inventory first... which took much longer than they anticipated.
It's the only reason I can think of for why it ended up coming out in the same year as the GBC, but with no GBC compatibility; and in one region only, for a dead platform 2 years after it had been succeeded by the N64. It's a really bizzare product!
Not quite. abca2 was the designation for the LCD Switch (HAC models). abca without the 2 was from an older internal Nvidia project that was taken over to eventually become the Switch and never released.
Any references to abca2 are very, very likely referring to the old hardware, which NVN2 clearly supported at one time (which makes sense, since it likely grew out of NVN). Even the OLED model, which is very similar, is abcd.
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Oh whoops, that clears some things up! Thank you!
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That's not so different from what 3DS did with its tracking cards, except with improved modern camera tracking you could basically ditch the cards and just tell it where the corners of the table are. Similar things are doable with Quest now, though the cameras were really only intended for tracking so it makes for a bit of an uncomfortable grayscale visual.
I believe ML is a game changer in what can be done in this space. Remember, this technology is repurposed hardware for self driving cars.
If Orin is capable of actually driving a car around safely in traffic based on camera inputs, don’t you think it can do some pretty crazy stuff in AR?
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It's cut down hardware for self driving cars, with a lot of the stuff specific to self driving cars being the stuff that's cut out. It's not nearly as AI capable as Orin from what I understand.
Still has a decent amount of tensor cores. They can be used for other thing than dlss.
Demon Lizardman
Rattata
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So, how powerful will this thing be?
My Tulpa
Bob-omb
It could play the ps4 pro version of Spider-man better than the ps4 pro. If it really wanted to.
Sol
Moblin
Around a PS4 in handheld mode, and around a PS4 Pro when docked. And that's before DLSS.
That's for GPU performance. Unless Nintendo goes incredibly cheap with the CPU configuration, it will run circles around the PS4/Pro, and will fall somewhere in between the PS4 and PS5 in CPU performance.
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