StarTopic Future Nintendo Hardware & Technology Speculation & Discussion |ST| (New Staff Post, Please read)

[Hush]

There's that, but more importantly, what really strikes me as odd regarding TotK is the abnormally prolonged development cycle of that game.

If it releases as scheduled on May 12th, 2022, it will have been a 6 years and 2 months wait for that game to release since BotW.

For the record, the longest time gap we've ever had between two mainline Zelda games on home consoles so far was between Skyward Sword and BotW, which was about 5 years and 3 months, and one of the reasons we had to wait for so long in the first place was because the game had been delayed in order to launch with the Switch, as Aonuma himself stated in an interview.

Furthermore, since Nintendo has now dropped support for the 3DS, all development resources are now exclusively allocated to Switch development, so they don't even have the excuse of also having to develop Zelda games for another platform.

And before anyone says "But there's been COVID and it's Nintendo's most ambitious game ever!", please let me familiarize you with what I believe to be the most relevant point of comparison here: Xenoblade Chronicles 3.

XC3 is a game that features a humongous open world, which, while heavily inspired by previous entries in the series, was nonetheless built entirely from the ground up in a significantly different art style from the other games, with an entire new cast of characters, as well as a brand new story full of inspiration and complex developments.

This game has obviously seen a lot of care and effort be put into every aspect of its development, whether it be the game design, the UI, the general art direction, the animations and voice acting, the soundtrack, as well as of course the visuals, with the implementation of some pretty advanced rendering techniques in an effort to improve the image quality over its predecessor.

On the other hand, from what we've been shown so far in TotK's trailers, that game seems to be pretty much nothing more than BotW with updated graphics as well as some extra verticality and new gameplay mechanics thrown in for good measure. Of course there's probably more to it than what we've seen so far (I'm fairly convinced that there will be dungeons this time around, for instance), but still, it's plain for anyone to see that the game's base world map is exactly the same as in BotW and that the art style hasn't changed in the slightest bit since the predecessor, with which it also shares some very similar if not identical assets.

Heck, Aonuma himself stated in an interview that the game was originally intended to release as DLC for BotW, and that they decided to make it standalone as the project grew more ambitious. And in all fairness, if it weren't for the upgraded visuals, that's exactly what TotK's trailers would look like to me: BotW DLC.

I would actually argue that there seem to be less differences between BotW and TotK than there were between Ocarina of Time and Majora's Mask, and the latter games released at an interval of about 18 months.

Now don't get me wrong: I'm not trying to say that as a game, TotK will be inferior to XC3. We won't be able to tell that until it releases. But at least as a project, I've got no reason to believe XC3 was any less ambitious than TotK is. I'm actually rather inclined to believe the contrary.

And yet, Monolith soft (who by the way is almost certainly heavily involved in TotK's development, making the comparison all the more relevant) still managed to complete their game on time for it to release merely 4 years and 8 months after its predecessor, even in spite of the pandemic.

I might add that the game didn't feel at all like it had been rushed, and released in a highly polished state, with good optimization and very few bugs and glitches.

Now if Monolith could achieve this when it comes to their own game, how on earth would Nintendo need more than 6 years to develop a game that doesn't even seem that different from BotW?

Nintendo would have us believe that they're just being extremely ambitious with that project and are working harder than ever to deliver us the best possible experience, but to me that just sounds like some generic PR talk and I'm not buying at all into that narrative.

Not only is 6 years way too long of a development period, but the fact that the very first teaser trailer for the game was shown at E3 2019 lends credence to the idea that it was originally meant to be released much earlier than in 2023 or even 2022, as it's very unusual for a game to be teased 4 or even just 3 years before it's intended release window.

I tend to believe that Nintendo's initial intent was to release the game somewhere in 2021 or maybe even late 2020, perhaps alongside the OLED model or some other mid-gen refresh that has since been canned, and that plans changed for whatever reason, with COVID perhaps being one factor (though I doubt the pandemic would account for any more than a year of delay or so).

Also, the idea that TotK has now been done for a little while is, in my opinion, strongly supported by the very unusual fact that Nintendo was able to announce a hard release date for the game 8 months ahead of time: I don't think they would have taken the risk to do so if back in September development wasn't already complete, or at least extremely close to completion, considering how any unexpected occurrence in the development process would result in a delay that might compromise the announced release date.

Personally, I'm under the impression that TotK has been "golden" for probably at least a full year by now if not longer, which raises the following question: what would possess Nintendo to sit on such a game for such a long period of time? Surely such a decision must be warranted by some pretty serious motive. It's not like Nintendo had an incredible lineup of games on offer for the last holiday season, and couldn't have advantageously slotted TotK in there. So why would they rather wait?

Obviously the reason must be somehow marketing related. What it is exactly is anyone's guess, but personally, I feel like TotK's weird timing can't be better explained than by Nintendo's intention to use that game in order to promote new hardware.

If that's the case, then it's only natural to assume said new hardware will release either alongside the game or a few weeks before, as that would seemingly make the most sense.

But even if that weren't the case, I would still assume that the game's timing is somehow related to the will of promoting new hardware, and that the new device must be somewhere right around the corner.

In any case, I guess the moment of truth will be the next Direct, unless we get information from somewhere else by then.

I agree with what you are saying, the development time is way too long for a direct sequel and feels like it has been done for a long while now. Lack of footage makes it hard to asses though.I will say it would be absolutely maddening if TotK has nothing to do with the Switch 2 when all signs point to it being so.

 

[Serif]

Nintendo would have us believe that they're just being extremely ambitious with that project and are working harder than ever to deliver us the best possible experience, but to me that just sounds like some generic PR talk and I'm not buying at all into that narrative.

I mean, that's what I believe.

I'm not adhering to some specific PR talk. It just makes sense for this particularly ambitious dev team to take a long time developing, implementing and testing numerous systems and level designs. The same dev team of which all 300 members playtested the game at least 10 times and left notes for each other in the overworld. The sort of development where they had to tweak the wind physics because objects in one side of the overworld started flying across the map, and now they're adding mechanics like free falling and going through walls. This sort of coordination would have been especially disrupted by COVID, along with motion capture, voice recording, etc.

Reusing assets can only do so much if you still have to create new ones, possibly equal to the amount in the original, and reusing an engine still requires regression testing a bunch of systems. I'm not convinced by the comparison to Xeno 3, a game which itself reuses a lot of enemy assets and doesn't have hundreds of mini-dungeons nor specific physics based mechanics, and which still took 4 years to develop.

I would actually argue that there seem to be less differences between BotW and TotK than there were between Ocarina of Time and Majora's Mask, and the latter games released at an interval of about 18 months.

Majora's Mask was planned from the beginning with an extremely contracted dev time and the developers themselves experienced horrible crunch, to the point where the developers inserted dialogue into the actual game about the stress they were experiencing and Aonuma had nightmares. I doubt if they were more in control of their circumstances, Majora's Mask would have taken that short a time.

TotK could very well come with hardware, I'm just not convinced by the arguments of it 'looking like BotW DLC' and they 'must' be preparing for a hardware blowout. I think they are simply keeping their cards close to their chest just as they did with BotW, without revealing information far in advance because they know how familiar we are with a BotW-style open-world game.

This whole 'development is taking too long for a direct sequel' just isn't convincing to me. There's no mandate for how long a 'direct sequel' must take. If it's taking longer than we expected, then my expectations for the scope of the game increase, and I don't think that's unreasonable.

 

[Truno]

I agree with what you are saying, the development time is way too long for a direct sequel and feels like it has been done for a long while now. Lack of footage makes it hard to asses though.I will say it would be absolutely maddening if TotK has nothing to do with the Switch 2 when all signs point to it being so.

What signs? Seems like you're gonna get mad for a dream scenario you made up in your head.

Sony just had a very similar marketing strategy with God of War Ragnarok, a sequel to one of their most acclaimed games

 

[Link_enfant]

I agree with what you are saying, the development time is way too long for a direct sequel and feels like it has been done for a long while now. Lack of footage makes it hard to asses though.I will say it would be absolutely maddening if TotK has nothing to do with the Switch 2 when all signs point to it being so.

This.
They could have shown more of it and especially some gameplay with new features by now, and I'm not really buying the argument that "they didn't have a right moment to do so". For instance the last Direct could have had a much longer Zelda segment and much less of indie/farming games.
They could have also released a trailer outside of a Direct, either shadow dropping or with a teasing tweet 1-2 days before.
It wouldn't have harmed the marketing cycle of any other game imo (even Pokémon), since it's not releasing before May 12th anyway.
It feels like they still didn't want to show it in this Direct for some reason but eventually felt obligated to do so, with a bare minimum teaser showing the title and a hard release date.
Whether it's related to Switch 2 or anything else, it's quite baffling even for Nintendo.

EDIT
Just to make sure I'm not misunderstood, all of the above doesn't mean I'm expecting Drake to come with it and that I'll be "mad at Nintendo" if it doesn't happen. I've been accepting the idea of a later announcement by now and agree that it sounds more and more unlikely, even for 2023.
But that doesn't invalidate some arguments by Hush or ADR91 imo. Whether it's related to Zelda or other hardware rumors we've already talked about a lot, there's been many signs and I just wish we were in a better timeline

 

[manfromthedam]

Also, the idea that TotK has now been done for a little while is, in my opinion, strongly supported by the very unusual fact that Nintendo was able to announce a hard release date for the game 8 months ahead of time.

The idea that the game has been done for a while already makes me go oof. Being a Zelda fan is pain.

Also great post - many of your arguments are the reason why I'm still considering Switch 2 with Zelda a possibility. However, as soon as Nintendo shows proper Zelda stuff in a Direct with Switch 2 nowhere to be seen I'm going with "weird marketing shenanigans just like Splatoon 3".

 

[Hush]

What signs? Seems like you're gonna get mad for a dream scenario you made up in your head.

Sony just had a very similar marketing strategy with God of War Ragnarok, a sequel to one of their most acclaimed games

No idea how you can read the conversation and come in with saying ¨What signs?¨

 

[Bonejack]

The idea that the game has been done for a while already makes me go oof. Being a Zelda fan is pain.

Also great post - many of your arguments are the reason why I'm still considering Switch 2 with Zelda a possibility. However, as soon as Nintendo shows proper Zelda stuff in a Direct with Switch 2 nowhere to be seen I'm going with "weird marketing shenanigans just like Splatoon 3".

I'd say the game had at least 5+ months of nothing but playtesting and polishing. Don't underestimate physics in an open world and now even an "open sky".

 

[Skittzo]

I'd say the game had at least 5+ months of nothing but playtesting and polishing. Don't underestimate physics in an open world and now even an "open sky".

It is a good point though that if you believe it needs that much testing and polishing then how were they confident enough to commit to a hard release date 8 months in advance?

IIRC for BOTW play testing and debugging happened constantly throughout the years of development. It's not a separate phase for Nintendo games I believe.

 

[Truno]

No idea how you can read the conversation and come in with saying ¨What signs?¨

In an unprecedented act, Nintendo is holding a lot to its chest regarding its most anticipated title. Clearly, they're holding it back so they can showcase a brand-new console that hasn't been officially acknowledged in less than 4 months.

That doesn't seem like a, "all signs are pointing to it" kind of scenario. They're clearly waiting for a game-specific direct

 

[Bonejack]

It is a good point though that if you believe it needs that much testing and polishing then how were they confident enough to commit to a hard release date 8 months in advance?

IIRC for BOTW play testing and debugging happened constantly throughout the years of development. It's not a separate place for Nintendo games I believe.

I can see the amount of "on the fly" playtesting and debugging being down a lot since the work done in BotW can almost fully be reused in TotK, at least for the ground parts.

 

[Hush]

This.
They could have shown more of it and especially some gameplay with new features by now, and I'm not really buying the argument that "they didn't have a right moment to do so". For instance the last Direct could have had a much longer Zelda segment and much less of indie/farming games.
They could have also released a trailer outside of a Direct, either shadow dropping or with a teasing tweet 1-2 days before.
It wouldn't have harmed the marketing cycle of any other game imo (even Pokémon), since it's not releasing before May 12th anyway.
It feels like they still didn't want to show it in this Direct for some reason but eventually felt obligated to do so, with a bare minimum teaser showing the title and a hard release date.
Whether it's related to Switch 2 or anything else, it's quite baffling even for Nintendo.

Yeah, and Nintendo is very aware how people are waiting eagerly for TotK updates so the lack of info and footage is doing the game no favors. I can´t imagine it being due to development issues given they are building upon BotW. It has to be related to the new console and I really hope that ends up being the case.

In an unprecedented act, Nintendo is holding a lot to its chest regarding its most anticipated title. Clearly, they're holding it back so they can showcase a brand-new console that hasn't been officially acknowledged in less than 4 months.

That doesn't seem like a, "all signs are pointing to it" kind of scenario. They're clearly waiting for a game-specific direct

They have had many avenues to go about that though and have passed on it time and time again. The VGAs would have been a great place to do it rather than waiting for a Direct that is just (most likely) ~three months till the game launches. Nothing short of you actually playing as Zelda instead of Link 90% of the game would excuse the secrecy really

 

[Link_enfant]

In an unprecedented act, Nintendo is holding a lot to its chest regarding its most anticipated title. Clearly, they're holding it back so they can showcase a brand-new console that hasn't been officially acknowledged in less than 4 months.

That doesn't seem like a, "all signs are pointing to it" kind of scenario. They're clearly waiting for a game-specific direct

To be honest I had to read the beginning of your post twice to get the irony cause to me it kinda makes sense lol
Can't recall if we had a dedicated Zelda BotW direct though? I think it was only treehouse gameplay sessions?

 

[Truno]

Yeah, and Nintendo is very aware how people are waiting eagerly for TotK updates so the lack of info and footage is doing the game no favors. I can´t imagine it being due to development issues given they are building upon BotW. It has to be related to the new console and I really hope that ends up being the case.



They have had many avenues to go about that though and have passed on it time and time again. The VGAs would have been a great place to do it rather than waiting for a Direct that is just (most likely) ~three months till the game launches. Nothing short of you actually playing as Zelda instead of Link 90% of the game would excuse the secrecy really

With a game-specific direct they can go all out. The VGAs don't provide an avenue to do so, they'd only be able to tease something.

I think you're vastly underestimating the impact that COVID had on this game, as Nintendo planned to release it much sooner without a next-gen console

 

[Hush]

With a game-specific direct they can go all out. The VGAs don't provide an avenue to do so, they'd only be able to tease something.

I think you're vastly underestimating the impact that COVID had on this game, as Nintendo planned to release it much sooner without a next-gen console

And what would the harm be in showing a less than two minute trailer of pure gameplay at the September Direct or the VGAs that gave a brief but more concrete look at the actual game in motion? The difference it would make to the secrecy would be negligible?

I want to point out that Nintendo also planned a Switch Pro at one point too which could have been related to TotK

 

[Skittzo]

I don't think TotK has ever been explicitly tied to new hardware. Both it and the new hardware can stand on their own easily enough.

However there's reason to believe they may be linked now, simply because of how development of both things played out over the years. But certainly nothing concrete pointing clearly to them being linked. If they're both gonna be ready within a few months of each other though then it just Makes Sense (TM) to release them together.

 

[Hocot8]

To be honest I had to read the beginning of your post twice to get the irony cause to me it kinda makes sense lol
Can't recall if we had a dedicated Zelda BotW direct though? I think it was only treehouse gameplay sessions?

There was an entire e3 dedicated to it haha

And what would the harm be in showing a less than two minute trailer of pure gameplay at the September Direct or the VGAs that gave a brief but more concrete look at the actual game in motion? The difference it would make to the secrecy would be negligible?

I want to point out that Nintendo also planned a Switch Pro at one point too which could have been related to TotK

I mean MS steered clear of the VGAs in order to give their games a pure dedicated presentation.

 

[Herb Alpert]

I don't think TotK has ever been explicitly tied to new hardware. Both it and the new hardware can stand on their own easily enough.

However there's reason to believe they may be linked now, simply because of how development of both things played out over the years. But certainly nothing concrete pointing clearly to them being linked. If they're both gonna be ready within a few months of each other though then it just Makes Sense (TM) to release them together.

My personal reasoning is that either they release together or they release very far (I'd say a year) from each other.

Zelda is the perfect franchise to drive enthusiasts towards a new Nintendo system. Far Better than Mario.

It would be beyond dumb not to use it as a launch title if they release close to each other.

That's of course only my opinion, and Nintendo is very unpredictable.

 

[JoshuaJSlone]

you heard it here first folks, ps5 peaked early!

Heh. It is true that (until the Oct-Dec 2022 quarter we don't have full data on yet), PS5's launch quarter was by far its biggest, which didn't help year-on-year comparisons. Launch through September 2021? 13.3m. October 2021 - September 2022? 11.7m. But yeah, I don't think this is a situation like 3DS where it legit peaked early.

 

[Hush]

There was an entire e3 dedicated to it haha

I mean MS steered clear of the VGAs in order to give their games a pure dedicated presentation.

But Nintendo actually participated in the VGAs with Bayoetta Origins. I would understand if they just didnt want to spend the money to host something there like MS clearly did

 

[LiC]

My personal reasoning is that either they release together or they release very far (I'd say a year) from each other.

Zelda is the perfect franchise to drive enthusiasts towards a new Nintendo system. Far Better than Mario.

It would be beyond dumb not to use it as a launch title if they release close to each other.

That's of course only my opinion, and Nintendo is very unpredictable.

Not being tied together means they can release at any time relative to each other. Such as, the most likely outcome in my eyes, TotK launches in May and new hardware releases later in the year. And there's no reason to believe they're tied to each other.

The "just delay it for another 6 months" arguments for launching with hardware are extremely silly. The game was delayed because it needed more time. Delaying it even more is not what Nintendo wants. They can launch their hardware with whatever they originally intended to launch it with, not changing those plans just because TotK happened to get delayed into the same year.

 

[Bosintang]

My personal reasoning is that either they release together or they release very far (I'd say a year) from each other.

Zelda is the perfect franchise to drive enthusiasts towards a new Nintendo system. Far Better than Mario.

It would be beyond dumb not to use it as a launch title if they release close to each other.

That's of course only my opinion, and Nintendo is very unpredictable.

No that's very reasonable, which is why I believe more in April 2024 than October 2023. Releasing it with Zelda would have been neat I guess, but I'm under the impression that the ship has now sailed (and will definitely have after mid-February).

 

[Serif]

I still believe Nintendo's BotW showings pre-release - the E3 2016 event and the Game Awards 2016 demo - were to convince folks of an entirely new kind of Zelda game and to drum up excitement for the NX, both are unproven concepts. The Great Plateau demo was an effective spoiler-free way of demonstrating all the new systems and how it differed from Skyward Sword and past Zelda games. The real hype train kicked off after the January presentation trailer, less than three months before release.

Both a BotW-style Zelda and the Switch are proven, they're confident most people are already on board. They can kick off the marketing and ride a wave of momentum close to release. The 'secrecy' is how they chose to build up excitement and intrigue, as disagreeable as some find it.

 

[Concernt]

Should have specified in the EU Ireland

I've had luck with Smyth's Toys.

 

[Hosermess]

Yeah, and Nintendo is very aware how people are waiting eagerly for TotK updates so the lack of info and footage is doing the game no favors. I can´t imagine it being due to development issues given they are building upon BotW. It has to be related to the new console and I really hope that ends up being the case.



They have had many avenues to go about that though and have passed on it time and time again. The VGAs would have been a great place to do it rather than waiting for a Direct that is just (most likely) ~three months till the game launches. Nothing short of you actually playing as Zelda instead of Link 90% of the game would excuse the secrecy really

Doing the game no favours? Secrecy? lol come on now. All that type of talk just smacks of impatience. They used their most recent Direct and VGA to announce two titles that will be released 2 & 3 months before TotK. They're not being dicks just cause they know it's so anticipated and can get away with it. They do know they can get away with it, but it's 5 months away, so they're not dicks yet.

Honestly, if they released nothing except another mystery trailer for it, I would respect that. And laugh at the 'outrage'. And buy it anyway.

 

[MilkyChance]

Could Nintendo start embracing AI tools for game development? Something like Nvidia Omniverse? AI that can also check for any bugs and automatically fix it, but will still need a coder to manually check. As well as making the porting process easier like Apple's Rosetta and AI can easily translate from x86 to ARM. Of course we're long ways off for such to happen, but it will lower costs and such

 

[ILikeFeet]

Could Nintendo start embracing AI tools for game development? Something like Nvidia Omniverse? AI that can also check for any bugs and automatically fix it, but will still need a coder to manually check. As well as making the porting process easier like Apple's Rosetta and AI can easily translate from x86 to ARM. Of course we're long ways off for such to happen, but it will lower costs and such

a lot of devs are already using automated testing, so it wouldn't be surprising if Nintendo did as well

 

[Mr Swine]

Glad the game's getting good reviews, but hopefully once it's released Nintendo can focus their marketing on something else which is... Pretty soon now!

Pikmin 4, Zelda, Zelda Oled and other games!

 

[Homura]

Furthermore, since Nintendo has now dropped support for the 3DS, all development resources are now exclusively allocated to Switch development, so they don't even have the excuse of also having to develop Zelda games for another platform.

EPD does not have fixed teams; instead, people are constantly moved around to assist in various projects, which means that some of the staff working on ToTK may have been busy with other projects during the development process. This is to say it's not really different from how Nintendo developed multiple Zelda games at the same time in the past for different consoles.

And before anyone says "But there's been COVID and it's Nintendo's most ambitious game ever!", please let me familiarize you with what I believe to be the most relevant point of comparison here: Xenoblade Chronicles 3.

XC3 is a game that features a humongous open world, which, while heavily inspired by previous entries in the series, was nonetheless built entirely from the ground up in a significantly different art style from the other games, with an entire new cast of characters, as well as a brand new story full of inspiration and complex developments.

This game has obviously seen a lot of care and effort be put into every aspect of its development, whether it be the game design, the UI, the general art direction, the animations and voice acting, the soundtrack, as well as of course the visuals, with the implementation of some pretty advanced rendering techniques in an effort to improve the image quality over its predecessor.

I loved Xenoblade 3, it might as well be my GOTY 2022, but it's not even remotely comparable to Breath of the Wild in scope nor ambition. The world while pretty large, it's not open world at all, and certainly not as interactive nor dense with content as Hyrule.

On the other hand, from what we've been shown so far in TotK's trailers, that game seems to be pretty much nothing more than BotW with updated graphics as well as some extra verticality and new gameplay mechanics thrown in for good measure. Of course there's probably more to it than what we've seen so far (I'm fairly convinced that there will be dungeons this time around, for instance), but still, it's plain for anyone to see that the game's base world map is exactly the same as in BotW and that the art style hasn't changed in the slightest bit since the predecessor, with which it also shares some very similar if not identical assets.

We don't know anything about the game. You can't claim the overworld is identical to BOTW's, as we've seen mere snippets of it in the not even one total minute of gameplay we got. Not to mention, there are plenty of differences with it, such as missing towers.

Heck, Aonuma himself stated in an interview that the game was originally intended to release as DLC for BotW, and that they decided to make it standalone as the project grew more ambitious. And in all fairness, if it weren't for the upgraded visuals, that's exactly what TotK's trailers would look like to me: BotW DLC.

That's not what Aonuma said. Nintendo had so many DLC ideas for BOTW, they couldn't fit them all in the game without changing it entirely, and as such developing a whole new game from scratch was necessary.

Also, the idea that TotK has now been done for a little while is, in my opinion, strongly supported by the very unusual fact that Nintendo was able to announce a hard release date for the game 8 months ahead of time: I don't think they would have taken the risk to do so if back in September development wasn't already complete, or at least extremely close to completion, considering how any unexpected occurrence in the development process would result in a delay that might compromise the announced release date.

This isn't any different from when Nintendo gave a firm release date to Animal Crossing New Horizons 9 months before release, delaying the game from 2019 to 2020, in order to give the game a smooth development without crunch.
What this means for ToTK is the game was in the final stages of development but wasn't ready yet for a 2022 release.

Personally, I'm under the impression that TotK has been "golden" for probably at least a full year by now if not longer, which raises the following question: what would possess Nintendo to sit on such a game for such a long period of time? Surely such a decision must be warranted by some pretty serious motive. It's not like Nintendo had an incredible lineup of games on offer for the last holiday season, and couldn't have advantageously slotted TotK in there. So why would they rather wait?

I have no idea how can you say this when Nintendo literally had their biggest launch of all time with Pokemon Scarlet Violet. And it was a full OPEN WORLD game, so Nintendo was never going to release another massive open world such as ToTK right next to it, even if it was ready.

Obviously the reason must be somehow marketing related. What it is exactly is anyone's guess, but personally, I feel like TotK's weird timing can't be better explained than by Nintendo's intention to use that game in order to promote new hardware.

If that's the case, then it's only natural to assume said new hardware will release either alongside the game or a few weeks before, as that would seemingly make the most sense.

But even if that weren't the case, I would still assume that the game's timing is somehow related to the will of promoting new hardware, and that the new device must be somewhere right around the corner.

In any case, I guess the moment of truth will be the next Direct, unless we get information from somewhere else by then.

Thinking about it, it's obvious to me the delay was because the game was certainly not ready for 2022, and May 12th is the earliest date they can release the game this year without overshadowing other games.

And let's not forget how the leaked TOTK OLED almost certainly is proof Drake isn't launching with the game, and was never planned to.

 

[Deleted member 887]

We should make the whole thread hidden, so we have less YouTuber just repeating what’s discussed here.

What's funny is we're the most informed place on the fan-internet about the hardware, then hide half the thread and complain that YouTuber's don't seem to know anything.

No that's very reasonable, which is why I believe more in April 2024 than October 2023

I think Nintendo will opt for a "normal" release cycle as much as possible. The heads of NCL, NoA, NoE, and even Nintendo Australia are all new in their positions since the Switch launch, and are, collectively, business people first.

But I think there is plenty of room for a "normal" launch that hits the holidays this year.

Honestly, if they released nothing except another mystery trailer for it, I would respect that. And laugh at the 'outrage'. And buy it anyway.

People who seem to think that Nintendo's next console needs a tiny release cycle want a huge one for the next Zelda

I just think that there is no win for Nintendo showing more Zelda. It's a franchise built on a total visual reinvention, and craploads of bespoke experiences. Now along comes a game that reuses the graphical style and world map of the previous game. Everything that they show will be samey or spoilery.

They don't need to sell Zelda on anything but the mystery, so they have.

 

[Vash_the_Stampede]

see my post above. I think it's routine as he travelled to Japan in the fall of 2019 and Jan 2020. COVID obviously messed up travel in 2020 and 2021.
This is just me quickly looking at his twitter feed. there may have been trips I missed or he didn't post about.

Yea I wonder why he didn’t go to Japan in Jan 2021 and Jan 2022



He also posted prior to 2020. Would would he want to signal anything about hardware with a tweet like that? Let’s be sensible.

 

[Instro]

a lot of devs are already using automated testing, so it wouldn't be surprising if Nintendo did as well

Automated testing, but results must be printed and sent via fax.

 

[Hush]

Doing the game no favours? Secrecy? lol come on now. All that type of talk just smacks of impatience. They used their most recent Direct and VGA to announce two titles that will be released 2 & 3 months before TotK. They're not being dicks just cause they know it's so anticipated and can get away with it. They do know they can get away with it, but it's 5 months away, so they're not dicks yet.

Honestly, if they released nothing except another mystery trailer for it, I would respect that. And laugh at the 'outrage'. And buy it anyway.

The thing is they have had it featured in some form in their Directs and have had people scrambling to find even a few seconds of new footage. No one is saying they just dont want to show it, but rather it is meant to be shown on the new hardware and thus can only be briefly updated on till then. Even Metroid Prime 4 which restarted development 4 years ago now has also been due for a proper update which I also think will be at the Switch 2 presentation

 

[Aether]

People who seem to think that Nintendo's next console needs a tiny release cycle want a huge one for the next Zelda

I just think that there is no win for Nintendo showing more Zelda. It's a franchise built on a total visual reinvention, and craploads of bespoke experiences. Now along comes a game that reuses the graphical style and world map of the previous game. Everything that they show will be samey or spoilery.

They don't need to sell Zelda on anything but the mystery, so they have.

a yeahs not enough, 100% that. They have nothing to gain, only to lose by showing it early. every screenshot is a risk of spoiling something big if they just miss a slight thing in the background. (just look no further then "hidden dragon behind the island" and "glowing branch... we will get a hookshot!").

 

[Hocot8]

But Nintendo actually participated in the VGAs with Bayoetta Origins. I would understand if they just didnt want to spend the money to host something there like MS clearly did

Not to be disrespectful but it is Bayonetta Origins haha.

To me it's seems pretty clear that Nintendo would rather show their big tentpole game at their own event.

Doing the game no favours? Secrecy? lol come on now. All that type of talk just smacks of impatience. They used their most recent Direct and VGA to announce two titles that will be released 2 & 3 months before TotK. They're not being dicks just cause they know it's so anticipated and can get away with it. They do know they can get away with it, but it's 5 months away, so they're not dicks yet.

Honestly, if they released nothing except another mystery trailer for it, I would respect that. And laugh at the 'outrage'. And buy it anyway.

All the talk about lack of updates hurting the game will go out the window during the next direct. None of this silence really matters lol.

 

[Aether]

All the talk about lack of updates hurting the game will go out the window during the next direct. None of this silence really matters lol.

its just a sing that we are getting close to the game, since people are getting inpatient.

 

[Hush]

Not to be disrespectful but it is Bayonetta Origins haha.

To me it's seems pretty clear that Nintendo would rather show their big tentpole game at their own event.

All the talk about lack of updates hurting the game will go out the window during the next direct. None of this silence really matters lol.

But tentpole games are more appropriate for big shows and the smaller ones for Directs.

Oh and my ¨n¨ key appreciates you for calling out that it wasnt hit in that post!

 

[Dekuman]

Yea I wonder why he didn’t go to Japan in Jan 2021 and Jan 2022



He also posted prior to 2020. Would would he want to signal anything about hardware with a tweet like that? Let’s be sensible.

Yep. I made a follow-up post with his travels going back too 2017 it was pretty consistent 2 trips to Japan until covid.

https://famiboards.com/threads/futu...-staff-posts-before-commenting.55/post-517389

 

[Hocot8]

But tentpole games are more appropriate for big shows and the smaller ones for Directs.

Oh and my ¨n¨ key appreciates you for calling out that it wasnt hit in that post!

I disagree because when Nintendo has a direct the gaming world stops for THEM. All eyes are on them, especially now. But listen, I think they should've shown it at TGA haha. I just view it from a Nintendo POV based on how they seem to be acting lately. Since Reggie has been gone they haven't viewed Keighley's shows as worth the time. I could be completely wrong with how I'm thinking so I want to be clear that I don't think I'm right and you are wrong haha.

I'm very much aware I can be an idiot.

 

[Serif]

We don't know anything about the game. You can't claim the overworld is identical to BOTW's, as we've seen mere snippets of it in the not even one total minute of gameplay we got. Not to mention, there are plenty of differences with it, such as missing towers.

I don't know why people are still doing this thing of jumping to conclusions re: scope when Nintendo are known to and have actively admitted to hiding content pre-release for the sake of surprises. They didn't show a single town in BotW until 3 months before it came out (and folks indeed did claim 'no towns' despite Aonuma saying at E3 they were hiding them). They didn't show an inside of a Divine Beast until the Switch presentation trailer. There's so much content in that game they never breathed a word of pre-release. To me, it makes more sense to assume a larger scope of this game because of how large BotW already is. The extensive E3 demo for BotW felt circumstantial for the sake of selling a new kind of Zelda game and the Switch. I can see why they felt no need to repeat that. All of this will go out the window the moment they drop a new trailer and suck all the attention in the room.

 

[Zemya]

I hope TotK isn't just "more Botw" considering how long it took.

 

[LiC]

Who says they're not manufacturing it right now...?

Let's recall that, when the exterior does not look all that different, it does not arouse suspicion.

The Mariko revision was known to exist internally at Nvidia/Nintendo through 5.0 firmware changes on March 12 2018, but then we knew nothing more definitive until around the news of the Shield TV in June 2019, when people put 2 and 2 together to speculate it meant a Switch SoC die shrink coming to the vaguely rumoured handheld-only Switch, and then we got the news a month later that the Lite was real. But we knew next to nothing that confirmed the existence of the Lite before it dropped and had NO idea that same SoC was being dropped into OG Switches; our factory uncle friends failed us.

So any suggestion of "we'd have heard something by now if it was being manufactured" should probably be significantly tempered; we knew about as much about the Lite as we do about Drake at this point.

A photo of a prototype Switch Lite backplate leaked in April 2019, so I wouldn't say the manufacturing process went by unnoticed there. And there may well have been leaks from mass production too, they probably would have just gotten ignored since they'd have to be very close to or after the Lite was announced.

But, well, no, I don't believe it's an absolute certainty that we would have a leak if it was being manufactured. What I believe is that Nintendo is unlikely to start manufacturing weeks or months before they're ready to make an announcement. If there's no announcement by that point in February, then manufacturing couldn't have been going on long enough for the required production period prior to May.

 

[Hush]

I disagree because when Nintendo has a direct the gaming world stops for THEM. All eyes are on them, especially now. But listen, I think they should've shown it at TGA haha. I just view it from a Nintendo POV based on how they seem to be acting lately. Since Reggie has been gone they haven't viewed Keighley's shows as worth the time. I could be completely wrong with how I'm thinking so I want to be clear that I don't think I'm right and you are wrong haha.

I'm very much aware I can be an idiot.

You shouldn´t feel that way since Nintendo is a hard to read company. I just think everyone was like ¨Huh, ok cool I guess¨ when they saw BO at the VGAs when people were expecting something big when they saw the Nintendo logo at the show last month lol.

A lot of us here just feel like new hardware is why TotK has been so rarely featured or mentioned since it was announced, especially as it got close to having a launch window. Could it be the reason? No one knows for sure but it would be one that explains it

 

[Aether]

They didn't show a single town in BotW until 3 months before it came out (and folks indeed did claim 'no towns' despite Aonuma saying at E3 they were hiding them). They didn't show a hint of Divine Beast until the Switch presentation trailer.

Everybody is forgetting the life in ruins trailer that came out at the game awards 2016... (We have vah medoh filling the screen)

 

[Mr.Gamerson]

I actually think not having a switch pro is a lot better for the Switch 2 considering I don't know what Nintendo can do outside of power to greatly show off a difference worth upgrading for. I think power will have to be a major selling point this time and the bigger the gap in power between Switch and 2 the better for Nintendo. Third party games will really help to show off the generational difference between the two systems early on, especially once we start seeing all of the third-party games that can't run on Switch 1 but can run on Switch 2. The first few years may be cross-gen for 1st party, so 3rd party exclusives will be very useful to help sell the new system.

 

[Serif]

Everybody is forgetting the life in ruins trailer that came out at the game awards 2016... (We have vah medoh filling the screen)

I didn't, I thought I wrote 'inside' but apparently not, edited.

 

[Krikeno]

I think people don't realize that Zelda TotK takes place in 2 worlds and not just 1 like in BotW.
In the trailers they always show the 2 versions of Link: present and past. They show that time travel will be a big feature, even the music is like it's backwards.

Why does Link have 2 different looks? Clearly 1 is from the present and 1 is from the past. Therefore:

• At first the game will be set in the present and later in the past. (And at the end Link will return to the present after sleeping for 100 years /s).
• The game will be set in the present and the past and Link will be able to travel through time.

Those are my 2 theories but there is a problem with each one:

• In the first one, they would "delete" Hyrule from the present and that would be a waste of resources. But they could also just change minor things.
• In the second one, there is the question: why would Link's appearance change? Consciousness time travel like in the movie "The Butterfly Effect"?

Another question is when did the "islands" arise: in the present or in the past?

Hmm

But 1 thing is clear and it is that TotK takes place in 2 worlds and that is 1 of the factors why it took so long to develop.

 

[LukasManak22]

EPD does not have fixed teams; instead, people are constantly moved around to assist in various projects, which means that some of the staff working on ToTK may have been busy with other projects during the development process. This is to say it's not really different from how Nintendo developed multiple Zelda games at the same time in the past for different consoles.

Thanks for this whole post. I would also add that TotK obviously has not started development in March 2017. The DLC work was done until end of 2017. We don't know when this title entered full production. Could be fall to winter of 2017 or even very early 2018.

 

[Deleted member 887]

a yeahs not enough, 100% that. They have nothing to gain, only to lose by showing it early. every screenshot is a risk of spoiling something big if they just miss a slight thing in the background. (just look no further then "hidden dragon behind the island" and "glowing branch... we will get a hookshot!").

I have no idea what these are referring to, and if they are ToTK speculation, I am glad I don't.

I think people don't realize that Zelda TotK takes place in 2 worlds and not just 1 like in BotW.
In the trailers they always show the 2 versions of Link: present and past. They show that time travel will be a big feature, even the music is like it's backwards.

Why does Link have 2 different looks? Clearly 1 is from the present and 1 is from the past. Therefore:

• At first the game will be set in the present and later in the past. (And at the end Link will return to the present after sleeping for 100 years /s).
• The game will be set in the present and the past and Link will be able to travel through time.

Those are my 2 theories but there is a problem with each one:

• In the first one, they would "delete" Hyrule from the present and that would be a waste of resources. But they could also just change minor things.
• In the second one, there is the question: why would Link's appearance change? Consciousness time travel like in the movie "The Butterfly Effect"?

Another question is when did the "islands" arise: in the present or in the past?

Hmm

But 1 thing is clear and it is that TotK takes place in 2 worlds and that is 1 of the factors why it took so long to develop.

Love Zelda chatter, but for the sake of my poor heart, please lets not turn this into a Zelda spec thread! I've managed to avoid all of it so far, and I'd like to keep it that way!

(Zelda timing as it relates to hardware, valid)

 

[wolftendo]

Only said mix of his 3 points

I cracked the code:

1. Early announcement within the next month-ish, Full reveal + trailers at E3, Holiday Season launch.
2. Early announcement at E3, Full reveal + trailers during holiday season, Launch H1 2024.

Spoiler

Please do not read too much into this

 

[Aether]

I have no idea what these are referring to, and if they are ToTK speculation, I am glad I don't.

Yeah, TotK speculation is about the same as hardware speculation but from a different direction, and some are really out there.

I think people don't realize that Zelda TotK takes place in 2 worlds and not just 1 like in BotW.
In the trailers they always show the 2 versions of Link: present and past. They show that time travel will be a big feature, even the music is like it's backwards.

Why does Link have 2 different looks? Clearly 1 is from the present and 1 is from the past. Therefore:

• At first the game will be set in the present and later in the past. (And at the end Link will return to the present after sleeping for 100 years /s).
• The game will be set in the present and the past and Link will be able to travel through time.

Those are my 2 theories but there is a problem with each one:

• In the first one, they would "delete" Hyrule from the present and that would be a waste of resources. But they could also just change minor things.
• In the second one, there is the question: why would Link's appearance change? Consciousness time travel like in the movie "The Butterfly Effect"?

Another question is when did the "islands" arise: in the present or in the past?

Hmm

But 1 thing is clear and it is that TotK takes place in 2 worlds and that is 1 of the factors why it took so long to develop.

this now seems like pure TotK speculation in the hardware thread

Thanks for this whole post. I would also add that TotK obviously has not started development in March 2017. The DLC work was done until end of 2017. We don't know when this title entered full production. Could be fall to winter of 2017 or even very early 2018.

well... the DLC was implemented and published by end of 2017.
but the planning for it? probably mostly done when they announced it and made the key art during the release of the game.
im confident that the decision what can be DLC and what will be done in a sequel was made before the DLC was actually implemented during planning. after that, they moved on to the next zelda in parallel to the DLC for pre production.