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Reviews Kirby and the Forgotten Land | Review Thread

NGL, some of these write-ups are really opening my eyes regarding how difficulty is handled in game reviews. It’s kinda jarring that a game like Kirby, which is clearly aimed at a more casual, family audience, is often criticized (which reflects in the scores) for being “too easy” for veteran gamers, whereas a very difficult game like Elden Ring which is aimed at a core audience is not punished by critics for being “too hard.”

Kinda makes me think that only games designed for a “hardcore audience” are worthy of high review scores in the eyes of some critics.
 
Jbone916 said:
NGL, some of these write-ups are really opening my eyes regarding how difficulty is handled in game reviews. It’s kinda jarring that a game like Kirby, which is clearly aimed at a more casual, family audience, is often criticized (which reflects in the scores) for being “too easy” for veteran gamers, whereas a very difficult game like Elden Ring which is aimed at a core audience is not punished by critics for being “too hard.”

Kinda makes me think that only games designed for a “hardcore audience” are worthy of high review scores in the eyes of some critics.
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Right. A good way to approach this would be

a). What goal does the game set for itself?
b). And does it accomplish this?

Elden Ring and Kirby both seemingly succeed in their own difficulty goals.
 
Delighted this has turned out so well. Cant wait to go through co-op with the family on Friday. All big Kirby fans!
 
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Kirby is supposed to be open to all skill levels and save the real challenge for specialized side modes and 100% collectibles
 
Jbone916 said:
NGL, some of these write-ups are really opening my eyes regarding how difficulty is handled in game reviews. It’s kinda jarring that a game like Kirby, which is clearly aimed at a more casual, family audience, is often criticized (which reflects in the scores) for being “too easy” for veteran gamers, whereas a very difficult game like Elden Ring which is aimed at a core audience is not punished by critics for being “too hard.”

Kinda makes me think that only games designed for a “hardcore audience” are worthy of high review scores in the eyes of some critics.
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Reviewers playing Elden Ring: Finally, I beat Malenia after 20 tries and leveling up for hours. God I'm so good at this game.

Reviewers playing Donkey Kong: Man, fuck this piece of shit monkey ass game! I know for a fact I barrel rolled into that penguin over the gap! FUUUUCCKKKK!!!
 
manfromthedam said:
Right. A good way to approach this would be

a). What goal does the game set for itself?
b). And does it accomplish this?

Elden Ring and Kirby both seemingly succeed in their own difficulty goals.
Click to expand...

This is already how games are reviewed.

The actual example of being upset about a game you've not even played yet not reviewing to the same score level as Elden ring already on this page is some daft nonsense. Hitting your difficulty goal doesn't then turn in to "And therefore this game deserves a 95+ metacritic".


Putting a mention in a review that a Kirby game is gonna be on the easier side is just part of reviewing the game. It doesn't mean it was reviewed poorly because of it in most cases. It's exactly the same in that a review of any major Fromsoft game that failed to mention the backbreaking difficultly, would be a bad review. (And as an aside, number of which are also in the mid 80s like this game will end up being)
 
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Great reviews, as expected. Playing Triple Deluxe again for system-testing purposes has made me realize that I could go for a new Kirby game, my hype has been increasing steadily.
 
Linkstrikesback said:
This is already how games are reviewed.

The actual example of being upset about a game you've not even played yet not reviewing to the same score level as Elden ring already on this page is some daft nonsense.

Hitting your difficulty goal doesn't then turn in to "And therefore this game deserves a 95+ metacritic"
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Your post makes me think that I'm back on ERA. I'm not upset, I didn't say anything about Metacritic scores, and was just ruminating about how one would go about this. Chill the heck out.
 
One week cooldown ban: unwarranted hostility and history of similar behavior. - blondkayvon, BozPaggs, Donnie
manfromthedam said:
Your post makes me think that I'm back on ERA. I'm not upset, I didn't say anything about Metacritic scores, and was just ruminating about how one would go about this. Chill the heck out.
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Sorry, I didn't realise I accidentally sent you a private message instead of expecting the obvious continuation of the post you quoted from the thread a single post directly above you, which verbatim said "only games designed for a “hardcore audience” are worthy of high review scores in the eyes of some critics." also needed to be quoted again in order to make the reason for continuing to discuss the review scores clear, because the continuing stream of logic seemed obvious to me.

"Chill the heck out"
 
Holy shit did not expect this game to get so many 9’s since it’s Kirby. To me every game has been great, but still…. I know how the series reviews usually as an easy more kid oriented game. Wow. Great scores!
 
Linkstrikesback said:
This is already how games are reviewed.

The actual example of being upset about a game you've not even played yet not reviewing to the same score level as Elden ring already on this page is some daft nonsense. Hitting your difficulty goal doesn't then turn in to "And therefore this game deserves a 95+ metacritic".
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Nobody said anything about Kirby scoring similarly to Elden Ring - the point was more about what reviewers see as acceptable forms and levels of difficulty which is a perfectly valid topic for a series like Kirby which does get criticised for lacking challenge.
 
Linkstrikesback said:
Sorry, I didn't realise I accidentally sent you a private message instead of expecting the obvious continuation of the post you quoted from the thread a single post directly above you, which verbatim said "only games designed for a “hardcore audience” are worthy of high review scores in the eyes of some critics." also needed to be quoted again in order to make the reason for continuing to discuss the review scores clear, because the continuing stream of logic seemed obvious to me.

"Chill the heck out"
Click to expand...

The primary criticism shared among the most negative reviews of this game is that it’s too easy. That’s what motivated the fairly benign observation you’ve responded to with weird, misplaced hostility.
 
Linkstrikesback said:
Sorry, I didn't realise I accidentally sent you a private message instead of expecting the obvious continuation of the post you quoted from the thread a single post directly above you, which verbatim said "only games designed for a “hardcore audience” are worthy of high review scores in the eyes of some critics." also needed to be quoted again in order to make the reason for continuing to discuss the review scores clear, because the continuing stream of logic seemed obvious to me.

"Chill the heck out"
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Apology accepted.
 
although some reviewers seem to act like harder-to-beat games are more worthy of higher scores, in the big picture I don't think that matters too much, I believe Kirby and the Forgotten Land is getting the scores it deserves.

85 is an amazing achievement and I bet everyone involved in the game is very happy right now.
 
Guaraná said:
although some reviewers seem to act like harder-to-beat games are more worthy of higher scores, in the big picture I think Kirby and the Forgotten Land is getting the scores it deserves.

85 is an amazing achievement and I bet everyone involved in the game is very happy right now.
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Is this true? Off the top of my head the highest scoring games are things like Mario Galaxy and the Last of Us. Meanwhile challenging games like DKCTF score poorly because of that same challenge.
 
I'm looking forward to Kirby. Not had a preorder dispatch notification yet, but hopefully it turns up in time for the weekend.
 
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Clix said:
Holy shit did not expect this game to get so many 9’s since it’s Kirby. To me every game has been great, but still…. I know how the series reviews usually as an easy more kid oriented game. Wow. Great scores!
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Seriously, can't wait to dive in with my 8yo in co-op! Like Yoshi's Crafted World it seems like a game that offers plenty of player expression, which goes a long way to keep more easy games interesting for me.
 
Brock Reiher said:
Is this true? Off the top of my head the highest scoring games are things like Mario Galaxy and the Last of Us. Meanwhile challenging games like DKCTF score poorly because of that same challenge.
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donkey kong is for children though. Souls are for manly men. hence the scores

/s
 
#9 on opencritic's 2022 hall of fame

screenshot2022-03-23wajga.jpeg
 
Mandos said:
Kirby is supposed to be open to all skill levels and save the real challenge for specialized side modes and 100% collectibles
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Exactly. Anyone who's claiming Kirby's easy haven't tried to 100% any of the games. Real challenge of Kirby comes after beating the game.
 
Greta to see it being received so well, definitely left a positive impression for me in the demo so very much looking forward to playing this on Friday. Perfect chaser for Elden Ring.

Not much to say on the difficulty side of things being mentioned as I haven't played it properly yet, but have any places actually highlighted it as an explicit negative, or is it more just general commenting on how easy/hard it is?
 
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Jbone916 said:
NGL, some of these write-ups are really opening my eyes regarding how difficulty is handled in game reviews. It’s kinda jarring that a game like Kirby, which is clearly aimed at a more casual, family audience, is often criticized (which reflects in the scores) for being “too easy” for veteran gamers, whereas a very difficult game like Elden Ring which is aimed at a core audience is not punished by critics for being “too hard.”

Kinda makes me think that only games designed for a “hardcore audience” are worthy of high review scores in the eyes of some critics.
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Well said. It's so illuminating that folks take offense to those asking for accessibility options in Elden Ring, yet are quick to ask for a hard mode for Kirby. Total bs.
 
The poster has a point about the difficulty Kirby games strive for for the main critical path campaign. Notice the lowest reviews - while still good of course - do seem to have that as a point of contention.

And in my opinion, there is nothing wrong with striving to make an easy kid friendly game as long as it is FUN. And it seems that like other Kirby games, there is the extra stuff to do for those that want that extra challenge. So I’m here for it.
 
Brock Reiher said:
Meanwhile challenging games like DKCTF score poorly because of that same challenge.
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Was that really the case? It has an 83(WiiU) / 86(Switch) metacritic and I remember the reception being more negative due to it being painted as iterative rather than difficulty.
 
These are really great scores for a Kirby game, I'm pumped and glad I preordered. Perfect chaser for Elden Ring, which I'm about 65 hours into with no signs of slowing down lol
 
Release day cannot get here quick enough. A little bummed this didn’t get an Essential from EG but the reviewer was very positive anyways. The NL and Dtoid reviewers were practically gushing.

So hyped!!

NeonRed said:
How long is the game? 60€ is too much for 6 hour game.
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NintendoLife’s reviewer basically said 7-15 hours depending on how completionist you are.
 
Wow, I thought this thread would just be as delighted as I am to see it reviewing so well. At least many of us are.

I'm really glad Nintendo is finally getting another 3D platformer out, and that it has a fun co-op mode as well!

mazi said:
#9 on opencritic's 2022 hall of fame

screenshot2022-03-23wajga.jpeg
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Triangle Strategy made the cut!
 
Good job HAL

Excited to see some fresh life and ambition in the series after so many years
 
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Linkstrikesback said:
This is already how games are reviewed.

The actual example of being upset about a game you've not even played yet not reviewing to the same score level as Elden ring already on this page is some daft nonsense. Hitting your difficulty goal doesn't then turn in to "And therefore this game deserves a 95+ metacritic".


Putting a mention in a review that a Kirby game is gonna be on the easier side is just part of reviewing the game. It doesn't mean it was reviewed poorly because of it in most cases. It's exactly the same in that a review of any major Fromsoft game that failed to mention the backbreaking difficultly, would be a bad review. (And as an aside, number of which are also in the mid 80s like this game will end up being)
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“Daft nonsense” really? This is some unnecessary hostility to my inoffensive observation.

Discussion on hardcore bias in games media is important to have if the goal is to be inclusive. I’m not implying that Elden Ring is undeserving of its praise and review scores, my intent was to point out the impression I get from some of the Kirby reviews I read that easiness is inherently a negative regardless of a game’s intended audience.
 
Pretty great scores although I find weird that some reviewers consider the difficulty as a negative. You went into a Kirby game, you should know the level of challenge that was coming.

Also, has anyone mentioned how crazy the story and lore will be?
 
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Jbone916 said:
NGL, some of these write-ups are really opening my eyes regarding how difficulty is handled in game reviews. It’s kinda jarring that a game like Kirby, which is clearly aimed at a more casual, family audience, is often criticized (which reflects in the scores) for being “too easy” for veteran gamers, whereas a very difficult game like Elden Ring which is aimed at a core audience is not punished by critics for being “too hard.”

Kinda makes me think that only games designed for a “hardcore audience” are worthy of high review scores in the eyes of some critics.
Click to expand...
I think there's more to this than what you're seeing and what the reviewers are saying. I'm going to throw some reviewers under the bus here, but whatever. What I assume is probably going on, which has happened with Kirby before ironically, is that there are some design elements that never really build up in a linear way as the game goes along. Kirby has a history of abandoning platforming challenges in favor of going for more exploratory and player driven kinds of engagement which don't always work. Some people when they open up the platforming game, are rightfully going to expect platforming to be front and center. When the platforming doesn't engage with them and they are disappointed, it's easy enough to identify the lack of challenge as a component and just point the finger at that. I'd imagine a lot of writers either aren't equipped to get into stuff like that in these "timely" reviews, or whatever platform they write for is just not lookin for that type of analysis in their review format. They could be right in saying something is lacking in that area which harms the game, but are misidentifying the lack of engagement as a lack of difficulty.

On the flip side of this, Soulsborne titles tend to really benefit from their boss design more or less forcing certain kinds of engagement. Difficulty is not the reason this works, but it's a component/consequence of that kind of design. Again, it's easier to identify the experience of difficulty and put those words down on paper rather than zero in on what specifically about the difficulty is engaging and rewarding. It makes it really hard to talk about the ways in which "difficulty" draws people to games and why it works when most talk about games is simplified like this. If you've ever seen Derek Yu's talk on Spiky vs Soft design it much better contextualizes this and has much more useful language/analogies to talk about how elements like these work. Considering the whiplash of Elden Ring into Kirby, it's a great time to check that idea out.
 
I'm actually quite glad that the game isn't that difficult, and I'm really glad the game's turned out good. Gonna be such a nice breather after the monster that was Elden Ring.
 
Jbone916 said:
NGL, some of these write-ups are really opening my eyes regarding how difficulty is handled in game reviews. It’s kinda jarring that a game like Kirby, which is clearly aimed at a more casual, family audience, is often criticized (which reflects in the scores) for being “too easy” for veteran gamers, whereas a very difficult game like Elden Ring which is aimed at a core audience is not punished by critics for being “too hard.”

Kinda makes me think that only games designed for a “hardcore audience” are worthy of high review scores in the eyes of some critics.
Click to expand...
Dead on. This has really bothered me in recent years, yet it's something I've admittedly been guilty of in the past.

I've written thoughts and deleted them out of fear they sound too "gamer-y" but I get consistently frustrated with what is considered "greatness" in games. Often the 'feelings' people take seriously in the greatest games are feelings of sadness in these downtrodden worlds with somber characters. (I maintain that The Last Of Us Part 2 is a miserable experience). It definitely doesn't happen as often as it used to, but it's like critics forget that joy is just as valid of an emotion.

On the topic of Kirby, I remember the discourse when Epic Yarn came out. While it still reviewed relatively well, there was the prevailing sentiment of "what's the point" of a Kirby game with no lives, no penalty if you die, etc. Meanwhile, that game was LOVELY. A unique presentation, a wonderful soundtrack, imaginative levels, great co-op... It fully and wholeheartedly succeeded in what it attempted to do, yet even glowing reviews landed at an 8 because of difficulty.
 
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