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StarTopic Future Nintendo Hardware & Technology Speculation & Discussion |ST| (New Staff Post, Please read)

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Issen said:
Not just battery technology, as increasing the power envelope will also result in increased noise and heat output. Both are undesirable on their own for a handheld device, even assuming infinite battery life.
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Ha ha indeed. My post DEFINITELY isn't helping with any of that.
 
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Hermii said:
I imagine its trivial to patch in new dynamic res parameters though. You probably just need to edit the switch equalient of a .ini file.
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I was talking about without a specific game patch, which the original reply was asking with respect to.
 
Hermii said:
It’s about damn time we have something new to discuss in this thread.
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You guys can discuss this:
careers.nintendo.com

Job Openings - Careers at Nintendo of America

CONTRACT - Software Engineer (NTD), Software Development
careers.nintendo.com careers.nintendo.com

Just saw it on their recruitment site.

The NTD Hardware group designs and manufactures FPGA and Linux based embedded systems in support of global Nintendo operations. The ideal candidate has extensive knowledge and experience with board support packages, kernel configuration, and device integration in an embedded Linux environment, such as PetaLinux or Yocto.

DESCRIPTION OF DUTIES

  • Compose script for Device Tree overlays for custom Xilinx FPGA based embedded systems. These Device-Trees include both modules internal to the FPGA as well as external peripheral IC’s.
  • Configure Linux kernel to remove unused modules and other software while integrating custom applications and kernel modules to support customer requirements.
  • Assist debugging of hardware from the Linux side. Resolve issues where the hardware runs under bare metal testing but does not work properly under Linux or is not recognized by the Linux OS.
  • Ensure that our custom board is fully integrated into targeted frameworks, such as Gstreamer. Make recommendations to the hardware group for any necessary modifications.
  • Compose device drivers where they do not already exist or assist hardware team in selection of equivalent components that are supported under the targeted Linux distribution


SUMMARY OF REQUIREMENTS
  • Strong understanding of source control (e.g., Git) and branching strategies.
  • Knowledge and understanding of software product development, related tools and testing paradigms.
  • Experience with embedded Linux and kernel configuration of new custom platforms.
  • Knowledge of I2C, UART, Video Frameworks, Ethernet, AXI4, and GPIO modules in an embedded Linux environment and how to connect or mount these hardware peripherals so that Linux applications can access them.
  • Experience with Zynq UltraScale + MPSOC devices and the Xilinx development environment including Vitis, Vivado, and PetaLinux SDK. Emphasis is on Vitis and PetaLinux SDK. Vivado experience is a plus.
  • Expert knowledge of bitbake and the Yocto framework for customizing Linux distributions in embedded projects is required.
  • Expert knowledge of how the Xilinx tools export information about the FPGA logic to the PetaLinux kernel and how to debug projects in this environment is required as well as how to add information for external components outside of the FPGA using device tree overlays and other layer or packaging mechanisms in PetaLinux.
  • Expert knowledge of video streaming frameworks and how they call into the Linux kernel. This includes Gstreamer, v4l2, media-ctl, and other generic tools such as modetest.
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Clearly Nintendo is going to AMD /s
 
ReddDreadtheLead said:
You guys can discuss this:
careers.nintendo.com

Job Openings - Careers at Nintendo of America

CONTRACT - Software Engineer (NTD), Software Development
careers.nintendo.com careers.nintendo.com

Just saw it on their recruitment site.



Clearly Nintendo is going to AMD /s
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  • Configure Linux kernel to remove unused modules and other software while integrating custom applications and kernel modules to support customer requirements.
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Guess they want to tighten up any potential leaks from dataminers going through the firmware updates lol
 
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Dakhil said:
Nintendo's cloud gaming service powered by AMD and Nvidia?!
/jk
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Usually the top item in a job post would be the primary task.
  • Compose script for Device Tree overlays for custom Xilinx FPGA based embedded systems. These Device-Trees include both modules internal to the FPGA as well as external peripheral IC’s.
  • Configure Linux kernel to remove unused modules and other software while integrating custom applications and kernel modules to support customer requirements.
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Is Nintendo building some sort of FPGA based device for BC? perhaps another classic console?
 
Dekuman said:
Usually the top item in a job post would be the primary task.

Is Nintendo building some sort of FPGA based device for BC? perhaps another classic console?
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This is what I was wondering...
Then again a classic console currently goes against them pushing NSO.
 
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Dekuman said:
Is Nintendo building some sort of FPGA based device for BC? perhaps another classic console?
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I presume that depends on which Xilinx FPGA embedded system Nintendo's going to use as the base for Nintendo's custom FPGA embedded system for the former.
 
Jeff Grubb / Mike Minotti latest Last of the Nintendogs (live now) is following up on the recent Direct, and has them speculating once again that the window for a "Pro" has passed, and that a proper successor may just arrive in 2024.

@NateDrake , can we expect a similar discussion on your end soon? Have you heard anything on the subject more recently, and if so, are you in a position to share?
 
This week's Digital Foundry Direct has a tiny little Switch 4K segment where John makes exactly the face I have when thinking of the Switch 4K. Yearning. Trepidatious. Insecure.

Que a fitting Backstreet Boys song.
 
Hermii said:
I Haven’t got the faintest idea what this is.

Edit: could this be about porting the Switch OS to a new SOC?
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In the context of a consumer devices, FPGAs would be mainly used to prototype new integrate circuits. Companies like Nvidia, AMD, Intel, etc, use them as an important step in validating new designs, but they're also useful when designing any kind of integrated circuit, big or small. Nintendo obviously don't design their own SoC, but their hardware often includes a lot of custom ICs, and there's nothing stopping them designing their own chips in-house if they have a very specific need that wouldn't be covered by off-the-shelf hardware. They could also be doing pre-silicon integration testing for a part that another company is designing for them.

As to what they're specifically building in this case, I can offer some speculation. The posting specifically mentions Gstreamer in the duties, which is a multimedia framework. They also mention V4L2, which is collection of video capture drivers for Linux, and media-ctl, which is part of V4L and is also, unsurprisingly, related to media on Linux. Therefore, it seems likely that they're prototyping a chip which handles audio or video capture, streaming or playback in some form or another.

A standalone codec chip is unlikely, as that would be covered by Nvidia's codec hardware on the SoC. Any kind of standard camera, display or audio device could also be ruled out, as they're all handled by easily available* standard ICs. I would hazard a guess that wireless video/audio streaming of some kind is possible. Nintendo obviously did this before with Wii U (using Broadcom hardware, I believe), and it's exactly the sort of use-case where they may want a custom IC to minimise latency. Streaming from a handheld to a TV, or vice-versa, is definitely plausible, although they've already done that with Wii U, and the Switch approach of simply docking the "handheld" has clearly been more successful for them.

My slightly out-there prediction is that it's for streaming to some kind of AR headset. I saw people were recently discussing the use of a new Switch model to slot into a VR headset (a "proper" version of Labo VR, so to speak), but I don't think that's very likely. Firstly because the headset would be very front-heavy and uncomfortable for anything other than short play sessions, but also because I don't think the closed off format of VR is something Nintendo is particularly interested in (which they've stated in multiple interviews). Local multiplayer is still an important feature for Nintendo, and more than that, Koizumi stated that during development of the Switch being able to play games while facing each other was something they wanted to achieve:

Ever since the first prototype back in the early days of development, I would ask Kawamoto: “Couldn’t we make a game where players look each other in the face?” That idea eventually gave birth to 1-2-Switch, but this wasn’t a concept we came up with out of the blue. It was something we had wanted to do for a very long time. We would often wonder why it was that you could play card games face to face with your opponents, but not video games. Our company originally made karuta and playing cards, so it has been a very influential concept for us since the early days.
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VR is pretty much the opposite of this, but local AR multiplayer would fit directly into this vision. Being able to share an augmented reality space would allow people to play video games while facing each other, not just the TV, and I could see Nintendo's game designers having a lot of fun with it. Nintendo have been playing with AR for a while, from the built-in 3DS games to Mario Kart Home Circuit on Switch just over a year ago. They also have experience with low-latency video streaming, and taking a wireless streaming approach to AR (as opposed to other AR headsets, which I believe pretty much all have in-headset processing) would allow for both lower cost for the headset, and better graphical hardware behind it.

Of course even with wireless streaming sorted, Nintendo would have to fix a lot of issues with current AR hardware. Price being the obvious and most important one, but also limited field of view being another. There's also the issue that, if you want to use them for local multiplayer, you'll need multiple headsets (price again), and would a single console be able to stream to multiple headsets, or does everyone need both a console and a headset?

I could see it being a part of Nintendo's post-Switch plans in 2025 or 2026 or so. There seems to be a lot of money going into developing consumer AR hardware at the moment, so Nintendo may be able to leverage some of that research and reduced component costs. They could release a device which can still play in handheld and/or TV modes, but also supports wireless AR headsets. Keep BC with Switch, but make it very much its own thing with the AR support.

*Well, aside from the general chip shortage, but designing your own display driver IC isn't going to help you with that.
 
karmitt said:
Jeff Grubb / Mike Minotti latest Last of the Nintendogs (live now) is following up on the recent Direct, and has them speculating once again that the window for a "Pro" has passed, and that a proper successor may just arrive in 2024.

@NateDrake , can we expect a similar discussion on your end soon? Have you heard anything on the subject more recently, and if so, are you in a position to share?
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Such a topic of discussion is being considered but I'd want to approach it in a different manner.

As for the topic of additional information on the hardware planning front... nothing new. Devkits are out and software is in production. Whether it is positioned as a Switch 2 or whatever is for Nintendo to decide.
 
Pokemaniac said:
The specific combination of Linux and FPGA suggests something like the classic mini consoles to me, at least as a customer facing product.
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I would be very surprised if Nintendo used an FPGA in any consumer product. Mini consoles make the most sense, but Nintendo are clearly happy using (much cheaper) emulation for that purpose. They've also already released NES and SNES minis, and when you get to N64 you'd need an FPGA which really pushes the limit of affordable consumer hardware. Particularly when a cheap off-the-shelf ARM SoC would give them a level of emulation they're clearly happy about providing on Switch. In fact, given the likely sales numbers, if they actually got the N64 fully running on an FPGA, it would very likely end up cheaper to use those files to do a run of hardware-compatible N64 chips on an old process like 28nm rather than using the FPGAs in consumer hardware themselves.
 
Thraktor said:
I would be very surprised if Nintendo used an FPGA in any consumer product. Mini consoles make the most sense, but Nintendo are clearly happy using (much cheaper) emulation for that purpose. They've also already released NES and SNES minis, and when you get to N64 you'd need an FPGA which really pushes the limit of affordable consumer hardware. Particularly when a cheap off-the-shelf ARM SoC would give them a level of emulation they're clearly happy about providing on Switch. In fact, given the likely sales numbers, if they actually got the N64 fully running on an FPGA, it would very likely end up cheaper to use those files to do a run of hardware-compatible N64 chips on an old process like 28nm rather than using the FPGAs in consumer hardware themselves.
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I'm sure they could use a relatively cheap one for their handhelds, but software emulation has historically not been a huge issue for those.

The Linux part is weird, because it suggests something relatively standalone so there won't be a Switch around to drive it.
 
NateDrake said:
Such a topic of discussion is being considered but I'd want to approach it in a different manner.

As for the topic of additional information on the hardware planning front... nothing new. Devkits are out and software is in production. Whether it is positioned as a Switch 2 or whatever is for Nintendo to decide.
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Do you mean that the device is still targetting a window around the end of 2022 and the beginning of 2023 ?

I don't think it is reasonable to expect ready software from 3rd party publishers to sit 1 year unused
 
NintenDuvo said:
So if Nintendo does release the next generation of Switch in 2024, about how powerful can it be and will backwards compatibly be able to be easily implemented?
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Roughly the same as what it would look like in 2022 unless there's something Nvidia's not telling us about between Orin and Atlan. The hardware could potentially be pushed a bit harder on a better manufacturing node, but that's about it.
 
Pokemaniac said:
Roughly the same as what it would look like in 2022 unless there's something Nvidia's not telling us about between Orin and Atlan. The hardware could potentially be pushed a bit harder on a better manufacturing node, but that's about it.
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I meant like in terms of raw output power would it be around Xbox one S, PS4, PS4 pro, or Xbox one X?
 
NateDrake said:
Such a topic of discussion is being considered but I'd want to approach it in a different manner.

As for the topic of additional information on the hardware planning front... nothing new. Devkits are out and software is in production. Whether it is positioned as a Switch 2 or whatever is for Nintendo to decide.
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Yeah, although I do say we likely will figure out if it's coming this year by April/Early May with Nintendo's Financial Expectations meeting for FY2022.

If they expect to sell 24+M Units in this situation they have to be getting those extra units from somewhere, that somewhere likely being Dane.

Either that or a Tape-Out leak before that.
 
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NateDrake said:
Last window I had heard was still by H1 2023 but that was months ago. As said, I've heard nothing new on the plans.
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Honestly with how this year is with BOTW2 still targeting 2022 seemingly they really want it to be in 2022 but aren't going to pull the trigger until they can be as certain as they can BOTW2 will make it in 2022
 
Alovon11 said:
Honestly with how this year is with BOTW2 still targeting 2022 seemingly they really want it to be in 2022 but aren't going to pull the trigger until they can be as certain as they can BOTW2 will make it in 2022
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Personally, I'm waiting for GDC and hoping industry chatter at GDC brings forth new light on their plans in regards to the hardware.
 
NateDrake said:
Personally, I'm waiting for GDC and hoping industry chatter at GDC brings forth new light on their plans in regards to the hardware.
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When is GDC again?

The generally accepted latest time for Tape out for Dane is May for an November launch and their Financial Expectation Meeting will likely be in April so is it before those two points?
 
NateDrake said:
Personally, I'm waiting for GDC and hoping industry chatter at GDC brings forth new light on their plans in regards to the hardware.
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Yeah it feels to me that if we don't hear any chatter at or after GDC then something happened and we shouldn't really expect to see this soon anymore.

Nintendo's financial briefing in May will also be telling.
 
Skittzo said:
Yeah it feels to me that if we don't hear any chatter at or after GDC then something happened and we shouldn't really expect to see this soon anymore.

Nintendo's financial briefing in May will also be telling.
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I thought it was Mid-Late April to Early May
 
Alovon11 said:
Okay, so we should hopefully hear something about it in the spring then with GDC in March, Financial Expectations in April, and Latest Tape Out for 2022 in May
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Yeah given that GDC is the first big in person event in a while, if something is coming in the next 12 months there should be some gossip that gets out from GDC.
 
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NateDrake said:
Such a topic of discussion is being considered but I'd want to approach it in a different manner.

As for the topic of additional information on the hardware planning front... nothing new. Devkits are out and software is in production. Whether it is positioned as a Switch 2 or whatever is for Nintendo to decide.
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Great to hear devkits are out and software in production
 
Dark Cloud said:
Great to hear devkits are out and software in production
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Honestly really hoping we get a power target for the Devkits in relation to another console.

Like, is pre-DLSS docked PS4 level? Higher?
Is post DLSS docked better than the Series S's Native presentation?

Things like that as it is more helpful than predicting what exactly 4SM Dane versus 8SM Dane can do as they both should be able to render the same image if the former is set to higher clocks (DLSS maybe not so)
 
NateDrake said:
Last window I had heard was still by H1 2023 but that was months ago. As said, I've heard nothing new on the plans.
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I still think it's wild that they'd have such a device and choose to release Breath of the Wild 2 before it. It just doesn't make sense - the year is clearly stacked already, far more than many prior years.
 
Yeah, we have to wait a bit more, I am sure something will leak at GDC, but before that we'll probably get nothing unless we get another Mochizuki miracle scoop, though that may also happen after and as a result of GDC.
 
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I just hope something leak that shows more tangible proof that a more powerful Switch exists, im just pessimistic that Nintendo is going to run this current Switch into the ground for dreadfully the next 5 years, they need to finally end a generation on a high note
 
GDC and Furukawa talking to investors are definitely the big key times to pay attention too. Furukawa is pretty good with denying any kind of new hardware coming. So if he wafers or give not any definitive “no” answer then it’s coming.
 
Dark Cloud said:
GDC and Furukawa talking to investors are definitely the big key times to pay attention too. Furukawa is pretty good with denying any kind of new hardware coming. So if he wafers or give not any definitive “no” answer then it’s coming.
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Wait so its confirmed that Furukawa himself is going to be at GDC
 
Dark Cloud said:
GDC and Furukawa talking to investors are definitely the big key times to pay attention too. Furukawa is pretty good with denying any kind of new hardware coming. So if he wafers or give not any definitive “no” answer then it’s coming.
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I’m also sure even if he gave a definitive “no” people on places like here will hyper-analyze what he said to come to their preferred conclusion anyway. Never mind that we have already established that Nintendo “lies” all the time so their word shouldn’t be trusted no matter what they say.

Anyway we’ll se what he has to say. His words won’t have any meaning if people don’t hear about a tape-out within the next few months.

Edit: there is also zero reason to delay BOTW2 if the software is ready and hardware isn’t. Like what you gonna delay it a year if hardware isn’t slated to come out until late 2023 or even 2024.
 
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Tentacle-tropes said:
Edit: there is also zero reason to delay BOTW2 if the software is ready and hardware isn’t. Like what you gonna delay it a year if hardware isn’t slated to come out until late 2023 or even 2024.
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If the hardware wasn't ready until 2024 - no. But we've only been hearing late 2022 or early 2023 from Bloomberg's last report + what Nate's heard.

So yes, I would 100% delay BotW2 to release 3-6 months later if it's aligned with new hardware. There's literally no better title in the pipeline to sell a premium piece of hardware than BotW2, and the game itself would benefit from being previewed / reviewed under more favorable conditions.
 
karmitt said:
If the hardware wasn't ready until 2024 - no. But we've only been hearing late 2022 or early 2023 from Bloomberg's last report + what Nate's heard.

So yes, I would 100% delay BotW2 to release 3-6 months later if it's aligned with new hardware. There's literally no better title in the pipeline to sell a premium piece of hardware than BotW2, and the game itself would benefit from being previewed / reviewed under more favorable conditions.
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Indeed.
Software can get pushed back far easier than hardware
 
karmitt said:
If the hardware wasn't ready until 2024 - no. But we've only been hearing late 2022 or early 2023 from Bloomberg's last report + what Nate's heard.

So yes, I would 100% delay BotW2 to release 3-6 months later if it's aligned with new hardware. There's literally no better title in the pipeline to sell a premium piece of hardware than BotW2, and the game itself would benefit from being previewed / reviewed under more favorable conditions.
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Okay, if Bloomberg and Nate are wrong with the hardware slipping into late 2023?

You’ll what delay it a year still? Go into E3 again and tell people, “please understand we’re delaying BOTW2 till next year”. Torpedo any marketing plans that have BOTW2 as your holiday title. What would you replace it with? I don’t see any reason to delay BOTW2 if the software is ready and the hardware isn’t. Otherwise there is literally zero reason to release all the games this year instead of “saving it” to sell a premium device. Then we get back into old Nintendo having super dry periods because all their pipeline is focused on the next devices. Also no one frankly cares outside enthusiasts if BOTW2 is reviewed/previewed under better conditions since it is going to preview/review well anyway.
 
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