Doug Bowser Jr
Piranha Plant
It's time!
I think it's good to have 80 of the roster still being in the Mario universe for the first Mario Kart crossover, they will have the opportunity to addd more in the future episodes. The ones that I quoted are I think those who fit the most tho the cartoon graphic style of the series (even though I recognize that Captain Falcon would fit really good, actually).Pauline is basically a shoo-in. Totally forgot about her!
And no Samus or Captain Falcon?
I totally forgot that Dixie was in Tour as well, so I realy hope to see them in the next game even more, lmao.it's probably actually important to note that pauline and dixie being in tour (which borrows a lot of assets from MK8, including character models) probably means they've got HD assets sitting around waiting to be put into a new game
king bob-omb, nabbit, pauline, diddy, dixie, funky, kamek, birdo, monty mole and the hammer bros all have a pretty good odds of getting into the next mario kart assuming they don't scrap the existing HD models
Metroid
- Samus
- Kraid (if Ridley wasn't too big for Smash, Kraid's not too big for Kart)
Oooh I totally forgot about Mini/Fake Kraid!
Because she is the goddess herself. Also, because I didn't know who else to mention, as Min Min is too obvious because she's in Smash. And also I don't believe there would be 2 ARMS characters.why in god's name would twintelle be the only arms rep
it would obviously be the protagonist of the game,Because she is the goddess herself. Also, because I didn't know who else to mention, as Min Min is too obvious because she's in Smash. And also I don't believe there would be 2 ARMS characters.
I can't argue with a clean grid. It's just so...nice.I intentionally limited myself on WarioWare characters but i'd love to have even more of that cast! Thought about Noki and the Big Cat from Bowser's Fury too (plus a few Galaxy NPC series like Star Bunny, Gearmo and Whittle) but I really wanted that clean grid!
Agree with you on Mario Kart's track design for sure; there's absolutely a unique charm to them that would be lost when accounting for a grander crossover. Mario Kart was never focused on recreating iconic locations from other games as race tracks, but what's what people want Nintendo Kart to be.
It's easy to forget how many Mario-isms are in Mario Kart. The items, characters, courses, all obvious. But things as small as "the jingle playing on the last lap and the music speeding up," that's an adaptation from 2D Mario. Perhaps I'm biased, but I love the little details and how...Mario Mario Kart is.I hate this idea and how it's now inescapable when talking about the future of this series. I'm sure it's something Nintendo's thought of internally given the fan demand, so if they do it I just hope it's still largely a "Mario Kart" game in aesthetic and design.
The thing about a crossover is it wouldn't just be the characters. Mario Kart's art direction, track themes, item selection, and series staple elements (stuff like Lakitu as flag man) are all things they could change if they decide this isn't a Mario game anymore.
I want metal versions of every main characterI want pink gold peach to return, but I think it also time nurse toadstool was added to the roster
Tin Yoshi and "Regular Gold Daisy" would be goated, would preorder from the eshop day 1I want metal versions of every main character
Metal Mario
Pink Gold Peach
Brass Toad
Copper Bowser
Regular Gold Daisy
Tin Yoshi
Anodized Niobium Rosalina
All this and no love for the canon Silver Luigi. Neglected even now, poor younger bro. :')I want metal versions of every main character
Metal Mario
Pink Gold Peach
Brass Toad
Copper Bowser
Regular Gold Daisy
Tin Yoshi
Anodized Niobium Rosalina
Alright, but, hear me out. In ARMS lore Twintelle is into collecting luxary cars; the cars on her home stage are from her "personal collection" according to official descriptions.it would obviously be the protagonist of the game,Spring-manMechanica
she even has experience piloting a vehicle, which I think is a major boon
So here's my proposed roster changes - first of all, I'd get rid of the crossed out characters. Babies suck, and the variants of Mario, Peach and Bowser are pointless. Koopalings were on the edge but they're at least different enough.
So now we have to replace them. Let's start with some decent characters who were in older games but fell off the roster (I say decent so that rules out Funky Kong and ROB)
Diddy Kong
Birdo
Petey Piranha
Wiggler
Honey Queen
We're obviously going to need some newbies now, characters who have appeared in Mario-universe games but haven't made it into this series yet
Pauline
Professor E. Gadd (Luigi's Mansion)
Captain Toad
Poochy (Yoshi)
Nabbit
Kamek
Wart
I'd keep the guest characters (Link stays in by a hair's breadth), and I would only add two more - Olimar and Kirby - as they fit the aesthetic of Mario Kart much more than any other main character in Nintendo's series.
And then there's a couple of wildcard picks - let's go with Mona from WarioWare (she already rides a bike-like vehicle in the a few of the games in the series) and then something completely out there. Sure, why not - cartoon Lewis Hamilton. They already had Merc promos karts for the first game after all.
I am completely biased, I'm very aware,.. but to me, it should be like CTR Nitro-Fueled where you pick your engine/weight class before getting your character, so if you want a light-weight Bowser, you can! The handling shouldn't be tied to characters or even vehicles; That way they also can trim the fat of redundant characters, and make some of them costumes (Tanooki Mario and so many other power ups could serve as basic costumes for Mario);So many people want to see the babies and the Koopalings and the metal variants gone. And like...I get it, but I can't see Nintendo actually doing that. Nintendo invented new baby and metal forms for these games. Nintendo wants you to have multiple different versions of Mario and Peach with their own stats so you can choose the one you like the most while still having your favorite character. As a compromise I could see Peachette getting Cat Peach's stats? But even then, unless they radically change how they handle stats or don't mind lumping multiple statistics into the same slot (which they DID in MK8 but undid in MK8D), then the "redundant" characters stay.
I prefer the term "Internet Commentator" (or "Analyst," which also works well).Who are you calling a gamer?
I think they're also just clutter, and should be more like alternate "costumes" that you can select upon choosing a character. They bloat up the character select screen with what some may consider filler.people really gotta consider that the babies and the metals aren't there at the cost of other characters, they're all using small variations of shared models and have a lot of shortcuts like sharing animation rigs. cutting them won't suddenly give you 7 slots for nintendo characters
not that i want to diminish people's fantasies. i also want nintendo kart, but it's not the babies holding that reality back.
That’s only a problem if Sakurai is directing the next Mario Kart. That was his proclivity (even said as much, if I remember right).I really don't think going apeshit with Nintendo characters in Mario Kart makes sense. MK fans groaning because there's another anime swordfighter in their racing game is the last thing I need to hear or read.
I looked it up, and here's what I said at the time:At least I can say I was the first one to make a thread on this topic on Famiboards.
I'm biased because I find the "Marioverse" pretty dull compared to other Nintendo worlds, so in recognition of that bias I voted for Mario Kart with crossover DLC. Let Mario Kart stay Mario, I think.
my favorite roster posted by far, even including my ownMy attempt at a realistic 64 character roster that I could totally see happen. Obviously, some of these would be DLC added over time:
1.) Mario 2.) Luigi 3.) Peach 4.) Toad 5.) Yoshi 6.) Donkey Kong 7.) Wario 8.) Bowser
9.) Rosalina 10.) Pauline 11.) Daisy 12.) Toadette 13.) Birdo 14.) Diddy Kong 15.) Waluigi 16.) Bowser Jr.
17.) Koopa Troopa 18.) Shy Guy 19.) Dry Bones 20.) Wiggler 21.) Kamek 22.) King Bob-omb 23.) Petey Piranha 24.) King Boo
25.) Larry Koopa 26.) Wendy O. Koopa 27.) Lemmy Koopa 28.) Iggy Koopa 29.) Morton Koopa 30.) Ludwig von Koopa 31.) Roy Koopa 32.) Nabbit
33.) Baby Mario 34.) Baby Luigi 35.) Baby Wario 36.) Baby Peach 37.) Baby Daisy 38.) Baby Rosalina 39.) Baby Pauline 40.) Baby Donkey Kong
41.) Dixie Kong 42.) Cranky Kong 43.) Funky Kong 44.) K. Rool 45.) Professor E. Gadd 46.) Polterpup 47.) Captain Syrup 48.) Ashley
49.) Metal Mario 50.) Gooigi 51.) Cat Peach 52.) Captain Toad 53.) Yarn Yoshi 54.) Vampire Wario 55.) Cosmic Rosalina 56.) Dry Bowser
57.) Link 58.) Zelda 59.) Isabelle 60.) Villager 61.) Inkling Girl 62.) Inkling Boy 63.) Samus 64.) Pikmin
My reasoning for these choices:
1-16 Recurring primary and secondary Mario cast. They are the ones that feel like they should always be in any multiplayer Mario game at this point. They make great Double Dash pairings too.
17-24 Popular recurring baddies and series bosses. One of these is always one of your friends/family members' favorite Mario character of all time. I couldn't cut any of them.
25-32 The Koopalings and Nabbit. They(aside from Nabbit) are in the theme park ride. So I don't think they are going anywhere. Nabbit is Nabbit.
33-40 The Babies are actually pretty popular, and I do think the ones I added are the most likely to get added in the next game.
41-48 Expanded Mario universe characters who I feel a lot of people would enjoy. Wario's cast are perhaps the most unlikely portion of this whole list tho. But if Nintendo saw a lot of people requesting Ashley and Captain Syrup for Smash, and they wanted to add a few more women to Mario Kart, I could see it.
49-56 Transformations/alts/doppelgangers. Tried to limit it to one memorable one per character. This is unrealistic probably, but so is no alts.
57-64 Guest Stars! For some reason I don't think they will add ARMS characters even though they developed it. I don't think they will go crazy with guests, but they will have some. Also think it will stay EPD only.
And even though I've made another list about this, I have to admit I care way more about the tracks and music than I do the cast. Also I need 200cc to be brought back.
To be fair, among the 42 characters in Mario Kart 8 Deluxe, there are 16 unique sets of statistics. That's a decent variety - more so than the five driving styles of CTR, but less diverse proportional to the cast than then totally unique spreads of a Team Sonic Racing (though I suppose each category of racer is still similar?). Though even ignoring statistics, people just...wanna play with the characters they like. But yeah, assuming they lean heavily on MK8D and the characters they already released for Tour, getting to 50+ characters is relatively easy. But hey - if Crash fans can get excited for all the deep cuts they got in CTR, Mario fans can get excited for more characters in their Mario Kart roster. If they really need to make each character more unique, they could bring back the Special Item system from Double Dash and Tour - I'm not as big of a fan of that, since the balance of those items isn't great (and I'm sure there's at least a few people who see people mentioning balance in Mark Kart and let out a hearty laugh), but it IS an option.At least I can say I was the first one to make a thread on this topic on Famiboards.
I’m seeing character rosters in the 50s and I’m here to tell you all that you‘re missing the point a bit. Smash having that many characters makes better sense because most of them have fully unique movesets, weight classes, etc. It’s what makes the series interesting and appealing and it’s what most of its Dev time is dedicated to.
Aside from 3-5 weight/speed classes, Mario Kart characters all have the same capabilities, or at least incredibly similar ones (though I toyed with the idea of SLIGHT item variations by character or track previously, like swapping shells with missiles for Samus or Metroid tracks, but obeying the same basic principles of straight and seeking characteristics of the green and red shells respectively). MKTour has shown that character additions are relatively trivial if Nintendo wants them to be, just a matter of constructing the character model and slapping them with a weight/speed class.
It’s TRACKS that make “Nintendo Kart” the most conceptually interesting, it’s what the bulk of the series’ development time is focused on getting right, it’s what gets fans the most excitable (the gnashing of teeth over the continued absence of the Block Fort battle track is/was as vociferous as any request for Ridley in Smash in the Mario Kart fandom), it’s the info you wait on baited breath to learn about with MK, what the new and retro courses are. And most importantly, it’s the best way to represent Nintendo’s franchise history in the context of a “Nintendo Kart”, where the developers could express the most ingenuity and creativity.
Unless they drastically change the entire gameplay of the next Kart game, getting excited about characters is like getting excited about Mii costume options in Smash.
That’s only a problem if Sakurai is directing the next Mario Kart. That was his proclivity (even said as much, if I remember right).
See, I'm really of two minds when it comes to this. One one hand, I think it makes sense to make getting into a Mario Kart race as simple as possible. I like the Kart customization mechanics, but I do know that it slows things down for a casual audience. On the other hand, I like how the different car parts give you options to tweak your build, and I kinda like the character choice mattering a bit and not just being a skin, even if it does mean seeing a bunch of Waluigis and Roys online.. It really is a difference of philosophy, no approach is better than the other.I am completely biased, I'm very aware,.. but to me, it should be like CTR Nitro-Fueled where you pick your engine/weight class before getting your character, so if you want a light-weight Bowser, you can! The handling shouldn't be tied to characters or even vehicles; That way they also can trim the fat of redundant characters, and make some of them costumes (Tanooki Mario and so many other power ups could serve as basic costumes for Mario);
I also want vehicle customization to be simplified, if not cut-out altogether; Give characters their own unique karts, and leave for customization basic stuff like paint jobs and stickers;
I'm not big into the whole Nintendo Kart thing, but allow me to throw some contenders into the ring who exude cuteness and character, as one might expect from the Mario Kart series:
These all seem like they would fit the aesthetic perfectly and represent Metroid very well.
I still dislike the fact that Double Dash had a character outside of Mario Universe (Diddy) and this is one the things that I strong dislike in 8/8 Deluxe.
So I hope that they put only Mario characters in the new game (and that the new Smash only have Nintendo characters as well).
@CMM1215 they're suggesting cutting the koopalings
No Kirby because he's getting a new Air Ride game instead.
Tutankoopa
Where's Alex Roivas in the bike bound with mummified human flesh?
Alex Roivas' special is making every other racer hallucinate being in first but they're really driving off of the road or into walls.
Here's my dream roster:
Mario
Luigi
Captain Falcon
Dr. Stewart
Pico
Samurai Goroh
Jody Summer
Mighty Gazelle
Baba
Octoman
Dr. Clash
Mr. EAD
Bio Rex
Billy
Silver Neelsen
Gomar & Shioh
John Tanaka
Mrs. Arrow
Blood Falcon
Jack Levin
James McCloud
Zoda
Michael Chain
Super Arrow
Kate Alen
Roger Buster
Leon
Draq
Beastman
Antonio Guster
Black Shadow
The Skull
getting the notification for this was like hearing your name being called from inside a corn mazeThe idea of turning the series into more of a Nintendo Kart or Smash Kart or what have you has never particularly appealed to me. I know, for some people, branching out more into the wider Nintendo universe would be exciting, whether because it might bring in characters they want or it might allow for desired locales to be imported as race tracks, but I find it would be more interesting to delve deeper into the ExpandedDonkey KongMario Universe and pull from there.
The universe this series is already rooted in contains so much that could yet be incorporated into a still Mario-centric series, elements which would certainly be cast to the side if the focus became Nintendo as a whole -- characters, for instance, that would never make it into Smash Bros. but nevertheless should have their chance to shine--; Mario Kart simply hasn't reached this potential yet.
A Vast UniverseA brief consideration will conjure readily apparent individual characters who have been ignored and would almost certainly be left to languish should the series take a turn into more focus on Nintendo as a whole.
Super Mario
Pauline / Foreman Spike / Nabbit / Captain Toad / Toadsworth / Wart
(Some of these examples, such as Pauline and Foreman Spike, though iconic in the beginnings of the franchise, have waited years in relative obscurity but appear to be making a resurgence, whereas others, such as Nabbit and Captain Toad, are more recent inventions waiting on their big chance, and yet others still, such as Toadsworth and Wart, have fallen more out of favor -- Toadsworth after building a career of appearances, Wart as the big bad of a single game, leaving Toadsworth the more likely contender, both to appear here and to reappear elsewhere.)
It doesn't even require delving particularly deep to discover the vast wealth of potential buried even just beneath the surface. While it might appear the universe in question provides nothing further of value, nothing to be mined for the improvement of Mario Kart itself (a position one might suppose supported by the continuous inclusion of further metal and baby variants of existing characters), even just considering the branches of this Expanded Universe will show there is much that has been ignored, much that would provide value to Mario Kart.
Luigi's Mansion
King Boo* / Professor E. Gadd / Hellen Gravely / Polterpup
(King Boo already holds a slot in Mario Kart but he would now draw more from his Luigi's Mansion appearances, where he has become the recurring villain. E. Gadd has appeared in various Mario-related titles, but remains most tied to Luigi's Mansion. Hellen Gravely is new, but appears poised to become recurring; if King Boo can do it, so can she. And Polterpup. Polterpup is an adorable ghost doggo who I considered would be an interesting surprise with fascinating potential in Smash, but who would almost certainly never make it in.)
Mario RPG
Kammy Koopa / Lady Bow / Vivian / Fawful / Cackletta / Popple
(This began as a separate listing for Paper Mario and Mario & Luigi, but these have been combined for ease. I considered the suggestion of Kamek, but Kammy presents her own unique appearance and characterization. Lady Bow is obvious, if we are considering RPG characters, and Vivian is well-received. Fawful makes sense, as a recurring villain, and I had considered whether Cackletta would be included -- eventually determining she should be, so secret shenanigans on the Character Select screen using both her and Bowser can lead to Bowletta --, and Popple seems like a character who could be made use of.)
Of course, the RPGs have no dearth of characters that could be considered, as evidenced by this Mario & Luigi Kart mockup, which draws only from characters who have appeared in [/i]Mario & Luigi[/i], courtesy of Deiji_Zeruda:
Donkey Kong
K. Rool / Dixie Kong / Cranky Kong
(K. Rool and Dixie are pretty self-explanatory. Cranky is a crotchety old curmudgeon who rounds out The Geriatric Crew. There are other possibilities, but these are the most likely newcomers, without delving deeper into the series.)
Wario Land/Ware
Captain Syrup / Mona
(For the time being, I have limited this post to one supporting character from each Wario property. Captain Syrup should be in this and other Mario spinoffs by now. Mona is in the WarioWare slot because she already rides around on a motor scooter and has different outfits she can be outfitted with. Also, the obvious choice of Ashley is currently fighting for her spot in Super Smash Bros., though there really isn't anything saying they couldn't both compete in both series.)
Other
Poochy / Viruses
(Poochy, known for appearances in Yoshi's subseries, is an adorable pseudo-doggo-thing who should be given the opportunity to drive a vehicle and feel the wind without needing a window. While I don't tend to be particularly keen on the inclusion of generic enemies, the viruses are exactly the sort of zany addition one might expect, especially as Mario is now able to don his Dr. Mario persona.)
Past Inclusions
This is disregarding, even, such characters as have been in Mario Kart before and could make sense to return, such as Birdo, Petey Piranha, Diddy Kong, Funky Kong, King Bob-omb (through his appearance in Tour), et cetera, even Robo Mario.
All this is without even delving too deep into characters available in the universe. More depth, of course, if not achieved through character choice, can be afforded through forms.
Characters of Myriad Forms
As for the baby characters, metal variants, powered-up forms, and other such versions of characters, I would suggest they all be folded into the base form of the character. There would be options for different forms, which would affect handling (metal, baby, and so forth), accessed in one location, and then costumes and such would be accessed separately.
Luigi, for example, would have access to alts such as Gooigi and Mr. L, which would be named as such. Dry Bowser and Meowser would be folded into the base Bowser slot. Rosalina can manifest as the Cosmic Spirit. Yoshi can be yarn. Wario receives Wario Land transformations and his WarioWare look. Peachette is a heavier form of Toadette.
Really, this keeps the Character Select screen looking clean and helps keep players from being overwhelmed by the immediate options, allowing for a quick ability to jump in for those who aren't too particular and the option to select from a number of specific forms for those who have particular desires.
It's important to note that, while these variations might seem like superfluous additions that clutter the Character Select screen, they enjoy more popularity than we denizens of the internet message boards might expect, and, being built largely on the same models and only requiring some "simple" tweaks for gameplay, require less in time and resources. All this works into the idea of collecting them within their own base characters, in that people will want to keep them and their removal won't necessarily allow for much more work elsewhere. Worked well, it can all function for furthering Mario Kart as a celebration of the Mario universe.
Taking Center Stage
Of course, discussions on this topic would be remiss not to include the subject of courses: Mario Kart isn't all racers and nothing else, after all. The courses are an important part of the series' character, and certainly key to the overall gameplay.
A neat element of the series is its ability to flesh out the world through the stages, to explore areas and concepts beyond what is found in other Mario-based games. It's not beholden to worlds that have been seen elsewhere, and when it does visit them it visits them askew. There's no end to the possibilities. Even just considering existing locales, the Mario universe presents unending potential. Take, for instance, the potential of a Bob-omb Battle Zone, weaving around the incoming impact of giant water bombs, or of Boggly Woods, which has barely been explored and could be fashioned into a brilliant and gorgeous setting through which to race. While the Woods would likely be rendered in a typical Mario style, a less specific papercraft course would explore how the paper realms could be used, folding and unfolding all while looking amazing, and it would fit in with a Crafted World or Wooly World from Yoshi. A MicroGame course would keep racers on their toes.
That's not to say there aren't reasons to be interested in what courses based on other series could bring. One could imaging cruising across Hyrule, through the marketplace of Hyrule Castle Town as townspeople dodge out of the way, across the fields dodging cuckoos, diving into Death Mountain -- there's potential there, and I wouldn't be against the possibility of seeing it, but it doesn't negate the endless potential already found in the concepts afforded Mario Kart as it explores Mario's universe.
Courses are, however, one of the more potentially interesting aspects of a theoretical Nintendo Kart, but additional courses from elsewhere in Nintendo's portfolio don't guarantee these new courses will be any more fun, valuable, or well thought out than new Mario-based courses would be.
A continued focus on Mario-related courses also allows both a wider and deeper exploration of the franchise, which plays into the overall tone and feel of the series: a celebration of Mario.
A Celebration of Mario
In the end, Mario Kart is positioned to serve as an exploration and celebration of the Mario universe, and something of that would be lost if it went full-on Nintendo Kart. Little touches, such as Lakitu or music quirks or items or any other such element, all stem from and point to the Mario'verse. This is part of what gives the series its particular character, and while you could change that, any major alterations to such should be carefully weighed and considered.
Instead, I would like to see the series lean more into that exploration and celebration. Reach into further areas of the Mario world to pull in characters and items and courses. Treat individual characters themselves as a celebration, with the choices of alternate forms and costumes. There's still a lot of untapped potential.
But What of those Guests?
Well, I don't see guests from other Nintendo franchises going away anytime soon, but I also don't expect nor want them to become much larger a focus. I would imagine most such guests would originate with EAD/EPD.
Guests
R.O.B. / Isabelle / Link / Inkling / Biff / Olimar / Kirby
(R.O.B. is a link to the olden days of Nintendo history and has seen karting action in the past. Link probably isn't going anywhere -- Champion Link, and other variations, are included as selections --, nor would I expect Isabelle or the Inklings to do so. Biff works as a representative of ARMS, but adhering more to the aesthetic one might expect from Mario Kart and without picking out an actual fighter from the lineup. Olimar, likewise, melds with the aesthetic. Kirby is from outside EAD/EPD, but fits perfectly.)
Other Business
This has all been, essentially, conclusions I've considered posting in previous Mario/Nintendo Kart threads, but never actually got to.
First, to address the question of Samus, I've actually commented on that subject in the past with the proposal of characters that would fit the Mario Kart aesthetic, perhaps, a tad more:Specifically dachora and etecoon, which we already know can pilot craft. A kart should be no issue.
See, the thing is, Mario sprung forth from Donkey Kong, which means Diddy was well within his rights to play around in what is actually Donkey Kong's expanded universe. As referenced above, Donkey Kong would be considered part of the same universe as Mario.
I would agree with more focus on Nintendo for Smash, though.
Where else are we supposed to fit in all the other Nintendo characters?
Kirby is a super special character who is obtained when you have save data from the new Air Ride game.
But this, this is brilliance.
Alex Roivas can avoid blue shells if she has enough Pargon at her disposal, but she sometimes hallucinate course obstacles herself. Her mummified bike appears to be powered by some eldritch tome nestled in a hand-shaped pedestal.
If Nintendo Kart is the price that must be paid for this, let it be so; give it to me.
Somehow this doesn't seem like the Mario and Luigi one might expect, but you make a strong case -- YOU HAVE BOOST POWER!
When Nitro-Fueled released, they had speed classes tied to characters as were originally in CTR and CNK, with everyone keeping their original stats; But when the Halloween update came out, they added the option to change the class (they call it Engines) before getting your character (or you can select "Classic", so characters retain their original stats); This was a tremendous game changer, because now you was free to pick a character without being worried if they'd suck, or you could get the Engine that would make you comfortable the most regardless of character choice; --They even later on added an new Engine class that wasn't present in CTR or CNK to balance things out (A "Drift" class)See, I'm really of two minds when it comes to this. One one hand, I think it makes sense to make getting into a Mario Kart race as simple as possible. I like the Kart customization mechanics, but I do know that it slows things down for a casual audience. On the other hand, I like how the different car parts give you options to tweak your build, and I kinda like the character choice mattering a bit and not just being a skin, even if it does mean seeing a bunch of Waluigis and Roys online.. It really is a difference of philosophy, no approach is better than the other.
In CTR, everyone has the same Kart size, right? Mario Kart tries to balance the heavier drivers by making them larger, letting them push people around but being easier targets. Meanwhile the lighter karts are smaller targets. That would have to be the one big design change a Mario Kart with selectable stats would have to make.
Love all of this, great post!The idea of turning the series into more of a Nintendo Kart or Smash Kart or what have you has never particularly appealed to me. I know, for some people, branching out more into the wider Nintendo universe would be exciting, whether because it might bring in characters they want or it might allow for desired locales to be imported as race tracks, but I find it would be more interesting to delve deeper into the ExpandedDonkey KongMario Universe and pull from there.
The universe this series is already rooted in contains so much that could yet be incorporated into a still Mario-centric series, elements which would certainly be cast to the side if the focus became Nintendo as a whole -- characters, for instance, that would never make it into Smash Bros. but nevertheless should have their chance to shine--; Mario Kart simply hasn't reached this potential yet.
A Vast UniverseA brief consideration will conjure readily apparent individual characters who have been ignored and would almost certainly be left to languish should the series take a turn into more focus on Nintendo as a whole.
Super Mario
Pauline / Foreman Spike / Nabbit / Captain Toad / Toadsworth / Wart
(Some of these examples, such as Pauline and Foreman Spike, though iconic in the beginnings of the franchise, have waited years in relative obscurity but appear to be making a resurgence, whereas others, such as Nabbit and Captain Toad, are more recent inventions waiting on their big chance, and yet others still, such as Toadsworth and Wart, have fallen more out of favor -- Toadsworth after building a career of appearances, Wart as the big bad of a single game, leaving Toadsworth the more likely contender, both to appear here and to reappear elsewhere.)
It doesn't even require delving particularly deep to discover the vast wealth of potential buried even just beneath the surface. While it might appear the universe in question provides nothing further of value, nothing to be mined for the improvement of Mario Kart itself (a position one might suppose supported by the continuous inclusion of further metal and baby variants of existing characters), even just considering the branches of this Expanded Universe will show there is much that has been ignored, much that would provide value to Mario Kart.
Luigi's Mansion
King Boo* / Professor E. Gadd / Hellen Gravely / Polterpup
(King Boo already holds a slot in Mario Kart but he would now draw more from his Luigi's Mansion appearances, where he has become the recurring villain. E. Gadd has appeared in various Mario-related titles, but remains most tied to Luigi's Mansion. Hellen Gravely is new, but appears poised to become recurring; if King Boo can do it, so can she. And Polterpup. Polterpup is an adorable ghost doggo who I considered would be an interesting surprise with fascinating potential in Smash, but who would almost certainly never make it in.)
Mario RPG
Kammy Koopa / Lady Bow / Vivian / Fawful / Cackletta / Popple
(This began as a separate listing for Paper Mario and Mario & Luigi, but these have been combined for ease. I considered the suggestion of Kamek, but Kammy presents her own unique appearance and characterization. Lady Bow is obvious, if we are considering RPG characters, and Vivian is well-received. Fawful makes sense, as a recurring villain, and I had considered whether Cackletta would be included -- eventually determining she should be, so secret shenanigans on the Character Select screen using both her and Bowser can lead to Bowletta --, and Popple seems like a character who could be made use of.)
Of course, the RPGs have no dearth of characters that could be considered, as evidenced by this Mario & Luigi Kart mockup, which draws only from characters who have appeared in [/i]Mario & Luigi[/i], courtesy of Deiji_Zeruda:
Donkey Kong
K. Rool / Dixie Kong / Cranky Kong
(K. Rool and Dixie are pretty self-explanatory. Cranky is a crotchety old curmudgeon who rounds out The Geriatric Crew. There are other possibilities, but these are the most likely newcomers, without delving deeper into the series.)
Wario Land/Ware
Captain Syrup / Mona
(For the time being, I have limited this post to one supporting character from each Wario property. Captain Syrup should be in this and other Mario spinoffs by now. Mona is in the WarioWare slot because she already rides around on a motor scooter and has different outfits she can be outfitted with. Also, the obvious choice of Ashley is currently fighting for her spot in Super Smash Bros., though there really isn't anything saying they couldn't both compete in both series.)
Other
Poochy / Viruses
(Poochy, known for appearances in Yoshi's subseries, is an adorable pseudo-doggo-thing who should be given the opportunity to drive a vehicle and feel the wind without needing a window. While I don't tend to be particularly keen on the inclusion of generic enemies, the viruses are exactly the sort of zany addition one might expect, especially as Mario is now able to don his Dr. Mario persona.)
Past Inclusions
This is disregarding, even, such characters as have been in Mario Kart before and could make sense to return, such as Birdo, Petey Piranha, Diddy Kong, Funky Kong, King Bob-omb (through his appearance in Tour), et cetera, even Robo Mario.
All this is without even delving too deep into characters available in the universe. More depth, of course, if not achieved through character choice, can be afforded through forms.
Characters of Myriad Forms
As for the baby characters, metal variants, powered-up forms, and other such versions of characters, I would suggest they all be folded into the base form of the character. There would be options for different forms, which would affect handling (metal, baby, and so forth), accessed in one location, and then costumes and such would be accessed separately.
Luigi, for example, would have access to alts such as Gooigi and Mr. L, which would be named as such. Dry Bowser and Meowser would be folded into the base Bowser slot. Rosalina can manifest as the Cosmic Spirit. Yoshi can be yarn. Wario receives Wario Land transformations and his WarioWare look. Peachette is a heavier form of Toadette.
Really, this keeps the Character Select screen looking clean and helps keep players from being overwhelmed by the immediate options, allowing for a quick ability to jump in for those who aren't too particular and the option to select from a number of specific forms for those who have particular desires.
It's important to note that, while these variations might seem like superfluous additions that clutter the Character Select screen, they enjoy more popularity than we denizens of the internet message boards might expect, and, being built largely on the same models and only requiring some "simple" tweaks for gameplay, require less in time and resources. All this works into the idea of collecting them within their own base characters, in that people will want to keep them and their removal won't necessarily allow for much more work elsewhere. Worked well, it can all function for furthering Mario Kart as a celebration of the Mario universe.
Taking Center Stage
Of course, discussions on this topic would be remiss not to include the subject of courses: Mario Kart isn't all racers and nothing else, after all. The courses are an important part of the series' character, and certainly key to the overall gameplay.
A neat element of the series is its ability to flesh out the world through the stages, to explore areas and concepts beyond what is found in other Mario-based games. It's not beholden to worlds that have been seen elsewhere, and when it does visit them it visits them askew. There's no end to the possibilities. Even just considering existing locales, the Mario universe presents unending potential. Take, for instance, the potential of a Bob-omb Battle Zone, weaving around the incoming impact of giant water bombs, or of Boggly Woods, which has barely been explored and could be fashioned into a brilliant and gorgeous setting through which to race. While the Woods would likely be rendered in a typical Mario style, a less specific papercraft course would explore how the paper realms could be used, folding and unfolding all while looking amazing, and it would fit in with a Crafted World or Wooly World from Yoshi. A MicroGame course would keep racers on their toes.
That's not to say there aren't reasons to be interested in what courses based on other series could bring. One could imaging cruising across Hyrule, through the marketplace of Hyrule Castle Town as townspeople dodge out of the way, across the fields dodging cuckoos, diving into Death Mountain -- there's potential there, and I wouldn't be against the possibility of seeing it, but it doesn't negate the endless potential already found in the concepts afforded Mario Kart as it explores Mario's universe.
Courses are, however, one of the more potentially interesting aspects of a theoretical Nintendo Kart, but additional courses from elsewhere in Nintendo's portfolio don't guarantee these new courses will be any more fun, valuable, or well thought out than new Mario-based courses would be.
A continued focus on Mario-related courses also allows both a wider and deeper exploration of the franchise, which plays into the overall tone and feel of the series: a celebration of Mario.
A Celebration of Mario
In the end, Mario Kart is positioned to serve as an exploration and celebration of the Mario universe, and something of that would be lost if it went full-on Nintendo Kart. Little touches, such as Lakitu or music quirks or items or any other such element, all stem from and point to the Mario'verse. This is part of what gives the series its particular character, and while you could change that, any major alterations to such should be carefully weighed and considered.
Instead, I would like to see the series lean more into that exploration and celebration. Reach into further areas of the Mario world to pull in characters and items and courses. Treat individual characters themselves as a celebration, with the choices of alternate forms and costumes. There's still a lot of untapped potential.
But What of those Guests?
Well, I don't see guests from other Nintendo franchises going away anytime soon, but I also don't expect nor want them to become much larger a focus. I would imagine most such guests would originate with EAD/EPD.
Guests
R.O.B. / Isabelle / Link / Inkling / Biff / Olimar / Kirby
(R.O.B. is a link to the olden days of Nintendo history and has seen karting action in the past. Link probably isn't going anywhere -- Champion Link, and other variations, are included as selections --, nor would I expect Isabelle or the Inklings to do so. Biff works as a representative of ARMS, but adhering more to the aesthetic one might expect from Mario Kart and without picking out an actual fighter from the lineup. Olimar, likewise, melds with the aesthetic. Kirby is from outside EAD/EPD, but fits perfectly.)
Other Business
This has all been, essentially, conclusions I've considered posting in previous Mario/Nintendo Kart threads, but never actually got to.
First, to address the question of Samus, I've actually commented on that subject in the past with the proposal of characters that would fit the Mario Kart aesthetic, perhaps, a tad more:Specifically dachora and etecoon, which we already know can pilot craft. A kart should be no issue.
See, the thing is, Mario sprung forth from Donkey Kong, which means Diddy was well within his rights to play around in what is actually Donkey Kong's expanded universe. As referenced above, Donkey Kong would be considered part of the same universe as Mario.
I would agree with more focus on Nintendo for Smash, though.
Where else are we supposed to fit in all the other Nintendo characters?
Kirby is a super special character who is obtained when you have save data from the new Air Ride game.
But this, this is brilliance.
Alex Roivas can avoid blue shells if she has enough Pargon at her disposal, but she sometimes hallucinate course obstacles herself. Her mummified bike appears to be powered by some eldritch tome nestled in a hand-shaped pedestal.
If Nintendo Kart is the price that must be paid for this, let it be so; give it to me.
Somehow this doesn't seem like the Mario and Luigi one might expect, but you make a strong case -- YOU HAVE BOOST POWER!
Welp
The video explains that the Miis were the line that crossed, and MK8 added those crossover DLCs since. It's just notable that Miyamoto apparently was uneasy about Mario Kart having crossovers, but his role in games nowadays is a lot less prevalent as he focuses on movies/parks and approaches retirement.That Miyamoto quote comes from MKWii development, and was the Miis that gave him a pause (R.O.B. was totally fine on DS apparently, or even Pac-Man & Mametchi on Arcades lol); -- Mario Kart 8 surely went way beyond that line
Yes, absolutely; Miyamoto's grip onto many franchises are loosen recently as new folks take the helm; But either way, I found it funny that the Miis that were the ones that got him comment on such concept, when R.O.B. in DS was more of a outsider (before even debuting as a Smash character);The video explains that the Miis were the line that crossed, and MK8 added those crossover DLCs since. It's just notable that Miyamoto apparently was uneasy about Mario Kart having crossovers, but his role in games nowadays is a lot less prevalent as he focuses on movies/parks and approaches retirement.
Yeah it's pretty strange, huh? You'd think he'd be ecstatic to have Miis in there and would say no to R.O.B.!Yes, absolutely; Miyamoto's grip onto many franchises are loosen recently as new folks take the helm; But either way, I found it funny that the Miis that were the ones that got him comment on such concept, when R.O.B. in DS was more of a outsider (before even debuting as a Smash character);