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StarTopic Donkey Kong Community |ST| No Country For Old Kongs

I know there was a huge emphasis on the 3D models in the advertising of DKC when it first came out, but the box calling it a "3D adventure" always seemed very disingenuous to me.
 
Joe said:
I know there was a huge emphasis on the 3D models in the advertising of DKC when it first came out, but the box calling it a "3D adventure" always seemed very disingenuous to me.
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"3D" was just a marketing buzzword at the time. It was very novel in the 90s. DKC1 came out before Toy Story even.
 
This thread has had me thinking about Donkey Kong a lot and it made me remember what is conceptually (and maybe also?) my favorite boss battle in the series.

 
If anybody's looking for DKC-like games, I think Kaze is worth checking out. Tbh not really a fan of the art style but besides that, I think it's a pretty solid game, the gameplay reminds me a lot of DKC1.
 
Codacious said:
If anybody's looking for DKC-like games, I think Kaze is worth checking out. Tbh not really a fan of the art style but besides that, I think it's a pretty solid game, the gameplay reminds me a lot of DKC1.
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I totally agree, it's really under-appreciated. The first world felt like it aped DK a bit too much, but after that it really comes into its own.
 
PikminSnezkov said:
The DMs are fabricated.

I got in touch with both of the recipients, and they both told me they don't remember that conversation ever happening. Both were flabbergasted by the fake DMs.
Don't take my word for it, try reaching out to them yourself. Show them the DM and say "Hey this was circulated to me, is it real?" And they'll let you know what they told me.

This is my last message on this thread btw. This DK story needs more fact-checking than Donald Trump's Twitter.
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You don't even know who I talked to besides one guy and I told you he hadn't heard of anything. Why you have to lie so hard man? You don't have to like me, but I literally only told you about 1 single contact by name and I told you that person said he hadn't heard anything about this at all.
 
I'd also want to say that I love how Nintendo is treating Metroid lately and sincerely hope that Donkey Kong will start getting the same treatment. The series deserve having new 2D and 3D entries and remasters of older titles (at least DKC Returns).

I believe it's happening, even the fact that DK plays a big role in the movie makes me hopefull. Bring it on!!!
 
Codacious said:
If anybody's looking for DKC-like games, I think Kaze is worth checking out. Tbh not really a fan of the art style but besides that, I think it's a pretty solid game, the gameplay reminds me a lot of DKC1.
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Seconded! I agree about the artstyle, but everything else is great.

The game was made by a Brazilian studio, and the SNES DKC games were hugely popular in Brazil in the 90s, I could tell you first hand. So this is a labor of love from childhood fans.
 
Upcoming Kongversation covering the Activision 2016 cancelled Donkey Kong game

And the Mario movie is only 13 days away!

We eating good out here 🍴 🍽
 
Something else that might bold well for the DK movie rumors is that we don't have any DK toys based on the Mario film. Considering DK has important role in the film, you'd think there would be a toy of him. Perhaps they are saving that for something... special. 🤔

This has been Nathan's random thoughts of the day. 🐒
 



full


pls
 
Nathan Little said:
Something else that might bold well for the DK movie rumors is that we don't have any DK toys based on the Mario film. Considering DK has important role in the film, you'd think there would be a toy of him. Perhaps they are saving that for something... special. 🤔

This has been Nathan's random thoughts of the day. 🐒
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Great catch. All we have as far as DK related Mario movie merch is the Jungle Kingdom hotwheels and the McDonald's toy of DK. Considering how essential he is to the movie, you'd expect a proper figure, a plush and much much more, yet we have so little.
 
I replayed DKC3 in a very casual playthrough and just beat the game.

I honestly think it's really good. Graphically, it's absolutely gorgeous, looking like it could have come from a 32-bit console at times. The brighter and more cartoony art style is debatable but I think it's fine, personally.

I know the game gets a bad rap for all the gimmick levels, but I actually didn't mind them at all. It kept the game feeling fresh and it never got in the way of the tight platforming, which is still as good as ever.

As a kid, the overworld always captured my imagination and felt like I was on a grand adventure, but looking at it now, it is very limited in scale and doesn't really do much with the concept. Just kind of a fancier level select at the end of the day. I think the way the overworld was laid out meant that the game felt like it just kind of ended with no real build-up or climax. The first two DKCs had a very clear measure of progress and made you well aware when you are approaching the end, with DKC2 being especially dramatic about it. This game kind of had me like "oh, this is the final world, isn't it". All of the worlds are kind of samey with no real specific theming, which I guess makes them fit into a larger world but at the same time gets rid of some of the adventurous feeling.

All that aside, I still had a great time with it.
 
PikminSnezkov said:
The DMs are fabricated.

I got in touch with both of the recipients, and they both told me they don't remember that conversation ever happening. Both were flabbergasted by the fake DMs.
Don't take my word for it, try reaching out to them yourself. Show them the DM and say "Hey this was circulated to me, is it real?" And they'll let you know what they told me.

This is my last message on this thread btw. This DK story needs more fact-checking than Donald Trump's Twitter.
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NintendoPrime said:
You don't even know who I talked to besides one guy and I told you he hadn't heard of anything. Why you have to lie so hard man? You don't have to like me, but I literally only told you about 1 single contact by name and I told you that person said he hadn't heard anything about this at all.
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Yeah, at this point I only 50% believe VV did something DK-related (could be anything). I'm not going any further than that.

I've always been skeptical about this DK project because the one trustable insider source I know (Emily) has heard little about it. I respect Nate, but I do know he sometimes falls to cyclical sources. DKVine for all I know has no actual credibility. The feeling is that there has never been any serious attempt to fact-check things regarding this potential game due to a severe case of wishful thinking going on, so everybody is free to create their own rumors.
 
KCannon said:
Yeah, at this point I only 50% believe VV did something DK-related (could be anything). I'm not going any further than that.

I've always been skeptical about this DK project because the one trustable insider source I know (Emily) has heard little about it. I respect Nate, but I do know he sometimes falls to cyclical sources. DKVine for all I know has no actual credibility. The feeling is that there has never been any serious attempt to fact-check things regarding this potential game due to a severe case of wishful thinking going on, so everybody is free to create their own rumors.
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About what DK project? One is long dead and there is a current active DK project. The two have nothing in common beyond using DK. NintendoLife reported on the active DK project citing their own sources.

I've said it before in here: the VV information never should have been shared publicly because the details were limited and, in most cases, never verified. How far the game even got remains to be determined -- companies pitch ideas all the time & there exists the realistic possibility it may have never advanced beyond that stage. I've not backed nor supported a single claim about the game's concept or direction because I could never verify a single bit of that information.

It's not worth the time nor discussion it has received.
 
KCannon said:
Yeah, at this point I only 50% believe VV did something DK-related (could be anything). I'm not going any further than that.

I've always been skeptical about this DK project because the one trustable insider source I know (Emily) has heard little about it. I respect Nate, but I do know he sometimes falls to cyclical sources. DKVine for all I know has no actual credibility. The feeling is that there has never been any serious attempt to fact-check things regarding this potential game due to a severe case of wishful thinking going on, so everybody is free to create their own rumors.
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You have the right to believe whatever you want to believe. I don't act like I know everything and everything I say is just regurgitated from the Kongversation podcast which I've been a regular listener to since 2018.

The thing about Hyle and DK Vine is he's not a leaker. He has no interest in playing the insider game. So it's not about comparing him to Nate, Emily, Zippo or anyone else who claims to be in the know. He's just a dude that runs a DK podcast that happened to get contacted by the right people. Apparently, he met these people at E3 one year in like 2015 or 2016 and they've been in contact since. Those people told him VV was developing a 3D DK game and it got cancelled and moved to EPD. No one knows what the DK EPD game will be though: 2D, 3D, an RTS, a FPS, an RPG or a dating sim lol

He's mentioned that he only publicly addressed this once the leaks hit in 2021 as a way to validate those rumors and because the fanbase needs hope since it's coming up on a decade since the last game.
 
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Spawn Wave's coverage of the illusive DK game. Probably the biggest channel to cover this story:

 
KremlingKuthroat said:
You have the right to believe whatever you want to believe. I don't act like I know everything and everything I say is just regurgitated from the Kongversation podcast which I've been a regular listener to since 2018.

The thing about Hyle and DK Vine is he's not a leaker. He has no interest in playing the insider game. So it's not about comparing him to Nate, Emily, Zippo or anyone else who claims to be in the know. He's just a dude that runs a DK podcast that happened to get contacted by the right people. Apparently, he met these people at E3 one year in like 2015 or 2016 and they've been in contact since. Those people told him VV was developing a 3D DK game and it got cancelled and moved to EPD. No one knows what the DK EPD game will be though: 2D, 3D, an RTS, a FPS, an RPG or a dating sim lol

He's mentioned that he only publicly addressed this once the leaks hit in 2021 as a way to validate those rumors and because the fanbase needs hope since it's coming up on a decade since the last game.
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To be fair, there were a lot of people who "weren't leakers, only fans of [Character]" who, during the rampant speculation on Smash Ultimate rosters, coincidentally got in touch with the right people and know everything about the future of [Character].

Now, I'm not comparing Hyle to these people. I know next to nothing about him (mainly what people here said), and I presume he's in good faith.

With that said, what I find believable about the old Hyle's rumors, and the more detailed version from Prof. Chops is that they say very little about the EPD game. They tell the story of the DK game that never was and stop right before the DK game that will be. Someone like Zippo (now, he is someone in bad faith!) would fabricate a rumor and focus on the new, shining, totally true game we're absolutely going to get.

How the first random Zippo would know these things from one of the most secretive development studios in the world, located in a faraway country, with most employees speaking a different language, is a mystery. On the other hand, it is believable that Hyle and Chops got in contact with someone involved with the VV project, who had the vague idea of "... and they decided to bring DK in-house". I'm not saying it's true, and I think the sanest thing is always remaining skeptical, but the rumor is at least plausible.

For the same reason, I don't believe the whole story involving K. Rool, Retro Studios, and Sakurai. Lots of parties involved and too many details.
 
I just had the privilege of listening to the latest Kongversation via Patreon early access and all I can say is, WOW! I was incredibly joyous with their details and stories. This is one you won't want to miss when it goes public 👏👏👏
 
Yamanoi said:
Is Donkey Kong more iconic than Geno?
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The real question is, is the DKC CG cartoon more iconic than another Canadian CG classic, Beast Wars? I would say no. The 90s was when CG was absolutely IN, the way of the future, but in the present. While Toy Story ruled the box office, and DKC ruled video games, it was definitely Beast Wars that won the battle of the airwaves.

 
Clov said:
The real question is, is the DKC CG cartoon more iconic than another Canadian CG classic, Beast Wars? I would say no. The 90s was when CG was absolutely IN, the way of the future, but in the present. While Toy Story ruled the box office, and DKC ruled video games, it was definitely Beast Wars that won the battle of the airwaves.

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I hope that YouTube link was the official upload and not some fan upload. I'm 100% official.
 
Yamanoi said:
I hope that YouTube link was the official upload and not some fan upload. I'm 100% official.
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Well if it's official you want, let me just point you to Takara Tomy's YouTube channel, to welcome you back... to the Beast Wars!



Select episodes of Beast Wars will be reairing in Japan under the name "Beast Wars Again", coinciding with a new toyline that aims to recreate the CG look of the characters!

What I mean to say is... 90s CG fever is BACK. I hope Nintendo's new DK project utilizes pre-rendered sprites of 90s style CG workstation models. Not only would it look extremely cool, but it would be an excellent callback to the original trilogy.
 
Clov said:
Well if it's official you want, let me just point you to Takara Tomy's YouTube channel, to welcome you back... to the Beast Wars!



Select episodes of Beast Wars will be reairing in Japan under the name "Beast Wars Again", coinciding with a new toyline that aims to recreate the CG look of the characters!

What I mean to say is... 90s CG fever is BACK. I hope Nintendo's new DK project utilizes pre-rendered sprites of 90s style CG workstation models. Not only would it look extremely cool, but it would be an excellent callback to the original trilogy.
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Thank you. Glad to see you are also official.
 
Clov said:
The real question is, is the DKC CG cartoon more iconic than another Canadian CG classic, Beast Wars? I would say no. The 90s was when CG was absolutely IN, the way of the future, but in the present. While Toy Story ruled the box office, and DKC ruled video games, it was definitely Beast Wars that won the battle of the airwaves.

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Beast Wars fucking rules

Second best Transformers cartoon
 
Apparently the Japanese Donkey Kong Jungle Beat story was a little more complicated and nuanced than what was translated in the west

The Japanese Jungle Beat story talks of DK being heroic and liberating the fruit kingdoms from tyrants

And the west is just "lol he beats up other kingdom leaders cause he is the king of all jungles!"
 
Chill_Phil said:
Apparently the Japanese Donkey Kong Jungle Beat story was a little more complicated and nuanced than what was translated in the west

The Japanese Jungle Beat story talks of DK being heroic and liberating the fruit kingdoms from tyrants

And the west is just "lol he beats up other kingdom leaders cause he is the king of all jungles!"
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The NPC version of Jungle Beat actually had that in its English manuals.

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I love the evil kong designs for Jungle Beat. They are just so awesome looking! What a shame their boss fights suck.
 
Couldn't really get into Jungle Beat but I think evil Kongs are a pretty cool idea.
 
I enjoyed Jungle Beat alright but I never had the urge to revisit it. Maybe if it got a remaster.
 
Nathan Little said:


Haven't had the chance to watch it yet.
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"In DKC1, DK lost his bananas. In DKC2, he lost his body. In DKC3, he lost his mind."
"Yeah, and in DK64, he lost his time."

I laughed so hard, lol

That said, they more or less corroborated what Prof. Chops said. I think the only new information was about the plot, and Nintendo being very firm that DK shouldn't be "altruistic". VV people were also interested in bringing back the Kremlings, but that was just an idea on their part.

They also reiterated that Retro wanted K. Rool as a secret boss in Tropical Freeze, but his return was reserved for Smash.
 
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I listened to about an hour of it, but the best new info so far is that DKs banana trees were withered up. As Gingerbread Man said, DK apparently can't be altruistic. That's kind of a neat spin on the usual DKC plot instead of the Kongs bananas being stolen, the trees are straight up dehydrated of their water. Shows that whatever bad guys they went with weren't gonna be messing around, lmao
 
Something else they say near the end: Donkey Kong Country is without doubt Donkey Kong now, with some throwbacks here and there to the arcade era. Donkey Kong Country Returns is "the baseline" for the brand's future, even without Retro. That doesn't mean that the Kremlings, other kongs, or even Jungle Beat characters can't come back.

Dante Kong said:
I listened to about an hour of it, but the best new info so far is that DKs banana trees were withered up. As Gingerbread Man said, DK apparently can't be altruistic. That's kind of a neat spin on the usual DKC plot instead of the Kongs bananas being stolen, the trees are straight up dehydrated of their water. Shows that whatever bad guys they went with weren't gonna be messing around, lmao
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I got the impression that NCL sees DK as a sort of "primate Wario" but without his weirdness. It will be interesting to see how DK is portrayed in the Mario movie.
 
Gingerbread Man said:
Something else they say near the end: Donkey Kong Country is without doubt Donkey Kong now, with some throwbacks here and there to the arcade era. Donkey Kong Country Returns is "the baseline" for the brand's future, even without Retro.
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Really like this, since the DKC aspects are what I love about the series.

Also, I think it's interesting how Retro would have included K Rool as a secret boss. Like, how he would have fit in the story, whether he would be associated with the Snowmads somehow or just doing his own thing totally separate from the Snowmads.
 
0
A summary of the Kongversation episode

2015- Nintendo needed a stopgap for Donkey Kong after Retro Studios had moved on to their new IP and thus, Skylanders with Vicarious Visions came about.

Nintendo was so impressed with how Donkey and Diddy were portrayed that it got the ball rolling and an actual green light for an entire 3D Donkey Kong game made by Vicarious Visions. The project codename was "Donkey Kong Freedom"

The idea was to incorporate a more Donkey Kong Country style of movement and gameplay only in 3D. It was very obstacle driven and very dense. But you could go anywhere on Donkey Kong Island. Vine Swinging and Vine Grinding were two essential gameplay pieces.

The game would enter development shortly after Skylanders in 2015 with the main focus being on the gameplay core concepts and mechanics were functioning and refined. They had Donkey Kong moving through a Jungle very efficiently.

The plot was something early on discussed, how Vicarious Visions had a factory opened up that was stealing the Kongs' water from the Kongo Jungle River. (As stated above by previous users here) Nintendo chimed in and questioned what was in it for Donkey Kong since he never acts altruistic. So without changing the plot, VV claimed that it was causing the banana trees to dry up and decay. This placated Nintendo and was an easy fix for VV

Miyamoto was very heavily involved with oversight for the project. And played a role in the development of feet banana peels when he saw Donkey Kong was sliding down vines and ropes, expressing concern that DK would get rope burn or injuries on the soles of his feet. VV's pitch to Miyamoto made him overjoyed and excited.

Vicarious Visions never got far enough in development to establish who would be the enemies / villains of the game who ran the factory. But there was a desire amongst specific VV team members to use the Kremlings. With some feeling the Kremlings were an obvious choice. This was never actually pitched to Nintendo though, development was abandoned before they could even request it. Whether or not Nintendo would have said yes or not is anyone's guess.

The playable characters featured Donkey Kong with Diddy Kong mounted on his shoulders like in DKCR/DKCTF , and a Jane Goodall redesign of Pauline.
Pauline would be playable in specific stealthish sections grounded. There is a strong theory that Freedom's cancelation might have segued to her being repurposed as mayor of New Donk City in Super Mario Odyssey later on. Rambi the Rhino was the only rideable animal buddy, but keep in mind, development was very early. So those 4 (Donkey, Diddy, Pauline, and Rambi) along with possibly the Kremlings, may not have been the only characters that VV had hoped to include.

April 2016
Founding brothers of Karthik and Guha Bala announce they are leaving Vicarious Visions to pursue other projects. The very two individuals who have a strong connection with Nintendo, leave Donkey Kong Freedom's fate severed and uncertain with new management takeover and Activision wanting more lucrative measures applied to VV

In November 2016, Activision assigned Vicarious Visions to become a support studio for Destiny 2 and as such, they didn't want VV working on Donkey Kong Freedom as it was a title that Activision would not get full profits to (having to split with Nintendo). And demanded VV focus solely on Activision IP.

Some of the plants and trees seen in Donkey Kong Freedom were repurposed for Crash Bandicoot N. Sane Trilogy.

December 2016 (on or around) Donkey Kong Freedom is abandoned.


2017- Nintendo is disappointed Vicarious Visions backed out. But to make matters even more challenging, Universal Studios had already agreed to a theme park expansion for DKC, but Freedom was shelved. And Miyamoto didn't want to just not make a Donkey Kong game, so the attitude shifted to "Looks like we will have to do this ourselves!" Leading the charge for DK as a series to return home internally in Japan at EPD.

Tropical Freeze for Switch was an obvious choice to be ported amongst other Wii U titles that made the jump, but it got the immediate greenlight in 2017 as a way to keep the franchise alive and get it onto the Switch. As did Donkey Kong Adventure in Mario + Rabbids Kingdom Battle. Both would serve as stopgaps once more (Like Skylanders in 2015) to keep the torch alive while they shift gears and start over within EPD.

2018, DKCTF Switch, Donkey Kong Adventure and King K. Rool in Super Smash Bros. Ultimate all commence the franchise refresh movement.

It is unknown when exactly the new DK project commenced under EPD but Hyle has been informed it is a new dedicated team internally at Nintendo that will be the home studio for Donkey Kong as a brand not had since 2002 with Rare's departure.

It is also entirely unknown if any of the Vicarious Visions project was at all retained from several years ago. Nintendo really liked what they were seeing but there is literally just no way to know what state the current project is in (3D, 2.5, 2D)
But Freedom was 3D back in 2016 , so the franchise is not locked in.

The Bala Brothers formed a new studio at the end of 2016, known as Velan. and their rapport with Nintendo lived on through Mario Kart Live Home Circuit's development, continuing the great toys to life concept.

Reassurances that the brand is going to be taken care of and flourishing in the future. Miyamoto wants this to be the case long after he is no longer with us, Donkey Kong is his baby after all. (The theme park, Donkey Kong spinoff movie)

And we are going to get our first taste of that next week with DK's heavy presence in the Mario movie!
 

We know that the movies and games aren't going to be 100% similar, but this definitely makes it seem like Nitnendo definitely doesn't view DK as an "altruistic" kind of guy.
 
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