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StarTopic Nintendo General Discussion |ST8 May 2022| Prime Real E-ST8

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Party Sklar said:
Finished my week-end by completing RE4 on the Switch. Probably the most influential game of the last 20 years. Still a 10/10.

If you never played it, it's around 20 bucks on the eShop. Well worth it for twenty hours of pure pleasure.
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I was going to get on switch, then i found out there was no motion controls.
 
Joseki said:
Controversial (?) take: the next 2D Mario game should try to reinvent the wheel when it comes to art style, structure and game design. Mario 2D peaked with U.
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Fully agree.

Mentioned in the direct speculation thread that I think 2D Mario could do well with a sketchbook artstyle. That, and rethink the world-based "3 stages, one mini-castle, 3 stages, 1 big Koopaling castle" approach.
 
Gay Bowser said:
Super Mario Advance 3: Super Mario Bros. 5: Super Mario World 2: Yoshi's Island
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You rarely see people consider Wario Land: Super Mario Land 3 to be a Mario game (because it’s clearly a Wario game), so it’s weird to me that so many people insist that Super Mario World 2: Yoshi’s Island is a Mario game rather than a Yoshi game. The Japanese Super Mario website agrees that it is indeed a Yoshi game rather than a Super Mario game.
 
I was looking over the Summer Games Done Quick schedule. There' some new and interesting stuff this year. Kirby and the Forgotten Lands, Metroid Dread, Xenoblade 2: Torna The Golden Country, and Pokemon Brilliant Diamond/Shining Pearl will all make their debuts I believe.
 
Tye said:
You rarely see people consider Wario Land: Super Mario Land 3 to be a Mario game (because it’s clearly a Wario game), so it’s weird to me that so many people insist that Super Mario World 2: Yoshi’s Island is a Mario game rather than a Yoshi game. The Japanese Super Mario website agrees that it is indeed a Yoshi game rather than a Super Mario game.
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Yoshi's Island is an interesting case of a game that, for a time, was almost absolutely intended to be mainline Super Mario. The prototype name is Super Mario Bros. 5, internationally the game is Super Mario World 2, and even in Japan the game was given the Super Mario name - Yoshi's Island was the subtitle. You can absolutely see the shared DNA between it and future Super Mario games, too - the use of Red Coins as a collectible (and a greater focus on exploration in general), the idea of Bowser growing to huge sizes for certain boss fights, and the extended Super Star theme all come from Yoshi's Island. And Yoshi's Island was included with the Super Mario Advance line of remakes, which would seem to cement it as a Super Mario game. But the way Nintendo views the game has changed; even with the "Super Mario" name, it's considered the first Yoshi platformer now and the start of its own series.

In a world where Mario Lands 1 and 2 weren't considered mainline for a time (the Super Mario History 1985-2010 booklet that came with All-Stars Wii doesn't mention them in any region), I'm not surprised that Wario Land wasn't ever brought up in the conversation of being a Mario game. By the time the first two Land games were included with the SMB 30th anniversary material, the idea of Yoshi's Island as mainline was pretty distant, and you can see Wario Land with the same logic as it - namely, even with the Super Mario Land 3 title, it's the first "Wario Land" game instead.
 
VolcanicDynamo said:
Yoshi's Island is an interesting case of a game that, for a time, was almost absolutely intended to be mainline Super Mario. The prototype name is Super Mario Bros. 5, internationally the game is Super Mario World 2, and even in Japan the game was given the Super Mario name - Yoshi's Island was the subtitle. You can absolutely see the shared DNA between it and future Super Mario games, too - the use of Red Coins as a collectible (and a greater focus on exploration in general), the idea of Bowser growing to huge sizes for certain boss fights, and the extended Super Star theme all come from Yoshi's Island. And Yoshi's Island was included with the Super Mario Advance line of remakes, which would seem to cement it as a Super Mario game. But the way Nintendo views the game has changed; even with the "Super Mario" name, it's considered the first Yoshi platformer now and the start of its own series.

In a world where Mario Lands 1 and 2 weren't considered mainline for a time (the Super Mario History 1985-2010 booklet that came with All-Stars Wii doesn't mention them in any region), I'm not surprised that Wario Land wasn't ever brought up in the conversation of being a Mario game. By the time the first two Land games were included with the SMB 30th anniversary material, the idea of Yoshi's Island as mainline was pretty distant, and you can see Wario Land with the same logic as it - namely, even with the Super Mario Land 3 title, it's the first "Wario Land" game instead.
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Yet there's reason to believe Mario wasn't even originally going to be in it 🤔
 
Amadeus said:
3n9l.jpg

New 2D Mario with this exact artstyle would be fire
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Odyssey artwork is so depressing tbh. Game is great but it surely would’ve been welcome if it had like 2-3 more big worlds to explore. I didn’t have this feeling of „incompletion“ with Galaxy/3D World etc.
New Donk City and snow kingdom artwork look really good
 
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It's amazing how much people's desires for a "new" 2D Mario mostly hinge on presentation and a few pacing tweaks. Keep Mario in the levels after he loses a life and have an "ambitious" presentation and bam, there goes most of the complaints about the NSMB series.

I'm curious to see what people think of any mechanics or structural changes for 2D Mario. Maybe I should make a thread for it...

EDIT: Mekanos always has my back.
 
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Joseki said:
Controversial (?) take: the next 2D Mario game should try to reinvent the wheel when it comes to art style, structure and game design. Mario 2D peaked with U.
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Dardan Sandiego said:
Well, one part of this statement is definitely controversial.
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😬

New Super Mario Bros and all the sequels proved that both the fans and Nintendo are right. When a series has been gone for a while, you don't need a big idea to deliver a gangbuster game. A couple clever ideas, and modernize the visuals and you can get a stone cold classic out of repeating yourself... and without a new Big Idea, if the sequels are close on each other, those clever ideas start to feel pretty insipid, no matter how polished your execution.

Metroid: Dread did it, F-Zero could do it, 2D Mario needs to stop doing it.
 
I agree. I wish Odyssey’s art design leaned more heavily on this vibrant style that we see throughout the concept art. I still love the game, but I thought that the environmental design lacked cohesion and that the more realistic worlds meshed poorly with the cartoony characters.
 
oldpuck said:
😬

New Super Mario Bros and all the sequels proved that both the fans and Nintendo are right. When a series has been gone for a while, you don't need a big idea to deliver a gangbuster game. A couple clever ideas, and modernize the visuals and you can get a stone cold classic out of repeating yourself... and without a new Big Idea, if the sequels are close on each other, those clever ideas start to feel pretty insipid, no matter how polished your execution.

Metroid: Dread did it, F-Zero could do it, 2D Mario needs to stop doing it.
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Yeah, I actually think that NSMBU is really good, especially when you add NSLU. But I would have enjoyed it much more if it was the first or second entry of the subseries, not the fourth in 6 years.
 
DrDave said:
I agree. I wish Odyssey’s art design leaned more heavily on this vibrant style that we see throughout the concept art. I still love the game, but I thought that the environmental design lacked cohesion and that the more realistic worlds meshed poorly with the cartoony characters.
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Uhhhh....I think that's the whole point....
 
Wooded Kingdom is one of my favorite areas in any Mario game ever.

Edit: double post but I feel this so strongly that I'm gonna leave it
 
You know what would be rad? A 2D Mario...

Metroidvania (GASP)

Like, keep it mostly focused on platforming, but eliminate individual stages and have it take place in one large world. You can still unlock new abilities and things to advance further into the world, and find secrets, etc. that unlock even cooler things.

Actually, what if characters were the unlockables? You start as Mario, and you either rescue/recruit new characters as the 'unlocks' throughout the game, until you have Luigi, Peach, Toad, maybe even Bowser, etc. that you can swap to on the fly ala Castlevania 3. They all have different platformer abilities and can do different levels better, or worse, or not at all than others.

Combine all this with a rad new artstyle and it'd really shake up the 2D Mario formula while also keeping it mostly focused on platforming in the same way that a lot of metroidvanias are all about that rather than combat.

(this started off as a half-joke post, but I honestly think this would be really fun)
 
SammyJ9 said:
You know what would be rad? A 2D Mario...

Metroidvania (GASP)
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I think the contrary, a Metroid game more focused on platforming would be really cool instead of a Mario metroid game. I just feel Samus controls especially well when you get all powerups and that it would fit really well in a more platform-heavy style of game.
 
I think that most EPD teams do have a specific identity and it's easy to find a name for them.

EPD1 - The External Team for AAA Japanese games
EPD2 - The Other External Team
EPD3 - Triforce Heroes
EPD4 - The Wacky Team
EPD5 - Live an Online Life!
EPD6 - "Our mission is to develop EAD-like titles with external devs"
EPD7 - R&D1
EPD8 - EPD Tokyo / Mario Team
EPD9 - The Competitive Online Team

EPD10 is the outlier. Pikmin 3 and 2D Mario have nothing in common, excluding Hino and Tezuka's involvement in both of them (and Hino isn't really involved in 2D Mario as he's in Pikmin games).

EAD5 (Star Fox, Steel Diver, F-Zero, Tank Troopers) was the "Vehicle Team", but they're dead now.
 
Blue Monty said:
I think the contrary, a Metroid game more focused on platforming would be really cool instead of a Mario metroid game. I just feel Samus controls especially well when you get all powerups and that it would fit really well in a more platform-heavy style of game.
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So like... a puzzle-platformer that's full of stuff like the shine-spark puzzles and dashing around you can do near the end of Dread? I could see that maybe working, despite not really being something I'd be interested in much. But then I'm firmly in the "make everything ever into a metroidvania" camp, so I know I'm a bit of a sicko
 
Metroid Pinball 2.

No...Metroid Block Ball.

Yeah, I need that game.

I don't even like Doki Doki Mario 2, but I think honestly they should explore that style of gameplay again when they decide to make another 2D Mario. There's probably a pretty fun game in there somewhere that modern Nintendo devs can pull out.
 
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Curious to see how closely Strikers hews to the model established on Switch with Golf and Tennis (even though it's from NLG rather than Camelot), and if it performs similarly well commercially. Strikers Charged did 1.77 million on Wii, so that's the high watermark to beat. Looking at the performance of Golf and Tennis versus recent Mario sports games, I'd think Battle League will manage it.
 
Haven’t had my eye on Mario Strikers at all because I have a baby coming in a few weeks. I’m definitely gonna get it as a quick cool-me-down at the end of my long days.
 
Red Monster said:
No no, NSMBU is the peak of 2D Mario. Especially when you include Luigi U. The level design is impeccable and the controls are sublime. I dare anyone to try and go back to SMW after playing NSMBU and see how it feels to not have a wall jump.
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Excluding Luigi U, what distinguishes, in your mind, NSMBU from the rest of the NSMB games?
 
MisterSpo said:
Curious to see how closely Strikers hews to the model established on Switch with Golf and Tennis (even though it's from NLG rather than Camelot), and if it performs similarly well commercially. Strikers Charged did 1.77 million on Wii, so that's the high watermark to beat. Looking at the performance of Golf and Tennis versus recent Mario sports games, I'd think Battle League will manage it.
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4M should be the floor of Strikers, before Aces released Strikers Charged was the best selling entry of the Mario Sports series and it's easy to think Strikers should outsell Aces (3.66M) due to how popular is football worldwide and releasing close to World Cup. Also it seems at least to me it has much higher budget than the Camelot sports games but that could just be NLG being a bigger studio more cappeable. (not trying to discredit Camelot job at all btw it's impressive how their games look especially when you consider Camelot size)
 
I havent played it myself but Wario Land Shake It has a criminally underrated style. I recently found out that Good-feel developed it.
 
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