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Reviews Princess Peach: Showtime! | Review Thread

VintoWin said:
If they told everyone it was being made by Good-Feel from the get go I think expectations would have fallen more in line with what it actually is lol.
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That's just a really unnecessary way of thinking. "LOL, mid, lol Mid-Feel, lol Princess Peach Mid Time".

This thread is getting really exhausting with that when reviews are more or less positive if not raving.
 
Hailinel said:
That's just a really unnecessary way of thinking. "LOL, mid, lol Mid-Feel, lol Princess Peach Mid Time".

This thread is getting really exhausting with that when reviews are more or less positive if not raving.
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The entire pre-release discourse has been exhausting lol, just a constant circle of "it's a game for baby children, accept that --> actually simple games can be good --> ...", a complete talking past each other. Probably won't change much post-release but at least we can talk about things that are more concrete.
 
Hailinel said:
That's just a really unnecessary way of thinking. "LOL, mid, lol Mid-Feel, lol Princess Peach Mid Time".

This thread is getting really exhausting with that when reviews are more or less positive if not raving.
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Ah, my bad. Didn't mean to rain on the parade.

I didn't know you were highly anticipating this one.
 
Gingerbread Man said:
I'm surprised by the (recent?) negativity surrounding Good-Feel. Both Epic Yarn and Wooly World were at least "good" and had their charm. They were even great by the standard of Artoon Yoshi games or post-N64 pre-Wii Kirby games.
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Yoshi's wooly world is the best Yoshi game even arguably over the SNES one, there's no need for qualifiers there. Kirby's epic yarn similarly is very good at what it does, and I'm honestly not sure what it actually got dinged for. It could perhaps have done with 4 player co-op instead of just 2 but that's about my only complaint.
 
I loved Kirby's Epic Yarn years ago. Wooly World is probably good too, but I wasn't big fan of Crafted World.
 
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Wooly World is superb, like many have said previous, it's a fantastic Yoshi game. Full of charm, great levels and a wonderful soundtrack. Would actually love a Switch port.
Crafted World was a step down from it unfortunately, somewhat pedestrian compared to Wooly World.

Was going to get Peach for my kids but they are addicted to Hollow Knight at the moment... Will leave them to it 🙂
 
Linkstrikesback said:
Yoshi's wooly world is the best Yoshi game even arguably over the SNES one, there's no need for qualifiers there. Kirby's epic yarn similarly is very good at what it does, and I'm honestly not sure what it actually got dinged for. It could perhaps have done with 4 player co-op instead of just 2 but that's about my only complaint.
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I think when Epic Yarn came out, I remember the idea that you literally could not die was controversial. I never felt it lacked challenge as a result though. It's still my favorite of Good Feel's games by a large margin. They didn't have to try and adapt someone else's faster-paced gameplay, and it has the most balanced quality of presentation (Woolly has great music but less unique levels, Crafted has super unique levels but bad music).
 
Scores are in line with what I expected. A lot of really positive takes, which is good to see. Good-Feel has always been a solid developer. I can't remember to much of Skake It, but to me, Epic Yarn and Woolly World are the best games in their respective series, and both easily top 10 all time Nintendo 2D Platformers. Crafted World was a big letdown for me (middling level design and some of the worst videogame music I've ever heard), but Good-Feel has enough of my confidence for me to give Peach a try, even though some of the transformations look kind of boring (The singing and baking ones in particular).
 
Gingerbread Man said:
I'm surprised by the (recent?) negativity surrounding Good-Feel. Both Epic Yarn and Wooly World were at least "good" and had their charm. They were even great by the standard of Artoon Yoshi games or post-N64 pre-Wii Kirby games.
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Crafted World is also good

Good Feel’s recent games haven’t been any easier than Kirby or Pokemon games and people don’t complain about them that much

Heck even the base game of Mario Odyssey is really easy
 
TheSpaceBetween said:
Scores are in line with what I expected. A lot of really positive takes, which is good to see. Good-Feel has always been a solid developer. I can't remember to much of Skake It, but to me, Epic Yarn and Woolly World are the best games in their respective series, and both easily top 10 all time Nintendo 2D Platformers. Crafted World was a big letdown for me (middling level design and some of the worst videogame music I've ever heard), but Good-Feel has enough of my confidence for me to give Peach a try, even though some of the transformations look kind of boring (The singing and baking ones in particular).
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Crafted World in my opinion has amazing level design

The “axe murderer” level, the rhino level, and above all the arcade levels, like the safari plane and racing levels, all of them completely unlike any other Yoshi level and all ridiculously fun
 
I would join a "Crafted World was good actually" train, obviously flawed but it was overall an interesting game that was at least undeniably fresh compared to the last bunch of Yoshi games (even Woolly World while being on par with the original is rehashing a heck of a lot of ideas)
 
Number1000DKFan said:
Crafted World in my opinion has amazing level design

The “axe murderer” level, the rhino level, and above all the arcade levels, like the safari plane and racing levels, all of them completely unlike any other Yoshi level and all ridiculously fun
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There are some great levels for sure, but overall it felt like a big step back from WW. My favorite was the whole Ninja diorama.
 
Wasn’t expecting an 80 or 90 for Princess Peach Showtime. Hopefully those who got the game enjoy it. Will be keeping tabs on Good-Feel’s next project.
 
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Magic-Man said:
I really hate difficulty discussions with video games. Let games be incredibly easy or incredibly challenging. Not every game is made for you.
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And there are plenty of really easy games that are popular and enjoyed by a wide audience.

And let's not pretend like some of the most beloved games of all time aren't also easy.

I'm planning on playing this tomorrow after I pick it up when I get home from work and I have no qualms about enjoying it.
 
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Magic-Man said:
I really hate difficulty discussions with video games. Let games be incredibly easy or incredibly challenging. Not every game is made for you.
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Video games should be accessible to any gamer who wants to play them, and they should all offer customisation options commensurate with different skill and ability levels; plenty of non-ableist perspectives to support this idea. If you find difficulty discussions about video games tedious, perhaps they're not made for you?
 
kaya bunji said:
Video games should be accessible to any gamer who wants to play them, and they should all offer customisation options commensurate with different skill and ability levels; plenty of non-ableist perspectives to support this idea. If you find difficulty discussions about video games tedious, perhaps they're not made for you?
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I get it from an accessibility perspective and those arguments are valid, but I can't take people complaining that a game is "too hard" or "too easy" seriously. If that's your only reason to care you shouldn't play the game, straight up.
 
Magic-Man said:
I get it from an accessibility perspective and those arguments are valid, but I can't take people complaining that a game is "too hard" or "too easy" seriously. If that's your only reason to care you shouldn't play the game, straight up.
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I appreciate that you aren't trying to bully others, but the point remains: if something upsets you, don't engage with it. Plenty of people online dealing in absolutes (Sith, obviously), but stuff like this is so subjective. Just don't engage with people who speak through pure emotion; engage with logical argumentation.
 
I'll grab this once it comes to my library lol. I think good feel is a pretty underrated dev. The yoshi games are fun and kirbys epic yarn got like an 89 mc score back in the day.
 
Lugia667 said:
Wooly World's MC is actually not much higher than this one
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In my mind it should be near Tropical Freeze's score, which it is...those scores should both just be higher than they are. I dunno why review scores for these two games bother me. It's silly really. I just feel these two games and KEY are misunderstood works of delight...TF got its due though...and I suppose Skyward Sword did too. So maybe Switch ports would help YWW and KEY.
 
Number1000DKFan said:
Crafted World in my opinion has amazing level design

The “axe murderer” level, the rhino level, and above all the arcade levels, like the safari plane and racing levels, all of them completely unlike any other Yoshi level and all ridiculously fun
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Thank you. Yes. These levels were brilliant. The shōji level too! 🎋🎴
 
I didn't love crafted world but it was fun. Woolly world though???? Omg that's an amazing game. And princess peach is fine, I'm glad people can play it now instead of just discoursing over it. It's fun
 
Crafted World is full of super creative level concepts but the whole game feels really muddled as a result of the troubled development (the core gimmick that was shown off in the reveal trailer was almost completely gutted from the final product). It's clunky to control and stuck between being a platformer like its predecessor and some sort of I Spy diorama thing, and it honestly should have gone all-in on the latter because I think that's historically closer to their strength. Good Feel has always been held back by being a platformer developer who just aren't especially good at platforming. Both Shake It and Woolly World are so slow and mushy feeling compared to the Nintendo games they're based on. What they're good at is making a game with a distinct art style and packing it full of unique environments and concepts. This Peach game might actually be better-suited to that? The art style isn't anything special this time, but in theory they have a lot to gain from the gameplay being "whatever" because it means they can just go all-in on doing anything with the levels. ...No idea how they executed any of it though, I still haven't even gotten around to the demo.
 
MetalLord said:
Wait…people dislike wario land 5,how ???
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I thought it was very dull and the controls didn't work well. The first four Wario Lands are all very unique and creative but Shake It just feels like a slower and less interesting retread of Wario Land 4 to me. I don't think the music or visuals are up to series standards either. Personally I don't consider it part of the series.
 
I'm glad people are enjoying the game, and I find it has its own qualities.

However, I don't find it at all shocking to think that the game's technical problems, repetitiveness and lack of depth deserve to reflect negatively on the overall perception of the game.

I don't care who a game is aimed at. Kirby and The Forgotten Land is also aimed at a young audience and is not extraordinarily difficult. That doesn't stop it from being a wonderful game and possessing a lot of qualities that Princess Peach Showtime clearly lacks, in my opinion, without this making PPS a terrible game, of course.
 
boodream said:
I'm glad people are enjoying the game, and I find it has its own qualities.

However, I don't find it at all shocking to think that the game's technical problems, repetitiveness and lack of depth deserve to reflect negatively on the overall perception of the game.

I don't care who a game is aimed at. Kirby and The Forgotten Land is also aimed at a young audience and is not extraordinarily difficult. That doesn't stop it from being a wonderful game and possessing a lot of qualities that Princess Peach Showtime clearly lacks, in my opinion, without this making PPS a terrible game, of course.
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So where do you land when it comes to Princess Peach Showtime?
 
Brock Reiher said:
I thought it was very dull and the controls didn't work well. The first four Wario Lands are all very unique and creative but Shake It just feels like a slower and less interesting retread of Wario Land 4 to me. I don't think the music or visuals are up to series standards either. Personally I don't consider it part of the series.
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Funny because that's what I feel from WL4 compared to WL3.
 
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9-Volt said:
"It's easy so it must be a games for younger gamers". This statement is so wrong yet the reviewers keep repeating it. Why should something easy needs to be younger gamers? Do people know what young gamers under 10 play these days? Or similarly, why can't adults play something easy and relaxing once in a while?

Personally, my childhood days were filled with challenging stuff like Contra, TMNT or Batman games. As an adult, I always choose the easiest option in games to save time. I still appreciate some challenge but I certainly welcome relaxing games in between. I need games like Showtime.
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its like.

my grandma whos never played a video game could beat this in her sleep, its shallow as all hell.
its very clearly targeted toward 6 year olds.
 
TrashMarket said:
it's a shitty brand management decision, to associate all nintendo games with nintendo singularly, regardless of the individual teams/devs that actually did the work
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in this case it might have been a mistake, as now you can associate a mid game (for my age group, looks great for 4 year olds) with nintendo

thought its pretty interesting, most nintedno games are made with kids in mind but never fully targeted and geared towards them, theres always some amount of depth plus a brutal post-game usually that no one below 8 is clearing.

they really target everyone, peach just kinda doesn't, its just, what you get without much else. which is where my disappointment with it lies, mostly optional depth.

boodream said:
To be honest, before the game's release, I was a bit worried that the critical reception of the game would be overly harsh because of this kind of bias, which doesn't really mean anything, and I totally agree with you. I don't think it's wrong to say that the game is trying to appeal to a young audience, but that doesn't mean it's only aimed at them. We can judge a game on what it is, not on the image we have of it.

However, I have to admit that on reading the first feedbacks, even if we can indeed read a few reflections on the intended audience, I have the feeling that critics are going a little overboard in their indulgence, perhaps too pronounced in their desire to be benevolent. Irrespective of the audience, real or supposed, for which the game is intended, problems of performance, repetitiveness and lack of depth seem to be major flaws.

Kirby and the Forgotten Land is an absolutely adorable game, and yet I don't remember reading reviews that constantly emphasized a supposedly young audience. Perhaps that's because there was no need to even ask the question of audience to downplay or minimize obvious flaws, since it was simply an excellent game. I bought PPS because I want to play it with my nephews, but honestly I would much rather have read that the game had great variety, that the experience was getting richer as it went along and that the performance problems had disappeared since the demo than to read that all that was still there but that it didn't matter because it's cool that Peach has her game.
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sometimes it does seem like an excuse for why this game isnt up to snuff with what nintendo usually puts out.

the assumption unless xenoblade or fire emblem is its always for kids but every adult will have a good time anyway.
 
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Djehuty said:
my grandma whos never played a video game could beat this in her sleep, its shallow as all hell.
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Djehuty said:
most nintedno games are made with kids in mind but never fully targeted and geared towards them, theres always some amount of depth plus a brutal post-game usually that no one below 8 is clearing.

they really target everyone, peach just kinda doesn't, its just, what you get without much else. which is where my disappointment with it lies, mostly optional depth.
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Lack of challenge isn't synonymous with shallow gameplay. Just increasing the distance between two platforms doesn't make the gameplay of jumping from platform to platform deeper. But making one of the platforms move does. Putting enemies on the platform does. Making platforms vanish in a certain pattern does. You get what I mean and can continue with other examples in your mind.

So does Princess Peach: Showtime leave ideas on the table or does it iterate on what each costume can do in fun, interesting ways throughout the levels dedicated to that costume's style of gameplay? Or is the problem more that each costume is so limited in it's abilities you can't do much with it, no matter where the difficulty curve would be set?
 
Sheldon said:
Lack of challenge isn't synonymous with shallow gameplay. Just increasing the distance between two platforms doesn't make the gameplay of jumping from platform to platform deeper. But making one of the platforms move does. Putting enemies on the platform does. Making platforms vanish in a certain pattern does. You get what I mean and can continue with other examples in your mind.

So does Princess Peach: Showtime leave ideas on the table or does it iterate on what each costume can do in fun, interesting ways throughout the levels dedicated to that costume's style of gameplay? Or is the problem more that each costume is so limited in it's abilities you can't do much with it, no matter where the difficulty curve would be set?
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they do have creative ideas, but the game-play doesn't really back up those ideas, the costumes feel like linear play this mini game then play another mini game then another especially. it does and has a lot of things to do, but because its so fast paced in moving on from ideas not a lot is developed.

the ones that aren't like this are the action ones which feel way to samey seroisly there are some differences in some key moments but the same 3 hit combo for each actiion focused one just with different aimations is very noticble , and two I really thoughtwere the games highlights were Detective and Dashing thief, detective has a lot slower pase gameplay so it stays around much much more than the others and feels properly developed and phatom theif is a platformer based on grappling hooks its still pretty short but it plays pretty well with what it has, and as a platofrmer it doenst need as much stuff going on to really shine, jusst good jumping here to there (though its definlty on the flashier side with gameplay that sometimes jsut feels like walking forward with extra steps)


essentially you get 10ish minutes per costume to make and develop a concept and it comes back every so often within the same costume, but each costume is still only going to be 30-40 minutes except for detective and each time it comes around you just do more of the same or some different minigames if you are baker or iceskater for example, if i could compare you essnetialy play a bunch of tutorial levels mashed together and thats the game.

I think it could have benifited by either having more costumes so the repeats dont feel to bad and having greater variety. and giveing each 15 or so mintues of a concept, because for prett ymuch all of them you get it in 2 minutes and then it doesnt do anything beyond the I get it.

or like 4 or 5 costumes and give them each an hour and a half instead of 40 minutes to really hone in on each gameplay stlyle because as it is theres too much overlap between some, and the others are baker peach (the worst one easily)

and mermaid peach was just kind of tedious. thats all i really have to say about it
the games just like fine

its not bugyy its an expereince that isnt bad, like its solid and the presentation is pretty good but i dont know the gameplay is just very whatever for anything.
i just odnt like this kinda, dumbing it down for kids, causse i hope thats what it is.
Pikmin 4 is super easy for kids but has a lot of optional challenge and gameplay that really evolves by introduing more things to keep track of and further uses for pikmin.

its like a 6/10
its not bad at all.
ver solidly built but the gameplay is lackluster, its a game you play once and never replay it ebcause the fun of it is seeing the new stuff first introduced really.
the first hour or two when its all new concepts is defintly the best at least for me.

when it starts to reapet them and it just becomes more of the same. which is fine if you like the gameplpay but the real fun is based on trying something new imo.
 
I hope Nintendo releases Princess Peach Showtime 2 before new Paper Mario and Metroid games.
 
Stilt Village said:
Crafted World is full of super creative level concepts but the whole game feels really muddled as a result of the troubled development (the core gimmick that was shown off in the reveal trailer was almost completely gutted from the final product). It's clunky to control and stuck between being a platformer like its predecessor and some sort of I Spy diorama thing, and it honestly should have gone all-in on the latter because I think that's historically closer to their strength. Good Feel has always been held back by being a platformer developer who just aren't especially good at platforming. Both Shake It and Woolly World are so slow and mushy feeling compared to the Nintendo games they're based on. What they're good at is making a game with a distinct art style and packing it full of unique environments and concepts. This Peach game might actually be better-suited to that? The art style isn't anything special this time, but in theory they have a lot to gain from the gameplay being "whatever" because it means they can just go all-in on doing anything with the levels. ...No idea how they executed any of it though, I still haven't even gotten around to the demo.
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I was saying this in the OT (and not saying it's a bad thing) but in retrospect it's obvious this is a Good Feel game because while the theming is less an all-encompassing art style, it's still extremely committed to a crafty "theatre" theme that is informing the gameplay in a serious way. It could've easily been "go through a painting/portal" Mario-style levels but it's not that.
 
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Stilt Village said:
Crafted World is full of super creative level concepts but the whole game feels really muddled as a result of the troubled development (the core gimmick that was shown off in the reveal trailer was almost completely gutted from the final product). It's clunky to control and stuck between being a platformer like its predecessor and some sort of I Spy diorama thing, and it honestly should have gone all-in on the latter because I think that's historically closer to their strength. Good Feel has always been held back by being a platformer developer who just aren't especially good at platforming. Both Shake It and Woolly World are so slow and mushy feeling compared to the Nintendo games they're based on. What they're good at is making a game with a distinct art style and packing it full of unique environments and concepts. This Peach game might actually be better-suited to that? The art style isn't anything special this time, but in theory they have a lot to gain from the gameplay being "whatever" because it means they can just go all-in on doing anything with the levels. ...No idea how they executed any of it though, I still haven't even gotten around to the demo.
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I don't want to derail this topic with talk about Crafted World but I'm still impressed how little the E3 2017 demo resembles the full game. I wonder who decided to scrap the ability to flip the camera* at any time. I'm not sure that would've made for a compelling game if I'm honest, seeing as the mechanic is exactly as I described it - a camera trick, one that doesn't affect objects in the levels themselves. I can see how that led to a lot of scrapped content as a result, especially as much of the E3 2017 trailer is completely absent in the full game (like that top-down train boss, which isn't like the final Gator Train boss we got), and probably impacted things like the soundtrack as a result.

*(between the "front side" and "flip side")
 
It's astonishing that Crafted World was so much more difficult to develop than its Wii U predecessor, which was already an HD development. Add to this the performance problems encountered not only in Princess Peach Show Time, but also, from what we've seen, in the previous game developed by Good Feel, and we might assume that the problem stems from their switch to the Unreal Engine.

That puzzles me. This kind of decision was supposed to facilitate development, not complicate it, according to Etsunobu Ebisu's own words:
Unreal Engine made it easy to make adjustments to the visuals, and allowed us to produce textures we were satisfied with. And when it comes to making these crafted objects feel real, their physical properties are every bit as important as aesthetics. The physics engine the Unreal Engine makes use of also proved handy for accomplishing this goal.
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www.ign.com

Yoshi's Crafted World Developers Speak on Unreal Engine, amiibo, and More! – IGN First - IGN

Takashi Tezuka and Etsunobu Ebisu speak about the decision to work with a Western game engine, their favorite parts of Yoshi's Crafted World, and more.
www.ign.com www.ign.com
 
boodream said:
It's astonishing that Crafted World was so much more difficult to develop than its Wii U predecessor, which was already an HD development. Add to this the performance problems encountered not only in Princess Peach Show Time, but also, from what we've seen, in the previous game developed by Good Feel, and we might assume that the problem stems from their switch to the Unreal Engine.

That puzzles me. This kind of decision was supposed to facilitate development, not complicate it, according to Etsunobu Ebisu's own words:

www.ign.com

Yoshi's Crafted World Developers Speak on Unreal Engine, amiibo, and More! – IGN First - IGN

Takashi Tezuka and Etsunobu Ebisu speak about the decision to work with a Western game engine, their favorite parts of Yoshi's Crafted World, and more.
www.ign.com www.ign.com
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UE might be a bit painful for them on the Switch but hopefully it's a good bet for the future and those issues will be ironed out with stronger hardware. They make good looking games, I'm excited to see their next one.
 
buildz said:
I don't want to derail this topic with talk about Crafted World but I'm still impressed how little the E3 2017 demo resembles the full game. I wonder who decided to scrap the ability to flip the camera* at any time. I'm not sure that would've made for a compelling game if I'm honest, seeing as the mechanic is exactly as I described it - a camera trick, one that doesn't affect objects in the levels themselves. I can see how that led to a lot of scrapped content as a result, especially as much of the E3 2017 trailer is completely absent in the full game (like that top-down train boss, which isn't like the final Gator Train boss we got), and probably impacted things like the soundtrack as a result.

*(between the "front side" and "flip side")
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I think the idea was probably that it would relate to the heavy background interaction the game has, so you would constantly be flipping perspectives to look all around you for secrets or things you needed to progress, like the pieces of the bridge you build to reunite the rhinos in the jungle level. At some point they probably realized that it was disorienting test players, wasn't actually any fun, and in general an idea that seems like it would have come out of the early 90's as a bizarre workaround to be able to boast that your game was "3D". They probably dropped it crazy late in development though, isn't the entire flip side of each level still in the game as a sort of mirror mode replay thing where you hunt for the Poochy Pups?

The soundtrack being the way it is was IIRC mostly a result of them moving offices and not continuing to work with their previous composer, who didn't move with them. I wouldn't necessarily say the shuffling of content made much of a difference there in the end, because despite the massive variety of different settings, the game has fewer level themes than a New Super Mario Bros. game. It doesn't seem like they cared about making sure the music closely matched the level to begin with (or its quality in general, for that matter), so I'd be surprised if they threw much if anything out during development (and baffled, because they needed every scrap of music they could get). It's a thing that happens, I think both Retro DKC games had the music continually tweaked throughout development as the levels evolved, and you can still hear some earlier versions in Tropical Freeze prerelease footage. I just doubt it was the case for Crafted World because it really doesn't seem like they cared in the first place.
 
Charamiwa said:
UE might be a bit painful for them on the Switch but hopefully it's a good bet for the future and those issues will be ironed out with stronger hardware. They make good looking games, I'm excited to see their next one.
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Pikmin 4 was also developed with UE, if I'm not mistaken, and doesn't seem to be limited by hardware, so I'm rather mixed about it. I like Good Feel, I agree, they make very nice games, albeit a little slow at times, but I think they certainly have problems that are not solely related to technical constraints.
 
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