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StarTopic Future Nintendo Hardware & Technology Speculation & Discussion |ST| (New Staff Post, Please read)

It may not be compatible with the existing game card slot? They'd have to redesign the cards completely
Why would they, the interface wouldn't have to change, would it?

Incidentally, do Switch carts have their own controllers? I guess if they don't that might be a problem.
Edit: Looks like they do. So I don't see any issue in changing to a 3D stacked design using the same interface? Am i missing something?
 
Me, too often: "Oh nice, i can't wait to play this new PS5 game right now when i have some time!"

PS5: "Copying"

Me: >:|

Non-PS5 owner here, that's when copying from the disc to the internal storage, right? Even if Nintendo went this route, it should still be immensely faster since it's going from one solid state storage to another.
 
If Mario Kart X comes out (Switch 2 release title baby!) there will be no consumers going "WTF NINTENDO? WHERE IS 9?" Consumers will be like "Oooh new MK game, cool!"

So.. it really doesn't matter if they "skip" 9. Consumers don't care. Only hardcore, such as yourself, are going to care lol.
you said mario kart X. that's vague. i was talking about the very explicit name of "mario kart 10"
 
Do we have information on how compression works on PS5? Is it a prescribed method that precludes the use of other compression formats?
I imagine the hardware is optimised for a specific set of algorithms, no?
That I don't know. Theoretically, it should be able to do more than just Kracken, albeit not as efficiently. For Drake I expect gdeflate to be commonly used

I'm guessing Nintendo could probably get away with having 512 GBs of internal UFS 3.1 memory and force consumers to do mandatory installs and mandatory downloads for games larger than 16 GBs or 32 GBs.
Doing mandatory installation would wipe 512GB very quickly. I expect Nintendo's own games to double in size. Third parties? Mandatory external storage
 
Release date March 2024?! Nah I don't think so. Not when I just started a bet where I chose March as announcement month.
 
10 or X... I believe my point remains. Average consumers aren't counting.
they're going to be counting when the most recent mario kart game released is called mario kart 8 deluxe...
obviously they can just not use a numbered title at all (which is effectively what you suggested) but that's not what we're arguing about. it's about how they can't legitimately call the next mario kart game "mario kart 10" as all of you do because tour isn't mario kart 9 as far as your ordinary reasonable person sees it.
 
they're going to be counting when the most recent mario kart game released is called mario kart 8 deluxe...
obviously they can just not use a numbered title at all (which is effectively what you suggested) but that's not what we're arguing about. it's about how they can't legitimately call the next mario kart game "mario kart 10" as all of you do because tour isn't mario kart 9 as far as your ordinary reasonable person sees it.
Ordinary people don't give a shit. They couldn't name the 6 Mario Karts before Mario Kart 7
 
they're going to be counting when the most recent mario kart game released is called mario kart 8 deluxe...
obviously they can just not use a numbered title at all (which is effectively what you suggested) but that's not what we're arguing about. it's about how they can't legitimately call the next mario kart game "mario kart 10" as all of you do because tour isn't mario kart 9 as far as your ordinary reasonable person sees it.
Calling it MK 10 or X or whatever won't cause any confusion or lose them a single sale. It's the tenth MK game.
 
they're going to be counting when the most recent mario kart game released is called mario kart 8 deluxe...
obviously they can just not use a numbered title at all (which is effectively what you suggested) but that's not what we're arguing about. it's about how they can't legitimately call the next mario kart game "mario kart 10" as all of you do because tour isn't mario kart 9 as far as your ordinary reasonable person sees it.
Yes they can call the next game Mario Kart 10 lol. Companies have skipped numbers before. Don’t make the consumer seem like their idiots now. Mario Kart sells on its name alone. Everyone and their mother will know Mario Kart X or 10 is the next game after Mario Kart 8 Deluxe.
 
Why don't you folks make an avatar bet thread about what the next Mario Kart will be called so that this thread won't be drowned in pages of naming discussions not about ReDraketed's name? ;D
 
If Mario Kart X comes out (Switch 2 release title baby!) there will be no consumers going "WTF NINTENDO? WHERE IS 9?" Consumers will be like "Oooh new MK game, cool!"

So.. it really doesn't matter if they "skip" 9. Consumers don't care. Only hardcore, such as yourself, are going to care lol.
Nintendo will tell it costumers Mario Kart 9 is Mario Kart Tour(since we see a lot of it tracks on Mario Kart 8 Deluxe,in a way Nintendo consider Mario Kart Tour as a mainline Mario Kart)
 
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Nate speculated on 3D NAND on Game & Talk a while back:



(is timestamped)
 
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Why would they, the interface wouldn't have to change, would it?

Incidentally, do Switch carts have their own controllers? I guess if they don't that might be a problem.
Edit: Looks like they do. So I don't see any issue in changing to a 3D stacked design using the same interface? Am i missing something?
The interface would probably need to change to allow for the higher bandwidth of the memory? I dunno how exactly all that works, but it's hard to imagine that you could use the identical card components and card reader components and just slot in a completely different kind of storage technology.

The bigger issue is probably the fact that they have existing contracts for the other types of memory that game cards currently use and negotiating a new contract and then opening up new production lines for new game cards probably just doesn't make sense financially to do in the middle of a generation for either party.
 
MP4 will be like God of War in terms of world structure with a central hub and different worlds to explore with different biomes, not open world


I hope the central hub is the ship and we can explore different planets and not just stuck to one this time, watch MP4 be the Starfield killer haha
 
MP4 will be like God of War in terms of world structure with a central hub and different worlds to explore with different biomes, not open world


I hope the central hub is the ship and we can explore different planets and not just stuck to one this time, watch MP4 be the Starfield killer haha

No, that doesn’t make sense. They’re wildly different types of games.
 
The interface would probably need to change to allow for the higher bandwidth of the memory? I dunno how exactly all that works, but it's hard to imagine that you could use the identical card components and card reader components and just slot in a completely different kind of storage technology.

The bigger issue is probably the fact that they have existing contracts for the other types of memory that game cards currently use and negotiating a new contract and then opening up new production lines for new game cards probably just doesn't make sense financially to do in the middle of a generation for either party.
Well, if theyre as cheap as theyre made out to be they can probably pay quite a hefty fine and still make a profit. I would go with one of these 2 explanations:

1. Its a tech issue.

2. They arent as cheap as theyre made out to be.
 
God of War 2018 is a very light Metroidvania, but that structure sucks and adds nothing to the game and instead just killed the story pacing by having constant backtracking to get keys. It's hyper linear as well, just with backtracking. There's only one real gameplay change that comes with any of the keys you acquire.
 
March is most likely for the announcement as opposed to the release, it’s just too soon.
If the rumors of December (or January?) production comes true, then March wouldn't be too soon. But of course, rumors are exactly that.. rumors.

Once production starts, it's a losing battle to keep things under wrap.
 
The interface would probably need to change to allow for the higher bandwidth of the memory? I dunno how exactly all that works, but it's hard to imagine that you could use the identical card components and card reader components and just slot in a completely different kind of storage technology.
The interface doesn't care what form the data takes. It won't be able to use the higher bandwidth, no, but it doesn't need to.
That's why you can get a tlc ssd for sata, after all.

I think Switch is using the ASIC Xtra ROM format, in which case, the device hardware is not seeing beyond the interface.

Now, regarding contracts, yeah, maybe, but if the savings are as good as advertised, it would absolutely make sense to get that production line running asap and start manufacturing current Switch carts on that tech. They wouldn't have been locked into a 7 year commitment from the outset given that they wouldn't have known that the Switch would still be a going concern, surely? There's no way Nintendo are happy with the haircut they're getting on Tears of the Kingdom cart. So maybe the savings aren't that great unless you move up to 64GB? I have no idea.

I genuinely think it makes more sense to make the transition mid gen if at all possible. To enable production to ramp and slowly transition. Because I bet there is zero production on ROM chips of these sizes outside of Nintendo wanting to do it. They are the only market for it. Which, I think, complicates things and makes that initial ramp a little scary.
 
Well, that's a valid concern.

I missed the first 98 F-Zero games, after all.
Ya... missed a lot of those too... however I'm pretty sure I caught all of the 98 Tetris games!

TBF I believe there is a good chance Nintendo will call the next MK something other than 10 or X, but if they do I don't believe it will be because they are trying to avoid confusion but simply they feel like whatever they come up with will do better/be easier to market.

For instance I could see just calling it the same as the original: Super Mario Kart...if the next system is named Super Switch. Or it could be connected to a new mechanic they put in the game, for instance (and this is just off the top of my head) they add Wonder Flowers to the game which randomly spawn a few times per race and when picked up alter the course dramatically until someone finds and collects another one? Mario Kart Wonder.

Who knows, but... if they want to call it Mario Kart 10, they will likely not be concerned about the average consumer being confused. I just don't think that will be a concern whatsoever.
 
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If the rumors of December (or January?) production comes true, then March wouldn't be too soon. But of course, rumors are exactly that.. rumors.

Once production starts, it's a losing battle to keep things under wrap.
If production starts by around January or so, they could definitely reveal it in February to early March & release the system in September (if the reveal is February, March can be the certification submission deadline for launch). Remember, they still have Mario Wonder & accompanying Switch 1s to sell this holiday season. no reason for Nintendo to potentially hurt those sales if they don’t have to. And getting production going earlier in 2024 would allow Nintendo to have ample Switch 2 stock upon release, as previously reported this past summer.
 
Well, if theyre as cheap as theyre made out to be they can probably pay quite a hefty fine and still make a profit. I would go with one of these 2 explanations:

1. Its a tech issue.

2. They arent as cheap as theyre made out to be.

The interface doesn't care what form the data takes. It won't be able to use the higher bandwidth, no, but it doesn't need to.
That's why you can get a tlc ssd for sata, after all.

I think Switch is using the ASIC Xtra ROM format, in which case, the device hardware is not seeing beyond the interface.

Now, regarding contracts, yeah, maybe, but if the savings are as good as advertised, it would absolutely make sense to get that production line running asap and start manufacturing current Switch carts on that tech. They wouldn't have been locked into a 7 year commitment from the outset given that they wouldn't have known that the Switch would still be a going concern, surely? There's no way Nintendo are happy with the haircut they're getting on Tears of the Kingdom cart. So maybe the savings aren't that great unless you move up to 64GB? I have no idea.

I genuinely think it makes more sense to make the transition mid gen if at all possible. To enable production to ramp and slowly transition. Because I bet there is zero production on ROM chips of these sizes outside of Nintendo wanting to do it. They are the only market for it. Which, I think, complicates things and makes that initial ramp a little scary.
The other part of it is that while this paper came out a few years ago it probably took a while to fully scale up to full production, considering they apparently just opened up full production lines earlier this year:





EDIT: actually it should be in its own post
 
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I’m also on team that they will reveal next Switch HW at H1 next year, likely around march or april and launch it around september /october

I know lots of you guys are a little anxious regarding Switch NG and everything around it but just be pacient. In the meanwhile, enjoy Mario Wonder or other upcoming Switch 1 titles.
 
I’m also on team that they will reveal next Switch HW at H1 next year, likely around march or april and launch it around september /october

I know lots of you guys are a little anxious regarding Switch NG and everything around it but just be pacient. In the meanwhile, enjoy Mario Wonder or other upcoming Switch 1 titles.
This!

Even if we have a weak first half of 2024, carried by remakes and remasters, that is only because the second half and 2025 is going to be fruitful with lots of games, just like 2017.
 
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I_Find_Your_Lack_of_Faith_Disturbing_banner.jpg
 
Remember, they still have Mario Wonder & accompanying Switch 1s to sell this holiday season. no reason for Nintendo to potentially hurt those sales if they don’t have to.
I would say something here but it'd just send this discussion into a circle, one this forum have already went through many times before. LOL.
 
So to atone for all my adblocking I became a Digital Foundry Patron. It's not cheap, but they've got quite a bit of bonus content on there!

The Patron exclusive video exploring what an underclocked RTX2050 can do using Death Stranding is super insightful. Won't spoil too much here, though I can recommend it to everyone in this thread. DLSS has quite the computational cost - even when the internal resolution stays the same, just changing the DLSS output resolution makes an enormous impact on framerate. The difference between 720p native - which runs really well - to 1080p DLSS all the way up to Ultra Performance 4K is enormous.

What I came away with most of all is that Switch 2 probably gives developers lots of options and variables to tweak for their ports/projects, while Switch 1 projects often felt like squeezing at the cost of everything.
Just for the record, the estimates for DLSS in this thread have always been done with this understanding. And it's wasn't just guessing; people have tested it on other hardware, or referenced the big table of execution time estimates Nvidia publishes where you can see it going up to several milliseconds.

I'm a little concerned that people are going to treat the DF video too literally/seriously. Closer comparison or no, to me this is a retread of the Shield TV experiments DF did in 2016: entertaining, not informative. I guess it's good for DF's wider audience who have no idea of the ballpark performance, but it has the potential for exaggerating too high or too low in various respects that makes it not very useful to me, and we already know the ballpark, at least when assuming clocks (which the DF video is also doing).

Well, if theyre as cheap as theyre made out to be they can probably pay quite a hefty fine and still make a profit. I would go with one of these 2 explanations:

1. Its a tech issue.

2. They arent as cheap as theyre made out to be.
There's no serious possibility of Nintendo switching storage technologies mid-generation even if the memory was 100 times cheaper. Getting it up and running is an R&D expenditure that is only justified when building new hardware, same with a lot of things. On top of that, waiting for new hardware to deploy an advancement in tech helps differentiate it.
 
Also here is the paper I was thinking of, it's actually from 2017- (courtesy of @Thraktor )


Requires a subscription though. This is a relatively exciting excerpt (if true):

image.png

Basically the idea is, the more layers you have the more storage you have and the less the storage costs per GB, since cost scales much more with area than volume. Not sure if the exact costs will be the same as in 2017 ($0.04 per GB which would be ~$5 for 128GB) but the concept is the same- more layers equals larger yet cheaper storage.
 
Still waiting on Switch2 so i can play botw and totk again with better graphics and zero fps issues when lighting grass on fire!
Yeah if you look at footage of botw and totk running 4k 60fps on emulators it is amazing, would be great to have that on switch 2
 
There's no serious possibility of Nintendo switching storage technologies mid-generation even if the memory was 100 times cheaper. Getting it up and running is an R&D expenditure that is only justified when building new hardware, same with a lot of things. On top of that, waiting for new hardware to deploy an advancement in tech helps differentiate it.
Doesnt make sense to me. If they can make back that R&D investment quite quickly by selling a few million game cards, you would want to make the investment as early as possible. Would make zero difference to the end user, Switch woudnt be able to utilize the higher speed anyway,

Except it might open up the door for games, that currently arent ported because of size limitations.
 
Also here is the paper I was thinking of, it's actually from 2017- (courtesy of @Thraktor )


Requires a subscription though. This is a relatively exciting excerpt (if true):

image.png

Basically the idea is, the more layers you have the more storage you have and the less the storage costs per GB, since cost scales much more with area than volume. Not sure if the exact costs will be the same as in 2017 ($0.04 per GB which would be ~$5 for 128GB) but the concept is the same- more layers equals larger yet cheaper storage.

I guess stacking everything is the future to avoid costs and Moores law.

Also:

 
I hope MP4 won’t be open world. Open world is completely antithetical to the series’ design and gameplay philosophy.



For clarification, because I’ve seen it a few times over the last few pages here, bellydrum did not get permabanned. He got a temporary ban and the duration was still being evaluated by site moderation when he himself requested that his account be permanently closed.
My mistake, thank you.
 
Please read this new, consolidated staff post before posting.

Furthermore, according to this follow-up post, all off-topic chat will be moderated.
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