StarTopic Future Nintendo Hardware & Technology Speculation & Discussion |ST| (New Staff Post, Please read)

[karmitt]

What do you mean? Workers or Polygons statement?

Polygon has to prove hinself having sources otherwise its just hot air like it would be from the rest of us without any proof.

I was talking about Polygon’s. Far too much going on in that post, all with heaps of confidence™

I’ve realized there’s another wall of text above my post as well and I’m even less inclined to engage. Like…damn.

 

[Raccoon]

I've been snide to you guys for only caring about silicon but having seen how the thread goes when you talk about actual products I kind of get it

 

[Blue Monty]

The issue with New 3DS is that one of its biggest issues was the lack of Nintendo exclusives, is hard for 3rd parties to want to make games for the console only if Nintendo themselves doesn’t do it

 

[Stinky Horse]

The issue with New 3DS is that one of its biggest issues was the lack of Nintendo exclusives, is hard for 3rd parties to want to make games for the console only if Nintendo themselves doesn’t do it

As long as they can sell large volumes of hardware that should be irrelevant. If the industry was keen on having to compete with Nintendo software then you'd see much more Switch support to begin with.

 

[Link_enfant]

Does Nintendo absolutely need to release Drake and BOTW2 at the same time, or very close?
Zelda comes in Spring, but which month?
If they don’t both release at the same, would Nintendo rather have Drake released or Zelda released for the current FY?

 

[Raccoon]

Does Nintendo absolutely need to release Drake and BOTW2 at the same time, or very close?
Zelda comes in Spring, but which month?
If they don’t both release at the same, would Nintendo rather have Drake released or Zelda released for the current FY?

I'd bet that, if it's happening at all, it will be out before or on the same day as Zelda

 

[ILikeFeet]

I've been snide to you guys for only caring about silicon but having seen how the thread goes when you talk about actual products I kind of get it

the silicon is what determines how the games run and look and if it will even get games, not how it's marketed

 

[Raccoon]

the silicon is what determines how the games run and look and if it will even get games, not how it's marketed

and how it's positioned determines what games get made for it at all

silicon doesn't get games, products do

 

[ILikeFeet]

and how it's positioned determines what games get made for it at all

silicon doesn't get games, products do

and the switch is the best selling system in the world on a monthly basis

look at all the games that ain't coming to it

 

[Pokemaniac]

This Switch revision will be exactly the same as the New Nintendo 3DS. Everything points to this (Remember Nate telling us about some Exclusives? --> NN 3DS principe)

Even just from what we know from the Nvidia hack, this is a very different sort of system from the New 3DS. If they actually intended for it to just be that and nothing more, building a chip that's going to require software assistance to run existing Switch games is not just overkill, but arguably counterproductive. Unless Nintendo decides to go all in on rapid iterative upgrades, the idea of another spec upgrade as soon as 2025 is ludicrous.

 

[Raccoon]

and the switch is the best selling system in the world on a monthly basis

look at all the games that ain't coming to it

you really think a switch pro and a switch 2 would get the same support?

 

[fwd-bwd]

I don't think a lot of this stuff is really fully exposed, if at all, to games in the first place. The reason I'm so convinced it's a bad idea is that docked vs undocked is currently a very binary state, and, as such games are most likely absolutely full of assumptions that all of the elements of that will change together. It's likely not something that can be disentangled easily.

That’s very good point. Sorry I didn’t explain my thinking well. The docked/handheld modes being a binary blackbox IMO is an advantage. Nintendo may do those things I listed on the system level without exposing them to the game.

Using handheld profiles on a docked Switch can be very problematic, but using docked profiles on a more powerful handheld Switch (when done on the OS level as I described) I don’t foresee many software issues (I welcome to be corrected though). It seems to me an universal solution with a blacklist would be easier to execute and maintain than a case-by-case whitelist approach.

That said, this is really a thought experiment. Even if this solution works, it’d only help old games to run better in handheld mode on Drake. It won’t enhance the docked performance at all. Games may still need to be patched.

 

[Crusters]

you really think a switch pro and a switch 2 would get the same support?

I mean, there will never be a switch pro. That name will never be used.

But, yes, it's literally just a name.

 

[ILikeFeet]

you really think a switch pro and a switch 2 would get the same support?

you first have to say what the difference even is. all we know of is Drake. it's a 1536 core ampere gpu. we can, fairly accurately, guesstimate its (theoretical) performance. what even is a "pro" and a "2" in respect to information that we know? only then can we begin to guess what the support would look like

 

[Hermii]

This Switch revision will be exactly the same as the New Nintendo 3DS. Everything points to this (Remember Nate telling us about some Exclusives? --> NN 3DS principe)

Nah, new 3ds was using the same generation of hardware as the original.

Ampere is 3 gens better than maxwell. And it has 6 times the cuda core count.

A78 is like 5 generations over a57.

Hardware wise, this is definitely a next gen system. No matter how Nintendo positions it.

 

[Crusters]

Nah, new 3ds was using the same generation of hardware as the original.

Ampere is 3 gens better than maxwell. And it has 6 times the cuda core count.

A78 is like 5 generations over a57.

Hardware wise, this is definitely a next gen system. No matter how Nintendo positions it.

I think this line of posts is referring to marketing/positioning and not hard information like the actual hardware.

 

[Hermii]

I think this line of posts is referring to marketing/positioning and not hard information like the actual hardware.

But again, if you say Nintendo is launching “real next gen” in 2025 or something, and it’s supposed to be a substantial leap over Drake the math doesn’t add up.

 

[Stinky Horse]

I've been bored of this conversation for getting on for 3 years now but my expectation is still it being a new generation by stealth, similar to the Game Boy Color, which had zero exclusives for the first year, and I'm sure that was a deliberate decision to make it feel like part of the same family, before they opened the floodgates and almost all titles started being exclusive to GBC. (For the rather short life it had before GBA, but that part doesn't need to be repeated)

 

[Crusters]

But again, if you say Nintendo is launching “real next gen” in 2025 or something, and it’s supposed to be a substantial leap over Drake the math doesn’t add up.

As far as I can gather from these posts, which I assume are already aware of what Drake is, compared to the x1, the marketing is purposefully decoupled from reality.

 

[Serif]

Why didn't Nintendo call the Game Boy Advance "Game Boy 2?"

I'm sure they could have, I'm wondering if they explained it anywhere.

 

[Stinky Horse]

Why didn't Nintendo call the Game Boy Advance "Game Boy 2?"

I'm sure they could have, I'm wondering if they explained it anywhere.

Probably because it's the kind of thing Sega was doing in the mid 80s

 

[CypressFX]

I was talking about Polygon’s. Far too much going on in that post, all with heaps of confidence™

I’ve realized there’s another wall of text above my post as well and I’m even less inclined to engage. Like…damn.

I a

Nah, new 3ds was using the same generation of hardware as the original.

Ampere is 3 gens better than maxwell. And it has 6 times the cuda core count.

A78 is like 5 generations over a57.

Hardware wise, this is definitely a next gen system. No matter how Nintendo positions it.

It doesnt change anything in the approach. This thing can have a RTX 4090 in it and would change a bit. New 3DS got Exclusives, thats all what counts. And so will the Super Switch. It will be a Switch 1.9 in this regards. Until 2025 and 2026 there is very likely another breakthrough in mobile SoCs so it will jsutify to go again to a new console (as Nintendo always do).

 

[Deleted member 887]

Thanks for the great info regarding the pitfalls of running docked profiles in handheld modes (aka "game boost"). Nintendo, however, can do things that the emulation community cannot, therefore I wonder if we are over-estimating the difficulty. It seems to me that Nintendo could remap some controller inputs and system settings to support the performance boost automatically without the games being any wiser:

1. Exclude games that requires handheld mode (e.g., Disney Tsum Tsum Festival)
   • I don't know if there's any system flag for a game to declare that it can't run in docked mode
   • If there is, these games can be excluded automatically (no patch needed)
   • If not, blacklist these games from performance boost
2. Remap controller inputs
   • Disable the touchscreen
   • Declare to the game that the on-rail joycons are detached; pass all joystick/button events, sensor readings, RFID data, and HD Rumble streams

If you disable the touchscreen in handheld mode, you break touchscreen games, like Mario Maker. If you leave it powered on, and then use it to emulate motion controls to the game that believes it is docked when it isn't you might find a config that works reliably (again, Mario Maker) but it will still break games that don't use motion controls to handle touchscreen-like inputs - many games offer touch support for menus (and I wish it was more common in strategy games)

1. • For games that require joycons to be physically detached (e.g., Fitness Boxing):
     • Usually these games already provide on-screen instructions to detach the joycons; the players won't be confused
     • But if necessary, blacklist these games from performance boost
2. Set "TV" resolution to 720p, and route the video from DP (USB-C) to eDP (build-in display)
3. Set sound mode to stereo, and route the audio to internal speakers

So unless I'm missing something, Nintendo should be able to apply the performance boost (running docked profiles in handheld) automatically. Even if a handful of games need to be blacklisted, that would be a lot easier to do than whitelisting thousands of games to be boosted. (MS already gave up on adding more titles to "FPS boost" after about 130 games.)

The appeal of running Drake Handheld in a mode which pretends to be Classic Docked (with its faster clocks) is that you can get a boost mode that reliably works across the board because games have already been tested in that configuration.

Thing is that even if there is a setup that reliably works, it only boosts handheld mode, and I'm sure Nintendo want to boost docked as well. The only way to boost docked mode without patching games is to run games at faster clocks (and with more RAM) than they request. Nintendo could do that 1) across the board, by default, 2) using a whitelist, 3) with some user-controlled option, or 4) some combination 2+3

At the point at which that is the route for docked mode, it is the simplest path for handheld mode as well. The clocks that Nintendo uses in Drake Handheld Boost mode might, indeed, match the clocks used in Classic Docked, but I don't think they'll lie to handheld mode about running in docked.

The advantage that this method has is you can actually get better than docked performance in handheld, or just boost GPU or just CPU for games that might benefit from just one, without the power consumption that boosting both might cost.

 

[Haida]

Might as well have given us that overclocked Mariko that can already run BotW in 60 fps.

The overclocked Mariko could only just about run it at 60 while using the handheld profile, so it's kind of pointless.

 

[Serif]

The overclocked Mariko could only just about run it at 60 while using the handheld profile, so it's kind of pointless.

'Twas a joke. The time for OC'd Mariko has passed since the Redbox revision.

 

[Dizzle]

As far as I can gather from these posts, which I assume are already aware of what Drake is, compared to the x1, the marketing is purposefully decoupled from reality.

Not to be too glib, but that is basically the definition of marketing.

 

[KMStwo]

I believe we are free to doubt any "insider" posts so I'm kind of dubious about Polygon's post. Let me explain:

PS4 + DLSS and conservative RT is too in line with what we have been discussing here. And for me this isn't how a dev would describe the performance of this next Switch. Just PS4 + DLSS, surely talking about the GPU weirdly in line with the most extensively discussed part of the console in this thread and what has already leaked. Not to mention PS4 + DLSS is kind of the safest bet from what we know. What about the CPU and RAM? Talking about the PS4 how is the next Switch CPU compared to it? What about the RAM? I believe devs must know the amount of RAM they are working with.

What I'm saying is that there is no new info on the real unknowns of this thread(Clocks, CPU and RAM). It is too lining what have been discussed here. Not that I was especting something different but he actually brings nothing new to the thread.

There is no actual new info apart from the devkit one which may not even be verified after the console releases. And if RDR2 doesn't happen, it can be easily countered with any argument why it didn't.

 

[Pokemaniac]

Ask yourself this.

Why would Nintendo launch a new more powerful, more expensive console that will be extremely supply constrained due to chip shortages and manufacturing issues (due to both Covid and the war in Ukraine) when they have no huge hitting “blockbuster” games that appeal to a global audience due this Holiday season. Yes I know Splatoon is huge in Japan.

On top of that Nintendo have a line of very successful current line up of hardware models (which combined they will have tens of millions of units already built) with a new special edition of their biggest selling current model (Splatoon OLED) to sell alongside their collection of holiday titles (Splatoon 3, Mario + Rabbids 2, Bayonetta 3, Pokemon and potentially Metroid Prime Remake).

Why on Earth would they rush this new model out this holiday when they have no giant games to push it and show off what it can do technically? They will be in essence performing a soft launch due to limited stock. They also have potentially their biggest ever AAA title launching next Spring where hardware demand is traditionally much lower than their usual massive Holiday hardware spike regardless of new models so a new Zelda to launch with a more powerful model would be far more potent in Q1 and keep the Switch family selling throughout 2023 (the consoles sixth year on the market). That would be unprecedented.

I’m going to back away from the thread for a while because to be honest it’s becoming stale at this point but I will leave you with some new info I have from last weeks drunken chat with a friend and their co worker. This is all the info I have so I apologise that I won’t be able to follow up with more -

New updated devkits with higher clocks arrived only weeks ago.

RDRII is one of the major third party exclusives for the console due around launch / launch window. RDR1 was also in development for all Switch models but was recently cancelled along with the RDRII PS5 / Series ports.

The new model is part of the current Switch family. Not a new generation.

It supports a custom DLSS and RT solution which are not directly comparable to Nvidia’s PC performance. Think their custom Switch API which is a good thing I’m told as it’s mobile technology and has different hurdles.

RT support is extremely conservative. Think AO or sound or other use cases versus high resolution reflections for instance. DLSS will help RT a lot in supported titles however.

Plan has always been 2023 as far as I’m told. “No chance” of it coming this year due to the kits not being final.

Finally when asked how powerful it is in ballpark terms I was told to think standard PS4 but using DLSS when supported to hit 4k instead of Sony’s checkerboard rendering solution so essentially a PS4 Pro. Not all games will support DLSS though so I’d take from that a lot of PS4 gen third party titles at 720p mobile and 1080p docked (which imo is great considering what PS4 can do and the fact many 2023 third party games are still cross gen and possible on standard PS4).

I’m personally guessing Switch 2 will come when mobile tech has reached the ability to run PS5 gen third party games at 540p mobile and 720p docked (then DLSS’ed). I’d guess Switch 2 will come around late 2025 at the earliest giving Switch an almost 10 year life cycle of support and in line with Nintendo’s PR on the subject.

Enjoy the 2022 software line up. There’s a ton to play on Switch and on all consoles. 2023 is where the real fun begins if you’re a tech enthusiast and a Nintendo fan!

Not going to comment too much on the validity of the information (though I definitely have some significant doubts, even if nobody in this situation is lying), but I don't really agree with a lot of the stuff around it. 2022 vs 2023 is probably not going to make all that significant a difference wrt shortages. Basically any of their announced or rumored titles for fall/holiday could make a good showcase with the appropriate work put in (though launching hardware with Bayonetta would probably be a bit of a power move). Zelda makes for a good launch title, but it's far from their only option. The lack of final dev kits in the hands of a third party doesn't really seem like that big of an obstacle to a 2022 release, even at this point in the year.

Also, as I said earlier, I really think what we already know about the hardware precludes the standard revision -> 2 years -> successor playbook. Any new hardware we'd be getting by 2025 would probably either be bargain bin Switch 1 revsions, Drake revisions, or something that is functionally Switch 3.

 

[Crusters]

I believe we are free to doubt any "insider" posts so I'm kind of dubious about Polygon's post. Let me explain:

PS4 + DLSS and conservative RT is too in line with what we have been discussing here. And for me this isn't how a dev would describe the performance of this next Switch. Just PS4 + DLSS, surely talking about the GPU weirdly in line with the most extensively discussed part of the console in this thread and what has already leaked. Not to mention PS4 + DLSS is kind of the safest bet from what we know. What about the CPU and RAM? Talking about the PS4 how is the next Switch CPU compared to it? What about the RAM? I believe devs must know the amount of RAM they are working with.

What I'm saying is that there is no new info on the real unknowns of this thread(Clocks, CPU and RAM). It is too lining what have been discussed here. Not that I was especting something different but he actually brings nothing new to the thread.

There is no actual new info apart from the devkit one which may not even be verified after the console releases. And if RDR2 doesn't happen, it can be easily countered with any argument why it didn't.

To be fair, I don't expect someone passing on the Information from an actual dev to match their vernacular, or to be able to recite word for word, unless they themselves are also a subject matter expert.

Also I don't think any devs have any finalized dev kits, just target kits.

This is just stating my outside a vacuum concept, and not necessarily weighing in on the subject at hand one way or another.

 

[NateDrake]

I have to laugh at the accusation that one thinks I have not heard new information on this hardware. Here's a bit of knowledge for you: not all new information requires a new report.

I heard plenty of information at GDC; but I didn't see it as enough to justify an entire discussion around. I've heard information the last several months but none requires an update or new report.

To illustrate this point; I'll use Polygon's post as an example. All of that has been discussed last year -- minus mentions of RDR. Which bit of that would require another report to reiterate the same information? If I cared about views and clickbait... maybe. But I don't.

 

[Raccoon]

I have to laugh at the accusation that one thinks I have not heard new information on this hardware.

the man just really, really wants a switch 2

 

[Golden Darkness]

I have to laugh at the accusation that one thinks I have not heard new information on this hardware. Here's a bit of knowledge for you: not all new information requires a new report.

I heard plenty of information at GDC; but I didn't see it as enough to justify an entire discussion around. I've heard information the last several months but none requires an update or new report.

To illustrate this point; I'll use Polygon's post as an example. All of that has been discussed last year -- minus mentions of RDR. Which bit of that would require another report to reiterate the same information? If I cared about views and clickbait... maybe. But I don't.

It's more about reconfirming the existence of the device and that things are still on track and nothing's been shelved. But if there was discussion around GDC, what would have been interesting is people's opinion on the device, and how strong is developer interest in it.

 

[NateDrake]

It's more about reconfirming the existence of the device and that things are still on track and nothing's been shelved. But if there was discussion around GDC, what would have been interesting is people's opinion on the device, and how strong is developer interest in it.

If I hear it's been shelved then it would be something worthy of reporting. Reconfirming it's a thing doesn't need to be a monthly event.

 

[CypressFX]

I have to laugh at the accusation that one thinks I have not heard new information on this hardware. Here's a bit of knowledge for you: not all new information requires a new report.

I heard plenty of information at GDC; but I didn't see it as enough to justify an entire discussion around. I've heard information the last several months but none requires an update or new report.

To illustrate this point; I'll use Polygon's post as an example. All of that has been discussed last year -- minus mentions of RDR. Which bit of that would require another report to reiterate the same information? If I cared about views and clickbait... maybe. But I don't.

Pointing to Polygons Tweet will be seen as : Nate confirms Launch for 2023 (+ Rockstar is working on some kind of game)

I do believe you dont want this to happen, right?

 

[NateDrake]

Pointing to Polygons Tweet will be seen as : Nate confirms Launch for 2023 (+ Rockstar is working on some kind of game)

I do believe you dont want this to happen, right?

If people choose to ignore "example" being used & opt to tweet it, then they are an idiot.

No outlet should report that post unless they can independently verify its claims; but, who am I kidding. In the era of post anything, profit, and shift the blame... why would one do the responsible thing. Buffoons think they can put 'Rumor' in a title and that grants freedom to report/discuss anything.

 

[Skittzo]

If I hear it's been shelved then it would be something worthy of reporting. Reconfirming it's a thing doesn't need to be a monthly event.

You underestimate this forum's need for reassurance

 

[CypressFX]

If I hear it's been shelved then it would be something worthy of reporting. Reconfirming it's a thing doesn't need to be a monthly event.

I think anyone in this thread is just curious to know if it will come out this year or next year. I think many of us will pause for months if its a 2023 product and discussion will cool down by minimum 90% until new big smoke is visible.

 

[NateDrake]

I think anyone in this thread is just curious to know if it will come out this year or next year. I think many of us will pause for months if its a 2023 product and discussion will cool down by minimum 90% until new big smoke is visible.

And I have near weekly discussions about production timing and such. Things take time.

 

[10k]

and it’s called the Nint

Ask yourself this.

Why would Nintendo launch a new more powerful, more expensive console that will be extremely supply constrained due to chip shortages and manufacturing issues (due to both Covid and the war in Ukraine) when they have no huge hitting “blockbuster” games that appeal to a global audience due this Holiday season. Yes I know Splatoon is huge in Japan.

On top of that Nintendo have a line of very successful current line up of hardware models (which combined they will have tens of millions of units already built) with a new special edition of their biggest selling current model (Splatoon OLED) to sell alongside their collection of holiday titles (Splatoon 3, Mario + Rabbids 2, Bayonetta 3, Pokemon and potentially Metroid Prime Remake).

Why on Earth would they rush this new model out this holiday when they have no giant games to push it and show off what it can do technically? They will be in essence performing a soft launch due to limited stock. They also have potentially their biggest ever AAA title launching next Spring where hardware demand is traditionally much lower than their usual massive Holiday hardware spike regardless of new models so a new Zelda to launch with a more powerful model would be far more potent in Q1 and keep the Switch family selling throughout 2023 (the consoles sixth year on the market). That would be unprecedented.

I’m going to back away from the thread for a while because to be honest it’s becoming stale at this point but I will leave you with some new info I have from last weeks drunken chat with a friend and their co worker. This is all the info I have so I apologise that I won’t be able to follow up with more -

New updated devkits with higher clocks arrived only weeks ago.

RDRII is one of the major third party exclusives for the console due around launch / launch window. RDR1 was also in development for all Switch models but was recently cancelled along with the RDRII PS5 / Series ports.

The new model is part of the current Switch family. Not a new generation.

It supports a custom DLSS and RT solution which are not directly comparable to Nvidia’s PC performance. Think their custom Switch API which is a good thing I’m told as it’s mobile technology and has different hurdles.

RT support is extremely conservative. Think AO or sound or other use cases versus high resolution reflections for instance. DLSS will help RT a lot in supported titles however.

Plan has always been 2023 as far as I’m told. “No chance” of it coming this year due to the kits not being final.

Finally when asked how powerful it is in ballpark terms I was told to think standard PS4 but using DLSS when supported to hit 4k instead of Sony’s checkerboard rendering solution so essentially a PS4 Pro. Not all games will support DLSS though so I’d take from that a lot of PS4 gen third party titles at 720p mobile and 1080p docked (which imo is great considering what PS4 can do and the fact many 2023 third party games are still cross gen and possible on standard PS4).

I’m personally guessing Switch 2 will come when mobile tech has reached the ability to run PS5 gen third party games at 540p mobile and 720p docked (then DLSS’ed). I’d guess Switch 2 will come around late 2025 at the earliest giving Switch an almost 10 year life cycle of support and in line with Nintendo’s PR on the subject.

Enjoy the 2022 software line up. There’s a ton to play on Switch and on all consoles. 2023 is where the real fun begins if you’re a tech enthusiast and a Nintendo fan!

And it’s called the Nintendo Switch Advance, right?

 

[Golden Darkness]

If I hear it's been shelved then it would be something worthy of reporting. Reconfirming it's a thing doesn't need to be a monthly event.

Well, not exactly shelved. But if there was for some reason total silence during GDC. Its hard to tell when nothing leaks.

But as you say, there was apparently private discussions during GDC. That could hint at more projects for the device, or how enthusiastic are developers and publishers looking to work on it.

How is developer reception to Drake?

 

[Alovon11]

Ask yourself this.

Why would Nintendo launch a new more powerful, more expensive console that will be extremely supply constrained due to chip shortages and manufacturing issues (due to both Covid and the war in Ukraine) when they have no huge hitting “blockbuster” games that appeal to a global audience due this Holiday season. Yes I know Splatoon is huge in Japan.

On top of that Nintendo have a line of very successful current line up of hardware models (which combined they will have tens of millions of units already built) with a new special edition of their biggest selling current model (Splatoon OLED) to sell alongside their collection of holiday titles (Splatoon 3, Mario + Rabbids 2, Bayonetta 3, Pokemon and potentially Metroid Prime Remake).

Why on Earth would they rush this new model out this holiday when they have no giant games to push it and show off what it can do technically? They will be in essence performing a soft launch due to limited stock. They also have potentially their biggest ever AAA title launching next Spring where hardware demand is traditionally much lower than their usual massive Holiday hardware spike regardless of new models so a new Zelda to launch with a more powerful model would be far more potent in Q1 and keep the Switch family selling throughout 2023 (the consoles sixth year on the market). That would be unprecedented.

I’m going to back away from the thread for a while because to be honest it’s becoming stale at this point but I will leave you with some new info I have from last weeks drunken chat with a friend and their co worker. This is all the info I have so I apologise that I won’t be able to follow up with more -

New updated devkits with higher clocks arrived only weeks ago.

RDRII is one of the major third party exclusives for the console due around launch / launch window. RDR1 was also in development for all Switch models but was recently cancelled along with the RDRII PS5 / Series ports.

The new model is part of the current Switch family. Not a new generation.

It supports a custom DLSS and RT solution which are not directly comparable to Nvidia’s PC performance. Think their custom Switch API which is a good thing I’m told as it’s mobile technology and has different hurdles.

RT support is extremely conservative. Think AO or sound or other use cases versus high resolution reflections for instance. DLSS will help RT a lot in supported titles however.

Plan has always been 2023 as far as I’m told. “No chance” of it coming this year due to the kits not being final.

Finally when asked how powerful it is in ballpark terms I was told to think standard PS4 but using DLSS when supported to hit 4k instead of Sony’s checkerboard rendering solution so essentially a PS4 Pro. Not all games will support DLSS though so I’d take from that a lot of PS4 gen third party titles at 720p mobile and 1080p docked (which imo is great considering what PS4 can do and the fact many 2023 third party games are still cross gen and possible on standard PS4).

I’m personally guessing Switch 2 will come when mobile tech has reached the ability to run PS5 gen third party games at 540p mobile and 720p docked (then DLSS’ed). I’d guess Switch 2 will come around late 2025 at the earliest giving Switch an almost 10 year life cycle of support and in line with Nintendo’s PR on the subject.

Enjoy the 2022 software line up. There’s a ton to play on Switch and on all consoles. 2023 is where the real fun begins if you’re a tech enthusiast and a Nintendo fan!

I feel you are getting a bit semantical about the "Switch 2" thing because ....there isn't any arguing it, the hardware is a generational leap over Switch

150GFLOP - 400GFLOP GPU + 4 < Jaguar CPU in OG Switch

All the way to a GPU that can beat the Series S if it breaks 1.3GHz when docked, and would beat the OG XBO at OG Portable Mode clocks Before DLSS
(NVIDIA hack has a 12SM GPU in it for the SoC referring to NVN2, so 1536 CUDA cores, 2(12(128*1.3)) ~= 4TFLOPs like the Series S which is a tiny bit weaker GPU-wise than the PS4 Pro, but a fair bit behind the One X GPU wise)

And a CPU generation (A78 Family) that puts it at better IPC than even Zen 2 in the PS5/Series S|X (But at a far lower clock so it would be weaker than those, but it would still be far ahead of the Jaguar CPU cores)

"Switch 2" as a clean-break is more or less a dead-in-the-water idea IMHO, and Nintendo likely is moving onto a Smartphone-like model like Iwata himself said he wanted to go for (Comparing to iPhones) and what Nintendo in the now implies with the software library of Nintendo Account users carrying forwards to systems "past the switch"

Either way, on the note of clocks...what clock speeds can that GPU hit when docked?

EDIT:
Also some fun numbers with that 12SM GPU

Drake/T239's GPU would only need to run at 50MHz to beat the 300MHz profile of the OG Switch's Portable mode XD

 

[Hermii]

You underestimate this forum's need for reassurance

I don’t think this forum is his primary audience.

Cause if it was, he would deem such things as specific clock speeds, cpu core count, ram or process nodes worthy topics.

 

[CypressFX]

the man just really, really wants a switch 2

But who did say that Nate doesnt have any info?

 

[Raccoon]

But who did say that Nate doesnt have any info?

The fact people take him seriously as a leaker is so bizarre to me. This isn't the way a real leaker behaves. A real leaker does not randomly stop getting information for several months, conveniently when no one else is leaking anything. I guarantee when we get to September and no new hardware is announced he's going to come back saying "actually Nintendo may have delayed the Drake so it could be anytime next year."

Same as when the direct was coming out and he continually "reassured us" to not worry about it being a partner showcase and then when actual leakers started saying it's a partner showcase he flipped on it.

I don't understand how anyone would believe his claims to begin with, because it's waaaaaay too high level. 99% of leaks happen because of low level employees in localization. These are people with low paying jobs that they can risk losing. So the stuff that leaks is almost always stuff that is releasing soon, especially software and especially third parties. When a game is near completion they begin localization and this is when the leaking happens. With hardware specifically, leaks generally happen when manufacturing has begun, because a low level factory employee in China or wherever may be willing to talk about it. But Nate has been continuously claiming to leak hardware that has according to him at certain points in his leaking, not even been close to manufacturing. And much much worse than that is that he claims to leak not only the hardware itself, but Nintendo's plans with it. He claims to know how Nintendo will market the Drake, and what kind of exclusive content it would have. Do you know who has this information? Nintendo's top executives. These are the only people who would know 6+ months in advance how Nintendo is planning to market new hardware, and the sort of exclusive content it would launch with.

Occam's razor is that some random leaker on twitter does not have access to information on Nintendo's future hardware marketing plans 6+ months in advance, and is simply making it up because that's the stuff people will click on. He could even have some legitimate real information, for example, maybe he really did here about 4k switch dev kits at some third party, but there's 0 chance this guy knows whether the Drake is gonna be marketed as a sequel or revision or what games it might launch with.

 

[Mr.Gamerson]

Do you guys think the next system will bring about major updates and features to the OS? I think an improved miiverse like service should come back.

 

[Alovon11]

Do you guys think the next system will bring about major updates and features to the OS? I think an improved miiverse like service should come back.

Eh, depends on if they want to make OS-Features exclusive to Switch2/Pro/Drake/T239 System or not

 

[CypressFX]

If I hear it's been shelved then it would be something worthy of reporting. Reconfirming it's a thing doesn't need to be a monthly event.

I think the topic that hyped everything to maximum was that NVN2 leak. And with it and your announcement back then (plus that piece of information) to discuss it in a special podcast, everyone thought there are some big news and maybe a launch date etc.

I know that you have reiterated for many times now, that there is at this moment nothing worthy to discuss and you also pointed out that your current opinion is the same as that podcast from October 2021.

Still, this madness continues

 

[Mr.Gamerson]

Eh, depends on if they want to make OS-Features exclusive to Switch2/Pro/Drake/T239 System or not

They don't have to be exclusive, they could just be waiting for the new system to introduce stuff.

 

[Ojoloco]

Where is the source of the RDR2 thing? Did new information come out?

 

[Dekuman]

I have to laugh at the accusation that one thinks I have not heard new information on this hardware. Here's a bit of knowledge for you: not all new information requires a new report.

I heard plenty of information at GDC; but I didn't see it as enough to justify an entire discussion around. I've heard information the last several months but none requires an update or new report.

To illustrate this point; I'll use Polygon's post as an example. All of that has been discussed last year -- minus mentions of RDR. Which bit of that would require another report to reiterate the same information? If I cared about views and clickbait... maybe. But I don't.

As many have said, it's just a reconfirmation/reassurance thing. Doesn't need to be monthly, but I do recall you pointing to your October 2021 podcast episode a few months back to re-iterate that nothing has changed since. Which i took as reconfirmation at the time, but since then we've moved on to a general directlless summer, people feel antsy for good reason given there were a lot of hopes the general direct would either announce the product or give us a good indication of timing.

Further, given the lack of general reporting on it from the usual sources (bloomberg/nikkei/wsj) it's fair to ask what exactl;y is going on with it. With both PS5 and Series S/X leaks/reports picked up as the announcement neared, we're seeing the opposite with this. Which again leads to questions about timing and the product's status etc.

Thanks for this post, I think it's a good enough reconfirmation